Another example of police doing s*** they're not supposed to do

[chosen_one6]

http://youtu.be/XsW-QCxXkQA

:wtf:

Yo this shit is really getting ridiculous. How far will they go? :facepalm

EDIT: The back story goes as follows:

The lady in the drivers seat was pulled over for not wearing her seatbelt. The lady and the passengers were on their way to the hospital to see the drivers dying mother and were in a hurry. During the traffic stop the police officers asked to see the passengers ID for reasons unknown. The passenger stated that he did not have an ID because it was confiscated due to driving without insurance in a prior traffic stop on a different date. When the passenger told the police officers that he had a ticket showing that he was not allowed to have his drivers license and that the ticket was in his backpack, they started drawing their guns. You can hear the driver on the phone with 911 telling dispatch that the police are pointing their guns at the car simply because he was reaching into his bag.

The video is being filmed by the drivers 14 year old son. Her 7 year old daughter is also in the backseat and can be heard crying at the end of the video.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/10/07/1334971/-Indiana-man-tasered-and-ripped-from-car-during-routine-traffic-stop

[oh the horror]

While I don't have enough info prior to make any judgement here I'm wondering are tasers/batons and guns the norms for how they deal with citizens or what?

[MadeFromDust]

Like always...


Terrorizing the public, one child at a time

[MadeFromDust]

While I don't have enough info prior to make any judgement here I'm wondering are tasers/batons and guns the norms for how they deal with citizens or what?
Sometimes they'll use their jackboots to stomp on ya head too

[SunsN07BookIt]

Idiot cops +_Idiot people = Bad outcome

[chosen_one6]

While I don't have enough info prior to make any judgement here I'm wondering are tasers/batons and guns the norms for how they deal with citizens or what?

The back story goes as follows:

The lady in the drivers seat was pulled over for not wearing her seatbelt. The lady and the passengers were on their way to the hospital to see the drivers dying mother and were in a hurry. During the traffic stop the police officers asked to see the passengers ID for reasons unknown. The passenger stated that he did not have an ID because it was confiscated due to driving without insurance in a prior traffic stop on a different date. When the passenger told the police officers that he had a ticket showing that he was not allowed to have his drivers license and that the ticket was in his backpack, they started drawing their guns. You can hear the driver on the phone with 911 telling dispatch that the police are pointing their guns at the car simply because he was reaching into his bag.

The video is being filmed by the drivers 14 year old son. Her 7 year old daughter is also in the backseat and can be heard crying at the end of the video.

[chosen_one6]

Idiot cops +_Idiot people = Bad outcome

Please explain to me how the driver and her boyfriend were being idiots.

It seems like you're the one thats being an idiot.

[MadeFromDust]

Please explain to me how the driver and her boyfriend were being idiots.

It seems like you're the one thats being an idiot.
This ^^

[SunsN07BookIt]

The back story goes as follows:

The lady in the drivers seat was pulled over for not wearing her seatbelt. During the traffic stop the police officers asked to see the passengers ID for reasons unknown. The passenger stated that he did not have an ID because it was confiscated due to driving without insurance in a prior traffic spot on a different date. When the passenger told the police officers that he had a ticket showing that he was not allowed to have his drivers license and that the ticket was in his backpack, they started drawing their guns. You can hear the driver on the phone with 911 telling dispatch that the police are pointing their guns at the car simply because he was reaching into his bag.

The video is being filmed by the drivers 14 year old son. Her 7 year old daughter is also in the backseat and can be heard crying at the end of the video.

The driver started driving erratically and made an aggressive pull to the shoulder in such a manner, that they put spike strips in front of the car before they even approached the vehicle. The passenger was also asked to exit the vehicle several times and he did not comply. According to the police chief Indiana law says that a driver and any passenger must exit a vehicle if requested to do so. I guess who's at fault relies on if that's true or not.

[MadeFromDust]

The driver started driving erratically and made an aggressive pull to the shoulder in such a manner, that they put spike strips in front of the car before they even approached the vehicle. The passenger was also asked to exit the vehicle several times and he did not comply. According to the police chief Indiana law says that a driver and any passenger must exit a vehicle if requested to do so. I guess who's at fault relies on if that's true or not.
Even if true, state law can't trump the Constitution. If he's not suspected of a crime or being placed under arrest, he does not have to exit the car. The cops had no right to break into the car like that and physically assault the guy.

[gts]

The driver started driving erratically and made an aggressive pull to the shoulder in such a manner, that they put spike strips in front of the car before they even approached the vehicle. The passenger was also asked to exit the vehicle several times and he did not comply. According to the police chief Indiana law says that a driver and any passenger must exit a vehicle if requested to do so. I guess who's at fault relies on if that's true or not.

On CNN they also reported this had been going on for 30 mins before they broke out the window and tased the guy...

[chosen_one6]

The driver started driving erratically and made an aggressive pull to the shoulder in such a manner, that they put spike strips in front of the car before they even approached the vehicle. The passenger was also asked to exit the vehicle several times and he did not comply. According to the police chief Indiana law says that a driver and any passenger must exit a vehicle if requested to do so. I guess who's at fault relies on if that's true or not.

The drivers behavior is understandable given the situation. I think anyone would drive that way if their mother was dying at the hospital and they wanted to be with them in their final moments of life.

As far as Indiana law is concerned, I'm not sure how they handle their traffic stops but it is to my understanding that a citizen can refuse to show their ID to a police officer if the police officer has no reasonable cause to see the ID and/or the person of interest is not going to be detained for a valid reason.

[SunsN07BookIt]

Please explain to me how the driver and her boyfriend were being idiots.

It seems like you're the one thats being an idiot.


First of all the driver, started driving aggressively when lit up. That's why they put spike strips in front of the vehicle. Driver = idiot.

Passenger is asked several times to exit vehicle, ignores police. Passenger = idiot.

You being unaware of the information out there so far on this story but running yer yap anyway. You = idiot

[chosen_one6]

First of all the driver, started driving aggressively when lit up. That's why they put spike strips in front of the vehicle. Driver = idiot.

Passenger is asked several times to exit vehicle, ignores police. Passenger = idiot.

You being unaware of the information out there so far on this story but running yer yap anyway. You = idiot

You being unaware of the constitution = idiot

Keep talking though, you're making yourself look stupid with every post.

