Are Today's Defenders of Corner 3-Point Shooters Allowed to Camp In Paint?

[3ball]

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GIF's of Shooters At 3-Point Line Being Guarded By Defenders Camping in Paint:


The old 3 seconds rule allowed players to camp in the paint so much, that players could camp in the paint while their man was behind the 3-point line - on every possession, there were paint-campers guarding players who were behind the 3-point line, or at least far outside the paint.

I can post literally thousands of clips like the ones below... The ones listed below are from a single, run-of-the-mill Jordan highlight video: MICHAEL JORDAN ULTIMATE LEVEL - YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7Huo88x-Fk)



BJ Armstrong in far-corner being guarded by paint-campers (this one's actually from a different vid):

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/cc9f5bd27abe1cedf21d5f3133957e62.gif



Pippen in far-corner, guarded by paint-campers:

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/b64923de29630157895f9c3f9dc2e1bd.gif



Pippen in near-corner, guarded by paint camper:

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/pippen-is-at-near-corner-3poin-545a2a6bc32f2.gif



Paxson is near the top of key, guarded by habitual paint-camper, Price:

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/Paxson-guarded-by-paintcamper-545a381e32380.gif



Craig Hodges in near-corner AND Sellers near-sideline, both guarded by paint campers:

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/near-corner-3pt-shooter-guarde-545a2b06491c5.gif



Pippen at top of key AND Paxson far sideline being guarded by paint-campers:

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/Paxson-on-far-sideline-being-b-545a2f9c3dd98.gif



Paxson on far sideline is being guarded by paint-camper:

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/paxson-far-sideline-being-guar-545a3071c7d91.gif



Pippen (top of key) and Armstrong (far sideline) being guarded by paint-campers:

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/ff254945c516053cd729b4e7438b4688.gif

[SugarHill]

I won't believe you until you post 100 more of these since you have them and it would make your point much more potent.

[3ball]

I won't believe you until you post 100 more of these since you have them and it would make your point much more potent.
you make a good point... and this is easily done...

and i will do it, but i'll wait until someone can post just TWO plays from today's game matching the above.

i like posting clips so i will post more anyway, even if no one can find any equivalent highlights..

but the funny thing is that ANYONE can go to youtube and look up old footage and very easily see for themselves "oh yeah, that's true."

better than denial.

[3ball]

I won't believe you until you post 100 more of these since you have them and it would make your point much more potent.
you mean like i posted over 100 gifs of jordan's chest-to-chest posters?

guys were STILL arguing that lebron finished better at the rim... :roll:

:facepalm

i'm going to post them though... just because i know i'm right and all these shallow fans of today's game are wrong.

[ThatCoolKid]

Wade in the Finals. Spurs completely sagged off of him.

[Nikola_]

2014>>>1991

[oarabbus]

you mean like i posted over 100 gifs of jordan's chest-to-chest posters?

guys were STILL arguing that lebron finished better at the rim... :roll:

:facepalm

i'm going to post them though... just because i know i'm right and all these shallow fans of today's game are wrong.


Why do you even watch basketball today? Clearly it's weaker at every position, the defense sucks, the best player today isn't very good, etc.

[3ball]

.
Jordan Dunking on Drexler:


http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/Jordan_over_Drexler_5a3411aa88633318670558bc6a82e9 ed.gif


http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/8164ca93f4b87b011d7f1b01b8119e11.gif


http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/682b3d613c774743a2a443ce8c063f02.gif


http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/Jordan_embarrass_drexler_410b837b0c35d9433a65ba753 b222833.gif



Jordan vs. Drexler in 1992 NBA Finals... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dASHnEHnQ7Q

Jordan with 52 on Drexler in 1988... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHQpqJkHxFI

Jordan with 53 on Drexler in 1987... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmOZmnTgtOs
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[mehyaM24]

i have about 300 clips i could pluck out right now, if need be, but i rather just back my opinion with PURE facts:

what coaches say:
Three key participants in the storied Lakers-Celtics rivalry who still hold lofty positions in the game

[3ball]

i have about 300 clips i could pluck out right now,
you don't have shit...

you don't have ONE clip of today's game, where the defender of a corner 3-point shooter is camping in the paint.

not one.

so stfu.

i'm about to have over 100 such plays, just like the Jordan chest-to-chesters, only it won't take me a fraction as long to get them... i already have 15.

and are you seriously trying to show open 3-pointers from previous eras as evidence of today's better era?.... there has never been an era in history that gives up more open 3's than today's game.

