AI's 2001 playoff run vs. Kobe's 2008 playoff run.

[Magic 32]

Both lost in the finals.

Both are SG's

Both played some of the best basketball of their career.

http://s17.postimg.org/96b3nwfin/image.png

http://s12.postimg.org/av9108tfh/kobe.png

[SouBeachTalents]

Kobe was much better against a tougher conference, but Iverson was a lot better in the Finals against an all time great team

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe was much better against a tougher conference, but Iverson was a lot better in the Finals against an all time great team

imagine if shaq didnt start demanding 5 more shots and for kobe to get frozen out so he could steal finals mvp

shaq made kobe dominate to get rid of the real competition.

i think kobe was averaging like 33ppg up until the finals. shaq only 28ppg or some shit..

then shaq stole it right out from under kobe


pretty lame

[Warfan]

Kobe. Deke > AI in the ECF too imo

[JT123]

Kobe's pathetic Finals performance will always taint his 2008 playoff run. First he allows his team to blow a 25 point half time lead, AT HOME, in the series turning game 4. Then his team loses the game 6 elimination game by 39 points! :facepalm Those are the only 2 things that people will remember about Kobe's 2008 playoffs.
Iverson on the other hand led a team of D leaguers to the Finals, and handed one of the most stacked teams of all time their only playoff loss. :bowdown:
I'm not even a fan of Iverson, but that team he took to the Finals was almost as bad as Lebron's 2007 Cavs.

[SouBeachTalents]

Kobe's pathetic Finals performance will always taint his 2008 playoff run. First he allows his team to blow a 25 point half time lead, AT HOME, in the series turning game 4. Then his team loses the game 6 elimination game by 39 points! :facepalm Those are the only 2 things that people will remember about Kobe's 2008 playoffs.
Iverson on the other hand led a team of D leaguers to the Finals, and handed one of the most stacked teams of all time their only playoff loss. :bowdown:
I'm not even a fan of Iverson, but that team he took to the Finals was almost as bad as Lebron's 2007 Cavs.

Kobe's 2008 Finals > LeBron's 2011 Finals

Kobe's Game 4 >>>>>>>>>> LeBron's Game 4

[JohnFreeman]

Iverson

[Magic 32]

Iverson

Nooo, really.

[dubeta]

That 38% fg makes me want to puke


A.I, westbrook, kobe, whats with the praise and idolatry of inefficient players?I understand A.i was the only one who could get a shot off, and put pressure on the defense but at 38% you are really hurting your team

[ai9]

That 38% fg makes me want to puke


A.I, westbrook, kobe, whats with the praise and idolatry of inefficient players?I understand A.i was the only one who could get a shot off, and put pressure on the defense but at 38% you are really hurting your team

Would it be better to just let the shot clock expire?

[riseagainst]

Would it be better to just let the shot clock expire?

:oldlol:

ether

[SOD 21]

It is extraordinary that Iversen averaged 30 field-goal attempts per game in the 2001 playoff run and barely averaged over a point per shot.

He should have an averaged close to 40 points per game with that number of shots.

[riseagainst]

It is extraordinary that Iversen averaged 30 field-goal attempts per game in the 2001 playoff run and barely averaged over a point per shot.

He should have an averaged close to 40 points per game with that number of shots.

if he averaged 32.9 points on those 30 shot attempts on 50% FG, would you still criticize him?

[Baller1986]

It is extraordinary that Iversen averaged 30 field-goal attempts per game in the 2001 playoff run and barely averaged over a point per shot.

He should have an averaged close to 40 points per game with that number of shots.


In fairness to Iverson he played in the pre 2005 NBA Rules. An older iverson averaged 33 ppg on 46 FG% in the 2005-06 NBA Season.

[SouBeachTalents]

if he averaged 32.9 points on those 30 shot attempts on 50% FG, would you still criticize him?

That would be almost mathematically impossible. He'd have to average making either just one 3 pointer per game, or 2-3 free throws. Both extremely unlikely

[riseagainst]

That would be almost mathematically impossible. He'd have to average making either just one 3 pointer per game, or 2-3 free throws. Both extremely unlikely

33 points on 30 FGA, 50%FG, 3FTA a game. maybe a couple 3s made.

do you guys still criticize him for taking 30 shots to put up 33 points? How bout 30 points on 30 shots. 50%FG. Stop picking at technicalities.

[chazzy]

Kobe's for sure. Since Kobe was the best player in the league that year, are the people picking Iverson saying he was better than 08 Lebron and CP3?

