Am I the only one who thinks: Wiggins >>> Love

[JtotheIzzo]

Yes Kevin Love puts up great stats, but here are some realities to marinade on:

-'leader' of a semi-talented team that has never sniffed the playoffs.

-undersized at the four.

-suspect defender.

-floats around the 3pt line.

-has injury history.

Plenty of fours have put up big numbers on non-playoff teams, even Charles Smith put up multiple 20ppg seasons with bad Clipper teams.

I think Love is fool's gold and giving up Andrew Wiggins for him will be like when the Sixers gave up Brad Daugherty for Jeff Ruland. That deal kept Charles Barkley from winning a title, and this deal will not help Cleveland win. Finals maybe, win no.

You will basically take away a full stopper who will keep Braan fresh in return for a stat padder who will make more work for Bran.

If I am LeBron, don't I want to guard the second perimeter option every night instead of the first, don't I want to play with someone who will beat me down the floor?

[moe94]

Here's the reality. Love is a proven NBA star. Wiggins is not.

[JtotheIzzo]

Here's the reality. Love is a proven NBA star. Wiggins is not.

really? I thought stars played in the playoffs.

[stalkerforlife]

I wouldn't trade Wiggins for Love and I wouldn't accept Lebron back.

Cavs look pathetic right now. They are stockpiling talent and they don't need to take the cheating ex back.

[plowking]

Agreed. Wiggins will be one of the faces of the league soon.

[G-train]

I don't know if Wiggins is >>>, but I wouldn't trade him for a guy that will average 20/10 and play no D on a good team.
It's possible Wiggins will provide more overall to the Cavs in his first season, let alone the next possible 14.

[Legends66NBA7]

Future star, sure. But you have to take a proven commodity over a rookie at this point.

Besides, we don't know if Wiggins becomes injury prone either.

[moe94]

really? I thought stars played in the playoffs.

So if Love was in the East and made the playoffs without doing anything, then he'd be a star? Is that it?

[D-Rose]

Honestly, I think Cavs have enough without a Wiggins package.

Assets like Waiter, TT, Bennett, multiple 1st rounders are gold for the Wolves. Better than any of the things Boston/GSW will actually give.

[Black and White]

Let Wiggins play in the NBA before we can make this comparison, Love is proven at this point, Wiggins is not.

[FireMcFailPlease]

Honestly, I think Cavs have enough without a Wiggins package.

Assets like Waiter, TT, Bennett, multiple 1st rounders are gold for the Wolves. Better than any of the things Boston/GSW will actually give.
are they clevelands first rounders, because those would be in the 20s...unless Irving/James/Love all tear ACL's and Cleveland wins 2 lotteries in a row.

That said, it has to be Wiggins or no Love for Cleveland. The young players are there, but it can't be another Kevin Garnett return with tapped talent.

[jzek]

Wiggins could turn out to be like Bennett.

Love is a future HoF.

Stop looking at POTENTIAL and look at the present reality.

[D-FENS]

I don;t think Wiggins should be included either

[NumberSix]

Love is a RIGHT NOW move.

[veilside23]

Wiggins could turn out to be like Bennett.

Love is a future HoF.

Stop looking at POTENTIAL and look at REALITY


Love a future HOF? i wont bank on it yet ...

and wiggins is no bennett at all they play complete differently..

19 year old kevin love vs 19 year old wiggins i would go for wiggins

kevin love has been in the league for 6 years ... so lets say give wiggins at least 2 or 3 years and we can start comparing

[robert de niro]

'leader' of a semi-talented team that has never sniffed the playoffs.
:lol :lol :lol :lol

[Mass Debator]

Wiggins <<<<< Jabari :hammertime:

[JellyBean]

Wiggins could turn out to be like Bennett.

Love is a future HoF.

Stop looking at POTENTIAL and look at the present reality.

:applause: Thank you. Wiggins could be a stud or a dud. At least we all know what numbers Kevin Love is capable of putting up.

[Carbine]

Love is a top 10 player in the league. Adding him makes way more sense than keeping Wiggins and hoping in three years he will be that good.

Love is the perfect offensive big to play with LeBron.