[3ball]

Both the original defensive 3 seconds rule and the new rule from 2001 are listed below: one rule "allows", and the other one "prohibits":


1981-82
"Defender on post player is allowed in defensive three-second area (A post player is any player adjacent to paint)"

"Adjacent" would include players outside of the paint - we don't know how far outside, because there was no accompanying clarification for how "adjacent" the player needs to be.. But even without clarification, the original language of the rule allowed defenders to occupy the paint while guarding players who were outside the paint, so the ambiguity in exactly how "adjacent" the player needs to be only gave defenders more latitude than they already had, and more latitude for the refs to allow it.

Clearly, such wording would never be used today - instead, the NBA saw the need to replace this rule in 2001 and use different language that would actually crack-down on ("prohibit") defenders (as opposed to "allowing" as the previous rule did):


2001-2002
A new defensive three-second rule will prohibit a defensive player from remaining in the lane for more than three consecutive seconds without closely guarding an offensive player.



Btw, GIF's like in the OP that show players behind the 3-point line being guarded by paint campers is the best evidence - THAT demonstrates the difference in the rules from 1982 and 2001 better than anything.
.

[mehyaM24]

you don't have shit...

you don't have ONE clip of today's game, where the defender of a corner 3-point shooter is camping in the paint.

not one.

so stfu.

i'm about to have over 100 such plays, just like the Jordan chest-to-chesters, only it won't take me a fraction as long to get them... i already have 15.

and are you seriously trying to show open 3-pointers from previous eras as evidence of today's better era?.... there has never been an era in history that gives up more open 3's than today's game.

:oldlol: at this 3ball guy questioning me. i could post pics of my 90s vhs archive, all playoff games from 2k up, mass collection of dvd's that i obtained from pontel (while still having disk space) and shut this thread down. you on the OTH want to fly out to challenge random ISH posters to petty nonsense.

clowns that cannot differentiate past eras. :facepalm

i have tried to make you catch on by breaking it down in the most simplest of terms, but you are quite honestly slow. google > "NBA defenses are better today" and let me know what you see.

[3ball]

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/d6c47d055cfff266f26bde61297986cf.gif

Under today's defensive 3 seconds rule, a paint defender must be within "armslength" of an opponent to stay in the lane.. http://www.nba.com/nba101/misunderstood_0708.html

In today's game, Eaton would draw a technical after 3 seconds because Cartwright is out of "armslength" reach, but in previous eras, Eaton is legal because Cartwright only needs to be "adjacent to the paint":


Here's the original rule from 1982: (http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_history.html)


1981-82
"Defender on post player is allowed in defensive three-second area (A post player is any player adjacent to paint)".

So just by substituting the rule's own parenthetical reference, the rule translates EXACTLY to: "Defender on player adjacent to the paint is allowed in defensive 3 second area."

There is a quote from then-commissioner Larry O'Brien saying the old 3-seconds rule was meant to open up the lane, but in reality, the league didn't even know what spacing was at the time like we do today... The way people thought about the game back then was 180-degrees different from the way we think about the game today, so O'Brien's standard in 1982 of what a clear lane was does not compare to our current standard, which is why the old 3-seconds rule was replaced in 2001, in an attempt to "open up the game", as the NBA has stated.

The old rule had been incredibly simple in saying that anytime your man is "adjacent to the paint", you can stay in the lane.. The paint is a huge, 16-foot area, so a player "adjacent to the paint" is almost always out of "armslength", especially considering "adjacent to the paint" meant right next to the paint, a few feet outside the paint, or all the way out to the 3-point line...