Jordan shot 41% in his 1st comeback year at age 31...

[sundizz]

Yes, you read that right.

The year Jordan came back from baseball at the very mortal age of 31, with no major injuries etc, he came back and shot 9.8 out of 23.8. 41.1% pathetic %.

His stats were 26.9 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 5.3 apg for those 17 games.

Then his 2nd comeback at age 38 he shot 41.6% for those 60 games and averaged 22.9 ppg, 5.7 rpg and 5.2 apg.

We really need to cut Kobe some slack. His team is absolutely awful. And he is a terrible pg/floor general. He is a player built to play with another superstar and to win chips (e.g., midrange game). He is never going to do amazing with a bunch of scrubs...similar to how Jordan never did well with a bunch of scrubs. They intimidate and overshadow their teammates too much. You need a 2nd superstar to even out this alpha mentality and to get others involved.

It's just amazing to me to watch him play. He looks to be in great shape and is surprisingly quick up and down the floor. This is the best defense I've seen him play in a while. He just came back from ACL surgery. At age 36. With his ridiculous mileage. I dunno how people can be hating on this.

I also honestly think he is doing this in part because he is sick of telling his teammates to attack on their own. If Jeremy Lin could dribble penetrate without turning it over, or any other wing player could even dribble, he wouldn't be chucking up this many shots. Their 2nd best option is Boozer. That's sad. This team is worse than his Smush team.

[Magic 32]

We really need to cut Kobe some slack. .

That will never happen with Lebron stans still reeling from the 2014 finals and long time haters who are still about 2009 and 2010.

The last month has been a RELEASE for these losers.

[ImKobe]

No. This Lakers team is championship material and Kobe's turned it into a lottery team. If only he let Lin run the offense and Wes get his shots. Kobe is sacrificing games to pad his ppg. This has to stop. Jordan in 95 still looked great physically, he was just rusty from the time off. With Kobe, he's just missing wide open shots, doesn't attack the rim nearly often enough.

You ever played 2K and had a maxed out player and when you got bored, just ran up the floor and chucked long 2s? That's exactly what Kobe's doing, and they don't fall on 2K either, unless you have them sliders turnt up.

Point being, Kobe is a chucker and he's taking low-percentage shots. He might literally have one or two good games out of 10, and it will be enough to make these stans forget about the 8-9 bad games he just had. But I don't expect a bunch of teenagers to have any knowledge of the game regarding this subject. All Kobe fans care about is him winning a scoring title and passing MJ this season. Lakers might win 20 games if he has a good stretch or two.


/sarcasm fakkit

[juju151111]

Yes, you read that right.

The year Jordan came back from baseball at the very mortal age of 31, with no major injuries etc, he came back and shot 9.8 out of 23.8. 41.1% pathetic %.

His stats were 26.9 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 5.3 apg for those 17 games.

Then his 2nd comeback at age 38 he shot 41.6% for those 60 games and averaged 22.9 ppg, 5.7 rpg and 5.2 apg.

We really need to cut Kobe some slack. His team is absolutely awful. And he is a terrible pg/floor general. He is a player built to play with another superstar and to win chips (e.g., midrange game). He is never going to do amazing with a bunch of scrubs...similar to how Jordan never did well with a bunch of scrubs. They intimidate and overshadow their teammates too much. You need a 2nd superstar to even out this alpha mentality and to get others involved.

It's just amazing to me to watch him play. He looks to be in great shape and is surprisingly quick up and down the floor. This is the best defense I've seen him play in a while. He just came back from ACL surgery. At age 36. With his ridiculous mileage. I dunno how people can be hating on this.

I also honestly think he is doing this in part because he is sick of telling his teammates to attack on their own. If Jeremy Lin could dribble penetrate without turning it over, or any other wing player could even dribble, he wouldn't be chucking up this many shots. Their 2nd best option is Boozer. That's sad. This team is worse than his Smush team.
That was 17 games. He was not in basketball shape. He was in baseball and had no training camp. Kobe had all of this and is shooting worse. Mj also got better with time and played good in the playoffs.

