The fifth season of The Wire is fantastic

[RidonKs]

i've seen a ton of people not just say it doesn't stack up to the other seasons but say that it's just flat out average / way off course for the show.

anybody who dislikes that season of the wire for any particular reason please comment in this thread : what don't you like about it?

[LJJ]

I think the consensus is not that it was bad, but that it was a big drop off. You won't find many people who stuck with the show for five seasons saying the fifth was flat out bad, only that it was by far the worst season.

It's just so ham fisted compared to the other seasons.

The most obvious example is the new journalism storyline. David Simon is incredibly bitter about his own final years as a reporter for the Sun, which is what he used as the basis for the story. Gus is the archangel of newspaper justice, he's practically a Mary Sue character. While Templeton is the collection of every single thing that's wrong with modern journalism and the bosses are pure evil. Non of the major characters in the other settings are that flat and uninteresting, in the newsroom they all are.

That's the most direct example, but it pervades through all the other storylines. The characters are still the same, the themes are still the same and that part of it still works very well. But the plot this time is highly derivative of the previous seasons and a lot of nuance and detail is missing.

[Nick Young]

Its good but I thought the newspaper team were boring and the fat black newspaper editor is like a Mary Sue author insert from David Simon. Also that dumb latina writer lady always complaining about not being on the front page was annoying. Also the fat newspaper guy who always corrected peoples grammar and vocabulary was obnoxious. The newspaper writer who was supposed to be the most annoying, the one who made stuff up and won a pulitzer, wound up being the least annoying out of all these self righteous bozos, but he sucked too.


The rest of the season was good though.

[kNIOKAS]

RidonKs are you black?

[chips93]

mcnultys fake serial killer plot was unbelievable and so out of place in a show like the wire. the wire was great partly because of its realism, and that storyline was just too unrealistic for me.

[KevinNYC]

mcnultys fake serial killer plot was unbelievable and so out of place in a show like the wire. the wire was great partly because of its realism, and that storyline was just too unrealistic for me.
yeah, it was weak.

The fourth season which was based on Ed Burn's teaching experience was much better.

[Nastradamus]

i've seen a ton of people not just say it doesn't stack up to the other seasons but say that it's just flat out average / way off course for the show.

anybody who dislikes that season of the wire for any particular reason please comment in this thread : what don't you like about it?

Still a very good season, but all 4 others had a very strong baseline story that carried it, which season 5 does not. The Mcnulty creating a serial killer stuff is beneath The Wire(though in character for Mcnulty arguably) and a bit too network TV crime drama esque. Everything else on that show you can point to and say, yah, that feels like something that happens daily in any ghetto in America.

I like it though. The newspaper stuff is well done overall IMO, Marlo is awesome, Omar's death is epic etc.

[KyrieTheFuture]

I hated it because it basically made McNaulty's character progression useless and the Media members were so incredibly boring

[DonDadda59]

Season 5 was a massive letdown, especially considering it followed the brilliant 4th. Season 2 was also meh IMO. Nicky Sabotka irritated the hell out of me :mad:

[Nick Young]

I liked all the callbacks, like Nick Sabotka being a random protester at the docks and Horse the dockworker being one of the homeless, and Randy just being some a-hole kid only a year after going to that group home. And also I really like the ending.

[Qwyjibo]

Season 5 was a massive letdown, especially considering it followed the brilliant 4th. Season 2 was also meh IMO. Nicky Sabotka irritated the hell out of me :mad:
Are you sure about Nick? Ziggy was the one that irritated the hell out of me. But he got what he deserved in the end.

Like others have said, I also didn't like the McNulty stuff in season 5. Way too ridiculous and out of character for him. It did end on a great note though.

[DonDadda59]

Are you sure about Nick? Ziggy was the one that irritated the hell out of me. But he got what he deserved in the end.


Yeah, whichever one is the skinny rat-faced one. Not the one that looks like Ben Affleck's special needs cousin. I may have confused the names.

