30 Million Americans On Antidepressants And 20 Other Facts About America

[winwin]

Has there ever been a nation more hooked on drugs than the United States? And I am not just talking about illegal drugs

[Nick Young]

O Brave new world:rockon: :rockon: :rockon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_FDjDwNygM

[ROCSteady]

O Brave new world:rockon: :rockon: :rockon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_FDjDwNygM

That was a great song. :rockon:

[9erempiree]

Sadly this is very true. I blame the doctors for writing all these prescriptions and it doesn't help that most of them get kickbacks from the pharm companies out there. My dad goes to his doctor and all that guy does is prescribe new medication for him to take. My dad doesn't even take them or get the prescriptions fill.

He also comes home with little packets of samples from his doctor. Don't know what they are but he refuses to take them.

[Dresta]

People like taking drugs that make them feel better when depressed? Big surprise that. Should be the individual's choice whether they want medication or not when they are suffering pain, mental or physical, and the doctor is there to advise and to provide medication, not dictate. And people need to learn that doctors are like members of any other profession: some are good to exceptional at what they do, most are average or worse. Becoming a doctor isn't too trying if you've got the money, time and work ethic usually needed (though only 4 years in US, compared with 6 in UK).

Particularly with mental health i would not trust your average GP, as i could personally only trust a respected psychiatrist, and would still then be wary. I would only take antidepressants as a last resort, and if i was a GP i would only recommend them as a last resort, but there is no consensus on the matter really; doctors have their different methods and treatments and it should stay that way in a field still with so much uncertainty.

But these days there are no excuses in most cases: with the wealth of information now so readily available, if you are prescribed a medication, it is easy to find about all the potential risks and benefits for yourself. Only once multiple medications start being prescribed does it get a bit more difficult as interactions have to be taken into account. But still, i've known GPs to prescribe medications that interact (unintentionally) that could have been found out by anybody with internet access after about ten minutes research.

[~primetime~]

#14 In the United States today, prescription painkillers kill more Americans than heroin and cocaine combined.

Prescription painkillers are opiates...same as heroin

"But legalizing drugs wouldn't cause the drug use to go up!"

Well, opiates ARE legal in the US and we consume more than the rest of the world combined...so there is that

[Dresta]

Prescription painkillers are opiates...same as heroin

"But legalizing drugs wouldn't cause the drug use to go up!"

Well, opiates ARE legal in the US and we consume more than the rest of the world combined...so there is that
What nonsense! Taking codeine and shooting heroin are world's apart. Such a comparison is idiotic to say the least.

[~primetime~]

What nonsense! Taking codeine and shooting heroin are world's apart. Such a comparison is idiotic to say the least.
They are both opiates and the painkillers are winning in terms of death count, but the point of my post wasnt to compare the two.

[Jailblazers7]

I have a daily prescriptions that I take for a mild anti-inflammatory drug that (along with good diet and exercise) has massively improved my life. However, the medical condition that requires I take this drug is potentially a side effect of a drug I was given as a teen. So I kind of have a love/hate relationship with pharma drugs. I do think that doctors are too trigger happy with giving prescriptions and that more people should have a healthy skepticism with regards to drugs.

I've had doctors try to give me pretty intense drugs (immunosuppressants) without even exploring alternative methods. I've literally had to tell doctors no to prescriptions because I'd prefer to use them as a last resort.

[GimmeThat]

people have a strong mistrust with their doctors


have you seen Side Effects? or Repo Man, or Sherlock Holmes?

[joe]

Prescription painkillers are opiates...same as heroin

"But legalizing drugs wouldn't cause the drug use to go up!"

Well, opiates ARE legal in the US and we consume more than the rest of the world combined...so there is that

As a general pro-legalization guy, I have some thoughts for you to consider.

-Prescription drugs being legal gives a false impression that they are safe, simply BECAUSE every other drug is illegal. The fact that the government bans every single drug but one communicates 1) that our government is not friendly to drugs, and therefore 2) the single one that they ARE friendly towards is probably okay. Or else why would they approve it?