[qrich]

On CNN they also reported this had been going on for 30 mins before they broke out the window and tased the guy...

B-B-B-ut the 3 minute one says full video!!

[chosen_one6]

First of all the driver, started driving aggressively when lit up. That's why they put spike strips in front of the vehicle. Driver = idiot.

Passenger is asked several times to exit vehicle, ignores police. Passenger = idiot.

You being unaware of the information out there so far on this story but running yer yap anyway. You = idiot

A federal lawsuit accuses Hammond police of "malice" and "reckless indifference" when they smashed a car window and used a Taser on a passenger during a traffic stop last month.

But Hammond police, in a two-page rebuttal, said they resorted to force only after the passenger repeatedly refused to leave the car and kept reaching toward the back seat, prompting fears he may have had a weapon.

Neither the police statement nor the lawsuit say a gun was found in the car.
Statement from the Hammond Police DepartmentRead the story

The incident happened around 3:30 p.m. on Sept. 24 when Lisa Mahone was pulled over as she drove with a friend, Jamal Jones, and her two children, 7 and 14, according to the lawsuit filed Monday in Indiana.

The officer told Mahone, 47, she was stopped for not wearing her seatbelt and asked for her driver's license. The officer also asked to see Jones' identification, according to both police and the lawsuit.

Mahone produced her license, but Jones told the officer he had been ticketed for not paying his insurance and did not have his license, the lawsuit states.

Jones claims the officer drew his gun "for no reason" after Jones retrieved the ticket from his backpack and "offered the ticket to the officer."

But police say Jones refused to hand over the ticket. "(Jones) refused to lower the window more than a small amount, then told the officer that 'he was not going to do (the officer’s) job' and for him to get a piece of paper," police said in their statement. "The first officer then called for back-up after asking (Jones) several more times to provide his name."
Graphic language: Watch the full video
Family cellphone video shows Hammond police officers breaking the car window and using a Taser on Jamal Jones during a traffic stop. (Video courtesy Kurtz Law Offices, Ltd.)

As the back-up officer arrived, "the first officer saw the passenger inside the vehicle drop his left hand behind the center console. . .Fearing for officer safety, the first officer ordered the passenger to show his hands and then repeatedly asked him to exit the vehicle," according to the statement.

The lawsuit says Jones refused to leave the car "because he feared the officers would harm him."

Around this time, Mahone shifted the car into gear and began moving until officers warned her that a "stop strip" had been placed in front of her car and

Mahone told the officers they were on the way to Stroger Hospital in Chicago to visit her sick mother. In a video recorded by Mahone's 14-year-old son, she can be heard calling the Hammond police department to explain the situation.

"Just give me a ticket for no seatbelt so I can go to the hospital because the doctor called me to tell me to come in because my mom is about to pass away," Mahone said as officers continued to ask Jones to get out of the car, according to the video.

One officer tells Jones if he does not step out of the car, they will "have to open the door for [him]." Jones nods and, after a few moments, one officer breaks the window with a club and uses a Taser on Jones, the video shows.
PDF: Full text of lawsuit against Hammond, Indiana, police officersRead the story

Officers pull Jones out of the car as Mahone's 7-year-old daughter can be heard in the backseat crying. The lawsuit says shards of glass hit the the girl and the boy in the back seat.

Police said the officers took the action "fearing the occupants of the vehicle may have possessed a weapon, and seeing the passenger repeatedly reach towards the rear seats of the vehicle."

According to the lawsuit and the police statement, Jones was arrested and issued citations for resisting law enforcement and refusal to aid an officer. Mahone was cited for not wearing her seatbelt and was allowed to leave.

The lawsuit accuses Hammond police of excessive force, battery and false arrest, saying the officers' actions "were taken intentionally with malice, willfulness, and reckless indifference to the rights and safety of plaintiffs."

But police, in their statement, said officers "who make legal traffic stops are allowed to ask passengers inside of a stopped vehicle for identification and to request that they exit a stopped vehicle for the officer’s safety without a requirement of reasonable suspicion.

"When the passenger displayed movements inside of the stopped vehicle that included placing his hand in places where the officer could not see, officers’ concerns for their safety were heightened," it added.

Hammond police said an officer also recorded the incident.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/breaking/chi-hammond-police-taser-story.html

Tell me what the passenger did wrong.

And tell me again how someone could drive recklessly and swerve to the shoulder when the tire strip is right in front of their f*cking car.

[qrich]

And tell me again how someone could drive recklessly and swerve to the shoulder when the tire strip is right in front of their f*cking car.


Yeah, you must be retarded.

[SunsN07BookIt]

You being unaware of the constitution = idiot

Keep talking though, you're making yourself look stupid with every post.


Ok, show me where in the Constitution it says an officer cannot direct you to exit the vehicle. You confusing the right to search your vehicle with them asking you to get out of your car. Here you go, this lawyer can explain it in a manner even you can understand:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41l9gDQ5AA4

He's in Oklahoma, the incident was in Indiana, but if what you are saying is protected by the Constitution, it would apply in all 50 states. Like I said, it all depends on Indiana law whether this guy had the right to refuse the cop's direction but it does not go against the Constitution, only against common sense. I guess the stupids on you this time....

[MadeFromDust]

Yeah, you must be retarded.
Yur an idiot

[SunsN07BookIt]

Yeah, you must be retarded.

:oldlol:

[gts]

Even if true, state law can't trump the Constitution. If he's not suspected of a crime or being placed under arrest, he does not have to exit the car. The cops had no right to break into the car like that and physically assault the guy.

In Indana the are saying the police have the legal right to ask for your ID, you must comply with their request, the police have the right to ask you to step out of your vehicle, you must comply. If you do not comply they have the legal right to detain/arrest you


same in Cali, NY is different it's a state thing not a constitutional one

[SunsN07BookIt]

Yur an idiot


C'mon MadeFromDust, even you have to admit it's kinda dumb for the poster to think a cop was running along side a moving vehicle trying to place a spike strip in front of it. At least that's what it sounds like he stated in his post even if it wasn't his intent. I side with you on most of your opinions I've read, but this isn't one of them.