This is assuming they have to trade him to get Love. If Minnesota will accept another package not involving him, that would be ideal.

[Kingwillball]

I would try to Hold onto Wiggins but if he was guy than only include Thompson or Bennet with him.

[JimmyMcAdocious]

I'm sure Love missing significant time every other year and playing in the West doesn't play a part in his missing the playoffs?

The thing about Love is that he's not just a 20/10 player. He's a 26/13+, stretches the floor, and is a quality passer player. Who's 25. And whose game relies on positioning, skill, and basketball IQ (ie, he will age well). Just his outlet passing can put so much pressure on a defense and changes a game.

OK, he's not LeBron or Durant. No one is saying he is. He's a #2, and might be the best true #2 in the NBA.

His ability as a basketball player I would not be worried about. Injuries, maybe. Not basketball ability.

[lilteapot]

This board reaches a new level of full retard with every thread made. Lmao apparently Wiggins is better than Love :roll:

[livingby3's]

Besides, it's safer to say that Love's game fits almost perfectly next to LeBron and Varejao, that is if they're sure they getting Bron

[JtotheIzzo]

Wiggins could turn out to be like Bennett.

Love is a future HoF.

Stop looking at POTENTIAL and look at the present reality.

Wiggins turn out like Bennett? You cant seriously believe that can you?

Love a HoFer? Lets see him play a playoff game there first, as you say, 'stop looking at POTENTIAL!'

[hawksdogsbraves]

It's not fair at all to compare Wiggins to Love right now. Let the kid play a season in the NBA ffs.

[JtotheIzzo]

It's not fair at all to compare Wiggins to Love right now. Let the kid play a season in the NBA ffs.


No, lets live in the now.

Lets ask every GM in the league who they would rather have today, and I bet Wiggins gets more votes than you might think.

Besides, they have both played the same amount of NBA playoff games, so it is basically a toss up experience wise. :lol

[SavageMode]

Kevin Love reminds me of Evan Turner.... Empty Stats.

Both of these players put up good numbers on their old(and current) teams, but one disputable point remains. Both couldn't scathe the playoffs.

Kevin Love is fools gold who isn't worth much.
A white version of Bosh that is better overall basically.

[hawksdogsbraves]

No, lets live in the now.

Lets ask every GM in the league who they would rather have today, and I bet Wiggins gets more votes than you might think.

Besides, they have both played the same amount of NBA playoff games, so it is basically a toss up experience wise. :lol

Let's live in the now?

I don't think Wiggins will ever be as good as Love is right now. Wiggins might get some votes but that's ONLY because his salary is like $3mil/yr on that rookie salary.

Wiggins could be a top 10 player in the league some day, but Love IS a top 10 player RIGHT NOW. Right now, in the now, it's not a contest.

[hawksdogsbraves]

And the empty stats argument is so ****ing ridiculous, don't even get me started. You can see a troll poster from a mile away by how he starts the 'empty stats' argument.

[macmac]

Whether wiggins is better than Love is irrelevant. First of all, Love can be had for way less than wiggins, unless wolves feel a team is desperate.

Second of all, Wiggins will be on a rookie contract, not making 20mil a year. So you have to account for that in assessing his value. With Wiggins they have way more cap space to play with, now and in the future and can therefore build a way more potent team

[PleezeBelieve]

This board reaches a new level of full retard with every thread made. Lmao apparently Wiggins is better than Love :roll:
I know, right. This place been hyping Wiggins up for three years and he's never backed it up on the court.

Expect the same during his rookie season.

[yeaaaman]

And the empty stats argument is so ****ing ridiculous, don't even get me started. You can see a troll poster from a mile away by how he starts the 'empty stats' argument.

Would you care to explain this? I'm not sure how I feel about the argument. But can you explain why it's ridiculous to you?

I remember reading an article about Amir Johnson, who has less than spectacular stats, but was an advanced stat all-star. Not everything is Rebs Pts Asts etc.

Edit: http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2014/story/_/id/10844963/amir-johnson-hidden-gem-toronto-raptors

Article claims he is a superstar by some measures.

So yea, I don't know if "empty stats" is a real thing or not, I think it can be - or at least "less meaningful than they appear on paper" stats.