-Legalization might increase or decrease the use of a drug, depending on the drug. If marijuana is legal, I would be shocked if use did not go up. Then again, I personally do not see that as a bad thing- if the people using it enjoy it and think it adds value to their life. For heroin, I would agree with your strawman- heroin use would not increase with legalization. I doubt most people would even enter a store that sold heroin.

-Opiates being legal is not the full story. They are also pushed by doctors and psychiatrists, because it is easier than other methods of treatment. A lot goes into that. A culture that lacks compassion, for one. A high financial strain on doctors due to extravagant tuition fees (they cannot spend too long on one patient, just give them a pill and move on).

-Finally, the FDA intentionally restricts the prescription pill market- both in an honest effort for safety and also because they are bribed by these people. No matter the reason, big pharma has less competitors who could potentially craft less addicting pills with more reasonable side effects. As it stands, the big guys dominate and the small guy does not even exist. Meanwhile, politicians are funded by big pharma as well, so this system is not challenged.

[~primetime~]

heroin use would not increase with legalization. I doubt most people would even enter a store that sold heroin.

that is exactly what they are doing though...the doctor's office is the "store" and the pain killers are the heroin (again both opiates)...and sales are through the roof.

maybe shooting up is more intense than ingesting pills, but they are very similar, they effect the nervous system the same way, it's the same class of drug.



I agree with your other points though...

[joe]

that is exactly what they are doing though...the doctor's office is the "store" and the pain killers are the heroin (again both opiates)...and sales are through the roof.

maybe shooting up is more intense than ingesting pills, but they are very similar, they effect the nervous system the same way, it's the same class of drug.



I agree with your other points though...

I just think the entire cultural perception of heroin is too dark for that to happen. I agree that scientifically the two drugs are siblings, but their reputations are miles apart. At least for now.

[KyrieTheFuture]

A decent amount of these "facts" are wrong or misleading, but the rate of drug consumption in America is extremely dangerous and troubling I agree.

12 and 13 straight up contradict eachother

A person dying every 19 minutes is ~27,000 a year not 200,000

[Jailblazers7]

A decent amount of these "facts" are wrong or misleading, but the rate of drug consumption in America is extremely dangerous and troubling I agree.

12 and 13 straight up contradict eachother

A person dying every 19 minutes is ~27,000 a year not 200,000

Well, 13 is only "unintentional overdoses" I'm guessing 12 includes any and all prescription drug related deaths like mixing the wrong drugs and shit.

[~primetime~]

All these depressed Americans...smh

I've never been on anti-depressants and it will stay that way till I die, the only way it could change for me is if I feel like I am at risk of suicide.

I mean come on people toughen the fck up please...we all have bad days, or weeks, or months...even bad years. IT'S NORMAL TO BE DOWN EVERY NOW AND THEN.

And some of the people I know on anti-depressants SHOULD be depressed...if you're 100lbs overweight and unemployed you SHOULD be depressed, that's just means your NORMAL. How about instead of asking your doctor to fck with your brain chemistry you instead get a job and lose weight???

[AirGauge23]

All these depressed Americans...smh

I've never been on anti-depressants and it will stay that way till I die, the only way it could change for me is if I feel like I am at risk of suicide.

I mean come on people toughen the fck up please...we all have bad days, or weeks, or months...even bad years. IT'S NORMAL TO BE DOWN EVERY NOW AND THEN.

And some of the people I know on anti-depressants SHOULD be depressed...if you're 100lbs overweight and unemployed you SHOULD be depressed, that's just means your NORMAL. How about instead of asking your doctor to fck with your brain chemistry you instead get a job and lose weight???

Come on, man :facepalm

Really? Toughen up? Really, Prime?

