Did a prime/near prime Shaq or Duncan ever have a bad playoff series?

[SouBeachTalents]

:confusedshrug:

[riseagainst]

05 Duncan in the finals?

[kennethgriffin]

duncan won finals mvp averaging like 20 points on 40% in 2005. worst finals mvp ever IMO

[BoutPractice]

Tim Duncan was the FMVP, and averaged 20 (maintained regular season average) and 14 (improved regular season average). His percentage dropped but he was facing a top 3 defense in the league in a tough, physical 7 game series that almost reminded you of the 90s...

So no, 2005 is not a good choice.

[Kvnzhangyay]

Were you even old enough to watch them? :confusedshrug:

[Big#50]

Bad? no
Sub-par?? yup
I don't think any great had a bad series ever.

[NBAplayoffs2001]

Tim Duncan was the FMVP, and averaged 20 (maintained regular season average) and 14 (improved regular season average). His percentage dropped but he was facing a top 3 defense in the league in a tough, physical 7 game series that almost reminded you of the 90s...

So no, 2005 is not a good choice.

The first NBA finals that I watched each game :bowdown:. Drinking pepsi and eating Dominos pizza with friends on summer nights while watching this. 7 game series, all the excitement :rockon: awesome.

[SouBeachTalents]

Bad? no
Sub-par?? yup
I don't think any great had a bad series ever.

LeBron- 2011 Finals
Kobe- 2004 Finals

I didn't watch the following ones, so I'm not 100% sure if these were actually "bad" series or not, so if anyone knows they can clarify

Kareem- 1973 vs. Warriors
Wilt- 1969 NBA Finals
Magic- 1983 NBA Finals
Bird- 1983 vs. Bucks, 1985 Finals, 1988 vs. Pistons
Hakeem- 1990 vs. Lakers

[Gotterdammerung]

Duncan was held to a measly 9 points in Game 3 of the 2001 west conference playoffs vs the Lakers in a 39 point loss. :facepalm

[Big#50]

LeBron- 2011 Finals
Kobe- 2004 Finals

I didn't watch the following ones, so I'm not 100% sure if these were actually "bad" series or not, so if anyone knows they can clarify

Kareem- 1973 vs. Warriors
Wilt- 1969 NBA Finals
Magic- 1983 NBA Finals
Bird- 1983 vs. Bucks, 1985 Finals, 1988 vs. Pistons
Hakeem- 1990 vs. Lakers
I said GREATS.

[T_L_P]

According to GameScore, anything under 10 is bad for a star.

Duncan's lowest from 98-08 (his prime) was the 08 Western Conference Semis vs. the Hornets (13.2).

He averaged 15/13/3/1/1/.475 TS% for the series. However, Duncan was sick during the first two games. From games 3-7 he averaged 17/16/3/2 with a GameScore of 15.2.

Duncan's worst series for me was against the Lakers in 04. He choked that one, but he was still far and away his team's best player, and it wasn't a bad series.

[Big#50]

According to GameScore, anything under 10 is bad for a star.

Duncan's lowest from 98-08 (his prime) was the 08 Western Conference Semis vs. the Hornets (13.2).

He averaged 15/13/3/1/1/.475 TS% for the series. However, Duncan was sick during the first two games. From games 3-7 he averaged 17/16/3/2 with a GameScore of 15.2.

Duncan's worst series for me was against the Lakers in 04. He choked that one, but he was still far and away his team's best player, and it wasn't a bad series.

**** no. IN 04 he was hacked almost every play by Malone and Shaq. NO calls because the fix for the four legends was in.

[pauk]

Shooting bad? Playing bad D? Turning the ball over? Not delivering when it matters? Yep.... mostly Duncan tho, but he has been bailed out most of the time thanks to his star teammates and won many of those series anyways, mostly thanks to Tony Parker & Manu Ginobili (who would lead in points while shooting higher % & close out games in the clutch when Duncan didnt have it going or often even when he had it going) and ofcourse David Robinson....

[SouBeachTalents]

Shooting bad? Playing bad D? Turning the ball over? Not delivering when it matters? Yep....

Do tell sir

[HOoopCityJones]

07 Shaq.

[SouBeachTalents]

07 Shaq.

Shaq averaged 17 & 7 in the '07 regular season, and put up 19 & 9 against the Bulls

[T_L_P]

Shooting bad? Playing bad D? Turning the ball over? Not delivering when it matters? Yep.... mostly Duncan tho, but he has been bailed out most of the time thanks to his star teammates and won many of those series anyways, mostly thanks to Tony Parker & Manu Ginobili (who would lead in points while shooting higher % & close out games in the clutch when Duncan didnt have it going or often even when he had it going) and ofcourse David Robinson....

