Would prime MJ get this Laker team into the post-season?

[BigBoss]

:confusedshrug:

[russwest0]

yes.

[fpliii]

Obviously not. This is a sub-20 win team right now. Jordan isn't worth 30 wins on his own (and it's going to take 50ish to make the playoffs), nobody is. Not even the GOAT two-way centers.

Silly thread.

[navy]

Hmmm....Nah. Lakers are terrible inside. Only so much a perimeter player can do.

[Kvnzhangyay]

no lol

the team has crap team/help defense, and one player swap won't change much

along with fact that team doesnt have much depth

[jstern]

Under the current rules. Yes.

[Shih508]

Prime MJ would will any team into playoff!

[ThatCoolKid]

I'd say if you gave him 14 chances, he'd probably get them there at least once.

[ThatCoolKid]

Obviously not. This is a sub-20 win team right now. Jordan isn't worth 30 wins on his own (and it's going to take 50ish to make the playoffs), nobody is. Not even the GOAT two-way centers.

Silly thread.

Cavs 2009-10: 61-21
2010-2011: 19-63

[PsychoBe]

Cavs 2009-10: 61-21
2010-2011: 19-63

because they only lost one player? :facepalm

[chazzy]

MJ's elite D at the SG position isn't enough to fix this team's defense. It's historically bad and this conference is tough as hell, needing 48+ wins to make it.

[j3lademaster]

Maybe in the east.

[fpliii]

Cavs 2009-10: 61-21
2010-2011: 19-63
That was a team built around a star with a ton of role players. The star wasn't replaced by anyone serviceable.

Also, the guys getting minutes on average were much worse the next season.

09-10 Cavs
LeBron James 2966
Mo Williams 2359
Anthony Parker 2289
Anderson Varejao 2166
J.J. Hickson 1691
Delonte West 1500
Zydrunas Ilgauskas 1339
Shaquille O'Neal 1240
Daniel Gibson 1068
Jamario Moon 1052
Antawn Jamison 811
Jawad Williams 742
Leon Powe 236
Danny Green 115
Darnell Jackson 114
Sebastian Telfair 77
Cedric Jackson 10
Coby Karl 5

10-11 Cavs
J.J. Hickson 2256
Ramon Sessions 2133
Anthony Parker 2091
Daniel Gibson 1865
Antawn Jamison 1842
Ryan Hollins 1182
Mo Williams 1065
Anderson Varejao 994
Alonzo Gee 973
Christian Eyenga 947
Manny Harris 933
Jamario Moon 764
Samardo Samuels 701
Joey Graham 586
Luke Harangody 399
Jawad Williams 391
Baron Davis 380
Leon Powe 187
Semih Erden 64

Not that it wasn't a terrific carry job. Clearly was.

[sbw19]

With this current roster? I'd say that's a tall order, even if you include post-achilles Kobe and slide him to the 3.

A freak center like prime Shaq could do more than perimeter guards. He clogs the lane and works well with rebounders and spot-up shooters, provides scoring punch inside and (more importantly) constantly draws fouls and double-teams.

[LAZERUSS]

Well, MJ took his 86-87 team into the first round, where they were swept. And that team had more surrounding talent than this Laker squad has.

[ThatCoolKid]

At PsychoBe and fpliii:

I think Lebron was worth at least 30 of those 42 wins the team lost:confusedshrug:

[Collie]

MJ won 50 games and made the second round with a team that had Brad Sellers, Dave Corzine, Sam Vincent and Rory Sparrow as starters, so I say he could probably drag it to a low seed.

[bdreason]

In the West?

Nope.

[deja vu]

Well, if they're in the East they could make the playoffs with a 35-47 record or something.

This team is terrible, not even a prime Shaq could carry them to the West playoffs.

[Micku]

Well, if they're in the East they could make the playoffs with a 35-47 record or something.

This team is terrible, not even a prime Shaq could carry them to the West playoffs.

I could see a prime Shaq getting this team to the Suns or Kings record at this point. Shaq would give you 30/11, with paint protection. This is something that the Lakers need more of. And he will cause their frontline to get in foul trouble, which will help out his team.

With prime Jordan I could see a similar thing on the perimeter side. The offense will be better. I could see MJ winning some of those clutch situations that Kobe missed out on this year. MJ also played better defense. His help defense would be more key here. So, I could see them winning more. Maybe struggling for the .500 mark?

[Mr. Jabbar]

Google image lakers 2014-15 roster and try to say yes with a straight face, I couldnt

[ThatCoolKid]

The wild card in Lin. I think MJ's leadership abilities would get Lin back to his vintage Linsanity style of play (25/10 kind of guy). Coupled with MJ's own 40/10/10 on good percentages from playing in this weak era, the Lakers would probably have home court advantage, and be a dark horse candidate for the championship.

[Kvnzhangyay]

The wild card in Lin. I think MJ's leadership abilities would get Lin back to his vintage Linsanity style of play (25/10 kind of guy). Coupled with MJ's own 40/10/10 on good percentages from playing in this weak era, the Lakers would probably have home court advantage, and be a dark horse candidate for the championship.

L O L

[3ball]

Well, MJ took his 86-87 team into the first round, where they were swept.

And that team had more surrounding talent than this Laker squad has.


they did?

please explain.

[No_Look604]

Maybe in the east.

Maybe? The Lakers right now with this shiddy team and old man Kobe would make the playoffs in the east THIS YEAR. Down right "horrawful" conference.

[3ball]

.
2014 Lakers vs. 1987 Bulls:


Carlos Boozer, Jordan Hill, Nick Young, Jeremy Lin, Wesley Johnson

Charles Oakley, Dave Corzine, John Paxson, Gene Banks, Earl Cureton


Lakers are better by a mile... There's actual physical talent there - Jordan would be able get something out of those Lakers.

truthfully, today's players do a bad job of terrorizing and really attacking the today's spaced-out defenses... Westbrook is the only guy that really takes full advantage, and Jordan's, power, volume and efficiency would be a lot greater than Westbrook's - like, he'd be dunking at least 3 times as often for example (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352399), just to give you an idea.

[Random_Guy]

no, but give this lakers team peak shaq then yes.
peak shaq/current kobe is good enough even in the wild west.
despite all the criticism lets not act like current kobe is not a great player, he would be even better if he had shaq in the paint

[andgar923]

For starters, he wouldn't be shooting under 40%

But more importantly he'd be a huge improvement defensively (by miles).

Without a doubt they make the post season.

[VeeCee15]

For sure yes.

MJ is a better leader and his teammates would play better for him.

Current lakers are BETTER with Kobe OFF the FLOOR.

[tamaraw08]

Cavs 2009-10: 61-21
2010-2011: 19-63

I'll take prime, Delonte West, Verajao, Jamison, Mo Williams, Z, etc over washed up Booze, Lin etc.
Pls most teams the Lakers faced are much tougher than the Cavs played iMO.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

That was a team built around a star with a ton of role players. The star wasn't replaced by anyone serviceable.

Also, the guys getting minutes on average were much worse the next season.

09-10 Cavs
LeBron James 2966
Mo Williams 2359
Anthony Parker 2289
Anderson Varejao 2166
J.J. Hickson 1691
Delonte West 1500
Zydrunas Ilgauskas 1339
Shaquille O'Neal 1240
Daniel Gibson 1068
Jamario Moon 1052
Antawn Jamison 811
Jawad Williams 742
Leon Powe 236
Danny Green 115
Darnell Jackson 114
Sebastian Telfair 77
Cedric Jackson 10
Coby Karl 5

10-11 Cavs
J.J. Hickson 2256
Ramon Sessions 2133
Anthony Parker 2091
Daniel Gibson 1865
Antawn Jamison 1842
Ryan Hollins 1182
Mo Williams 1065
Anderson Varejao 994
Alonzo Gee 973
Christian Eyenga 947
Manny Harris 933
Jamario Moon 764
Samardo Samuels 701
Joey Graham 586
Luke Harangody 399
Jawad Williams 391
Baron Davis 380
Leon Powe 187
Semih Erden 64

Not that it wasn't a terrific carry job. Clearly was.

LeBron in 08-09 is the greatest regular season carry-job in NBA history. 09-10 is a close second.

[3ball]

LeBron in 08-09 is the greatest regular season carry-job in NBA history. 09-10 is a close second.
just look at lebron's 2009 and 2010 rosters - i see 10 very solid players on those Cavs teams... let's not be history revisionists - those teams were very deep.

but as usual lebron underachieved against Dwight's Magic who he was favored against... that's the 4th time in his career that he had a team that was favored, but he lost.

if he was really a top 10 all-time player, this wouldn't happen that many times.

and it's 5 times if you include him losing as the favorite in high school.

[La Frescobaldi]

Jordan would be playing to win, not pass somebody on the all-time scoring list.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

just look at lebron's 2009 and 2010 rosters - i see 10 very solid players on those Cavs teams... let's not be history revisionists - those teams were very deep.

but as usual lebron underachieved against Dwight's Magic who he was favored against... that's the 4th time in his career that he had a team that was favored, but he lost.

if he was really a top 10 all-time player, this wouldn't happen that many times.

and it's 5 times if you include him losing as the favorite in high school.
I see anderson varejao as the second best player on both rosters.

[La Frescobaldi]

I see anderson varejao as the second best player on both rosters.
when he played 30 games that second year

[Bless Mathews]

Dave corzine.


MJ made the playoffs with Dave corzine.


A 6'11" with a 4 inch vertical.

Yea. He would take this team to playoffs.

He would get the most out of his teammates.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

when he played 30 games that second year
I was referring to the 09-10 and 08-09 rosters.

[La Frescobaldi]

I was referring to the 09-10 and 08-09 rosters.
Oh I see ya different story

[imnew09]

If Jordan can guard C, Power Foward and PG position, at the same time

[3ball]

I see anderson varejao as the second best player on both rosters.
you see wrongly because Mo Williams was a 17.8ppg scorer and an All-Star, while Antawn Jamison averaged 16ppg.

You can't put Varejao's 8 ppg and 8 rebs over either.

Can't even put Varejao over Shaq, who was still playing 23 minutes and giving you 12 ppg, 7 rebounds, and 1.2 blocks on 57% TS.

Or Zydrunas for that matter, who was getting 13 and 8 and was a go-to post player..

Again, a very deep team.. Delonte might have also been better than Varejao (athletic two-way player with a 3-point shot, 12 ppg).

[La Frescobaldi]

you see wrongly because Mo Williams was a 17.8ppg scorer and an All-Star, while Antawn Jamison averaged 16ppg.

You can't put Varejao's 8 ppg and 8 rebs over either.

Can't even put Varejao over Shaq, who was still playing 23 minutes and giving you 12 ppg, 7 rebounds, and 1.2 blocks on 57% TS.

Or Zydrunas for that matter, who was getting 13 and 8 and was a go-to post player..

Again, a very deep team.. Delonte might have also been better than Varejao (athletic two-way player with a 3-point shot, 12 ppg).

I was letting the guy live the illusion. Off night.

[JellyBean]

Heck no. The only twist would be, the media would be throwing he team under the bus rather Jordan. The media would give Jordan a free pass on taking a lot of shots and not passing. Because we all know how much of a competitor Jordan was. The media would spin the angle that Jordan wants to win so badly that he has to shoot for the Lakers to have any chance of winning. He is left with a D- League roster, the media would say. Hmmm. But the Lakers would not make the playoffs with this current roster and Jordan leading the way.

[AirFederer]

Only if Kobe doesn't play. :lol

[yarrak]

just look at lebron's 2009 and 2010 rosters - i see 10 very solid players on those Cavs teams... let's not be history revisionists - those teams were very deep.

but as usual lebron underachieved against Dwight's Magic who he was favored against... that's the 4th time in his career that he had a team that was favored, but he lost.

if he was really a top 10 all-time player, this wouldn't happen that many times.

and it's 5 times if you include him losing as the favorite in high school.

How stupid are you dawg? Since when dropping 38/8/8 in the ECF against the BEST DEFENSIVE TEAM is underachieving?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3o4JDxQ0IE8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqJOf9v2e_s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70AUcQ3PzQ4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPT6QxoxEZg

This is considered underachieving now?

[ImKobe]

Well, MJ took his 86-87 team into the first round, where they were swept. And that team had more surrounding talent than this Laker squad has.

But was the EC in 86-87 as deep as this year's WC? I wouldn't say so.

86-87 Bulls had a below .500 record and made the Playoffs, you'd need at least 48-50 wins to make the Playoffs in the current Western Conference.

[I<3NBA]

they'd make the 8th seed in the west, and lose in the first round.

[3ball]

How stupid are you dawg? Since when dropping 38/8/8 in the ECF against the BEST DEFENSIVE TEAM is underachieving?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3o4JDxQ0IE8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqJOf9v2e_s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70AUcQ3PzQ4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPT6QxoxEZg

This is considered underachieving now?
it's like Iverson, who averaged 38ppg in the 2001 Finals, only Lebron had better teammates than Iverson did, and Lebron was going up against Dwight Howard, not Shaquille O'Neal/Kobe Bryant, so yeah, Lebron's style of play causes his teams to underachieve, which is why he has lost as the favorite so many times.

it's an Allen Iverson-type achievement, ultimately, stat-padding - all stars do that when they are young... and again, Lebron lost as the favorite, while Allen was the big underdog.

lebron has lost as the favorite 4 times in his NBA career, and once in high school... wait, lebron lost as the favorite in the olympics too.. and the world games too?..

either way, that's at least 6 times lebron has lost as the favorite: 4 times in the NBA, once in high school, and once in the Olympics... that's the only 6 for 6 he's going to get.. :lol

[LAZERUSS]

.
2014 Lakers vs. 1987 Bulls:


Carlos Boozer, Jordan Hill, Nick Young, Jeremy Lin, Wesley Johnson

Charles Oakley, Dave Corzine, John Paxson, Gene Banks, Earl Cureton


Lakers are better by a mile... There's actual physical talent there - Jordan would be able get something out of those Lakers.

truthfully, today's players do a bad job of terrorizing and really attacking the today's spaced-out defenses... Westbrook is the only guy that really takes full advantage, and Jordan's, power, volume and efficiency would be a lot greater than Westbrook's - like, he'd be dunking at least 3 times as often for example (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=352399), just to give you an idea.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Oakley led the NBA in rebounding and was a considerably better player than anyone on this current Laker team. The rest of the rosters slightly favor the Bulls as well.

Paxson was better than Lin. After that it is a wash.

I won't argue with those that would claim that a PRIME MJ would improve this Laker team. But I would also claim that a PRIME Kobe would, as well.

Look at Kobe's '06 roster.

Aside from a serviceable Lamar Odom, that roster was about as bad as it gets. Smush Parker, Kwame Brown, Devean Goerge, Chris Mihm, et. al. And some how Kobe managed to get THAT roster to a 45-37 record. Not only that, but they nearly upset a more talented Suns team in the first round.

[finchyyy]

No way.

[ImKobe]

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Oakley led the NBA in rebounding and was a considerably better player than anyone on this current Laker team. The rest of the rosters slightly favor the Bulls as well.

Paxson was better than Lin. After that it is a wash.

I won't argue with those that would claim that a PRIME MJ would improve this Laker team. But I would also claim that a PRIME Kobe would, as well.

Look at Kobe's '06 roster.

Aside from a serviceable Lamar Odom, that roster was about as bad as it gets. Smush Parker, Kwame Brown, Devean Goerge, Chris Mihm, et. al. And some how Kobe managed to get THAT roster to a 45-37 record. Not only that, but they nearly upset a more talented Suns team in the first round.

You're also forgetting Doug Collins, who shits on Byron Scott as a coach. Jordan only won 40 games with that roster.

He's not going to add 40 wins (if you put him in place of Kobe) to the current Lakers roster to make the Playoffs.

[francesco totti]

yes, but i think with prime kobe they be close as well.
I don't think anyone believes kobe is playing in his prime now.

[L.A. Jazz]

We can look at 06 and 07 and say yes, there is a chance. if Kobe in his prime could do it with a slightly better team, MJ as the all around better player has a chance. But the West is tough this year. No chance for umcoming stars like Boogie and Brow.

[Hey Yo]

Google image lakers 2014-15 roster and try to say yes with a straight face, I couldnt
Go back to page 1 and look at the Cavs 09-10 roster. Do you know still think he should have stayed in Cleveland with those "upcoming future stars" like all the MJ and Kobe stans were saying?

[swagga]

you see wrongly because Mo Williams was a 17.8ppg scorer and an All-Star, while Antawn Jamison averaged 16ppg.
he sure showed that in the playoffs
You can't put Varejao's 8 ppg and 8 rebs over either.
Can't even put Varejao over Shaq, who was still playing 23 minutes and giving you 12 ppg, 7 rebounds, and 1.2 blocks on 57% TS.

Or Zydrunas for that matter, who was getting 13 and 8 and was a go-to post player..

Again, a very deep team.. Delonte might have also been better than Varejao (athletic two-way player with a 3-point shot, 12 ppg).

whose troll are you? you should add more variation in your posts, you are informed but don't know how to sell it tbh. Like saying how jordan would have willed mo williams into a strong competitor instead of a PO chocker. Or that lebron was the only one out of wade/bron/kobe that couldn't ring with shaq. Or that jordan never lost with the best record in the NBA. Variation is key.

[aj1987]

it's like Iverson, who averaged 38ppg in the 2001 Finals
I really don't know why I even bother replying to your delusional ass anymore. Anyways, AI averaged 36/6/4 on 49% and LeBron averaged 39/8/8 on 59%. LeBron did it against the #1 defensive team with the DPOY and AI did it against the #21 defensive team. Not even close, kid.

[3ball]

I really don't know why I even bother replying to your delusional ass anymore. Anyways, AI averaged 36/6/4 on 49% and LeBron averaged 39/8/8 on 59%. LeBron did it against the #1 defensive team with the DPOY and AI did it against the #21 defensive team. Not even close, kid.
ur right - dwight howard's magic are not remotely close to being as good a team as Shaq and Kobe's Lakers.

and again, Lebron has lost as the favorite 6 times in his career: high school, Olympics, and 4 times in the NBA - you are avoiding this, but it kills lebron's career and his chances to be top 10 all-time.

[Quizno]

For starters, he wouldn't be shooting under 40%

But more importantly he'd be a huge improvement defensively (by miles).

Without a doubt they make the post season.
lmao you are such a biased dumbass

[aj1987]

ur right - dwight howard's magic are not remotely close to being as good a team as Shaq and Kobe's Lakers.
Defense, you idiot.


and again, Lebron has lost as the favorite 6 times in his career: high school, Olympics, and 4 times in the NBA - you are avoiding this, but it kills lebron's career and his chances to be top 10 all-time.
I didn't know that NBA was a 1 on 1 sport.

[STATUTORY]

prime MJ would be playing baseball

[BigBoss]

prime MJ would be playing baseball

Prime MJ retired to study high school Kobes moves

[NBASTATMAN]

Obviously not. This is a sub-20 win team right now. Jordan isn't worth 30 wins on his own (and it's going to take 50ish to make the playoffs), nobody is. Not even the GOAT two-way centers.

Silly thread.


BULLSHIT, Pau led a much worse team to 27 wins last year.. This is a much more talented team than last years.. I don't believe its kobe's fault though... Byron Scott has not shown he is even as good as MIKE D ANTONI... And therefor The Lakers are in this situation.. How can a team with kobe , lin, boozer, young , and hill be this BAD... This team is talented enough to win 30-40 games. Scott sucks big time...:rockon:

[riseagainst]

Cavs 2009-10: 61-21
2010-2011: 19-63

whose alt is this?

:roll:

[RoundMoundOfReb]

you see wrongly because Mo Williams was a 17.8ppg scorer and an All-Star, while Antawn Jamison averaged 16ppg.

You can't put Varejao's 8 ppg and 8 rebs over either.

Can't even put Varejao over Shaq, who was still playing 23 minutes and giving you 12 ppg, 7 rebounds, and 1.2 blocks on 57% TS.

Or Zydrunas for that matter, who was getting 13 and 8 and was a go-to post player..

Again, a very deep team.. Delonte might have also been better than Varejao (athletic two-way player with a 3-point shot, 12 ppg).

I would 100% legitimately take Varejao over any non LeBron player on those teams.

BTW these "extremely deep" teams with LeBron on the bench:

08-09:
On: +15.0
Off: -6.2

09-10:
On: +11.5
Off: -5.3

[scm5]

I would 100% legitimately take Varejao over any non LeBron player on those teams.

BTW these "extremely deep" teams with LeBron on the bench:

08-09:
On: +15.0
Off: -6.2

09-10:
On: +11.5
Off: -5.3

http://www.82games.com/0809/0809CLE.HTM

http://www.82games.com/0910/0910CLE.HTM

It's true, those teams weren't that deep but the starters played really well together and were much more productive than the bench. It wasn't just Lebron though.

[ImKobe]

http://www.82games.com/0809/0809CLE.HTM

http://www.82games.com/0910/0910CLE.HTM

It's true, those teams weren't that deep but the starters played really well together and were much more productive than the bench. It wasn't just Lebron though.

Still remember when Boobie Gibson got them to the Finals :applause:

[Soundwave]

In the East yes, but in this year's West .... man that's a tall order. Not sure if any player in NBA history could do it with this group.

Though I think Jeremy Lin isn't as bad as he's showing right now.

If Nick Young and Lin could increase their scoring into the 15 ppg range and Jordan improves their perimeter D considerably ... maybe. Still very tough.

[SamuraiSWISH]

As GM? No.
In his prime form? '88 to '93 ... umm yea.
But honestly so could 2003, 2006 to 2008 Kobe.

[RoundMoundOfReb]

http://www.82games.com/0809/0809CLE.HTM

http://www.82games.com/0910/0910CLE.HTM

It's true, those teams weren't that deep but the starters played really well together and were much more productive than the bench. It wasn't just Lebron though.
LOL LeBron at +23.5 and +20.0......To put that into perspective Durant was at +15.8 last year