[MadeFromDust]

The police have the legal right to ask for your ID, you must comply with their request, the police have the right to ask you to step out of your vehicle, you must comply. If you do not comply they have the legal right to detain/arrest you
That's buulshiite. All we need to do is crack the window down enough to show them ID on request. They can ask you to get out of your car but you don't have to...just like you don't have to exit your HOME just because they ask you to. AND they don't have the right to enter, much less vandalize, your vehicle without a search warrant...just like if you are in your home. That would be an unreasonable search and seizure, and a violation of our Constitutional RIGHT to be secure in our persons, houses, papers, and effects. :rolleyes:


Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

[MadeFromDust]

C'mon MadeFromDust, even you have to admit it's kinda dumb for the poster to think a cop was running along side a moving vehicle trying to place a spike strip in front of it. At least that's what it sounds like he stated in his post even if it wasn't his intent. I side with you on most of your opinions I've read, but this isn't one of them.
From what I'm gathering, they placed a spike strip in front of her car after she pulled over so as not to allow her to leave, not as the car was moving :oldlol:

It just doesn't seem right how the Supreme Court can make rulings that erode what is clearly stated in the Constitution. So damn annoying

[qrich]

Yur an idiot

Yes, I'm an idiot because I don't believe that spike strips being placed after the alleged reckless driving equates to the reckless driving being impossible.

[gts]

That's buulshiite. All we need to do is crack the window down enough to show them ID on request. They can ask you to get out of your car but you don't have to...just like you don't have to exit your HOME just because they ask you to. AND they don't have the right to enter, much less vandalize, your vehicle without a search warrant...just like if you are in your home. That would be an unreasonable search and seizure, and a violation of our Constitutional RIGHT to be secure in our persons, houses, papers, and effects. :rolleyes:

your confusing search and seizure laws with a cop asking for ID and for a person to step out of the car two different things

[MadeFromDust]

your confusing search and seizure laws with a cop asking for ID and for a person to step out of the car two different things
So you're telling me that just because a cop decides to come knock on my door at home for any old reason that is not an arrest or search, I have to 1) open the door; 2) exit my house; 3) get my ass kicked or killed by the terrorist thug with a badge? Dafuq??

[gts]

So you're telling me that just because a cop decides to come knock on my door at home for any old reason that is not an arrest or search, I have to 1) open the door; 2) exit my house; 3) get my ass kicked or killed by the terrorist thug with a badge? Dafuq??

now you're just talking nonsense... :lol

i'd venture to say if a cop is knocking on your door somebody told them to come knocking or they saw something out of place...

[longtime lurker]

So wait he told the cops that he didn't have If because his license was suspended and when he tried to produce proof they thought he was reaching for a weapon (of course he was he's black). So instead of having him show proof they smash the car window and take him. Sounds legit. The people defending the cops in this situation ain't shit. I'm not surprised though

[qrich]

So wait he told the cops that he didn't have If because his license was suspended and when he tried to produce proof they thought he was reaching for a weapon (of course he was he's black). So instead of having him show proof they smash the car window and take him. Sounds legit. The people defending the cops in this situation ain't shit. I'm not surprised though

:roll:

:roll:.

This guy is pure comedy

[longtime lurker]

now you're just talking nonsense... :lol

i'd venture to say if a cop is knocking on your door somebody told them to come knocking or they saw something out of place...
Or it could be the wrong house.... You feign ignorance like that doesn't happen

[NumberSix]

So you're telling me that just because a cop decides to come knock on my door at home for any old reason that is not an arrest or search, I have to 1) open the door; 2) exit my house; 3) get my ass kicked or killed by the terrorist thug with a badge? Dafuq??
This topic is not about people in their houses or on their property/residence. It's about people in vehicles on public streets.

[gts]

Or it could be the wrong house.... You feign ignorance like that doesn't happen

yes it does happen but you're reaching for that rare moment trying to connect dots that aren't there

[MadeFromDust]

So wait he told the cops that he didn't have If because his license was suspended and when he tried to produce proof they thought he was reaching for a weapon (of course he was he's black). So instead of having him show proof they smash the car window and take him. Sounds legit. The people defending the cops in this situation ain't shit. I'm not surprised though
This ^^

[MadeFromDust]

This topic is not about people in their houses or on their property/residence. It's about people in vehicles on public streets.
If I can shoot a thief breaking into my car just like I can shoot a thief breaking into my house, then yeah. It's the same shiite :rolleyes:

[NumberSix]

So wait he told the cops that he didn't have If because his license was suspended and when he tried to produce proof they thought he was reaching for a weapon (of course he was he's black). So instead of having him show proof they smash the car window and take him. Sounds legit. The people defending the cops in this situation ain't shit. I'm not surprised though
Did you see that take place in the video?

[qrich]

Did you see that take place in the video?

He didn't watch the video, he is a person that looks at zero facts and jumps on anything that he and the media can spin out to be racist.

[NumberSix]

If I can shoot a thief breaking into my car just like I can shoot a thief breaking into my house, then yeah. It's the same shiite :rolleyes:
This is not a matter of opinion. This is not a philosophical debate. It's not a matter of opinion whether a law exists or not. You can believe it's the "same shiite" all you want. The law is not a matter of your own personal opinion.

[NumberSix]

He didn't watch the video, he is a person that looks at zero facts and jumps on anything that he and the media can spin out to be racist.
Well, I don't know that they specifically weren't "racist", but I don't know of any information that would indicate that they were.

I can understand his position though. If the police did actually point a gun at them for no reason, I can completely understand not wanting to get out of the car. If you have a reasonable suspicion that these people (whether they're cops or not) intend to do you harm, you have every right in the world not to comply with them. The driver did call the police.

In my opinion, the people in the car handled it the right way. Assuming of course that the part of the police pointing guns at them for no reason is actually true.

[MadeFromDust]

This is not a matter of opinion. This is not a philosophical debate. It's not a matter of opinion whether a law exists or not. You can believe it's the "same shiite" all you want. The law is not a matter of your own personal opinion.
Oh yes it is, because this is a government OF the people, and FOR the people. They change laws all the time to "adjust" to us. It is not proper for cops to violate our clearly defined Constitutional right to be secure in our persons against unreasonable search and seizure. The cops should've just given that fight up once the guy declined to exit the car. The cops made him feel insecure in his person by drawing their murder sticks out when he tried to show them why he doesn't have an ID to give them. Thus, they violated his rights and the two will have a good probability of success in the lawsuit.

[SunsN07BookIt]

For those that didn't watch the lawyer video on page 2.

