Game Thread: Denver Nuggets (2-7) @ Cleveland Cavaliers (5-3) - 11/17/14

[Meticode]

Denver Nuggets
_C - Mozgov
PF - Faried
SF - Chandler
SG - Affalo
PG - Lawson

Cleveland Cavaliers
_C - Varejao
PF - Love
SF - LeBron
SG - Marion
PG - Irving

Note: LeBron James is probable for the game after having flu-like symptoms earlier today and skipped practice.

[Smook A.]

So is LeBron playing tonight or not?

Edit - Nvm, he's playing.

[CavaliersFTW]

Green rep to the first post of a HQ livestream :cheers:

[Smook A.]

Green rep to the first post of a HQ livestream :cheers:
http://nba-stream.com/live/cavaliers-live-stream/channel-4/

[Thunderfan86]

Why does Lebron refuse to jump high anymore? :confusedshrug: It's not like he can't....he's playing below the rim on purpose.

[Cavalier]

Shawn Marion moves REALLY well for a 36 year-old.

[Trollsmasher]

LeBron doing Kobe out there:facepalm

[lebron06]

Bran about to pull a 1-14 :oldlol: :oldlol:

[inclinerator]

Why does Lebron refuse to jump high anymore? :confusedshrug: It's not like he can't....he's playing below the rim on purpose.
he al jefferson now

[G0ATbe]

LeBald going for 0%.:bowdown:

The Flu game.:bowdown:

[Uncle Drew]

Love schooled Faried right there.

[Smook A.]

Lawson is mad underrated. Dude's a real good player

[inclinerator]

lee bran looking mighty fast out there

[NuggetsFan]

Nuggets actually looking half decent.

[Cavalier]

Joe f*cking Harris. Steal of the draft.:bowdown:

[Uncle Drew]

I have a man crush on Joe Harris.

[Uncle Drew]

Loving the ball movement yet again.

[RedBlackAttack]

I love that this ball movement thing has been consistent since the first three games or so. Really beautiful basketball right now, even when the shots aren't falling.

Kyrie has been killing it from three lately.

[RedBlackAttack]

Afflalo is a nice player. I always liked him in Orlando. Smooth game.

[Thunderfan86]

Afflalo is a nice player. I always liked him in Orlando. Smooth game.
Yeah, he is. I was hoping the Thunder would trade for him. He would've been a great fit.

[Uncle Drew]

http://i.imgur.com/u7piWMJ.gif

[PleezeBelieve]

Denver played a great half of basketball. Good to see them fighting for their coach

[Twiens]

http://i.imgur.com/u7piWMJ.gif

Sick pass, gonna be scary when they get that down pat. Cavs seem like a lazy team right now, they know they can turn it on whenever they want and smoke teams.

[NugzFan]

We are terrible at tanking.

[Lebronxrings]

this team sucks... Relying so much on lebron...

[Meticode]

this team sucks... Relying so much on lebron...
Funny considering that Love leads the team in points and rebounds in the first half. :oldlol: And Irving has the same exact points, rebs and assist as LeBron in the first half.

[Smoke117]

All of the Cavs problems begin and end with defense. They are a complete joke in that respect. There is nothing to talk about offensively...any problems there are way down the list in importance.

[Meticode]

Everytime TT takes that 12-15 foot floater in the lane I just think, "Yep, that's not going in." :lol

[truhooper]

:facepalm

[D-Wait]

Everytime TT takes that 12-15 foot floater in the lane I just think, "Yep, that's not going in." :lol

Exactly this. :facepalm

[Meticode]

All of the Cavs problems begin and end with defense. They are a complete joke in that respect. There is nothing to talk about offensively...any problems there are way down the list in importance.
Yes.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

Cavs should trade for Mozgov. And irving is really bad on D.

[coin24]

The nuggets are such a shitty put together team..

[Fork]

Every time the Cavs get momentum..........BOOM another 3

[Keno]

fluke ass game where scrubs are hitting their 3's.

[DonDadda59]

How are the Cavs losing to this team? Their whole offense is Nate Robinson dribbling around and launching 3s. :biggums:

This is some other level shit defense.

[Asukal]

Nate going kobe mode. :facepalm

[Cavalier]

That foul on TT.:facepalm

[L.Kizzle]

Cavs are ass juice.

[MUGEN]

:biggums: da hell is going on here

[coin24]

Nuggets beasting:lol

[kurple]

Cavs should trade for Mozgov. And irving is really bad on D.
yes. the cavs should, what kinda picks do they have?

[kurple]

fluke ass game where scrubs are hitting their 3's.
afflalo is a 40% career 3pt shooter. way to scout your opponents

[Mr. Jabbar]

How are the Cavs losing to this team? Their whole offense is Nate Robinson dribbling around and launching 3s. :biggums:

This is some other level shit defense.

5 positions

[SAKOTXA]

Lawson so good

[Fork]

Game over :facepalm

[NuggetsFan]

How are the Cavs losing to this team? Their whole offense is Nate Robinson dribbling around and launching 3s. :biggums:

This is some other level shit defense.

Not really. He just chucks off the bench wouldn't even be a top 4 option on our team.

Nuggets have actually looked really good tonight which isn't a good sign for the Cavs. Denver does have the talent but obviously a huge mess right now.

[Andrei89]

David Blatt looks like a bird

[D-Wait]

Seeing Lawson slicing up our D, Tony Parker will have a field day on Wed...

