Who are the top 5 European players?

[hawkfan]

Who are the top 5 European players?

And no, Manu doesn't qualify since he's from Argentina.

PG: Tony Parker
SG: Drazen Petrovic
PF: Pau Gasol
SF: Dirk Nowitzki
C: Arvydas Sabonis

[fandarko]

Who are the top 5 European players?

And no, Manu doesn't qualify since he's from Argentina.

PG: Tony Parker
SG: Drazen Petrovic
PF: Pau Gasol
SF: Dirk Nowitzki
C: Arvydas Sabonis

Kukoc has to be in there.

Put him instead of either Drazen at SG or Gasol.

[robert de niro]

Kukoc has to be in there.

Put him instead of either Drazen at SG or Gasol.
:facepalm

[Dragic4Life]

Goran Dragic at PG.

[Iceman#44]

Kukoc has to be in there.

Put him instead of either Drazen at SG or Gasol.
Kukoc over Drazen? Are you nuts? :biggums:

[9512]

Lol just goes to show you playing for the bulls and being hyped up by jerry Krause will overrate you. No disrespect to kukoc BTW...

Drazen is uber underrated. He was tough, a dead shooter, and a court rat. He was all NBA 3rd team in 1993 without making the all star team.

[kkb_12]

Talent wise, Kukoc, Drazen and Kreso Cosic are on the same level, but Drazen was the first real professional basketball player in Croatia, or former Yugoslavia, and had tremendous work ethics and habits - which made him number one European player from 1985 to his death - ahead of Sabonis, Galis, Kukoc, Marculionis, Martin, Radja, Divac...

As much as I like Kukoc, he does not have case over Nowitzki - and that is the position he was playing, and no other PG from Europe comes close to Drazen in this consideration.

[Rooster]

Lol just goes to show you playing for the bulls and being hyped up by jerry Krause will overrate you. No disrespect to kukoc BTW...

Drazen is uber underrated. He was tough, a dead shooter, and a court rat. He was all NBA 3rd team in 1993 without making the all star team.

Kukoc was winning everything in Europe like Anthony Parker before he went to play against real pros.

If Drazen was American, just another good player.

Only Nowitki can hold the great players jockstrap

[9512]

Just another good player? he was one of the best shooting guards not named Michael Jordan during his time with the nets.

[LBJ 23]

Udrih
Dragić
Nachbar
Nesterović
Brezec


:D

[Rooster]

Just another good player? he was one of the best shooting guards not named Michael Jordan during his time with the nets.

So was Mitch Richmond

[kkb_12]

Udrih
Dragić
Nachbar
Nesterović
Brezec


:D
If you want Slovenians only, than Vilfan has to be there

[chocolatethunder]

Foreal Bodiroga has to be in there. Petro is so overrated on this board.

[Sakkreth]

Foreal Bodiroga has to be in there. Petro is so overrated on this board.

Haha, no way.

[r0drig0lac]

PG- bodiroga/parker
SG- Drazen/Belov
SF- Kukoc/
PF- Dirk/Gasol
C - Sabonis/Divac?

[kkb_12]

PG- bodiroga/parker
SG- Drazen/Belov
SF- Kukoc/
PF- Dirk/Gasol
C - Sabonis/Divac?

Parker / Dragic / Djordjevic / Bodiroga/ Zdovc / Jasikevicius / Corbalan
Drazen / Belov / Galis / Marciulonis/ Danilovic / Riva / San Epifanio / Berkovich
Nowitzki / Kukoc / Kirilenko / Dalipagic / Stojakovic
P. Gasol / Cosic / Radja / Volkov
Sabonis / Divac / M. Gasol / Meneghin /Rebraca

[TaLvsCuaL]

Parker / Dragic / Djordjevic / Bodiroga/ Zdovc / Jasikevicius / Corbalan
Drazen / Belov / Galis / Marciulonis/ Danilovic / Riva / San Epifanio / Berkovich
Nowitzki / Kukoc / Kirilenko / Dalipagic / Stojakovic
P. Gasol / Cosic / Radja / Volkov
Sabonis / Divac / M. Gasol / Meneghin /Rebraca

Not a bad list but I miss some great players like Navarro for example. "La Bomba" is better than some players in that list.