[ImKobe]

Kobe was much better against a tougher conference, but Iverson was a lot better in the Finals against an all time great team

Oh really? And 08 Celtics weren't an all-time great team?

AI only had one good game in that series and averaged 36/6/4/2 on 32 FGA while Kobe averaged 26/5/5/3 on 22 FGA...And Kobe went up against the better defense.

[dubeta]

Lebron would be averaging 50 if he chucked 30 shots a game

[SouBeachTalents]

Oh really? And 08 Celtics weren't an all-time great team?

AI only had one good game in that series and averaged 36/6/4/2 on 32 FGA while Kobe averaged 26/5/5/3 on 22 FGA...And Kobe went up against the better defense.

Even if you factor in defense, not sure how 26, 5, 5 on 41% > 36, 6, 4 on 41%

[Jlamb47]

Lebron would be averaging 50 if he chucked 30 shots a game

then maybe Lebron should of so his team had a better shot at winning in the finals

I dont get how someone can shoot over 50% but not take more shots -_-

The point of the game is to SCORE and get a BASKET.

Betas like to make sure their stats dont dip

[Beastmode88]

then maybe Lebron should of so his team had a better shot at winning in the finals

I dont get how someone can shoot over 50% but not take more shots -_-

The point of the game is to SCORE and get a BASKET.

Betas like to make sure their stats dont dip

Gotta statpad in garbage time.:hammerhead:

[Demitri98]

Kobe's pathetic Finals performance will always taint his 2008 playoff run. First he allows his team to blow a 25 point half time lead, AT HOME, in the series turning game 4. Then his team loses the game 6 elimination game by 39 points! :facepalm Those are the only 2 things that people will remember about Kobe's 2008 playoffs.
Iverson on the other hand led a team of D leaguers to the Finals, and handed one of the most stacked teams of all time their only playoff loss. :bowdown:
I'm not even a fan of Iverson, but that team he took to the Finals was almost as bad as Lebron's 2007 Cavs.
IMO the 01 Sixers were quite a bit better than the '07 Cavs. The Sixers had former DPOY Mutumbo, who was still very good on that end, and an all-time great coach in Larry Brown.

On the other hand, the '07 Eastern conference was probably the weakest we've ever seen. The Cavs' only real competition was an old, broken down, former champion Pistons team who had lost their heart and soul, Ben Wallace. LeBron's team was worse but the conference was much worse too.

In my eyes they were both equal, but AI performed much better in the Finals, while a young LeBron struggled against the Spurs on the big stage where he has no experience and a horrible team/coach surrounding him.

[Smoke117]

IMO the 01 Sixers were quite a bit better than the '07 Cavs. The Sixers had former DPOY Mutumbo, who was still very good on that end, and an all-time great coach in Larry Brown.

On the other hand, the '07 Eastern conference was probably the weakest we've ever seen. The Cavs' only real competition was an old, broken down, former champion Pistons team who had lost their heart and soul, Ben Wallace. LeBron's team was worse but the conference was much worse too.

In my eyes they were both equal, but AI performed much better in the Finals, while a young LeBron struggled against the Spurs on the big stage where he has no experience and a horrible team/coach surrounding him.

Former? He WAS the DPOY in 2001.

[ImKobe]

Even if you factor in defense, not sure how 26, 5, 5 on 41% > 36, 6, 4 on 41%

Because one guy takes 10 more shots a game? You take 30+ shots, you better score 30+ ppg...

Plus, AI's supporting cast in 01 is arguably better than Kobe's 2008 cast with Bynum out for the season and Ariza being a garbage time player...

[dubeta]

Because one guy takes 10 more shots a game? You take 30+ shots, you better score 30+ ppg...

Plus, AI's supporting cast in 01 is arguably better than Kobe's 2008 cast with Bynum out for the season and Ariza being a garbage time player...


So Kobes 35 ppg season doesnt really mean much since he took 28 shots to get it?

[ArbitraryWater]

33 points on 30 FGA, 50%FG, 3FTA a game. maybe a couple 3s made.

do you guys still criticize him for taking 30 shots to put up 33 points? How bout 30 points on 30 shots. 50%FG. Stop picking at technicalities.

except he wasnt 50% but 39% :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Myth]

imagine if shaq didnt start demanding 5 more shots and for kobe to get frozen out so he could steal finals mvp

shaq made kobe dominate to get rid of the real competition.

i think kobe was averaging like 33ppg up until the finals. shaq only 28ppg or some shit..

then shaq stole it right out from under kobe


pretty lame

Thinking back to the 2000 WCF against my Blazers, Kobe put up more points, but that was because the Blazers strategies focused around Shaq. He was more bothersome. Most of my painful memories from that series involved Shaq (and phantom calls on Sabonis), not Kobe.

