Are the Heat still contenders?

[Roundball_Rock]

With the Heat retaining Bosh and finding an all-star caliber replacement for LeBron (as opposed to a D-leaguer like Pete Myers :lol ) are the Heat still contenders? They are bringing back basically the same core, with the one significant change being Deng in place of LeBron. This will test the proposition of how much a GOAT-caliber player brings versus a run-of-the-mill all-star at his position. They won 54 games in 2014, but they did that while resting Wade for much of the season and coasting. They should win 50+ next year and fight for at least the #2 seed (the Bulls should win the #1 seed comfortably) with the Cavs and Pacers, although I suspect they likely would wind up placing 4th. The Heat won't have the luxury of coasting through the regular season next year because seeding will be of paramount importance to them. I could see them as high as #2 and as low as #6 next year.

What do you think? Are the Heat still elite or will they fade into mediocrity? I had them as a 40-45 win team but with Deng they should be competitive and probably be the 3rd-5th best team in the conference, depending on how the Cavs shake out, whether the Raptors second half last year was legit and if the Pacers keep Lance and Hibbert.

The East is still much weaker than the West but the East champion will have to go through at least two legitimate rounds of competition this year thanks to the return of Rose and the dissolution of the "Big 3" instead of being able to coast until the ECF like the Heat did in 11', 13' and 14'. I expect the East champion to be a lot more competitive in the Finals next year, even if it likely would lose to OKC/SAS/LAC.

[The_Night_Elf]

Kinda see 45-49 wins. want to see if they sign anyone else though. They wouldn't be my favourites to make it out of the East and even if they did it would be a no contest against whomever comes out of the west.

[SamuraiSWISH]

The Pete Myers dig would make sense here if Wade was at his peak 2009 form, the way Pippen was at his peak in 1994. So the comparison you're attempting tip make isn't accurate. We get it, you're insecure about Pippen's place in the history of the game, but you need to get over it.

[Inactive]

They should be.

Lebron replaced with a borderline all-star/one of the best 2 way SFs. Modest roster improvements with McBob, and Granger. Wade gets to dominate the ball, Bosh gets more scoring opportunities in the paint.

If Wade can somehow become healthy, they should hardly miss Lebron. If Wade is really as done as he's looked recently, then they might not be real contenders, but I think they will be a top team in the East either way.

[GOBB]

Playoff contenders? Certainly. Finals contenders? Not a chance.

[MostHated305]

Playoff contenders? Certainly. Finals contenders? Not a chance.

So who do you have going to the finals for the East?

[Roundball_Rock]

The Pete Myers dig would make sense here if Wade was at his peak 2009 form, the way Pippen was at his peak in 1994.

94' Pippen>15' Wade. However, 94' Pippen/94' Grant/94' Armstrong<15' Wade/15' Bosh/15' Deng. I am giving props to Pat Riley. Deng and Ariza were the only realistic options for a quality SF and the godfather was able to bring one home. The 2015 Heat are a great thought experiment: a contender with the same crew except with a GOAT-caliber player replaced by an all-star caliber player (think the 89' Celtics with Reggie Lewis filling in for Bird). It will be fascinating to see how they fare. I think they will be competitive, probably around 50 wins and a second round thrashing at the hands of the Bulls or Cavs.


I'm just happy that the East looks a fair bit stronger this year. With the Cavs, Heat, Pacers, Bulls, Raps, Hawks and Wizards all likely to be very good/good teams.

Yup. :applause: The East is wide open now. The Bulls are nominal favorites, but even they have a big question mark, and they aren't a tier above the rest.

Do people see the Heat at least likely to reach the ECF?

[SilkkTheShocker]

If everything goes right I can see them being the 3rd best team in the division.

[PJR]

No one in the East is a contender. Some one will be in the Finals by default, and Miami can certainly be that team. Chicago, Cleveland, Washington, Indiana, Miami, Toronto...all in the hunt. None will be world beaters.

[crisoner]

Playoffs in the East....yup

Contenders to go to the Finals in the East....YUP!

Winning it all...NOPE!

[BoNafidde]

At best they will lose in the second round of playoffs if not the first.

[navy]

No.

