Dr J's Top 5

[LeBird]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZjopaoa_Lg

He goes on to say that he picked his 5 when he was 14-15 years old and hasn't changed them since.

In no order:

Russell
Wilt
Baylor
Oscar
West

Steven A and Skip keep hassling him about Jordan, and without being controversial you saw he wasn't going to give him the kind of props they thought Jordan deserved.

In fact, he even started talking about Russell having more rings or that the competition has been lessened through more teams. :lol

I wonder what the other greats would really say if they weren't scared to be inundated with Jordan stans trying to burn their house down.

[SouBeachTalents]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZjopaoa_Lg

He goes on to say that he picked his 5 when he was 14-15 years old and hasn't changed them since.

In no order:

Russell
Wilt
Baylor
Oscar
West

Steven A and Skip keep hassling him about Jordan, and without being controversial you saw he wasn't going to give him the kind of props they thought Jordan deserved.

In fact, he even started talking about Russell having more rings or that the competition has been lessened through more teams. :lol

I wonder what the other greats would really say if they weren't scared to be inundated with Jordan stans trying to burn their house down.

:biggums:

[navy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZjopaoa_Lg

He goes on to say that he picked his 5 when he was 14-15 years old and hasn't changed them since.



While Im not here to pick apart his list, this kind of mentality is straight up toxic. Hopefully he had great reasons for his list and wasnt blinded by nostalgia.

[LeBird]

I think he said that simply because he probably thinks he's better than his contemporaries and this absolves him from having to give them a lot of credit.

[CavaliersFTW]

The Doctor always keeping things real f*ck the media hype, he's absolutely right about them, they say rings and they leave out Bill Russell and half his Celtic teammates, they say stats and the leave out Wilt, Oscar, Baylor and a whole slew of other legends. They SAW Jordan because Jordan came and did a lot of great things at the right time to be seen doing them. But many other players were doing and had done great things in the game of basketball before the Jordan era. They get swept under the rug by the media. The Doctor is a true student of the history of the game, he knows about players most media "experts" on the mic don't even recognize.

[kennethgriffin]

he's so god damn bitter

i hate jordan and even i say hes arguably the goat with kareem or russell

you'd have to be mentally challenged to leave him off the top 5


if you watch the whole interview. he actually put 8 guys over jordan


- nate archibald
- george gervin
- pete maravich
- bill russell
- wilt chamberlain
- elgin baylor
- jerry west
- oscar robertson

and he even went as far as to say rings don't matter at all or they mean everything. he has no understanding of value in terms of performance

he said either "robert horry is better than jordan and bill is the best ever... or i'm the best ever... take it or leave it"

in a nutshell he's a clown. he's butthurt. hes so damn envious of players with multiple nba titles.

he loathes jordan

he's a moron

[kennethgriffin]

The Doctor always keeping things real f*ck the media hype, he's absolutely right about them, they say rings and they leave out Bill Russell and half his Celtic teammates, they say stats and the leave out Wilt, Oscar, Baylor and a whole slew of other legends. They SAW Jordan because Jordan came and did a lot of great things at the right time to be seen doing them. But many other players were doing and had done great things in the game of basketball before the Jordan era. They get swept under the rug by the media. The Doctor is a true student of the history of the game, he knows about players most media "experts" on the mic don't even recognize.

there wasnt a god damn shred of realism or truth to what he said

**** off lol

everything he said was era biased/agenda driven/ring bashing

[CavaliersFTW]

he's so god damn bitter

i hate jordan and even i say hes arguably the goat with kareem or russell

you'd have to be mentally challenged to leave him off the top 5


if you watch the whole interview. he actually put 8 guys over jordan


- nate archibald
- george gervin
- pete maravich
- bill russell
- wilt chamberlain
- elgin baylor
- jerry west
- oscar robertson

and he even went as far as to say rings don't matter at all or they mean everything. he has no understanding of value in terms of performance

he said either "robert horry is better than jordan and bill is the best ever... or i'm the best ever... take it or leave it"

in a nutshell he's a clown. he's butthurt. hes so damn envious of players with multiple nba titles.

he loathes jordan

he's a moron
nah, he's none of those things you claim

[kennethgriffin]

nah, he's none of those things you claim

hes such an angry person. anyone can see this. youre blind

[CavaliersFTW]

hes such an angry person. anyone can see this. youre blind
seems pretty chill to me

[Milbuck]

West and Oscar over Jordan :oldlol:

[jstern]

I have no problem with Dr. J having his own opinion, but the OP saying that the other greats all say Jordan because they're afraid, and people like Dr J are so brave is so :facepalm ,

I mean that's basically saying that all these players who think Jordan is the GOAT, Bird, Barkley, Kobe, Magic Johnson, are extremely weak minded.

