Thunder fans would you reverse the Harden trade now if you had the chance

[KDthunderup]

Seeing what you have seen and if you had the ability, would you go back in time and reverse the result the Thunder got from the Harden trade.

Be honest.

[NugzFan]

Of course they would

But they'll deny it.

[KDthunderup]

Of course they would

But they'll deny it.
But in that universe it would most likely mean Thunder don't keep Ibaka and don't have Adams.

[Buffalobraves]

I'd reverse it if we could keep the core of Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka, and Harden together. If we had to move one of them I'm glad it was Harden and we got a pretty good haul back for him (Adams will be very solid and Lamb has been okay).

[O_City_Thunder]

James Harden was a perfect fit for the Thunder, but cap space would have been very limited with Ibaka's contract on the books.

[MiseryCityTexas]

I would reverse the Jeff Green trade also. I liked the Thunder a lot better when they had Durant, Westbrook, Green, Harden, Thabo, and even Nened Krystic.

[KDthunderup]

I would reverse the Jeff Green trade also. I liked the Thunder a lot better when they had Durant, Westbrook, Green, Harden, and even Nened Krystic.
I think it was necessary for the evolution of the Thunder at the time

[Fudge]

Obvs not. Lamb looked great today, while also getting a future Top 5 Center in the draft in Adams? No thanks. I was okay with it back when it happened, and i'm GREATLY satisfied with it now.

[NugzFan]

Obvs not. Lamb looked great today, while also getting a future Top 5 Center in the draft in Adams? No thanks. I was okay with it back when it happened, and i'm GREATLY satisfied with it now.

:oldlol:

[YouGotServed]

Well, seeing as everything the Thunder got in return so far has been garbage, the answer should be pretty clear.

I don't think anyone expected Harden to be this good.

[NugzFan]

Well, seeing as everything the Thunder got in return so far has been garbage, the answer should be pretty clear.

I don't think anyone expected Harden to be this good.

Garbage? Haven't you seen how amazing Adams is??

[Fudge]

:oldlol:
https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/440322452409692163/B6OpC4gH_400x400.jpeg

You madd brah?

[Jameerthefear]

Adams is trash. So I expect yes.

[fpliii]

I think they made the right choice if it was between Ibaka and Harden.

[Milbuck]

Considering Adams is already a better player than Harden, OKC already won the trade there. Factor in whatever else they got in the trade and it's not even remotely close.

[YouGotServed]

Garbage? Haven't you seen how amazing Adams is??

Not impressed. Poor mans Mad Dog Masen.

Harden is the best SG in the league, an all star and a future HOFer. How is this even a question?

[NugzFan]

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/440322452409692163/B6OpC4gH_400x400.jpeg

You madd brah?


Nope. That's why I'm laughing.

[Fudge]

Considering Adams is already a better player than Harden
Exactly. People still don't get this.

Getting Lamb and a 1 year rental of Kevin Martin was just icing on the cake.

[NugzFan]

Considering Adams is already a better player than Harden, OKC already won the trade there. Factor in whatever else they got in the trade and it's not even remotely close.

What the...

[NugzFan]

Not impressed. Poor mans Mad Dog Masen.

Harden is the best SG in the league, an all star and a future HOFer. How is this even a question?

I know. I was being sarcastic.

Dunno if harden is a future hof'er tho.

[YouGotServed]

I know. I was being sarcastic.

Dunno if harden is a future hof'er tho.

HOFer or not, still a lot better than anything those hillbilly clowns got in return.

[Fudge]

Oh dey salty doe

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/440322452409692163/B6OpC4gH_400x400.jpeg

[juju151111]

No I don't think James would of changed much. Come playoffs time he is always horrible.

[Cocaine80s]

OKC wouldve won by now if Harden was still 6th man

[SCdac]

How long was Harden willing to play 6th man though? Clearly dude wanted to be the main guy (or he wouldn't have left for the max Houston can give). Say OKC moved him into the starting lineup, would him RW and KD all work? Imo, trading him or losing him was a foregone conclusion once OKC didn't necessarily get 100% verbal commitment from him or he hesitated alot on his accepting an offer. In saying that, trading him may have been best for the chemistry of the team

[SOD 21]

OKC wouldve won by now if Harden was still 6th man

How so?

