So what's up with Cleveland and Lebron?

[triangleoffense]

We gonna act like there's no pieces there? Seems like Lebron can't really go all the way without 2 other superstars on his side.

[Im so nba'd out]

How bout them lakers

[Cocaine80s]

Bosh and Irving were never considered superstars

[Fudge]

Imagine what Durant would do with Love and Irving as his teammates. Top seed in the East right now, I guarantee it.

[edrick]

We gonna act like there's no pieces there? Seems like Lebron can't really go all the way without 2 other superstars on his side.

You just described practically every top team in the West.

Neither Love nor Irving have any playoff experience, that's not something that should be ignored. Bosh barely had any playoff experience before joining the Heat, either.

[pauk]

1. Interior defense
2. Kyrie Irving never was & never will be a superstar, the guy is essentially a better Mo Williams with flashy handles, not a bad thing, but yea and i dont consider Love a superstar aswell.
3. The rest of the roster is basically what you would call "scrubs".
4. Chemistry, but thats normal for a new team/offense etc. playing their first games together.
5. Did i mention interior defense?

Thats what is going on.

[J Shuttlesworth]

Imagine what Durant would do with Love and Irving as his teammates. Top seed in the East right now, I guarantee it.
Sorry bud but Durant isn't stopping other teams from taking shits on the Cavs frontcourt.

[STATUTORY]

1. Interior defense
2. Kyrie Irving never was & never will be a superstar, the guy is essentially a better Mo Williams with flashy handles, not a bad thing, but yea and i dont consider Love a superstar aswell.
3. The rest of the roster is basically what you would call "scrubs".
4. Chemistry, but thats normal for a new team/offense etc. playing their first games together.
5. Did i mention interior defense?

Thats what is going on.

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

dat scapegoating, dat deflection, dat smoke screen

:applause:

Kyrie universally considered top 3 PG last year = mo williams now

Love, the guy that Lebron personally campaigned and recruited for = never was good

[pauk]

Imagine what Durant would do with Love and Irving as his teammates. Top seed in the East right now, I guarantee it.

Yea im sure he would do better with a team who at every position (and bench) plays much worse defense compared to OKC.... and KD's defense wont help much either...

[Cocaine80s]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

dat scapegoating, dat deflection, dat smoke screen

:applause:

Kyrie universally considered top 3 PG last year = mo williams now

Love, the guy that Lebron personally campaigned and recruited for = never was good
:biggums:

[Relinquish]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

dat scapegoating, dat deflection, dat smoke screen

:applause:

Kyrie universally considered top 3 PG last year = mo williams now

Love, the guy that Lebron personally campaigned and recruited for = never was good

Kyrie wasn't even top 8 last year, and still might not be. :biggums: :biggums:

You are on some shit.

[pauk]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

dat scapegoating, dat deflection, dat smoke screen

:applause:

Kyrie universally considered top 3 PG last year = mo williams now

Love, the guy that Lebron personally campaigned and recruited for = never was good

I didnt say Kyrie = Mo Williams, i said Kyrie is a better version of Mo Williams, similar games/gamestyles at that size/position especially when Lebron is next to him. Lebrons game is similar to Scottie Pippen, doesnt mean he is only that good. :confusedshrug: Understand? And no, Kyrie was not top 3 PG last year.

Love is great offensively, but horrible defensively, for the outcome of the game it almost nullifies whatever he does offensively..... he is the #1 problem for Cavs lack of interior defense...

[STATUTORY]

Kyrie wasn't even top 8 last year, and still might not be. :biggums: :biggums:

You are on some shit.
8 point guards better than Kyrie last year?

name them

[Undisputed]

Maybe this just isn't their year. Which doesn't diminish LeBron, Irving, and Love at all. It's just going to take some time.

[Cocaine80s]

8 point guards better than Kyrie last year?

name them
Curry
Cp3
Westbrook
Lillard
Parker
Wall

were all better

Not 8 but Kyrie definitely was not top 3 last year

[J Shuttlesworth]

8 point guards better than Kyrie last year?

name them
CP3
Westbrook
Tony parker
Curry
Lillard
John Wall

There's 6 that have a case. You lost all credibility when you said he was a top 3. No way he was better than Cp3, Westbrook, or Curry

[STATUTORY]

CP3
Westbrook
Tony parker
Curry
Lillard
John Wall

There's 6 that have a case. You lost all credibility when you said he was a top 3. No way he was better than Cp3, Westbrook, or Curry
and you lost all credibility when you said 8, those 6 are "debatable" and really guys like parker and wall, last year, are barely that. cp3 is overrated and curry vs kyrie is simply a matter of coaching and system.

get a clue

[coin24]

Probably due to brans decline and the team plays no D

[J Shuttlesworth]

and you lost all credibility when you said 8, those 6 are "debatable" and really guys like parker and wall, last year, are barely that. cp3 is overrated and curry vs kyrie is simply a matter of coaching and system.

get a clue
I never said 8, idiot.

[Milbuck]

Kyrie Irving never was & never will be a superstar, the guy is essentially a better Mo Williams with flashy handles, not a bad thing, but yea and i dont consider Love a superstar aswell.
Irving is an all-star game MVP, FIBA MVP on a team with Davis, Harden, Cousins, Curry, etc...these aren't MVPs or FMVPs or anything in terms of prestige, but to shine in those settings takes some serious game. Mo Williams with flashy handles... You don't have to consider either a superstar, I sure as hell don't, but you can't deny the talent there.

Your other points are fair, regarding chemistry and interior defense. One of those is just going to take time, and the other is just a fundamental weakness in the roster's construction, which may or may not ever be resolved this season, considering how little there is to work with in terms of available free agents and/or quality defensive bigs on the trade block.

I think chemistry will eventually be resolved...those three are way too talented and have too good an understanding of the game to never develop comfort playing alongside each other offensively. Defensively I see that being a serious flaw in this team. That's something you can't just expect them to "figure out", and I think will be the reason why they can make the finals, but will get destroyed if they get there.

[Cocaine80s]

I never said 8, idiot.
:oldlol:

[STATUTORY]

I never said 8, idiot.
am i really suppose to keep track of which bran stan posted what? :confusedshrug:

[J Shuttlesworth]

am i really suppose to keep track of which bran stan posted what? :confusedshrug:
No, I wouldn't expect someone as dumb as you to be able to hold 2 conversations at once

[Inferno]

and you lost all credibility when you said 8, those 6 are "debatable" and really guys like parker and wall, last year, are barely that. cp3 is overrated and curry vs kyrie is simply a matter of coaching and system.

get a clue

:biggums: :biggums:

Curry >> Kyrie in literally everything

[livingby3's]

LeBron definitely isn't in his best shape right now, but having Irving and Love doesn't make things better.

There's a reason those two have had losing records their whole careers before coming together, and had never played a minute of PO basketball in like a combined 9 seasons.

You sort of developed a losing mentality after all those years, that fire just isn't there. Having talents on a team doesn't equate to immediate success. The culture has to change after all those tanking years. That said, LeBron has to be a better leader for that team, he's the clear cut best player and knows how to play winning ball. Those three have alot to work on.

[bluechox2]

Wussup is that he doesn't have wade to carry him anymore

[STATUTORY]

No, I wouldn't expect someone as dumb as you to be able to hold 2 conversations at once

:lol u think what u do here constitute a conversation? take ur 6000 post since january 200+ pound diet dr. pepper sipping ass out of the basement please.

[andremiller07]

1. Interior defense
2. Kyrie Irving never was & never will be a superstar, the guy is essentially a better Mo Williams with flashy handles, not a bad thing, but yea and i dont consider Love a superstar aswell.
3. The rest of the roster is basically what you would call "scrubs".
4. Chemistry, but thats normal for a new team/offense etc. playing their first games together.
5. Did i mention interior defense?

Thats what is going on.
Truer words never been spoken

[SexSymbol]

1. Interior defense
2. Kyrie Irving never was & never will be a superstar, the guy is essentially a better Mo Williams with flashy handles, not a bad thing, but yea and i dont consider Love a superstar aswell.
3. The rest of the roster is basically what you would call "scrubs".
4. Chemistry, but thats normal for a new team/offense etc. playing their first games together.
5. Did i mention interior defense?

Thats what is going on.
so what's up with Love being as good as Durant, Pauk?
Motherfocker deflecting shit left and right

[Lebron23]

They are doing good. They just needs some rim protection, and consistency every game.

[plowking]

2. Kyrie Irving never was & never will be a superstar, the guy is essentially a better Mo Williams with flashy handles, not a bad thing, but yea and i dont consider Love a superstar aswell.



Then explain this.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=259855

Seriously.

"But I'm a non biased, facts only fan"

Shut up bitch. :oldlol:
You get sonned daily on here, going back on your opinion and doing anything to try and hype Lebron.

[Heavincent]

Then explain this.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=259855

Seriously.

"But I'm a non biased, facts only fan"

Shut up bitch. :oldlol:
You get sonned daily on here, going back on your opinion and doing anything to try and hype Lebron.

Damn...

[J Shuttlesworth]

Then explain this.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=259855

Seriously.

"But I'm a non biased, facts only fan"

Shut up bitch. :oldlol:
You get sonned daily on here, going back on your opinion and doing anything to try and hype Lebron.
:lebronamazed:

[The Red Viper]

Cavs have a very talented but flawed squad. I disagree that Kyrie isn't an all star. He is. He may not be amongst the top five point guards in the game but he is still very good. Same with Love, who was never the best power forward like many claimed but he is amongst the top five power forwards in the game. Their major problem is their defense. Both interior as well as perimeter. Love's defense is horrible and while Kyrie has improved his, its still not enough. They are stacked offensively and once they all gel in properly, they will be gold offensively. But in order to win the championship, you need a balanced squad which is good in both the offense as well as defense. They are getting killed in the paint and you have random guys shooting threes for fun against them.

The likes of Andy Varejao and Dion Waiters are good indivdiual players but they are not the "right" players for that team. With LeBron, Kyrie and Love there, you don't need more players who are good in offense. You need good defensive players who will hustle for you. Replace Andy with a good rim-protector like Biyombo and Dion with a good wing defender and you would see them do much better than what they have done.

[theaussieguy]

Cavs have a very talented but flawed squad. I disagree that Kyrie isn't an all star. He is. He may not be amongst the top five point guards in the game but he is still very good. Same with Love, who was never the best power forward like many claimed but he is amongst the top five power forwards in the game. Their major problem is their defense. Both interior as well as perimeter. Love's defense is horrible and while Kyrie has improved his, its still not enough. They are stacked offensively and once they all gel in properly, they will be gold offensively. But in order to win the championship, you need a balanced squad which is good in both the offense as well as defense. They are getting killed in the paint and you have random guys shooting threes for fun against them.

The likes of Andy Varejao and Dion Waiters are good indivdiual players but they are not the "right" players for that team. With LeBron, Kyrie and Love there, you don't need more players who are good in offense. You need good defensive players who will hustle for you. Replace Andy with a good rim-protector like Biyombo and Dion with a good wing defender and you would see them do much better than what they have done.

its cringe worthy how watching a CLE game. They beast on offense then the very next play down the floor everyone just stands around and lets in an easy layup

[DoodleDa]

and you lost all credibility when you said 8, those 6 are "debatable" and really guys like parker and wall, last year, are barely that. cp3 is overrated and curry vs kyrie is simply a matter of coaching and system.

get a clue

Curry is so much better than Kyrie that it isn't really close.

[theaussieguy]

Curry is so much better than Kyrie that it isn't really close.

yeah, kyrie lacks awareness, Curry can start creating for himself and as soon as he sees a better option he has the awareness and skill to instantly opt out and defer for a better shot, kyrie is all in or nothing when it comes to creating for himself.

[2swift4u]

This cleveland team reminds me a lot of the 2011 Miami team. They play very well at times but the consistency isn't there yet. However the huge potential is clearly visible. But I'm not sure how good they can get on the defensive end of the floor. They also lack size under the rim, just like Miami did. When they played OKC a couple of days ago this became very obvious. So I guess they will continue to get abused under the rim by a lot of teams.

[I<3NBA]

They need better defenders. Keep the big 3. Everyone else is tradeable.

[DukeDelonte13]

the squad is not "flawed"

it's not simply an interior defense problem either. A rim protector isn't going to magically fix their problems, they still have issues guarding the perimeter.


The problem is Love, Kyrie, and Lebron play L-A-Z-Y.

Lebron throws sloppy passes, Love has been sloppy on the defensive glass, and Kyrie is still trying to find his way.

They don't communicate enough, and they haven't fully bought in. They won't until Lebron will, and I think Lebron is not jiving w/ coach Blatt.

This cavs team plays with 0 intensity.

[pastis]

the squad is not "flawed"

it's not simply an interior defense problem either. A rim protector isn't going to magically fix their problems, they still have issues guarding the perimeter.


The problem is Love, Kyrie, and Lebron play L-A-Z-Y.

Lebron throws sloppy passes, Love has been sloppy on the defensive glass, and Kyrie is still trying to find his way.

They don't communicate enough, and they haven't fully bought in. They won't until Lebron will, and I think Lebron is not jiving w/ coach Blatt.

This cavs team plays with 0 intensity.

what? i think lebron and kyrie are the only ones giving everything every night. did you see how lebron was looking after love gets raped everytime on the d-end?

[The Red Viper]

the squad is not "flawed"

it's not simply an interior defense problem either. A rim protector isn't going to magically fix their problems, they still have issues guarding the perimeter.


The problem is Love, Kyrie, and Lebron play L-A-Z-Y.

Lebron throws sloppy passes, Love has been sloppy on the defensive glass, and Kyrie is still trying to find his way.

They don't communicate enough, and they haven't fully bought in. They won't until Lebron will, and I think Lebron is not jiving w/ coach Blatt.

This cavs team plays with 0 intensity.

The problem for LeBron is after the last four years where he has gone to the NBA finals each time, it has taken a toll on his body. The minutes don't help either. He can still lock down a guy in the crunch time if the need arises and he has shown it but the issue is doing it consistently. So, that is why you won't see him having the intensity you would have with the old LeBron. Usually you have a set of players in a team compensate for the main man's lack of defensive contribution. With Cavs, they have three.

But, I agree with you that by simply getting a good rim protector and a wing defender, it won't solve all their issues. The first improvement has to come from the team in terms of effort and intensity.

[f0und]

Then explain this.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=259855

Seriously.

"But I'm a non biased, facts only fan"

Shut up bitch. :oldlol:
You get sonned daily on here, going back on your opinion and doing anything to try and hype Lebron.

:lol

[jzek]

As always, 'bron's coasting. He'll wake up after the All Star break like always...

[Kingwillball]

Imagine what Durant would do with Love and Irving as his teammates. Top seed in the East right now, I guarantee it.


lol your funny..:rolleyes:

[Kingwillball]

This cleveland team reminds me a lot of the 2011 Miami team. They play very well at times but the consistency isn't there yet. However the huge potential is clearly visible. But I'm not sure how good they can get on the defensive end of the floor. They also lack size under the rim, just like Miami did. When they played OKC a couple of days ago this became very obvious. So I guess they will continue to get abused under the rim by a lot of teams.

Rebounding not a problem so not sure it's size but instead lack of interior defenders.

[hawksdogsbraves]

This cleveland team reminds me a lot of the 2011 Miami team. They play very well at times but the consistency isn't there yet. However the huge potential is clearly visible. But I'm not sure how good they can get on the defensive end of the floor. They also lack size under the rim, just like Miami did. When they played OKC a couple of days ago this became very obvious. So I guess they will continue to get abused under the rim by a lot of teams.

The 2011 team, even when it was finding its groove, always had elite perimeter defense. Like, the best in the league.

This Cavs team doesn't have that at all, and with weak interior defense, you're left with one crappy defensive team.

[Jlamb47]

Funny how Love an Irving arnt good anymore now they are with Lebron, when half of the people on ish would name Love top 3 PF.

[DukeDelonte13]

adding a great individual defensive player will not make a team instantly good at defending.

The team must learn how to defend as one unit.

[JellyBean]

Bosh and Irving were never considered superstars

:coleman:

Really? You went there?

[JellyBean]

adding a great individual defensive player will not make a team instantly good at defending.

The team must learn how to defend as one unit.

I am glad that Kevin Garnett does not read ISH, especially with that first sentence.

I seem to recall the Celtics before KG arrived were ranked some where in the middle (16th/30) on their defense. They add KG and they were the #1 defensive team in that 07-08 Championship season. Just saying :confusedshrug:

[Nash]

1. Interior defense
2. Kyrie Irving never was & never will be a superstar, the guy is essentially a better Mo Williams with flashy handles, not a bad thing, but yea and i dont consider Love a superstar aswell.
3. The rest of the roster is basically what you would call "scrubs".
4. Chemistry, but thats normal for a new team/offense etc. playing their first games together.
5. Did i mention interior defense?

Thats what is going on.
:roll: :roll:
kyrie not a superstar. Kyrie is a star with all the potential in the world to be a superstar.

The team has chemistry issues and issues on defense, that is it. At times they've looked bad but at others they've looked fantastic.


it takes time, team is basically bunch of new guys playing together.
chill out

[jlip]

Meh...They more than likely will still win 50+ games and have homecourt in the first round. No big deal.

[Papaya Petee]

Then explain this.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=259855

Seriously.

"But I'm a non biased, facts only fan"

Shut up bitch. :oldlol:
You get sonned daily on here, going back on your opinion and doing anything to try and hype Lebron.
:roll: :roll:
This is comical. Pauk is the biggest idiot on this board.