[~primetime~]

some people really do need them and some people do have a legit chemical imbalance...BUT NOT THE WHOLE FCKIN COUNTRY!!!...look at the numbers in the OP ffs

yeah, lots of people need to toughen up...sorry that is how I feel

[oarabbus]

Depression is a chemical imbalance not having a bad week.


some people really do need them and some people do have a legit chemical imbalance...BUT NOT THE WHOLE FCKIN COUNTRY!!!...look at the numbers in the OP ffs

yeah, lots of people need to toughen up...sorry that is how I feel


No, they don't. Sick of this myth being accepted as fact.


The "chemical imbalance" theory of depression is bullshit. It was popularized by pharmaceutical companies for their marketing. There never was any kind of scientific proof of a chemical imbalance.

We don't even know what baseline levels/concentrations of neurotransmitters should be, there is no "balance" to speak of in the first place. Not to mention, the theory was developed when SSRI (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors) were shown to help people's moods, so Pharma marketing departments ran with an "imbalance" in serotonin causing depression.

People soon realized it was bullshit, not to mention that other drugs like SNRI (selective norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors) also can treat depression while affecting entirely different systems.

I don't know why people ate this up in the first place. You will literally not find any proof or confirmation of this theory anywhere except for TV commercials selling you drugs, and perhaps psychiatrists/psychologists who deserve to lose their license to practice.

If your doctor tells you about a chemical imbalance, find a new doctor.



http://www.madinamerica.com/2014/05/psychiatrys-manufacture-consent-chemical-imbalance-theory-antidepressant-explosion/

http://bigthink.com/devil-in-the-data/the-chemical-imbalance-myth

http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2013/10/18/mental_illness_is_chemical_imbalance_theory_a_myth .html

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2011/08/04/doctor-is-my-mood-disorder-due-to-a-chemical-imbalance/

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-first-impression/201302/5-myths-about-depression

[Nanners]

http://www.npr.org/2011/03/02/134143813/the-oxy-express-floridas-drug-abuse-epidemic


Doctors in Florida prescribe 10 times more oxycodone pills than every other state in the country combined. People come from all over the Southeast to visit the state's pain clinics.

crazy

[~primetime~]

chemical imbalance or not...we are to believe 30 million Americans suffer from this imbalance?

I'm not trying to belittle real depression here, I'm just stating the obvious...lots of Americans need to stop being lazy and battle their depression the real way.


I would bet money half the people on antidepressants would probably benefit more from a small amount of exercise each week and a slightly healthier diet...but of coarse that would require 'effort' so it's probably asking too much.

[oarabbus]

chemical imbalance or not...we are to believe 30 million Americans suffer from this imbalance?

I'm not trying to belittle real depression here, I'm just stating the obvious...lots of Americans need to stop being lazy and battle their depression the real way.


I would bet money half the people on antidepressants would probably benefit more from a small amount of exercise each week and a slightly healthier diet...but of coarse that would require 'effort' so it's probably asking too much.


Now I'm going to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but it ties back to the chemical imbalance BS they made up. I agree with you, 30 million Americans did not sprout up a problem over the past decade.

However, that's a dream ****ing subscription right there for those companies. Ultimately there aren't any conspiracies, just people making money. 30 million americans are reliant on their drugs. Therefore they are reliant on insurance to pay several hundred bucks on their behalf a month, while they chip in their monthly copay. The insurance companies are reliant on doctors to write prescriptions and the doctors are reliant on the insurance companies who lobby and work closely with/control the hospital industry.

30 million prescriptions, at a cost of $50 dollars per prescription per month (usually copay is like $5-20 and the actual cost of the medicine can be >10x that) is equal to pharm companies making $1.5billion per month or $60 billion per year.

and that's IF the total cost of medicine is 50 bucks. If it's actually 150 bucks, that means Pharma is making a cool $180 billion.

If you are a Pharma CEO, you want that number to keep going up up up. That means more lobbying, getting more doctors to keep diagnosing more bullshit and calling every kid who wants to play tag for 15 minutes an ADHD sufferer, every housewife who feels sad once in a while has depression, everyone who tweaks their back gets opiates (I realize many people actually do have debilitating back injuries btw) next thing you know we're gonna have 60, 70, 80 million americans on prescription meds.