[ArbitraryWater]

Dude is a bit delusional basically ignoring everything happening after the 1960's :lol

This is fapping material for guys like CavaliersFTW though

[kennethgriffin]

seems pretty chill to me

i thought you knew about past generations. but it seems your knowledge stops after the 60's

dr j, bill, wilt, frazier... these guys were renound older era promoters and jordan haters, new era bashers

they all leave pretty much any modern day player or anyone from 1980-2014 off any list for anything

dr J couldnt even stand other people sudgesting that he might not be the greatest dunker ever on that round table discussion..

the look dr j gave tmac when he said vince was better was like he wanted to strangle him

its common knowledge that julius is a hard headed individual that prides himself on promoting past players and trashing titles

i mean how can you respect anyone who says robert horrys 7 rings are better than jordans 6

well HE JUST SAID THAT

keeping it real? get the **** outa here

[kennethgriffin]

people need to realize that its possible to not say jordan is the best ever. but still have him in your top 5


this is the same thing kobe and his fans had to put up with the last 18 years

kobe used to either be #1 or #2 on someones mvp ballot. or left off the top 5 all together

same with the espn all time rankings vote. kobe gets the 2nd most first place votes... and ends up 8th all time because 100,000 out of the 200,000 people left him off their list all together


just buthurt people


i'm not one of them... i have jordan 2nd all time. arguably best ever. i just think kareem has a slightly better resume

i also have lebron top 10 tied with hakeem. thats more than fair considering he only has 2 titles.

people need to be as understanding as i am

[LeBird]

I have no problem with Dr. J having his own opinion, but the OP saying that the other greats all say Jordan because they're afraid, and people like Dr J are so brave is so :facepalm ,

I mean that's basically saying that all these players who think Jordan is the GOAT, Bird, Barkley, Kobe, Magic Johnson, are extremely weak minded.

Whenever players are asked about other greats they give political answers at the best of times. With Jordan, it's a whole other level.

Jordan himself is a bit of a bully in this regard - just look how insecure he is about Lebron. When there are so many deluded people both in the media and, especially, fans; then you can become a pariah pretty quick.

[LA Lakers]

I think he is bitter. Could be cuz so many best show in town scoring acts Mike, Lebron, Kobe, Drexler, Wilkens, etc etc etc etc etc etc idolized Dr. J and modeled so much of their own games after him. Not saying he shouldn't have Michael Jordan in his top five, that is ludicrous to me, but he is certainly entitled to his opinion and is a TEACHER of the game, he taught while students learned. Lets not forget his prime years in the ABA were not seen by the majority of thre public like those Chicago teams in the 90's were seen and recognized not just nationwide, but by the entire world. So it is probably a combination of bitterness towards the younger generations of players like the Jordans and Lebrons that followed in his footsteps as a player and a superstar scorer combined with his own impact on the game and history that created his list with some obvious omissions. I thought he always said Kareem was the greatest?

[Soundwave]

Whenever players are asked about other greats they give political answers at the best of times. With Jordan, it's a whole other level.

Jordan himself is a bit of a bully in this regard - just look how insecure he is about Lebron. When there are so many deluded people both in the media and, especially, fans; then you can become a pariah pretty quick.

Jordan hasn't said anything that controversial about LeBron. He gave him props and said it was very close between him and Kobe but he picked Kobe only on the basis of overall titles (which LeBron may eventually match).

That and he said if he was covering LeBron he'd force him left. Which is pretty much what you're taught in 7th grade gym class.

He's also said LeBron is the best player in the game today.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Chris Paul is one of my favorite players ever, but that doesn't mean he's top 5 all-time. I would pay money to see PEAK Vince Carter play, but like Paul, it doesn't mean he's top 5 nor has a case for "GOAT".

Putting my biases aside, when you add everything together (rings, stats, accolades, honors, accomplishments etc.), Russell/Kareem/Jordan/Wilt all have legit cases for GOAT.

[kennethgriffin]

the top 6 all time is pretty much set in stone

- kareem
- jordan
- russell
- wilt
- magic
- bird

doesnt matter how many rings kobe wins or how many espn mvps lebron gets. neither guy will get in that top 6 cause theres some kind of nostalgia bump that continues to be used to prop them up.



the next 5 is also set in stone

- kobe
- duncan
- shaq
- hakeem
- lebron



these guys get the short end of the stick. a few of them could be argued for the top 5-6 place. but its just the way history goes. gotta come first or win in the most popular era

[inclinerator]

jordon's reaction

http://www.thefumble.com/sites/captainwag.com/files/giphy_4.gif

[SouBeachTalents]

the top 6 all time is pretty much set in stone

- kareem
- jordan
- russell
- wilt
- magic
- bird

doesnt matter how many rings kobe wins or how many espn mvps lebron gets. neither guy will get in that top 6 cause theres some kind of nostalgia bump that continues to be used to prop them up.



the next 5 is also set in stone

- kobe
- duncan
- shaq
- hakeem
- lebron



these guys get the short end of the stick. a few of them could be argued for the top 5-6 place. but its just the way history goes. gotta come first or win in the most popular era

Order issues aside, I agree 100% with those two tiers

[ArbitraryWater]

I don't think he understands... GREATEST.

Guys with dominant impact, stats, winning, accolades, peak play, playoff performance...

NOT favorite players to watch, most entertaining, who you'd pay to see...


It's weird, he always mentions that to kind of cop out..

