List of PGs that would be an upgrade over Kyrie for this Cavs team

[oarabbus]

NOT necessarily a better player than Kyrie, just an upgrade for THIS Cavs team:

Curry/CP3/Westbrook (lets forget these guys since they are clearly better regardless)

Rondo
Conley
Rubio
Calderon
Patrick Beverley (offense sucks but major defensive upgrade)
Holiday

Who else?


edit: John Wall.

If the Cavs can manage it somehow, they need to ship Kyrie's ass out and get Wall or Rondo ASAP

[Taller than CP3]

Lebron needs Wade again

Lebron + Wade + Love = 3peat

it doesn't matter who the PG is

[Heavincent]

Lillard?

[oarabbus]

Lillard?

Definitely. My list wasn't meant to be inclusive at all.

[Kiddlovesnets]

Curry is the best fit for this Cavs team, a perfect catch and shoot PG next to Lebron.

[ArbitraryWater]

Definitely. My list wasn't meant to be inclusive at all.

conclusive?

[oarabbus]

conclusive?


Inclusive: : covering or including everything

covering or intended to cover all items


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/inclusive

[SyRyanYang]

Dragic
Bledsoe
Maybe Isaiah Thomas
Jeff Teague if he keeps it up
Kyle Lowry

[BasedTom]

In no particular order:

Jeff Teague
Dennis Schroder
Shelvin Mack
Deron Williams
Jarrett Jack
Jorge Gutierrez
Rajon Rondo
Marcus Smart
Phil Pressey
Kemba Walker
Brian Roberts
Jannero Pargo
Derrick Rose
Aaron Brooks
Kirk Hinrich
E'Twaun Moore
Matthew Dellavedova
Will Cherry
Jameer Nelson
Devin Harris
Ty Lawson
Nate Robinson
Brandon Jennings
D.J. Augustin
Spencer Dinwiddie
Stephen Curry
Shaun Livingston
Patrick Beverley
Jason Terry
Isaiah Canaan
George Hill
C.J. Watson
Donald Sloan
Chris Paul
Jordan Farmar
Jeremy Lin
Ronnie Price
Steve Nash
Mike Conley
Beno Udrih
Nick Calathes
Norris Cole
Shabazz Napier
Mario Chalmers
Ricky Rubio
Mo Williams
Brandon Knight
Kendall Marshall
Nate Wolters
Jrue Holiday
Jimmer Fredette
Russ Smith
Jose Calderon
Pablo Prigioni
Shane Larkin
Russell Westbrook
Reggie Jackson
Sebastian Telfair
Elfrid Payton
Luke Ridnour
Michael Carter-Williams
Tony Wroten
Alexey Shved
Goran Dragic
Isaiah Thomas
Archie Goodwin
Tyler Ennis
Damian Lillard
Steve Blake
Tony Parker
Cory Joseph
Patty Mills
Darren Collison
Ramon Sessions
Ray McCallum
Kyle Lowry
Greivis Vasquez
Trey Burke
Dante Exum
Toure Murry
John Wall
Andre Miller
Garrett Temple
Kalin Lucas

[Mass Debator]

Replace Lebron with healthy Paul George. :bowdown:
And Waiters with Danny Green :bowdown:

[dubeta]

Any player in the league would be an upgrade tbh

[ralph_i_el]

Wall would be an upgrade but idk how well he'd play alongside Lebron. They have a similar style. We havent ever seen Wall NOT be ball dominant. He just happens to kick it out to shooters unlike Kyrie.

[SexSymbol]

Rondo and CP3, that's it

[SexSymbol]

conclusive?
marginally

[J Shuttlesworth]

Curry is the best fit for this Cavs team, a perfect catch and shoot PG next to Lebron.
Yeah and he can get assists too, unlike Kyrie.

Curry would be the best fit, Conley would be great too, but I think both of those are unrealistic.

