i wish more teams in the NBA played like Spain

[kennethgriffin]

i find everyone in the nba trys to be like kobe or jordan. seems like every single player growing up thinks they don't need smart passing and team work/chemistry to win. just isolation. but its insanely rare to be good enough to beat teams going 1 on 5 and only passing the ball when you feel like it

i find most american players don't have a clue how to play basketball

i think its why the spurs draft mostly over seas talent.

the spurs are basically an international team. and it shows with their style of play. they know how to win without having a single superstar

parkers an allstar. but hes not a superstar. duncan hasnt been one for years

kawhi is good but hes 3-4 years from being a superstar.


i'm watching spain right now on tv live. they don't have a single superstar. they only have one current allstar ( marc gasol ) but i think they can beat team USA..

i think theres a reason why theres rarely ever a great white american player. its because they dont have the athleticism black people have. and theyre growing up with bad teachers/coaches who just push athleticism over skills. while all the great talent around the world is usually not black. because they grow up learning fundimentals, team work, skills.

[SamuraiSWISH]

i think theres a reason why theres rarely ever a great white american player. its because they dont have the athleticism black people have. and theyre growing up with bad teachers/coaches who just push athleticism over skills. while all the great talent around the world is usually not black. because they grow up learning fundimentals, team work, skills.
You just described 90s basketball.

Best of both worlds, diversity, whites / blacks, skills, intelligence, and athleticism all rolled into one. Role players. Not everyone wanting to be a superstar, because everyone can't be.

Ever since HS draftees, and AAU came to power in the late 90's, and early 2000s. Fundamentals, niche players, and unique playing styles fell by the waste side. Everything became cookie cutter.

Also you described the greatness of LeBron James at the start of your post. He's an insane athlete, one of the best ever, can score in isolation near with the best of them, but is a selfless passer who willingly tries to get others involved.

Good job on basically back firing all your agenda pushing myths. You just negated all of your trolling, attention seeking behavior on ISH.

:applause:

[kennethgriffin]

You just described 90s basketball. Best of both worlds, of diversity, skills, intelligence, and athleticism all rolled into one. Ever since HS draftees, and AAU came to power in the late 90's, and early 2000s. Fundamentals, niche players, and unique playing styles fell by the waste side. Everything became cookie cutter.

Also you described the greatness of LeBron James at the start of your post. He's an insane athlete, one of the best ever, can score in isolation near with the best of them, but is a selfless passer who willingly tries to get others involved.

Good job on basically back firing all your agenda pushing myths. You just negated all of your trolling, attention seeking behavior on ISH.

:applause:


na i wouldnt put lebron on that level of fundimental/skills


lebrons offensive game isnt well rounded at all

he passes and scores with layups and wide open threes

but wheres the footwork

wheres the technique

wheres the post game

wheres the off hand

wheres the shooting form

wheres the offensive system of 5 guys moving and the ball not sticking


lebron is not anywhere near a euro style baller. not even close

he holds the ball way too long. he isnt nearly as polished

common man


just points and assists dont = all around fundimentals of basketball

but i will give lebron credit for his euro flopping skills and ability to realize his short comings and not try to force it 1 on 5.

[NZStreetBaller]

this is actually a good thread and i see no agenda in it. I never grew up in america but you're right alot of black american players choose option 1 jump over 3 guys in the paint for a dunk instead of kick it out to the open man.

And because alot of european player dont show off flashy moves and individual dominance they dont get alot of attention.

[Levity]

with the spurs recent, but continued success, i feel we'll see more teams trying to mimic their type of game. its beautiful execution that has been proven to lead to winning basketball in this league. also, its a type of system that doesnt require a "superstar". instead, you need players that fit that style of play, or are willing to adapt.

[ImKobe]

You just described 90s basketball.


Good job on basically back firing all your agenda pushing myths.


You're a ****ing tool.

Calling him out for having an agenda while you shamelessly prop up the 90s to make Jordan's 6 rings seem greater.

[kennethgriffin]

i think there should be a banner on the wall of every single highschool gym around america that says

"only one guy was ever successful trying to be like mike. pass the damn ball"



not that kobe or jordan never passed. but they looked to shoot for their 1st, 2nd and 3rd option


because they could get away with it... but not many people can

[SamuraiSWISH]

You're a ****ing tool.

Calling him out for having an agenda while you shamelessly prop up the 90s to make Jordan's 6 rings seem greater.
Prop up? I don't need to prop it up, only defend it from young kids who were swimming in their daddy's sack when the rest of us witnessed it.

All I said was OP just described that era. Verbatim.

So Jordan's 6 rings aren't great? Only cholo Laker or Kobe stans down play the 90s or MJ. Insecurity. Your favorite player's favorite player.

Same goes for their agenda against LeBron.

[SpanishACB]

American players have just adapted to NBA rules.

And on an international level, there's two things, one: the NBA as a whole, including its fanbase, don't really care. And two: they have so much talent they can win games internationally without playing the Spurs game.

If USA played Spurs ball, they'd be unstoppable even for Spain. With a few tweaks in the current roster of course.

But there's big problems stopping that from happening, for one, the NBA is a player's league, there's only so many coaches bigger or at the same level as their whole team, Pop is one. If there were more and players were forced into a tactical scheme and forced to make plays based on matchups and how hot players are, ignoring the fact the franchise player must take X shots and yadda yadda and most importantly, impose a culture where taking a bad shot is bad and it's even worse if you take it with a teammate open, and if it gets in it's just luck because no guard or perimeter F shoots contesteds over 50%, no one, then for us hardcore basketball fans, it would be a joy to watch.