Basically said Tiny Archibald and George Gervin are the GOAT's not including rings :lol (Yet then went on to explain it by saying those are the players he'd want to see play)

[LA Lakers]

Kuniva Almighty just summed up the entire history of basketball invented by Dr. James Naismith. When you add up all the years and sagas and battles, it comes down to Wilt, Kareem, Russell, and Jordan. Jordan the only perimeter player/ scoring guard of the group. That says something about Michael's greatness. Basically the other guys are mostly seven feet tall. Huge. Athletic freaks.Genetic advantage. Bill Russell played underneath the basket his entire career so he is a Kareem and a Wilt. But yeah, those four names. If Im rounding out a top five I add Magic for overall impact and accomplishments as well.

[JimmyMcAdocious]

Is that what these players typically do? They go up to their era, with slight favoritism to those they played against/with for obvious reasons.

Nothing wrong with that. Take it with a grain of salt like you would any somewhat knowledge person's list.

[LA Lakers]

Also Kenneth Griffin, I agree. Top 6. Set in stone in my opinion. But a lot of guys have Elgin and Oscar and Jerry West set in stone. Sure my father would take some of them. I think Wilt, Kareem and Bill Russell should be the three intangibles. Although how can Michael Jordan not be an intangible, right? He is synonymous with the words "basketball."

[kennethgriffin]

Order issues aside, I agree 100% with those two tiers

its just so sad that this nostalgia boost is used.. because realistically.. imagine if

- kobe
- duncan
- shaq
- hakeem
- lebron

all came before

- kareem
- russell
- wilt
- magic
- bird


people might see things differently

[kennethgriffin]

in all honesty. in terms of dominance if all these guys were placed into todays nba all in their primes

- kobe > Magic
- duncan > Russell
- shaq > wilt
- hakeem > kareem
- lebron > Bird



brutally honest...

i will admit theyre set in stone over new era players. but i think if both were in todays league. the newer legends would outperform the old ones

magic played during an era and on a team where defense didnt matter
russell played on a team that was so stacked that it didnt matter if he only shot 40% and only scored 15 points... plus in an era where theres only 8 teams
kareem needed 4 other hall of famers just to win his 2nd,3rd,4th,5th,6th titles
wilt was a choker, underachiever
bird had a short career. really only had 9 good years. had no athleticism.



i mean... yeah the guys who came first are better by default. thats just how era boosts go

you come before someone. youre better in the publics eyes. i know that


but if we take away all the bias. things are different

[Soundwave]

LeBron can get into the top six.

So could Kobe really, it's just that he probably doesn't have enough tread left in his career, especially with the Lakers going where they are, him coming off a major injury, and age.

If Kobe led the Lakers to another title as the no.1 option I'd rank him above Bird and Magic and I'm not even a big Kobe fan.

[kennethgriffin]

LeBron can get into the top six.

So could Kobe really, it's just that he probably doesn't have enough tread left in his career, especially with the Lakers going where they are, him coming off a major injury, and age.

If Kobe led the Lakers to another title as the no.1 option I'd rank him above Bird and Magic and I'm not even a big Kobe fan.

kobe is either already top 6 or he never will be top 6

thats just the way nostalgia boosts go


if

5 nba titles
2 finals mvps
all time record 1st team all nba's,
all time record 1st team d's,
all time record consecutive allstar games
81 point game
4th all time scorer

isnt better than

3 nba titles
2 finalsl mvps
a 60 point game




NOW


then it doesnt matter what kobe does

##########################nostalgiaboost




#############################****BIRD


:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[215Philly]

the top 6 all time is pretty much set in stone

- kareem
- jordan
- russell
- wilt
- magic
- bird

doesnt matter how many rings kobe wins or how many espn mvps lebron gets. neither guy will get in that top 6 cause theres some kind of nostalgia bump that continues to be used to prop them up.



the next 5 is also set in stone

- kobe
- duncan
- shaq
- hakeem
- lebron



these guys get the short end of the stick. a few of them could be argued for the top 5-6 place. but its just the way history goes. gotta come first or win in the most popular era
Soo much truth right here :applause: Samething applies to other sports & music

[Soundwave]

kobe is either already top 6 or he never will be top 6

thats just the way nostalgia boosts go


if

5 nba titles
2 finals mvps
all time record 1st team all nba's,
all time record 1st team d's,
all time record consecutive allstar games
81 point game
4th all time scorer

isnt better than

3 nba titles
2 finalsl mvps
a 60 point game




NOW


then it doesnt matter what kobe does

##########################nostalgiaboost




#############################****BIRD


:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

The difference between leading your team as the no.1 option to 2 titles versus 3 is a fairly significant one in GOAT rankings I think.

[LA Lakers]

Okay nevermind KennethGriffin youre honest but also misinformed if you think those guys wouldnt dominate todays league too. Especially Wilt and Kareem for having a clear genetic advantage over any player not named Shaq.