[ImKobe]

That was 17 games. He was not in basketball shape. He was in baseball and had no training camp. Kobe had all of this and is shooting worse. Mj also got better with time and played good in the playoffs.

MJ was 31
MJ wasn't coming off of a ruptured achilles nor a broken knee
MJ was in his 10th NBA season

there's a HUGE difference.

But I get the OP, the rust is going to be there and it's going to take some time + learning to play with your teammates for the production to improve.

Kobe's much worse athletically than a 31 yr old MJ, it's not even close... Much much more mileage and injuries... You can't be serious.

[chocolatethunder]

That was 17 games. He was not in basketball shape. He was in baseball and had no training camp. Kobe had all of this and is shooting worse. Mj also got better with time and played good in the playoffs.
This.

There's no way the OP was alive when this happened or he wouldnt have been stupid enough to make this thread. Jordan said himself that he wasn't in basketball shape. He said something to the effect that "I've been training to play baseball and I don't have the same lift or explosiveness that I normally have. I'm not as quick because I haven't been using those muscles. Next year will be different." And what do you know, it was.

[andgar923]

Yes, you read that right.

The year Jordan came back from baseball at the very mortal age of 31, with no major injuries etc, he came back and shot 9.8 out of 23.8. 41.1% pathetic %.

His stats were 26.9 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 5.3 apg for those 17 games.

Then his 2nd comeback at age 38 he shot 41.6% for those 60 games and averaged 22.9 ppg, 5.7 rpg and 5.2 apg.

We really need to cut Kobe some slack. His team is absolutely awful. And he is a terrible pg/floor general. He is a player built to play with another superstar and to win chips (e.g., midrange game). He is never going to do amazing with a bunch of scrubs...similar to how Jordan never did well with a bunch of scrubs. They intimidate and overshadow their teammates too much. You need a 2nd superstar to even out this alpha mentality and to get others involved.

It's just amazing to me to watch him play. He looks to be in great shape and is surprisingly quick up and down the floor. This is the best defense I've seen him play in a while. He just came back from ACL surgery. At age 36. With his ridiculous mileage. I dunno how people can be hating on this.

I also honestly think he is doing this in part because he is sick of telling his teammates to attack on their own. If Jeremy Lin could dribble penetrate without turning it over, or any other wing player could even dribble, he wouldn't be chucking up this many shots. Their 2nd best option is Boozer. That's sad. This team is worse than his Smush team.:lol :lol :lol

[plowking]

It is amazing how Kobe's teammates constantly get criticized for how poor they are, and then they leave and they're the best players on their team, and lead that team to wins, and funnily enough are appreciated at their new teams.

Howard and Gasol we were told were done, terrible, over the hill and just not good enough. Yet, away from Kobe, and the narrow minded LA fans, funnily enough, they are both thriving.

Phil Jackson was and probably still is the only one who can keep Kobe honest, in check, and get him to play basketball the right way. We're constantly told it is all the teammates fault, but Kobe needs to look at himself and start doing what he was doing on those championship teams; play some team basketball. If Phil was coaching, this team would be above .500.

[juju151111]

MJ was 31
MJ wasn't coming off of a ruptured achilles nor a broken knee
MJ was in his 10th NBA season

there's a HUGE difference.

But I get the OP, the rust is going to be there and it's going to take some time + learning to play with your teammates for the production to improve.

Kobe's much worse athletically than a 31 yr old MJ, it's not even close... Much much more mileage and injuries... You can't be serious.
No not. Kobe was in basketball shape. You can't just start playing Basketball out of nowhere. Even Terrell Owens could barley keep up in a celebrity game one year and he was in football shape. Until the next year at the event where he said he trained his body.

Bryant has healed from those injuries since the summer.

Learning to play with teammates? He just chucking .

[guy]

MJ was 31
MJ wasn't coming off of a ruptured achilles nor a broken knee
MJ was in his 10th NBA season

there's a HUGE difference.