Pennsylvania_v._Mimms 1977
*States that the police ordering a driver out of the car DOES NOT violate his 4th amendment rights.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania_v._Mimms



MARYLAND, PETITIONER v. JERRY LEE WILSON 1997

In the last 2 paragraphs of Chief Justice Rehnquist's opinion on the ruling of the Supreme Court in this case:



We therefore hold that an officer making a traffic stop may order passengers to get out of the car pending completion of the stop. [n.3]

The judgment of the Court of Special Appeals of Maryland is reversed, and the case is remanded for proceedings not inconsistent with this opinion.

It is so ordered.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/95-1268.ZO.html

So if state law allows it, it doesn't go against the grain of the Constitution according to the Supreme Court.

*edit

[MadeFromDust]

For those that didn't watch the lawyer video on page 2.

Pennsylvania_v._Mimms 1977
*States that the police ordering a driver out of the car DOES NOT violate his 4th amendment rights.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania_v._Mimms



MARYLAND, PETITIONER v. JERRY LEE WILSON 1997

In the last 2 paragraphs of Chief Justice Rehnquist's opinion on the ruling of the Supreme Court in this case:



We therefore hold that an officer making a traffic stop may order passengers to get out of the car pending completion of the stop. [n.3]

The judgment of the Court of Special Appeals of Maryland is reversed, and the case is remanded for proceedings not inconsistent with this opinion.

It is so ordered.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/95-1268.ZO.html

So if state law allows it, it doesn't go against the grain of the Constitution according to the Supreme Court.

*edit

I watched it, but I just don't like it. No no no, not one damn bit! :oldlol:


:banghead:

[SunsN07BookIt]

Thus, they violated his rights and the two will have a good probability of success in the lawsuit.

If there are repercussions against the police department or officers involved, I'm not so sure it will revolve around those two. It might have a lot to do with them smashing in a window and shooting a taser into a car with children in it. That was obviously traumatic for the kids through no fault of their own.

[KNOW1EDGE]

"God bless these brave officers and thank them for their service to the community that day." :bowdown:

How f*cking stupid do you have to be to support these criminals? Holding people against their will, property destruction, assault, unlawful arrest, kidnapping, child endangerment...

[dude77]

seems odd they would be focusing on the passenger when it's the driver who was 'driving erratically' ? .. they should be asking her to get out to check if she's intoxicated I would think ..

I'm guessing Jamal was 'acting the fool' and giving the cops reason to turn their attention on him ? .. I think we should hold off on judging until we see everything that happened .. either way, I can see why he would be taking a shit about getting out considering how some of these thugs handle people sometimes but it might've been better to just gtfo of the car if only to spare everyone else in the car and those children from watching a scene unfold which is what ended up happening

[BrownEye007]

seems odd they would be focusing on the passenger when it's the driver who was 'driving erratically' ? .. they should be asking her to get out to check if she's intoxicated I would think ..

I'm guessing Jamal was 'acting the fool' and giving the cops reason to turn their attention on him ? .. I think we should hold off on judging until we see everything that happened .. either way, I can see why he would be taking a shit about getting out considering how some of these thugs handle people sometimes but it might've been better to just gtfo of the car if only to spare everyone else in the car and those children from watching a scene unfold which is what ended up happening
They turned their attention to him because they asked to see identification and he didn't have any. Could have read that yourself in the op but I guess you missed it.

[dude77]

They turned their attention to him because they asked to see identification and he didn't have any. Could have read that yourself in the op but I guess you missed it.

no I got that .. but why are they asking him for id ? is that standard procedure when you stop a car .. ask the driver and passenger for id ? .. don't recall seeing that before unless the passenger started doing something that drew their attention or somethig

[dude77]

no I got that .. but why are they asking him for id ? is that standard procedure when you stop a car .. ask the driver and passenger for id ? .. don't recall seeing that before unless the passenger started doing something that drew their attention or somethig




For those that didn't watch the lawyer video on page 2.

Pennsylvania_v._Mimms 1977
*States that the police ordering a driver out of the car DOES NOT violate his 4th amendment rights.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania_v._Mimms



MARYLAND, PETITIONER v. JERRY LEE WILSON 1997

In the last 2 paragraphs of Chief Justice Rehnquist's opinion on the ruling of the Supreme Court in this case:



We therefore hold that an officer making a traffic stop may order passengers to get out of the car pending completion of the stop. [n.3]

The judgment of the Court of Special Appeals of Maryland is reversed, and the case is remanded for proceedings not inconsistent with this opinion.

It is so ordered.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/95-1268.ZO.html

So if state law allows it, it doesn't go against the grain of the Constitution according to the Supreme Court.

*edit

ooh .. nevermind

[97 bulls]

This is insane. The cops were wrong. Ill never understand this logic. Why demand to see some identification, then when the person reaches for it, you draw your weapon.

Why not just write the seatbelt ticket and move on. Damn

I wouldn't have exited my car for that reason as well. The passenger has just as much a right to his life as the police.

[gts]

This is insane. The cops were wrong. Ill never understand this logic. Why demand to see some identification, then when the person reaches for it, you draw your weapon.

Why not just write the seatbelt ticket and move on. Damn

I wouldn't have exited my car for that reason as well. The passenger has just as much a right to his life as the police.

they had been asking for his ID and for him to step out of the car for 20 minutes. this didn't happen in the space of 2-3 minutes

[zoom17]

why do I always see the same posters ass kissing the cops all the time.

[97 bulls]

they had been asking for his ID and for him to step out of the car for 20 minutes. this didn't happen in the space of 2-3 minutes
But based on what was said in the video, when he reached in his bag to get the info, they drew their weapons. The passenger said they had his info, why did he have to get out of the car? They were harassing that man.

[97 bulls]

Some of you will find any reason to justify the behavior of police officers. Its just crazy. Like when the police officer shot that man in the hip for reaching for his id which was a request from the officer. And the idiots tried to justify that officers actions by saying the guy turned around too fast.

Its like I always say. Black life is just not that important. Do you think its a coincidence that the prevailing theme of these police brutality videos is whit cops and black person.

[iamgine]

The whole story makes sense to me.

1. Lady was pulled over for not wearing seatbelt.

2. Lady pulled over erratically causing police officer to suspect something.

3. Police asked for ID from both passengers due to them suspecting something.

4. Guy has no ID and tell some story as explanation which makes the cops even more suspicious.

5. Guy reach for something to prove that his story is true. Cops pulled gun because they were afraid he could be reaching for a gun.

