Michael Jordan on his worst day is ten times better than Kobe Bryant on his best day

[jzek]

...and that is not short-changing Kobe Bryant.

- Reggie Miller

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gawNoggvBPw&t=5m16s

[KobesFinger]

So Wizards Jordan is better than peak Kobe? I wholeheartedly accept that Jordan > Kobe but thats silly

[pegasus]

So Wizards Jordan is better than peak Kobe? I wholeheartedly accept that Jordan > Kobe but thats silly
This. There's an obvious gap, but that's like taking it waaaaaaaaaay too far.

[riseagainst]

lol, not short changing Kobe. Kobe at his best is 10 times better than MJ at his worst, i can agree with this one.

[MastaKilla]

Kobe from 06-10 was better than 2nd 3peat Jordan

[ZeN]

MJ could not guard peak, premangled fingers, scored 81 Kobe.

Kobe could however D up MJ during his peak defensive year, not just because he emulated all of MJs moves.

[Young X]

Kobe from 06-10 was better than 2nd 3peat JordanNo he wasn't.

[Imtheman]

No he wasn't.
Yes he was

[outbreak]

Kobe from 06-10 was better than wizards Jordan
Fixed for accuracy

[JohnMax]

Peak Kobe shot around 40 percent against Boston and Orlando

[OldSchoolBBall]

I don't think he meant Jordan at the worst point of his career against Kobe at his best point - that would be silly. You have to consider the question he was answering, which was "who was tougher to guard?" In that context, I assume Reggie meant that a PRIME Jordan on his worst day was a TOUGHER COVER than PRIME Kobe on his best day in terms of how difficult they were to defend and how many ways they could beat you.

[Dragonyeuw]

Kobe could however D up MJ during his peak defensive year, not just because he emulated all of MJs moves.

Please. Lesser players have dropped buckets on Kobe at different times ( tmac, wade, vince, hell Arenas dropped 60 on him FFS), yet he's going to stop MJ? MJ and Kobe at their best are indefensible, thats why they're the two GOAT shooting guards.

[ZeN]

Please. Lesser players have dropped buckets on Kobe at different times ( tmac, wade, vince, hell Arenas dropped 60 on him FFS), yet he's going to stop MJ? MJ and Kobe at their best are indefensible, thats why they're the two GOAT shooting guards.
Yea I agree with all that. I'm just saying Kobe is sociopathic when it specifically comes to MJ.

[3ball]

Kobe from 06-10 was better than 2nd 3peat Jordan
except during these periods you specify, jordan took worse talent to far superior success against better teams.

[AirFederer]

I hear you, Reginald :applause:

Also, inb4 gifs of The lean dunk :lol

[MastaKilla]

except during these periods you specify, jordan took worse talent to far superior success against better teams.

are you trying to tell me the 09& 10 Lakers are more stacked than the 96 bulls?

:roll: :roll:

[3ball]

Kobe from 06-10 was better than 2nd 3peat Jordan
Kobe ..(06'-10'): 25.0 PER, 56.5% TS, 45.9% FG, 114 ORtg, WS/48: 0.200

Jordan (96'-98'): 27.4 PER, 56.0 TS, 48.2% FG, 119 ORtg, WS/48: 0.279


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 39.2 pts, 7.3 rebs, 6.6 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.5 blks,
Jordan: 41.4 pts, 8.5 rebs, 5.5 assists, 2.6 stls, 0.7 blks

[3ball]

are you trying to tell me the 09& 10 Lakers are more stacked than the 96 bulls?


yes - i'll take pau gasol and healthy andrew bynum over scottie pippen and rodman any day... good thing the bulls had jordan to give them a true inside presence.

lamar and kukocs cancel each other out, although i still like prime lamar's overall contribution more than kukocs.

[MastaKilla]

Kobe ..(06'-10'): 25.0 PER, 56.5% TS, 45.9% FG, 114 ORtg, WS/48: 0.200

Jordan (96'-98'): 27.4 PER, 56.0 TS, 48.2% FG, 119 ORtg, WS/48: 0.279


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 39.2 pts, 7.3 rebs, 6.6 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.5 blks,
Jordan: 41.4 pts, 8.5 rebs, 5.5 assists, 2.6 stls, 0.7 blks

why aren't you posting ppg/apg/rpg?

[MastaKilla]

yes - i'll take pau gasol and healthy andrew bynum over scottie pippen and rodman any day... good thing the bulls had jordan to give them a true inside presence.

lamar and kukocs cancel each other out, although i still like prime lamar's overall contribution more than kukocs.

i can't figure out which is more stupid, this overall comment or that you just called "6&4" and "9&6" Bynum healthy

:roll: :roll: you've jumped the shark

[Da_Realist]

Kobe ..(06'-10'): 25.0 PER, 56.5% TS, 45.9% FG, 114 ORtg, WS/48: 0.200

Jordan (96'-98'): 27.4 PER, 56.0 TS, 48.2% FG, 119 ORtg, WS/48: 0.279


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 39.2 pts, 7.3 rebs, 6.6 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.5 blks,
Jordan: 41.4 pts, 8.5 rebs, 5.5 assists, 2.6 stls, 0.7 blks

I'd take what MJ did bumping-n-grinding against the Knicks, Heat and Pacers over whatever Kobe did. If you take a look at what MJ did during the playoffs alone on a game level basis you'll see MJ was a better player.