[boozehound]

no, not contenders. A playoff team? sure. They are probably the 5th best team in the east

[Inactive]

94' Pippen>15' Wade. However, 94' Pippen/94' Grant/94' Armstrong<15' Wade/15' Bosh/15' Deng. I am giving props to Pat Riley. Deng and Ariza were the only realistic options for a quality SF and the godfather was able to bring one home. The 2015 Heat are a great thought experiment: a contender with the same crew except with a GOAT-caliber player replaced by an all-star caliber player (think the 89' Celtics with Reggie Lewis filling in for Bird). It will be fascinating to see how they fare. I think they will be competitive, probably around 50 wins and a second round thrashing at the hands of the Bulls or Cavs.



Yup. :applause: The East is wide open now. The Bulls are nominal favorites, but even they have a big question mark, and they aren't a tier above the rest.

Do people see the Heat at least likely to reach the ECF?I can't wait to see how it turns out.

It seems like many people are discounting the idea that Bosh, Wade, and possibly others will step into bigger roles to make up for Lebron's absence. They seem to think that Bosh is just going to be a 15 ppg spot up shooter, and Wade isn't going to be more productive when he gets to control the ball and go back to scoring off of p&r instead of cuts, and curls.

[shady6121]

Considering how bad the East still is, they could still potentially make the NBA Finals next season but then get demolished by a Western Conference team.

[Roundball_Rock]

I can't wait to see how it turns out.

It seems like many people are discounting the idea that Bosh, Wade, and possibly others will step into bigger roles to make up for Lebron's absence. They seem to think that Bosh is just going to be a 15 ppg spot up shooter, and Wade isn't going to be more productive when he gets to control the ball and go back to scoring off of p&r instead of cuts, and curls.

Exactly. They will increase their production to fill some of the void and Deng will supply 15-18 ppg. This is why the Myers thing was such a shame. We could have had a chance to see the GOAT himself replaced by a legitimate SG, i.e. Jeff Hornacek (comparable among 90's SG's to Deng among today's SF's, namely a borderline all-star type player. The Bulls attempted to trade for him in mid-season but Krause failed unlike the godfather). The only other case like this I can think of is the 89' Celtics where Reggie Lewis was inserted into the line-up for Bird (the Celtics fell from 57-25 to 42-40 that year). I suspect what will happen is Miami will remain very competitive, although diminished (i.e. going from favorites in the East to 4th-5th place)--but the Cavs make a jump from 33 wins to 54-57 with LeBron.

[pegasus]

I think they'll be top-4 in the East and make the ECF. They may not make the finals, but that's mainly because the East has gotten a lot stronger. I'd put my money on the Heat vs. the Cavs in the playoffs.

[TheMan]

The Pete Myers dig would make sense here if Wade was at his peak 2009 form, the way Pippen was at his peak in 1994. So the comparison you're attempting tip make isn't accurate. We get it, you're insecure about Pippen's place in the history of the game, but you need to get over it.
This

Everything the OP posts either props up LeBron/Pippen, or throwing shade at Jordan.

[Da Hammer]

There is no great team in the East. Miami, Chicago, Cleveland, Indiana are all pretty much lumped together. Although I would consider Inidiana the best team out of the bunch if they resign Stephenson. Heat will probably win 50 games though.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

LeBron left for an even more stacked team, but Miami will still be a STRONG playoff contender. In a historically weak conference, making the finals isn't out of the question.

[Roundball_Rock]

There is no great team in the East. Miami, Chicago, Cleveland, Indiana are all pretty much lumped together.

Yup. One of Toronto/Washington/Atlanta likely will join that group in the East's first tier.


This

Everything the OP posts either props up LeBron/Pippen, or throwing shade at Jordan.

:biggums: I am saying the Heat will be solid without LeBron. To prop up LeBron wouldn't I be arguing the Heat will be garbage without him? What does Pippen have to do with this? Jordan? How does this thread diminish MJ? I even referred to MJ as GOAT for the first time since 2009. :lol As all NBA fans know, the core that won 55 games without Jordan won 72 games with him. MJ fans need to get over his team being talented. His team winning 55 doesn't diminish him just as the Heat winning 48-52 next year won't diminish LeBron. :lol MJ stans need to relax with the insecurity. The 94' Bulls were referenced for the same reason the 89' Celtics were: losing a GOAT-caliber player. I could have tossed in the 92' Lakers or the 97' Magic (who replaced Shaq with a 17/10 center) but those teams collapsed. The 94' Bulls are the more appropriate parallel to the 15' Heat.

