Why is Jordan's 1-9 playoff record without Pippen ignored?

[mehyaM24]

i always see the same posters bring up 2/5, 6/24, shaq's sweeps, pau's 0-16 playoff record without kobe, wilt's "only" 2 championships, etc. but this factoid is ALWAYS swept under the rug.

no other GOAT candidate had that terrible of a playoff record to begin their careers.

espn, Nike and Gatorade looks to have done a masterful job. :bowdown:

[GOATbrook]

6/6 > 2/5

[SamuraiSWISH]

I don't think anyone ever said MJ didn't have a teammate named Scottie Pippen?

[Trollsmasher]

I find his inability to even reach a regular season winning record without Pip more embarassing.

[Sarcastic]

He played the Celtics twice, and a 59 win Milwaukee Bucks team, while his team was total crap besides him. It's kinda like asking why did Lebron get swept by the Spurs in 2007.

[ArbitraryWater]

Unlike 6 of 24 which is the ONLY INDIVIDUAL stat, everything else is team stuff, and kind of useless and arbitrary.

[J Shuttlesworth]

Ignored? I've seen threads on this shit like every day :lol

[BigBoss]

Put it into context

[mehyaM24]

I find his inability to even reach a regular season winning record without Pip pretty embarassing.

for all the shit kobe gets, at least his teams competed. the bulls, in a historically weak conference, went 30-52. 1-9 in 3 seasons. that is mediocrity personified.

[Milbuck]

Unlike 6 of 24 which is the ONLY INDIVIDUAL stat, everything else is team stuff, and kind of useless and arbitrary.
Captain objective strikes again :applause:

Does 8 points not count?

[DonDadda59]

Playing the arguable GOAT team in back to back years with scrubs will do that. But then Pip and his 8 PPG off the bench came along and saved MJ's legacy :bowdown:

[mehyaM24]

jordan played the "GOAT team" 3 straight years? ya, ok. :rolleyes:

[Hey Yo]

Captain objective strikes again :applause:

Does 8 points not count?
Why bring up Larry Bird?

[ArbitraryWater]

Captain objective strikes again :applause:

Does 8 points not count?

What do you disagree with, here?

Which of the ones in the OP is an individual stat, and why does it bother you so much?

Nah, 8 point game is horrible as well, but I'd easily have the 6 of 24 as worse, as it came at the worst possible time.. G.A.M.E 7 F.I.N.A.L.S


Why bring up Larry Bird?

Bird did it in back to back games as well... Wilt scored 5 points, in consecutive games... Russell 6 once.

6 of 24 is shit that never happens elsewhere.

[Cali Syndicate]

Why even bring up a team record during the season Where MJ only played half a dozen full games?

[JT123]

Playing the arguable GOAT team in back to back years with scrubs will do that. But then Pip and his 8 PPG off the bench came along and saved MJ's legacy :bowdown:
Why couldn't MJ lead the Bulls to a better record to avoid playing the Celtics? :confusedshrug:
The East was weaker back then than it is today.

[WindmiLL]

But then Pip and his 8 PPG off the bench came along and saved MJ's legacy :bowdown:


I'm not on the ''lets bash Jordan in this thread'' brigade, but this post is ignorant, we all know that Pip brings way more than just scoring, actually his best virtues on the basketball court are not scoring related.

[DonDadda59]

Why couldn't MJ lead the Bulls to a better record to avoid playing the Celtics? :confusedshrug:

Which season? The one where he broke his leg and started in only 7 games or the one where he was riding with Gene Banks and Dave Corzine? :confusedshrug:


The East was weaker back then than it is today.

:oldlol:

By all metrics and measures, the post decision East has been the worst conference in NBA History post merger.


I'm not on the ''lets bash Jordan in this thread'' brigade, but this post is ignorant, we all know that Pip brings way more than just scoring, actually his best virtues on the basketball court are not scoring related.

Great. But people here act like Pip showed up and was this all star caliber talent right away. Dude was a bench scrub yet he's given credit for the Bulls winning 50 and making the second round when Jordan won the MVP, DPOY, scoring title, steals title, etc that season.

Some posters' favorite player would've either forced the Bulls front court to trade Pip for Charles Barkley before Pip played a minute for the Bulls or left the team to form a hand-picked super squad after Scottie's "migraines" later became an issue.

Just keeping it real.

[Cali Syndicate]

Why couldn't MJ lead the Bulls to a better record to avoid playing the Celtics? :confusedshrug:
The East was weaker back then than it is today.

40-42 would have been making the playoffs in today's eastern conference too. What does that tell you about today's comp?

Or we're you talking about the 86 season where MJ played in basically 6 full games?

[Smoke117]

Do really need this same exact thread every other day?

[Sarcastic]

Why couldn't MJ lead the Bulls to a better record to avoid playing the Celtics? :confusedshrug:
The East was weaker back then than it is today.


No :no:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

You LeBron stans are funny. Of course we know this is another feeble ploy to take attention away from LeBron's lack of Finals success.

[JT123]

You LeBron stans are funny. Of course we know this is another feeble ploy to take attention away from LeBron's lack of Finals success.
Why can't you answer the question instead of deflecting. :lol

[Milbuck]

What do you disagree with, here?

Which of the ones in the OP is an individual stat, and why does it bother you so much?

Nah, 8 point game is horrible as well, but I'd easily have the 6 of 24 as worse, as it came at the worst possible time.. G.A.M.E 7 F.I.N.A.L.S

You've been spamming that 6/24 stuff for a while now, my apologies for calling you out on it. Wetting the bed in any game of the finals is a bad time, especially when you lose.. 8 points. And his team lost by 3. So if he just barely cracked double digits, his team would've won the game and gone up 3-1...which would take a pretty awful collapse to choke away. At least Kobe was aggressive that game despite having a terrible shooting night..10 points in the 4th quarter, mostly off getting contact and getting to the line, and grabbed 15 boards. He had a shit game, but at least he showed up. I'll take that and a win over 8 points and a close loss any day of the week.

[JT123]

No :no:
Yes. I don't remember any 30 win teams making the playoffs in the East over the last 4 years. :confusedshrug:

[Young X]

Like Sarcastic said those losses were like Lebron's losses to the Spurs in 2007 against SAS. The only difference is Jordan actually played well against an even better team while Lebron had the worst finals series ever for a player of his caliber (besides his trash 2011 series).

Damn, when you think about it, how could someone with 2 finals performances like that be a GOAT candidate? He even let Kawhi Leonard outplay him for most of the 2014 series too smh. He only has 1 great finals series out of 5 smh.

[ArbitraryWater]

You've been spamming that 6/24 stuff for a while now, my apologies for calling you out on it. Wetting the bed in any game of the finals is a bad time, especially when you lose.. 8 points. And his team lost by 3. So if he just barely cracked double digits, his team would've won the game and gone up 3-1...which would take a pretty awful collapse to choke away. At least Kobe was aggressive that game despite having a terrible shooting night..10 points in the 4th quarter, mostly off getting contact and getting to the line, and grabbed 15 boards. He had a shit game, but at least he showed up. I'll take that and a win over 8 points and a close loss any day of the week.

Of course anyone would take a win over a loss... duh. That's the typical kobetard "I would rather win titles than mvp's" logic.

But Kobe DIDN't show up... That's the difference. He missed 18 shots and was 1-4 25% in the 4th quarter... Same shooting as all game long. The Refs came through...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJnXxQlPC48

Kobe's FT's:

Pulled the Durant Flail to earn himself 3 FT's...
Grabs a rebound on defense, clashes with Pierce and get's 2 FT's because C's are over the limit...
Gets blocked by Pierce but get's 2 more FT's...
Celtics had to foul in the dying seconds and Kobe gets 2 more.

Besides the drive to the basket, none of this was aggressive, forcing the issue...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ohp-JX2BxCg


Like Sarcastic said those losses were like Lebron's losses to the Spurs in 2007 against SAS. The only difference is Jordan actually played well against an even better team while Lebron had the worst finals series ever for a player of his caliber (besides his trash 2011 series).

Damn, when you think about it, how could someone with 2 finals performances like that be a GOAT candidate? He even let Kawhi Leonard outplay him for most of the 2014 series too smh. He only has 1 great finals series out of 5 smh.


The Jordan loons :facepalm

Another created myth by you guys... Kawhi outplayed him in game 3 and in none of the other contests.

MJ was outplayed and outscored by Kemp in game's 1 and 2 in '96, later by SCHREMPF.... So what?

LeBron actually played great in 2012, 2013 and 2014, while 2007 shouldn't really be mentioned, same as MJ from '85-'87... One-man-teams that had to do it all on offense.

[sportjames23]

Do really need this same exact thread every other day?


This is OP's m.o. The fakkit is like a broken record.

[Cali Syndicate]

Yes. I don't remember any 30 win teams making the playoffs in the East over the last 4 years. :confusedshrug:

It was just those last 4 teams for that 8th spot. 7th seed won 39 games which is on par with teams making the playoffs in east these days. The top 5 eastern teams in 86 basically had better records than the top 5 eastern teams this entire decade.

[Milbuck]

Of course anyone would take a win over a loss... duh. That's the typical kobetard "I would rather win titles than mvp's" logic.

But Kobe DIDN't show up... That's the difference. He missed 18 shots and was 1-4 25% in the 4th quarter... Same shooting as all game long. The Refs came through...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJnXxQlPC48

Kobe's FT's:

Pulled the Durant Flail to earn himself 3 FT's...
Grabs a rebound on defense, clashes with Pierce and get's 2 FT's because C's are over the limit...
Gets blocked by Pierce but get's 2 more FT's...
Celtics had to foul in the dying seconds and Kobe gets 2 more.

Besides the drive to the basket, none of this was aggressive, forcing the issue...

Good god...it's not Kobetard logic to take the win over the loss, it's just common ****ing sense, even moreso considering the context.

They were both horrendous games...but one was far more aggressive and compensated for awful shooting in other ways, and his team won the game. He crashed the boards, and although there were questionable calls, you have to be aggressive to get them in the first place.

And it's not like the rest of the Lakers were lighting it up. Gasol put up 19 points on 38% shooting, Artest 20 on 39% shooting..it was an all-around messy game. No excuse for Kobe, but it's not like he was the sole shitstain on that game getting carried by his teammates.

Whereas in game 4 vs Dallas, Wade put up 32 points on 65% shooting, and Bosh 24 points on 47% shooting. That is the definition of getting carried...although not enough to get the win.

Just pointing out the broken logic in considering 6/24 the "only individual stat" and that everything else is arbitrary, when there was a performance arguably even worse just a year later.

[Young X]

The Jordan loons :facepalm

Another created myth by you guys... Kawhi outplayed him in game 3 and in none of the other contests.

MJ was outplayed and outscored by Kemp in game's 1 and 2 in '96, later by SCHREMPF.... So what?

LeBron actually played great in 2012, 2013 and 2014, while 2007 shouldn't really be mentioned, same as MJ from '85-'87... One-man-teams that had to do it all on offense.Lebron did not play great in 2013 by any means. He struggled in the first 3 games had a good game 4 where he statpadded at the end to make his numbers look better, was below average in game 5, good in game 6, and great in game 7. He had 1 or 2 great games the whole series.

I over exaggerated about the finals last season, he played very well but it wasn't that great.

So far Lebron has had 1 truly great finals series out of 5. That's not GOAT sh!t.

[G.O.A.T]

Because only someone with an anti-MJ agenda would think it means anything.

Jordan took the Bulls to the ECF before Pippen was even close to what he'd become. When Pippen became an all-star and played like it in the playoffs, the Bulls became Champions.

Realistically, expecting the Bulls to beat the Celtics in '86 or '87, even in a single game is really showing a lack of understanding.

Jordan never lost a playoff series with HCA, he never lost a finals, he never lost a game seven. Once he had enough talent to win around him, he never lost. These are things that matter more than a 1-9 playoff record in his first three seasons with little to no help.

It's the same as when people "ignore" or as I'd put it, focus on more important factors in the case of...

Kareem winning two playoff series from in five prime seasons (two MVP seasons) from 1975-1979 the only seasons he played without Magic or Oscar after his rookie year.

Magic making several bonehead or just bad plays in crucial playoff moments in 1981 and 1984.

Bird and the Celtics only make one Finals to Doc and the 76ers three from 1980-1983.

Wilt's Warriors getting upset by the Nationals in '61 or missing the playoffs in '63.

Shaq's pattern of being swept out of the playoffs from '95 thru '99.

Duncan's Spurs getting beaten by an eight seed or losing to the Mavs with HCA.

Kobe missing the playoffs and losing twice in the first round between 2005-2007 when he was arguably at his physical peak.

...once you put the context of those events along with an understanding of the players entire career and the different circumstances at different stages, it makes enough sense not to have to question it, unless you have an agenda of course.

[3ball]

When Lebron was a Cav in the mid-2000's, it was a historically weak era, which is why USA Basketball lost in international competition in 2004 and 2006 - because they sucked.

The best Eastern Conference Playoff teams Lebron has defeated in his career are as follows:

1) 2011 Boston Celtics - Post-Garnett-Injury Celtics, with Pierce past his prime

2) 2013 Indiana Pacers - This team was never championship-caliber, and gave Lebron more problems than they should have

3) 2007 Detroit Pistons - Only a 53-win team and two-time DPOY Ben Wallace was gone and replaced by ancient, decrepit Chris Webber


The Bad Boys compare to #1 above when Jordan beat them.

HOF Shaq and Penny are a massive step up from #2 above, Hibbert and George.

Ewing's Knicks snap-made the Finals each time Jordan retired (94' and 99') and they compare to the 53-win, no-Ben Wallace 07' Pistons (#3 above)... well, Ewing's Knicks were a lot better actually.



But in addition to matching Lebron's 1-3 above, Jordan also has:

4) MJ beat a very deep Pacer team in 1998, led by all-stars Reggie Miller and Rik Smits - this same Pacer team made the Finals in 2000 against Shaq and Kobe's Lakers.

5) MJ beat a 3 all-star Cleveland team with Mark Price, Larry Nance and Brad Daughtery (and Ron Harper at SG with All-defensive team Hot Rod Williams at the 4) - this team won 57 games and had the #2 ranked defense when MJ's Bulls upset them with "the shot" in 1989.

6) MJ beat Pat Riley's 61-win Heat in the ECF in 5 games - those Heat had the #1 ranked defense and two all-stars in Alonzo Mourning and Tim Hardaway.

[Asukal]

^ Why are you even defending Jordan?

These agenda driven threads means nothing. It's pathetic how they would resort to using Pippen as an argument. :oldlol:

[AirGauge23]

Because only someone with an anti-MJ agenda would think it means anything.

Jordan took the Bulls to the ECF before Pippen was even close to what he'd become. When Pippen became an all-star and played like it in the playoffs, the Bulls became Champions.

Realistically, expecting the Bulls to beat the Celtics in '86 or '87, even in a single game is really showing a lack of understanding.

Jordan never lost a playoff series with HCA, he never lost a finals, he never lost a game seven. Once he had enough talent to win around him, he never lost. These are things that matter more than a 1-9 playoff record in his first three seasons with little to no help.

It's the same as when people "ignore" or as I'd put it, focus on more important factors in the case of...

Kareem winning two playoff series from in five prime seasons (two MVP seasons) from 1975-1979 the only seasons he played without Magic or Oscar after his rookie year.

Magic making several bonehead or just bad plays in crucial playoff moments in 1981 and 1984.

Bird and the Celtics only make one Finals to Doc and the 76ers three from 1980-1983.

Wilt's Warriors getting upset by the Nationals in '61 or missing the playoffs in '63.

Shaq's pattern of being swept out of the playoffs from '95 thru '99.

Duncan's Spurs getting beaten by an eight seed or losing to the Mavs with HCA.

Kobe missing the playoffs and losing twice in the first round between 2005-2007 when he was arguably at his physical peak.

...once you put the context of those events along with an understanding of the players entire career and the different circumstances at different stages, it makes enough sense not to have to question it, unless you have an agenda of course.

http://www-scf.usc.edu/~shenchik/itp104/checkmate.jpg

[Dragonyeuw]

Because only someone with an anti-MJ agenda would think it means anything.

Jordan took the Bulls to the ECF before Pippen was even close to what he'd become. When Pippen became an all-star and played like it in the playoffs, the Bulls became Champions.

Realistically, expecting the Bulls to beat the Celtics in '86 or '87, even in a single game is really showing a lack of understanding.

Jordan never lost a playoff series with HCA, he never lost a finals, he never lost a game seven. Once he had enough talent to win around him, he never lost. These are things that matter more than a 1-9 playoff record in his first three seasons with little to no help.

It's the same as when people "ignore" or as I'd put it, focus on more important factors in the case of...

Kareem winning two playoff series from in five prime seasons (two MVP seasons) from 1975-1979 the only seasons he played without Magic or Oscar after his rookie year.

Magic making several bonehead or just bad plays in crucial playoff moments in 1981 and 1984.

Bird and the Celtics only make one Finals to Doc and the 76ers three from 1980-1983.

Wilt's Warriors getting upset by the Nationals in '61 or missing the playoffs in '63.

Shaq's pattern of being swept out of the playoffs from '95 thru '99.

Duncan's Spurs getting beaten by an eight seed or losing to the Mavs with HCA.

Kobe missing the playoffs and losing twice in the first round between 2005-2007 when he was arguably at his physical peak.

...once you put the context of those events along with an understanding of the players entire career and the different circumstances at different stages, it makes enough sense not to have to question it, unless you have an agenda of course.

The end.

[OldSchoolBBall]

jordan played the "GOAT team" 3 straight years? ya, ok. :rolleyes:

The '86 and '87 Celtics were better than any team Lebron has EVER faced, and the '85 Bucks (when Mj was a ROOKIE, btw), were better than all but one or two teams Lebron has ever faced.

[SouBeachTalents]

Lebron did not play great in 2013 by any means. He struggled in the first 3 games had a good game 4 where he statpadded at the end to make his numbers look better, was below average in game 5, good in game 6, and great in game 7. He had 1 or 2 great games the whole series.

I over exaggerated about the finals last season, he played very well but it wasn't that great.

So far Lebron has had 1 truly great finals series out of 5. That's not GOAT sh!t.

How many great Finals has Kobe had?

[TheMan]

OP sure is persistent, I'll give him that :oldlol:

[Paul George 24]

LEFLOP WILL NEVER BE GOAT,FACE IT,LEFLOP STANS :lol

[poido123]

OP sure is persistent, I'll give him that :oldlol:


Needs his meds. It's not pension day :oldlol:

[Magic 32]

Gets blocked by Pierce but get's 2 more FT's...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pL6jq5Zvos&t=5m11s

Your parents needs a refund. NOW!



LeBron actually played great in 2012, 2013 and 2014.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y02r-Dz5cMw&list=UUSpvjDk06HLxBaw8sZw7SkA

[Paul George 24]

When Lebron was a Cav in the mid-2000's, it was a historically weak era, which is why USA Basketball lost in international competition in 2004 and 2006 - because they sucked.

The best Eastern Conference Playoff teams Lebron has defeated in his career are as follows:

1) 2011 Boston Celtics - Post-Garnett-Injury Celtics, with Pierce past his prime

2) 2013 Indiana Pacers - This team was never championship-caliber, and gave Lebron more problems than they should have

3) 2007 Detroit Pistons - Only a 53-win team and two-time DPOY Ben Wallace was gone and replaced by ancient, decrepit Chris Webber


The Bad Boys compare to #1 above when Jordan beat them.

HOF Shaq and Penny are a massive step up from #2 above, Hibbert and George.

Ewing's Knicks snap-made the Finals each time Jordan retired (94' and 99') and they compare to the 53-win, no-Ben Wallace 07' Pistons (#3 above)... well, Ewing's Knicks were a lot better actually.



But in addition to matching Lebron's 1-3 above, Jordan also has:

4) MJ beat a very deep Pacer team in 1998, led by all-stars Reggie Miller and Rik Smits - this same Pacer team made the Finals in 2000 against Shaq and Kobe's Lakers.

5) MJ beat a 3 all-star Cleveland team with Mark Price, Larry Nance and Brad Daughtery (and Ron Harper at SG with All-defensive team Hot Rod Williams at the 4) - this team won 57 games and had the #2 ranked defense when MJ's Bulls upset them with "the shot" in 1989.

6) MJ beat Pat Riley's 61-win Heat in the ECF in 5 games - those Heat had the #1 ranked defense and two all-stars in Alonzo Mourning and Tim Hardaway.

:applause:

[The_Pharcyde]

Why couldn't MJ lead the Bulls to a better record to avoid playing the Celtics? :confusedshrug:
The East was weaker back then than it is today.

hahaha what an idiot

he was out basically the whole season

[Magic 32]

The best Eastern Conference Playoff teams Lebron has defeated in his career are as follows:

1) 2011 Boston Celtics - Post-Garnett-Injury Celtics, with Pierce past his prime

2) 2013 Indiana Pacers - This team was never championship-caliber, and gave Lebron more problems than they should have

3) 2007 Detroit Pistons - Only a 53-win team and two-time DPOY Ben Wallace was gone and replaced by ancient, decrepit Chris Webber


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/50/Morton_Ether_1846.jpg

[The_Pharcyde]

Because only someone with an anti-MJ agenda would think it means anything.