6. Guy refuse to give his proof to the cops.

7. Cops plead for 20 minutes for him to get out of car.

8. Cops break window and tased him.

[SunsN07BookIt]

This is insane. The cops were wrong. Ill never understand this logic. Why demand to see some identification, then when the person reaches for it, you draw your weapon.

Why not just write the seatbelt ticket and move on. Damn

I wouldn't have exited my car for that reason as well. The passenger has just as much a right to his life as the police.

Is that what happened? Because I didn't notice that on the video. He may have reached into the bookbag when they were walking up to the vehicle after it pulled over very aggressively, if that was the case, every cop in the world is going to draw their weapon. They are not going to wait and see if you are pulling out a weapon or not. Only the people at that incident know what happened, it's 3 minutes of video of a half hour incident. You notice they didn't have their weapons drawn once they could evaluate the situation and found out there was children in the vehicle.

You notice, the guy in the car asks for "white shirts", the officer says we don't have those. He then asks for "somebody in charge" or a "somebody that's a sergeant", I can't really make it out. The cop then says "There's our lieutenant(higher ranked than a sergeant) right there", and the guy still is combative.

The cops could have just wrote a ticket, the guy also could have just stepped out of the car. There may be lots of reasons why neither party did that, but if you want to break things down into the simplest scenario, there it is.

99% of the time, if you argue or fight with a cop at a traffic stop you lose. Only idiots want to take those odds. It boils down to common sense.


why do I always see the same posters ass kissing the cops all the time.

I notice that most the people "ass kissing the cops" in this topic, still find fault with the police, while the people hating on the cops find no fault with the driver and passenger. Kinda shows which party has more of a balanced, level headed viewpoint eh?

In the overwhelming majority of incidents like these, it's dumb people making dumb mistakes going up against dumb cops making dumb mistakes. Then the public, politicians and/or courts get to weigh in who they think is more at fault. Usually, not always, if one party uses some common sense there never is a controversy. The only real party not at fault here, is the kids.

[russwest0]

So why didn't the guy or woman just speed up the process and get out of the car and let the cops do what they needed, and then go on with their day?

From the get go of the video the woman is speaking in a very unpleasant and bitchy tone to the officers, and the guy is being argumentative.

I don't agree with what the cops did, but let's not pretend that the people in the car probably weren't being a pain in the ass either.

[gts]

So why didn't the guy or woman just speed up the process and get out of the car and let the cops do what they needed, and then go on with their day?

From the get go of the video the woman is speaking in a very unpleasant and bitchy tone to the officers, and the guy is being argumentative.

I don't agree with what the cops did, but let's not pretend that the people in the car probably weren't being a pain in the ass either.

that's the problem.. both sides are clearly in the wrong here but the folks pulld over were wrong from the start... they could have made everyone's lives so much easier by just getting with the program by cooperating and off they go but instead they have to elevate the situation to something it's not, the cops lose patience and there we are...

[97 bulls]

So why didn't the guy or woman just speed up the process and get out of the car and let the cops do what they needed, and then go on with their day?
Because when they asked the passenger for his identification, when he reached for it, they drew their weapons. I wouldn't have exited the vehicle either.


From the get go of the video the woman is speaking in a very unpleasant and bitchy tone to the officers, and the guy is being argumentative.
Lol. People tend to be unpleasant when they're being fined for an infraction. And she said she was in a hurry to see about her dying mother. They couldve easily checked her info and then told her to buckle up and be safe.


I don't agree with what the cops did, but let's not pretend that the people in the car probably weren't being a pain in the ass either.
They probably were being jerks. But damn have a little humanity. The woman's mother was about to die. Wow you are insensitive.

[97 bulls]

Is that what happened? Because I didn't notice that on the video. He may have reached into the bookbag when they were walking up to the vehicle after it pulled over very aggressively, if that was the case, every cop in the world is going to draw their weapon.
Spare me. How are you gonna threaten someone thats doing what you ask. Theres no winning in that kind of situation. If youre that afraid then dont pull anyone over. Hell don't be a cop. Citizens have just as much a right to their life as Police officers do.


They are not going to wait and see if you are pulling out a weapon or not. Only the people at that incident know what happened, it's 3 minutes of video of a half hour incident. You notice they didn't have their weapons drawn once they could evaluate the situation and found out there was children in the vehicle.
Im only going by what was said in the video. But one thing I do agree with. If im in a hurry to see my mother for what may be the last time,.im not gonna waste precious minutes arguing with a racists cop over some identification.

[gts]

They probably were being jerks. But damn have a little humanity. The woman's mother was about to die. Wow you are insensitive.


Like every cop in the world hasn't heard a bucket load of BS stories in during their career...

Funny how they have no time to be issued a fine because they're in a hurry but plenty to sit inside their car being sticks in the mud... you think if they were in such a hurry you'd have heard the woman tell her significant other to get with the program so they can get moving, no instead they ask for more cops to come to the party and call 911...

[NumberSix]

Because when they asked the passenger for his identification, when he reached for it, they drew their weapons. I wouldn't have exited the vehicle either.
Assuming that is true....... I would have done exactly what the people in the car did. Stay in the car and call the police to explain the situation.

The police SHOULD have sent 2 other officers to deal with it and removed the police who had pointed their weapons at them from the situation.

[longtime lurker]

.
Spare me. How are you gonna threaten someone thats doing what you ask. Theres no winning in that kind of situation. If youre that afraid then dont pull anyone over. Hell don't be a cop. Citizens have just as much a right to their life as Police officers do.


Im only going by what was said in the video. But one thing I do agree with. If im in a hurry to see my mother for what may be the last time,.im not gonna waste precious minutes arguing with a racists cop over some identification.

:applause: if the guy was reaching for papers to explain why he doesn't have ID and the cops still pulled a gun on him after he explained to them then I don't blame him for not exiting the vehicle. And wtf are they doing pulling guns on the car when children are inside. ****ing idiots break the glass while kids are present.

[zoom17]

:applause: if the guy was reaching for papers to explain why he doesn't have ID and the cops still pulled a gun on him after he explained to them then I don't blame him for not exiting the vehicle. And wtf are they doing pulling guns on the car when children are inside. ****ing idiots break the glass while kids are present.