[Qwyjibo]

Ziggy didn't deserve anything. You have no heart if you didn't feel bad for him. :(
I felt a little bad but off the streets and in prison (especially after what he did) is probably the best place for a loose cannon like him. It felt right that Nick ended up as the only main Sobotka with a chance to turn things around.

[The_Yearning]

Yeah that serial killer shit was bullshit.

Way too unrealistic...

[Nick Young]

Yeah, whichever one is the skinny rat-faced one. Not the one that looks like Ben Affleck's special needs cousin. I may have confused the names.
He doesnt look like special needs cousin, he looks more like Ben Affleck with a big nose.

[Nick Young]

Yeah that serial killer shit was bullshit.

Way too unrealistic...
this I don't get so much-are you saying that Hamsterdam was realistic?

[The_Yearning]

this I don't get so much-are you saying that Hamsterdam was realistic?

That shit was realistic. It was only one zone.

[dazzer87]

A ton of people hate season 2 because it didn't deal with the shit established in the first season that much.
that was me the first time watching season 2. Watched it again and its probably my favorite season.

[Nick Young]

Season 2 is great, just as good as season 4. My favorite though is season 3: Rise of Marlo

[cuad]

You're all watching The Wire wrong if you care about which season is better than which.

[RidonKs]

there's so much about that fifth season i really think you guys are missing. i'm halfway through it now, rewatching this season for at least the seventh or eighth time.

this

You're all watching The Wire wrong if you care about which season is better than which.
pretty much sums it up though.

it's the perfectly bittersweet conclusion to what simon has described as a greek tragedy. the city is completely broke. the new mayor has proved not much different from the old one. the same broken politics control the major state institutions. the focus returns to the cop shop where a 'new day' had been promised by a seemingly sincere mayor who had campaigned on the crime rate. he refuses to take state funds to plug the enormous public school system deficit because he doesn't want the republican governor to have it over him. he refuses to accept federal help to prosecute a corrupt democratic senator because he doesn't want the bad party press. long story short, his administration is a mess because he's not making policy to solve problems, he's making policy to further his future political ambitions. and if you read really honest autobiographies by politicians or civil servants, they'll be the first to tell you about this game.

which is the metaphor of the entire saga. the games people play to... what? get ahead. more or less. and the current setting is the modern american city, or what your critical theorists might prefer to call the postmodern american city. one in which the major institutions are massive bureaucracies, some public some private, that host the lives of ambitious people trying to reach the top. and the real work those institutions were actually created to do is lost in the wind. everybody in it for themselves, nobody in it together. and nobody with the balls to stand up and point out the systematic failures.

i've posted this video from season one before but i think it sums up my point (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nAZZdL1qhk8)

which brings us to the disgruntled individuals within these systems who are fed up. who you might even be able to say have a ounce of integrity; maybe they care about the bureaucratic nightmare and perpetual careerism because they're on the front line doing good work which is not aided but impeded by the structure around them; all levels of management, principles like seniority and cronyism, political maneuvering, laziness and apathy and no sense of purpose, etc etc etc. these all exist in modern organizations of people to varying degrees everywhere in the world today.

in the case of season five, the disgruntled individual was jimmy mcnulty. a shall we say eccentric sort of person. and he went haywire. i'd love to address this issue of believability and realism... or at least hear somebody elaborate on what was so inconceivable of the plot.

but as the the concept, he broke the rules out of some great moralism. in a sense it's "crime and punishment" if anybodys read that, or at least i think it is. the main character in that story is trying to convince himself killing this old evil hag was the right thing to do. mcnulty struggles with the same question though with perhaps more convincing (at least imo) justifications. which is what makes it all so compelling. and we know what happens in the end; it bites him in the ass... sort of. it also works... sort of. marlo is out of the game... sort of. stan valchek is police commissioner.... sort of.