[iznogood]

Kukoc over Drazen? Are you nuts? :biggums:
Kukoc was always considered to be the more talented. Drazen had greater work ethic though.

[Euroleague]

Not a bad list but I miss some great players like Navarro for example. "La Bomba" is better than some players in that list.

Just Navarro?

Spanoulis ---> best Euroleague player ever.

Riva ----> best Italian League player ever / best Italian national team player ever.

Giannakis ---> all time leading FIBA scorer in Europe and 2nd all time leading FIBA scorer in the world after Schmidt.

E. Rodriguez ---> one of the best Spanish players ever and one of the best European guards of all time.

Then you have also some guys like,

Siskauskas, Papaloukas, Diamantidis, Myers, Delibasic, Kicanovic, Korac (I mean they named an entire European league after him), Brabender, Marciulionis, Tchachenko, Marzorati, Krumins, and etc., etc. the list goes on.....

I think he left out a little more than just La Bomba.

[CHi1PriDe]

Mirotic >>>>>>

AINEC :rockon:

[SupermanOnSteroids]

WHO THE **** in his right mind would like Nowitzki as a SF if he didn't have some sort of agenda?

[jzek]

Spanoulis is better than Jordan in some areas according to Euroleague :confusedshrug:

[Milbuck]

Just Navarro?

Spanoulis ---> best Euroleague player ever.

Riva ----> best Italian League player ever / best Italian national team player ever.

Giannakis ---> all time leading FIBA scorer in Europe and 2nd all time leading FIBA scorer in the world after Schmidt.

E. Rodriguez ---> one of the best Spanish players ever and one of the best European guards of all time.

Then you have also some guys like,

Siskauskas, Papaloukas, Diamantidis, Myers, Delibasic, Kicanovic, Korac (I mean they named an entire European league after him), Brabender, Marciulionis, Tchachenko, Marzorati, Krumins, and etc., etc. the list goes on.....

I think he left out a little more than just La Bomba.
:roll: :roll: :roll:

Just ****ing LOL at the bolded. The guy wasn't even better than Mirotic last year, put up 2.7 ppg in his prime in the NBA, and suddenly in your deluded world he's the best player in Euroleague?

And for the red..it's spelled Giannis, not Giannakis. He may only be 19, but you need to show the greatest Greek player ever some damn respect and spell his name correctly.

[Euroleague]

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Just ****ing LOL at the bolded. The guy wasn't even better than Mirotic last year, put up 2.7 ppg in his prime in the NBA, and suddenly in your deluded world he's the best player in Euroleague?

And for the red..it's spelled Giannis, not Giannakis. He may only be 19, but you need to show the greatest Greek player ever some damn respect and spell his name correctly.

Spanoulis is the best Euroleague player EVER, not just the best "last year", which also was not Mirotic either.

No, it's NOT spelled Giannis idiot. It's spelled Giannakis, as in Panagiotis Giannakis. The guy that Goran Dragic is nicknamed after.

How the hell could Giannis be the 2nd all time leading FIBA scorer in world history when he has never in his entire life played a single game in FIBA senior level?

I am putting you on ignore list.

Your trolling isn't funny anymore.

[robert de niro]

Your trolling isn't funny anymore.
so it was funny before :lebronamazed:

[LongLiveTheKing]

I thought Anthony Parker was the best Euroleague player ever?

[Iceman#44]

Dont forget Sasha Danilovic

[Iceman#44]

Parker / Dragic / Djordjevic / Bodiroga/ Zdovc / Jasikevicius / Corbalan
Drazen / Belov / Galis / Marciulonis/ Danilovic / Riva / San Epifanio / Berkovich
Nowitzki / Kukoc / Kirilenko / Dalipagic / Stojakovic
P. Gasol / Cosic / Radja / Volkov
Sabonis / Divac / M. Gasol / Meneghin /Rebraca
Good but you miss the best SG from Italy: Carlton Myers was way better than Riva

[Crystallas]

Where's Noah?

[Maga_1]

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Just ****ing LOL at the bolded. The guy wasn't even better than Mirotic last year, put up 2.7 ppg in his prime in the NBA, and suddenly in your deluded world he's the best player in Euroleague?