- 3 straight titles, 3 straight FMVP's, 2 League MVP's, leader of 72 and 69 win teams

This is just the Finals
- Flu game (stomach virus) in the Finals that ends with game winning shot
- Near 39-point triple double
- Game winning buzzer beater
- Championship winning assist
- Championship winning shot-steal-shot combo

[Da_Realist]

yes - i'll take pau gasol and healthy andrew bynum over scottie pippen and rodman any day... good thing the bulls had jordan to give them a true inside presence.

lamar and kukocs cancel each other out, although i still like prime lamar's overall contribution more than kukocs.

What? :no:

No, no, no. Scottie and Rodman were winners. Tough, hardened and seasoned. With them you win 72 and 69 games. MJ+Pippen+Rodman would embarrass Kobe+Gasol+Bynum. 6 games tops.

[SouBeachTalents]

except during these periods you specify, jordan took worse talent to far superior success against better teams.

Dude's right, those Bulls teams were utter trash. Pippen made an All-NBA team every year of the second 3peat, including a first team in '96, and made the All-Defensive First Team all 3 years as well. Rodman led the league in rebounding every year of that second 3peat, and you had a sixth man of the year in Kukoc coming off the bench. Oh, and Phil Jackson was coaching also. Those Bulls teams were terrible

[nba_55]

Didn't Bulls win 55 games without Jordan?:facepalm That homer is trying to convince us Bulls were not stacked hahahahahhaha

[3ball]

Kobe ..(06'-10'): 25.0 PER, 56.5% TS, 45.9% FG, 114 ORtg, WS/48: 0.200

Jordan (96'-98'): 27.4 PER, 56.0 TS, 48.2% FG, 119 ORtg, WS/48: 0.279


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 39.2 pts, 7.3 rebs, 6.6 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.5 blks,
Jordan: 41.4 pts, 8.5 rebs, 5.5 assists, 2.6 stls, 0.7 blks





why aren't you posting ppg/apg/rpg?


per-100 possession stats are an unbiased comparison of raw production, because it factors in pace and playing time differences.

what difference would it make - kobe's numbers are lower regardless:

kobe ..(06'-10'): 29.8 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 5.5 apg, 1.6 spg, 0.4 bpg, 45.9% FG
jordan (96'-'98'): 29.6 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 4.0 apg, 1.9 stls, 0.5 bpg, 48.2% FG


now that was kobe's prime vs. MJ's 2nd three-peat... you want to compare jordan's prime (87-91) to kobe's (06'-10')?

[3ball]

Dude's right, those Bulls teams were utter trash. Pippen made an All-NBA team every year of the second 3peat, including a first team in '96, and made the All-Defensive First Team all 3 years as well. Rodman led the league in rebounding every year of that second 3peat, and you had a sixth man of the year in Kukoc coming off the bench. Oh, and Phil Jackson was coaching also. Those Bulls teams were terrible
scottie and rodman were nice, but kobe's supporting cast with gasol, bynum and odom was better - and they had phil too!

the stats prove that jordan was contributing MUCH more to his teams wins than kobe: Jordan's WS/48 was 0.274 from 96' to 98', while kobe's was only 0.200 during his prime of 06' to 10'.

[Levity]

yes - i'll take pau gasol and healthy andrew bynum over scottie pippen and rodman any day... good thing the bulls had jordan to give them a true inside presence.

lamar and kukocs cancel each other out, although i still like prime lamar's overall contribution more than kukocs.

who is this healthy bynum you speak of?

Bynum had 1.5-2 good seasons with LA. the season that pau was traded, Bynum was putting up career numbers (though, the years before he was total shit), and went down in memphis that january, missing the next 3-4 months. Had very little impact following, and suffered another injury the following season

it wasnt until mike brown took over as HC that bynum had his truly dominant season. and even then, he was all over the place. the bynum mythology that is often spewed on this site is pretty disgusting.

but back to the quote in the OP. i understand miller sees himself as a writer and often uses excessive hyperbole, but with that quote, miller went down the ben stiller path from simple jack... fully retarded

[BigBoss]

Kobe scored 55 on Jordan
Jordans career low: 2 points-was againt Kobe.

[MastaKilla]

per-100 possession stats are an unbiased comparison of raw production, because it factors in pace and playing time differences.

what difference would it make - kobe's numbers are lower regardless:

kobe ..(06'-10'): 29.8 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 5.5 apg, 1.6 spg, 0.4 bpg, 45.9% FG
jordan (96'-'98'): 29.6 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 4.0 apg, 1.9 stls, 0.5 bpg, 48.2% FG


now that was kobe's prime vs. MJ's 2nd three-peat... you want to compare jordan's prime (87-91) to kobe's (06'-10')?

why do you want to change subjects? all i said was that 06-10 Kobe was better than 96-98 Jordan. Which is true.

i'm not even going to bother with somebody who thinks the 09 & 10 lakers had more talent.