there is much more to say about all of this but lastly, the press come into the picture. the free press is an even worse case of an institution having its funds cut to the bone than the public school or police system. perhaps not quite as bad as the stevadore unions lol

lots of people complain that the baltimore sun store line was boring or silly or shallow or w/e. others complain it was just disgruntled david simon taking out his frustration with his familiar institution, though in a much healthier way than his character jimmy mcnulty. and yes, gus was probably portrayed in simon's own image... that seems very likely.

but to be brief, the newspaper plot was somewhat deceiving. the idea wasn't so much what the newsroom was covering so much as what it wasn't even talking about. think about all the other stories in season five; carcetti's undercover political dealings with the black caucus and various developers, marlo stanfield taking over the drug market of the entire city by axing prop joe (a marlo murder that a writer suggested for a story but was axed for a story about a fire or something).

that's two examples. but the creme de la creme of this whole circus is the insanity of the carcetti administration jumping on the homeless issue. the irony is pointed out by the black political aid (norman something) when he says "boy id love to write on this. they [mcnulty, freamon] manufactured an issue to get paid. we [carcetti] manufacured an issue to get elected. it's just too much".

and once again, the sun doesn't have a clue about this. a few reporters and editors have their suspicions about the legitimacy of this homeless murder fraud but nobody can figure it out. and for good reason because it's very carefully implemented scheme by professional cops and a lying but clever young reporter who stumbles into it. and instead of investigating its legitimacy further, the sun wins a pulitzer for it.

the last thing to bear in mind is that this season was cut short. it was supposed to have at least 2 more episodes and maybe 3 which would mean anywhere from 1.5 to 2.5 extra hours of footage. it probably would have been wrapped up much better and its a shame the ending was rushed.

[Nick Young]

Yes season 5 is good, it's just that the newspaper team is obnoxious with Mary Sue author inserts. It ended the whole show very well in that last episode too. You didn't have to write an essay explaining what is obvious on a basketball message board dawg.

[RidonKs]

i like writing essays and it clarifies shit so aint no thang plus i'd write/talk about the wire for hours if i had the time

i dunno i also think there's a lot to talk about it with regard to the way real society operates. its fictional and hyperbolic of course as any dramatic rendition must be but the lessons and understanding it offers isn't just timely right this second; these are the sorts of issues that have been plaguing artists to pour their souls our for thousands of years.

[Nick Young]

i like writing essays and it clarifies shit so aint no thang plus i'd write/talk about the wire for hours if i had the time

i dunno i also think there's a lot to talk about it with regard to the way real society operates. its fictional and hyperbolic of course as any dramatic rendition must be but the lessons and understanding it offers isn't just timely right this second; these are the sorts of issues that have been plaguing artists to pour their souls our for thousands of years.
Yep its the best show ever.

/thread.

[RidonKs]

:eek: we agree on something :eek:

[Nanners]

i like writing essays and it clarifies shit so aint no thang plus i'd write/talk about the wire for hours if i had the time

i dunno i also think there's a lot to talk about it with regard to the way real society operates. its fictional and hyperbolic of course as any dramatic rendition must be but the lessons and understanding it offers isn't just timely right this second; these are the sorts of issues that have been plaguing artists to pour their souls our for thousands of years.

you should really just ignore him, or at least ignore asshole statements like this one


You didn't have to write an essay explaining what is obvious on a basketball message board dawg.

go fvck yourself bruinlove

[johndeeregreen]

A ton of people hate season 2 because it didn't deal with the shit established in the first season that much.
Whereas others, such as myself, feel it was the best.

[RidonKs]

Whereas others, such as myself, feel it was the best.
this opens up the discussion further. there is not much of a consensus of bet season. i suppose typically the order 4-3-1/2-5. but these seasons are not even worth ranking for the reason explained earlier by cuad.

am i mistaken mr tractor or have you professed your distaste for season five of the wire on this website? i might be confusing you with somebody else.