[NBAplayoffs2001]

I always thought Kyrie was overrated. Getting exposed by LeBron :applause:.

3-17 vs. Portland :biggums: and Lillard dropping 27 pts.

[sammichoffate]

Lebron and Kyrie getting exposed :lol

[blablabla]

I think Mike Conley would be great on this squad

[For_Three]

Collison

[PP34Deuce]

Kyrie is not going to be the problem. They will work things out. Kyrie definitely wants to be the hero and it's going to take Lebron being the big brother and leading him to a better player.

They need to get an Andre Roberson style SG next to them who does the dirty work and hits the 3. Waiters is toxic and I expect Kyrie to change his tune more than Waiters. Sad thing is Waiters could be perfect if he focused on defense and had a slightly better jumper.

This team has no big problems that can't be solved. They will figure it out.

[MiseryCityTexas]

Jeremy Pargo's looking for work, so why not hire him?

[MiseryCityTexas]

Lebron needs to check Irving like how he used to check Mario Chalmers, whenever he ****ed up.

[Mass Debator]

Kyrie is not going to be the problem. They will work things out. Kyrie definitely wants to be the hero and it's going to take Lebron being the big brother and leading him to a better player.

Yes! Do for Kyrie what big brother Wade did for you. The far more experienced player should have an easier time adapting his game anyway.

[jrong]

Mario Chalmers.

LeBron doesn't like it when teammates talk back to him. Chalmers would take it and then drop to his knees or turn around and bend over, whichever James wanted.

Kyrie ain't having that shit.

[FatComputerNerd]

Bring back Delonte West!

[Lebronxrings]

anyone who gets over 1 assist per game.

[LakersForlife]

anyone who gets over 1 assist per game.
/thread

[bdreason]

A guy like Conley would be a nice fit.

[WallIn]

If the Cavs can manage it somehow, they need to ship Kyrie's ass out and get Wall or Rondo ASAP

You wish :oldlol:

[Asukal]

You guys acting like offense is their biggest problem. :oldlol:

The real problem is they need to work on their defense. The offense is a minor thing.

[pauk]

Couple of guys obviously, but I think Kyrie would actually be perfect if only he could change his offensive approach, to the more traditional/more unselfish type of PG approach..... Its amazing how he doesnt get it or maybe he does but refuses to do it (ego thing?) or who knows he simply maybe doesnt have that vision/passing to do it..... I mean he doesnt have scrubs around him anymore... he doesnt have to alienate everybody & hog around anymore (a strategy which didnt win games before Lebron/Love either)... If Kyrie cant go CP3 (not as good as that obviously, but you know, be more of a pass-first guy with great handles/penetration) for Cavs to win as much as possible then he needs to simply give Lebron the ball and heck, become a spotup shooter, Mo Williams part 2 (but better).... not the best thing for him individually, but for the team it sure would be much better, certainly better than what is going on right now i think....

[JonatanRey]

I think you are all overreacting just after a few games. Obv, I dont think Kyrie is the best PG that could play alongside Lebron, but its definitely one of the best. They are loosing because of (the lack of) the system. They dont play as a team, they seem to have no playbook and just play iso, but thats it, dont put the blame on Kyrie. Some post in this thread could be brought up in June and some of you could be embarrassed.

[D.J.]

We're only 4 games in. When LeBron first started playing with Wade and Bosh, they struggled to stay above .500 for the first 20 or so games. I'm not making any assumptions after only 4 games.

[Sarcastic]

Why would the Cavs consider getting rid of Kyrie, when he is locked into a long term contract?

Lebron is the one that is not committed long term. They already dumped Wiggins and Bennett to get Love, who is also not committed long term, for Lebron. They should trade Love and Lebron, if they are thinking of making any trades.

[oarabbus]

Why would the Cavs consider getting rid of Kyrie, when he is locked into a long term contract?