Oklahoma City wasn't winning in 2013 with Russell Westbrook being out for the duration of the playoffs and they weren't winning without a healthy Ibaka against San Antonio. Those injuries had as much or more to do with Oklahoma City failing to win a championship then the James Harden trade itself over the last two seasons.

History will look back on this trade a lot differently than it does today.

[Cocaine80s]

How so?

Oklahoma City wasn't winning in 2013 with Russell Westbrook being out for the duration of the playoffs and they weren't winning without a healthy Ibaka against San Antonio. Those injuries had as much or more to do with Oklahoma City failing to win a championship then the James Harden trade itself over the last two seasons.

History will look back on this trade a lot differently than it does today.
Ibaka only missed 2 games in the 2014 spurs series. Not to mention James Harden always torches the Spurs

[SOD 21]

Ibaka only missed 2 games in the 2014 spurs series. Not to mention James Harden always torches the Spurs

Do you really believe it didn't hurt Oklahoma City that he missed the first two games of the series and was obviously limited for the entire series? Yes, he was out there playing for the final four games but he was clearly not fully healthy.

[Cocaine80s]

Do you really believe it didn't hurt Oklahoma City that he missed the first two games of the series and was obviously limited for the entire series? Yes, he was out there playing for the final four games but he was clearly not fully healthy.
this is why I said they shouldve kept James Harden :facepalm

do you not see my point?

[KDthunderup]

this is why I said they shouldve kept James Harden :facepalm

do you not see my point?
And who the **** is down there defending the paint? Perkins :oldlol: I don't care how good the back 3 is, the Thunder wouldn't be going anywhere with the weakest front court in the league.

Ibaka is the Thunder's defense. Check the stats compared to when he is in and out.

[Cocaine80s]

And who the **** is down there defending the paint? Perkins :oldlol: I don't care how good the back 3 is, the Thunder wouldn't be going anywhere with the weakest front court in the league.

Ibaka is the Thunder's defense. Check the stats compared to when he is in and out.
Ibaka

[KDthunderup]

Ibaka
You realise it was a decision between Ibaka and Harden? No other team in the league has 3 max players plus a player earning around 12mill as well, simply because it isnt possible.

[j3lademaster]

And who the **** is down there defending the paint? Perkins :oldlol: I don't care how good the back 3 is, the Thunder wouldn't be going anywhere with the weakest front court in the league.

Ibaka is the Thunder's defense. Check the stats compared to when he is in and out.Perkins would have been amnestied to keep Harden. He'd probably be playing in china right now against comp more his speed.

edit: I'm seeing how keeping Harden would have helped OKC now. It would keep Brooks from playing Perkins for excessive minutes.

[NugzFan]

I think thunder fans are using the Ibaka versus Harden argument to cover up the fact that they got an awful return for Harden in the first place

I get wanting to keep ibaka over harden however you should've gotten a lot more for Harden in return

[KDthunderup]

I think thunder fans are using the Ibaka versus Harden argument to cover up the fact that they got an awful return for Harden in the first place

I get wanting to keep ibaka over harden however you should've gotten a lot more for Harden in return
Are we talking about the same Harden that didn't even have enough value at the time to land a rookie Bradley Beal?

[J Shuttlesworth]

Wait I thought that the Thunder could have kept Ibaka and Harden, but the owner cheaped out on the luxury tax?

[KDthunderup]

Wait I thought that the Thunder could have kept Ibaka and Harden, but the owner cheaped out on the luxury tax?
They were already going over the luxury tax by offering him an extension anyway, Harden demanded max and that would of put the Thunder well over which was something they couldnt afford. The franchise would of be crippled and probably would of hurt the chances of retaining KD and Westbrook when their contracts were up.