[ImKobe]

except he wasnt 50% but 39% :roll: :roll: :roll:

And he took 32 FGA for 36 ppg :oldlol: Taking 32 shots PER GAME

Kobe outplayed him the next 4 games of that series, averaging 27/9/6/2/1 on 44% shooting vs AI putting up 33/6/2 on 40/26/67 shooting

dumb ass nikkaz

[ImKobe]

Thinking back to the 2000 WCF against my Blazers, Kobe put up more points, but that was because the Blazers strategies focused around Shaq. He was more bothersome. Most of my painful memories from that series involved Shaq (and phantom calls on Sabonis), not Kobe.

And you completely disregard the game-saving block Kobe had on Sabonis in that series? Like that didn't happen :oldlol:

[riseagainst]

except he wasnt 50% but 39% :roll: :roll: :roll:

meh. You don't even know the context of this discussion.

[Myth]

And you completely disregard the game-saving block Kobe had on Sabonis in that series? Like that didn't happen :oldlol:

I said "most." I wasn't disregarding everything Kobe did.

And even on that particular play you were mentioning, Fisher's defense allowed for the block by Kobe.

[ArbitraryWater]

And he took 32 FGA for 36 ppg :oldlol: Taking 32 shots PER GAME

Kobe outplayed him the next 4 games of that series, averaging 27/9/6/2/1 on 44% shooting vs AI putting up 33/6/2 on 40/26/67 shooting

dumb ass nikkaz

Yea... You're wrong about Kobe having a weaker supporting cast (albeit playing MUCH better competition), but Kobe's 2008 Playoff run is GOAT-ish, and BLOWS IVERSON OUT OF THE WATER.... This isn't close.

[PejaTheSerbSnip]

I'll take Kobe in '08. AI had a special year but that playoff run is a tad overrated. If you look at the box scores the OP included, there were at least 7-8 atrocious shooting games. I think he only played 2 consecutive GREAT games in a series ONCE, games 6 and 7 versus Milwaukee, but remember that the majority of his points in game 6 came after the Bucks had established a huge lead. People harp on how bad that team was, and it was by no means a formidable team, but even if they had few shot creators, AI should not be putting up 5/26, 8/27, 5/22 etc. A couple of times they even won in spite of him! Shot 5/26 in a game 5, 1 point win for Sixers in a crucial game

Look at the Toronto series. 2 monster games and 4 dreadful ones.

[PejaTheSerbSnip]

meh. You don't even know the context of this discussion.

If he shot 50% to get his 33 ppg on 30 shots, he almost certainly would be receiving less flak. While that would have meant he was a virtual non-factor at drawing fouls and making long-range shots, i bet his performance would be evaluated differently. But he didn't. He shot 39%.

[SamuraiSWISH]

Kobe was the better player, Bubba Chuck faced much better competition. '01 Bucks, '01 Lakers ... no other legit offensive options.

Ivo was much more entertaining, and showed way more heart. Ninja was a 5'11 SG. A certifiable little weapon. I enjoyed Iverson more, rooted harder for him, and I feel he had the more memorable / iconic playoffs.

Gave the undefeated Lakers 48 and their only loss, in LA during the Finals, while being guarded by the best perimeter defender in the league.

[sportjames23]

imagine if shaq didnt start demanding 5 more shots and for kobe to get frozen out so he could steal finals mvp

shaq made kobe dominate to get rid of the real competition.

i think kobe was averaging like 33ppg up until the finals. shaq only 28ppg or some shit..

then shaq stole it right out from under kobe


pretty lame


:facepalm

[Stringer Bell]

The 2001 Sixers as a whole get underrated a lot. They were a very good defensive team, including DPOY Mutombo. The team was designed to build around AI with good defenders and unselfish role players.

They were still winning postseason games in which AI shot dreadfully, including that Bucks game where AI had 15 points on 5-27 shooting and Philly still won.

[riseagainst]

The 2001 Sixers as a whole get underrated a lot. They were a very good defensive team, including DPOY Mutombo. The team was designed to build around AI with good defenders and unselfish role players.

They were still winning postseason games in which AI shot dreadfully, including that Bucks game where AI had 15 points on 5-27 shooting and Philly still won.

all hail the great Larry Brown.

:bowdown:

[Bigsmoke]

The 2001 Sixers as a whole get underrated a lot. They were a very good defensive team, including DPOY Mutombo. The team was designed to build around AI with good defenders and unselfish role players.