Lebron is the one that is not committed long term. They already dumped Wiggins and Bennett to get Love, who is also not committed long term, for Lebron. They should trade Love and Lebron, if they are thinking of making any trades.


Lol. If you have LeBron you do absolutely everything in your power to keep LeBron. End of story.

[TheBigVeto]

NOT necessarily a better player than Kyrie, just an upgrade for THIS Cavs team:

Curry/CP3/Westbrook (lets forget these guys since they are clearly better regardless)

Rondo
Conley
Rubio
Calderon
Patrick Beverley (offense sucks but major defensive upgrade)
Holiday

Who else?


edit: John Wall.

If the Cavs can manage it somehow, they need to ship Kyrie's ass out and get Wall or Rondo ASAP

CP3
Curry
Lin
That's it

[Sarcastic]

Lol. If you have LeBron you do absolutely everything in your power to keep LeBron. End of story.


How did that work out for them last time?

"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me"


They traded two number 1 overall picks for Lebron. You want them to trade their third? I doubt Silver will gift them 3 number 1 picks in 4 years again.

[ralph_i_el]

CP3
Curry
Lin
That's it
Lin:roll: I think not

[NZStreetBaller]

Ricky rubio would be amazing. U dont really need a scoring pg for this team they got plenty of fire power plus ricky knows kevin love like the back of his hand cavs would dominate offensively

[bizil]

It has to be a pure PG like Rondo, CP3, or even Rubio. Or it can be a great catch and shoot PG who looks to pass more than Kyrie in Steph. When u watch Steph play, it's clear he's more pass first than Kyrie. And he's just as dominant scoring the rock as Kyrie and maybe even more.

In Miami one thing to keep in mind is the fact that Wade is great scorer who is also a great passer. Bron is a great passer who is also a great scorer. Kyrie at this point hasn't proven he's a great passer, especially for a PG. He's part of the new breed of PG's who are score first and basically smaller SG's or combo guards. And there's nothing wrong with that, but at PG I just like a certain premium when it comes to passing-floor generalship.

[coin24]

Couple of guys obviously, but I think Kyrie would actually be perfect if only he could change his offensive approach, to the more traditional/more unselfish type of PG approach..... Its amazing how he doesnt get it or maybe he does but refuses to do it (ego thing?) or who knows he simply maybe doesnt have that vision/passing to do it..... I mean he doesnt have scrubs around him anymore... he doesnt have to alienate everybody & hog around anymore (a strategy which didnt win games before Lebron/Love either)... If Kyrie cant go CP3 (not as good as that obviously, but you know, be more of a pass-first guy with great handles/penetration) for Cavs to win as much as possible then he needs to simply give Lebron the ball and heck, become a spotup shooter, Mo Williams part 2 (but better).... not the best thing for him individually, but for the team it sure would be much better, certainly better than what is going on right now i think....


derp he should let bran be point guard and stand in the corner and shoot 3s?
so bran can pad his assists? ok pauk:lol

[bizil]

Couple of guys obviously, but I think Kyrie would actually be perfect if only he could change his offensive approach, to the more traditional/more unselfish type of PG approach..... Its amazing how he doesnt get it or maybe he does but refuses to do it (ego thing?) or who knows he simply maybe doesnt have that vision/passing to do it..... I mean he doesnt have scrubs around him anymore... he doesnt have to alienate everybody & hog around anymore (a strategy which didnt win games before Lebron/Love either)... If Kyrie cant go CP3 (not as good as that obviously, but you know, be more of a pass-first guy with great handles/penetration) for Cavs to win as much as possible then he needs to simply give Lebron the ball and heck, become a spotup shooter, Mo Williams part 2 (but better).... not the best thing for him individually, but for the team it sure would be much better, certainly better than what is going on right now i think....