And for the red..it's spelled Giannis, not Giannakis. He may only be 19, but you need to show the greatest Greek player ever some damn respect and spell his name correctly.

:rolleyes:

[kkb_12]

Oversight on my part, Noah, Navarro, Myers, Yannakis, Delibasic, Kicanovic, Fasoulas, Turkoglu, Fu*ka, Brabender are all time greats.

In recent years I did not have much chance to see players that played only in Europe (or played in NBA briefly) therefore I did not include Diamantidis, Spanoulis, Teodosic, Tomic, Lorbek, Smodis, Vujcic, Fernandez, Khryapa...

I watched Drazen playing 100 or more games, Kicanovic 150 games, and I saw Teodosic or Diamantidis in 5 games - my list is obviously biased towards players that I followed longer

[Euroleague]

Oversight on my part, Noah, Navarro, Myers, Yannakis, Delibasic, Kicanovic, Fasoulas, Turkoglu, Fu*ka, Brabender are all time greats.

In recent years I did not have much chance to see players that played only in Europe (or played in NBA briefly) therefore I did not include Diamantidis, Spanoulis, Teodosic, Tomic, Lorbek, Smodis, Vujcic, Fernandez, Khryapa...

I watched Drazen playing 100 or more games, Kicanovic 150 games, and I saw Teodosic or Diamantidis in 5 games - my list is obviously biased towards players that I followed longer

Teodosic and Lorbek are nowhere close to good enough to be in that discussion. Especially Lorbek.

[kkb_12]

Teodosic and Lorbek are nowhere close to good enough to be in that discussion. Especially Lorbek.

That list simply indicates who was excluded from any consideration due to fact that I do not know enough about them and did not see them enough. I will trust you that these two guys are not good enough to be in consideration.

[RRR3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/50_Greatest_Euroleague_Contributors


Damn. V-Span not even an honorable mention :oldlol:

[Ray22]

PG - Galis (Papaloukas)
SG - D. Petrovic (Marciulonis)
SF - Kukoc (Stojakovic)
PF - Nowitzki (P. Gasol)
C - Sabonis (Divac)

[Fiba basketball]

Teodosic and Lorbek are nowhere close to good enough to be in that discussion. Especially Lorbek.

And Tomic, Khryapa, Smodis, Vujcic, Spanoulis, DD, Fernandez or even Navarro are close to top 5 ever ? Player from Europe in last decade that was closest to top 5 is Bodiroga and he probably doesn't make it.

[kkb_12]

And Tomic, Khryapa, Smodis, Vujcic, Spanoulis, DD, Fernandez or even Navarro are close to top 5 ever ? Player from Europe in last decade that was closest to top 5 is Bodiroga and he probably doesn't make it.

They might not be - I just listed names of some of the current players to say that I do not know about them... Bodiroga is one of the all time greats - and of all players I have ever seen, only his first coach:Kreso Cosic had the same level of basketball IQ !!!!

There is one more guy that I missed in this consideration - Detlef Schrempf

[Euroleague]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/50_Greatest_Euroleague_Contributors


Damn. V-Span not even an honorable mention :oldlol:

He only played one year in his career when that was made genius.

[Euroleague]

And Tomic, Khryapa, Smodis, Vujcic, Spanoulis, DD, Fernandez or even Navarro are close to top 5 ever ? Player from Europe in last decade that was closest to top 5 is Bodiroga and he probably doesn't make it.

Spanoulis and Navarro are top 5 discussion without any doubt whatsoever. Spanoulis is at the top for all time in Euroleague and Navarro is at the top for all time in FIBA.

Unless you are being INCREDIBLY biased and nonobjective.

And Spanoulis has done more in Euroleague than Bodiroga ever did already, and Navarro is at least in the arguable discussion FIBA wise with Bodiroga, although Bodiroga had a better club career.

If you want to get into stuff like national leagues I don't think it should matter really. Because all of these players in these lists are dominant in national leagues, winning bunches of awards and championships. And some of them are even all time leaders in stats.

And we are talking the historically most important leagues...Spain, Greece, Yugoslavia (Adriatic), Soviet Union, Italy - so I don't think that stuff really matters a whole lot one way or the other.

