No Progression in Extension Talks Between Kawhi and Spurs

[T_L_P]

As Kawhi Leonard holds firm on his desire for a maximum contract, extension talks with the San Antonio Spurs have failed to gather traction despite a looming Friday deadline, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

Leonard, the 2014 NBA Finals Most Valuable Player, would become a restricted free agent in July without an extension agreement by midnight Oct. 31 – the deadline for eligible extensions for the NBA's draft class of 2011.

Spurs president and general manager R.C. Buford and agent Brian Elfus have had several discussions in recent weeks, but no progress has been made, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

Leonard, 23, is considered one of the NBA's rising young stars, and multiple league executives told Yahoo Sports he'll command a max offer sheet on the market next summer. The Spurs would assuredly match a sheet and retain Leonard, but there remains the risk of Leonard signing a similar offer sheet to Dallas Mavericks forward Chandler Parsons.

Parsons signed a three-year, $46 million offer sheet that included a player option on the third year. This way, Leonard could become an unrestricted free agent and potentially leave the Spurs in 2017.

San Antonio could sign Leonard to a five-year, $90 million-plus extension now, if the Spurs were willing to make him their designated player. San Antonio could also negotiate a four-year deal at the maximum contract level – or below – before the Friday deadline. As a restricted free agent next summer, the Spurs could also sign Leonard to a five-year extension at or below the maximum contract level.

Leonard has missed the preseason with an eye infection and is unlikely to be in the lineup on Tuesday for the Spurs opening night game against Dallas.

Leonard averaged 12.8 points, 6.2 rebounds, two assists and 1.7 steals a game in 29 minutes in the 2013-14 season. He averaged 14.3 points in the playoffs on the Spurs' way to the NBA title and a Finals MVP performance.

Leonard was the second-youngest NBA Finals MVP in history, only behind Magic Johnson.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/sources--no-progress-in-extension-talks-between-kawhi-leonard--spurs-050509203.html

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Should the Spurs hold out till next season? Should they sign him now even with his potentially damaging injuries? Is he even a max player?

[Real Men Wear Green]

The article says he's restricted next season, right? So the worst case scenario is that he signs an offer sheet which they have the right to match. That's not that bad. IF he won't agree to a deal they like the ball is still in their court.

[Fowl]

Kawhi would be stupid not to stay on the Spurs. No, he is not worth a max contract. He is a very good player but the system hes in makes him better because they cover his weaknesses perfectly.

If Kawhi were to be signed by a team by let's say the Suns, or the 76ers he wouldn't be worth near the max deal at all. What would those teams be stuck with? A slightly better Iman Shumpert.

[Mure]

Lol at all these average to slightly above average NBA players wanting max deals. :facepalm :facepalm

[Real Men Wear Green]

Kawhi would be stupid not to stay on the Spurs. No, he is not worth a max contract. He is a very good player but the system hes in makes him better because they cover his weaknesses perfectly.

If Kawhi were to be signed by a team by let's say the Suns, or the 76ers he wouldn't be worth near the max deal at all. What would those teams be stuck with? A slightly better Iman Shumpert.
1: Leonard is a lot better than Iman Shumpert.

2: There is nothing stupid about signing a contract for the max. I am not sure whether or not a team would offer him the max but if someone is willing to then there's a lot more of an argument to be made that he would be stupid for not signing the max.

[choppermagic]

Kawhi would be stupid not to stay on the Spurs. No, he is not worth a max contract. He is a very good player but the system hes in makes him better because they cover his weaknesses perfectly.

If Kawhi were to be signed by a team by let's say the Suns, or the 76ers he wouldn't be worth near the max deal at all. What would those teams be stuck with? A slightly better Iman Shumpert.

agree. and i'll add that they'd be stuck with an Iman Shumpert with a chip on his shoulder and jacking up shots to try and justify his max deal. Even worse.

[Smoke117]

He's crazy and the Spurs would be crazy to give him a max extension. Everyone is talking all this nonsense that he's going to be a star player (he never is), so lets see if this comes to fruition. There is no reason for them to feel pressured into giving him an extension at this point though. It would be amusing if he started to try and show he's a max player and screw up the Spurs rhythm.