Well said! Historically guys like Magic, Isiah, and Big O proved u could be pass first and still be among the most dangerous scorers in the world when called on. CP3 is the best in that regard for PG's today. Some coaches like a Larry Brown might have ACTUALLY moved Kyrie to SG and used a bigger guard to play PG before Bron and Love even got to Cleveland. But some coaches prefer to keep him at PG because of the pressure he puts on a defense with his scoring and handles. Plus when u have a smaller SG, it can throw off the balance of a team if u don't have the right roster.

Sick part about Cleveland's team is the fact u can go with a lineup of:

PG- Bron
SG- Irving
SF- Marion
PF- Love
C- Anderson

U could sit Waiters down and put Bron at PG FLAT OUT. Put Kyrie of the ball and let him focus on scoring. And u got a legit SF in Marion out there to help Bron defend the SG's and SF's. As we all know, Bron can dominate scoring while being a pass first player. Bron might have to be Magic while Irving is like a smaller but more dominant version of Byron Scott!

[D.J.]

Ricky rubio would be amazing. U dont really need a scoring pg for this team they got plenty of fire power plus ricky knows kevin love like the back of his hand cavs would dominate offensively


That was actually the first name that came to mind. A pass first PG who can play D, plus has the experience of having played with Love. You got LeBron and Love in the starting five. You don't need another combo guard who loves to shoot. You just need someone who can run an offense and is willing to be a pass first point who can play minimal D.

[PsychoBe]

Well said! Historically guys like Magic, Isiah, and Big O proved u could be pass first and still be among the most dangerous scorers in the world when called on. CP3 is the best in that regard for PG's today. Some coaches like a Larry Brown might have ACTUALLY moved Kyrie to SG and used a bigger guard to play PG before Bron and Love even got to Cleveland. But some coaches prefer to keep him at PG because of the pressure he puts on a defense with his scoring and handles. Plus when u have a smaller SG, it can throw off the balance of a team if u don't have the right roster.

Sick part about Cleveland's team is the fact u can go with a lineup of:

PG- Bron
SG- Irving
SF- Marion
PF- Love
C- Anderson

U could sit Waiters down and put Bron at PG FLAT OUT. Put Kyrie of the ball and let him focus on scoring. And u got a legit SF in Marion out there to help Bron defend the SG's and SF's. As we all know, Bron can dominate scoring while being a pass first player. Bron might have to be Magic while Irving is like a smaller but more dominant version of Byron Scott!

:facepalm

dont be delusional. the reason why bran hasn't seen pure pg minutes since his rookie season was because he did not, and still doesn't, have elite pg ball-handling skills he will get stripped every time he brought the ball up court and trapped.

[iBandwagon]

Rondo is the obvious #1 choice for their set up.

[Rose'sACL]

How did that work out for them last time?

"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me"


They traded two number 1 overall picks for Lebron. You want them to trade their third? I doubt Silver will gift them 3 number 1 picks in 4 years again.
it worked great for them last time unless you're an idiot who hates money. if cleveland doesn't win any title but still makes deep playoff runs then that would be a huge success for the franchise as it would result in a lot of money because lebron plays there. Ask people in cleveland and they would tell you that many people from other cities used to go to cleveland just to watch big cavs games when lebron was there and those people used to spend a lot which helped a lot of local businesses.

[Out_In_Utah]

Oh boo hoo. If LeBron can't win with Kyrie and Love, he doesn't deserve to win.

[The_Yearning]

Honestly, the Cavs would be much better with Damian Lillard at the point.

Dude can shoot lights out, play off ball, unselfish, and only really likes to play when the game is on the line (offsetting Lebron's beta mentality).

Plus, he runs the PNR better than Irving and would be a lethal combination with Kevin Love.

Also plays better defense.

[VengefulAngel]

Can't believe this name hasn't been mentioned. Eric Bledsoe. (Almost perfect)

[roffie]

pat bevs would be a pretty good option.. let lebron handle the ball again shift k yrie to SG

[bizil]

:facepalm

dont be delusional. the reason why bran hasn't seen pure pg minutes since his rookie season was because he did not, and still doesn't, have elite pg ball-handling skills he will get stripped every time he brought the ball up court and trapped.

