Is there a guard-version of Tim Duncan?

[sammichoffate]

Fundamentally sound, efficient, not flashy, may or may not be an all-time great?

[IncarceratedBob]

You just described Kobe Bryant except for being efficient and fundamentally sound.

[Round Mound]

Big O

[reppy]

I always kind of thought as Brandon Roy as being a Tim Duncan type player but as a SG.

[tpols]

sidney moncrief.. not that famous compared to other stars, great defense, good offense from what ive heard

[Jacks3]

You just described Kobe Bryant except for being efficient and fundamentally sound.
:facepalm

[Shih508]

MJ! Except MJ is way more exciting to watch. Other than that, a great winner and a great leader

[L.Kizzle]

Ray Allen.

[ThePhantomCreep]

Joe Dumars

[BoNafidde]

Andre Miller

[ZMonkey11]

Paul Pierce

[outbreak]

Pierce, nash and Miller

[Demitri98]

Surprised no one's mention Jerry West yet.

[atljonesbro]

Did you just say a top 5 player all time may not be an all time great?

[Milbuck]

Prime Ray Allen came immediately to mind. Obviously TD is on another level as an overall player, but the similarities are there relative to position.

Quintessential shooting guard. Great on both ends of the floor, can shoot the lights out, can handle the ball when needed but is elite off ball mover/player, high BBIQ, great leader, etc. He isn't as flashy as MJ, Kobe, T-Mac, etc but the guy does everything you want from his position and more through sheer fundamentals and skill. And from a physical/athletic standpoint he was up there as well, just as young TD was for PFs.

Did you just say a top 5 player all time may not be an all time great?
Think he meant the guard player may or may not be an all time great.

[JohnMax]

Michael Jordan

[EllEffEll]

Surprised no one's mention Jerry West yet.


:rockon: Yup.

[GimmeThat]

John Stockton.

[GimmeThat]

Michael Jordan

you mean the guard-version of Shaq?

[Sarcastic]

Did you just say a top 5 player all time may not be an all time great?


No he didn't. He said the player could be either or.


And Duncan isn't top 5.

[Myth]

I always kind of thought as Brandon Roy as being a Tim Duncan type player but as a SG.

They even have nerdy voices in common.

[Kellogs4toniee]

Ray Allen
Joe Dumars
John Stockton
Reggie Miller


These all come to mind and for these reasons below:

1. They aren't overly flashy. They don't handle the ball for 10 seconds and end up hoisting a very hard shot. The shot they do take can be trusted to be the most fundamentally open, and sound shot at the time. This includes both on-ball and off-ball.

2. Great on both ends of the floor. Reggie wasn't really known for his defense, but he was great at being scrappy and mentally getting in the head of the other player.

3. Consistent high level performers for a very very VERY long time (decade +)

4. Everyone except for Ray Allen can be associated closely with just one team. Reggie with Indiana, Dumars with Detroit, and Stockton with the Jazz. Even with Allen people immediately think Sonics and Celtics.

All four points above is what makes Tim Duncan what he is, and that is why I chose the four guards above.

[GimmeThat]

No he didn't. He said the player could be either or.


And Duncan isn't top 5.


well, there must be an empty seat at the hall of fame.

because I wonder who's got the balls to take that seat.

[GimmeThat]

I always kind of thought as Brandon Roy as being a Tim Duncan type player but as a SG.


true, but I feel like a 21/7/7 is more Duncan-esque

[DMAVS41]

John Stockton comes to mind.

Efficient, great teammate, great leader, tough, durable, consistent, played quality defense, great longevity...etc.

He's nowhere near as good as Duncan, but he's the closest to what you describe in the OP in my opinion.

Prime playoffs averages of 16/4/12 57% TS

[CavaliersFTW]

Oscar Robertson

but also throw in michael jordan's competitive intensity

[AintNoSunshine]

John Stockton, he's all that you described.

[EllEffEll]

Ray Allen
Joe Dumars
John Stockton
Reggie Miller


These all come to mind and for these reasons below:

1. They aren't overly flashy. They don't handle the ball for 10 seconds and end up hoisting a very hard shot. The shot they do take can be trusted to be the most fundamentally open, and sound shot at the time. This includes both on-ball and off-ball.

2. Great on both ends of the floor. Reggie wasn't really known for his defense, but he was great at being scrappy and mentally getting in the head of the other player.

3. Consistent high level performers for a very very VERY long time (decade +)

4. Everyone except for Ray Allen can be associated closely with just one team. Reggie with Indiana, Dumars with Detroit, and Stockton with the Jazz. Even with Allen people immediately think Sonics and Celtics.

All four points above is what makes Tim Duncan what he is, and that is why I chose the four guards above.

Ray was pretty feisty earlier in his career, and was even a little on the mouthy side as a Celtic at times. Reggie had a smooth stroke (as did Ray), but Reggie loved to mouth off and try to get under the opposition's skin.

If TD got into someone's head, it's because they put him in there themselves. He just quietly and humbly goes about destroying you. Reggie and Ray don't really fit this profile IMHO. Dumars and Stockton, I can live with in that regard.

Reggie and Ray are greats in their own right, but I don't see them handling themselves in a TD-like manner throughout their careers IMHO.

[gts]

Jerry West...