[shlver]

The HMO system favors cookie cutter medicine. Actual diagnosis of depression as a symptom/result of another disorder is uncertain, expensive, time consuming and not covered by insurance. Most symptoms of depression could be attributed to lifestyle changes, physical disorders, etc. but it is much easier to simply prescribe an anti depressant, or "pass off" a patient than to rule out all other possible causes.

[~primetime~]

Imbalance or whatever you wanna call it, it's your brain chemistry being fvked up not just being bummed you lost your job and are ugly
I think a lot of those 30 mill are just "bummed"...probably the majority of them

30m Americans weren't born with fcked up brains

[shlver]

No, they don't. Sick of this myth being accepted as fact.


The "chemical imbalance" theory of depression is bullshit. It was popularized by pharmaceutical companies for their marketing. There never was any kind of scientific proof of a chemical imbalance.

We don't even know what baseline levels/concentrations of neurotransmitters should be, there is no "balance" to speak of in the first place. Not to mention, the theory was developed when SSRI (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors) were shown to help people's moods, so Pharma marketing departments ran with an "imbalance" in serotonin causing depression.

People soon realized it was bullshit, not to mention that other drugs like SNRI (selective norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors) also can treat depression while affecting entirely different systems.

I don't know why people ate this up in the first place. You will literally not find any proof or confirmation of this theory anywhere except for TV commercials selling you drugs, and perhaps psychiatrists/psychologists who deserve to lose their license to practice.

If your doctor tells you about a chemical imbalance, find a new doctor.



http://www.madinamerica.com/2014/05/psychiatrys-manufacture-consent-chemical-imbalance-theory-antidepressant-explosion/

http://bigthink.com/devil-in-the-data/the-chemical-imbalance-myth

http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2013/10/18/mental_illness_is_chemical_imbalance_theory_a_myth .html

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2011/08/04/doctor-is-my-mood-disorder-due-to-a-chemical-imbalance/

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-first-impression/201302/5-myths-about-depression
In terms of biochemistry and flux, I think chemical imbalance is a perfectly fine way to put it. I'm on my phone, I'll expand on this post when I get on a computer.

[bdreason]

I'm not sure what's worse, certified doctors telling people that a pill can solve their problems... or the people who believe it.

[Nanners]

i think the fact that we allow perscription drug manufacturers to advertise on tv feeds into this problem. the anti depressant commercials in particular are fvcking ridiculous these days.

[BrownEye007]

If I remember correctly the pharmaceutical industry is the biggest industry in the U.S. The biggest reason weed is still illegal and these other much more harmful and addictive substances aren't is that the pharmaceutical companies can't profit off it because they can't patent a natural substance. These drugs aren't meant to help people they're meant to help corporations make more money.

[~primetime~]

If I remember correctly the pharmaceutical industry is the biggest industry in the U.S. The biggest reason weed is still illegal and these other much more harmful and addictive substances aren't is that the pharmaceutical companies can't profit off it because they can't patent a natural substance. These drugs aren't meant to help people they're meant to help corporations make more money.
but marijuana and opiates ARE used in pharmaceuticals :confusedshrug:

[oarabbus]

I'd conservatively say that 90% of the 30 million do not have legitimate depression. Maybe another 10% did have it and would be fine now if they weened off the pills.

They ask you like 15 generic questions if you think you're depressed and if you answer about 3 of them the right way, you get prescribed pills.


Good post.


but marijuana and opiates ARE used in pharmaceuticals :confusedshrug:


Please do not try to compare marijuana, to marinol/dronabinol which are created from marijuana. Doing so is like comparing crack/cocaine to the coca leaf. Not to mention marinol/dronabinol can be lethal unlike our friendly plant marijuana.

Plus, most antidepressants and stimulants/ADHD medications are not meant to help people just like BrownEye said. They treat symptoms at best sometimes they don't even do that. They are moneymakers, that's it.