[kennethgriffin]

Prop up? I don't need to prop it up, only defend it from young kids who were swimming in their daddy's sack when the rest of us witnessed it.

All I said was OP just described that era. Verbatim.

So Jordan's 6 rings aren't great? Only cholo Laker or Kobe stans down play the 90s or MJ. Insecurity. Your favorite player's favorite player.

Same goes for their agenda against LeBron.


i think a better example of team basketball is the 80s


the 90's was the 1 man show expansion era. the 90's is literally the reason we're in the type of situation we're in today.

jordan ruined it. he made everyone believe it was easy. only kobe knew how much work went into being that type of guy

its not all just fade aways and dunks

[KyrieTheFuture]

There's just no possible way you have any friends or acquaintances. If I had to deal with you in real life I'd last maybe a week before snapping and killing both of us.

[kennethgriffin]

American players have just adapted to NBA rules.

And on an international level, there's two things, one: the NBA as a whole, including its fanbase, don't really care. And two: they have so much talent they can win games internationally without playing the Spurs game.

If USA played Spurs ball, they'd be unstoppable even for Spain. With a few tweaks in the current roster of course.

barely

before kobe got there the US lost in 2002, 2004, and 2006

talent alone didnt make them good


and it took a historic performance by kobe in the gold medal game in 2008 just to beat spain


they literally needed every single piece of talent the US could put out there just to barely get it done



only just in the last few years has the US finally started playing dominant. and its due to the new system they have in place and the chemistry these guys have built

[Kblaze8855]

You just described 90s basketball.


Depends what part. Late 90s and early 2000s baketball was the most isolation based game possibly of all time.

[kennethgriffin]

Depends what part. Late 90s and early 2000s baketball was the most isolation based game possibly of all time.


i remember back in the late 90's.. there was allot of "clear out" plays


where the best isolation player on the team would tell the other 4 guys to all stand on the opposite side of the floor

because at the time you had to be within arms length of a defender. and if you left your man for more than a few seconds youd be called for illegal defense



its a shame they got rid of this before kobes prime

he woulda averaged 50+ in 06 instead of 35 lol

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

The 90s isn't a great example because of expansion and HERO ball that ushered its way into the late 90s.

The 80s = ultimate team ball


There's just no possible way you have any friends or acquaintances. If I had to deal with you in real life I'd last maybe a week before snapping and killing both of us.

:biggums:

Over a basketball opinion? Yeah, you're not mentally unstable or anything.

[Kblaze8855]

i remember back in the late 90's.. there was allot of "clear out" plays


where the best isolation player on the team would tell the other 4 guys to all stand on the opposite side of the floor

because at the time you had to be within arms length of a defender. and if you left your man for more than a few seconds youd be called for illegal defense



its a shame they got rid of this before kobes prime

he woulda averaged 50+ in 06 instead of 35 lol

It was an issue of who had the ball. If he had the ball you could double off someone all day. You couldnt do it off the ball.

It wouldnt help the Kobes, Lebron, Melos, and Pierces as much as the quick strike guys. It wouldnt benefit the guys who spend a while sizing up. Well it would...just not as much.

They could quadruple team you if you had the ball.

[SexSymbol]

You just described 90s basketball.

Best of both worlds, diversity, whites / blacks, skills, intelligence, and athleticism all rolled into one. Role players. Not everyone wanting to be a superstar, because everyone can't be.

Ever since HS draftees, and AAU came to power in the late 90's, and early 2000s. Fundamentals, niche players, and unique playing styles fell by the waste side. Everything became cookie cutter.

Also you described the greatness of LeBron James at the start of your post. He's an insane athlete, one of the best ever, can score in isolation near with the best of them, but is a selfless passer who willingly tries to get others involved.

Good job on basically back firing all your agenda pushing myths. You just negated all of your trolling, attention seeking behavior on ISH.

:applause:

Bullshit, 90s were more individualism centered.

[Shade8780]

Agreed. European basketball = the beautiful game.

I don't even watch Euroleague, but I do know it's full of a lot of fundamentally-sound, non-athletic white guys who play team ball :D Hopefully the Spurs recent success can usher in a new era of team ball in the NBA.

[kennethgriffin]

It was an issue of who had the ball. If he had the ball you could double off someone all day. You couldnt do it off the ball.

It wouldnt help the Kobes, Lebron, Melos, and Pierces as much as the quick strike guys. It wouldnt benefit the guys who spend a while sizing up. Well it would...just not as much.

They could quadruple team you if you had the ball.




http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_history.html






1981-82
• Zone defense rules clarified with new rules for Illegal Defensive Alignments.
a. Weak side defenders may come in the pro lane (16’), but not in the college lane (12’) for more than three seconds.
b. Defender on post player is allowed in defensive three-second area (A post player is any player adjacent to paint area).
c. Player without ball may not be double-teamed from weak side.
d. Offensive player above foul line and inside circle must be played by defender inside dotted line.
e. If offensive player is above the top of the circle, defender must come to a position above foul line.
f. Defender on cutter must follow the cutter, switch, or double-team the ball.
• After the first illegal defense violation, the clock is reset to 24 seconds. All subsequent violations result in one free throw and possession of the ball. If any violation occurs during the last 24 seconds of each quarter or overtime period, the offended team receives one free throw.


2001-02
• Illegal defense guidelines will be eliminated in their entirety.
• A new defensive three-second rule will prohibit a defensive player from remaining in the lane for more than three consecutive seconds without closely guarding an offensive player.




defensive rules really favored the offense back in the day


this whole handchecking thing is nothing compared to the implementation of zone like defense in 2002