[SAKOTXA]

lmao nice defense Lebron

[MUGEN]

WTF was that defense Lebron? hahaha That was Harden-esque

[JimmyMcAdocious]

So the Nuggets going to blow it up or what?

[sbw19]

Quick guards giving Cavs D all kinds of trouble.

[Bless Mathews]

The nuggets at home, Down 14. ? On second night of back to back?


Dat west?

[Micku]

David Blatt looks like a bird

Don't compare Blatt to da Bird.

http://nzhoops.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/larry-bird-pacers-coach.jpg

[Lebronxrings]

no way this team is stacked... Without lebron this team is comparable to the 76ers...

[NuggetsFan]

So the Nuggets going to blow it up or what?

Probably not. I wish. I imagine they eventually get there shit together but because of the West being so good/shitty start they miss out on the playoffs but aren't shitty for long enough to secure a top 5 pick.

Hoping I'm wrong and they either a) blow it up or b) somehow make the playoffs.

[Cavalier]

I want to erase this game from my memory.

[Meticode]

afflalo is a 40% career 3pt shooter. way to scout your opponents
He's probably talking about Darrell Arthur, career 25% three point shooter, is 3/3 in the game and 5/5 from the field. :lol

[MUGEN]

no way this team is stacked... Without lebron this team is comparable to the 76ers...

Some days they are comparable to the 76ers even with Lebron :lol

But no seriously, Cavs are really weak on defense and it shows

[coin24]

Where is Lebron? Oh yeah it's the 4th qtr and his teams down:lol

He's standing around throwing and slamming the ball down making angry faces:roll:

[Warfan]

The Mighty West :applause:

[Meticode]

Win some, lose some. Cavs looked lethargic most of the game and they couldn't hit any shots back-to-back for the most part to make any runs. Good game Denver.

[The_Yearning]

There are no easy games out West... and it's never an easy game playing against the West.

[Legends66NBA7]

Afflalo and Mozgov on the trading block ?

[Ai2death]

How is that a foul??? I take harder shits than that after a night full of **** enomas!

[sbw19]

Rare miss on FB by Bron.

[NuggetsFan]

Afflalo and Mozgov on the trading block ?

Don't think anybody knows. No way Denver goes with this payroll going forward if there not winning. Not going to blow it up and move AA/Mozzy after a bad 10 games.

I'd have them on the block tho :lol

[Ai2death]

Rare miss on FB by Bron.


That's cause it's the 4th :yaohappy:

[MUGEN]

The worst commentator duo in the league in Cavs :facepalm

[Ai2death]

The worst commentator duo in the league in Cavs :facepalm

Watching on mute at work :banana:

[Bless Mathews]

The worst commentator duo in the league in Cavs :facepalm

Word.

TURRIBLE. Horrible. Bad.

[MUGEN]

Watching on mute at work :banana:

:lol Smart choice :cheers:

[Lebronxrings]

good game nuggets :cheers: Refs were the difference

[HOoopCityJones]

How many times will The Cavs play Denver and Utah? I haven't seen them play a West contender yet.

[Ai2death]

Man i'm so happy we were able to keep a team under 100pts for a change :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol FVCK BRON and his BRAN STANS!!!!!
:rockon: :rockon: :rockon: :banana:

[Legends66NBA7]

Don't think anybody knows. No way Denver goes with this payroll going forward if there not winning. Not going to blow it up and move AA/Mozzy after a bad 10 games.

I'd have them on the block tho :lol

Would like to have at least Mozgov on the Raps. Maybe even both if possible. Raps needs more size and another wing to hit 3's and plays defense wouldn't hurt either.

Not sure who to send in the trade, though. Picks and perhaps expiring contracts/young talent ?

[Ai2death]

good game nuggets :cheers: Refs were the difference

Refs were the difference keeping you in it, Fvck u stan, fvck your god.
Den - 18 fouls
Cavs - 15 fouls

Here's the difference:
Points off Turnovers- Den: 26 - Cavs: 11

[kamil]

good game nuggets :cheers: Refs were the difference

:hammerhead:

[JimmyMcAdocious]

The worst commentator duo in the league in Cavs :facepalm

Nah, one of those Texas teams has a group with that annoying thick Texas accent and they are enormous homers. I think it was Houston or San Antonio. Clippers are pretty ****ing annoying, too.

But I can't stand Austin Carr's voice. I literally understand no more than 25% of what he says. And not in a good way like Bill Raftery. He sounds like he has a dick in his mouth.

[kurple]

Would like to have at least Mozgov on the Raps. Maybe even both if possible. Raps needs more size and another wing to hit 3's and plays defense wouldn't hurt either.

Not sure who to send in the trade, though. Picks and perhaps expiring contracts/young talent ?
raptors own the worse of denvers and NY's picks in '16

i would easily trade Mozgov and Chandler (fits the wing d3 request) for that pick, landry and camby or whatever expirings you have

[NugzFan]

So the Nuggets going to blow it up or what?


Hope so

[I<3NBA]

Cavs transition defense suck so bad. everytime the Nugs got a defensive rebound, they were raring to go as Cavs couldn't stop them in transition.

[Undisputed]

This Cavs teams is awful to watch. Not sure if Irving, Love, and LeBron will ever really work...then again people said the same thing in LeBrons first run with the Heat.

If anything, I doubt the Cavs win it all this season. Irving and Love need lessons in winning first.

[RedBlackAttack]

Impressive performance by Denver. They definitely came out with a fire under their @ss and the Cavs simply didn't match their intensity for 48 minutes. It felt like they were just waiting for the Nuggets to go away, but did nothing to facilitate it actually happening (especially defensively).

