How good would a team built around peak Pau & Marc Gasol do in the NBA today?

[Milbuck]

These two have been monsters in international play, always been curious as to how good they could be together in the NBA, especially if you paired them both at their absolute best.

Let's say you replace Zbo with peak Pau, say 2009, on the 2014-15 Grizzlies with current Marc Gasol. And maybe make some other roster tweaks here and there to give them some added depth.

Mike Conley / Beno Udrih / Nick Calathes
Tony Allen / Courtney Lee / Vince Carter
Trevor Ariza / Tayshaun Prince / Quincy Pondexter
Pau Gasol / Jordan Hill / Jon Leur
Marc Gasol / Kosta Koufos / Pau Gasol

Dave Joerger is head coach.

Just swapped in peak Pau Gasol for Zbo, and added some depth with Trevor Ariza and Jordan Hill. No unreasonable additions, and still built around the Gasol bros (with Conley).

How good would that team be?

[oarabbus]

goat lol

[sammichoffate]

They would win at least one title, max would be three. That team's only weakness is lack of a go-to perimeter scorer, and even then that weakness is compensated by having FOUR wing defenders who can put any backcourt into straitjackets

[TylerOO]

maybe make the second round in the east

[BuffaloBill]

They'd just be how good the Grizzlies have been for the past 3 years.

[JellyBean]

To be honest, :confusedshrug: A lot depends on matchups. On paper, things look good. They could be a force to reckon with. But in actual games, who the heck knows.

[Milbuck]

They'd just be how good the Grizzlies have been for the past 3 years.
Peak Pau >>>>> 2012-13 Zbo though, and Marc's chemistry on court with Pau is even better than with Zbo.. and adding Trevor Ariza, Jordan Hill, and Courtney Lee. Doesn't that take them at least from a WCF team to a contender?

[stalkerforlife]

Pau needs his alpha daddy, Kobe, to protect him at the playground. Marc is seemingly more alpha than Pau, but that's his younger brother and Pau would have too much pride to take orders from him.

They'd probably be 0-16 in the playoffs.

[BuffaloBill]

Peak Pau >>>>> 2012-13 Zbo though, and Marc's chemistry on court with Pau is even better than with Zbo.. and adding Trevor Ariza, Jordan Hill, and Courtney Lee. Doesn't that take them at least from a WCF team to a contender?



i somehow overlooked the word "peak." My bad. But yeah WCF at best

[MastaKilla]

Peak Pau >>>>> 2012-13 Zbo though, and Marc's chemistry on court with Pau is even better than with Zbo.. and adding Trevor Ariza, Jordan Hill, and Courtney Lee. Doesn't that take them at least from a WCF team to a contender?

Nope, they would be good in the regular season but come playoff time they wouldn't have a single guy who could create his own shot.

And 09 Gasol isn't that much better than 2013 Randolph.

Gasol put up 18/11 in the 09 playoffs & Randolph put up 17/10 in the 2013 playoffs. Gasol shot a lot better from the floor but that obviously has a lot more to do with Kobe than the gap between Gasol & Randolph's effeciency in putting the ball in the basket.

They would make the 2nd round, possibly make the WCF to be handled by a healthy OKC or healthy SAS.

[Milbuck]

Nope, they would be good in the regular season but come playoff time they wouldn't have a single guy who could create his own shot.

And 09 Gasol isn't that much better than 2013 Randolph.

Gasol put up 18/11 in the 09 playoffs & Randolph put up 17/10 in the 2013 playoffs. Gasol shot a lot better from the floor but that obviously has a lot more to do with Kobe than the gap between Gasol & Randolph's effeciency in putting the ball in the basket.

They would make the 2nd round, possibly make the WCF to be handled by a healthy OKC or healthy SAS.
Don't see the logic here.

1) 2008-2010 peak Pau was much better than 2012-13 Zbo on both ends of the floor, it's not super close either. Pau on those repeat Laker teams was considered by many to be the best PF in the game..Zbo never touched that in 2013.

2) Pau could easily create his own shot..he's one of the most skilled post scorers ever. And the passing between him and Marc only makes it even more dangerous. Plus they'd have Conley to run the offense and Ariza to space the floor from the wing.

3) They took OKC to 7 games with a far inferior team this past season than they had in 2013...now we're beefing up that whole roster and giving them a legit all-star PF and they're worse?

[hawksdogsbraves]

I think they could win a title, the defense would be outstanding.

There may be times when they'd want more perimeter scoring though, Conley would have to make some big shots down the stretch of games if they were going to win championships.

[JimmyMcAdocious]

I have trouble imagining a team starting Allen and Ariza on the wing (without a Ginobili type player off the bench) winning a championship. I like both players and the defensive potential between the two, especially with Conley at point and Gasol down low, is absurd... But it just looks wrong, you know?

You look at those Larry Brown Pistons and at least you had Rip on the wing. Billups certainly carried his own offensive weight at PG. Spurs had Leonard winning FMVP, along with the aforementioned Ginobili.

I guess that Mavs team might be the closest. Marion and Terry/Stevenson/Barea all started. Tho Terry was sort of that Ginobili-mold type of 6th man and peak Gasol is not near the offensive tank Dirk is.

Then you got Miami with LeBron and Wade, Boston with PP and Ray, older Spurs with Ginobili, Lakers with Kobe, Jordan and Pippen.

Perhaps that 99 Spurs team is another case.

Basically it just looks weird without an alpha on the perimeter. It's just so unusual.