The question specifically referred to entire series during their primes, so I'd be interested to see some examples.

[HOoopCityJones]

Shaq averaged 17 & 7 in the '07 regular season, and put up 19 & 9 against the Bulls

And just like when Lebron puts up those pedestrian numbers, it's a terrible game in Shaq's case.

If Lebron went like 14-5-5 , you gonna consider it a good game by his standards just because he tried to pad the stats all around?

[SouBeachTalents]

And just like when Lebron puts up those pedestrian numbers, it's a terrible game in Shaq's case.

If Lebron went like 14-5-5 , you gonna consider it a good game by his standards just because he tried to pad the stats all around?

I seriously have no idea WTF you're talking about. '07 Shaq was clearly not in his prime, yet put up better numbers in the playoffs anyway. If LeBron averaged 14-5-5 during the regular season and put up those numbers in the playoffs, that obviously wouldn't be a bad series for him.

[HOoopCityJones]

I seriously have no idea WTF you're talking about. '07 Shaq was clearly not in his prime, yet put up better numbers in the playoffs anyway. If LeBron averaged 14-5-5 during the regular season and put up those numbers in the playoffs, that obviously wouldn't be a bad series for him.

:cheers: Whatever helps you sleep at night.

[CelticBalla32]

Why are you guys bringing up like Shaq in 06 and 07 and all that? Doesn't even apply lol.

[MastaKilla]

Shaq WCSF 2002.. not a 'bad' series per say but definitely not anywhere near a 'MDE' performance

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

Shaq in '99 against the Spurs was sub-par compared to what he was usually doing.

[SouBeachTalents]

Shaq WCSF 2002.. not a 'bad' series per say but definitely not anywhere near a 'MDE' performance

Dude, 30 & 14 on 53% is pretty dominant, and was ironically his most dominant western conference playoff series that year

[T_L_P]

Dude, 30 & 14 on 53% is pretty dominant, and was ironically his most dominant western conference playoff series that year

He meant this one:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2002_WCS.html#LAL-SAS

Shaq averaged 21/12/3/3/.487 TS%.

It wasn't a great series by Shaq's standards, but it obviously wasn't a bad series. :cheers:

[CelticBalla32]

You know you're a bad brothatrucker when dudes look at 21/12/3/3 as "eh."

[SouBeachTalents]

He meant this one:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/NBA_2002_WCS.html#LAL-SAS

Shaq averaged 21/12/3/3/.487 TS%.

It wasn't a great series by Shaq's standards, but it obviously wasn't a bad series. :cheers:

Ah ok, I misread that as WCF. You would both be right, excellent series for most, for prime Shaq, that is actually under par for him

[iamgine]

Shaq in '05 playoff? Over his prime but still close right?

Duncan in '10 was not very good against Dallas.

[HOoopCityJones]

Ah ok, I misread that as WCF. You would both be right, excellent series for most, for prime Shaq, that is actually under par for him

:roll: I gave you worse numbers than that and you tried to write my opinion off.

[SouBeachTalents]

:roll: I gave you worse numbers than that and you tried to write my opinion off.

I'm not sure what's so difficult to understand about Shaq not only being past his prime in 2007, but putting up better numbers in the playoffs than he did in the regular season that year

[Smoke117]

I'm not sure what's so difficult to understand about Shaq not only being past his prime in 2007, but putting up better numbers in the playoffs than he did in the regular season that year


He's clearly a moron and has trouble reading, so just give up.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

You know you're a bad brothatrucker when dudes look at 21/12/3/3 as "eh."

While shooting below 50%...that is a big drop off for Shaq. He was banged up in that series, but he wasn't as effective against SA as he had been in other years.

[longhornfan1234]

06 Shaq. Wade had to bailed him out in the finals.

[oarabbus]

duncan won finals mvp averaging like 20 points on 40% in 2005. worst finals mvp ever IMO


42%, against one of the all time defenses. Yeah, not too great. But he put up 20.5/14/2blk on that series, beast

[ImKobe]

Shaq in 04 first round against Houston - 16 & 11 on 52% shooting, for a guy that's supposed to still be in his prime at 32 years old, that was pretty medicore(for his standards).

Duncan's 05 Finals at 29 years old - 20.6 ppg on 47% TS, pretty sure that's the lowest TS% for any Finals MVP in the modern era.


42%, against one of the all time defenses. Yeah, not too great. But he put up 20.5/14/2blk on that series, beast

How's that "beast"? 20 ppg on 18 shots a game, 14 rebounds against 6'8 Ben Wallace. Manu had a case for the FMVP of that series, 19/6/4 on 64%TS.