[DMV2]

I don't know about "Wiggins >>> Love" but if I was asked to build a team around with, I'd roll the dice with Wiggins. He could be a #1 pick bust like Kwame or a #1 pick superstar like LeBron. We don't know.

Love, we know he can put up beastly numbers but we also know he's not a leader, he doesn't play defense, he's not a #1 option.

I'll rather take a chance with Wiggins on a rookie contract for the next 3-4 years than to take Love for $18-20 million a year and not make the playoffs.

[DMV2]

Whether wiggins is better than Love is irrelevant. First of all, Love can be had for way less than wiggins, unless wolves feel a team is desperate.

Second of all, Wiggins will be on a rookie contract, not making 20mil a year. So you have to account for that in assessing his value. With Wiggins they have way more cap space to play with, now and in the future and can therefore build a way more potent team
I swear to God, your post wasn't there when I posted mine. :lol

Although my post is a little more critical of Love.

[MiseryCityTexas]

really? I thought stars played in the playoffs.

Mitch Richmond was an All Star and only made the play-offs like three times in his whole career.

[MiseryCityTexas]

I don't know about "Wiggins >>> Love" but if I was asked to build a team around with, I'd roll the dice with Wiggins. He could be a #1 pick bust like Kwame or a #1 pick superstar like LeBron. We don't know.

Love, we know he can put up beastly numbers but we also know he's not a leader, he doesn't play defense, he's not a #1 option.

I'll rather take a chance with Wiggins on a rookie contract for the next 3-4 years than to take Love for $18-20 million a year and not make the playoffs.


Wiggins is suspect as hell when it comes to creating his shot off the dribble.

[JtotheIzzo]

Mitch Richmond was an All Star and only made the play-offs like three times in his whole career.

He is also widely regarded as the worst HoFer ever. Thanks for making my point.

[JtotheIzzo]

Whether wiggins is better than Love is irrelevant. First of all, Love can be had for way less than wiggins, unless wolves feel a team is desperate.

Second of all, Wiggins will be on a rookie contract, not making 20mil a year. So you have to account for that in assessing his value. With Wiggins they have way more cap space to play with, now and in the future and can therefore build a way more potent team

Which is precisely why Wiggins >>>

I love it (and this is not in reference to you Mac Mac, you get it) when the tards on this board call others tards because they fail to comprehend a nuanced post (thus highlighting their tardness) and I like it even more when the World Champion Delusional tard, PB, rushes in to back them up.

Its like the leaves falling in autumn, or the snow melting in the spring, it is natural and feels right.

Like my boy Willie D once said: 'you gotta let a tard be a tard.'

[TrueRob]

I think Love is overrated, but I'm not ready to say Wiggins > Love just yet. I'm too high on Love because he doesn't play defense, and his offense doesn't command enough defensive attention to make up for it. Maybe keep Wiggins for at least a season, it would look pretty bad to trade him away only for him to develop into a star.

[veilside23]

I know, right. This place been hyping Wiggins up for three years and he's never backed it up on the court.

Expect the same during his rookie season.


can you post scottie pippen's rookie number's and he turned out to be one of the greatest of all time. am not saying that wiggins will be like pippen

but if i would start my team id rather have a 2 way player...

tell me when did kevin love play defense? :rolleyes:

[PleezeBelieve]

can you post scottie pippen's rookie number's and he turned out to be one of the greatest of all time. am not saying that wiggins will be like pippen

but if i would start my team id rather have a 2 way player...

tell me when did kevin love play defense? :rolleyes:
I never heard so much about a wing's alleged defensive ability than Wiggins in this draft. The dude only averaged 1.2 spg, and he played 75% of the minutes.

Very average numbers there.

He had plus length at the collegiate level, which helped him greatly at Kansas. But just as he floats on offense, he does the same thing on defense. He wasn't shutting anyone down that I remember. Yet you people keep talking about his defense like I don't know its only because you know his offensive numbers are only slightly above average.

[JtotheIzzo]

I never heard so much about a wing's alleged defensive ability than Wiggins in this draft. The dude only averaged 1.2 spg and on average, he played 75% of the minutes.