Jordan left the team and in 94 the Bulls won 55 games by replacing him with some dude off the street, and they were even more stacked in 96.

96 Bulls and 86 Celtics are widely regarded as the two most stacked teams of all time

[3ball]

How could kobe have a worse supporting cast AND have worse personal stats across the board, yet still win two championships?

Jordan's superior stats alone prove that he had a worse supporting cast.
.

[3ball]

why do you want to change subjects? all i said was that 06-10 Kobe was better than 96-98 Jordan. Which is true.

i'm not even going to bother with somebody who thinks the 09 & 10 lakers had more talent.

Jordan left the team and in 94 the Bulls won 55 games by replacing him with some dude off the street, and they were even more stacked in 96.

96 Bulls and 86 Celtics are widely regarded as the two most stacked teams of all time
how could kobe have won 2 championships with LESS talent, when his stats were so much worse than Jordan's across the board?

why ignore the stats showing Jordan contributed more to his teams wins than kobe did, and therefore must have had a worse supporting cast?

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Jordan's hype machine is just insane. Dude isn't even five times better than Kobe peak vs peak.

[3ball]

who is this healthy bynum you speak of?

Bynum had 1.5-2 good seasons with LA. the season that pau was traded, Bynum was putting up career numbers (though, the years before he was total shit), and went down in memphis that january, missing the next 3-4 months. Had very little impact following, and suffered another injury the following season

it wasnt until mike brown took over as HC that bynum had his truly dominant season. and even then, he was all over the place. the bynum mythology that is often spewed on this site is pretty disgusting.
bynum played 23 mpg in the 2009 Finals averaging 6.4 pts, 4.2 rebs, and 0.4 blocks.

bynum played 25 minutes per game in the 2010 Finals, averaging 7.3 pts, 5.3 rebs, and 1.3 blocks.

by comparison, in the 1998 Finals, Rodman averaged 3.3 pts, 8.3 rebs, and 0.3 blks... in the 1997 Finals, Rodman averaged 2.3 pts, 7.7 rebs, and 0.2 blks.

so there is a lot of Rodman mythology in these threads.

regardless of the splitting of hairs we are doing here, the stats prove the point: kobe's only had a 0.200 WS/48 and worse stats across the board during his prime, than Jordan had in his 2nd three-peat (0.274 WS/48)..

so how could kobe have somehow have contributed MORE to his team's wins with such worse stats?

[3ball]

Jordan isn't even five times better than Kobe peak vs peak.



Kobe's peak 06'-10' vs. Jordan's peak 87'-91'.


Kobe:.. 25.0 PER, 56.5% TS, 45.9% FG, 114 ORtg, WS/48: 0.200

Jordan: 31.1 PER, 59.6% TS, 52.2% FG, 122 ORtg, WS/48: 0.290


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 39.2 pts, 7.3 rebs, 6.6 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.5 blks,
Jordan: 43.1 pts, 8.0 rebs, 7.7 assists, 3.7 stls, 1.4 blks


:roll:


Kobe's peak 06'-10' vs. Jordan's 96'-98'


Kobe ..: 25.0 PER, 56.5% TS, 45.9% FG, 114 ORtg, WS/48: 0.200

Jordan: 27.4 PER, 56.0 TS, 48.2% FG, 119 ORtg, WS/48: 0.279


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 39.2 pts, 7.3 rebs, 6.6 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.5 blks,
Jordan: 41.4 pts, 8.5 rebs, 5.5 assists, 2.6 stls, 0.7 blks

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kobe's PEAK was from 2006 - 2008. Just saying.

[WallIn]

Kobe's peak 06'-10' vs. Jordan's peak 87'-91'.


Kobe:.. 25.0 PER, 56.5% TS, 45.9% FG, 114 ORtg, WS/48: 0.200

Jordan: 31.1 PER, 59.6% TS, 52.2% FG, 122 ORtg, WS/48: 0.290


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 39.2 pts, 7.3 rebs, 6.6 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.5 blks,
Jordan: 43.1 pts, 8.0 rebs, 7.7 assists, 3.7 stls, 1.4 blks


:roll:


Kobe's peak 06'-10' vs. Jordan's 96'-98'


Kobe ..: 25.0 PER, 56.5% TS, 45.9% FG, 114 ORtg, WS/48: 0.200

Jordan: 27.4 PER, 56.0 TS, 48.2% FG, 119 ORtg, WS/48: 0.279


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 39.2 pts, 7.3 rebs, 6.6 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.5 blks,
Jordan: 41.4 pts, 8.5 rebs, 5.5 assists, 2.6 stls, 0.7 blks

:roll:

[Fire Colangelo]

I'd probably take two Kobes over one MJ...

so no lol... he's not 10 times better

[f0und]

not sure what he specifically meant, but ill take rookie-98 jordan over any version of kobe 10 times out of 10.