They were still winning postseason games in which AI shot dreadfully, including that Bucks game where AI had 15 points on 5-27 shooting and Philly still won.

The Sixers literally won every individual award besides rookie of the year and Finals MVP Iverson stans still say "well Iverson had no help in 2001"

His style of play cant compliments with of the stars like a Kobe or Tim Duncan

[Angel Face]

A.I., Single-handedly end Lakers win streak. 48 points on his 1st finals game.

[Bigsmoke]

A.I., Single-handedly end Lakers win streak. 48 points on his 1st finals game.

U can give credit to the Eric snow locking down Kobe in that game too


Mutombo's 13 points, 16 rebounds, and 5 block didn't mean shit either huh

[Shih508]

AI has more 50 point playoff games in one series than kobe has for his whole career out of god knows how many games Kobe has played in playoff.

AI topped Kobe's highest scoring point in Final with the first game he ever played.

Kobe is not a good scorer when it matters PERIOD!

[Angel Face]

U can give credit to the Eric snow locking down Kobe in that game too


Mutombo's 13 points, 16 rebounds, and 5 block didn't mean shit either huh

A.I was hitting clutch shots after clutch shots, and his step over on Lue was epic.

[Shih508]

The Sixers literally won every individual award besides rookie of the year and Finals MVP Iverson stans still say "well Iverson had no help in 2001"

His style of play cant compliments with of the stars like a Kobe or Tim Duncan

They only won everything because the team was so overachieved not that they were that great.

You only looked at record without knowing anything.

[RRR3]

AI has more 50 point playoff games in one series than kobe has for his whole career out of god knows how many games Kobe has played in playoff.

AI topped Kobe's highest scoring point in Final with the first game he ever played.

Kobe is not a good scorer when it matters PERIOD!
If Kobe shot as much as Iverson was shooting he'd score more.
Iversons fg% is atrocious; I understand he was the guy to create on that team and was instructed to shoot a lot, so I don't fault him for volume necessarily, but I would say he should have at least managed 42%+

[Shih508]

If Kobe shot as much as Iverson was shooting he'd score more.
Iversons fg% is atrocious; I understand he was the guy to create on that team and was instructed to shoot a lot, so I don't fault him for volume necessarily, but I would say he should have at least managed 42%+

You are acting like Kobe didn't have the green light like AI for his whole career. Kobe could shoot as many shots as he wanted after Shaq left the team why didn't he have more 50 points in playoff than AI while playing almost 3x more games than AI.

Just admit it, Kobe sux when it matters. Even Lebron is not on the same level SCORING wise comparing to AI.

If AI took one less desperation shot in that playoff run per game, he'd be sitting at 42-43%. I bet he prolly took more than 3 a game in that year.

Pound for pound best player ever - Allen Iverson

[RRR3]

You are acting like Kobe didn't have the green light like AI for his whole career. Kobe could shoot as many shots as he wanted after Shaq left the team why didn't he have more 50 points in playoff than AI while playing almost 3x more games than AI.

Just admit it, Kobe sux when it matters. Even Lebron is not on the same level SCORING wise comparing to AI.

If AI took one less desperation shot in that playoff run per game, he'd be sitting at 42-43%. I bet he prolly took more than 3 a game in that year.

Pound for pound best player ever - Allen Iverson
:facepalm

I'm not even looking up the stats now, but just off memory, pretty sure Kobe scores marginally less than AI but is significantly more efficient while rebounding better with comparable assist totals. All this and he's widely considered the superior defender as well. Kobe didn't shoot as much, that's why he scored less, how are you not getting this?
LeBron is better as well.

[ai9]

They only won everything because the team was so overachieved not that they were that great.

You only looked at record without knowing anything.

True. I mean, what the hell is 6th man of the year anyway? That's like calling someone the world's tallest midget.

[Shih508]

:facepalm

I'm not even looking up the stats now, but just off memory, pretty sure Kobe scores marginally less than AI but is significantly more efficient while rebounding better with comparable assist totals. All this and he's widely considered the superior defender as well. Kobe didn't shoot as much, that's why he scored less, how are you not getting this?
LeBron is better as well.

Kobe is more efficient cuz he wasn't the focal point on defense.

And you still haven't answered why Kobe never had a playoff scoring run like AI while he had as much green light as anyone in the history of NBA and playing most of playoff games of any all time greats

And shooting 22+ shots with Shaq on ur team is almost as bad AI shooting 30 a game tbh

[SouBeachTalents]

True. I mean, what the hell is 6th man of the year anyway? That's like calling someone the world's tallest midget.