But I get the OP, the rust is going to be there and it's going to take some time + learning to play with your teammates for the production to improve.

Kobe's much worse athletically than a 31 yr old MJ, it's not even close... Much much more mileage and injuries... You can't be serious.

You're an idiot if you think 17 games, especially being completely removed from the game for over a year, really means anything. Do you really think Kobe, before his injuries and at a younger age, never had a sample of 17 games where he shot 41% or less overall? :oldlol:

[NBAplayoffs2001]

27/7/6 on 41% fg and 50% 3pt is nothing to be ashamed of...

I do agree if he never retired, they would have won 8 championships in a row. I think he still plays on the Wizards though. Can't forget he donated his first year salary to the 9/11 victims. #respect :applause:

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Jordan wasn't chucking up shots...at least to the degree Kobe is doing ATM. Not only that, but the biggest fundamental difference between them is that Mike actually passed the basketball and played defense. Basically he played the all-around game.

Sounds like you clearly weren't watching Jordan or the NBA in 95, to be frank.

[chris02jammers]

Yes, you read that right.

The year Jordan came back from baseball at the very mortal age of 31, with no major injuries etc, he came back and shot 9.8 out of 23.8. 41.1% pathetic %.

His stats were 26.9 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 5.3 apg for those 17 games.

Then his 2nd comeback at age 38 he shot 41.6% for those 60 games and averaged 22.9 ppg, 5.7 rpg and 5.2 apg.

We really need to cut Kobe some slack. His team is absolutely awful. And he is a terrible pg/floor general. He is a player built to play with another superstar and to win chips (e.g., midrange game). He is never going to do amazing with a bunch of scrubs...similar to how Jordan never did well with a bunch of scrubs. They intimidate and overshadow their teammates too much. You need a 2nd superstar to even out this alpha mentality and to get others involved.

It's just amazing to me to watch him play. He looks to be in great shape and is surprisingly quick up and down the floor. This is the best defense I've seen him play in a while. He just came back from ACL surgery. At age 36. With his ridiculous mileage. I dunno how people can be hating on this.

I also honestly think he is doing this in part because he is sick of telling his teammates to attack on their own. If Jeremy Lin could dribble penetrate without turning it over, or any other wing player could even dribble, he wouldn't be chucking up this many shots. Their 2nd best option is Boozer. That's sad. This team is worse than his Smush team.

I don't know if your stupid or moron.

the Bulls made it deep into play offs. while your GOAT Kobe is dropping the lakers further down into lottery, they won't win 15 games this year

FYI 2014 Lakers has a better supporting casts than 2007 Cavs which has Larry Hughes as the second best player, but LeBron carried them all the way to NBA Finals

[CelticBaller]

Jordan was older and still put up better stats? :applause:

[Inactive]

For 17 games. Then he put up 31.5 on .484/.367 in the playoffs. Kobe hasn't put up playoff numbers that good in his entire career, and that wasn't one of Jordan's better seasons.

[ranigma]

Yes, you read that right.

The year Jordan came back from baseball at the very mortal age of 31, with no major injuries etc, he came back and shot 9.8 out of 23.8. 41.1% pathetic %.

His stats were 26.9 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 5.3 apg for those 17 games.

Then his 2nd comeback at age 38 he shot 41.6% for those 60 games and averaged 22.9 ppg, 5.7 rpg and 5.2 apg.

We really need to cut Kobe some slack. His team is absolutely awful. And he is a terrible pg/floor general. He is a player built to play with another superstar and to win chips (e.g., midrange game). He is never going to do amazing with a bunch of scrubs...similar to how Jordan never did well with a bunch of scrubs. They intimidate and overshadow their teammates too much. You need a 2nd superstar to even out this alpha mentality and to get others involved.

It's just amazing to me to watch him play. He looks to be in great shape and is surprisingly quick up and down the floor. This is the best defense I've seen him play in a while. He just came back from ACL surgery. At age 36. With his ridiculous mileage. I dunno how people can be hating on this.