[NugzFan]

Are we talking about the same Harden that didn't even have enough value at the time to land a rookie Bradley Beal?

Yup. Pretty sure top 10 players can net you much more than what you got

[KDthunderup]

Yup. Pretty sure top 10 players can net you much more than what you got
So please tell me why they couldn't even land Bradely Beal or Klay Thompson when he was offered to these teams????

[YouGotServed]

This thread still going? :yaohappy: Take the L on this one. Harden is a top 10 player and what did OKC get for him? Madsen 2.0? Lamb?

On the other hand, Morey essentially traded Lowry for Harden. Genius.

[KDthunderup]

This thread still going? :yaohappy: Take the L on this one. Harden is a top 10 player and what did OKC get for him? Madsen 2.0? Lamb?

On the other hand, Morey essentially traded Lowry for Harden. Genius.
u mad rockets are gonna lose in the 1st round again?

[YouGotServed]

u mad rockets are gonna lose in the 1st round again?

Cool argument, will read again.

[Fudge]

u mad rockets are gonna lose in the 1st round again?
They won't even make the playoffs doe

http://www.picgifs.com/reaction-gifs/reaction-gifs/laughing/picgifs-laughing-35443.gif

[russwest0]

LOL @ retards still acting like Martin, Lamb, Adams, McGary, + tons more in cap space and an increased value for guys like Ibaka and Reggie Jackson was a bad deal.

It's almost like Harden didn't completely shit the bed in the finals, whine about his role, instantly demand a max deal, and then go to Houston and chuck them out of two first round playoff series'.

The love this man gets in the debates over trading him is absurd.

Keep Harden and who the hell is OKC starting at center once Perkins is gone? Reggie Jackson is a guaranteed walk. There's no cap room to sign Morrow, so OKC continues to have a 3pt shooting problem. Ibaka becomes much harder to keep. The list goes on and on.

[J Shuttlesworth]

LOL @ retards still acting like Martin, Lamb, Adams, McGary, + tons more in cap space and an increased value for guys like Ibaka and Reggie Jackson was a bad deal.

It's almost like Harden didn't completely shit the bed in the finals, whine about his role, instantly demand a max deal, and then go to Houston and chuck them out of two first round playoff series'.

The love this man gets in the debates over trading him is absurd.
Whether or not Harden choked in the finals, was that not the most successful season in Thunder history?

[russwest0]

Whether or not Harden choked in the finals, was that not the most successful season in Thunder history?

The follow up year OKC looked much better as a team, the Westbrook playoff injury just screwed everything up. This year OKC looks better than ever as long as Durant comes back 100%.

[NugzFan]

So please tell me why they couldn't even land Bradely Beal or Klay Thompson when he was offered to these teams????

Because those teams said no.

[NugzFan]

LOL @ retards still acting like Martin, Lamb, Adams, McGary, + tons more in cap space and an increased value for guys like Ibaka and Reggie Jackson was a bad deal.

You're right. It wasn't bad.

It was terrible. Just a bunch of role players that you can get anywhere. You can't get a harden anywhere

Hell, if you were ok with that deal you would have been content with any deal. And that's always a bad sign.

[KDthunderup]

Whether or not Harden choked in the finals, was that not the most successful season in Thunder history?
Just because the 2012 Thunder made the finals doesn't mean they've been better then the past two Thunder teams. Spurs 2013/2014 were a much better team then the 2011/2012 Spurs the Thunder faced in the WCF back then.

[KDthunderup]

Because those teams said no.
So it goes to show that his value at the time wasn't as high as you thought.

How are the Nuggets going these days? Haven't been paying attention since they've been irrelevant for a while.

[russwest0]

You're right. It wasn't bad.

It was terrible. Just a bunch of role players that you can get anywhere. You can't get a harden anywhere

Hell, if you were ok with that deal you would have been content with any deal. And that's always a bad sign.

Jesus christ, you cherry picked the phuck out of my post and ignored my other main points.