[r0drig0lac]

contender

[oarabbus]

Milbuck you're going to have to re-bump this thread when Spain plays the USA in the FIBA finals. I was joking about the "goat" comment but people don't think Prime Marc/Pau combo is title-worthy??

[MastaKilla]

Don't see the logic here.

1) 2008-2010 peak Pau was much better than 2012-13 Zbo on both ends of the floor, it's not super close either. Pau on those repeat Laker teams was considered by many to be the best PF in the game..Zbo never touched that in 2013.

2) Pau could easily create his own shot..he's one of the most skilled post scorers ever. And the passing between him and Marc only makes it even more dangerous. Plus they'd have Conley to run the offense and Ariza to space the floor from the wing.

3) They took OKC to 7 games with a far inferior team this past season than they had in 2013...now we're beefing up that whole roster and giving them a legit all-star PF and they're worse?

I just don't see a Pau Gasol led team winning a championship. Having Pau as your go to scorer isn't going to bring you a title.

He never even won a playoff game before he joined the lakers, had Dwight beside in him 2013 and couldn't get even put up a fight against the spurs.

That same spurs team dismantled the 2013 Grizzlies team, replacing Zbo with prime Pau would not have won them the series.

[Milbuck]

I have trouble imagining a team starting Allen and Ariza on the wing (without a Ginobili type player off the bench) winning a championship. I like both players and the defensive potential between the two, especially with Conley at point and Gasol down low, is absurd... But it just looks wrong, you know?

You look at those Larry Brown Pistons and at least you had Rip on the wing. Billups certainly carried his own offensive weight at PG. Spurs had Leonard winning FMVP, along with the aforementioned Ginobili.

I guess that Mavs team might be the closest. Marion and Terry/Stevenson/Barea all started. Tho Terry was sort of that Ginobili-mold type of 6th man and peak Gasol is not near the offensive tank Dirk is.

Then you got Miami with LeBron and Wade, Boston with PP and Ray, older Spurs with Ginobili, Lakers with Kobe, Jordan and Pippen.

Perhaps that 99 Spurs team is another case.

Basically it just looks weird without an alpha on the perimeter. It's just so unusual.
I get what you're saying..but I think Pau and Marc at their peaks are so damn good together in the post that all you would need is a competent playmaking PG to feed them the ball, which they have and then some in Conley. And they'd have Ariza to space the floor.

But for your examples..Pau and Marc are both highly skilled post scorers and have great chemistry offensively. For the Mavs, Dirk was a monster but Chandler was never a real offensive weapon. For the 04 Pistons, Sheed was great but Big Ben was basically useless aside from offensive rebounds and garbage buckets. Agreed on the Spurs though, these Grizzlies would never be the offensive juggernaut they were.

It'd be a filthy defense though..they were already the 2nd best defense in the league that year..then we're giving them 1) Ariza who is a terrific perimeter defender to pair with Tony Allen, 2) Jordan Hill who is a solid energy guy off the bench, and 3) Gasol who at his peak was a pretty damn good defensive anchor and far better defensively than Zbo ever was with Memphis. Just looking at it on paper, that looks like the 3rd best defensive team of the past decade behind the 04 Pistons and 08 Celtics.
Milbuck you're going to have to re-bump this thread when Spain plays the USA in the FIBA finals. I was joking about the "goat" comment but people don't think Prime Marc/Pau combo is title-worthy??
Yeah I definitely will..I think the Pau of the past couple years..the one that's soft as hell, doesn't play great defense, lost quite a bit athletically, and isn't used correctly..has made some people forget how ****ing good he used to be. Didn't think I would be a minority on this. We're essentially taking a WCF team, adding 3 pretty good players in Ariza, Hill, and Lee for more depth, and trading out a declining Zbo for an all-star PF at his peak.

[deja vu]

They'd make it to the WCF or the Finals. Add one superstar perimeter player and they'd easily win the title. That frontcourt is just too much.

Honestly I think if Spain had just one superstar perimeter player in the mold of Kobe or LeBron they would have beaten the superstacked USA team. That's how great the Spain frontline is.

[SwishSquared]

Yeah I definitely will..I think the Pau of the past couple years..the one that's soft as hell, doesn't play great defense, lost quite a bit athletically, and isn't used correctly..has made some people forget how ****ing good he used to be. Didn't think I would be a minority on this. We're essentially taking a WCF team, adding 3 pretty good players in Ariza, Hill, and Lee for more depth, and trading out a declining Zbo for an all-star PF at his peak.
They should re-watch the tape of the Olympics when Pau was taking it to the USA. FWIW, I think the team you assembled could definitely win a title. I think they could beat OKC this year (especially if you factor in Ibaka injury) and potentially the Spurs (they'd lose if Spurs ran them out the gym like they did vs. Miami). They'd have beaten any team from the East. I think that squad could give the Spurs fits due to their passing, although 3 point shooting isn't a strong suit in that starting 5. I don't think anybody else from the West could hang with them either.

[tpols]

Peak Pau >>>>> 2012-13 Zbo though, and Marc's chemistry on court with Pau is even better than with Zbo.. and adding Trevor Ariza, Jordan Hill, and Courtney Lee. Doesn't that take them at least from a WCF team to a contender?

Neither pau nor marc have a takeover the game mentality nor are either aggressive, great scorers. I could see them getting knocked out by the clips, thunder or spurs.

[Milbuck]

Bump.

Still curious about this.