I also honestly think he is doing this in part because he is sick of telling his teammates to attack on their own. If Jeremy Lin could dribble penetrate without turning it over, or any other wing player could even dribble, he wouldn't be chucking up this many shots. Their 2nd best option is Boozer. That's sad. This team is worse than his Smush team.

Jordan was 32, not 31.

[chazzy]

If Phil was coaching, this team would be above .500.
:roll:

[SamuraiSWISH]

His stats were 26.9 ppg, 6.9 rpg, 5.3 apg for those 17 games.
He was 32 years old ...

Then upped his production to 32 ppg, 7 rpg, 5 apg on 48% in the Playoffs.

This was at the time considered to be collosal failure, and very un-Mike-like. Even those numbers are amazing. Especially considering he was gone for 2 years, and built himself up for a different sport entirely.

Also, MJ in the 2002 season was 39, and suffered knee injuries that altered his production midway through the year.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

:roll:

There's not much difference between this team and the 06 squad other than peak Kobe.

I'm not sure about them being .500 - but they'd be closer to that than 1-9 (Bscott is likeable, but he's a mediocre headcoach.. maybe even a downgrade from MDA).

[ImKobe]

Jordan was older and still put up better stats? :applause:

This has to be sarcastic, right?

[3ball]

really need to cut Kobe some slack.


we definitely don't need to cut him slack if we are comparing to jordan.

Jordan had a 28.1 PER in the playoffs as a 35-year old... that would rank 5th highest in Lebron's career (same as lebron's 2013 playoff PER actually)... throw in superior clutchness that year, and Jordan's playoff performance at 35 was better than Lebron at 28...

(it's ironic too, because in the 1998 Finals, Jordan took 27 shots per game and scored a record 38% of his team's points, which attracted maximum defensive attention to free up teammates.... meanwhile, the stats prove that in the 2014 Finals, Lebron didn't shoot nearly enough (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10441295&postcount=236), which allowed the Spurs to play everyone straight up.. consequently, Miami had the worst offense of any Spurs opponent).

given what jordan did at 35 (being better than a 2013 Lebron), one can only assume that if jordan had come back at 36 in 1999, he would have been vastly better than 36-year old kobe is right now.

[sundizz]

People misunderstanding - it is not a who is better comparison. Just saying it took Jordan a while to start hitting shots etc and being Mike. This is without any injuries - simply time off.

We r 10 games in and i think that for an old 36 year old with a new acl and knee he looks pretty damn good. Not saying he is playing hoops the right way. Regardless of how he plays this laker team is turrible. Lamar Odom of 06 is vastly superior to any of these players.

If he went to a good team and played 25 mpg (like he should be doing) he would put up mediocre numbers with a great per/36 and be a great asset to a team.

Any version of lebron could not carry these Lakers to the playoffs. I do agree though that lebron is much better than both kobe and jordan with his ability to play with scrubs and get them to do well. However, both kobe and jordan r better when they have a talented superstar on their team. This year will be a good test for bron.

[3ball]

We r 10 games in and i think that for an old 36 year old with a new acl and knee he looks pretty damn good.


agreed... he has exceeded my expectations thus far... i had him averaging like 18 and 5.... waiting to see if his body breaks down at all like wizard jordan's did.


Lamar Odom of 06 is vastly superior to any of these players.

what kobe would do for lamar right now.... lamar was super-legit and crushes any of these current lakers.... a prime lamar would crush this league.


If he went to a good team and played 25 mpg (like he should be doing) he would put up mediocre numbers with a great per/36 and be a great asset to a team.
agreed.


Any version of lebron could not carry these Lakers to the playoffs.
only because the west is so good and it will take 50+ wins to get in.

but 10 years ago, a prime kobe, lebron or jordan would get this team to the playoffs.... that's how good all three were in their respective primes.