Bron easily has pg handles and passing ability! Its about ball control and not so much about fancy handles. And most teams wouldn't defend Bron with a small pg. It would be how teams would switch up on Magic. And if u do put a small guard on Bron, he will just back him down and dominate. Just like Magic and Penny used to do! Bron moved away from PG in Clevland cause that team needed him to score more, even though he was usually a point forward anyway. There's a REASON why all the guys on TNT, NBA TV, and ESPN all say Bron can play or defend PG to PF. Typically I want him playing SF or point forward. But if needed, he could EASILY move to the point guard position!

[Prometheus]

It's not a perfect fit, but everyone is overreacting. They're going to be scary in a few months.

[Asukal]

Again, their offense hasn't been much of a problem really. They have a lot of guys who can score. Sure their chemistry is way off but that will fix itself once everyone commits to their game plan. The only thing they really need to work on now is their defense, they must be alert all the time and give 100% effort in order to win games. Changing the PG won't win them games. :facepalm

[bizil]

Again, their offense hasn't been much of a problem really. They have a lot of guys who can score. Sure their chemistry is way off but that will fix itself once everyone commits to their game plan. The only thing they really need to work on now is their defense, they must be alert all the time and give 100% effort in order to win games. Changing the PG won't win them games. :facepalm

I wouldn't change the PG either! Kyrie is a beast and one of the top 5-7 PG's in the L. However Cleveland has the luxury at times to go with Bron at PG, Kyrie at SG, and Marion or Mike Miller at SF. Lebron is a pass first player that can dominate scoring and it would allow Kyrie to go off scoring. But overall, I would of course keep Kyrie at PG to do his thing.

[kurple]

Trade Idea


Lawson&Mozgov -4- Irving

[hawkfan]

NOT necessarily a better player than Kyrie, just an upgrade for THIS Cavs team:

Curry/CP3/Westbrook (lets forget these guys since they are clearly better regardless)

Rondo
Conley
Rubio
Calderon
Patrick Beverley (offense sucks but major defensive upgrade)
Holiday

Who else?


edit: John Wall.

If the Cavs can manage it somehow, they need to ship Kyrie's ass out and get Wall or Rondo ASAP

Teague is better than Irving.

[HurricaneKid]

Rondo is the obvious #1 choice for their set up.

I don't understand why I keep seeing this. LeBron needs to be the point. Rondo is the most ball dominant player in the league. Thats the problem with Kyrie too.

And to all the people saying its only been 4 games, you don't get it. Take Wade off the ball and he still scores 20ppg on elite %s with 5/5. Take Kyrie's handle away and he is barely an NBA calibur player (though one with a few spectacular skills). This isn't the best players in the league figuring out the best way to complement one another. This is a guy with an elite skill (handle, ability to break down his defender) who lacks the requisite complimentary skills (court vision, passing) to be the primary ball handler on a contender. He is young with immense potential but its not clicking for him. He needs to be able to find shooters when he breaks down his guy. He CANNOT just shot jack. He can't even lead the second unit playing like that.

This has ALWAYS been problem with this pairing. Read my posts from before the season started. I'm no nostradamus; this was easy to see coming and there is NOT an easy fix. They SHOULD be able to improve ball movement but Kyrie is as big a liability on defense as exists and thats not easily correctable. Last year he was #277 in RAPM (measuring a player's impact on the score) and rated as the second worst player in the NBA who played 7500 possessions. More effort on the defensive end will help immensely but taking away his best skill is going to be hugely problematic as well.

[Bandito]

Can Kyrie just play off ball?

[HurricaneKid]

Can Kyrie just play off ball?

Kyrie is one of a handful of players EVER to actually shoot better off the dribble than catch and shoot.

And you take away what makes him a special player, his mad handle, and you are stuck with his NBA worst defense, etc.

