Would you draft Bird or Wiggins today?

[Marchesk]

Seeing as how some wonder if Bird would be too slow to handle today's super athletes.

[noob cake]

Wigginstans are really reaching here

Top 5-6 GOAT vs one of the lowest skilled #1 pick of all times....

[Akrazotile]

:facepalm

[uber]

Seeing as how some wonder if Bird would be too slow to handle today's super athletes.

As i remember correctly that's what have been told about Bird before he came to the NBA back then either.

[HurricaneKid]

You know that saying "there are no stupid questions"?

OP proving it wrong.

[Marchesk]

As i remember correctly that's what have been told about Bird before he came to the NBA back then either.

Probably so. Were there any questions about Magic as a guard being quick or athletic enough?

[Marchesk]

You know that saying "there are no stupid questions"?

OP proving it wrong.

Should I have asked, would you draft Love or Wiggins? Would that make it more even?

[JohnMax]

Embiid would have been #1 pick if not for health problems.

[PHILA]

As i remember correctly that's what have been told about Bird before he came to the NBA back then either.

Alex Hannum, May 1979

http://i.imgur.com/rr3KhKy.png



Red Auerbach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcB43C0dawQ&t=19m14s

[Akrazotile]

Embiid would have been #1 pick if not for health problems.



He should still have been #1.

[StephHamann]

OP:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpuRcmPnSTM

[navy]

Alex Hannum, May 1979

http://i.imgur.com/rr3KhKy.png



Red Auerbach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcB43C0dawQ&t=19m14s
:applause:

[Marchesk]

OP:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YpuRcmPnSTM

I'm just a messenger, but hilarious clip.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Bird killed these playes, time and time again (just in case you don't know them)...

Bobby Jones: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NxCr-3L8J4

Michael Cooper: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7K-oa2bDFY

Larry Nance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdBDOyzh8T8

Orlando Woolridge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJ-CH_dHw8Q

Sidney Moncrief: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ADAo3W4Hos

Kenny Walker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5pVmmjLPlg

Xavier McDaniel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibgXpouwhgk

Buck Williams: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLLDjCLXtU0

Jerome Kersey: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLA8pj8yW58

As for the more well known names, he did this to them...

Dennis Rodman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5BJGCh_eCY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJd4H4QvUck https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-42c470-MjM

Michael Jordan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKoXZ1f00Mc

Julius Erving: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugW1oJuG7eo

Scottie Pippen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcXp3PSRGvw

James Worthy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TKx8hWaG_2o

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjyfWn5uq5I

Hakeem Olajuwon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WivGOEznCU

... then you also got Paul Pressey, Dominique Wilkins, Rodney McCray, Horace Grant, Tom Chambers, Cliff Robinson (all-defensive in the 00's), Terry Cummings, so on:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=msEmcemLR7M
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksp82aw-jqg

Lots of all-time great defenders and/or athletes, along with better bigs in the paint, and with more physicality going on, plus less superstar treatment...

I'm sorry but today's era couldn't "offer" as much in order to stop Bird, if anything Larry would've had it "easier" nowadays.

If you'd pick Wiggins you would be making the same mistake that some coaches, players, gm's and so on did back in the day, then Bird just proved them all dead wrong, having a top5 peak of all-time, playing unreal basketball.

In fact, Bird's athleticism is very underrated, he was a pretty solid athlete before serious injuries, all of that stuff was just to add to the "myth", being white and unathletic and whatnot.
Larry was 6'9'', played at over 220 lbs, was very mobile, two of the quickest hands ever, very coordinated, great footwork, very strong, deciptively quick especially in small spaces, same vertical as Karl Malone's, could run on the break, had some nice dunks...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NX8ipponmSc

[choppermagic]

Are you kidding?

Look up Larry Bird's college career. Dude was a god and the only game they lost in his final year was against Magic Johnson's team in the title game. Guy was scoring a ton more than Wiggins and transformed his school's basketball program single handedly. No way Wiggins is getting the nod over Bird.

[oarabbus]

Alex Hannum, May 1979

http://i.imgur.com/rr3KhKy.png



Red Auerbach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcB43C0dawQ&t=19m14s


LARRY "Probably not a franchise player" BIRD, DA GAWD :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

[Marchesk]

Are you kidding?

Look up Larry Bird's college career. Dude was a god and the only game they lost in his final year was against Magic Johnson's team in the title game. Guy was scoring a ton more than Wiggins and transformed his school's basketball program single handedly. No way Wiggins is getting the nod over Bird.

I'm not making the argument for Wiggins, it just came up in another thread that Bird might be too slow for today's athletes.

But let's do a hypothetical. Say Bird played this past season. Maybe he's leading undefeated WSU (in place of Cleanthony Early) to the title game against a healthy KU.

Now how would you imagine the draft order going between Bird and Wiggins? What do you think the discussion would be about Bird? Another great college white player like Danny Ferry who won't turn out in the pros? Better to pick Wiggins who has the elite athleticism to make it as a star on the next level?

I think Bird would be just as great today, and maybe even better with the focus on utilizing the 3pt line, but you know people would be questioning how his game would translate to the pros coming from a Missouri Valley school who doesn't look athletic.

[kshutts1]

Going by at the time of the draft, trying to ignore hindsight...

Bird had a great college career, albeit for a lower-echelon school. Won Naismith player of the year, and made a title game. Dropped out of his first college, because the transition was a shock to his system. Played 3 years.

Wiggins had a much worse college career, though not a bad one. Played for a stacked team, so naturally stats suffered relative to Bird. Played for a high-profile, upper-echelon team. Significantly better athlete.

I would personally choose Bird. But I think a strong case can be made that Wiggins would be picked over him. Very strong case, considering today's biases.