[3ball]

I do agree though that lebron is much better than both kobe and jordan with his ability to play with scrubs and get them to do well.

this isn't true at all - there were only 20 teams when Jordan first came in the league in the mid-80's, so each team had to play each other 6 times... and since there were more good teams in the Eastern Conference at that time than there were in the mid-2000's, having to play these good teams more often hurt Jordan's ability to amass regular season wins.

not only did jordan play better teams more often, but his supoporting cast wasn't as good as lebron's - in the mid-2000's, lebron actually didn't have total scrubs on his team like jordan did in the mid-80's.... lebron's teammates weren't all-stars, but several guys were solid, whereas jordan had complete scrubs... he really WAS a one-man team.

Then in the playoffs, Lebron got to play Gilbert Arenas' Wizards in the first round, while Jordan had to play literally one of the greatest teams of all time in the first round, the 80's Celtics..

so it doesn't make sense to only do a simple comparison, because these factors are important.

[Micku]

not only did jordan play better teams more often, but his supoporting cast wasn't as good as lebron's - in the mid-2000's, lebron actually didn't have total scrubs on his team like jordan did in the mid-80's.... lebron's teammates weren't all-stars, but several guys were solid, whereas jordan had complete scrubs... he really WAS a one-man team.


I disagree. MJ had guys like Oakley and Woolridge which were better than anybody that the LBJ had with the Cavs prior to the Heat imo. The 85-86 team would've interesting to see MJ play with for a full season since you had old man George Gervin, Woolridge, and a rookie Oakley. They got to the playoffs without MJ. They wouldn't beat the 86 Celts, but with MJ playing in the full RS, they should've got more wins in the regular season. But what happened is that they sucked in comparison relative to the competition of that time. They didn't have more talent than the Hawks, Pistons, 76ers still, and etc.

In 87 I think you could make that argument and in 88 and in 89. I would say that the Cavs fit LBJ style more, which generated more wins. With Miami, it was a little different. They had more talent, but generated less wins usually in the RS.

[Asukal]

There's a difference in being rusty and missing open shots and chucking contested shot after contested shot. Kobe is trash. :oldlol:

[Shaquille O'Neal]

MJ was 31
MJ wasn't coming off of a ruptured achilles nor a broken knee
MJ was in his 10th NBA season

there's a HUGE difference.

But I get the OP, the rust is going to be there and it's going to take some time + learning to play with your teammates for the production to improve.

Kobe's much worse athletically than a 31 yr old MJ, it's not even close... Much much more mileage and injuries... You can't be serious.

First of all, MJ was 32, not 31. Born in 02/63 - returned 03/95 = 32 years old.
Secondly, you mention his 10th year in the NBA but forget to mention the 3 years of college he played.
Third, MJ didn't play pro bball from June '93 to March 95 - almost a 2 year layoff. Has Chokobe ever taken 21 months off?:facepalm

[Milbuck]

It is amazing how Kobe's teammates constantly get criticized for how poor they are, and then they leave and they're the best players on their team, and lead that team to wins, and funnily enough are appreciated at their new teams.

Howard and Gasol we were told were done, terrible, over the hill and just not good enough. Yet, away from Kobe, and the narrow minded LA fans, funnily enough, they are both thriving.

Dwight was coming off a serious back surgery way too early, and also had a torn labrum which he played through. It's not like he just magically became a better player in Houston away from Kobe...the dude got healthy.

And Gasol was visibly losing motivation year after year with the trade rumors, and after Phil left, coaching pretty much shafted him. Favored Bynum when he emerged, then when Dwight came along it went to another level. Then last year he was on a garbage team, which obviously does wonders for your confidence, losing 50+ games. No shit he'd be rejuvenated playing for a brilliant coach on a contending team.

Kobe can be a tough teammate but you're completely ignoring some pretty key details here.

[DJ Leon Smith]

This totally clears Kobe of any blame this season.

Three-peat or bust next year though.

[Dragonyeuw]

Good post TC, you conveniently forget that he shot 49% the following year but anyways....:rolleyes:

[I<3NBA]

If Phil was coaching, this team would be above .500.

:roll:
why you laughing? that means he has too much belief in Kobe if he believes the Lakers will be above .500 just with the addition of PJax. :lol