He really doesn't make a ton of sense off ball.

[oarabbus]

Kyrie is one of a handful of players EVER to actually shoot better off the dribble than catch and shoot.

And you take away what makes him a special player, his mad handle, and you are stuck with his NBA worst defense, etc.

He really doesn't make a ton of sense off ball.


All of this just sounds like "not a championship PG". His ceiling is Iverson (probably lower) and Iverson never won a ring, despite being one of the most talented ever.

[HurricaneKid]

All of this just sounds like "not a championship PG". His ceiling is Iverson (probably lower) and Iverson never won a ring, despite being one of the most talented ever.

If there was an optimal team around him... Well, still almost no way. Which isn't to say he can't improve and become that. Just that he has a LOOong ways to go and that this is FAR different than Miami in 11.

But LeBron is the opposite of what would make him a better player. It duplicates his sole ++ skill and emphasizes several of his weaknesses.

[NattyPButter]

why do ppl still like to throw Lillard's name around. Dude is overrated as ****. He's a chucking PG also that don't get his teammates all that involved and just as bad as Kyrie on D. He fits the same mold as Kyrie but shoots at a worst FG%.

[Bandito]

Dwyane Wade would be an upgrade.

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

CP and Steph since theyre better PGs and better spotup shooters

[MUGEN]

why do ppl still like to throw Lillard's name around. Dude is overrated as ****. He's a chucking PG also that don't get his teammates all that involved and just as bad as Kyrie on D. He fits the same mold as Kyrie but shoots at a worst FG%.

Holy shit :roll: Salty as ****

He owned ur team and Kyrie's soul several times already

he is a much better defender than Kyrie...he involves his team a LOT. He is a better passer and also unselfish in play making unlike Kyrie. All u had to do was actually watch him play and you would know

Lillard >>>>> Kyrie any day of the week

[chris02jammers]

In no particular order:

Jeff Teague
Dennis Schroder
Shelvin Mack
Deron Williams
Jarrett Jack
Jorge Gutierrez
Rajon Rondo
Marcus Smart
Phil Pressey
Kemba Walker
Brian Roberts
Jannero Pargo
Derrick Rose
Aaron Brooks
Kirk Hinrich
E'Twaun Moore
Matthew Dellavedova
Will Cherry
Jameer Nelson
Devin Harris
Ty Lawson
Nate Robinson
Brandon Jennings
D.J. Augustin
Spencer Dinwiddie
Stephen Curry
Shaun Livingston
Patrick Beverley
Jason Terry
Isaiah Canaan
George Hill
C.J. Watson
Donald Sloan
Chris Paul
Jordan Farmar
Jeremy Lin
Ronnie Price
Steve Nash
Mike Conley
Beno Udrih
Nick Calathes
Norris Cole
Shabazz Napier
Mario Chalmers
Ricky Rubio
Mo Williams
Brandon Knight
Kendall Marshall
Nate Wolters
Jrue Holiday
Jimmer Fredette
Russ Smith
Jose Calderon
Pablo Prigioni
Shane Larkin
Russell Westbrook
Reggie Jackson
Sebastian Telfair
Elfrid Payton
Luke Ridnour
Michael Carter-Williams
Tony Wroten
Alexey Shved
Goran Dragic
Isaiah Thomas
Archie Goodwin
Tyler Ennis
Damian Lillard
Steve Blake
Tony Parker
Cory Joseph
Patty Mills
Darren Collison
Ramon Sessions
Ray McCallum
Kyle Lowry
Greivis Vasquez
Trey Burke
Dante Exum
Toure Murry
John Wall
Andre Miller
Garrett Temple
Kalin Lucas

you have too much time... get a life, you need to get laid...

[fiddy]

who would take on Kyrie's shitty contract?

[VengefulAngel]

who would take on Kyrie's shitty contract?

Nearly every team, his contract isn't horrible.