No, you can't just find guys like Steven Adams anywhere. He played extremely well in the playoffs for a 20 year old big man who is raw as phuck. Mitch McGary looks like a damn good Collison replacement. Lamb mostly sucks but he's a guy who you can go to and maybe have success if no one else is doing shit. Martin was a great one year rental.

Plus think of all of the cap space and the potential to actually keep Reggie Jackson and sign someone like Morrow now.

A team of Russ/Harden/KD/Ibaka with nothing but an assload of minimum contract scrubs doesn't look anywhere near as good as Russ/Morrow/KD/Ibaka/Adams with Reggie/Lamb/McGary + whoever else they choose to get with their free cap space.

Harden has been an arguable detriment to his team in his last three playoff series but because he shoots an assload of shots and gets to the line a bunch in the regular season while standing around on defense, everyone thinks he's some amazing asset worthy of a max deal as a SIXTH MAN.

News Flash: He isn't.

[RoseCity07]

Man OKC fans really overrating Steve Adams. I like Lamb too but you can't make up for Harden's offensive punch off the bench. It made OKC a great team.

[russwest0]

Man OKC fans really overrating Steve Adams. I like Lamb too but you can't make up for Harden's offensive punch off the bench. It made OKC a great team.

Even if OKC fans are overrating Adams (even though he just had a great postseason in a year where he was supposed to be stashed in the D-League to develop because he was just that raw), you have to understand that it's also addition by subtraction. The addition of Adams means the subtraction of Perkins which is HUGE for this squad.

[NugzFan]

So it goes to show that his value at the time wasn't as high as you thought.

How are the Nuggets going these days? Haven't been paying attention since they've been irrelevant for a while.

Keep trying to change the subject. Just keeps proving I'm right.

Not being able to trade for beal or Thompson doesn't mean they had to accept garbage in return for a top 10 player.

[NugzFan]

Man OKC fans really overrating Steve Adams. I like Lamb too but you can't make up for Harden's offensive punch off the bench. It made OKC a great team.

Yup.

Adams is nice but he's not saving that trade.

[KDthunderup]

Keep trying to change the subject. Just keeps proving I'm right.

Not being able to trade for beal or Thompson doesn't mean they had to accept garbage in return for a top 10 player.
Hit a bit of a salt wound on that question?

Harden wasn't close to being a top 10 player at the time he was traded, seriously his value wasnt that high as evidenced by the fact they couldn't even land a rookie Beal or a sophomore Thompson with him. Nothing more on the matter needs to be said besides the fact that any deal they were going to get was never going to be as good as most people thought they should of gotten.

[oarabbus]

Obviously RIGHT NOW they'd take Harden back, since KD is hurt.

In a few months when KD is back on his feet, are you ****ing kidding they are not going to miss that no-defense playing lazy ballhog. They already have a good-defense playing crackhead-motor ballhog. And Steven Adams is going to be really good if he isn't already.

[KDthunderup]

Obviously RIGHT NOW they'd take Harden back, since KD is hurt. Dumb topic IMO.

In a few months when KD is back on his feet, are you ****ing kidding they are not going to miss that no-defense playing lazy ballhog. They already have a good-defense playing crackhead-motor ballhog. And Steven Adams is going to be really good if he isn't already.
Why the **** would you think I was only talking about the next 2 months? I was obviously talking about the Thunder's whole future in general.

[russwest0]

Lol @ people ignoring Reggie Jackson averaging 13/4/4 last year while playing good defense off the bench.

Harden was absolutely not worth the max for this squad when he only plays one end of the floor, would have completely strapped OKC's money, and would have made guys like Reggie Jackson extremely less effective and cause OKC to miss out on getting any sort of depth.

Harden is a clown who screams "me first!" and I was happy about that trade the instant I saw the news. Houston fans can enjoy their first round exits year after year.

[KDthunderup]

Lol @ people ignoring Reggie Jackson averaging 13/4/4 last year while playing good defense off the bench.