[kennethgriffin]

The difference between leading your team as the no.1 option to 2 titles versus 3 is a fairly significant one in GOAT rankings I think.


kobes lead the lakers in FGA's per game and total for 4 out of his 5 titles

and almost tied or lead in scoring for 4 out of 5 titles

but if you wanna just count finals mvps.. both bird and kobe are tied

and also if you wanna just talk stats

kobes stats for his 5 titles >>>>>>> birds stats for his 3 titles

and without a doubt

kobes

2001 playoffs
2009 playoffs
2010 playoffs


= light years ahead of anything bird ever did

bird lost a finals mvp to cedric maxwell.. kobe would never do that.

only guy who can come close to knocking asside kobe was absolute prime shaq. and even he only outscored kobe by 2 points combined over those 3 titles

kobe = 25ppg from 2000-2002
shaq = 27ppg from 2000-2002


sorry but without the nostalgia boost. kobe tops bird

[kennethgriffin]

Okay nevermind KennethGriffin youre honest but also misinformed if you think those guys wouldnt dominate todays league too. Especially Wilt and Kareem for having a clear genetic advantage over any player not named Shaq.

i give players every bit as much respect for what they do in their eras. if a guy dominates it. then i give them goat consideration

russell is one of my top 3. hes arguably the goat

i also say wilt had the greatest prime


but it doesnt translate

and especially for non bigs. those guys wouldnt cut it


jerry west would get his pocket picked 24/7 with those sh*t handles

[jlip]

He actually said that Kareem was the GOAT a few years ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8bIDEtpOMs#t=0m15s

Just last year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ3nJ7ZfiF8

[Soundwave]

kobes lead the lakers in FGA's per game and total for 4 out of his 5 titles

and almost tied or lead in scoring for 4 out of 5 titles

but if you wanna just count finals mvps.. both bird and kobe are tied

and also if you wanna just talk stats

kobes stats for his 5 titles >>>>>>> birds stats for his 3 titles

and without a doubt

kobes

2001 playoffs
2009 playoffs
2010 playoffs


= light years ahead of anything bird ever did

bird lost a finals mvp to cedric maxwell.. kobe would never do that.

only guy who can come close to knocking asside kobe was absolute prime shaq. and even he only outscored kobe by 2 points combined over those 3 titles

kobe = 25ppg from 2000-2002
shaq = 27ppg from 2000-2002


sorry but without the nostalgia boost. kobe tops bird

I have Kobe in my top 6 though it's close.

I don't think nostalgia is that big of a factor. Guy's in their prime get a bounce too because you need time away from the immediacy of the championship honeymoon to probably analyze their entire career.

When the Lakers were winning championships, people rated Kobe higher, now that he got injured and is a few years removed from titles, the rating of his career is more objective.

Ditto for LeBron, he looked ready to jump into the top 5/6 this year, but losing that Finals hurts.

You need to also see the tail end of these guys' career to properly evaluate (see: Shaq).

[ArbitraryWater]

kenneth griffin.. **** off you shithead

[ArbitraryWater]

I have Kobe in my top 6 though it's close.

I don't think nostalgia is that big of a factor. Guy's in their prime get a bounce too because you need time away from the immediacy of the championship honeymoon to probably analyze their entire career.

When the Lakers were winning championships, people rated Kobe higher, now that he got injured and is a few years removed from titles, the rating of his career is more objective.

Ditto for LeBron, he looked ready to jump into the top 5/6 this year, but losing that Finals hurts.

You need to also see the tail end of these guys' career to properly evaluate (see: Shaq).


:biggums:

[Kblaze8855]

I wonder if John Havlicek had people acting like his 8 titles(6 as a star, I think 4 as leading scorer, and 2 as his teams leader) made him better than people who didnt stack extra rings on top of an already great career by spending time under a greater bigman....

Well I dont really wonder. I know they did. You should see some of the articles that came out late in his career. People put him over Russell and Baylor in some circles.

But now or then....big picture wise...not enough people will give Kobe full 5 ring credit when 3 came with Shaq....and Hondo didnt get 8 credit when 6 came with Bill. Not from enough people to tip the scales of history.


The rest is just talk.

Shaq is coming up every time Kobes 5 rings gets mentioned until the end of time. Well after the people in question even remember either of them....."Shaq put up 38ppg in the finals" is getting mentioned.

Fighting it is just a waste of keystrokes.

But ive never gone easy on my keyboard so...go right ahead.

[kennethgriffin]

simple fact

if kobe did what he did

in the 60's - hes top 5
in the 80's - hes top 5
in the 90's - hes top 3


but since he did it

in the 00's - hes top 10 ... nothing more.


if kobe came before bird... and if bird won his 3 ships in the 2000's... nobody would have bird even a country mile within being mentioned in the same breath as kobe

fact

[Hey Yo]

the top 6 all time is pretty much set in stone

- kareem
- jordan
- russell
- wilt
- magic
- bird

doesnt matter how many rings kobe wins or how many espn mvps lebron gets. neither guy will get in that top 6 cause theres some kind of nostalgia bump that continues to be used to prop them up.



the next 5 is also set in stone

- kobe
- duncan
- shaq
- hakeem
- lebron



these guys get the short end of the stick. a few of them could be argued for the top 5-6 place. but its just the way history goes. gotta come first or win in the most popular era
5 of your top 6 played both ends of the floor.

Magic barely gave an effort to play defense. He's not worthy of top 6. Closer to 12th than 6th.