That would definitely stay with them that's for sure.

[Dictator]

It's always the same posters arguing against what obviously makes sense just for the sake of trolling. :lol

[qrich]

Im only going by what was said in the video. But one thing I do agree with. If im in a hurry to see my mother for what may be the last time,.im not gonna waste precious minutes arguing with a racists cop over some identification.

And this is why there is zero point in responding to you. It's like trying to talk to Nick Young about anything including Jews. But I'll play the game with you, the only one here who has race issues.


Spare me. How are you gonna threaten someone thats doing what you ask. Theres no winning in that kind of situation. If youre that afraid then dont pull anyone over. Hell don't be a cop. Citizens have just as much a right to their life as Police officers do.


Because when they asked the passenger for his identification, when he reached for it, they drew their weapons. I wouldn't have exited the vehicle either.

Did he tell the officers he was grabbing his identification from a backpack int he backseat, or did he reach? And if he was grabbing his ID, what was the reason for multiple reaches into the back? Should the first time not have been enough to retrieve the backpack, as a whole?


Lol. People tend to be unpleasant when they're being fined for an infraction. And she said she was in a hurry to see about her dying mother. They couldve easily checked her info and then told her to buckle up and be safe.

So the cop is supposed to buy every sob story being told?

And if she was in such a hurry, why argue? Why not just cooperate, get the bottom of it instead of being a jackass?


Im only going by what was said in the video. But one thing I do agree with. If im in a hurry to see my mother for what may be the last time,.im not gonna waste precious minutes arguing with a racists cop over some identification.

Of course you are going by a 3 minute video of a 30 minute incident. Full situations do not exist to you, at all.

But yes, she was in such a hurry that they wasted 30 precious minutes arguing, for what should have been a 5-10 minute stop.


They probably were being jerks. But damn have a little humanity. The woman's mother was about to die. Wow you are insensitive.

My mom's dying, but let me argue with you for half an hour instead.


Cops should not have broken the window, if only due to the children, but the dumbass should have complied with the simple request. I've had an officer pull his gun out when I've opened my glove compartment during a routine stop, I didn't proceed to act like a little bitch.

[97 bulls]

And this is why there is zero point in responding to you. It's like trying to talk to Nick Young about anything including Jews. But I'll play the game with you, the only one here who has race issues.
Hey. I call it like I see it.






Did he tell the officers he was grabbing his identification from a backpack int he backseat, or did he reach? And if he was grabbing his ID, what was the reason for multiple reaches into the back? Should the first time not have been enough to retrieve the backpack, as a whole?
Lol. This is preposterous. So the men and woman that are paid through our tax dollars to protect our cities are so scary that I must prepare them for every movement in a routine traffic stop?

And your so big on following the law to a tee. Is it illegal to look in the back of his car? Especially when his children are back there?







So the cop is supposed to buy every sob story being told?
Yes. Until proven otherwise. Does he have any reason to suspect its not true?


And if she was in such a hurry, why argue? Why not just cooperate, get the bottom of it instead of being a jackass?
I agree. I stated the same thing in my last post.




Of course you are going by a 3 minute video of a 30 minute incident. Full situations do not exist to you, at all.
Those people weren't lying about the police drawing their guns.


But yes, she was in such a hurry that they wasted 30 precious minutes arguing, for what should have been a 5-10 minute stop.




My mom's dying, but let me argue with you for half an hour instead.


Cops should not have broken the window, if only due to the children, but the dumbass should have complied with the simple request. I've had an officer pull his gun out when I've opened my glove compartment during a routine stop, I didn't proceed to act like a little bitch.
Again I agree. But again. Reaching into YOUR glove compartment does not warrant the police putting a gun on you. Especially if he asks for something you normally keep there.

[MadeFromDust]

.
Spare me. How are you gonna threaten someone thats doing what you ask. Theres no winning in that kind of situation. If youre that afraid then dont pull anyone over. Hell don't be a cop. Citizens have just as much a right to their life as Police officers do.


Im only going by what was said in the video. But one thing I do agree with. If im in a hurry to see my mother for what may be the last time,.im not gonna waste precious minutes arguing with a racists cop over some identification.
That ^^

[MadeFromDust]

And this is why there is zero point in responding to you. It's like trying to talk to Nick Young about anything including Jews. But I'll play the game with you, the only one here who has race issues.





Did he tell the officers he was grabbing his identification from a backpack int he backseat, or did he reach? And if he was grabbing his ID, what was the reason for multiple reaches into the back? Should the first time not have been enough to retrieve the backpack, as a whole?



So the cop is supposed to buy every sob story being told?

And if she was in such a hurry, why argue? Why not just cooperate, get the bottom of it instead of being a jackass?



Of course you are going by a 3 minute video of a 30 minute incident. Full situations do not exist to you, at all.

But yes, she was in such a hurry that they wasted 30 precious minutes arguing, for what should have been a 5-10 minute stop.



My mom's dying, but let me argue with you for half an hour instead.


Cops should not have broken the window, if only due to the children, but the dumbass should have complied with the simple request. I've had an officer pull his gun out when I've opened my glove compartment during a routine stop, I didn't proceed to act like a little bitch.
WTF where are you getting this 30 minutes buulshat from? The video recorded the whole incident :rolleyes:

[chazzy]

It's always the same posters arguing against what obviously makes sense just for the sake of trolling. :lol
Waiting on Raymone

[qrich]

Hey. I call it like I see it.

Right, like saying Adkins was the one being aggressive, but poor little Trayvon was target practice.

Or like saying these cops are racist without an iota backing that idiotic claim up.


Lol. This is preposterous. So the men and woman that are paid through our tax dollars to protect our cities are so scary that I must prepare them for every movement in a routine traffic stop? t

Considering what they see on a normal basis, they will be weary about any "routine" traffic stop. Just yesterday morning, a DPS Officer in Phoenix was murdered during a routine stop.


And your so big on following the law to a tee. Is it illegal to look in the back of his car? Especially when his children are back there?

Looking into the backseat is entirely different than reaching. How can it be compared?


Yes. Until proven otherwise. Does he have any reason to suspect its not true?

Does he have any reason to believe it is? Everyone comes up with some type of story to try to get out of a ticket, and I've heard them all from friends, family, and local officers I converse with on a consistent basis. One guy even said he was speeding due to a similar situation, but claimed his kid got hit by a car. When the officer offered to escort him to the hospital he said his kid was being transported too (this was a black driver by the way), dude changes his story and said he had no kids.