Harden was absolutely not worth the max for this squad when he only plays one end of the floor, would have completely strapped OKC's money, and would have made guys like Reggie Jackson extremely less effective and cause OKC to miss out on any sort of depth.

Harden is a clown who screams "me first!" and I was happy about that trade the instant I saw the news. Houston fans can enjoy their first round exits year after year.
Exactly. You don't give a guy a max contract and cripple yourself financially when the absolute best there gonna give you is 18/5/5 off the bench.

[YouGotServed]

Still trying to save face. :oldlol: Haven't reached the finals since Harden left.

lol

[KDthunderup]

Still trying to save face. :oldlol: Haven't reached the finals since Harden left.

lol
More a result of circumstance then anything.

[oarabbus]

More a result of circumstance then anything.


Well, to play Devil's Advocate, Barkley, Malone, Stockton, Ewing, etc being ringless was "more a result of circumstance than anything".

But they're still ringless doe.

[russwest0]

Well, to play Devil's Advocate, Barkley, Malone, Stockton, Ewing, etc being ringless was "more a result of circumstance than anything".

But they're still ringless doe.

Yeah, and their careers have already played out and they aren't just 25/26 years old.

[oarabbus]

Yeah, and their careers have already played out and they aren't just 25/26 years old.


Fair enough, I really hope KD comes back 100% real fast and shows where he belongs amongst the all time greats. I don't think OKC will be missing Harden once Durant is back for the record.

[NugzFan]

Hit a bit of a salt wound on that question?

Not at all. Like I said, it only helped me.


Harden wasn't close to being a top 10 player at the time he was traded, seriously his value wasnt that high as evidenced by the fact they couldn't even land a rookie Beal or a sophomore Thompson with him. Nothing more on the matter needs to be said besides the fact that any deal they were going to get was never going to be as good as most people thought they should of gotten.

You keep brining up Thompson/ beal as if that's how all trades are judged. Not getting them doesn't mean accepting crap is fair.

[JT123]

Of course they would. :lol Let's be real, Harden is the ONLY reason they beat the Spurs in 2012. Everyone wants to talk about him playing bad in the Finals, but in the previous 3 rounds he was the clutchest player by far. Any Thunder fan saying they wouldn't have liked to have had him on the team in 2013 when Westbrook went down is a liar. If they still had Harden in the 2013 playoffs they at least get back to the Finals.

[YouGotServed]

Of course they would. :lol Let's be real, Harden is the ONLY reason they beat the Spurs in 2012. Everyone wants to talk about him playing bad in the Finals, but in the previous 3 rounds he was the clutchest player by far. Any Thunder fan saying they wouldn't have liked to have had him on the team in 2013 when Westbrook went down is a liar. If they still had Harden in the 2013 playoffs they at least get back to the Finals.

Dat rat poison.

Good post, repped.

[Demitri98]

No.

[Real14]

I was saying this for the last 2 seasons that Harden really made that team unstoppable. As soon as he left, the thunder never went back to the finals, and I still don't see them making the finals in 2015. Unless Reggie Jackson really steps in up this year, the thunder would have to look at another all star caliber player.

[Joyner82reload]

Seeing as Harden is a cancer...

The Thunder made the 2012 Finals because Harden had yet to develop into what he is now. And that is an ISO, ball-hogging, no defense playing, low b-ball iq having, me first-team second SG. He was well into the transitional phase, and he would have probably rounded full circle into the role in 2014. The Rockets expedited the process by giving him the keys to the offense, and as a result they will never have any playoff success whatsoever. Hell the Rockets already have 2 max players and aren't even thinking about contending this upcoming season, they're worried about trying to get Durant in 2 seasons :lol

The fact of the matter is that you can EASILY win a title with Jeremy Lamb as your SG and Steven Adams as your C. It's virtually impossible to win a title with James Harden as your 2nd or 3rd option. The fact that they came so close is a tribute to the excellence that is Kevin Durant.