:biggums:

I guess you're right, players like Kukoc, Terry, Ginobili, and McHale were useless because they didn't start, and they never contributed to winning championships

[TheMarkMadsen]

Kobe is more efficient cuz he wasn't the focal point on defense.

And you still haven't answered why Kobe never had a playoff scoring run like AI while he had as much green light as anyone in the history of NBA and playing most of playoff games of any all time greats

And shooting 22+ shots with Shaq on ur team is almost as bad AI shooting 30 a game tbh

Shooting 22+ times while 3peating bitch

[Bigsmoke]

A.I was hitting clutch shots after clutch shots, and his step over on Lue was epic.

The shots in overtime were nice but Kobe literally played like shit for the most part not because of Iverson. If Kobe played like Kobe that game then the Lakers would have won in regulation. To carry a team is what LeBron did against the Celtics in game 6 in the ECFs. "Scored efficiently, rebound, locked down Paul Pierce to 4-18 shooting, play stellar help defense"

Iverson didn't do all that and wasn't that efficient

[Bigsmoke]

They only won everything because the team was so overachieved not that they were that great.

You only looked at record without knowing anything.

That team was built by design. Larry Brown didn't get rid of all of the scorers the Sixers had in the past just to make Iverson's life miserable. They won those awards because Brown was the best coach that year "he outcoached Phil Jackson in the Finals 3 years later", Mutombo was the best defensive player, and Aaron McKie was the best backup

[Bigsmoke]

Kobe is more efficient cuz he wasn't the focal point on defense.

And you still haven't answered why Kobe never had a playoff scoring run like AI while he had as much green light as anyone in the history of NBA and playing most of playoff games of any all time greats

And shooting 22+ shots with Shaq on ur team is almost as bad AI shooting 30 a game tbh

But we are comparing Iverson to 08 Kobe

Kobe on beast mode and played almost as good as Shaq in 01 so why should he cut down his shot?

[ai9]

:biggums:

I guess you're right, players like Kukoc, Terry, Ginobili, and McHale were useless because they didn't start, and they never contributed to winning championships

Role players are important too. What I'm saying is that 6th man of the year is a really pointless award.

Yes, Aaron Mckie was instrumental to the sixers, but he only won the award because he was not a starter. Let's be real, Mckie was a great defender and a solid facilitator, but he couldn't really create his own shot. Outside of AI, no one else could be relied on to score, hence his "chucking".

Hell, since Kevin Durant can't win an MVP award, maybe he should come off the bench so he can win 6th man.

[Bigsmoke]

Role players are important too. What I'm saying is that 6th man of the year is a really pointless award.

Yes, Aaron Mckie was instrumental to the sixers, but he only won the award because he was not a starter. Let's be real, Mckie guy was a great defender and a solid facilitator, but the sixers were still a one man offense.

Hell, since Kevin Durant can't win an MVP award, maybe he should come off the bench so he can win 6th man.

Aaron Mackie averaged like 20ppg in the 11 games Iverson sat out in that year and were 6-5


They even defeated the Jazz on the road

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200012260UTA.html

[Shih508]

Shooting 22+ times while 3peating bitch

2 was rigged as hell!

[Shih508]

Aaron Mackie averaged like 20ppg in the 11 games Iverson sat out in that year and were 6-5


They even defeated the Jazz on the road

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200012260UTA.html

6-5 LOL that just shows u how important Iverson was to that team. 20ppg is not much when u are the first option of the team when AI was out.

[ai9]

Aaron Mackie averaged like 20ppg in the 11 games Iverson sat out in that year and were 6-5


They even defeated the Jazz on the road

Well someone has to pick up the slack when the star player is out. When Kobe, Lebron or whoever is out, I'm sure some bum like Smush Parker or Boobie Gibson picked up the scoring load for a few games. It doesn't make them special.

Don't get me wrong, Mckie was great for the sixers but some people are putting him in the same class as Ginobili or something just because they both have "6th man of the year" on their resume.

[Shih508]

Well someone has to pick up the slack when the star player is out. When Kobe, Lebron or whoever is out, I'm sure some bum like Smush Parker or Boobie Gibson picked up the scoring load for a few games. It doesn't make them special.

Don't get me wrong, Mckie was great for the sixers but some people are putting him in the same class as Ginobili or something just because they both have "6th man of the year" on their resume.

:rockon:

[Bigsmoke]

6-5 LOL that just shows u how important Iverson was to that team. 20ppg is not much when u are the first option of the team when AI was out.


If the team is winning then why wouldn't it mean anything?

[Shih508]

That team was winning close to 70% of game when AI played