So, props to the Nuggets and their fans. The more prepared team won tonight.


It was really a poor time for the Cavs to lay an egg, because the schedule is about to get really tough. We've got San Antonio, Washington and Toronto still to play this week. If they come out like they did tonight, I wouldn't be surprised if they're back under .500 by the end of the week.

[L.Kizzle]

This Cavs teams is awful to watch. Not sure if Irving, Love, and LeBron will ever really work...then again people said the same thing in LeBrons first run with the Heat.

If anything, I doubt the Cavs win it all this season. Irving and Love needs lessons in winning first.
Difference is Bosh and Wade shit on Love and Irving.

[NugzFan]

Don't think anybody knows. No way Denver goes with this payroll going forward if there not winning. Not going to blow it up and move AA/Mozzy after a bad 10 games.

I'd have them on the block tho :lol

Same. Sell high

[DonDadda59]

Cavs transition defense suck so bad. everytime the Nugs got a defensive rebound, they were raring to go as Cavs couldn't stop them in transition.

The Cavs are terrible defensively in general, but especially against teams that play at a higher tempo. If you have quick guards and go at the Cavs D, you can score 100 with your eyes closed.

I'd be shocked if they got past the second round this season.

[RedBlackAttack]

The Cavs are terrible defensively in general, but especially against teams that play at a higher tempo. If you have quick guards and go at the Cavs D, you can score 100 with your eyes closed.

I'd be shocked if they got past the second round this season.
:oldlol:

You've been strangely absent from these game threads the previous four times. What gives? And, of course there's no time for chemistry to improve in a bunch of guys that literally just got together a couple months ago.

[NugzFan]

good game nuggets :cheers: Refs were the difference

Sarcasm?

[NugzFan]

Would like to have at least Mozgov on the Raps. Maybe even both if possible. Raps needs more size and another wing to hit 3's and plays defense wouldn't hurt either.

Not sure who to send in the trade, though. Picks and perhaps expiring contracts/young talent ?

Yes please

[Meticode]

The Cavs are terrible defensively in general, but especially against teams that play at a higher tempo. If you have quick guards and go at the Cavs D, you can score 100 with your eyes closed.

I'd be shocked if they got past the second round this season.
You don't post in these threads when they're winning, but you're certainly ready to chime in with your agendas when they lose some.

[DonDadda59]

:oldlol:

You've been strangely absent from these game threads the previous four times. What gives? And, of course there's no time for chemistry to improve in a bunch of guys that literally just got together a couple months ago.

Which threads? Cavs threads? I've been trolling Kobe stans lately, that's been my main focus. I occasionally drop into game threads from time to time. Pretty sure I had a couple of posts during the Celts game where Boston couldn't close out a 20 point lead.

But even in their win streak when they improved on offense, their defense was still horrible. They haven't made any improvement whatsoever in that department and I don't think they will. It got so bad tonight Blatt had them playing zone for a few possessions like it was AAU or something. :lol


You don't post in these threads when they're winning, but you're certainly ready to chime in with your agendas when they lose some.

What agenda is that exactly? The letting everyone know the Cavs are downright terrible defensively agenda? Anyone with eyes can see that. I've been saying they would be a joke defensively since before the preseason began.

[chazzy]

I've been trolling Kobe stans lately, that's been my main focus.
The sad life of MJ stans :(

[DonDadda59]

The sad life of MJ stans :(

1-9, 37% Chump. That is really sad. But there's still hope- Swaggy P returns tomorrow :bowdown:

[FatComputerNerd]

Good game by the Nuggets. They simply outplayed us.

I thought Dion looked good though, which is nice to see.

[SwishSquared]

Would like to have at least Mozgov on the Raps. Maybe even both if possible. Raps needs more size and another wing to hit 3's and plays defense wouldn't hurt either.

Not sure who to send in the trade, though. Picks and perhaps expiring contracts/young talent ?
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=oc27ppr

For a first and two 2nd rounders? Add in Ross? I kinda feel like Denver might wanna clear house if they want to do a full rebuild. Plus, they need to make some time for the young guys to develop. The upcoming draft likely won't be as deep as this past one, so they'd need a higher pick to get the best chance at a potential star.

[NuggetsFan]

You don't post in these threads when they're winning, but you're certainly ready to chime in with your agendas when they lose some.


How are the Cavs losing to this team? Their whole offense is Nate Robinson dribbling around and launching 3s. :biggums:

This is some other level shit defense.

Clearly looking to troll the Cavs from the get go. Only thing good about being a shitty team with no superstars is you don't get none of that :oldlol:

IMO Cavs just need time. Guys like Thompson/Waiters/Irving haven't won at the NBA level before. They need time to adjust and alter how they go about things. Irving is already doing so which was surprising to me this early. If come playoff time nobody has bought in defensively than there in trouble. You could tell when they were playing catchup they haven't gelled all that much just yet.

Easily the best the Nuggets have played this season regardless of opponent/defense. Shaw finally figured the rotations out somewhat & the players played a full 48. Lawson deff got up vs Irving. Pretty sure he's called out Irving out before because of the UNC/Duke thing. Tough game going up against a mess of a team who put it together tonight.

[RedBlackAttack]

Which threads? Cavs threads? I've been trolling Kobe stans lately, that's been my main focus. I occasionally drop into game threads from time to time. Pretty sure I had a couple of posts during the Celts game where Boston couldn't close out a 20 point lead.

But even in their win streak when they improved on offense, their defense was still horrible. They haven't made any improvement whatsoever in that department and I don't think they will. It got so bad tonight Blatt had them playing zone for a few possessions like it was AAU or something. :lol
Zone isn't exactly a foreign principle in the NBA. It has been used on some rather big stages in the past few years. In fact, the Celtics gave the Heat some problems with a zone back in the last few battles between the PP/KG Celtics and the Wade/LeBron Heat.

And, Blatt has never been afraid to switch to a zone, especially in the middle quarters, at other points in his career. It even worked for a stretch against the Nuggets tonight.

I don't think the zone was indicative of anything other than Blatt just trying to throw their rhythm off... which it did for a short time.

As for the Cavs' defense, I'm not sure how much improvement you were expecting in eight games, but it absolutely has improved from the first handful of games until now. That isn't to say that there aren't moments/games where they still struggle, but it's pretty obvious that the guys are starting to pick up on the nuances of the system... a brand new system to all of them, btw.

Again, I didn't laugh because there has been some incredible leap from Game 1 to Game 8. I laughed because of the definitive nature of the statement after just eight games.

[1987_Lakers]

Lawson just dropped 24 and 12. The same Lawson who Don said last night was a worse player than Jordan Hill.:oldlol:

[RedBlackAttack]

What agenda is that exactly?
I know trolling when I see it. You're trolling.

It's OK to be up front about it. We're both adults, here.

[navy]

Lawson just dropped 24 and 12. The same Lawson who Don said last night was a worse player than Jordan Hill.:oldlol:
He's gonna be mad when Kobe passes MJ in scoring. :oldlol:

[NuggetsFan]

Lawson just dropped 24 and 12. The same Lawson who Don said last night was a worse player than Jordan Hill.:oldlol:

Lawson is clearly getting caught up in his troll fest where he acts like Nate Robinson is our offense, and Lawson isn't a top 7-14 PG depending on the person.

[tpols]

Lawson just dropped 24 and 12. The same Lawson who Don said last night was a worse player than Jordan Hill.:oldlol:

The guys gonna get tangled up in his jordan stanning. :lol He also said Jeremy Lin is better than Reggie Jackson. Well see how that goes...

[DonDadda59]

Clearly looking to troll the Cavs from the get go.

What did I say that constitutes as trolling there? :confusedshrug:

For a big stretch of the game the Nuggets only offense was their PG (at that particular time Robinson) dribbling around aimlessly and launching 3s. No passes, no ball movement, literally just that... and the Cavs were down like 15 at that point and seemed helpless to stop it. Got to the point Bron was slamming the ball on the court out of frustration.

And time isn't going to make them better defensively. They are just inept in that department.


Lawson just dropped 24 and 12. The same Lawson who Don said last night was a worse player than Jordan Hill.

Didn't I just point out how awful the Cavs D is (last I check they were ranked 28th)? Naturally a bad defensive team will make a good player look better.


I know trolling when I see it. You're trolling.

It's OK to be up front about it. We're both adults, here.

So what if I dabble in trolling from time to time? Name a poster who's earned it more.


He's gonna be mad when Kobe passes MJ in scoring.

Kobe being the new Karl Malone really grinds my gears and to do it on 37% shooting...

:mad:

[Ai2death]

Lawson is clearly getting caught up in his troll fest where he acts like Nate Robinson is our offense, and Lawson isn't a top 7-14 PG depending on the person.

Man i like Lawson, but he has been taking some seriously questionable shots as of late, that one in the second i think it was when he had Lebron up top, dude pass that shit to the missmatch.

[El Gato Negro]

Good win for the nugs now trade us a center.

[bdreason]

Cavs are going to have to add some defenders to this roster. They won't win a title playing this level of defense.

[All Net]

What did I say that constitutes as trolling there? :confusedshrug:

For a big stretch of the game the Nuggets only offense was their PG (at that particular time Robinson) dribbling around aimlessly and launching 3s. No passes, no ball movement, literally just that... and the Cavs were down like 15 at that point and seemed helpless to stop it. Got to the point Bron was slamming the ball on the court out of frustration.

And time isn't going to make them better defensively. They are just inept in that department.



Didn't I just point out how awful the Cavs D is (last I check they were ranked 28th)? Naturally a bad defensive team will make a good player look better.



So what if I dabble in trolling from time to time? Name a poster who's earned it more.



Kobe being the new Karl Malone really grinds my gears and to do it on 37% shooting...

:mad:

Well most who troll here now get banned so I wouldn't make a habit of it.

[ArbitraryWater]

Well most who troll here now get banned so I wouldn't make a habit of it.

Can't ban the Don, though..

ImKobe is still running around loose

[All Net]

Can't ban the Don, though..

ImKobe is still running around loose
Would ban obama if he was on here trolling. .nobody is unbanable

[tontoz]

Good win for the nugs now trade us a center.


What happened to McGee? Wasn't he supposed to break out after he left the Wizards? :lol

[NugzFan]

What happened to McGee? Wasn't he supposed to break out after he left the Wizards? :lol

he was playing well until he broke his leg. :rolleyes:

I love trolls who wait until the time is right, then pounce and act all proud. in reality, anyone could do this to any team multiple times a year.

[tontoz]

he was playing well until he broke his leg. :rolleyes:

I love trolls who wait until the time is right, then pounce and act all proud. in reality, anyone could do this to any team multiple times a year.


LOL @ McGee playing well. He has started 10 games since he was traded to Denver. He can't even beat out nobodys like Mozgov and Koufus.

He did win the Shaqtin a Fool MVP in 2013. Gotta give him props for that.

:bowdown:

[NugzFan]

LOL @ McGee playing well. He has started 10 games since he was traded to Denver. He can't even beat out nobodys like Mozgov and Koufus.

He did win the Shaqtin a Fool MVP in 2013. Gotta give him props for that.

:bowdown:

he did play well before the injury. losing an entire season is tough on any player.

just go back to waiting until the next time you can cherry pick your trolling attempts.

[tontoz]

he did play well before the injury. losing an entire season is tough on any player.

just go back to waiting until the next time you can cherry pick your trolling attempts.


I don't need to cherry pick. Even before his injury he wasn't doing crap in Denver other than making Shaqtin a Fool highlights.

He was averaging 12/9 with 2.5 blocks when we traded him. Contrary to your idiotic posts he didn't become a different player when he went to the Nuggets. He was still a fool with no clue how to play D.

He has consistently had a terrible +/- ever since he was traded to Denver. Our defense went from bad to good the day he was traded.

[kurple]

mcgee was a massive presence of the bench in the 57 win season. he and andre miller was a great combo

only casual fans sees him only as the guy on shaqtin a fool. sure he makes some really headscratching misstakes, but he's an athletic freak and a real asset if used correctly (most likely off the bench)

and yeah, he's overpaid, but it was a chance worth taking and it doesnt mean he sucks

[tontoz]

mcgee was a massive presence of the bench in the 57 win season. he and andre miller was a great combo

only casual fans sees him only as the guy on shaqtin a fool. sure he makes some really headscratching misstakes, but he's an athletic freak and a real asset if used correctly (most likely off the bench)

and yeah, he's overpaid, but it was a chance worth taking and it doesnt mean he sucks


McGee's offense wasn't the reason why the Wizards got rid of him. Defensively he was horrible in spite of his blocks. That hasn't changed. That is why he hasn't gotten many minutes in Denver.

He only played 18 minutes per game in your 57 win season.

At the time of the trade that Nugz clown went on and on and on about how Mcgee would do so much better for a quality orginization. Sure

[kurple]

but he did better. while playing less minutes

and washington was a mess at that time. you cant deny that

[tontoz]

but he did better. while playing less minutes

and washington was a mess at that time. you cant deny that


How did he do better? The Nuggets were 5 ppg better with McGee on the bench. He showed a lot of offensive improvement in his last season with us but was still clueless on D.

McGee was a big reason why the Wizards were a mess. They have been a top 10 defensive team ever since he left.

The only difference between McGee in DC and Mcgee in Denver is that he now gets paid a lot more money for fewer minutes.

[NugzFan]

I don't need to cherry pick. Even before his injury he wasn't doing crap in Denver other than making Shaqtin a Fool highlights.

He was averaging 12/9 with 2.5 blocks when we traded him. Contrary to your idiotic posts he didn't become a different player when he went to the Nuggets. He was still a fool with no clue how to play D.

He has consistently had a terrible +/- ever since he was traded to Denver. Our defense went from bad to good the day he was traded.

You do cherry pick. Don't even pretend otherwise. It's the exact reason your trolling posts pop up whenever convenient.

The Shaqtin a fool means nothing. Most of it comes from his reputation from Washington ironically.

So keep trying to feel better about your team by obsessing on McGee. I'm sure the next time he makes a mistake you'll post again while ignoring anything wizard players do. And yes they do make them. Every team does.

[NugzFan]

McGee's offense wasn't the reason why the Wizards got rid of him. Defensively he was horrible in spite of his blocks. That hasn't changed. That is why he hasn't gotten many minutes in Denver.



That and a broken leg.



He only played 18 minutes per game in your 57 win season.

At the time of the trade that Nugz clown went on and on and on about how Mcgee would do so much better for a quality orginization. Sure

He did do better in Denver than Washington.

[tontoz]

That and a broken leg.



He did do better in Denver than Washington.


He played only 18 minutes per game for an entire season before he broke his leg. Why did he play so few minutes if he was playing so well?

Obsessing on McGee? i didn't even mention him for over a year. The only reason i brought it up today was seeing a Nuggets fan asking for a center LMAO.

You are just butthurt that all the BS you posted at the time of the trade proved to be just that, BS.

McGee made the same dumb mistakes in Denver that he did in DC, hence the Shaqtin a Fool MVP. He made the same dumb mistakes on D as well which is why Karl didn't want to play him much.

[NuggetsFan]

He played only 18 minutes per game for an entire season before he broke his leg. Why did he play so few minutes if he was playing so well?


Karl used him in bursts. He only played like 4 minutes less than Kosta. He actually ended up playing more minutes than him in the playoffs I believe. 9/5 with 2 blocks off the bench is nowhere near his paycheck and doesn't make him a All-Star but he was massive off the bench. Doubt he even gets back to that point. Karl had him making less mistakes and used him to swing momentum. Kinda like Birdman.

Your also forgetting to mention his asthma and Denver's altitude. It factored in for sure.

I'd say he played better on Denver regardless of less minutes/stats. He put up numbers on lottery teams that were a mess. Kinda like if he was putting up numbers now. His best play came against the Lakers that one playoff series, after that he was huge coming off the bench for a 57 win team. I'd rather that than what he did with Washington on those brutal teams that he played a huge part in.

McGee hasn't looked good in forever tho :oldlol:

[tontoz]

Karl used him in bursts. He only played like 4 minutes less than Kosta. He actually ended up playing more minutes than him in the playoffs I believe. 9/5 with 2 blocks off the bench is nowhere near his paycheck and doesn't make him a All-Star but he was massive off the bench. Doubt he even gets back to that point. Karl had him making less mistakes and used him to swing momentum. Kinda like Birdman.

Your also forgetting to mention his asthma and Denver's altitude. It factored in for sure.

I'd say he played better on Denver regardless of less minutes/stats. He put up numbers on lottery teams that were a mess. Kinda like if he was putting up numbers now. His best play came against the Lakers that one playoff series, after that he was huge coming off the bench for a 57 win team. I'd rather that than what he did with Washington on those brutal teams that he played a huge part in.

McGee hasn't looked good in forever tho :oldlol:


You guys knew he had asthma when you traded for him and then resigned him, which was another headscrather for me. Did you really pay $10+ million/yr knowing he would only play 20 minutes per game? Why would a team at altitude take a chance on a project like McGee that has asthma?

The guy you had starting in front of him, who you traded for peanuts, is making only $3 million/yr.

And let's not forget that the Nuggets played at the 2nd fastest pace in the league in 2013 which inflates their numbers.

He averaged 12/9 in his last year with the Wiz. Doubt he ever sees that again in his career. And the Wizards became a .500+ team the day he left. His turnstile defense was a big reason the Wizards were losers.

I remember one play where Witman (our coach) signaled goaltend before the opposing player even took the shot. He knew exactly what McGee was going to do.

[NuggetsFan]

You guys knew he had asthma when you traded for him and then resigned him, which was another headscrather for me. Did you really pay $10+ million/yr knowing he would only play 20 minutes per game? Why would a team at altitude take a chance on a project like McGee that has asthma?

The guy you had starting in front of him, who you traded for peanuts, is making only $3 million/yr.

And let's not forget that the Nuggets played at the 2nd fastest pace in the league in 2013 which inflates their numbers.

He averaged 12/9 in his last year with the Wiz. Doubt he ever sees that again in his career. And the Wizards became a .500+ team the day he left. His turnstile defense was a big reason the Wizards were losers.

I remember one play where Witman (our coach) signaled goaltend before the opposing player even took the shot. He knew exactly what McGee was going to do.

It was an awful contract. What are you trying to argue? Nobody denies it was a brutal contract :oldlol:

2nd fastest pace probably hurt McGee. He was winded alot and probably why he wasn't the full time starter. As a I said he played 4 minutes less than Kosta, and played more minutes in the playoffs. Karl always did shit like that. He wanted McGee with Dre coming off the bench.

McGee had a game winner that one game with Denver going after the basket. He had goaltends but he also had big plays and was huge for Denver at times. You can take 12/9 on brutal teams that had no chance at making the playoffs. I'll take 9/5 with 2 blocks on a 57 win team. Personal preference, I think lottery teams inflates numbers far more than pace.

What he did in the Lakers series was greater than anything he did in Washington. While he no doubt had some stinkers he was blocking everything and had games of 16/15 & 21/14. He shot 1-7 in game 7 but grabbed 14 rebounds and blocked 5 shots.

He went on to play a big role off the bench, started next season and had a season ending injury and now the entire Nuggets team is a mess. McGee looks like shit and I don't want him gone and it's easy to say now but that wasn't always the case. It's the NBA it happens.

[tontoz]

It was an awful contract. What are you trying to argue? Nobody denies it was a brutal contract :oldlol:

2nd fastest pace probably hurt McGee. He was winded alot and probably why he wasn't the full time starter. As a I said he played 4 minutes less than Kosta, and played more minutes in the playoffs. Karl always did shit like that. He wanted McGee with Dre coming off the bench.

McGee had a game winner that one game with Denver going after the basket. He had goaltends but he also had big plays and was huge for Denver at times. You can take 12/9 on brutal teams that had no chance at making the playoffs. I'll take 9/5 with 2 blocks on a 57 win team. Personal preference, I think lottery teams inflates numbers far more than pace.

What he did in the Lakers series was greater than anything he did in Washington. While he no doubt had some stinkers he was blocking everything and had games of 16/15 & 21/14. He shot 1-7 in game 7 but grabbed 14 rebounds and blocked 5 shots.

He went on to play a big role off the bench, started next season and had a season ending injury and now the entire Nuggets team is a mess. McGee looks like shit and I don't want him gone and it's easy to say now but that wasn't always the case. It's the NBA it happens.


McGee has had an awful +/- with Denver each season, including the season he was traded. His defensive awareness is horrible. I am sure that is why Karl refused to start him and that is why Wizards fans dont miss him.

There were people acting like McGee would suddenly break out after getting out of DC. Instead he has been a limited minute backup playing behind nobodies.

[NuggetsFan]

McGee has had an awful +/- with Denver each season, including the season he was traded. His defensive awareness is horrible. I am sure that is why Karl refused to start him and that is why Wizards fans dont miss him.

There were people acting like McGee would suddenly break out after getting out of DC. Instead he has been a limited minute backup playing behind nobodies.

Now your just changing your argument. McGee improved was the only thing I was saying. 12/9 on lottery teams is useless. He got minutes/opportunity in Washington he wasn't going to realistic get on teams that were competitive.

Karl didn't "refuse" to start him. Stop making things up. Karl is well known for "it's not who starts but who finishes games". It was well known Karl loved Miller/McGee paired up and Miller was never going to start. Brewer also came off the bench and McGee fit into what the 2nd unit was doing. Karl also loved to go small which obviously McGee never fit into.