[Nash]

Problem is no point guard play and no bigs. What will be their style? No small ball without Lebron and can't expect Chalmers to take over PG duties full time now.

[Legends66NBA7]

Yup. One of Toronto/Washington/Atlanta likely will join that group in the East's first tier.

I think there will be a swap in tiers. I feel Toronto with their first full year together with the core that got them a 55 win pace post Rudy Gay trade and a better bench will be better than Indiana if they don't resign Stephenson. There is also no real threat to Toronto in their division as of now. Atlanta will be there too, but you wonder if Al Horford gets injured again. Washington has potentially 3 players starting all over 30+ years old and no real bench depth to speak off. It also has journey men Drew Gooden and Andre Miller returning, who are also well over 30+. Miller's best days are behind him and Gooden is known for his inconsistent play.

Once teams starts filling out the rest of their roster, then we can accurately try to rank these teams. I agree that there's isn't a true great team in the East right now, which makes it really fun to get ready for the upcoming season.

At least for now, the division leaders for each squad should be: Toronto, Chicago, and Miami.

[BigBoss]

If everything goes right I can see them being the 3rd best team in the division.

Them?!!!!

Weren't you riding with them last year? What happened???

[KungFuJoe]

Them?!!!!

Weren't you riding with them last year? What happened???

He's a Cleveland fan now. Been one since '62.

[Ne 1]

Them?!!!!

Weren't you riding with them last year? What happened???
http://i60.tinypic.com/2afajcl.jpg

[Byobob]

LeBron left for an even more stacked team, but Miami will still be a STRONG playoff contender. In a historically weak conference, making the finals isn't out of the question.


If Bran left Miami for a more stacked team, then CLE is a lock for ECF champs!?

[Meticode]

I think the Heat are contenders in the East because when you look at the team's on paper, no one stands out as a great team. Indiana would be the pick, but the have to reigns Stephenson. otherwise their fill-in for Stephenson will be C.J. Miles.

I think Indiana and Chicago will a top the East probably. After I have no clue.

[guy]

Hilarious how obsessed RR is with 1994:oldlol: dude is having a wet dream thinking about next season and all the new w/Lebron, w/o Lebron, w/Wade, w/o Wade, etc pace calculations he gets to make :roll:

[jlip]

As I said in another thread, I think the signing of Granger may be huge especially for their bench. I honestly do not believe he has fallen off as much as it appears since his injury. I feel that he simply lost his starting job in Indiana to a younger, slightly better player at the same position while he was injured. At that point he became expendable due to the presence of Paul George. If he is healthy he could be a 12-15 ppg 6th MOY candidate who doesn't give you that of much drop off when Deng goes to the bench.

[INDI]

Not for a championship but they'll probably be one of the top teams in the East and win a round.

I'm just happy that the East looks a fair bit stronger this year. With the Cavs, Heat, Pacers, Bulls, Raps, Hawks and Wizards all likely to be very good/good teams.

Sleeping on Brooklyn. If Lopez has a relatively injury free season, Brooklyn will get off to a way better start than last year. They lost Pierce but signed a few promising looking players and a way more established coach. I say Brooklyn is just as good as the heat this year

[RoundMoundOfReb]

not title contenders but they are a playoff team

[francesco totti]

i feel they are brooklyn nets of last year...

[Roundball_Rock]

Sleeping on Brooklyn. If Lopez has a relatively injury free season, Brooklyn will get off to a way better start than last year. They lost Pierce but signed a few promising looking players and a way more established coach. I say Brooklyn is just as good as the heat this year

Good point. They struggled out the gate and lost their best player. They should be better this year in terms of their record.

[poido123]

I'd love to see the Cavs and heat match up in the playoffs.

Would be an awesome series that I'd imagine would have some drama in it.

To answer OPs question, no they aren't.

Wade can't do any heavy lifting anymore and they still don't have any toughness inside.

[Jasper]

I think it would be fantastic if they get to the eastern finals....

Which I think it is possible.

The issue is can their old players remember how to play bball without bron doing everything :pimp:

Perfect example was their PG , who used to beable to take open shots as well as drive the ball to the rake... last year all I saw him do was walk around like he had game..:oldlol: