Absolutely NO ONE talks about Rondo

[sejoon101]

When he shits on all these soft ass guards, you nikkas will claim "he was always good" "Been Rondo > Rose"

[JohnFreeman]

Rondo with the right pieces around him, is top 5 PG

[CelticBaller]

Rondo is always going to be overrated to these ignorant fvcks :confusedshrug:

[buddha]

everywan with a bostan accent das.

[SpecialQue]

Rondo sucks.

[305Baller]

Heat should get Rondo.


:D

[cuad]

The Kings will get Rondo.

[outbreak]

Rondo is a top 5 point guard in this league. Deal with it. If he were on a contending team more people would be talking about him but it's hard to find a reason to discuss him when he is on a team doing a rebuild. Anyone who doesn't have him top five is letting bias influence them.

[Sheik1287]

What has Rondo done without a stacked team?

[Milbuck]

What has Rondo done without a stacked team?
Tore his ACL one season, and recover the next. What a ****ing scrub.

[outbreak]

Tore his ACL one season, and recover the next. What a ****ing scrub.
put up similar stats without them, improved in some areas. What a scrub.

[Sheik1287]

put up similar stats without them, improved in some areas. What a scrub.
Stats must improve immensely since the talent has dispersed. Rondo is the best player now, he is an all-star talent, he must be a ball hog and show everyone why he is an all-star.

If you are complacent with his performance last year, might as well not watch this season.

[oarabbus]

:biggums:

He was hurt most of last season. When he starts playing he will be talked about, obviously. Top 5 or top 8 PG. It's not like we forgot it was only a couple years ago OP :facepalm

[Sheik1287]

:biggums:

He was hurt most of last season. When he starts playing he will be talked about, obviously. Top 5 or top 8 PG. It's not like we forgot it was only a couple years ago OP :facepalm
We'll see, I doubt Celtics even make the playoffs with 110% Rondo.

Top 5 PG's excluding Rondo: Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Russell Westbrook, Tony Parker, Kyrie Irving.

[bdreason]

That's what happens when you're injured and playing for a non-playoff team.

[CelticBalla32]

That's what happens when you're injured and playing for a non-playoff team.

Exactly, Rondo was a top 5 point guard before he went down with the ACL. He's definitely got some more company now with the emergence of Lillard, Curry, Wall, etc. but I think he's gonna have a big year. He wants to prove that he's still elite plus he's in a contract year, for what I assume will be the biggest contract he signs in his whole career.

Rondo is unreal. He'll remind all you doubters.

[imnew09]

Whole Lakers roster except kobe for rondo

[oarabbus]

We'll see, I doubt Celtics even make the playoffs with 110% Rondo.

Top 5 PG's excluding Rondo: Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Russell Westbrook, Tony Parker, Kyrie Irving.


That's because Celtics kinda suck this year.

I mean there was talk of Rondo to the Pacers not that long ago. People definitely talk about Rondo :confusedshrug:

[sejoon101]

When I see top pg threads, i dont even see Rondo in the top 15 on HALF the peoples lists that post on here, but they always have Rose in the top 5 when he's been injured longer, that proves Rondo is underrated as shit even to the non casual fans of the game

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Rondos the most overrated player of the past era
empty stats, pounds the ball for most of the possession. When KG was out of his prime since 09 Rondo got the keys to the Cs offense and......................

2010-15th
2011-18th
2012-27th

the next year their offense was better with Rondo playing 38 games:oldlol: :oldlol: :oldlol:

Hes scared as shit of contact, one of the worst shooters for a guard EVER, overrated playmaker since he holds the ball all the time and doesnt get offense of flow and overrated defender as well

[UK2K]

We'll see, I doubt Celtics even make the playoffs with 110% Rondo.

Top 5 PG's excluding Rondo: Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Russell Westbrook, Tony Parker, Kyrie Irving.
I'd take Rondo over any PG in the league if he was 100% healthy.

But hes not, or rather, wasn't. Nothing like having a pass first, rebounding, elite defender running your team.

[Smoke117]

What is there to talk about? He's barely played the last two seasons and is on a terrible team...there isn't all that much to discuss right now.

[Reggie43]

Would love to have Rondo on the Pacers more than any point guard in the league, granted that he is injury free of course.

[BrownEye007]

Rondo is a top 5 point guard in this league. Deal with it. If he were on a contending team more people would be talking about him but it's hard to find a reason to discuss him when he is on a team doing a rebuild. Anyone who doesn't have him top five is letting bias influence them.
:oldlol: I could easily name 10 point guards I'd rather have on my team than Rondo. His shooting is just too bad to be an elite guard unless he was amazing at everything else. The only thing he does at an elite level though is pass. He's only slightly better than Rubio.

[UK2K]

:oldlol: I could easily name 10 point guards I'd rather have on my team than Rondo. His shooting is just too bad to be an elite guard unless he was amazing at everything else. The only thing he does at an elite level though is pass. He's only slightly better than Rubio.
I think you are alone when you dont consider him an elite rebounder for a PG, or an elite defender.

[comerb]

Stats must improve immensely since the talent has dispersed. Rondo is the best player now, he is an all-star talent, he must be a ball hog and show everyone why he is an all-star.

If you are complacent with his performance last year, might as well not watch this season.


That's not Rondo's game, in fact that's the opposite of his game. He's a distributor, not a scorer.

[BrownEye007]

I think you are alone when you dont consider him an elite rebounder for a PG, or an elite defender.
Actually for some reason I didn't consider rebounding. I guess I don't think it's that important when it comes to guards. But you're right he is elite there. He's one of the better guard defenders in the league but I can still think of a few guys I'd take over him just for defense. Still not enough to make up for the jump shooting to me.

[SexSymbol]

He's the best PG in the league when healthy, so looking forward to him being on a good team again

[wally_world]

Is he good? Can Cleveland get him?

[BlackWhiteGreen]

Actually for some reason I didn't consider rebounding. I guess I don't think it's that important when it comes to guards. But you're right he is elite there. He's one of the better guard defenders in the league but I can still think of a few guys I'd take over him just for defense. Still not enough to make up for the jump shooting to me.

Timestamp on this post must be wrong, talking like its 2009. Rondo hits as consistently from midrange as any other PG when healthy.

[TheMilkyBarKid]

Rondo was playing like a boss the last few seasons of the boston big 3 era.
Probably the best pg in the 2012 playoffs.

[NZStreetBaller]

Rondo is the best passer in the game today.

[MMM]

From 09-12 he consistently took the Celtics deep and was our best player for the most part. Only time he's out and they lost to a team that never won a series in a decade. Also he's been able to match or out play the league's best player in a series over the same span.

[salwan]

if he shakes off his rust and gets to 100% from a physical standpoint, he will open some eyes.

he should come out with a chip on his shoulder, since he basically lost 2 years and everybody is sleeping on him.:rockon:

repped OP.:applause:

[Shade8780]

Underrated as shit. Had a poor year to his standards last season because of his injury. You could clearly see him more confident in his jump shot though and his three had improved. A healthy Rondo this season will be fun to watch.

[Shade8780]

We'll see, I doubt Celtics even make the playoffs with 110% Rondo.

Top 5 PG's excluding Rondo: Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Russell Westbrook, Tony Parker, Kyrie Irving.
I don't know if I want them to make the Playoffs this season. I'd rather a high draft pick building towards the future, unless our young guys like Smart, Sully and Olynyk surprise us.

[KBaller33]

There's soooo many good point guards in the league if you're not getting to the playoffs or putting up crazy stats you will be forgotten. Rondo's the best passer in the league imo. Also one of the best rebounders at his position, if not the best. His shooting just brings him down.

[BrownEye007]

Timestamp on this post must be wrong, talking like its 2009. Rondo hits as consistently from midrange as any other PG when healthy.
You ever heard of this thing called the 3 pointer? It's only been around for like 35 years or so so I understand if you haven't but it's a pretty important part of the game.

[jzek]

He's one of those guys who can't lead your team all the way. Sure, he's a top 5, maybe even top 3 PG, but you don't want to spend top money on him because he has no chance of leading your team to the Finals.

Now if you have Love or LeBron on your team or Wade and Bosh then adding a third guy like Rondo would make a lethal trio. But pair him with just a Carmelo Anthony or any other sole superstar and it's still not enough. Your team will just be a playoff fodder with no real chance of going to the Finals. Rondo needs two others to make him worth it... and that is why no one talks about him. It's just him and he's not worthy of being talked about alone. Pair him with at least two superstars and we'll be hearing a lot more about Rondo.

[bigt]

if he shakes off his rust and gets to 100% from a physical standpoint, he will open some eyes.

he should come out with a chip on his shoulder, since he basically lost 2 years and everybody is sleeping on him.:rockon:

repped OP.:applause:

Given the kind of guy Rondo seems to be it's pretty safe to say there's already a pretty big chip on his shoulder. The guy's a fighter, he knows he's a great player and he'll show it, His team isn't exactly great right now, but fully healthy he'll be the kind of guy Nash was in making his teammates look better than they are

[BlackWhiteGreen]

You ever heard of this thing called the 3 pointer? It's only been around for like 35 years or so so I understand if you haven't but it's a pretty important part of the game.

Rose in his MVP year shot 31% from 3, Rondo shot 29% last year

BUT ITS PRETTY IMPORTANT YOU KNOW

[SCdac]

Rose in his MVP year shot 31% from 3, Rondo shot 29% last year

BUT ITS PRETTY IMPORTANT YOU KNOW

Actually, Rose shot .33% on the year, and .36% in the Bulls' 62 wins. And he was making about 2 of them per game. Rose is a better shooter than Rondo, but that's not saying much.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

Actually, Rose shot .33% on the year, and .36% in the Bulls' 62 wins. And he was making about 2 of them per game. Rose is a better shooter than Rondo, but that's not saying much.

Not according to basketball reference (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/rosede01/shooting/2011/) but OK.

Either way, if MVPs can be won by PGs shooting 4% better than Rondo, it's not a major issue.

[hawksdogsbraves]

If Rondo comes back at 100% and still can't get his team to the playoffs in the East then he's not going to get a ton of credit. Sorry, that's just how it works. Ask Melo about it.

[Wally450]

Comes back from ACL injury. Couple weeks in drops 18 assists 0 turnovers against the Pistons.

But But But he's nothing without the Big 3.

More playoff success than that choker Chris Paul.

Rondo>Paul

[ProfessorMurder]

he has no chance of leading your team to the Finals.

Except he was the best player on their team since KG's knee injury in 2009.

In 2010 and was 6 minutes from an FMVP... 2011 he had his elbow broken in the playoffs, and in 2012 he was a few minutes from getting to the finals again with an injury plagued team.


If Rondo comes back at 100% and still can't get his team to the playoffs in the East then he's not going to get a ton of credit. Sorry, that's just how it works. Ask Melo about it.

Even if he gets them to a 6 seed people will say, "It's the east, who cares?"

[BlackWhiteGreen]

Except he was the best player on their team since KG's knee injury in 2009.

In 2010 and was 6 minutes from an FMVP... 2011 he had his elbow broken in the playoffs, and in 2012 he was a few minutes from getting to the finals again with an injury plagued team.



Even if he gets them to a 6 seed people will say, "It's the east, who cares?"

It's the same for anyone, really. Unless you're top 3 in the East you aren't getting any credit

[Legends66NBA7]

Healthy Rondo is on the same level as current Kyle Lowry. They both have their advantages over each other. Kyle scorers and shoots better. Rondo rebounds and passes better. I think they both get the job done defensively and are much more active on help defense.

So that may get them talked into the Top 10 at best.

[tpols]

Rondo's a real underrated playoff performer.. hes kinda like Dirk in that all of his stats shoot up when it matters.

17/10/10
17/12/7
16/9/7

for whole playoff runs

against cavs in 2010 drops 20/12/7 54FG
against heat in 2012 drops 21/11/7 48FG
against bulls in 2009 drops 19/12/9 45FG


Hes done more in the playoffs than just about any PG that currently plays except maybe westbrook.

[hawksdogsbraves]

It's the same for anyone, really. Unless you're top 3 in the East you aren't getting any credit

I mean, how much credit do you really deserve if teams like Toronto and Charlotte are doing better than you?

If Rondo puts up 14/11/5, (his peak numbers) and has a bad Boston team in the playoffs, people will definitely take notice. Unfortunately, I don't think that's going to happen.

[BrownEye007]

Rose in his MVP year shot 31% from 3, Rondo shot 29% last year

BUT ITS PRETTY IMPORTANT YOU KNOW
Rose is also insanely athletic and a better scorer than Rondo even if he couldn't shoot 3's. Plus Rose is the main focus of a defense. Nobody's afraid of Rondo. I'm not saying he isn't a really good point guard, he's just not an inarguable top 5 pg like somebody on the first page said which is the whole reason I started posting in this thread. Personally he's not even in my top 10. Nothing wrong if you think he's better than I do though.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

I mean, how much credit do you really deserve if teams like Toronto and Charlotte are doing better than you?

True :oldlol: although Charlotte could be reallllly good this year. I don't think they will be... but IF Lance steps up there's real potential there.

RE: Rondo, he's a miracle worker if they make the playoffs unless someone else makes a huuuuge leap

[SpecialQue]

Rondo can't shoot.

[coolhandsteve]

Felt like the Rockets should've traded for him. Probably too late for that now.

[ballup]

Rose is also insanely athletic and a better scorer than Rondo even if he couldn't shoot 3's. Plus Rose is the main focus of a defense. Nobody's afraid of Rondo. I'm not saying he isn't a really good point guard, he's just not an inarguable top 5 pg like somebody on the first page said which is the whole reason I started posting in this thread. Personally he's not even in my top 10. Nothing wrong if you think he's better than I do though.
So? Rondo is insanely smart and a better distributor than Rose. Rondo is a main focus of the opposing defense. Since Rondo is a different type of player, looking to set up his teammates to score, teams have to defend him differently. Teams have decided to deny Rondo's teammates yet Rondo still gets his teammates good looks.

An opinion can't be wrong, but it can be very misinformed if one ignores a whole aspect of the subject.

[SwishSquared]

I'm a little surprised there's not more noise surrounding him in regards to being traded.

[dannywpt]

Is he good? Can the Cavs get him?

[outbreak]

Gotta love ish haters

"Rondo only looks good and puts up good stats because of his hof team mates"

Teammates leave

"Rondo only looks good and puts up good stats because he had no good team mates"

[riseagainst]

Gotta love ish haters

"Rondo only looks good and puts up good stats because of his hof team mates"

Teammates leave

"Rondo only looks good and puts up good stats because he had no good team mates"

:oldlol:

[Taller than CP3]

Didn't watch one Celtics game last year. I forgot Rondo was still in the NBA.

[Le Shaqtus]

Can't wait for Rondo to show up the doubters, he's always been a top 5 PG in this league.

[SpecialQue]

Didn't watch one Celtics game last year. I forgot Rondo was still in the NBA.

You're awesome.

[CelticBaller]

Gotta love ish haters

"Rondo only looks good and puts up good stats because of his hof team mates"

Teammates leave

"Rondo only looks good and puts up good stats because he had no good team mates"
:applause:

[Milbuck]

Gotta love ish haters

"Rondo only looks good and puts up good stats because of his hof team mates"

Teammates leave

"Rondo only looks good and puts up good stats because he had no good team mates"Pretty much this.

Hope he gets traded, doesn't seem to be much future for him in Boston. He'd be perfect with Indy, Sac, or Houston.

[oarabbus]

Pretty much this.

Hope he gets traded, doesn't seem to be much future for him in Boston. He'd be perfect with Indy, Sac, or Houston.


I hear Rondo is a great spot up 3pt shooter and an even better off-ball player :lol

[SwishSquared]

Pretty much this.

Hope he gets traded, doesn't seem to be much future for him in Boston. He'd be perfect with Indy, Sac, or Houston.
Indy would need him once PG came back (and I think they'd work pretty well together). I know Indy would love him and it'd make a lot of sense to deal for him if PG didn't get hurt. They could send expirings and a pick but I'm unsure if Boston would entertain that.

I think SAC is where BOS should send him, simply because they'd probably be dumb enough to take on either/both Wallace/Jeff Green. Also lets BOS engage full tank mode. Rondo is a whole lot more fun to watch on a competitive squad than on a team without identity right now. Simmons has thrown out packages based around Rondo + Green/Wallace for Amare (although he was super greedy in wanting picks + players lol).

[Milbuck]

I hear Rondo is a great spot up 3pt shooter and an even better off-ball player :lol
:oldlol: It'd be a difficult adjustment period no doubt..but I think he fits everything they need, minus the shooting which they have with Ariza and Harden at the wings. Harden just cannot be trusted to be the primary ball handler. He takes retarded shots, his offense relies on calls that disappear in the playoffs, he's a good passer but gets tunnel vision too often, etc. Rondo gives them a guy that takes pressure off everyone offensively. He's also great defensively, to compensate for Harden's bullshit.

They also need someone whose balls don't disappear completely in the playoffs.

Indy would need him once PG came back (and I think they'd work pretty well together). I know Indy would love him and it'd make a lot of sense to deal for him if PG didn't get hurt. They could send expirings and a pick but I'm unsure if Boston would entertain that.

I think SAC is where BOS should send him, simply because they'd probably be dumb enough to take on either/both Wallace/Jeff Green. Also lets BOS engage full tank mode. Rondo is a whole lot more fun to watch on a competitive squad than on a team without identity right now. Simmons has thrown out packages based around Rondo + Green/Wallace for Amare (although he was super greedy in wanting picks + players lol).
Yeah it's more one-sided towards Indy now in terms of interest..no doubt he'd be a perfect fit there. Matches there defensive identity, and gives them a reliable, steady ballhandler/playmaker that they've never had in the PG/Vogel era. If Hibbert could get his shit together and become a legit defensive anchor again, Rondo/PG/Hibbert puts them in the top 3 in the East again.

Agreed, he's the perfect guy to pair with Boogie. Someone who can relate with him competitor to competitor, bring some semblance of intensity into that locker room.

I just don't know what Boston's plan is..just read somewhere that they're not making it a priority to trade Rondo, which doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me..

[Meticode]

We'll find out what Rondo is made of this season. I always thought he was overrated and that he was in the perfect situation playing with Pierce, Garnett and Allen.

[SwishSquared]

:oldlol: It'd be a difficult adjustment period no doubt..but I think he fits everything they need, minus the shooting which they have with Ariza and Harden at the wings. Harden just cannot be trusted to be the primary ball handler. He takes retarded shots, his offense relies on calls that disappear in the playoffs, he's a good passer but gets tunnel vision too often, etc. Rondo gives them a guy that takes pressure off everyone offensively. He's also great defensively, to compensate for Harden's bullshit.

They also need someone whose balls don't disappear completely in the playoffs.

Yeah it's more one-sided towards Indy now in terms of interest..no doubt he'd be a perfect fit there. Matches there defensive identity, and gives them a reliable, steady ballhandler/playmaker that they've never had in the PG/Vogel era. If Hibbert could get his shit together and become a legit defensive anchor again, Rondo/PG/Hibbert puts them in the top 3 in the East again.

Agreed, he's the perfect guy to pair with Boogie. Someone who can relate with him competitor to competitor, bring some semblance of intensity into that locker room.

I just don't know what Boston's plan is..just read somewhere that they're not making it a priority to trade Rondo, which doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me..
I wonder what HOU would have to give up to get Rondo. I think he brings a lot to the table that Harden doesn't, but when Harden got ISO-tunnel-vision-mode, it'd make Rondo pretty ineffective. I like the fit of Bledsoe there a lot, but obvi not at a 4 year max. I'd probably gamble and give him a Parsons-type contract though. Worst-case scenario, he's a big expiring the summer KD's available.

I haven't seen Indy's cap sheet but I'm sure they have no room for a guy like Rondo next summer. Their cap space kinda went up in smoke now. I really like his fit on that squad though. Would finally have a real PG.

I hate shipping out talent to WC since it's so stacked, but Rondo to Kings just makes so much sense. I bet Malone would like him a lot, too. Now that they have Stauskas, he'd benefit a ton from Rondo also. If I'm BOS, I'd try to do this:
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mp9b7ck
Pretty sure Landry only has 1 guaranteed year left on his deal after this year anyway. I don't think I'd even ask for picks. Just ridding Green & Wallace makes it worth it. Boston would waive everybody they got in the trade and roll with it.

Maybe Ainge is blowing smoke to try to drum up some offers? I can't imagine keeping him on that squad. They need to play the young guys and lose. A lot lol. If they landed a guy like Towns Jr. and another swingman (via LAC pick) this upcoming draft, they could be in decent shape. Still have all those BKN picks too.

[Legends66NBA7]

Can't wait for Rondo to show up the doubters, he's always been a top 5 PG in this league.

We'll see. The PG position is going to be much deeper going into next season and there are established elites, veterans, and young up and comers who can all make an impact.

Chris Paul
Russell Westbrook
Stephen Curry

Is the Top 3 that's locked in. Then he's got the next batch to fight over

Derrick Rose (if he's back to his old self, I'll put him in top tier with other 3)
Tony Parker
Damian Lillard
Kyle Lowry
Goran Dragic
John Wall
Kyrie Irving


After that, there's still a climb

Mike Conley
Ty Lawson
Deron Williams
Jeff Teague


I would take healthy Rondo over those guys for sure. But even then, it's still battle from there and above him.

[eliteballer]

His shot will always limit him.

[Dro]

Kyrie Irving is not better than Rondo, lol...WTF.....

[CelticBalla32]

His shot will always limit him.

That may be so, but the jumper has undoubtedly improved and he is legitimately elite in every other facet of the game, with more natural intelligence than most. I'm not gonna act like the shaky jumper isn't a factor, but I think some people focus too much on that and forget how unbelievable all of his other attributes are. He's incredibly unique and one of the best competitors/playoff performers in the NBA, to boot.

[R.I.P]

Tore his ACL one season, and recover the next. What a ****ing scrub.
:lol you fukcing rite!

[allball]

We'll see. The PG position is going to be much deeper going into next season and there are established elites, veterans, and young up and comers who can all make an impact.

Chris Paul
Russell Westbrook
Stephen Curry

Is the Top 3 that's locked in. Then he's got the next batch to fight over

Derrick Rose (if he's back to his old self, I'll put him in top tier with other 3)
Tony Parker
Damian Lillard
Kyle Lowry
Goran Dragic
John Wall
Kyrie Irving


After that, there's still a climb

Mike Conley
Ty Lawson
Deron Williams
Jeff Teague


I would take healthy Rondo over those guys for sure. But even then, it's still battle from there and above him.

add Bledsoe

[R.I.P]

We'll find out what Rondo is made of this season. I always thought he was overrated and that he was in the perfect situation playing with Pierce, Garnett and Allen.
Yes. And he has ugly attitude.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

We'll find out what Rondo is made of this season. I always thought he was overrated and that he was in the perfect situation playing with Pierce, Garnett and Allen.
Three players who immediately fell off a cliff offensively after they stopped playing with him. Rondo helped those guys a lot more than he gets credit for, he was the clear cut best player on the team towards the end of their run.

Rondo's numbers from this past season are a little deceiving, he was on a minute restriction for quite awhile after he returned. Not to mention he was JUST coming off a major injury.

[outbreak]

I don't think there's a clear cut best point guard in the league right now, there's a few guys but which one I would choose for my team would depend on who else is on the team. For a line up that has a couple of elite scorers already Rondo would be one of the best choices (not that he can't score when needed) but for a poor team I'd take a Westbrook type guy who can be the volume scorer.

[CelticBalla32]

Three players who immediately fell off a cliff offensively after they stopped playing with him. Rondo helped those guys a lot more than he gets credit for, he was the clear cut best player on the team towards the end of their run.

Rondo's numbers from this past season are a little deceiving, he was on a minute restriction for quite awhile after he returned. Not to mention he was JUST coming off a major injury.

And Rondo still put up 11.7 points, 9.8 assists and 5.5 rebounds per game last year. Not even 100% - still pretty damn good. Now he's recovered, in tip top shape and in a contract year.

Also, acting like Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce and Ray Allen "fell off a cliff because they weren't playing with Rondo anymore" ...... :biggums: Say those names out loud one more time, and look at their ages.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

And Rondo still put up 11.7 points, 9.8 assists and 5.5 rebounds per game last year. Not even 100% - still pretty damn good. Now he's recovered, in tip top shape and in a contract year.

Also, acting like Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce and Ray Allen "fell off a cliff because they weren't playing with Rondo anymore" ...... :biggums: Say those names out loud one more time, and look at their ages.
Because they weren't old when they were playing with Rondo? The Celtics had KG and Allen in their prime (tail-end) for one, maybe two season. Their numbers stayed pretty consistent up until they left the Celtics, then they nosedived.

[Legends66NBA7]

Kyrie Irving is not better than Rondo, lol...WTF.....

Well, for last season.

Healthy Rondo is probably better.

[CelticBalla32]

Because they weren't old when they were playing with Rondo? The Celtics had KG and Allen in their prime (tail-end) for one, maybe two season. Their numbers stayed pretty consistent up until they left the Celtics, then they nosedived.

....... lol first of all, KG and Ray Allen both left the Celtics at age 37........... so there's that..........

And KG's prime was in Minnesota, and if you want to include his first year in Boston I'll agree with that too. But then he got hurt in the middle of the 08-09 season and his prime was over. Even if he didn't get hurt, he wasn't the same specimen as he was before. Clearly. KG's best individual basketball came from 1999-2008. Boston KG was literally a shell of his former self, especially in the later years you're speaking of from age 34-37, which is not selling him short. Father time caught up to him in Boston. Minnesota Garnett was an absolute freak and a top 3-5 player in the NBA for a decade.

Ray Allen's best days were in Milwaukee and Seattle. He was still close to that level his first couple of years in Boston, I'll give you that, but his drop off had EVERYTHING to do with age. So did Garnett's. So did Pierce's.

They both had incredible years in Boston, but neither KG or Ray Allen played their best individual basketball there and any NBA fan will tell you that. I'm telling you that as a Celtics die-hard.

[ihatetimthomas]

I've always felt Rondo was a player whose impact can be compared to the best pg's in the league. He is a true pg and plays on both sides of the floor. He is one of the few players who elevate their games significantly during the playoffs. I would trust Rondo at the point on any team and I think he often gets overlooked due to an abundance of talented pg's.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Three players who immediately fell off a cliff offensively after they stopped playing with him. Rondo helped those guys a lot more than he gets credit for, he was the clear cut best player on the team towards the end of their run.

Rondo's numbers from this past season are a little deceiving, he was on a minute restriction for quite awhile after he returned. Not to mention he was JUST coming off a major injury.

KG was better than Rondo ever year

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

....... lol first of all, KG and Ray Allen both left the Celtics at age 37........... so there's that..........

And KG's prime was in Minnesota, and if you want to include his first year in Boston I'll agree with that too. But then he got hurt in the middle of the 08-09 season and his prime was over. Even if he didn't get hurt, he wasn't the same specimen as he was before. Clearly. KG's best individual basketball came from 1999-2008. Boston KG was literally a shell of his former self, especially in the later years you're speaking of from age 34-37, which is not selling him short. Father time caught up to him in Boston. Minnesota Garnett was an absolute freak and a top 3-5 player in the NBA for a decade.

Ray Allen's best days were in Milwaukee and Seattle. He was still close to that level his first couple of years in Boston, I'll give you that, but his drop off had EVERYTHING to do with age. So did Garnett's. So did Pierce's.

They both had incredible years in Boston, but neither KG or Ray Allen played their best individual basketball there and any NBA fan will tell you that. I'm telling you that as a Celtics die-hard.
Huh? I don't see what any of this has to do with what I said. I know where KG and Ray spent their prime. I said Rondo had KG and Ray at the TAIL-END of their prime for two seasons at max, the rest were with a depleted version of them.

[CelticBalla32]

Huh? I don't see what any of this has to do with what I said. I know where KG and Ray spent their prime. I said Rondo had KG and Ray at the TAIL-END of their prime for two seasons at max, the rest were with a depleted version of them.

Your exact quote was this.


The Celtics had KG and Allen in their prime (tail-end) for one, maybe two season. Their numbers stayed pretty consistent up until they left the Celtics, then they nosedived.

Your point was that they "got worse after they left the Celtics," is if it was because they weren't playing with Rondo anymore. They were 37 years old when they left the Celtics lol, that's THE reason why "they nosedived."

KG played like 20 mpg in Brooklyn. He wasn't less productive because of Rondo, he was less productive because he was 37 and physically could barely play half of a game. Obviously Rondo helped them out. He would make anyone look better. But you're acting like KG, Ray and Pierce fell off so hard when they left the Celtics, for any reason other than the fact that their careers are on life support lol.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

Your exact quote was this.



Your point was that they "got worse after they left the Celtics," is if it was because they weren't playing with Rondo anymore. They were 37 years old when they left the Celtics lol, that's THE reason why "they nosedived."

KG played like 20 mpg in Brooklyn. He wasn't less productive because of Rondo, he was less productive because he was 37 and physically could barely play half of a game. Obviously Rondo helped them out. He would make anyone look better. But you're acting like KG, Ray and Pierce fell off so hard when they left the Celtics, for any reason other than the fact that their careers are on life support lol.

Their numbers stayed pretty consistent WHILE they were on the Celtics (In KG's case, they dropped after the 2008 season, then stayed around the 15/8 range for the rest of his tenure).

You act like they got old after they left the Celtics. Newsflash, they were old almost the entire time they were on the Celtics. KG went from 15 a game on 50%, to like 6 a game on 43% shooting (somewhere in that range) the very next season. That's a huge ****ing drop off. He didn't all of a sudden get old after he got traded, he was old since like 2010. Allen and Pierce had similar drop offs offensively after no longer playing for the Celtics.

Rondo got those guys easy shots. I watched a handful of Nets games this year, and I think I've seen KG score in the paint uncontested maybe 4-5 times max. Rondo got him layups, lobs, and wide open jumpers consistently. With the Nets, 90% of his offensive game consisted of bricked one dribble pull-ups (from what I've seen).

[CelticBalla32]

Their numbers stayed pretty consistent WHILE they were on the Celtics (In KG's case, they dropped after the 2008 season, then stayed around the 15/8 range for the rest of his tenure).

You act like they got old after they left the Celtics. Newsflash, they were old almost the entire time they were on the Celtics. KG went from 15 a game on 50%, to like 6 a game on 43% shooting (somewhere in that range) the very next season. That's a huge ****ing drop off. He didn't all of a sudden get old after he got traded, he was old since like 2010. Allen and Pierce had similar drop offs offensively after no longer playing for the Celtics.

Rondo got those guys easy shots. I watched a handful of Nets games this year, and I think I've seen KG score in the paint uncontested maybe 4-5 times max. Rondo got him layups, lobs, and wide open jumpers consistently. With the Nets, 90% of his offensive game consisted of bricked one dribble pull-ups (from what I've seen).

lol I'm acting like the Celtics "got old after they left Boston?" .... Have you read a single word I have said? My entire argument is that KG's prime was over by 2009.

You are the one that stated that "they fell off hard after they left Boston." Not me. That is what my last post was about, and I quoted/bolded when you said that lol. I responded by saying they were declining IN BOSTON, like any player in history at their age.

You act like Rondo was the main component for their success in Boston. Garnett, Pierce and Allen were Hall of Famers in the making before they even knew Rajon Rondo existed in this world. If the 2004 version of Kevin Garnett was on the 2010 Celtics team that lost in Game 7 of the Finals, they would not have lost lol.

I agree that by the end of that run, Rondo was the best player on the team. But that's only because all three of them declined due to age. He only "surpassed them" because they were in their mid-30s.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

lol I'm acting like the Celtics "got old after they left Boston?" .... Have you read a single word I have said? My entire argument is that KG's prime was over by 2009.

You are the one that stated that "they fell off hard after they left Boston." Not me. That is what my last post was about, and I quoted/bolded when you said that lol. I responded by saying they were declining IN BOSTON, like any player in history at their age.

You act like Rondo was the main component for their success in Boston. Garnett, Pierce and Allen were Hall of Famers in the making before they even knew Rajon Rondo existed in this world. If the 2004 version of Kevin Garnett was on the 2010 Celtics team that lost in Game 7 of the Finals, they would not have lost lol.

I agree that by the end of that run, Rondo was the best player on the team. But that's only because all three of them declined due to age. He only "surpassed them" because they were in their mid-30s.

My goodness. Is it really that difficult to understand what I was trying to get across? At no point did I say or imply that they weren't declining/past their prime in Boston, in fact that was my point from the start.

My orginal post:
Three players who immediately fell off a cliff offensively after they stopped playing with him. Rondo helped those guys a lot more than he gets credit for, he was the clear cut best player on the team towards the end of their run.

By saying Rondo was the clear best player on the team towards the end of their run, I'm acknowledging the fact that they were declining/over the hill at that point of their careers. I obviously don't believe Rondo was better than a prime KG/Pierce/Ray.

However, they were still getting 15, 17, and 18 a game consistently as declining/over the hill players towards the end of their run in Boston. As soon as they left Boston, their scoring numbers dropped off significantly. So I guess it's just a big coincidence that all three of them fell off a cliff after leaving Boston?

You act like it was a steady decline. KG went from 15 a game his last three (or so) seasons in Boston on 50% shooting, to 6 ****ing points a game on horrific shooting. That's a direct result of no longer having a PG who got him easy baskets consistently.

[CelticBalla32]

KG fell off a cliff because he is 37 and can't physically stay on the court for more than 20 minutes. Not because Rondo meant THAT much to his production.

My goodness, is right.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

KG fell off a cliff because he is 37 and can't physically stay on the court for more than 20 minutes. Not because Rondo meant THAT much to his production.

My goodness, is right.
:oldlol: I thought we both agreed that he was already declining in Boston. Why wasn't he putting up 6 a game on 43% shooting (or anything close to that) in Boston? Why was a declining, old KG able to get 15 on 50% in Boston and not Brooklyn?

Has nothing to do with his PG getting him wide open lobs, layups, and catch and shoot jumpers consistently, right?

[r0drig0lac]

healthy, is the best PG in the league by far

[CelticBalla32]

:oldlol: I thought we both agreed that he was already declining in Boston. Why wasn't he putting up 6 a game on 43% shooting (or anything close to that) in Boston? Why was a declining, old KG able to get 15 on 50% in Boston and not Brooklyn?

Has nothing to do with his PG getting him wide open lobs, layups, and catch and shoot jumpers consistently, right?

:rolleyes: Obviously Rondo helps anyone he ever played with get easy buckets. But if you literally believe Rondo is why KG scored 6 PPG last year, I don't know what to tell you lol.

You're also comparing his 30 mpg numbers to when he played 20 mpg. You're comparing the 13 shots per game he took his last two years in Boston.... to the 6 shots per game he took in Brooklyn. You're comparing a system he was accustomed to for years in Boston as a top option.... to the worst year of his career at age 37 under a rookie coach and a brand new roster as the 5th option, where he could hardly stay on the court for more than a few minutes at a time.

The factor for KG's drop off isn't Rondo. The factor is that last season was his 19th year in the NBA. The fact that you're fighting it is a joke to me lol.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

:rolleyes: Obviously Rondo helps anyone he ever played with get easy buckets. But if you literally believe Rondo is why KG scored 6 PPG last year, I don't know what to tell you lol.

You're also comparing his 30 mpg numbers to when he played 20 mpg. You're comparing the 13 shots per game he took his last two years in Boston.... to the 6 shots per game he took in Brooklyn. You're comparing a system he was accustomed to for years in Boston.... to the worst year of his career at age 37 under a rookie coach and a brand new roster, where he could hardly stay on the court for more than a few minutes at a time.

The factor for KG's drop off isn't Rondo. The factor is that last season was his 19th year in the NBA. The fact that you're fighting it is a joke to me lol.

Not having a PG getting him easy baskets had A LOT to do with KG's horrific offensive output last year.

Even if you take the minutes into account, his FG% went down significantly (because he wasn't getting good shots). He took a low amount of shots because he wasn't getting looks (which Rondo got him consistently). KG has played for bad coaches his whole career. He's a high IQ player and a HOFer, I would think he could adjust to a new system pretty quickly. Doc put him on a 5-5-5 plan towards the end of his run in Boston (5 minutes on, 5 minutes off), he was used to playing in short stints at that point.

At the end of the day, in Boston his offensive repertoire consisted of open jumpers, layups, and lobs (with the occasional post-up). In Brooklyn it consisted of one dribble pull-ups and the occasional catch and shoot 18 footer. He wasn't getting the same looks at all.

And? The previous season was his 18th, he put up 15/8 on 50%. The season before that was his 17th, he put up 15/8 on 50%.

[gts]

I've always felt Rondo was a player whose impact can be compared to the best pg's in the league. He is a true pg and plays on both sides of the floor. He is one of the few players who elevate their games significantly during the playoffs. I would trust Rondo at the point on any team and I think he often gets overlooked due to an abundance of talented pg's.


I think he gets overlooked because he's not a flashy speed demon like the newer crop, he's more of a blue collar PG if that makes sense...

[ihatetimthomas]

I think he gets overlooked because he's not a flashy speed demon like the newer crop, he's more of a blue collar PG if that makes sense...

Yeah completely agree. The NBA in general has become a bit flashy IMO. And we are in a era of unbelievable athleticism. Rondo to his credit was one of the quickest point guards on the league pre injury. He combined that with elite level playmaking skills. But yeah his lack of recognition has a lot to do with his less than flashy skillset.

[CelticBalla32]

At the end of the day, in Boston his offensive repertoire consisted of open jumpers, layups, and lobs (with the occasional post-up). In Brooklyn it consisted of one dribble pull-ups and the occasional catch and shoot 18 footer. He wasn't getting the same looks at all.

And? The previous season was his 18th, he put up 15/8 on 50%. The season before that was his 17th, he put up 15/8 on 50%.

Exactly dude. That's my point. He wasn't featured in Brooklyn's offense at all, as opposed to being one of the focal points of the Celtics. He wasn't used the same, under Jason friggen Kidd in his first year as an NBA head coach, in KG's 19th year in the NBA. KG was not used to the same way in Brooklyn, because he isn't physically capable of it anymore. It's a fact. Put your John Hollinger cap to the side and use your eyes. It's as clear as water.

The fact that you're arguing that Garnett's production is dependent on another player making it easy for him.... is exactly what I'm saying. He isn't physically capable of producing like that anymore. If Deron Williams was hypothetically traded for Rondo this summer, KG would not score 15 PPG next year lol. He is not capable of even playing half of the game on a consistent basis, let alone capable of being featured in the offense.

KG is one of the best players to ever play the game of basketball. He is 37 years old. It is 2014, he came into the league in 1995. You don't think that is the reason why he's fallen off?

I'm done with this conversation. Enjoy the last word. It's yours. You're wrong lol.

[Real14]

Maybe cuz Rondo is overrated and he cant stay healthy.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

Exactly dude. That's my point. He wasn't featured in Brooklyn's offense at all, as opposed to being one of the focal points of the Celtics. He wasn't used the same, under Jason friggen Kidd in his first year as an NBA head coach, in KG's 19th year in the NBA. KG was not used to the same way in Brooklyn, because he isn't physically capable of it anymore. It's a fact. Put your John Hollinger cap to the side and use your eyes. It's as clear as water.

The fact that you're arguing that Garnett's production is dependent on another player making it easy for him.... is exactly what I'm saying. He isn't physically capable of producing like that anymore. If Deron Williams was hypothetically traded for Rondo this summer, KG would not score 15 PPG next year lol. He is not capable of even playing half of the game on a consistent basis, let alone capable of being featured in the offense.

KG is one of the best players to ever play the game of basketball. He is 37 years old. It is 2014, he came into the league in 1995. You don't think that is the reason why he's fallen off?

I'm done with this conversation. Enjoy the last word. It's yours. You're wrong lol.


:oldlol: Wrong about what? Every single one of your posts has made my point for me. I honestly believe you haven't been reading my posts this entire time, just skimming through them (if even that). The bolded part of your post is the most hilarious to me, it is literally the EXACT point I've been making the whole ****ing time reworded. Rondo got 15/8 out of a depleted KG consistently, while he couldn't even come close to those numbers immediately after he stopped playing with him.

I am well aware of the fact that KG is old, I've made that clear in every single one of my posts. I know KG is one of the greatest players ever. If you couldn't tell from my username, he's my favorite player ever.

Again, I know how old Kevin Garnett is. I know what year he was drafted. But we already agreed that he was old and depleted for most of his tenure in Boston. So are you saying it's just a coincidence that his stats went from 15/8 on 50% consistently, to 6/6 on 43% after he stopped playing with Rondo?

[BrownEye007]

:oldlol: Wrong about what? Every single one of your posts has made my point for me. I honestly believe you haven't been reading my posts this entire time, just skimming through them (if even that). The bolded part of your post is the most hilarious to me, it is literally the EXACT point I've been making the whole ****ing time reworded. Rondo got 15/8 out of a depleted KG consistently, while he couldn't even come close to those numbers immediately after he stopped playing with him.

I am well aware of the fact that KG is old, I've made that clear in every single one of my posts. I know KG is one of the greatest players ever. If you couldn't tell from my username, he's my favorite player ever.

Again, I know how old Kevin Garnett is. I know what year he was drafted. But we already agreed that he was old and depleted for most of his tenure in Boston. So are you saying it's just a coincidence that his stats went from 15/8 on 50% consistently, to 6/6 on 43% after he stopped playing with Rondo?
Can't believe somebody's actually trying to argue that Rondo made KG :facepalm I'm sure Rondo didn't hurt his production but KG put up 15/8 in his late 30's because he's a great player not because of Rondo.

[Kevin_Garnett_5]

Can't believe somebody's actually trying to argue that Rondo made KG :facepalm I'm sure Rondo didn't hurt his production but KG put up 15/8 in his late 30's because he's a great player not because of Rondo.
Where the hell did I say Rondo "made" KG? That doesn't even make sense considering KG was an MVP before Rondo was in the league. My goodness, and I thought ISH was bad a few years ago. Now we apparently have posters who can't even read.

Rondo got KG easy shots. Which is why he went from 15/8 on 50% one year, to 6/6 on 43% the next.

[BrownEye007]

Where the hell did I say Rondo "made" KG? That doesn't even make sense considering KG was an MVP before Rondo was in the league. My goodness, and I thought ISH was bad a few years ago. Now we apparently have posters who can't even read.

Rondo got KG easy shots. Which is why he went from 15/8 on 50% one year, to 6/6 on 43% the next.
I'm only talking about when he got to Boston and onward. You basically said Kg would have sucked on Boston had Rondo not been there. That's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read.

[BlackWhiteGreen]

I'm only talking about when he got to Boston and onward. You basically said Kg would have sucked on Boston had Rondo not been there. That's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read.

He's saying that KG's dropoff from 2012-13 to 2013-14 is based on Rondo not being the one getting him the ball. Literally nothing more than that

[Hittin_Shots]

I'm only talking about when he got to Boston and onward. You basically said Kg would have sucked on Boston had Rondo not been there. That's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read.

I'm not sure what you and celtic_balla are reading in that other guys posts that im not. But after just reading it all, I'm leaning towards you both being at least slightly retarded.

[BrownEye007]

I'm not sure what you and celtic_balla are reading in that other guys posts that im not. But after just reading it all, I'm leaning towards you both being at least slightly retarded.
Yeah see the thing is Keving Garnett 5 has been arguing pretty much this entire time that KG would not be able to score 15 ppg on the Celtics if he didn't have Rondo getting him easy baskets. Even if Celtic Balla and I are both full blown retards that doesn't make what the other dudes saying true. You might want to read again.

[CelticBalla32]

I'm not sure what you and celtic_balla are reading in that other guys posts that im not. But after just reading it all, I'm leaning towards you both being at least slightly retarded.

I'm retarded for disagreeing that KG's production drop-off was directly tied to Rondo? Alright, brotha. Meanwhile, dude is comparing 13 shots per game to 6 shots per game and complaining that KG didn't score as much.... lol.

Hell, look at the rebounding stats between KG's last year in Boston and last year in Brooklyn. KG actually rebounded at a higher rate in Brooklyn. But he took half the shots and was never featured in the offense, hence the drop off in his offensive production. And played 10 less minutes per game. It's not hard to see.

[BrownEye007]

He's saying that KG's dropoff from 2012-13 to 2013-14 is based on Rondo not being the one getting him the ball. Literally nothing more than that
Yes I get this. But if He's playing poorly on the Nets because Rondo isn't getting him the ball anymore then wouldn't he have played just as poorly on the Celtics if Rondo wasn't there to get him the ball? By saying the drop off in his production was because he's not playing with Rondo anymore he's implying that he would have been just as bad in Boston as he is now on the Nets.

[SexSymbol]

Rondo is the PG version of Dennis Rodman

[FPJ]

Rondo is the best player the Celtics want to trade each season.

[Hittin_Shots]

So you're saying he scored more because he had a pg that got him the ball in better spots where he could finish at a higher percentage, and he only dropped off because the system or pg didnt include him in the offence as much while on and didnt get him as good of shots not due to the pg but because he dropped off. oh he took less shots... but youre ignoring the 7% fg drop which is the main thing. clearly hes not getting as good a shots even though taking less.

he is saying at the end of KGs celtic time Rondo contributed to his stats being much better than they are this year.

[CelticBalla32]

So you're saying he scored more because he had a pg that got him the ball in better spots where he could finish at a higher percentage, and he only dropped off because the system or pg didnt include him in the offence as much while on and didnt get him as good of shots not due to the pg but because he dropped off. oh he took less shots... but youre ignoring the 7% fg drop which is the main thing. clearly hes not getting as good a shots even though taking less.

he is saying at the end of KGs celtic time Rondo contributed to his stats being much better than they are this year.

I know what he's saying, but I think he's giving Rondo too much credit for KG's production. Does Rondo make his teammates better? Obviously. Is Rondo the reason KG shot 50% through his first 18 years in the NBA, or even his tenure with Boston? No.

You think Rondo provided the spacing in Boston? You don't think KG had more room to operate because he was playing with Rondo as well as Paul Pierce, Ray Allen and a slew of knock-down shooters? Meanwhile, Brooklyn was a weak and inconsistent perimeter shooting team with a rookie head coach that didn't use KG on the offensive end?

2012-13 --- 12.5 shots per game - 14.8 PPG
2013-14 --- 6.6 shots per game - 6.6 PPG

Took half the shots. Scored half the points. Less efficient because he was a year older, was never incorporated into any offensive gameplan (repetition is key) and played 20 mpg because he wasn't physically capable of playing more. Just like he wasn't physically capable of adding offensive responsibilities to his contributions last season.... at age 37. You think the fact that he played 10 less mpg than the year before in Boston, isn't because of age and physical capabilities?

KG shot 50% throughout the accumulation of his first 18 years in the NBA. You think the one year he dips - at age 37 - is because of another player? Come on. Especially when Jason Kidd - a rookie head coach who did not incorporate KG into his offensive gameplan ever - didn't use him.

Run 8 plays for KG per game - he will be more efficient than acting as a bail-out at the end of plays that break down on a team with weak spacing. Except you can't run 8 plays for him anymore, because he would pass out on the court. That's the difference.

[sejoon101]

Saw John Wall yesterday asked if he believed if he is a top 5 PG in the league he said of course