Leonard averaged 12.8 points, 6.2 rebounds, two assists and 1.7 steals a game in 29 minutes in the 2013-14 season. He averaged 14.3 points in the playoffs on the Spurs' way to the NBA title and a Finals MVP performance.


I dunno how he thinks he is a max player for doing that last season. The Finals MVP is obviously going to his head.

[T_L_P]

Kawhi's a really good kid, but I could legitimately see him throwing a hissy fit this season if he doesn't get paid (ala Parsons).

I want to see him play one more season until we give him the max. Sure, in this current climate where Parsons and Klay can get max deals, Kawhi deserves one too. But until I see him become the clear number 2 on offense, I'm a bit hesitant. I don't trust his knees either. And, when we inevitably go into rebuilding mode post Duncan/Manu/Parker/Pop, I would not want a non-franchise player making max money (the worst thing any rebuilding team can do imo).

I don't know enough about the new cap to speak on this accurately though. 18M in a few years could be 2005's 13M, which is basically what Manu and Tony made.

[dubeta]

That's the problem when the entire world hypes up a role player as 'outplaying LeBron', it boosts his self confidence to unattainable levels, and the player thinks he's better than he really is.


This overrating of Kawhi probably makes him think he's more than a role player

[Fowl]

1: Leonard is a lot better than Iman Shumpert.

2: There is nothing stupid about signing a contract for the max. I am not sure whether or not a team would offer him the max but if someone is willing to then there's a lot more of an argument to be made that he would be stupid for not signing the max.
You'd be surprised how similar they are. Kawhi does have length on his side, but Iman is a better playmaker and he is more atheltic than Kawhi.

They both have very similar defensive stats even with Kawhi being longer than Iman. Iman can guard 1-3. I'm not sure if Kawhi is as good at keeping up with 1s as Iman.

On the Spurs, Kawhi isn't the guy putting the ball on the floor and making something happen. The system gets him the ball where he wants it and his job is to make something with what hes given.

Iman Shumpert on the Knicks is often times relied on to play the Point Guard position especially when playing PGs like Damian Lilliard and Russell Westbrook.

And let's not forget Iman is a year younger.

Kawhi was very fortunate to be drafted and developed by the Spurs, and if he doesn't show any loyalty to what they have done to him and his career then he is dumb.

If it weren't for the Spurs he wouldn't be in position to be demanding a Max Deal, he would most likely be making less than what the Spurs are offering now.

[HurricaneKid]

You guys are delirious.

Kawhi is absolutely worth the max and SAS should have given it to him.

We are talking about a 4 yr max of ~62M right?

Kawhi not only won the FMVP but he led the team is WS during the regular season and was the best player on the Spurs all year. The Spurs utilize their bench unlike any team in the league and LOL at counting that against him. He was the best player on the best team last year. And he was close to that previous year. We are talking about a 22 year old who works hard as hell and would easily be the best player on a great many teams.

The risk isn't him signing a 4 yr max deal somewhere else. Its that he signs a 2 yr deal with a player option on the third year (like Parsons did). Then when the tax line goes from 76M to 110M+ (the league min salary will be ~20M higher than the salary cap now) he will be 24, an UFA and out on the open market where he will be getting a 4/90+ deal. And thats if his usage doesn't increase, his play doesn't improve, etc.

Times are a changing. Players will be making ~50% more than they were last year in the coming years. Those of you that say he doesn't deserve it are basically saying that Tiago Splitter, who signed a 9M/ deal after his dreadful Finals last year is a similar calibur player. Its a dumb position and you need to catch up on just how much the league is changing.

You are all just too slow to react to the rapidly changing financial structure of the league. Both GSW and SAS would be fools to not sign their respective young stars to 4 yr max deals. Now if one or both are holding out for a 5 yr supermax, well that I would get. But I haven't heard anything from either camp about that.

[Orlando Magic]

You guys are delirious.

Kawhi is absolutely worth the max and SAS should have given it to him.

No, no he's not. STFU.

The only reason that he might be "worth" that as of right now... for this year... is because of the looming potential for the capsize to explode next year.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

If Gordon Hayward is worth the max then so is Kawhi.