Jordan took the Bulls to the ECF before Pippen was even close to what he'd become. When Pippen became an all-star and played like it in the playoffs, the Bulls became Champions.

Realistically, expecting the Bulls to beat the Celtics in '86 or '87, even in a single game is really showing a lack of understanding.

Jordan never lost a playoff series with HCA, he never lost a finals, he never lost a game seven. Once he had enough talent to win around him, he never lost. These are things that matter more than a 1-9 playoff record in his first three seasons with little to no help.

It's the same as when people "ignore" or as I'd put it, focus on more important factors in the case of...

Kareem winning two playoff series from in five prime seasons (two MVP seasons) from 1975-1979 the only seasons he played without Magic or Oscar after his rookie year.

Magic making several bonehead or just bad plays in crucial playoff moments in 1981 and 1984.

Bird and the Celtics only make one Finals to Doc and the 76ers three from 1980-1983.

Wilt's Warriors getting upset by the Nationals in '61 or missing the playoffs in '63.

Shaq's pattern of being swept out of the playoffs from '95 thru '99.

Duncan's Spurs getting beaten by an eight seed or losing to the Mavs with HCA.

Kobe missing the playoffs and losing twice in the first round between 2005-2007 when he was arguably at his physical peak.

...once you put the context of those events along with an understanding of the players entire career and the different circumstances at different stages, it makes enough sense not to have to question it, unless you have an agenda of course.

^great post

I dont think you can emphasize the HCA stat enough
when Jordan was the top dog the bulls never lost... when he was supposed to win, he got the job done.. no excuses. Just 6 titles.

also think about this, the guy 3-peated(something only shaqs lakers have accomplished post merger, then took 2 years off.
came back 66 games in, lost to a better magic squad.

then went 72-10 in 96, while going 16-3 in the playoffs and sweeping the magic in the ECF. then the next year went 69-13 and iirc went 16-4(fact check me, dont know if they lost a game to the hawks)
171-30 over 2 years is amazing regardless of what you say about expansion

then won the title again the next year
6/6

[LeBird]

Because Jordan fans are deluded. They will argue a fire is going to freeze them if it suits the argument.

I mean, this is all about the fractions that people use to bash each other but going to a finals 5 times and winning twice means 2 times you were a champion and the other 3 times you were good enough to get to the finals.

In the minds of these Jordan stans, losing in the first round (mostly, not even winning 1 freaking game) is better than the above. Jordan didn't have great teams, but if he was the GOD as his stans claim, then he could win 1 game. His teams weren't that bad.

But of course, if they accept that, it means they have to accept that all it means is Jordan was flawed, like other players, and that he is only one of the GOAT candidates.

[Paul George 24]

Because Jordan fans are deluded. They will argue a fire is going to freeze them if it suits the argument.

I mean, this is all about the fractions that people use to bash each other but going to a finals 5 times and winning twice means 2 times you were a champion and the other 3 times you were good enough to get to the finals.

In the minds of these Jordan stans, losing in the first round (mostly, not even winning 1 freaking game) is better than the above. Jordan didn't have great teams, but if he was the GOD as his stans claim, then he could win 1 game. His teams weren't that bad.

But of course, if they accept that, it means they have to accept that all it means is Jordan was flawed, like other players, and that he is only one of the GOAT candidates.

u just hate jordan,plain and simple
because jordan is better than larry bird

[Stringer Bell]

Because of the opposition and the teammates he had.

[riseagainst]

Because Jordan fans are deluded. They will argue a fire is going to freeze them if it suits the argument.

I mean, this is all about the fractions that people use to bash each other but going to a finals 5 times and winning twice means 2 times you were a champion and the other 3 times you were good enough to get to the finals.

In the minds of these Jordan stans, losing in the first round (mostly, not even winning 1 freaking game) is better than the above. Jordan didn't have great teams, but if he was the GOD as his stans claim, then he could win 1 game. His teams weren't that bad.

But of course, if they accept that, it means they have to accept that all it means is Jordan was flawed, like other players, and that he is only one of the GOAT candidates.


:biggums:

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