[ArbitraryWater]

I wonder if John Havlicek had people acting like his 8 titles(6 as a star, I think 4 as leading scorer, and 2 as his teams leader) made him better than people who didnt stack extra rings on top of an already great career by spending time under a greater bigman....

Well I dont really wonder. I know they did. You should see some of the articles that came out late in his career. People put him over Russell and Baylor in some circles.

But now or then....big picture wise...not enough people will give Kobe full 5 ring credit when 3 came with Shaq....and Hondo didnt get 8 credit when 6 came with Bill. Not from enough people to tip the scales of history.


The rest is just talk.

Shaq is coming up every time Kobes 5 rings gets mentioned until the end of time. Well after the people in question even remember either of them....."Shaq put up 38ppg in the finals" is getting mentioned.

Fighting it is just a waste of keystrokes.

But ive never gone easy on my keyboard so...go right ahead.

Shaq better be brought up because Kobe was a highly replacable peace... I wont cherry pick two back to back 45+ pt games, but I can tell you (not you directly) his overall production / impact in 2000 and 2002 could have been replaced by any great, ever.. like top 50 range.

2001 not the exact impact/production, only top 15 guys, but theyd still win... Too large of a room for error.

[kennethgriffin]

5 of your top 6 played both ends of the floor.

Magic barely gave an effort to play defense. He's not worthy of top 6. Closer to 12th than 6th.

its not so much my top 6

just the general consensus

i'm saying theres no way anyone can pass them. not even bird


because kobe/duncan both already should have passed larry. but havent

so nobody ever will

not only did kobe and duncan accomplish way more. but played at a high level twice as long

kobe was 1st team all nba in his 17th year

duncan was 1st team all nba in his 16th year

bird was washed up by his 10th year


so yeah...

bird sucks ****. but hes guaranteed to always be top 6. and it doesnt matter what any idiot trys to tell me or anyone else


NOSTALGIA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[SHAQisGOAT]

in all honesty. in terms of dominance if all these guys were placed into todays nba all in their primes

- kobe > Magic
- duncan > Russell
- shaq > wilt
- hakeem > kareem
- lebron > Bird



brutally honest...

i will admit theyre set in stone over new era players. but i think if both were in todays league. the newer legends would outperform the old ones

magic played during an era and on a team where defense didnt matter
russell played on a team that was so stacked that it didnt matter if he only shot 40% and only scored 15 points... plus in an era where theres only 8 teams
kareem needed 4 other hall of famers just to win his 2nd,3rd,4th,5th,6th titles
wilt was a choker, underachiever
bird had a short career. really only had 9 good years. had no athleticism.



i mean... yeah the guys who came first are better by default. thats just how era boosts go

you come before someone. youre better in the publics eyes. i know that


but if we take away all the bias. things are different

:roll:

Horrible post... Full of fallacies, lies and ignorance, but go on child :rolleyes: :facepalm

[kennethgriffin]

:roll:

Horrible post... Full of fallacies, lies and ignorance, but go on child :rolleyes: :facepalm


http://i62.tinypic.com/2rdb8ck.png

3>10'


:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[ArbitraryWater]

It worries me that kenneth actually believes the stuff he says

[kennethgriffin]

It worries me that kenneth actually believes the stuff he says

it worries me that 100 years from now when 10 different guys all have 2-3 more rings than bird and way more 1st teams/scoring records etc.. and the same or more Fmvps and are STILLLLLLLLL ranked behind larry

and that hick from indiana is STILLLLLLL top 6


because if kobe cant pass bird with more accomplishments and twice as long a career

and duncan cant pass bird with more accomplishments and twice as long a career


then who can?



:oldlol:

if they still need more... what? 6 titles? double up bird to pass him?

then wouldnt someone need 12 rings to pass jordan?

:roll: :roll: :roll:



god bless nostalgia boosts :cheers:

[LAZERUSS]

Of course, Dr. J is the ONLY guy who would come up with a list of the five greatest ever that was not a consensus. Virtually everyone else agrees on an all-time Top-5, right?

[SouBeachTalents]

Of course, Dr. J is the ONLY guy who would come up with a list of the five greatest ever that was not a consensus. Virtually everyone else agrees on an all-time Top-5, right?

I've yet to see a list that has West or Baylor in the top 5 all time

[ArbitraryWater]

it worries me that 100 years from now when 10 different guys all have 2-3 more rings than bird and way more 1st teams/scoring records etc.. and the same or more Fmvps and are STILLLLLLLLL ranked behind larry

and that hick from indiana is STILLLLLLL top 6


because if kobe cant pass bird with more accomplishments and twice as long a career

and duncan cant pass bird with more accomplishments and twice as long a career


then who can?



:oldlol:

if they still need more... what? 6 titles? double up bird to pass him?

then wouldnt someone need 12 rings to pass jordan?

:roll: :roll: :roll:



god bless nostalgia boosts :cheers:

Duncan sure as hell can... more consistent, better rebounder, defender, better playoff performer, more finals mvp's, just one less mvp, longer career, better team mate & leader (?)... Duncan can.

But Kobe can't. Sorry. He's none of those things.

Now you can go erase that 81 pt game argument as it literally means jack shit.

So your main argument is 3 more rings, more ppg, and irrelevant selections like all star games and all nba teams?

cmon now.. weak.

[SHAQisGOAT]

http://i62.tinypic.com/2rdb8ck.png

3>10'


:bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :roll: :roll: :roll:

Wow... Meltdown over so little? :wtf:

You're so mad right now :roll:

Chill out, kid. Oh and stop with the horrible and ignorant posts. You have 0 knowledge and 0 pull.

[kennethgriffin]

in all brutal honesty

i got it like this

#1A) Kareem
#1B) Jordan
#1C) Russell ( his 60's titles are worth atleast half or a bit more )

after those 3 anything is possible from #4 to #7

- Kobe - 5 rings
- Duncan - 5 rings
- Magic - 5 rings
- Wilt - 2 rings ( but he gets a boost due to holding every record )

then after those guys

#8 Shaq
#9 Bird
#10 Hakeem
#11 Bron




this is how the top 10-11 goes... WITHOUT ANY ERA BIAS

NO NOSTALGIA BOOST

straight up

[LAZERUSS]

in all brutal honesty

i got it like this

#1A) Kareem
#1B) Jordan
#1C) Russell ( his 60's titles are worth atleast half or a bit more )

after those 3 anything is possible from #4 to #7

- Kobe - 5 rings
- Duncan - 5 rings
- Magic - 5 rings
- Wilt - 2 rings ( but he gets a boost due to holding every record )

then after those guys

#8 Shaq
#9 Bird
#10 Hakeem
#11 Bron




this is how the top 10-11 goes... WITHOUT ANY ERA BIAS

NO NOSTALGIA BOOST

straight up


So let's just forget the fact that Chamberlain was a career 30-30 player against Russell (143 H2H's), who abused Russell in every facet of the game.

[kennethgriffin]

So let's just forget the fact that Chamberlain was a career 30-30 player against Russell (143 H2H's), who abused Russell in every facet of the game.

wilt was infinitely more talented offensively than russell

but russell was infinitely better at defense/team defense/clutch/leadership

i mean russell coached and played for his last 2 titles

shows what kind of a basketball mind he had

wilt was also a choker and didnt try sometimes to avoid blame ( admittedly )

wilt was beta in a Hercules body

without all the records i'd have him 8th or 9th honestly

[Rameek]

He said these were his favorites as a teenager and they never changed. I dont see why its such an issue.


he's so god damn bitter

i hate jordan and even i say hes arguably the goat with kareem or russell

you'd have to be mentally challenged to leave him off the top 5


if you watch the whole interview. he actually put 8 guys over jordan


- nate archibald
- george gervin
- pete maravich
- bill russell
- wilt chamberlain
- elgin baylor
- jerry west
- oscar robertson

and he even went as far as to say rings don't matter at all or they mean everything. he has no understanding of value in terms of performance

he said either "robert horry is better than jordan and bill is the best ever... or i'm the best ever... take it or leave it"

in a nutshell he's a clown. he's butthurt. hes so damn envious of players with multiple nba titles.

he loathes jordan

he's a moron

His point was if you're counting rings then you have more players that could be considered. SAS later in the interview brought up that who was the go to player the top performer while getting these rings. I forgot Dr. J's response. It's his opinion that the era was the strongest because of less teams.

He qualified his statements multiple times that It's his opinion, he isnt an expert and he is prejudiced.

[LAZERUSS]

wilt was infinitely more talented offensively than russell

but russell was infinitely better at defense/team defense/clutch/leadership

i mean russell coached and played for his last 2 titles

shows what kind of a basketball mind he had

wilt was also a choker and didnt try sometimes to avoid blame ( admittedly )

wilt was beta in a Hercules body

i mean without all the records i'd have him 8th or 9th honestly

What is a "choker" to you?

In Wilt's MUST-WIN playoff games, his teams went 12-11, and he averaged 31.1 ppg, 26.4 rpg, and shot .540 from the field (in post-seasons that shot about .435 on average.)

In his four game seven's against Russell, Wilt outscored Russell, per game, 21.0 to Russell's 13.3 ppg; outrebounded Russell, per game, 28.8 to 24.5 rpg; and outshot Russell from the field by a .638 (yes .638) to .465 margin.

And a PEAK Chamberlain was Russell's equal on defense (and a considerably greater shot-blocker.)

And a PEAK Chamberlain, in their '67 H2H's, outscored Russell, per game, 21.6 to 10.2 ppg; outassisted Russell, per game, 10.0 to 6.0 apg (yes 10 apg!); outrebounded Russell, per game, 32.0 to 23.4 rpg (yes, NINE rpg!); and outshot Russell from the field, by a .556 to .358 margin. All while leading his team to a brutal slaughter of the eight-time defending Celtics.

[SouBeachTalents]

What is a "choker" to you?

In Wilt's MUST-WIN playoff games, his teams went 12-11, and he averaged 31.1 ppg, 26.4 rpg, and shot .540 from the field (in post-seasons that shot about .435 on average.)