[rmt]

You guys are delirious.

Kawhi is absolutely worth the max and SAS should have given it to him.

We are talking about a 4 yr max of ~62M right?

Kawhi not only won the FMVP but he led the team is WS during the regular season and was the best player on the Spurs all year. The Spurs utilize their bench unlike any team in the league and LOL at counting that against him. He was the best player on the best team last year. And he was close to that previous year. We are talking about a 22 year old who works hard as hell and would easily be the best player on a great many teams.

The risk isn't him signing a 4 yr max deal somewhere else. Its that he signs a 2 yr deal with a player option on the third year (like Parsons did). Then when the tax line goes from 76M to 110M+ (the league min salary will be ~20M higher than the salary cap now) he will be 24, an UFA and out on the open market where he will be getting a 4/90+ deal. And thats if his usage doesn't increase, his play doesn't improve, etc.

Times are a changing. Players will be making ~50% more than they were last year in the coming years. Those of you that say he doesn't deserve it are basically saying that Tiago Splitter, who signed a 9M/ deal after his dreadful Finals last year is a similar calibur player. Its a dumb position and you need to catch up on just how much the league is changing.

You are all just too slow to react to the rapidly changing financial structure of the league. Both GSW and SAS would be fools to not sign their respective young stars to 4 yr max deals. Now if one or both are holding out for a 5 yr supermax, well that I would get. But I haven't heard anything from either camp about that.

Leonard was not the best player on the Spurs last year - nor was he close to the best player the year before. And unless you haven't been paying attention, he doesn't come off the bench - he's a starter.

2013-14 regular season
Parker 16.7 pts / 5.7 asst
Duncan 15.1 pts / 9.7 rebs / 3 asst
Leonard 12.8 pts / 6.2 rebs / 2 asst

2012-13 regular season
Parker 20.3 pts / 7.6 asst
Duncan 17.8 pts / 9.9 rebs / 2.7 asst / 2.7 blks
Leonard 11.9 pts / 6 rebs / 1.6 asst / 1.7 stl

I do agree with the danger regarding him getting offered a short contract. Spurs need to lock him up for as long as possible, but I see their dilemma as he has not proven that he can carry a team during the regular season. They are very careful with their money, and a max contract is a lot to pay for someone who hasn't proven anything outside of the NBA Finals.

The way I see it - Spurs don't have a choice - they have no way to get a comparable player and he's done everything they've asked of him. It's not his fault that Pop plays him less than 30 minutes a game and hasn't integrated him more into the offense so that he can prove himself. I only hope there's enough left over to re-up Green.

[hiphopfan777]

He is better than durant. He has a ring and finals mvp something durant never had.

[Cocaine80s]

How you not gonna give your finals mvp a max? :facepalm

[ImKobe]

The team is making the smart move by waiting it out...


How you not gonna give your finals mvp a max? :facepalm

Because a smart GM does not pay the players off one Playoff series, when he can wait it out and see how much other teams offer. This is not the Lakers FO, where players basically get max contracts while rehabbing from career-ending injuries.

[ihatetimthomas]

That's the problem when the entire world hypes up a role player as 'outplaying LeBron', it boosts his self confidence to unattainable levels, and the player thinks he's better than he really is.


This overrating of Kawhi probably makes him think he's more than a role player

So in your mind, he should accept himself as a role player and be willing to accept a lot less money beause of the "hype?" Glad you are not his agent.

Its the agent and Leonard's camp who is going for that max money. They won a title and he got the MVP,he is also one of the young up and comers in the league. His stock is at all time high, why would he not try to get max? It would be absolutely ridiculous to not start at max in negotiation.

[r0drig0lac]

You guys are delirious.

Kawhi is absolutely worth the max and SAS should have given it to him.

We are talking about a 4 yr max of ~62M right?

Kawhi not only won the FMVP but he led the team is WS during the regular season and was the best player on the Spurs all year. The Spurs utilize their bench unlike any team in the league and LOL at counting that against him. He was the best player on the best team last year. And he was close to that previous year. We are talking about a 22 year old who works hard as hell and would easily be the best player on a great many teams.