Very average numbers there.

He had plus length at the collegiate level, which helped him greatly at Kansas. But just as he floats on offense, he does the same thing on defense. He wasn't shutting anyone down that I remember. Yet you people keep talking about his defense like I don't know its only because you know his offensive numbers are only slightly above average.

This is why you are dumb.

LOL

Gay A

[veilside23]

I never heard so much about a wing's alleged defensive ability than Wiggins in this draft. The dude only averaged 1.2 spg, and he played 75% of the minutes.

Very average numbers there.

He had plus length at the collegiate level, which helped him greatly at Kansas. But just as he floats on offense, he does the same thing on defense. He wasn't shutting anyone down that I remember. Yet you people keep talking about his defense like I don't know its only because you know his offensive numbers are only slightly above average.

you already admitted it slightly above averange defender is wiggins ...

when did kevin love play defense... ?

[outbreak]

isn't love 6"10? Anyway he is proven and ready to contribute big time to a play off run if you get lebron, wiggins is a guy who likely will need 2-3 years before he is ready to give you that contribution. If the cavs get lebron they want to compete this season. Different players for different situations, if the cavs don't get lebron than wiggins is the better fit, if they get lebron then love is better.

[Kvnzhangyay]

I"m fairly certain Cavs will try to get Love without getting rid of Wiggins. Even if Wiggins doesn't turn out to be a offensive juggernaut, he's still pretty decent defensively

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Odds are Wiggins won't be as good as Kevin Love is right now BUT with Wiggins you get 4 years of rookie salary and a guaranteed extension if he's good so IDK. It's tough to say...

[East_Stone_Ya]

hasn't played a single game in the NBA...yet is already rated higher than Love

only in ISH

[yeaaaman]

I never heard so much about a wing's alleged defensive ability than Wiggins in this draft. The dude only averaged 1.2 spg, and he played 75% of the minutes.

Very average numbers there.

He had plus length at the collegiate level, which helped him greatly at Kansas. But just as he floats on offense, he does the same thing on defense. He wasn't shutting anyone down that I remember. Yet you people keep talking about his defense like I don't know its only because you know his offensive numbers are only slightly above average.

Well to be honest they reported opponents only shot 33% against him if I'm not mistaken. If I were someone in a position to make any decision on or evaluate his talent, I'd be much more interested in that rather than how many steals he got per game. What does that really tell me?

In any case we all know he hasn't played a game in the NBA. Same with all players coming out of college. They evaluate them, they draft them accordingly, and then attach expectations for them. So we'll have to see how he does.

[GimmeThat]

I think that if you put them on the same team.

Wiggins may start arising as the 1st option because he's going to be more ball dominant than Love.


I haven't seen Love being the type of player that becomes a formidable 1/2 punch with another player. But just a player who passes the ball regardless of how good the other player is because it's the right play.

the whole team probably has the same opinion regarding Love, then Love having "cliques" on a team.

[JtotheIzzo]

hasn't played a single game in the NBA...yet is already rated higher than Love

only in ISH

hasn't read the full thread or thought the OP through...yet is already willing to make a misguided post .

only in ISH

[masonanddixon]

Wiggins is going to be a total bust. Can't shoot, can't dribble, can't play defense. Cavs screwed up yet another #1 pick.

[JtotheIzzo]

Wiggins is going to be a total bust. Can't shoot, can't dribble, can't play defense. Cavs screwed up yet another #1 pick.

Can't shoot or play defense? you must be a scout...:lol

[masonanddixon]

Can't shoot or play defense? you must be a scout...:lol

His shooting mechanics are atrocious. Seems like a nice guy but man is he going to be exposed this upcoming season.

[JtotheIzzo]

His shooting mechanics are atrocious. Seems like a nice guy but man is he going to be exposed this upcoming season.

So you have retracted your ridiculous defense statement then?

His shooting is not an issue, it is more than acceptable for someone his age.

[East_Stone_Ya]

hasn't read the full thread or thought the OP through...yet is already willing to make a misguided post .

only in ISH

I admit I didn't read the whole thread but c'mon your statement is really outrageous...but feel free to feel that way. Hopefully he does perform better than last years first pick