[Swaggin916]

People get addicted to things... they like feeling a certain way so they keep doing things over and over again until eventually the body becomes used to operating feeling that way. If you go cold turkey, there will be problems. There is a whole system set up to ween people off of them but many people are just a bunch of drug attics to begin just hadn't taken any yet.

[AirGauge23]

This is my view on Antidepressants in a nutshell...

Are they overprescribed? Hell yeah
Do some people really need them? Yes
Have they saved numerous lives? Yes again

[~primetime~]

Good post.




Please do not try to compare marijuana, to marinol/dronabinol which are created from marijuana. Doing so is like comparing crack/cocaine to the coca leaf. Not to mention marinol/dronabinol can be lethal unlike our friendly plant marijuana.

Plus, most antidepressants and stimulants/ADHD medications are not meant to help people just like BrownEye said. They treat symptoms at best sometimes they don't even do that. They are moneymakers, that's it.
I was talking about medicinal marijuana...which is marijuana

And there are lots of medicines created from opiates...including straight morphine

[oarabbus]

I was talking about medicinal marijuana...which is marijuana

And there are lots of medicines created from opiates...including straight morphine


Then you are proving his point. Medical MJ is extremely difficult to stay within the bounds of the law, mainly because the big pharma companies can't profit from it, and aside from CO/WA they try very hard to keep it that way. And opium itself, even though it is less lethal than morphine, fentanyl, oxymorphone/codone, etc is illegal, because pharma companies can't profit from it. So you agreed with him.

[shlver]

No, they don't. Sick of this myth being accepted as fact.


The "chemical imbalance" theory of depression is bullshit. It was popularized by pharmaceutical companies for their marketing. There never was any kind of scientific proof of a chemical imbalance.
Really? serotonin receptor polymorphisms and their link to suicidal behavior and aggressiveness? In vivo effect of serotonin on mammalian behavior? The fact there are certain serotonin effects at different concentrations implies that there is a optimal range of serotonin and serotonin receptor levels eg brain growth.


We don't even know what baseline levels/concentrations of neurotransmitters should be, there is no "balance" to speak of in the first place. Not to mention, the theory was developed when SSRI (selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors) were shown to help people's moods, so Pharma marketing departments ran with an "imbalance" in serotonin causing depression.

We don't necessarily need to know the baseline levels, do we? We don't know if serotonin dysfunction and low production is the sole cause of a patient's depression, but we do know that depression is linked to loss of brain mass and therefore lower neurotransmitter processivity in the brain. Now what's in question is, did lower serotonin production(due to lack of exercise, poor diet, etc) cause depression or did a prolonged episode of depression cause a loss of brain mass which resulted in lower serotonin processivity? The answer is probably both. I think you could describe this as a chemical imbalance in layman terms of non optimal serotonin(serotonin is a growth factor) levels for brain growth and synapse communication.
That is why antidepressant drugs should be used in conjunction with long term psychotherapy. Medication relieves the symptoms and serves as a crutch as the patient learns and utilizes coping mechanisms to later stop using the drugs. Of course, if depressive symptoms arise solely from genetic defects of serotonin and/or its receptors then medication is necessary.

People soon realized it was bullshit, not to mention that other drugs like SNRI (selective norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors) also can treat depression while affecting entirely different systems.
I really don't understand how norepinephrine's effect precludes SSRI's efficacy in individuals whose depressive symptoms are linked to low serotonin levels.

I don't know why people ate this up in the first place. You will literally not find any proof or confirmation of this theory anywhere except for TV commercials selling you drugs, and perhaps psychiatrists/psychologists who deserve to lose their license to practice.

If your doctor tells you about a chemical imbalance, find a new doctor.



http://www.madinamerica.com/2014/05/psychiatrys-manufacture-consent-chemical-imbalance-theory-antidepressant-explosion/

http://bigthink.com/devil-in-the-data/the-chemical-imbalance-myth

http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2013/10/18/mental_illness_is_chemical_imbalance_theory_a_myth .html

http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2011/08/04/doctor-is-my-mood-disorder-due-to-a-chemical-imbalance/

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-first-impression/201302/5-myths-about-depression
From a biochemistry perspective, I would define "chemical imbalance" as a lower than optimal neurotransmitter processivity(for whatever reason as I listed above). I don't think anybody is saying any single neurotransmitter or hormone would solely cause primary clinical depression, rather there is a possible bottom-up molecular component that is contributing to depressive symptoms. Psychotherapy is necessary to glean any top-down component(thought process, life events, drug addiction etc) that could have a role in a patient's depression.