The risk isn't him signing a 4 yr max deal somewhere else. Its that he signs a 2 yr deal with a player option on the third year (like Parsons did). Then when the tax line goes from 76M to 110M+ (the league min salary will be ~20M higher than the salary cap now) he will be 24, an UFA and out on the open market where he will be getting a 4/90+ deal. And thats if his usage doesn't increase, his play doesn't improve, etc.

Times are a changing. Players will be making ~50% more than they were last year in the coming years. Those of you that say he doesn't deserve it are basically saying that Tiago Splitter, who signed a 9M/ deal after his dreadful Finals last year is a similar calibur player. Its a dumb position and you need to catch up on just how much the league is changing.

You are all just too slow to react to the rapidly changing financial structure of the league. Both GSW and SAS would be fools to not sign their respective young stars to 4 yr max deals. Now if one or both are holding out for a 5 yr supermax, well that I would get. But I haven't heard anything from either camp about that.
this, the guy turned the team from a contender for best team in the league by far, of course he deserves the max, and the Spurs will pay at the right time,
Hayward and Parsons are not nearly as good and are being paid, of course he will get paid

[Nash]

so, two things.

-Leonard should ask for the max
-Spurs should not give it to him, they'll probably trade him before next year and get something back that does as well as Leonard did without asking for the max.

[finchyyy]

Give him the 5 year max now, can't risk losing him like the Mavericks lost Parsons.. And he's improved every year, I can definitely see him averaging something like 21/8/3 with elite D in he's prime.

[thefatmiral]

Someone will pay him what he wants. He has a elite defense and would be highly desirable

[Nash]

I don't think the Spurs wants to start rebuilding with a max Kawhi when Duncan retires.

Kawhi for MKG and Vonleh

Who says no?

Hornets get that wing they want to pair with Lance, Kemba and Jefferson to compete in the east.

MKG can go to the Spurs and basically fill the Kawhi role. Play some good defense, great motor and won't ask for max.

Vonleh is for the future beyond Duncan at the 4. He's young and has talent. He'll become whatever Pop, Duncan and the rest of those guys do of him. Surely a better plan than having absolutely nothing the day Duncan retires.

Some good rejuvenation for the Spurs.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

He would get exposed badly outside of Pops system

[Burgz V2]

He's crazy and the Spurs would be crazy to give him a max extension. Everyone is talking all this nonsense that he's going to be a star player (he never is), so lets see if this comes to fruition. There is no reason for them to feel pressured into giving him an extension at this point though. It would be amusing if he started to try and show he's a max player and screw up the Spurs rhythm.




I dunno how he thinks he is a max player for doing that last season. The Finals MVP is obviously going to his head.

why cite the stats of Spurs' players? do you even watch them play?

1) They spread the wealth on offense which limits his scoring numbers, but also, his rebounding numbers are exceptional for a wing that plays the majority of his minutes with Duncan/Splitter/Diaw

2) Most Spurs' starters are benched in the 4th because they are DAMN GOOD as a team. Can't fault him for getting "mediocre" numbers

[Real Men Wear Green]

You'd be surprised how similar they are. Kawhi does have length on his side, but Iman is a better playmaker and he is more atheltic than Kawhi.

They both have very similar defensive stats even with Kawhi being longer than Iman. Iman can guard 1-3. I'm not sure if Kawhi is as good at keeping up with 1s as Iman.

On the Spurs, Kawhi isn't the guy putting the ball on the floor and making something happen. The system gets him the ball where he wants it and his job is to make something with what hes given.

Iman Shumpert on the Knicks is often times relied on to play the Point Guard position especially when playing PGs like Damian Lilliard and Russell Westbrook.

And let's not forget Iman is a year younger.

Kawhi was very fortunate to be drafted and developed by the Spurs, and if he doesn't show any loyalty to what they have done to him and his career then he is dumb.

If it weren't for the Spurs he wouldn't be in position to be demanding a Max Deal, he would most likely be making less than what the Spurs are offering now.
The only advantage Shumpert has is that he can guard pgs better. Shumpert shot 38% from the field last year, and that's just a bad statistic. Leonard was over 50%. Leonard's 12.8 ppg isn't impressive but Shumpert was at 6.7. They may have similar roles for their teams but Leonard is doing a lot better job of fulfilling that role.