[Kblaze8855]

No, you can't just find guys like Steven Adams anywhere. He played extremely well in the playoffs for a 20 year old big man who is raw as phuck. Mitch McGary looks like a damn good Collison replacement. Lamb mostly sucks but he's a guy who you can go to and maybe have success if no one else is doing shit. Martin was a great one year rental.

Not one of those players is worth a conversation.

A mention....a passing mention.

James Harden if he stays healthy might go to the HOF. And hes barely 25....

He was right that we are talking straight up dime a dozen role players.

Now...such players can have more value than their standalone talent to the right team....but lets not act like any of them are special.

Being a pesky 4/4 off the bench center doesnt mean you are special. It means you are a role player. And not much of one either.

He might one day be...something.

Its not impossible.

As of now he was 100% right to call it a bunch of role players you can get anywhere.

Nobody is out searching high and low for any of these dudes.

[Kblaze8855]

The fact of the matter is that you can EASILY win a title with Jeremy Lamb as your SG and Steven Adams as your C. It's virtually impossible to win a title with James Harden as your 2nd or 3rd option. The fact that they came so close is a tribute to the excellence that is Kevin Durant.

Nothing virtually impossible comes that close to happening on the first attempt.

[BigMacAttack]

Harden is a scrub in the playoffs and plays no D. He wanted max deal so I doubt he would be happy with a 6th man role, not enough ball for Westbrook, Harden and Durant for Harden to be as good offensively as he is now on the rockets(dude couldnt get out the first round with Dwight anyway) plus you probably lose Ibaka.

All in all with Adams developing nicely I think the trade is looking good for the Thunder, was risky though.

[Fudge]

Harden is a scrub in the playoffs and plays no D. He wanted max deal so I doubt he would be happy with a 6th man role, not enough ball for Westbrook, Harden and Durant for Harden to be as good offensively as he is now on the rockets(dude couldnt get out the first round with Dwight anyway) plus you probably lose Ibaka.

All in all with Adams developing nicely I think the trade is looking good for the Thunder, was risky though.
:applause:

Yup, well said.

Rocket finna stay mediocre as long he's their franchise player.

[SugarHill]

Nothing virtually impossible comes that close to happening on the first attempt.
:roll:

[KyleKong]

James Harden was a perfect fit for the Thunder, but cap space would have been very limited with Ibaka's contract on the books.

Perfect fit yes, but look at the player Harden is now. I think he knew he could reach the level he is at, he probably would have been gone regardless.

[pnyozzzoo]

LOL at houston fans defending Harden. I remembered the debate back then was Harden or Westbrook. Now its not even a question no more. Next year it will be Lamb or Harden because Adam will be more valuable than a chucker like him. :roll:

[juju151111]

Not one of those players is worth a conversation.

A mention....a passing mention.

James Harden if he stays healthy might go to the HOF. And hes barely 25....

He was right that we are talking straight up dime a dozen role players.

Now...such players can have more value than their standalone talent to the right team....but lets not act like any of them are special.

Being a pesky 4/4 off the bench center doesnt mean you are special. It means you are a role player. And not much of one either.

He might one day be...something.

Its not impossible.

As of now he was 100% right to call it a bunch of role players you can get anywhere.

Nobody is out searching high and low for any of these dudes.
James harden is horrible in the Postseason and let's revisit this thread at a later date. OkC normally drafts good so let's see how Lamb/Adams do this year.

[KDthunderup]

Not at all. Like I said, it only helped me.



You keep brining up Thompson/ beal as if that's how all trades are judged. Not getting them doesn't mean accepting crap is fair.
So tell me why couldn't they get those players if you thought Harden's value was so high at the time?

[UK2K]

Garbage? Haven't you seen how amazing Adams is??
Yes. Garbage.

[imdaman99]

Harden would have never blossomed into a top 10 player playing on OKC as the 3rd option. He almost needed his own team, I thought his 2013 season was better than this past year, when he had to share the limelight with Dwight. That being said, he would be a godsend as a 2nd option to Westbrook or Durant when the other guy was injured (Westbrook 2013 playoffs, and Durant now).