I agree. I stated the same thing in my last post.

So why not put blame on them as well, as opposed to claiming these cops were racist?


Those people weren't lying about the police drawing their guns.

And it has never been denied by any party, so them telling the truth on that means....?

Did they mention, during 10% of this incident, that the susp refused to cooperate and was being an asshole, even after a Lt. came onto the scene? Did they mention how erratic the driver was driving, leading to the strips being planted? Or did they tell one side of the story?


Again I agree. But again. Reaching into YOUR glove compartment does not warrant the police putting a gun on you. Especially if he asks for something you normally keep there.

No, it does not, and I was quite pissed about it. But I didn't act like an asshole about it and refuse to comply with anything, sans him wanting to search my trunk without any exigent circumstances, which he didn't end up doing. Got my "warning" and was gone within 15 minutes.

I mean, unless the cop was Turkish and hated Armenians, I can't see race being a factor there. Just like race isn't an iota of a factor here.

If you want to play the race card, play it in cases that it would be justified. Such as the Christopher McCowen case. Or the black adopted son that got pepper sprayed as he was thought to be an intruder, most likely due to being the only non white person in the house.

[qrich]

WTF where are you getting this 30 minutes buulshat from? The video recorded the whole incident :rolleyes:

In that case, these pieces of shit need to be arrested for filing a police report, as nowhere in that whole recorded incident did I see the officers fully drawing their firearms.

[dude77]

the shattering of the window seems a bit extreme maybe ? .. it looks like they just got fed up and said 'fk this' .. is that really the proper response with the car full of people and children ? .. you could argue that he could be 'setting them up' to grab a gun and fire at them so they had to end the 'stand off' .. but I don't know .. maybe they could've done it differently ..

the driver and passenger could've handled it differently as well .. they're probably spooked from these other 'stops gone wrong' that have been going around on the news ..

ultimately though, it's just your best bet to be polite and do wtf they say(as long as it's not fkng with your rights and all that of course) .. some cops are going to be dks no matter what even if you're polite(it's happened to me) but usually it goes 'ok' when I've cooperated .. and why would you get all combative and act like that if you are black, knowing what you know ? .. I don't know .. I'm not in their head

[NumberSix]

There's really nothing to argue about here. None of us have the full context. We only saw the end of the incident.

[Theoo]

fk** corrupt police

[SunsN07BookIt]

Yes. Until proven otherwise.


This is laugh out loud absurd. That cops should believe every word out of the mouths of the people they stop unless they can PROVE it's not true. :rolleyes:

[tmacattack33]

I watched the video and glanced at some of the replies in this thread.

The cops were wrong. I'm not sure what people are arguing about...probably just some trolls who are kinda bored. I guess that's why i've made about 5 posts in the past two months total.

Peace

[christian1923]

Can anyone give me a good reason for the cops to smash a window and taze a guy sitting down? :coleman: To The people saying we only saw 3 minutes of the half hour scene, does that matter? What else is there to see? They assaulted a guy sitting down

[SunsN07BookIt]

Can anyone give me a good reason for the cops to smash a window and taze a guy sitting down? :coleman: To The people saying we only saw 3 minutes of the half hour scene, does that matter? What else is there to see? They assaulted a guy sitting down

The cops shouldn't have smashed the window with the kids in the vehicle, no one is disagreeing with that. But how long do you think cops are supposed to sit there and ask him politely to get out of the vehicle? The guy asks for a superior, and the cop says his lieutenant is right there, but instead of wanting to speak with him or her, he changes the subject and starts complaining again.

[97 bulls]

This is laugh out loud absurd. That cops should believe every word out of the mouths of the people they stop unless they can PROVE it's not true. :rolleyes:
To quote Ronald Reagan....."trust, but verify".

[97 bulls]

The cops shouldn't have smashed the window with the kids in the vehicle, no one is disagreeing with that. But how long do you think cops are supposed to sit there and ask him politely to get out of the vehicle? The guy asks for a superior, and the cop says his lieutenant is right there, but instead of wanting to speak with him or her, he changes the subject and starts complaining again.
Again, the police aggravated the situation when they drew their. weapons on him. Why did they pull their firearm out? Because.he reached for the notice in his bag that the police asked for.

So now lets say after the guns have been drawn (and then put away), he complies and exits the vehicle. Any move the officer or officers deem suspicious may cost this man his life. And correct me if im wrong, but "my bads" dont get people their lives back. The passenger could've stepped on a twig and the officer may hear it and mistakenly think the guy is cocking a gun and then he pulls out a gun and blows his head off.

Like I said, if your that damn scary find another way to make a living.

[97 bulls]

Another thing Sunsbookit.....

While I agree that if the people in the car are so much in a hurry just comply and move on, I also believe that if you fear for your life, all other things take a back burner to safety. Lets go through whats been stated.

The officer performs a routine traffic stop for no seat belt.

He notices the passenger looking in the back seat (why thats suspicious is beyong me but whatever).

He askes the passeger for identification. The passenger says HIS DRIVERS LICENSE WAS TAKEN FROM HIM IN ANOTHER TRAFFIC STOP AND ONLY HAS THE PAPER STATING SUCH IN HIS POSSESSION TO SHOW WHO HE IS. He then goes to retrieve the paper from from his bag and that's when the cops pull their guns out, thus creating the standoff. Having a weapon pulled is what created this situation. Had they not done that, the ordeal takes perhaps 10 minutes.


Why do I say such? For two reasons.
1. You hear the lady saying, pleading with the officer to write her the citation so she can go. Even telling the officer "you already have my info".

2. The man had just recently been pulled over and theres no record of him producing the same kind of reaction. And he gave the police the info he had.


What you're expecting fron the citizens in this situation is highly unreasonable.

[SunsN07BookIt]

Another thing Sunsbookit.....

While I agree that if the people in the car are so much in a hurry just comply and move on, I also believe that if you fear for your life, all other things take a back burner to safety. Lets go through whats been stated.

The officer performs a routine traffic stop for no seat belt.

He notices the passenger looking in the back seat (why thats suspicious is beyong me but whatever).

He askes the passeger for identification. The passenger says HIS DRIVERS LICENSE WAS TAKEN FROM HIM IN ANOTHER TRAFFIC STOP AND ONLY HAS THE PAPER STATING SUCH IN HIS POSSESSION TO SHOW WHO HE IS. He then goes to retrieve the paper from from his bag and that's when the cops pull their guns out, thus creating the standoff. Having a weapon pulled is what created this situation. Had they not done that, the ordeal takes perhaps 10 minutes.


Why do I say such? For two reasons.
1. You hear the lady saying, pleading with the officer to write her the citation so she can go. Even telling the officer "you already have my info".

2. The man had just recently been pulled over and theres no record of him producing the same kind of reaction. And he gave the police the info he had.


What you're expecting fron the citizens in this situation is highly unreasonable.

This has all been covered, and there are too many unknowns, mainly why the cops drew their guns and why the guy really refused to get out of the car. Was it fear or him just being an asshole? What we do know, is that there is no right to refuse a direction by cops to exit the vehicle in Indiana. He was coming out the easier way, or the hard way.

He refused to come out the easy way, let's leave it at that...

[97 bulls]

This has all been covered, and there are too many unknowns, mainly why the cops drew their guns and why the guy really refused to get out of the car. Was it fear or him just being an asshole? What we do know, is that there is no right to refuse a direction by cops to exit the vehicle in Indiana. He was coming out the easier way, or the hard way.

He refused to come out the easy way, let's leave it at that...
Lol. You can't be serious. The police dont have carte blanche to do whatever they want. Theres rules that they must abide by as well.

You keep stating that its lawful for the police to demand passenger exit the vehicle if told to do so. Well its NOT illegal for a father to look in the back seat of a car especially if his children are back there. But you refuse to acknowledge that.

Either way, the bottom line is once again you got the police overreacting to a situation. And treating another black man as an animal. And people like you feebly attempting to justify the actions of them.

[qrich]

Lol. You can't be serious. The police dont have carte blanche to do whatever they want. Theres rules that they must abide by as well.

You keep stating that its lawful for the police to demand passenger exit the vehicle if told to do so. Well its NOT illegal for a father to look in the back seat of a car especially if his children are back there. But you refuse to acknowledge that.

Either way, the bottom line is once again you got the police overreacting to a situation. And treating another black man as an animal. And people like you feebly attempting to justify the actions of them.

And if they ask you to exit your vehicle, you have to comply, as has already been posted.

Again with the looking and not being told he was reaching to the backseat numerous times.

Again, you bring in race in a situation that has nothing to do with race.

[NugzFan]

The cops shouldn't have smashed the window with the kids in the vehicle, no one is disagreeing with that. But how long do you think cops are supposed to sit there and ask him politely to get out of the vehicle? The guy asks for a superior, and the cop says his lieutenant is right there, but instead of wanting to speak with him or her, he changes the subject and starts complaining again.

i agree. if they had listened to the cops none of this would have happened.

seems like this is the case a lot of the time. people dont listen, and then get upset when the cops take action.

[MadeFromDust]

i agree. if they had listened to the cops none of this would have happened.

seems like this is the case a lot of the time. people dont listen, and then get upset when the cops take action.
A free people SHOULD resist a police state that has lost respect for our Constitutional rights and humanity in general, and meet it with the intensity said rights are being violated. I wouldn't expect anything less of my fellow Americans. That passenger had a right to be secure in his person and be left alone.

If he was the driver? I would say he needed to cooperate since he would've been the one suspected of a crime although victimless as it is (seatbelt /smh).

Once the driver told the officers the story, they should have been offered an escort to the hospital. There should be no threat to issue a ticket or useless escalation of the situation by harrassing the passenger with kids in the back seat. He was NOT a threat to their *safety*. It was the other way around.

I like what someone else said already...If you're so damn scared of people that you have to jump up with weapon drawn just because someone follows your order to present ID, then you shouldn't be a cop. :facepalm

[97 bulls]

i agree. if they had listened to the cops none of this would have happened.

seems like this is the case a lot of the time. people dont listen, and then get upset when the cops take action.
They did listen to the cops. She provided her info, the cop got suspicious of the passenger because he kept looking in the back seat or reaching for something, asked for his identification, and when he reached for it, then drew their weapon on him. And thats when they demanded that he exit the vehicle. He said he wasn't because he was afraid for his life.

You don't understand that concept?

[97 bulls]

A free people SHOULD resist a police state that has lost respect for our Constitutional rights and humanity in general, and meet it with the intensity said rights are being violated. I wouldn't expect anything less of my fellow Americans. That passenger had a right to be secure in his person and be left alone.

If he was the driver? I would say he needed to cooperate since he would've been the one suspected of a crime although victimless as it is (seatbelt /smh).

Once the driver told the officers the story, they should have been offered an escort to the hospital. There should be no threat to issue a ticket or useless escalation of the situation by harrassing the passenger with kids in the back seat. He was NOT a threat to their *safety*. It was the other way around.

I like what someone else said already...If you're so damn scared of people that you have to jump up with weapon drawn just because someone follows your order to present ID, then you shouldn't be a cop. :facepalm
And this is what I mean by trust but verify. Check out the story and if its a lie arrest the woman for obstruction of justice. If she was found to be lying, a simple traffic ticket that costs a couple hundred bucks turns into a couple thousand. On top of the original offense of not wearing a seatbelt.

[SunsN07BookIt]

Hmmmm, it looks like the guy had an arrest warrant out on him for failure to appear on a drug charge in 2007. No wonder he was reluctant to get out.



http://posttrib.suntimes.com/30353022-537/laporte-issues-warrant-for-hammond-man-in-controversial-video.html#.VDksUprn-SQ

[NugzFan]

Hmmmm, it looks like the guy had an arrest warrant out on him for failure to appear on a drug charge in 2007. No wonder he was reluctant to get out.



http://posttrib.suntimes.com/30353022-537/laporte-issues-warrant-for-hammond-man-in-controversial-video.html#.VDksUprn-SQ

surprise, surprise.

[Jameerthefear]

Hmmmm, it looks like the guy had an arrest warrant out on him for failure to appear on a drug charge in 2007. No wonder he was reluctant to get out.



http://posttrib.suntimes.com/30353022-537/laporte-issues-warrant-for-hammond-man-in-controversial-video.html#.VDksUprn-SQ
You are such a f*cking bootlicker. You disgust me.