McGee averaged 20 minutes to Mozzy/Kosta's 16/15 in his first 20 Nuggets games. Started less games than both. Kosta played 22 min the next season and McGee played 18. McGee played 26 minutes against the Lakers in the playoffs, far more than any other C. He played more minutes than Kosta against the Warriors and started a few games as well. So this whole he couldn't even start is pretty laughable. Next season he was done for the year, and this year the Nuggets are a mess.

+/- is useless in basketball too. Which is why it's not a statistic that's used heavily. It's a game of runs and units that are constantly changed. Different substitution patterns and especially with a team like Denver who was constantly running and scorers were up and down. I seen first hand against the Lakers McGee have a massive positive impact. Not saying it's completely irrelevant because McGee does have brutal defensive positioning and while he did improve he was making mistakes still. Just that it's not the entire story and McGee did play a large part in those 57 wins considering how are bench was one of if not the best in the entire league. +/- doesn't change that.

That to me better than what he did with the Wizards. After what he did against L.A of course people expected him to break out. He's 7 feet tall with the mobility of a guard and freakish athletic tools. His game wasn't completely raw either. His basketball IQ is among the lowest in the league. Nobody ever disputed that. People are wrong, it happens. Injuries/coaching changes etc. certainly haven't helped. With Mozzy/Nurkic McGee is far better off getting moved, for both sides.

[tontoz]

Now your just changing your argument. McGee improved was the only thing I was saying. 12/9 on lottery teams is useless. He got minutes/opportunity in Washington he wasn't going to realistic get on teams that were competitive.



The Nuggets are a lottery team now and were last year too. Does that mean Faried's numbers are useless?

If the numbers are useless then how can you say McGee improved? :rolleyes: I guess the numbers only matter when you want them to.


+/- is useless in basketball too. Which is why it's not a statistic that's used heavily. It's a game of runs and units that are constantly changed. Different substitution patterns and especially with a team like Denver who was constantly running and scorers were up and down.

So the units were constantly changing yet McGee has consistently had a very negative +/-, including the 57 win season. That is what cops refer to as a clue.

Chandler came off the bench that year and was +5.

Nobody playing significant minutes had as bad a +/- as McGee. That was true the year he was traded as well. It was also true with the Wizards when he was a starter. Again, a clue.


And yes it is used a lot in large sample sizes. Feel free to point out a good player who has a badly negative +/- over an extended period.

[kurple]

i dont get your point, do you have one?

[tontoz]

i dont get your point, do you have one?

It doesnt surprise me that you don't get it. Seems to be a common theme with Nuggets fans.

Again people like Nugzfan were saying that all McGee needed was to get out of DC and he would break out. He went on and on and on about how Mcgee's problems were just because he was with the Wizards, that a quality organization would allow him to be an impact player.

That was nonsense. In fact the opposit is true. He hasn't done crap in Denver and it was the Wizards that improved significantly the day he left.

Nuggets fans didn't get it then and still don't.

[NuggetsFan]

The Nuggets are a lottery team now and were last year too. Does that mean Faried's numbers are useless?


Yeah. Faried wasn't putting up 16/10 or whatever it was he was averaging the second half of last year on a playoff team. Context clearly needs to be used as well. Nuggets were derailed by injuries and with Lawson were a .500 ball club. Wizards were consistently a mess and McGee didn't even make the playoffs with that team. If the Nuggets become a consistent lotto team and Lawson averaged 22 points than yeah that's inflated.

Lottery teams inflate numbers more than anything. Everybody puts up better numbers on shittier teams. Teams play you less hard, more minutes, more opportunity. Rosters are less deep and talented so the players who do have talent are relied on heavier. It's pretty much common knowledge. Duncan/Manu/Parker split up last year and placed on a team like Philly have better stats :confusedshrug:


If the numbers are useless then how can you say McGee improved? :rolleyes: I guess the numbers only matter when you want them to.

Shouldn't have used "useless" more like in comparison to his Denver stats. He put up 9/5. So like 3 less points, and 4 less rebounds. On a team that won 57 games and he was a huge part of there 2nd unit which was considered by pretty much everyone as top 3. Of course his stats weren't going to look as good on a team with more talent/depth. He also played in the playoffs twice. Including some massive games against L.A. Take that over garbage time numbers in Washington.


So the units were constantly changing yet McGee has consistently had a very negative +/-, including the 57 win season. That is what cops refer to as a clue.


Strange a person can have such a negative impact on what was statistically one of the better benches. Guess everybody was doing that despite McGee. No disputing the role he played in that 2nd unit.


Chandler came off the bench that year and was +5.


Also played 7 more minutes. How can you ignore that? Those 7 more minutes means more time with the 1st unit and guys like Lawson. He was also used in different lineups like when Karl went small. Which is why +/- has never gained popularity in a era where people love advanced statistics.


Nobody playing significant minutes had as bad a +/- as McGee. That was true the year he was traded as well. It was also true with the Wizards when he was a starter. Again, a clue.


It's without a doubt telling. He still made mistakes, and had mental lapses. Everything needs to considered and your leaving out how Denver had an elite bench. McGee was a massive part of that bench. That tells me despite the +/- stats he never held them back.


And yes it is used a lot in large sample sizes. Feel free to point out a good player who has a badly negative +/- over an extended period.


Not really. I don't know because it's never pointed out and it's never something I've tracked. Your one of the few who use it with McGee because I mean there's so much else you can look at both positive and negative.