[ralph_i_el]

Always choose the young guy with the elite jumper.

Same reason why folks are going to regret passing up on dougy McD.

Two traits that rarely fail in the NBA: a young guy with an elite jumper, and a big guy who's quick with a good stride/sure feet.

[stanlove1111]

Alex Hannum, May 1979

http://i.imgur.com/rr3KhKy.png



Red Auerbach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcB43C0dawQ&t=19m14s

I believe at the time very few people thought Bird was going to be a really great player..I believe everyone thought he would just be a good tall shooter who couldn't guard anyone. This is before the season..

I saw him play in an exhibition game before his rookie year and his passing was unreal..He didn't score much but dominated the game with passing. It was incredible to see that in person. This was before you were used to seeing him do it and before defenses adjusted to his passing.

[uber]

Alex Hannum, May 1979

http://i.imgur.com/rr3KhKy.png



Red Auerbach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcB43C0dawQ&t=19m14s

That's a great find :applause:

I meant Joe B. Hall, the guy who recruited Bird for the WIT where Bird and Magic met for the first time.

[Thorpesaurous]

With the value of the "Stretch Four", Bird would probably be more valuable in the current league than he was in his own era. He'd play PF, and he'd open up offenses at an insane level. He was getting 10 rebounds a game as a SF with two other elite bigs surrounding him. His offensive versatility means your no getting some stand around stretch four, but a legit mismatch off the bounce, and even more in the post than say someone like Dirk. And on top of that, with the lack of other really quality bigs, if you're really worried about him defensively, he'd be defending PFs, so it's not like he's going to be killing himself at that end (in fact he was actually really dangerous roaming on defense, so giving him a dead cover might actually make him really good at that end).

He also wasn't nearly as bad an athlete as he's made out to be.

[dreamwarrior]

College Larry Bird was like a Keith Van Horn. Personally I'd take Wiggins over Van Horn.

[Xiao Yao You]

The Legend of course

[the mesiah]

Seeing as how some wonder if Bird would be too slow to handle today's super athletes.
:biggums: :biggums: :biggums:
C'mon now M, u better than that..:facepalm :facepalm

[BuffaloBill]

Bird is old as hell. I'd draft Wiggins

[Replay32]

I'll take the guy who led a bunch of scrubs to the championship game in college.

[La Frescobaldi]

Alex Hannum, May 1979

http://i.imgur.com/rr3KhKy.png



Red Auerbach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcB43C0dawQ&t=19m14s

#1. P Jax
#2 R Auerbach
#3 Riles
#4 Pops
#5 Coach Hannum

[deja vu]

Bird was unstoppable in college. Took a mediocre Indiana State team to the NCAA Final. Bird hit like a dozen consecutive shots against DePaul in the semis to lead his team to the Final.

No way I'd take Wiggins over a player like that, even without hindsight.

[Collie]

Yeah man, I mean look at the slowass neanderthals Bird had to play against in the past. Jordan, Wilkins, Drexler, Worthy, Hakeem, Drob, King, Rodman...

NOTHING compared to the athletes today.

[DCL]

if there's ever a thread topic that makes people want to stop coming back to insidehoops, this might be it.

but fortunately, it's just one bad apple. the rest of the posters aren't on the same level of WTF.

[jstern]

Alex Hannum, May 1979

http://i.imgur.com/rr3KhKy.png



Red Auerbach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcB43C0dawQ&t=19m14s

One of the most amazing quotes. Saved it to my computer.

[Marchesk]

but fortunately, it's just one bad apple. the rest of the posters aren't on the same level of WTF.

You must not come here very often then.

[BoutPractice]

I drafted Bird as my first pick in an all-time peak draft... Eighth round, no Wiggins yet. And it's the same in the other draft: Bird in the first round as well.

Of course the difference is that you already know Bird's body of work, but still, the all-time peak draft is for a hypothetical matchup with players that may be from the 00s and 10s. What it tells you is that deep down, people know. They're not prepared to gamble and not take him based on fantasy arguments.

Bird is the sort of player a scout might dismiss before watching him play. Try him in a 5 on 5 situation and you'll be prepared to trade anyone on your team for a chance to get him within 2 minutes.

[JtotheIzzo]

Seeing as how some wonder if Bird would be too slow to handle today's super athletes.


Ya draft Bird...not sure if serious.

[Reggie43]

Seeing as how some wonder if Bird would be too slow to handle today's super athletes.

Would you care to name these people who believes this statement? Other than yourself of course :D

[SyRyanYang]

if there's ever a thread topic that makes people want to stop coming back to insidehoops, this might be it.

but fortunately, it's just one bad apple. the rest of the posters aren't on the same level of WTF.
:oldlol:

[Lebron23]

Can we compare Wiggins to Bird after he plays 3-4 full seasons in the NBA?? Even Lebron was never hyped like Wiggins. Wiggins was being touted as the next big thing since he was 13.

[Marchesk]

Ya draft Bird...not sure if serious.

It's not my argument that Bird was possibly too slow. Someone else mentioned it, which is silly because it didn't matter back then that he was slower than the elite athletes in the 80s, who could jump and run as well as the elite athletes today.

[Marchesk]

Would you care to name these people who believes this statement? Other than yourself of course :D

If I believed, I would argue for it. This thread is a counter-argument, which I've made in the other thread on human evolution. Which is that Bird would be just as great today.

[Reggie43]

If I believed, I would argue for it. This thread is a counter-argument, which I've made in the other thread on human evolution. Which is that Bird would be just as great today.

Yeah most of us probably knew what you were trying to say but that was such a painful question to ask so you should probably understand the replies you got. Sorry for messing with you :D