[shlver]

If I remember correctly the pharmaceutical industry is the biggest industry in the U.S. The biggest reason weed is still illegal and these other much more harmful and addictive substances aren't is that the pharmaceutical companies can't profit off it because they can't patent a natural substance. These drugs aren't meant to help people they're meant to help corporations make more money.
Of course these drugs were meant to help people. That is an insult to every scientist who has done medical research.

[Nanners]

Of course these drugs were meant to help people. That is an insult to every scientist who has done medical research.
yeah except the decisions on which drugs to research and how much money to charge for them are made by some bean counting MBA, not a scientist. at a pharma company, the scientists are told what to research.

[tpols]

Of course these drugs were meant to help people. That is an insult to every scientist that has done medical research.

They can help people, but their primary purpose is making money. Low doses of different strains of weed could help many people with many different problems but you could never charge for it like you could with pills..

[BrownEye007]

but marijuana and opiates ARE used in pharmaceuticals :confusedshrug:
Yes they try to make drugs that mimic the effects of marijuana but if they make it themselves they CAN patent it then sell it for whatever price they want. They CAN'T patent the marijuana plant itself so even if they sold it there would be a ton of competition thus driving down the price. Also they don't use Marijuana to make the drugs they use THC.

[shlver]

yeah except the decisions on which drugs to research and how much money to charge for them are made by some bean counting MBA, not a scientist. at a pharma company, the scientists are told what to research.
Are you at a pharma company? I'm sure R&D departments have scientists doing independent research.

[Nanners]

Are you at a pharma company? I'm sure R&D departments have scientists doing independent research.

you are sure? so then you are at a pharma company?

[shlver]

They can help people, but their primary purpose is making money. Low doses of different strains of weed could help many people with many different problems but you could never charge for it like you could with pills..
No the corporation's primary purpose is making money. The primary purpose of the drug is medical treatment and helping people.

[shlver]

you are sure? so then you are at a pharma company?
No that was an overestimation. I'm probably wrong as I've only done research in a collegial setting.

[Nanners]

No that was an overestimation. I'm probably wrong as I've only done research in a collegial setting.

i am sure there are plenty of scientists working at pharma companies who are good people that only want to help others, but im not going to pretend that a company like pfizer has any altruistic intentions when it develops a new drug. its about money and nothing else.

[KyrieTheFuture]

Honestly though, ten percent of the nation really isn't that large a portion. Do those ten percent have a problem? I'd wager about 7%. There are a lot of people who NEED the pills and they help though, it's the doctors fault for being so stupid with ADD, Depression, and Pain medications.

[~primetime~]

Honestly though, ten percent of the nation really isn't that large a portion. Do those ten percent have a problem? I'd wager about 7%. There are a lot of people who NEED the pills and they help though, it's the doctors fault for being so stupid with ADD, Depression, and Pain medications.
it's more than 10% of the adult population

23% of the population is under 18 years old

[KyrieTheFuture]

it's more than 10% of the adult population

23% of the population is under 18 years old
Slightly less than 10% of the total population is on anti depressants according to this

[~primetime~]

Slightly less than 10% of the total population is on anti depressants according to this
?

total population 18 & over:

242,542,967


30m of that is like 14% of US adults

probably all the white women...smh

[Graviton]

Those are all just the "official" numbers too. When I went to LA I found out how hooked on drugs the young adults there were. A good portion of 18-25 year olds either on oxy, vicodin, coke, heroin or another variation. Even here in the Bay people use SOMETHING for their stress and depression.

Weed used to be the main thing years ago, but now pain pills seem to be the popular option.