McGee's been better in Denver than in Washington. Only point I made. Also informing you about the minutes/starting which you obviously weren't completely aware of because you've never really responded to that or used that argument again. He has a terrible contract, Denver's a mess, and never broke out like he could have. So not really sure what the argument really is at this point.

[NuggetsFan]

It doesnt surprise me that you don't get it. Seems to be a common theme with Nuggets fans.


Yeah. All 6 of us on this site. You only ever pop up about McGee, because your a Wizards fan :oldlol:


Again people like Nugzfan were saying that all McGee needed was to get out of DC and he would break out. He went on and on and on about how Mcgee's problems were just because he was with the Wizards, that a quality organization would allow him to be an impact player.


He was significantly less stupid. Played on a 57 win team. Made the playoffs twice. Nuggets helped cover up his mistakes with a better team and used him better. Nights when he was a mess he got less minutes, when he was on he was relied on more. Your +/- stats prove this point. Everything was "terrible" yet the Nuggets had a top 3 bench which he played a role in.


That was nonsense. In fact the opposit is true. He hasn't done crap in Denver and it was the Wizards that improved significantly the day he left.


Of course the Wizards improved. McGee was very much part of there problems. Probably why they made the trade. Split the knuckleheads up, makes perfect sense. Nuggets were in a position to take on a knuckle head and use it to there advantage, which they did. Check the L.A playoff series :oldlol:

[tontoz]

I'll tell you what inflates numbers, playing against bench players as opposed to starters. You do realize starters are generally better, right? And guys can look for their shot more often when the starters are on the bench.

McGee's negative defensive impact can be seen very clearly in the games before and after the trade:

-Before the trade the Wizards gave up 100 points or more in 12 of 13 games. In the other game they gave up 98.

-After the trade the Wizards gave up 100 points only once in their next 11 games. in that one game they gave up only 102.

I have never seen a defensive turnaround like that and it shows very clearly that McGee's negative +/- is not a fluke.

http://espn.go.com/nba/team/schedule/_/name/wsh/year/2012/washington-wizards

[NuggetsFan]

I'll tell you what inflates numbers, playing against bench players as opposed to starters. You do realize starters are generally better, right? And guys can look for their shot more often when the starters are on the bench.


Yeah except starters are subbed out in different patterns. It's not always 5 bench players vs 5 bench players, atleast not for extended periods of times. There was times McGee faced the starters. He played Pau/Bynum alot in the playoffs, which is why he got so much hype. It factors in tho I agree. I think the shitty team inflates numbers more tho. McGee had less rebounds/points because he played with better scorers/rebounders in Denver.

But than you agree with me right? You have a habit of just forgetting about some of the stuff you say when I respond to it. Players put up better numbers on lottery teams for the most part, correct?


McGee's negative defensive impact can be seen very clearly in the games before and after the trade:


Sure as a I said Washington was filled with dummies. McGee was one of them so getting rid of them had a positive effect. Just like Denver's elite bench and McGee's role in that could be seen very clearly.


Before the trade the Wizards gave up 100 points or more in 12 of 13 games. In the other game they gave up 98.

-After the trade the Wizards gave up 100 points only once in their next 11 games. in that one game they gave up only 102.

I have never seen a defensive turnaround like that and it shows very clearly that McGee's negative +/- is not a fluke.

http://espn.go.com/nba/team/schedule/_/name/wsh/year/2012/washington-wizards

Wizards also got rid of Nick Young. I'm not familiar of there minute situation and what happened post McGee trade so unlike you I won't just say random shit for the sake of saying it.

I'm sure the +/- wasn't a fluke with the Wiz if you say so. You continually ignore McGee's role in what was a top 3 statistical bench both by the numbers and most people's opinion. The bench was massive in Denver's success, more so than most teams without legit "stars". McGee played a big part in that but that's a fluke because of +/-? Seems kinda strange you want me to ignore something completely, while acknowledging what your saying when your doing the exact same thing to me. McGee still made mistakes and had a negative impact at times, also had a really positive impact at times that made Denver's bench that much better :confusedshrug: I'll take that over 3 more points, 4 more rebounds on a mess of a team.

Once again not sure your point. McGee's contract is bad. He's a knucklehead who had a negative impact in Washington. Still a knucklehead but was used more efficiently in Denver and had some success with them for 2 years. He got hurt and now Denver's a mess. Yet to be seen how the rest plays out, we could be looking at being Washington a few years back.

[tontoz]

Typically players get more touches on bad teams. When they move to better teams they don't get as many touches. See Bosh to Miami, Allen/KG to Boston, etc.

But that is not the case here. McGee got more opportunities with Denver. His usage rate was higher with Denver than it ever was with the Wizards, which is probably the result of playing off the bench. Playing with Miller probably led to more touches as well.

Nick was a good man defender. He consistently held his man under their averages. He used to give Wade all he could handle. But when it came to team D he had issues with rotations and other teams could exploit that. It seemed like that was happening more in his last season.

But when it comes to team defense the center spot is far more important than a wing. The center is the last line of defense before the rim.

It just irritates me that the Wizards get blamed for McGee's issues. He had ADD long before he came to the Wizards:

"I just didn't want to take [Ritalin]," McGee said. "I was young (when it was diagnosed); it was a long time ago. But, yeah, it's definitely fun having ADD. It's extremely fun. I'm not boring."

"I didn't know you had ADD," Kenneth Faried told McGee. "I knew something was wrong with you, but I didn't know it was that."

Karl called him "lazy and crazy".

http://www.thepostgame.com/blog/dish/201303/nbaers-bizarre-reason-not-taking-medication