In his four game seven's against Russell, Wilt outscored Russell, per game, 21.0 to Russell's 13.3 ppg; outrebounded Russell, per game, 28.8 to 24.5 rpg; and outshot Russell from the field by a .638 (yes .638) to .465 margin.

And a PEAK Chamberlain was Russell's equal on defense (and a considerably greater shot-blocker.)

And a PEAK Chamberlain, in their '67 H2H's, outscored Russell, per game, 21.6 to 10.2 ppg; outassisted Russell, per game, 10.0 to 6.0 apg (yes 10 apg!); outrebounded Russell, per game, 32.0 to 23.4 rpg (yes, NINE rpg!); and outshot Russell from the field, by a .556 to .358 margin. All while leading his team to a brutal slaughter of the eight-time defending Celtics.

Where did you get these stats, basketball reference?

[ralph_i_el]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZjopaoa_Lg

He goes on to say that he picked his 5 when he was 14-15 years old and hasn't changed them since.


Just because you were good at basketball doesn't mean you aren't a ****ing idiot

[Rameek]

in all brutal honesty

i got it like this

#1A) Kareem
#1B) Jordan
#1C) Russell ( his 60's titles are worth atleast half or a bit more )

after those 3 anything is possible from #4 to #7

- Kobe - 5 rings
- Duncan - 5 rings
- Magic - 5 rings
- Wilt - 2 rings ( but he gets a boost due to holding every record )

then after those guys

#8 Shaq
#9 Bird
#10 Hakeem
#11 Bron




this is how the top 10-11 goes... WITHOUT ANY ERA BIAS

NO NOSTALGIA BOOST

straight up

Of course you're biased... You cant appreciate the 50's, 60's and the 70's.
That's why its all subjective. My age group top 10 wouldnt include the same as anyone in there 20's or 30's. Basketball was played and meant different things to different people in different era's.

This isnt exclusive to basketball it goes for sports in general.

[kennethgriffin]

Of course you're biased... You cant appreciate the 50's, 60's and the 70's.
That's why its all subjective. My age group top 10 wouldnt include the same as anyone in there 20's or 30's. Basketball was played and meant different things to different people in different era's.

This isnt exclusive to basketball it goes for sports in general.


da fuq? i have a guy from the 60's and a guy from the 70's in my goat candidacy

i say russell is arguably best ever

but since wilt is anywhere from #4 to #7 i'm a hater? lol

[Rameek]

da fuq? i have a guy from the 60's and a guy from the 70's in my goat candidacy

i say russell is arguably best ever

but since wilt is anywhere from #4 to #7 i'm a hater? lol
Never said anyone is a hater please try to read correctly. Bottom line is its all subjective and biased.

[kennethgriffin]

What is a "choker" to you?

In Wilt's MUST-WIN playoff games, his teams went 12-11, and he averaged 31.1 ppg, 26.4 rpg, and shot .540 from the field (in post-seasons that shot about .435 on average.)

In his four game seven's against Russell, Wilt outscored Russell, per game, 21.0 to Russell's 13.3 ppg; outrebounded Russell, per game, 28.8 to 24.5 rpg; and outshot Russell from the field by a .638 (yes .638) to .465 margin.

And a PEAK Chamberlain was Russell's equal on defense (and a considerably greater shot-blocker.)

And a PEAK Chamberlain, in their '67 H2H's, outscored Russell, per game, 21.6 to 10.2 ppg; outassisted Russell, per game, 10.0 to 6.0 apg (yes 10 apg!); outrebounded Russell, per game, 32.0 to 23.4 rpg (yes, NINE rpg!); and outshot Russell from the field, by a .556 to .358 margin. All while leading his team to a brutal slaughter of the eight-time defending Celtics.

at the end of the day its about how successful you are

wilt was a stat machine. its why hes the only guy in my top 10 with a losing finals record and the only guy with only 2 rings in my top 9


its not like i'm giving him a hard time by saying hes not a goat candidate

:lol

top 4-7... i'm comfortable with any of those spots belonging to him

[LAZERUSS]

Where did you get these stats, basketball reference?


nbastats.net

there are excel spreadsheets on several of the greatest ever.

[LAZERUSS]

at the end of the day its about how successful you are

wilt was a stat machine. its why hes the only guy in my top 10 with a losing finals record and the only guy with only 2 rings in my top 9


its not like i'm giving him a hard time by saying hes not a goat candidate

:lol

top 4-7... i'm comfortable with any of those spots belonging to him

He was 2-0 in the Finals with equal rosters, that were healthy, well-coached, and that played on their regular season level (actually his '72 Laker teammates collectively shot .414 from the field in the playoffs...and they STILL went 12-3 in them.)

[Psileas]

These are his 5 most favorite players, the 5 ones who inspired him the most, he doesn't anywhere mention that they are the ones with the 5 GOAT careers, something which he has repeatedly claimed was Kareem, whom he doesn't even mention here.

Oh, and both Steven and Skip are way more bitter than Doc, due to him omitting MJ, which is what the conversation centered on. I wonder if they'd have agreed with (or cared to comment on) his list if he did list Jordan, but still kept, say, West and Baylor in his list and still left Kareem and Magic out.