[BoutPractice]

How can 20.6 ppg and 14 rpg, 2 bpg, the highest game score on your team, and the FMVP, all this vs a historically tough frontcourt (Ben Wallace, Rasheed Wallace, and Antonio McDyess, with both Wallaces being held under their averages in the relevant areas), be spinned into a "bad series"? What have you guys been smoking?

And how is Wallace being 6'8 relevant to Duncan's performance? Wallace is unquestionably an all-time great rebounder, and one of the great defenders of his era...

Also, TS% underrates bigs that don't take 3s, like Duncan. It's not the be-all-end-all of percentages. (Not disputing that Duncan's percentage was bad, just noting that TS% somewhat artificially makes it look worse than it was... you're not expecting Tim Duncan to take 3s).

You want to know what a bad series looks like? Try scoring 15 ppg on 37 FG% as your team's star second option in the NBA Finals, almost getting outscored by the likes of Austin Croshere (to be fair he was a decent player, but no one's ever called him GOAT)... or a 8 ppg dropoff and scoreless 4 quarters in the Finals as your team's superduperstar first option, getting outscored not only by the opposing team's star, but by two of your own teammates as well as Jason Terry.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

Nikkas mentioning 07 as part of Shaqs prime is reaching. Same with saying 06.
Shaqs pre prime to post prime was 94-05. Anything else is a carcass

[masonanddixon]

Duncan was garbage against Dallas in 08-09, including a 4 pt game on 1-8 shooting, lol. It was a very lebron-esque performance

[fpliii]

Nikkas mentioning 07 as part of Shaqs prime is reaching. Same with saying 06.
Shaqs pre prime to post prime was 94-05. Anything else is a carcass
I'd include 93 if you're throwing 05 in there. Rookie Shaq was so crazy going coast-to-coast. :bowdown:

[Stringer Bell]

You want to know what a bad series looks like? Try scoring 15 ppg on 37 FG% as your team's star second option in the NBA Finals, almost getting outscored by the likes of Austin Croshere (to be fair he was a decent player, but no one's ever called him GOAT)... or a 8 ppg dropoff and scoreless 4 quarters in the Finals as your team's superduperstar first option, getting outscored not only by the opposing team's star, but by two of your own teammates as well as Jason Terry.

I remember being impressed with Croshere in those finals and thinking he was going to have a much better career than he did.

The Pacers did too, giving him a $50 million contract. :facepalm

[HOoopCityJones]

He's clearly a moron and has trouble reading, so just give up.
Stay outta grown folks business puss.

Doesn't matter what he did in the reg season compared to Post. Those numbers by Shaq standards is shit sauce.

[robert_shaww]

Shaq in 04 first round against Houston - 16 & 11 on 52% shooting, for a guy that's supposed to still be in his prime at 32 years old, that was pretty medicore(for his standards).

Duncan's 05 Finals at 29 years old - 20.6 ppg on 47% TS, pretty sure that's the lowest TS% for any Finals MVP in the modern era.



How's that "beast"? 20 ppg on 18 shots a game, 14 rebounds against 6'8 Ben Wallace. Manu had a case for the FMVP of that series, 19/6/4 on 64%TS.

:facepalm

[Stringer Bell]

Duncan was held to a measly 9 points in Game 3 of the 2001 west conference playoffs vs the Lakers in a 39 point loss. :facepalm

I don't know if the whole series qualifies. He put up monster numbers in the first 2 games, then poor numbers in those dreadful blowouts in the last 2 games.

I don't think there was any postseason series in either Shaq or Duncan's primes that I would say was "bad".

[Stringer Bell]

Duncan was garbage against Dallas in 08-09, including a 4 pt game on 1-8 shooting, lol. It was a very lebron-esque performance

He only really played poorly in that one game though, where he played 15 minutes. He played well in the next 2 games.

Hard to find a "bad" postseason series for prime Duncan or Shaq.

Maybe below their usual standards, but not "bad" like Ewing in the 94' Finals, Kobe in the 04' Finals, Lebron in the 11' Finals, etc..

[T_L_P]

Hard to find a "bad" postseason series for prime Duncan or Shaq.

Maybe below their usual standards, but not "bad" like Ewing in the 94' Finals, Kobe in the 04' Finals, Lebron in the 11' Finals, etc..


Hit the nail on the head. Duncan has had plenty of bad/mediocre ones past his prime, but that's kinda the point: he's past the point where he's consistently elite. Happens to every great.

[SsKSpurs21]

Tim Duncan was the FMVP, and averaged 20 (maintained regular season average) and 14 (improved regular season average). His percentage dropped but he was facing a top 3 defense in the league in a tough, physical 7 game series that almost reminded you of the 90s...

So no, 2005 is not a good choice.

Timmy also spraining his ankle towards the end of the season vs detroit and twisted the other ankle in the WC semis vs seattle...played WCF and Finals on two sprained ankles.