As for Leonard being lucky to be a Spur and being able to develop his game in a great organization? Sure, that's true. But why is he any more beholden to his team for good coaching than the next man? He only has 10-15 years (barring major injury) to make this NBA money. So make it.

[livingby3's]

I'm all for Leonard asking for a max.

That said, the deals for Parsons n Hayward really fked up the league, salary wise. Very good players nowadays are all demanding max, especially swingmen. But most if not none of them are game changers on the level of James Durant Paul or Westbrook. Bledsoe, Klay, and now Leonard all aiming max.

Leonard has a case coming off his rep as a fmvp. But as I see it he's not a first option max guy on a team, it could work on the Spurs but most probably not on any other teams. He's better off as a second option on a contender.

[houston]

dude getting overrated as hell

[IGOTGAME]

id give it to him. dont really see the issue. he is a top 20 player in the league with tons of upside

[Tking714]

History shows you don't let skilled 6'8" players walk. Pay them, especially in their primes

[Rito3d30]

just pay the young man
I mean ****ing Hayward and Parsons get close to max dollar, why should he take less when he has so much upside

[dunksby]

He got his ring and FMVP, time to get paid, if it was any other team people would have called the FO cheap. Shouldn't he be on par at least with Parsons?

[Dro]

so, two things.

-Leonard should ask for the max
-Spurs should not give it to him, they'll probably trade him before next year and get something back that does as well as Leonard did without asking for the max.
This...I'm not mad at him for wanting the max, but I wouldn't give it to him unless I have too...Like many other nba players, thats just the market nowadays, players who aren't worth max money are getting max contracts. He's a good player, hell a very good player but the max?:biggums:

I'd wait to see him beasting on another squad other than SA to give him the max...He does play for the best organization in the NBA basically..That has something to do with his success...

[I<3NBA]

he's not worth a max contract now, but he will be in the future. He's the future of the Spurs. Tim, Manu, and Tony are all aging.

[HurricaneKid]

Leonard was not the best player on the Spurs last year - nor was he close to the best player the year before. And unless you haven't been paying attention, he doesn't come off the bench - he's a starter.

2013-14 regular season
Parker 16.7 pts / 5.7 asst
Duncan 15.1 pts / 9.7 rebs / 3 asst
Leonard 12.8 pts / 6.2 rebs / 2 asst

2012-13 regular season
Parker 20.3 pts / 7.6 asst
Duncan 17.8 pts / 9.9 rebs / 2.7 asst / 2.7 blks
Leonard 11.9 pts / 6 rebs / 1.6 asst / 1.7 stl

I do agree with the danger regarding him getting offered a short contract. Spurs need to lock him up for as long as possible, but I see their dilemma as he has not proven that he can carry a team during the regular season. They are very careful with their money, and a max contract is a lot to pay for someone who hasn't proven anything outside of the NBA Finals.

The way I see it - Spurs don't have a choice - they have no way to get a comparable player and he's done everything they've asked of him. It's not his fault that Pop plays him less than 30 minutes a game and hasn't integrated him more into the offense so that he can prove himself. I only hope there's enough left over to re-up Green.

Where did I even imply he didn't start? Of course he starts.

And quoting naked box score stats is so 1990s.

The Spurs without Kawhi aren't as good as OKC, LAC, and quite possibly Dal, GSW, Memphis. Pop knows this and awakening him before G3 is what swung the Finals last year.

[HurricaneKid]

Judging by the responses so far its like people have no clue how different the play of SAS is from the rest of the league and they have no idea how they are successful. Perhaps one day I'll write out an essay on it.

[Blue&Orange]

it's not him that is asking it's his agent, thats why players hire agents.

thats how negotiations are done. you ask for everything and get what u can.

[Haymaker]

As much as I like our finals MVP, he's not a max contract. But neither Parsons and Klay are, and they got paid. So Spurs should pay him max since they won't land a significant FA anytime soon and they won't find another Duncan in the draft.

[HurricaneKid]

In 4 years when the Spurs could have him under contract for ~17M with a cap of 90M and a tax line of ~110M I am going to laugh about the existence of this thread.