The same with some of the stuff like Saporta Cup and Korac cup. Because the numbers of these leagues and in those times were just too ridiculous to be realistic. Everyone only talks about Petovic's numbers in those leagues, without also interestingly enough (out of bias) mentioning how guys like,

Korac
Riva
Marzorati
Giannakis
Galis
Dalipagic
Korac
Schmidt
Kicanovic
Delibasic

Hell, the list goes on, how other guys also had similar insane such numbers in leagues like that, averaging also 30-40 points a game. But somehow it's just only Petrovic that only ever gets mentioned for his exploits in leagues like that.

So again, talking about second and third rate leagues 30 years ago in Europe, I really don't think it's all that important to the issue.

I mean guys like Kicanovic, Dalipagic, Giannakis, Galis - they were all getting 30 points or more a game in the 80s in European leagues. It wasn't just Petrovic, but he's the only one any one ever talks about.

The point is there is bias in comments and lists like "top 5 ever" in past players and current players. How people can act like Drazen was the only one putting up such stats then, when he was not, and just like how someone can pretend only Bodiroga could be considered in that discussion in recent times, when Navarro and Spanoulis easily could also.

Although to be fair, Navarro is probably down a tier, same as Jasikevicius, then probably someone like Diamantidis. Because Navarro didn't do enough play making and his defense was more average, and Jasikevicius had bad defense. While Diamantidis wasn't a good enough scorer.

But it's not like you can't pick weaknesses for every player. It's ALWAYS people praising guys like Drazen and Bodiroga and rightfully so, but then taking it a step further and downgrading anyone else, as if to make it seem they are somehow totally untouchable in every way.

Get serious. If you think Bodiroga would be winning Euroleague every year now when the level is so much better.....and he had absolute insane stacked teams every year. It wasn't like he was carrying a team on his back or something.

[duskovujosevic]

we need separate top 5 from yugoslavia, sssr and rest of europe. too many great players

spanoulis has done more than bodiroga? stop humiliating yourself

[Euroleague]

we need separate top 5 from yugoslavia, sssr and rest of europe. too many great players

spanoulis has done more than bodiroga? stop humiliating yourself

I said Spanoulis did more than Bodiroga in Euroleague. And he has. And you are full of it if you are claiming otherwise.

You can try to claim here that it's not true. But you have no argument at all and you can't do so. Because Spanoulis has already surpassed him in Euroleague.

Just so you know, they already did a poll last year they asked 20 of the top all time coaches and historians and players who the best Euroleague player ever was and 18 of them picked Spanoulis.

And you have no argument at all to claim Bodiroga did more in Euroleague or even as much as Spanoulis did. Spanoulis already has had a better Euroleague career. Period. Stop trolling.

What I am saying is, and is true, is that Bodiroga had a better FIBA career, as in with his national team. Which is something you could say. If you do a thread of who is top 5 all time in world history in FIBA ever, then should be right there in such a discussion to anyone that truly knows basketball.

Hell, he might be the greatest ever along with Belov.

I am talking about EUROLEAGUE.

I never said anything about national team play.

I specifically separated the two.

Then I said that Navarro has a case based on what he did with his national team being very great (similar to Bodiroga that is where he is most known), and also that he had a very good career in Euroleague, although lesser than Bodiroga's in this case.

If you are denying what I am saying is true here, you are trolling out of your freaking ass. PERIOD.

And this only confirms what I am saying, that ex-Yugoslavs cannot be objective about ANY player from ex-Yugoslavia. No matter what they must tear down all other players in order to magically prop up some ex-Yugoslavs.

It's pathetically the same disease Americans have about American NBA players, which is pathetic.

Navarro, due to a great career with Spain, and a great career in Euroleague, and Spanoulis, which is very close to being best Euroleague player ever almost unanimously, should be in such a discussion at least, and to say no is just a pure bullshit.

Like I am saying, Navarro didn't do as much play making as Bodiroga, so maybe you could penalize him for that and drop him down a tier, but also as I am saying, you can find and nitpick weaknesses in every player.

And it's something for example in Petrovic, you could say that he wasn't that good at defense either, or that Bodiroga wasn't that athletic or quick either, etc. Blah blah blah. Whatever.

Basic point is, you guys are freaking full of shit.