[GimmeThat]

Jerry West...


you mean the guard-version of Larry Bird?

both have shooting forms that are unguardable really.

[CavaliersFTW]

For those mentioning him, I personally don't think it's Jerry West.. Jerry West may have had a non-flashy game stylistically speaking but watch his game film and he still looks exciting to watch nonetheless because he played at an incredible level of intensity that you just don't see from Duncan's steady delivery of performance. West's game was also heavily reliant on his jump shot and all-around quickness, where as Duncan is sort of a steady jack of all trades pivot man with a wide variety of moves. I think Oscar Robertson fits the bill better than Jerry West.

[gts]

I was thinking more of the all around, not just the style of play... no frills attitude approach to the game, just play hard... great teammate, solid producer on the floor, team leader, long productive career always being one of the best year in and out... and both essentially the quintessential sports man and all around good guy

[JUDGE WITNESS]

paul pierce is the first that comes to mind

[Odinn]

It is probably Walt Frazier.

[Upgrayedd]

Make a team with players like this, I've tried but stuck at SG and C.

C: ?
PF: Duncan
SF: Pierce
SG: ?
PG: Stockton

[T_L_P]

Make a team with players like this, I've tried but stuck at SG and C.

C: ?
PF: Duncan
SF: Pierce
SG: ?
PG: Stockton

Walton and Moncrief. :cheers:

[Cali Syndicate]

Brandon Roy.

[Purch]

John Stockton...

[BoutPractice]

Stylistically I like Oscar Robertson as a comparison. Different personalities, different team circumstances, but a similar approach to the game privileging substance over style.

Among current players, it would be Chris Paul: highly consistent 20/10ish player with great fundamentals.

If the "good guy" and "quintessential sports guy" personality is what you're looking for, then I'd say Steve Nash. He's also very fundamentally sound and had impressive longevity.

[GimmeThat]

Make a team with players like this, I've tried but stuck at SG and C.

C: ?
PF: Duncan
SF: Pierce
SG: ?
PG: Stockton

off the name that hasn't been used.


Richmond and any Center who's won the DPOY

[Kargo]

Jason Kidd

Longevity,leadership,all around player,successfull.

[Haymaker]

I always kind of thought as Brandon Roy as being a Tim Duncan type player but as a SG.

Damn it, I've always thought the same. :applause:

[Ne 1]

Kobe Bryant- pure finesse, skill, craft and technique, the SG version of Duncan.

[Haymaker]

Kobe Bryant- pure finesse, skill, craft and technique, the SG version of Duncan.

I would agree if Kobe was not such a ball hog. Plus, Kobe is flashier than Timmy.

[inclinerator]

me.

[Asukal]

Stockton as others have said. Fundamental basketball, tough as nails, not flashy but effective, team player. :bowdown:

[IncarceratedBob]

Pierce is a ghetto thug, personality not like TD at all

[choppermagic]

John Stockton and Mark Price. Got the job done, super efficient, fundamentally sound, not flashy.

[unbreakable]

there is no guard with the combination of offensive and DEFENSIVE dominance that duncan brings to the table..

MAYBE RONDO.. but thats the closest it gets.. Rondo is an all time offensive team player and a great defender who has shutdown kobe in the finals before..

duncan is an ANCHOR.. rondo is an ANCHOR.. its close

[riseagainst]

You just described Kobe Bryant except for being efficient and fundamentally sound.

:roll:

[step_back]

John Stockton and Mark Price. Got the job done, super efficient, fundamentally sound, not flashy.

I was literally about to say Mark Price. Beat me to it :lol

Dennis Johnson is another guy you could add to the list.

[Pointguard]

To me the best example is Oscar and Joe Dumars. Moncrief, Mark Price, Gary Payton would be close if his style wasn't so different. I would also include Chris Paul. At shooting guard there aren't that many... West and Paul George maybe.


Oscar Robertson

but also throw in michael jordan's competitive intensity
Jordan's competitive intensity oo(s)ed out of him. Duncan's intensity is barely seen, sobeit, very high. The only other player, that immediately comes to mind that reeked intensity like Jordan was KG, who looked extremely different than Duncan because of that quality.

[CavaliersFTW]

To me the best example is Oscar and Joe Dumars. Moncrief, Mark Price, Gary Payton would be close if his style wasn't so different. I would also include Chris Paul. At shooting guard there aren't that many... West and Paul George maybe.


Jordan's competitive intensity oo(s)ed out of him. Duncan's intensity is barely seen, sobeit, very high. The only other player, that immediately comes to mind that reeked intensity like Jordan was KG, who looked extremely different than Duncan because of that quality.
Yeah, stylistically Oscar used the least amount of flair possible, he made a deliberate effort in his time not to look like a "globetrotter". But as far as the intensity and highly aggressive body language before/during/after say, a tough drive inside, well the player who comes to mind is Jordan.

[Pointguard]

Yeah, stylistically Oscar used the least amount of flair possible, he made a deliberate effort in his time not to look like a "globetrotter". But as far as the intensity and highly aggressive body language before/during/after say, a tough drive inside, well the player who comes to mind is Jordan.
That would be an interesting topic. Who manifested that drive to attack every opportunity or as you say the "highly aggressive body language."

[Nastradamus]

J Kidd