[f0und]

I'd probably take two Kobes over one MJ...

so no lol... he's not 10 times better

they'd cancel each other out, mabe even make each other worse. two wrongs dont make a right.

[SugarHill]

except during these periods you specify, jordan took worse talent to far superior success against better teams.
:roll:

[Da_Realist]

It's an exaggeration. What he means is that MJ was a significantly better player. "10 times better" was his way of saying "much better". He even respectfully called MJ "The Black Cat". So yeah, he made his point clear.

[Dragic4Life]

Agreed.

[andgar923]

Reggie has played with them in the league and in the off season, so he's gotten to see them up close in different scenarios.

[gts]

:lol people actually trying to justify these remarks as if they have any merit...

Reggie's delusional or he's trying to keep his legacy intact in some bizarre way seeing how he was abused by Jordan for years....

[mehyaM24]

:lol people actually trying to justify these remarks as if they have any merit...

Reggie's delusional or he's trying to keep his legacy intact in some bizarre way seeing how he was abused by Jordan for years....
10x better. hahahaha. kobe is about as overrated as anyone. ever - but come on! his fanboys will chalk it up to "reggie clearly exaggerating" (which he wasn't). dat hype train keeps on going, baby!

[Bless Mathews]

MJ could not guard peak, premangled fingers, scored 81 Kobe.

Kobe could however D up MJ during his peak defensive year, not just because he emulated all of MJs moves.

You're an idiot.

Plain and simple.

Jordan goat defender.

MJ would eat him for lunch.

Worst poast of the year nominee.

[Bless Mathews]

per-100 possession stats are an unbiased comparison of raw production, because it factors in pace and playing time differences.

what difference would it make - kobe's numbers are lower regardless:

kobe ..(06'-10'): 29.8 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 5.5 apg, 1.6 spg, 0.4 bpg, 45.9% FG
jordan (96'-'98'): 29.6 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 4.0 apg, 1.9 stls, 0.5 bpg, 48.2% FG


now that was kobe's prime vs. MJ's 2nd three-peat... you want to compare jordan's prime (87-91) to kobe's (06'-10')?

Slayed.

[COnDEMnED]

Both are light years better than queer voice Reggie Miller.

[AintNoSunshine]

Jordan's career low in points is 810:bowdown:

[PickernRoller]

Reggie couldn't even keep up with a young Kobe in 2000 and had his goon and enforcer **** Kobe up in the Finals. Big mouth, underachiever. Still lost it - which makes his comments more sweeter. Got bodied up by Jordan in his prime, got slapped by young Kobe in his decline.

[Shih508]

I'll take the word from a player who went head to head against both of them in their prime than someone who has never play against Kobe and saying Kobe's a top 5.

Kobe is just too easy comparing to MJ.... EasyBe

[J Shuttlesworth]

Jordan's career low in points is 810:bowdown:
:lol my thought exactly

[SamuraiSWISH]

Hyperbole ... But the point is he's saying Jordan > Kobe. Just so clown shoes like YMF, eliteballer, kennethgriffin, 9erempire are not paying attention to the obvious facts.

[Cold soul]

If Reggie Miller truly believes that he is an idiot. MJ better player of course maybe even twice as good but 10 times better GTFO with that hot garbage.

[imnew09]

LOL, Reggie tryna bump that TOP 10 list because he faced Jordan who is "10x better than Kobe" during his time


DELUSIONAL AF. Ringless like meeee

[stalkerforlife]

Reggie Miller is a salty ass nicca that's jealous of Kobe.

Join the crowd.

[Droid101]

Bless Matthews has sex with men. I have video proof.

[dubeta]

Quotes like this piss me off, when they engage in hyperbole and hype the shit outta a player that, the other is just dismissed. 10 times better? wtf you think Kobe after 19 years deserves to be called 10 times WORSE than MJ? Like it takes 10 Kobes to equal MJ? :facepalm

This article is so unfair to.....












MJ, Seriously 6/6 with 6 FMVP's vs 2/5 in FMVP Kobe and 1 MVP in 19 years :banana:

More like 20 times better :pimp:

[GimmeThat]

and PER don't win games

[ImKobe]

Nikkas are on some serious trolling ish in this thread

peak Kobe 06-10? We're putting 5 seasons of Kobe vs 3 seasons of MJ? Kobe played on limited minutes in both 09 and 10, his peak was 06-08

Peak Kobe (06-08): 31.7/5.8/5.1 on 57,1%TS
2nd 3-peat MJ (96-98): 29.6/6.1/4.0 on 56%TS

now let's compare Kobe's 3 straight Finals runs to 96-98 MJ Finals runs

Kobe (08-10): 29.8/5.7/5.5 on 56,9%TS
MJ (96-98): 31.4/6.0/4.1 on 54,3%TS

and if we take FG% into account, Kobe had a higher FG% in the Playoffs than MJ as well, MJ took 24.7 FGA vs Kobe's 22.4 FGA to average 1.6 more points per game, that's 2.3 more shots a game + 1 extra FTA for an extra 1.6 points. :kobe:, and Kobe shot a higher percentage on 2s, 3s(MJ 3 3s a game, Kobe 5), and FTs. MJ's PER is slightly higher due to averaging 0.8 less TOs a game, which is thanks to sharing ballhandling duties with Pippen.