[ninephive]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZjopaoa_Lg

He goes on to say that he picked his 5 when he was 14-15 years old and hasn't changed them since.

In no order:

Russell
Wilt
Baylor
Oscar
West

Steven A and Skip keep hassling him about Jordan, and without being controversial you saw he wasn't going to give him the kind of props they thought Jordan deserved.

In fact, he even started talking about Russell having more rings or that the competition has been lessened through more teams. :lol

I wonder what the other greats would really say if they weren't scared to be inundated with Jordan stans trying to burn their house down.
Every player on that list played in the 58-74 window (16 total years) and no player in the FORTY years since breaks the top 5? Wow. This would be like my top 5 list being:

1. Jordan
2. Hakeem
3. Barkley
4. Malone
4. Robinson

[jlip]

These are his 5 most favorite players, the 5 ones who inspired him the most, he doesn't anywhere mention that they are the ones with the 5 GOAT careers, something which he has repeatedly claimed was Kareem, whom he doesn't even mention here.

Oh, and both Steven and Skip are way more bitter than Doc, due to him omitting MJ, which is what the conversation centered on. I wonder if they'd have agreed with (or cared to comment on) his list if he did list Jordan, but still kept, say, West and Baylor in his list and still left Kareem and Magic out.

Yep

He actually said that Kareem was the GOAT a few years ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G8bIDEtpOMs#t=0m15s

Just last year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQ3nJ7ZfiF8

[LAZERUSS]

These are his 5 most favorite players, the 5 ones who inspired him the most, he doesn't anywhere mention that they are the ones with the 5 GOAT careers, something which he has repeatedly claimed was Kareem, whom he doesn't even mention here.

Oh, and both Steven and Skip are way more bitter than Doc, due to him omitting MJ, which is what the conversation centered on. I wonder if they'd have agreed with (or cared to comment on) his list if he did list Jordan, but still kept, say, West and Baylor in his list and still left Kareem and Magic out.

Those two, and Simmons, are the "Three-Stooges" of the so-called "experts."

None of them know anything about the pre-MJ era.

[LeBird]

Oh, and both Steven and Skip are way more bitter than Doc, due to him omitting MJ, which is what the conversation centered on. I wonder if they'd have agreed with (or cared to comment on) his list if he did list Jordan, but still kept, say, West and Baylor in his list and still left Kareem and Magic out.

Yeah, it's not like there weren't other players besides Jordan with a case. I have no problem with people picking Jordan as the GOAT, I just hate the inference that he is so far ahead of the pack that people pretend that it's blasphemous to name others.

[CavaliersFTW]

Yeah, it's not like there weren't other players besides Jordan with a case. I have no problem with people picking Jordan as the GOAT, I just hate the inference that he is so far ahead of the pack that people pretend that it's blasphemous to name others.
:applause:

[NumberSix]

Yeah, it's not like there weren't other players besides Jordan with a case. I have no problem with people picking Jordan as the GOAT, I just hate the inference that he is so far ahead of the pack that people pretend that it's blasphemous to name others.
I always say Michael Jordan is the best of AN era. However, there is no reason to say the best of that particular era is the best of all eras.

[Asukal]

I always say Michael Jordan is the best of AN era. However, there is no reason to say the best of that particular era is the best of all eras.

You forgot to say Lebron is your GOAT. :rolleyes:

[NumberSix]

You forgot to say Lebron is your GOAT. :rolleyes:
LeBron is in my top 4 that doesn't have an order. As is Jordan.

[Asukal]

LeBron is in my top 4 that doesn't have an order. As is Jordan.

Nice cover. Secretly you want him to be the GOAT but he isn't. :oldlol:

Having him in your top 4 is proof enough. :rolleyes:
In all honesty does Lebron deserve to be top 4 GOAT right now? The answer is simply no. And that's not me being biased, he just doesn't deserve to be there yet. :pimp:

[NumberSix]

Nice cover. Secretly you want him to be the GOAT but he isn't. :oldlol:

Having him in your top 4 is proof enough. :rolleyes:
In all honesty does Lebron deserve to be top 4 GOAT right now? The answer is simply no. And that's not me being biased, he just doesn't deserve to be there yet. :pimp:
I'm not "covering" anything. I think it's pretty obvious by what I say in the more serious topics that I don't care about taking unpopular or controversial opinions.

It's also no secret to people familiar with me here that LeBron is not even my favourite player of all time. Shaq is.

[sportjames23]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZjopaoa_Lg

He goes on to say that he picked his 5 when he was 14-15 years old and hasn't changed them since.

In no order:

Russell
Wilt
Baylor
Oscar
West

Steven A and Skip keep hassling him about Jordan, and without being controversial you saw he wasn't going to give him the kind of props they thought Jordan deserved.

In fact, he even started talking about Russell having more rings or that the competition has been lessened through more teams. :lol

I wonder what the other greats would really say if they weren't scared to be inundated with Jordan stans trying to burn their house down.


Fap material for you, huh? :facepalm

[Asukal]

Fap material for you, huh? :facepalm

Anything to bring down MJ. :applause: