A non-biased comparison of Demarcus Cousins and Marc Gasol...

[Im Still Ballin]

As an intelligent, honest, basketball fan I make sure that when I compare players, I use a strict, non-biased approach to analysis. This means I will factor into the equation, advanced statistics, base stat lines, team success in relation to said player/s, and a subjective, visual analysis AKA the eye test. Combining all of these different elements, creates an accurate value of basketball players.

Now on to the topic of this thread.

Demarcus Cousins vs Marc Gasol.

What do the advanced statistics say?
Player Efficiency Rating (PER): 28.00 vs. 22.60
Win shares/48: .210 vs. .202
Real Plus Minus: 7.08 (Offense 2.44 Defense 4.64) vs. 3.26 (Offense 0.89 Defense 2.37)
TS%: .586 vs. .578

What do the base stat lines say?
Points: 23.5 points vs. 19 points
Rebounds: 12.6 rebounds vs. 8.1 rebounds
Assists: 2.4 assists vs. 3.7 assists
Steals: 1.1 steals vs. 1 steals
Blocks: 1.5 blocks vs. 1.5 blocks
FG%: .512% vs. .490%
FT%: .806% vs. .847%
MPG: 32 mpg vs. 35 mpg

Team success w/ said player:
Memphis: 16-4, no injuries, easy schedule (SOS of .500)
Sacramento: 11-10, 1-4 without Demarcus, hardest schedule in the league so far (SOS of .600). Multiple injuries to key players (Gay/Cousins/Collision/Casspi/etc). When Kings are healthy, all of the Gay Cousins Collision tandem play, the Kings are 7-3 (This was against top tier WC teams)

Eye test:
Using my own extensive knowledge of the game, I can visually notice that Demarcus is the superior offensive player by a steep margin. This is further supported by pretty much every advanced/basic statistic, and is commonly accepted. Cousins' array of offensive moves is very impressive, he is extremely versatile. He has a solid mid range jumper that is in the 43-46% mark which is elite. He is really the only center who can drive to the basket off his own dribble in the halfcourt. He routinely gets to the charity stripe due to his quickness and strength and his ability to use those attributes combined with his high level of skill. His post moves down low are very impressive, he has a plethora of moves and counters that causes teams to either foul him, or double/triple/quadruple team him.He is an elite passer, especially from out of the post, which is why he is so important to his team. The offense runs around his dominance down low, the inside-out game.

On defense he has rapidly improved and is severely underrated in this department. The stats show that he has been very impressive this season, and the footage seems to back this uo. He does however need to cut down his foul count.

Marc on the offense has good finesse and crafty moves, but lacks the mobility to be more of a threat. He is slow footed, and mechanical in some of his moves, whereas he is fluid in others. His passing is definitely his most impresive attribute on this side of the court.

Defensively, he is impressive, being a former DPOY winner, he understands the role of being the big body in the lane, and plays this part well. He is a little overrated though, he benefits from great system defense, as well as superior wing/guard defenders in Tony Allen and Mike Conley. Randolph is no slouch either.

Conclusion:
All the supported evidence seems to allude to that Demarcus is the superior basketball player. I agree with this statement. Marc is no slouch, but he is not the best center in the league. That title belongs to the big man down in the Cowbell Kingdom.

[Im Still Ballin]

Any feedback/constructive criticism would be appreciated

[Myth]

Any feedback/constructive criticism would be appreciated

Ok. I don't believe you are capable of being non-biased, so have somebody else post this and maybe I'll read a couple sentences next time before realizing it is coming from a biased agenda.

[outbreak]

I'd take Gasol over Cousins if I wanted to have a competing team.

If I had a bunch of scrubs and wasn't going to be trying to actually win but just see how far one player could carry me then I'd take Cousins.

[Im Still Ballin]

I'd take Gasol over Cousins if I wanted to have a competing team.

If I had a bunch of scrubs and wasn't going to be trying to actually win but just see how far one player could carry me then I'd take Cousins.
This is stupid. Explain this please. How on earth would you come to this conclusion?

[Im Still Ballin]

Another huge point I talked about with my buddies at RealGM...

Kings are 2-15 without Demarcus in this season, and the last. Those two wins were this season, 1 pt win against the Pacers and a win against Utah.

[Mass Debator]

Cousins is definitely more talented to me, but I believe the thing that makes it closer than it should be is leadership and bball IQ. Marc can do all the little things on defense and offense that doesn't appear on the stat sheet which impact the game in ways Cousins just don't do on a consistent basis. I remember like last year when Gasol went down, the Grizzlies had like a 5 game losing streak in his 20 something games missed. Then when he came back, they won 9/10. I bet you if you counted hockey assists, Marc averages like near 10 assists per game. It's just a habit for him to make the right play. Cousins however can be a freak on offense. Explosive.

I don't think either team would swap players so that just tells me that both are very valuable to their respective teams. Both are pretty great. Marc Gasol could probably fit in any system with any type of players so I'd probably lean towards him being my pick.

[outbreak]

Cousins is definitely more talented to me, but I believe the thing that makes it closer than it should be is leadership and bball IQ. Marc can do all the little things on defense and offense that doesn't appear on the stat sheet which impact the game in ways Cousins just don't do on a consistent basis. I remember like last year when Gasol went down, the Grizzlies had like a 5 game losing streak in his 20 something games missed. Then when he came back, they won 9/10. I bet you if you counted hockey assists, Marc averages like near 10 assists per game. It's just a habit for him to make the right play. Cousins however can be a freak on offense. Explosive.

I don't think either team would swap players so that just tells me that both are very valuable to their respective teams. Both are pretty great. Marc Gasol could probably fit in any system with any type of players so I'd probably lean towards him being my pick.

That's the same point I was trying to make. I think Marc fits in better on a competitive team. He doesn't need to dominate to get his numbers and he contributes in a variety of ways.

[FKAri]

OP = number 1 Cousins ******ger so lol @ non biased. Even thought I might agree with most of your post. I think that needs to stated.

[TaLvsCuaL]

http://i.imgur.com/SBBQ7Yo.gif

[Im Still Ballin]

Alright lets be honest... the eye test is 100% biased. Thats why I don't like to use it, rather use objective measures like stats. Stats that seem to fall in Boogie's favor. No surprise there.

[Myth]

Alright lets be honest... the eye test is 100% biased. Thats why I don't like to use it, rather use objective measures like stats. Stats that seem to fall in Boogie's favor. No surprise there.

Is that why you needed to type more in the eye test section than any other section?

[Myth]

Another huge point I talked about with my buddies at RealGM...

Kings are 2-15 without Demarcus in this season, and the last. Those two wins were this season, 1 pt win against the Pacers and a win against Utah.

Are you aware that the only reason Grizzlies were an 8th seed instead of higher was because of Gasol's injury? Since Gasol's return last season, his team has won more games than any other team in the league.

[Im Still Ballin]

Is that why you needed to type more in the eye test section than any other section?
Are you aware that you are trying to compare an eye test to stats? One is just an objective base figure and one needs a paragraph.

And seeming as how Demarcus easily won the stats argument, no extra explanation was required. The only possible reasons why people can think Gasol is better are the eye test and team record. Both of which are pretty much a wash.

[Myth]

Are you aware that you are trying to compare an eye test to stats? One is just an objective base figure and one needs a paragraph.

And seeming as how Demarcus easily won the stats argument, no extra explanation was required. The only possible reasons why people can think Gasol is better are the eye test and team record. Both of which are pretty much a wash.

Team record is a wash he says :roll:

[outbreak]

Team record is a wash he says :roll:

He's right though isn't he? The kings always have the same record as the Grizz don't they? What universe do we live in again?

[Im Still Ballin]

Strength of schedule, injuries to major players, bogus foul trouble on Demarcus...

Not to mention the Kings got robbed of a W over Memphis.

[turret]

Strength of schedule, injuries to major players, bogus foul trouble on Demarcus...

Not to mention the Kings got robbed of a W over Memphis.


.3 rent free:hammerhead:

[Verticality]

Strength of schedule, injuries to major players, bogus foul trouble on Demarcus...

Not to mention the Kings got robbed of a W over Memphis.

http://cdn.sheknows.com/articles/2012/10/sarah_parenting/baby-crying.jpg

[Im Still Ballin]

For those unaware

[chips93]

since january of last year, when marc gasol came back from injury, the memphis grizzlies have had the best record in the entire league

i cant really get passed that.

[Burgz V2]

Alright lets be honest... the eye test is 100% biased. Thats why I don't like to use it, rather use objective measures like stats. Stats that seem to fall in Boogie's favor. No surprise there.

here's something to add to the eye-test:

Marc Gasol plays alongside Z-Bo.

DMC plays alongside Jason ****ing Thompson.

But the statistical disparity is because DMC is a better player?

what about the disparity between WINS and LOSSES?

:yaohappy:

[Fudge]

Don't make me get you banned again, OP. :yaohappy:

[Im Still Ballin]

here's something to add to the eye-test:

Marc Gasol plays alongside Z-Bo.

DMC plays alongside Jason ****ing Thompson.

But the statistical disparity is because DMC is a better player?

what about the disparity between WINS and LOSSES?

:yaohappy:
Playing along side only further proves my point. Without a beast down low in Randolph Gasol's numbers would plummet. He'd be the target of multiple double/triple teams. Something that Demarcus faces right now constantly. Despite the double/triple/quadruple teaming, he routinely finishes and 1's at the basket.

[Im Still Ballin]

This message is hidden because Fudge is on your ignore list.

Get it straight Simon I've blocked all your alts.

Stop posting in my threads.

[Burgz V2]

Playing along side only further proves my point. Without a beast down low in Randolph Gasol's numbers would plummet. He'd be the target of multiple double/triple teams. Something that Demarcus faces right now constantly. Despite the double/triple/quadruple teaming, he routinely finishes and 1's at the basket.

so Demarcus' numbers are higher because he faces more double/triple/quadruple teams?

makes sense.


that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of.

[Burgz V2]

This message is hidden because Fudge is on your ignore list.

Get it straight Simon I've blocked all your alts.

Stop posting in my threads.

Let me get that for you:


Don't make me get you banned again, OP. :yaohappy:

[Im Still Ballin]

so Demarcus' numbers are higher because he faces more double/triple/quadruple teams?

makes sense.


that's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of.
No Demarcus is simply a better player.

Naturally the superior player has better numbers.

[kshutts1]

ISH -- where people focus more on the success of a TEAM when comparing individuals.

Boogie has a worse team than Marc. Doesn't mean he can't be better.

Just like John Wall is hugely underrated.

[Genaro]

Gasol has better leadership, intangibles and bb iq. Thought I think that it's due to Cousins age.
At 29 he will probably be better than Gasol is right now.

[kshutts1]

Just like Lebron is arguably the greatest role player of all time (and that's not a knock), Marc is one of the best role players in the league right now.

If you want a leading man? Boogie.
If you have a team, and want a complimentary piece? Marc.

[Im Still Ballin]

Gasol has better leadership, intangibles and bb iq. Thought I think that it's due to Cousins age.
At 29 he will probably be better than Gasol is right now.
These things are great for making a bullshit argument when EVERY logical piece of evidence is against it.

[Done_And_Done]

No Demarcus is simply a better player.

Naturally the superior player has better numbers.

No. Just no.

The best players in the world will always find a way to get theirs but when you're playing in a winning system with a variety of scorers, there's a good chance your numbers won't be as inflated as they would if you're the focal point on a less stacked team.

[kshutts1]

No. Just no.

The best players in the world will always find a way to get theirs but when you're playing in a winning system with a variety of scorers, there's a good chance your numbers won't be as inflated as they would if you're the focal point on a less stacked team.
Not saying you did this, but it's funny how this line of thinking can be used to defend Marc Gasol, but no one was using this line when Bosh was being called done and a bad player, etc.

[Done_And_Done]

Not saying you did this, but it's funny how this line of thinking can be used to defend Marc Gasol, but no one was using this line when Bosh was being called done and a bad player, etc.

It's funny/ironic that you mentioned him because Chris actually came to mind prior to me typing that out. He's the greatest recent example of this phenomenon.

[Im Still Ballin]

Just like Lebron is arguably the greatest role player of all time (and that's not a knock), Marc is one of the best role players in the league right now.

If you want a leading man? Boogie.
If you have a team, and want a complimentary piece? Marc.
Bingo.

We can hypothesize though. Given a morale change, Demarcus could most definately play the complimentary role just as good, if not better than Marc. It's obviously a fine line though. Complimentary pieces have limits to the impact they put upon the game.

Now if we reverse the scenario, I doubt Marc could be a franchise superstar like Demarcus is. He has always been second fiddle to teammates like Rudy Gay, Zach Randolph, Mike Conley... We have no reason to believe he can suddenly becomes this type of player that Demarcus currently is. It's like asking someone to make lemonade with an orange. Two different qualities of players. The orange is hanging of a tree in someone's garden while the Lemon is hung from the flora of the garden of eden.

[kshutts1]

Bingo.

We can hypothesize though. Given a morale change, Demarcus could most definately play the complimentary role just as good, if not better than Marc. It's obviously a fine line though. Complimentary pieces have limits to the impact they put upon the game.

Now if we reverse the scenario, I doubt Marc could be a franchise superstar like Demarcus is. He has always been second fiddle to teammates like Rudy Gay, Zach Randolph, Mike Conley... We have no reason to believe he can suddenly becomes this type of player that Demarcus currently is. It's like asking someone to make lemonade with an orange. Two different qualities of players. The orange is hanging of a tree in someone's garden while the Lemon is hung from the flora of the garden of eden.
I'm not in here to defend you, or Boogie for that matter.. .but if I were, this post would have made me stop and switch sides.

[magnax1]

Demarcus is probably the most dominant offensive player in the league right now, so Ill go with him. People who are saying his team sucks or his numbers are inflated havent paid attention to him.

[Im Still Ballin]

I'm not in here to defend you, or Boogie for that matter.. .but if I were, this post would have made me stop and switch sides.
Use some logical thinking.

Demarcus is the superstar of his team. Marc is not.

If Demarcus were playing the role that Marc is now, his numbers might be similar, but his efficiency would be way higher.

If Marc were playing the role that Demarcus is now, his numbers would be slightly higher, but his efficiency would plummet.

And to put things into perspective, They pretty much have identical efficiency right now. But also Demarcus has more output/usage/volume. As we know, when usage increases, efficiency usually diminishes.

[Im Still Ballin]

It's really only the same guys every time that try to push this pro-Marc Gasol agenda to smother Demarcus. It's really only a few people, the majority are sided with Demarcus, as is majority of the evidence in the comparison, hence stated in the OP.

[kshutts1]

Use some logical thinking.

Demarcus is the superstar of his team. Marc is not.

If Demarcus were playing the role that Marc is now, his numbers might be similar, but his efficiency would be way higher.

If Marc were playing the role that Demarcus is now, his numbers would be slightly higher, but his efficiency would plummet.

And to put things into perspective, They pretty much have identical efficiency right now. But also Demarcus has more output/usage/volume. As we know, when usage increases, efficiency usually diminishes.
In theory. Reality does not always equal theory. Other factors are often at play.
That's one giant, convoluted reason why the Lebron/Wade/Bosh dynamic was so interesting.

[Done_And_Done]

Use some logical thinking.

Demarcus is the superstar of his team. Marc is not.

If Demarcus were playing the role that Marc is now, his numbers might be similar, but his efficiency would be way higher.

If Marc were playing the role that Demarcus is now, his numbers would be slightly higher, but his efficiency would plummet.

And to put things into perspective, They pretty much have identical efficiency right now. But also Demarcus has more output/usage/volume. As we know, when usage increases, efficiency usually diminishes.

Based on what body of work? If you claim that Marc has always been situated as a "second fiddle" how could you extrapolate that he wouldn't beast or strive as the go to guy on the current King's roster for instance?

[Im Still Ballin]

Because player comparisons are based on a lot of theory. Theory that is supported by the best evidence we have which is stats/eye test/team record

I'm only throwing a hypothesis out there, but it's the most accurate one based on the supporting data.

[3peated]

purple is a bad color for this, you should have bolded it as well.

[GoldMedallist]

It's really only the same guys every time that try to push this pro-Marc Gasol agenda to smother Demarcus. It's really only a few people, the majority are sided with Demarcus, as is majority of the evidence in the comparison, hence stated in the OP.

It's funny you say people has a pretended "pro-Marc Gasol" agenda to smother DeMarcus, when it's you who always make threads to smother Marc. Very few Gasol fan (like me) would dislike Cousins, because he is an excellent Center, and Gasol's fans usually like good Centers.

So I think it's you who has that "smother" problem, and if you continue making threads like this you could make some people start hating Cousins, and it will be your fault.