[MastaKilla]

Nikkas are on some serious trolling ish in this thread

peak Kobe 06-10? We're putting 5 seasons of Kobe vs 3 seasons of MJ? Kobe played on limited minutes in both 09 and 10, his peak was 06-08

Peak Kobe (06-08): 31.7/5.8/5.1 on 57,1%TS
2nd 3-peat MJ (96-98): 29.6/6.1/4.0 on 56%TS

now let's compare Kobe's 3 straight Finals runs to 96-98 MJ Finals runs

Kobe (08-10): 29.8/5.7/5.5 on 56,9%TS
MJ (96-98): 31.4/6.0/4.1 on 54,3%TS

and if we take FG% into account, Kobe had a higher FG% in the Playoffs than MJ as well, MJ took 24.7 FGA vs Kobe's 22.4 FGA to average 1.6 more points per game, that's 2.3 more shots a game + 1 extra FTA for an extra 1.6 points. :kobe:, and Kobe shot a higher percentage on 2s, 3s(MJ 3 3s a game, Kobe 5), and FTs. MJ's PER is slightly higher due to averaging 0.8 less TOs a game, which is thanks to sharing ballhandling duties with Pippen.

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1112978/kobeee.gif

[Magic 32]

Nikkas are on some serious trolling ish in this thread

peak Kobe 06-10? We're putting 5 seasons of Kobe vs 3 seasons of MJ? Kobe played on limited minutes in both 09 and 10, his peak was 06-08

Peak Kobe (06-08): 31.7/5.8/5.1 on 57,1%TS
2nd 3-peat MJ (96-98): 29.6/6.1/4.0 on 56%TS

now let's compare Kobe's 3 straight Finals runs to 96-98 MJ Finals runs

Kobe (08-10): 29.8/5.7/5.5 on 56,9%TS
MJ (96-98): 31.4/6.0/4.1 on 54,3%TS

and if we take FG% into account, Kobe had a higher FG% in the Playoffs than MJ as well, MJ took 24.7 FGA vs Kobe's 22.4 FGA to average 1.6 more points per game, that's 2.3 more shots a game + 1 extra FTA for an extra 1.6 points. :kobe:, and Kobe shot a higher percentage on 2s, 3s(MJ 3 3s a game, Kobe 5), and FTs. MJ's PER is slightly higher due to averaging 0.8 less TOs a game, which is thanks to sharing ballhandling duties with Pippen.

:applause:

[stalkerforlife]

Nikkas are on some serious trolling ish in this thread

peak Kobe 06-10? We're putting 5 seasons of Kobe vs 3 seasons of MJ? Kobe played on limited minutes in both 09 and 10, his peak was 06-08

Peak Kobe (06-08): 31.7/5.8/5.1 on 57,1%TS
2nd 3-peat MJ (96-98): 29.6/6.1/4.0 on 56%TS

now let's compare Kobe's 3 straight Finals runs to 96-98 MJ Finals runs

Kobe (08-10): 29.8/5.7/5.5 on 56,9%TS
MJ (96-98): 31.4/6.0/4.1 on 54,3%TS

and if we take FG% into account, Kobe had a higher FG% in the Playoffs than MJ as well, MJ took 24.7 FGA vs Kobe's 22.4 FGA to average 1.6 more points per game, that's 2.3 more shots a game + 1 extra FTA for an extra 1.6 points. :kobe:, and Kobe shot a higher percentage on 2s, 3s(MJ 3 3s a game, Kobe 5), and FTs. MJ's PER is slightly higher due to averaging 0.8 less TOs a game, which is thanks to sharing ballhandling duties with Pippen.

Ether.

So not only is MJ not 10 times better than Kobe on his worst day, he's actually a worse player during his 2nd 3peat. :roll:

[3ball]

Peak Kobe (06-08): 31.7/5.8/5.1 on 57,1%TS
2nd 3-peat MJ (96-98): 29.6/6.1/4.0 on 56%TS


despite kobe getting to stat-pad and not win anything, his stats still can't beat a 33 to 35 year-old MJ, whose stats represent playing optimal basketball to the tune of a 3-peat.

kobe's very best 3 years can't beat jordan's worst 3.... :roll:





now let's compare Kobe's 3 straight Finals runs to 96-98 MJ Finals runs

Kobe (08-10): 29.8/5.7/5.5 on 56,9%TS
MJ (96-98): 31.4/6.0/4.1 on 56.5%TS


MJ's stats are clearly better here - and he was older, with vastly superior Finals numbers.

Again, Kobe's very best 3 years can't beat Jordan's worst 3.





and if we take FG% into account, Kobe had a higher FG% in the Playoffs than MJ as well


no he didn't - kobe 06'-08' playoff FG% was 45.7%, less than MJ's 45.9% from 96'-98'.
.

[Droid101]

despite kobe getting to stat-pad and not win anything, his stats still can't beat a 33 to 35 year-old MJ, whose stats represent playing optimal basketball to the tune of a 3-peat.

Uh no. The thread states that MJ on his "worst day" is better than Kobe on his best. This exact post proves otherwise, so you are wrong, and will always be wrong, if you are defending it.

[Magic 32]

now let's compare Kobe's 3 straight Finals runs to 96-98 MJ Finals runs

Kobe (08-10): 29.8/5.7/5.5 on 56,9%TS
MJ (96-98): 31.4/6.0/4.1 on 56.5%TS

MJ's stats are clearly better here - and he was older, with vastly superior Finals numbers.

it's easy to make someone look better if you lie about the numbers.


http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/teamsites/images/legacy/jazz/20110902_hornacek_2.jpg

http://cache.boston.com/resize/bonzai-fba/Globe_Photo/2008/07/08/1215569514_9463/539w.jpg

http://ambasketball.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/9e066ea8cc_allen_10182007.jpg

[3ball]

Uh no. The thread states that MJ on his "worst day" is better than Kobe on his best. This exact post proves otherwise, so you are wrong, and will always be wrong, if you are defending it.
kobe's stats from 06'-08' (his best 3 years) are the same as Jordan's worst 3 years (96'-98'), only kobe's stats represent stat-padding and not winning anything, while Jordan's stats represent optimal, winning basketball to the tune of a 3-peat.

just look at plus-minus stats - Jordan's plus-minus during his 2nd three-peat is the highest of anyone ever.

[Droid101]

kobe's stats from 06'-08' (his best 3 years) are the same as Jordan's worst 3 years (96'-98'), only kobe's stats represent stat-padding and not winning anything, while Jordan's stats represent optimal, winning basketball to the tune of a 3-peat.
"Stat padding" is ****ing retarded. He was doing his best with the team he was given.

Regardless, it is nowhere near "10 times" worse than Jordan's worse years; not even close.

Go home kid.

PS: Jordan's worst years were when he was on the Wizards.

#wow #woah #makesuthink

[MastaKilla]

kobe's stats from 06'-08' (his best 3 years) are the same as Jordan's worst 3 years (96'-98'), only kobe's stats represent stat-padding and not winning anything, while Jordan's stats represent optimal, winning basketball to the tune of a 3-peat.

just look at plus-minus stats - Jordan's plus-minus during his 2nd three-peat is the highest of anyone ever.

unfortunately for Kobe he didn't have another first team all nba/first team all defense player beside him plus another first team defender/rebounding champ plus the 6 MOTY..

[3ball]

unfortunately for Kobe he didn't have another first team all nba/first team all defense player beside him plus another first team defender/rebounding champ plus the 6 MOTY..
rodman averaged 2.3 ppg, 7.7 rebs, and 0.3 blks in 1997 Finals.... and then he averaged 3.3 ppg, 8.3 rebs, and 0.2 blks in 1998 Finals.

this is worse than Bynum's contribution in the 2009 and 2010 Finals, especially when you consider Bynum's rim protection.

and i'd take pau gasol over scottie any day - a lot of HOF's like Isiah Thomas think Scottie is very overrated - either way, it's pretty close and the two can cancel each other out from a sheer talent standpoint.

but after rodman and scottie, jordan only has toni kukocs - while kobe has lamar odom, who gave a better 2-way contribution than kukocs and had way better stats (twice the rebounds).

[MastaKilla]

rodman averaged 2.3 ppg, 7.7 rebs, and 0.3 blks in 1997 Finals.... and then he averaged 3.3 ppg, 8.3 rebs, and 0.2 blks in 1998 Finals.

this is worse than Bynum's contribution in the 2009 and 2010 Finals, especially when you consider Bynum's rim protection.

and i'd take pau gasol over scottie any day - a lot of HOF's like Isiah Thomas think Scottie is very overrated - either way, it's pretty close and the two can cancel each other out from a sheer talent standpoint.

but after rodman and scottie, jordan only has toni kukocs - while kobe has lamar odom, who gave a better 2-way contribution than kukocs and had better stats.

:roll: :roll:

you are such a troll

Pippen: 3x NBA first team, 2x NBA second team, 2x third team, 10x all defensive team (8 first team all with Bulls)

Gasol: 1x NBA first team, 2x NBA third team, 0x all defensive team

[ImKobe]

kobe's stats from 06'-08' (his best 3 years) are the same as Jordan's worst 3 years (96'-98'), only kobe's stats represent stat-padding and not winning anything, while Jordan's stats represent optimal, winning basketball to the tune of a 3-peat.

just look at plus-minus stats - Jordan's plus-minus during his 2nd three-peat is the highest of anyone ever.

His best 3 yrs are actually from 01-03, but then he was sharing touches with Shaq and did not attempt as many shots (nor got as many FTs), his best averages come from 06-08 since that was basically the only time in his career he had free reign on offense (when he was in his prime, not talking 2010-14 Kobe.

And you can't compare their numbers literally like they played in the same era...

MJ's "optimal winning" from 96-98 are in a large way a tribute to the great teammates he had that made the game much easier for him. Kobe from 06-08 had shitty rosters, so his efficiency isn't going to be optimal.

This thread was about MJ's worst being better than Kobe's best, nikka that's a straight up lie. Kobe from 08-10 put up better numbers in the Playoffs than 96-98 MJ did.

People want to take Kobe's 2010 FMVP away for averaging 29/8/4 on 53%TS, MJ in the 96 Finals averaged 27/5/4 on 54%TS

And Kobe's 2001 WC Playoff numbers are on par with 91 MJ's EC Playoff numbers (mind you that Kobe is 21 years old and MJ is in his full prime).

Kobe: 32/7/6 on 49% shooting
MJ: 31/6/7 on 51% shooting

And Kobe in the 2002 Finals, putting up 27/6/5 on 18 FGA (1.5 pps) on the #1 ranked defense is also mad underrated.

[3ball]

Kobe's peak 06'-08' vs. Jordan's 96'-98'


Kobe:.. 26.1 PER, 57.1% TS, 45.7% FG, 115 ORtg, WS/48: 0.211
Jordan: 27.4 PER, 56.0% TS, 48.2% FG, 119 ORtg, WS/48: 0.279


Per Game Stats

Kobe:.. 31.1 pts, 5.8 rebs, 5.1 assists, 45.7% FG, 1.7 stls, 0.4 blks
Jordan: 29.6 pts, 6.1 rebs, 4.0 assists, 48.2% FG, 1.9 stls, 0.5 blks


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 40.6 pts, 7.4 rebs, 6.5 assists, 2.2 stls, 0.6 blks
Jordan: 41.4 pts, 8.5 rebs, 5.5 assists, 2.6 stls, 0.7 blks

[dubeta]

Boiled down:




LeBron >> MJ >>>>>>>> Kobe

[3ball]

Jordan performed FAR better in the playoffs from 96'-98' than Kobe did in his peak 06'-08'.

it's not even close - Jordan has 35% higher WS/48: 0.273 to 0.203

[3ball]

Kobe from 08-10 put up better numbers in the Playoffs than 96-98 MJ did..


Kobe's Playoff Best 06'-08' vs. Jordan's Worst 96'-98'


Kobe:.. 25.5 PER, 56.9% TS, 46.4% FG, 115 ORtg, WS/48: 0.203
Jordan: 27.3 PER, 54.3% TS, 45.9% FG, 118 ORtg, WS/48: 0.268


Per Game Stats

Kobe:.. 29.8 pts, 5.7 rebs, 5.5 assists, 1.6 stls, 0.7 blks
Jordan: 31.4 pts, 6.0 rebs, 4.1 assists, 1.6 stls, 0.6 blks


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 38.6 pts, 7.3 rebs, 7.1 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.9 blks
Jordan: 42.5 pts, 8.1 rebs, 5.6 assists, 2.2 stls, 0.8 blks



:facepalm .. Reggie Miller was right - Jordan's worst was better than Kobe's best - and Jordan really crushes Kobe if we look only at Finals numbers over these time periods.
.

[dreamwarrior]

reggie still salty about the fight with kobe

[3ball]

reggie still salty about the fight with kobe


http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/adc2eecce0fccf26ea9f6505d5d063b5.gif

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/77a764560aa9ba77579484ea1c04302f.gif

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/c965117e51ea53af09a731a437121aa1.gif

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHoN_joY6rY

[Da_Realist]

Nikkas are on some serious trolling ish in this thread

peak Kobe 06-10? We're putting 5 seasons of Kobe vs 3 seasons of MJ? Kobe played on limited minutes in both 09 and 10, his peak was 06-08

Peak Kobe (06-08): 31.7/5.8/5.1 on 57,1%TS
2nd 3-peat MJ (96-98): 29.6/6.1/4.0 on 56%TS

now let's compare Kobe's 3 straight Finals runs to 96-98 MJ Finals runs

Kobe (08-10): 29.8/5.7/5.5 on 56,9%TS
MJ (96-98): 31.4/6.0/4.1 on 54,3%TS

and if we take FG% into account, Kobe had a higher FG% in the Playoffs than MJ as well, MJ took 24.7 FGA vs Kobe's 22.4 FGA to average 1.6 more points per game, that's 2.3 more shots a game + 1 extra FTA for an extra 1.6 points. :kobe:, and Kobe shot a higher percentage on 2s, 3s(MJ 3 3s a game, Kobe 5), and FTs. MJ's PER is slightly higher due to averaging 0.8 less TOs a game, which is thanks to sharing ballhandling duties with Pippen.

You shouldn't even want to count 08. They gave up a huge lead at home to go down 3-1 and then lost by 100 points in the closeout game. That disqualifies the whole playoffs from a legacy perspective. Unless you just want to look at the stats and gloss over what really happened.

Also here are highlights of what MJ did during 96-98 Finals



- Flu game (stomach virus) in the Finals that ends with game winning shot
- Near 39-point triple double
- Game winning buzzer beater
- Championship winning assist
- Championship winning shot-steal-shot combo

Add to this... Going into Game 6 in Utah with his best teammate suffering with a back injury and snatching the title on his last legs. Could Kobe do that?

[blablabla]

That's some serious BS by Reggie, sure everyone knows Jordan is better than Kobe but when Kobe is hot he's literally unstoppable, maybe even above MJ at least as a scorer. I would have said MJ on his worst day is ten times better than Kobe on his. Kobe has had some serious off games over the years and far more of them than MJ, no wonder he is the all time leader in missed shots. That's my opinion at least and it is as valuable as Reggie's seeing as we both have 0 rings.

[Da_Realist]

That's some serious BS by Reggie, sure everyone knows Jordan is better than Kobe but when Kobe is hot he's literally unstoppable, maybe even above MJ at least as a scorer. I would have said MJ on his worst day is ten times better than Kobe on his. Kobe has had some serious off games over the years and far more of them than MJ, no wonder he is the all time leader in missed shots. That's my opinion at least and it is as valuable as Reggie's seeing as we both have 0 rings.

I think Kobe at his absolute best could ring a higher scoring total against softer defenses than MJ. Not so against tougher and especially more physical defenses. Which is why Kobe never* lit it up in the playoffs.

* never = an exaggeration. I know he had some high 40's games and a 50 point game in the playoffs.

[ArbitraryWater]

:lol people actually trying to justify these remarks as if they have any merit...

Reggie's delusional or he's trying to keep his legacy intact in some bizarre way seeing how he was abused by Jordan for years....

:roll:

so sensitive lmaoo


If Reggie Miller truly believes that he is an idiot. MJ better player of course maybe even twice as good but 10 times better GTFO with that hot garbage.

you're not supposed to take it literally :facepalm

Wouldn't even be measurable... All he's saying is MJ is a far superior player, no questions asked, and he's right.

[Budadiiii]

:roll:

so sensitive lmaoo



you're not supposed to take it literally :facepalm

Wouldn't even be measurable... All he's saying is MJ is a far superior player, no questions asked, and he's right.
Stop trying to belittle people. You're one of the biggest retards on this site, if not the biggest. Stop trying to "bully" people, it's ****ing embarrassing for everyone reading. Stick to being the punching bag. That's about the only thing you're good for on here.

[ArbitraryWater]

Still got Bukaki (lawl) on a leash it seems

[fandarko]

Yes he was

Yes he was. And MJ is my favourite all time player.

[fandarko]

:roll:

so sensitive lmaoo



you're not supposed to take it literally :facepalm

Wouldn't even be measurable... All he's saying is MJ is a far superior player, no questions asked, and he's right.

He was better, but he was not "far superior".

This is getting ridiculous.

Prime, first three-peat MJ was a better player than prime Kobe.

Slightly. Which means a great deal at this highest level of individual skill and accomplishment.

[stalkerforlife]

Jordan beat him. Plain and simple. If Reggie makes Jordan look otherworldly, it makes himself look better.

It was an idiotic statement and in fact, very, very false.

Reggie got the reaction he wanted, though.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Prime Jordan was not "slightly" better than prime Kobe - he was like 10% better in terms of impact, which is substantial when you're talking about players at this level.

[YouGotServed]

He is correct. Very accurate assessment by Reggie there. Jordan is better and is not even close.

[Tking714]

Stupid comment. Even Jordan knows he'd have to bring his best against Kobe all the time. If he slips even a little Kobe is going for the sleeper.

[3ball]

Kobe's Playoff Best 06'-08' vs. Jordan's Worst 96'-98'


Kobe:.. 25.5 PER, 56.9% TS, 46.4% FG, 115 ORtg, WS/48: 0.203
Jordan: 27.3 PER, 54.3% TS, 45.9% FG, 118 ORtg, WS/48: 0.268


Per Game Stats

Kobe:.. 29.8 pts, 5.7 rebs, 5.5 assists, 1.6 stls, 0.7 blks
Jordan: 31.4 pts, 6.0 rebs, 4.1 assists, 1.6 stls, 0.6 blks


Per-100 Possession stats

Kobe:.. 38.6 pts, 7.3 rebs, 7.1 assists, 2.0 stls, 0.9 blks
Jordan: 42.5 pts, 8.1 rebs, 5.6 assists, 2.2 stls, 0.8 blks


what am i missing - the stats ^^^^^^^ show that jordan's worst playoff stats (96'-98') are better than kobe's best playoff stats (06'-08').

so reggie is right - jordan at his worst, is better than kobe at his best... pretty much every category - look at the gap in WS/48... wow.

not sure what the debate is - the data is clear... :confusedshrug: