Kobe says European players more skilled than Americans, blames AAU

[JohnMax]

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/12114523/kobe-bryant-says-european-players-more-skilled-americans-blames-aau


Kobe Bryant believes European basketball players are more skillful than American basketball players, and says it's a growing trend that can be blamed on the greed and coaching at the AAU level.

"I just think European players are just way more skillful," Bryant said Friday night after the Los Angeles Lakers' 109-106 loss to the Memphis Grizzlies. "They are just taught the game the right way at an early age. ... They're more skillful. It's something we really have to fix. We really have to address that. We have to teach our kids to play the right way."

Bryant was quick to point the finger for the decline of skilled players in the United States.

"AAU basketball," Bryant said. "Horrible, terrible AAU basketball. It's stupid. It doesn't teach our kids how to play the game at all so you wind up having players that are big and they bring it up and they do all this fancy crap and they don't know how to post. They don't know the fundamentals of the game. It's stupid."

Bryant was born in Philadelphia, but when he was 6, his father, former NBA player Joe Bryant, moved the family to Italy to continue his playing career. Kobe spent his childhood in Europe until Joe retired in 1991 and moved the family back to the United States.

"When you have limitations and you understand your limitations and you stay within yourself, you can be great," Kobe Bryant said. "You know what you can do and what you can't do. In America, it's a big problem for us because we're not teaching players how to play all-around basketball. That's why you have Pau and Marc [Gasol], and that's the reason why 90 percent of the Spurs' roster is European players, because they have more skill."

Bryant smiled when asked what type of player he would have become if his family had never moved to Italy and he hadn't learned how to play the game in Europe.

"I probably wouldn't be able to dribble with my left and shoot with my left and have good footwork," Bryant said. "I was kind of fortunate because when I was growing up in Italy, the Red Auerbachs and the Tex Winters and all those great coaches were doing clinics and camps in Europe. They were teaching all the club coaches, and the club coaches were following their advice and their fundamentals like the bible, and they were teaching all of us kids that type of stuff. Me, Manu [Ginobili] and all these guys that grew up around that same time, we're a product of that. It's a big difference."

Bryant had a simple solution to the problem.

"Teach players the game at an early age and stop treating them like cash cows for everyone to profit off of," he said. "That's how you do that. You have to teach them the game. Give them instruction."

But Bryant, who holds an annual summer basketball camp, also was quick to point out that any solution involving changing the current culture of AAU basketball won't happen overnight.

"That's a deep well because then you start cutting into people's pockets," Bryant said. "People get really upset when you start cutting into their pockets because all they do is try to profit off these poor kids. There's no quick answer."

http://i.imgur.com/79c7dOg.png

[JohnFreeman]

Kobe thought everyone had an Italian villa

[chocolatethunder]

Already a thread on this

[Imtheman]

Knowledgebe strikes again

[B-hoop]

Kobe thought everyone had an Italian villa

Why so salty?

[gts]

Already a thread on thisYeah but Euorleague is posting in that one... He got all excited because Kobe said something positive about international players and jizzed all over the place


AAU has been a mess for sometime now... i think it's great there's a place the kids can get that much basketball in on a year round basis but the financial side is really creepy and most these kids float from club to club so there's no time to teach them basketball basics

not unlike college ball where the coaches only have a gifted player for a year so why bother teaching the fundamentals when you barely have enough time to teach him the system

[JohnMax]

http://i.imgur.com/rBcEXie.png

http://i.imgur.com/gzkPLmw.png

https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429058014494721
https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429447736635395

[Haymaker]

Somebody tell Kobe that Manu is from Argentina. :oldlol:

[JohnFreeman]

http://i.imgur.com/rBcEXie.png

http://i.imgur.com/gzkPLmw.png

https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429058014494721
https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429447736635395
:bowdown:

[Bandito]

http://i.imgur.com/rBcEXie.png

http://i.imgur.com/gzkPLmw.png

https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429058014494721
https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429447736635395
Somebody's butthurt:oldlol:

[atljonesbro]

Kobe is far worse than AAU teaching kids being a selfish shot chucker when you don't have the talent to be one is OK.

[sportjames23]

Educationbe

Teachthegametherightwaybe

[Bandito]

Being an assistant coach in AAU, I agree there is some alarming aspects about it, and even feels a bit corrupt. Much more a product or feeder system than it is a teaching tool to actually improve kids. Before I even joined the first thing I told our program leader was I want to bring back to basket skills back. But in this basketball climate it's difficult, and isn't the sexiest thing to teach kids.

We cheat our kid athletes out of aspects of the game because everyone out there is out for themselves. Everyone is trying to be a ball in hand star player.

But American lack of skills? Besides Kobe not including himself, what is he talking about?

LeBron (his court vision, passing alone makes him uniquely elite skilled)
Durant (Amazing shooter, ball handler @ 6'11)
CP3 (Possibly the best all around PG ever, both sides of ball)
Steph Curry (Best shooter of all-time?)
K. Love (Ridiculously skilled, smaller white, American Gasol)
Anthony Davis (a do it all PF who can handle the ball)

Some of these guys are of the most skilled of all-time, accompanied with elite bodies or athleticism. That's why Americans are better. Not simply due to athleticism. It's the lethal combination of that inherent genetic lottery with great skills.
He was probably talking about Lin.

[SamuraiSWISH]

Being an assistant coach in AAU, I agree there is some alarming aspects about it, and even feels a bit corrupt. Much more a product or feeder system than it is a teaching tool to actually improve kids. Before I even joined the first thing I told our program leader was I want to bring back to basket skills back. But in this basketball climate it's difficult, and isn't the sexiest thing to teach kids.

We cheat our kid athletes out of aspects of the game because everyone out there is out for themselves. Everyone is trying to be a ball in hand star player.

But American lack of skills? Besides Kobe not including himself, what is he talking about?

LeBron (his court vision, passing alone makes him uniquely elite skilled)
Durant (Amazing shooter, ball handler @ 6'11)
CP3 (Possibly the best all around PG ever, both sides of ball)
Steph Curry (Best shooter of all-time?)
K. Love (Ridiculously skilled, smaller white, American Gasol)
Anthony Davis (a do it all PF who can handle the ball)

Some of these guys are of the most skilled of all-time, accompanied with elite bodies or athleticism. That's why Americans are better. Not simply due to athleticism. It's the lethal combination of that inherent genetic lottery with great skills.

Kobe grew up in Italy, as an American, playing a caricature of our entire game because he was raised exclusively on MJ Come Fly w/ Me tapes.

Those tweets are correct, LeBron plays a more well rounded all-around game than Kobe offensively. Besides the lack of comparable post foot work, how is LeBron not every bit as talented if not more than Kobe?

[SHAQisGOAT]

Good shit, I agree with his premise/point.

[tpols]

Being an assistant coach in AAU, I agree there is some alarming aspects about it, and even feels a bit corrupt. Much more a product or feeder system than it is a teaching tool to actually improve kids. Before I even joined the first thing I told our program leader was I want to bring back to basket skills back. But in this basketball climate it's difficult, and isn't the sexiest thing to teach kids.

We cheat our kid athletes out of aspects of the game because everyone out there is out for themselves. Everyone is trying to be a ball in hand star player.

But American lack of skills? Besides Kobe not including himself, what is he talking about?

LeBron (his court vision, passing alone makes him uniquely elite skilled)
Durant (Amazing shooter, ball handler @ 6'11)
CP3 (Possibly the best all around PG ever, both sides of ball)
Steph Curry (Best shooter of all-time?)
K. Love (Ridiculously skilled, smaller white, American Gasol)
Anthony Davis (a do it all PF who can handle the ball)

Some of these guys are of the most skilled of all-time, accompanied with elite bodies or athleticism. That's why Americans are better. Not simply due to athleticism. It's the lethal combination of that inherent genetic lottery with great skills.

Kobe grew up in Italy, as an American, playing a caricature of our entire game because he was raised exclusively on MJ Come Fly w/ Me tapes.

Those tweets are correct, LeBron plays a more well rounded all-around game than Kobe offensively. Besides the lack of comparable post foot work, how is LeBron not every bit as talented if not more than Kobe?


LeBron is the perfect example of aau ball.. The biggest best kid that got to handle it all game and doesn't know how to play a lick off ball and has poor footwork/inconsistent post skills.

[aau]

knew he'd pin it on big men

"they bring it up and they do all this fancy crap
and they don't know how to post"


as with most things there's pros and cons but at
the end of most days , , talent kicks skills ass
9 times out of 10 . . . this game will always
be about talent and aau is just a place
for that talent to grow and develop

only when euros come over with extraordinary
talent atop the skills will this make any sense

until then i'll stick with aau and kids like

anthony davis
dem cousins
chris bosh
etc


interesting comment section:

Most people have a problem with AAU because the coaches are black. The best players of the past 20 years have been AAU superstars. Nobody is complaining about all the Catholic schools these guys play for and make millions for every year. Nobody is complains about the NCAA that makes billions off of their backs just AAU. AAU is fine and the top 1000 players in the world 950 are AAU superstars.

[gts]

Being an assistant coach in AAU, I agree there is some alarming aspects about it, and even feels a bit corrupt. Much more a product or feeder system than it is a teaching tool to actually improve kids. Before I even joined the first thing I told our program leader was I want to bring back to basket skills back. But in this basketball climate it's difficult, and isn't the sexiest thing to teach kids.

We cheat our kid athletes out of aspects of the game because everyone out there is out for themselves. Everyone is trying to be a ball in hand star player.



Amen

[JtotheIzzo]

knew he'd pin it on big men

"they bring it up and they do all this fancy crap
and they don't know how to post"


as with most things there's pros and cons but at
the end of most days , , talent kicks skills ass
9 times out of 10 . . . this game will always
be about talent and aau is just a place
for that talent to grow and develop

only when euros come over with extraordinary
talent atop the skills will this make any sense

until then i'll stick with aau and kids like

anthony davis
dem cousins
chris bosh
etc


interesting comment section:

Most people have a problem with AAU because the coaches are black. The best players of the past 20 years have been AAU superstars. Nobody is complaining about all the Catholic schools these guys play for and make millions for every year. Nobody is complains about the NCAA that makes billions off of their backs just AAU. AAU is fine and the top 1000 players in the world 950 are AAU superstars.


Kobe is completely wrong here.

EVERY team in Europe, Asia, South America import a black American to be their main post player.

Why would they take guys from an inferior talent pool to patrol the paint and score inside for them?

Failbe
Dumbbe
Bitterbe
Notarealbrothabe

[aau]

Kobe is completely wrong here.

EVERY team in Europe, Asia, South America import a black American to be their main post player.

Why would they take guys from an inferior talent pool to patrol the paint and score inside for them?

Failbe
Dumbbe
Bitterbe
Notarealbrothabe


trust if kobe had a son he'd be playing aau ball
and the youtubes would be numerous

lil chucky , , ballhog junior , , lil bean shooter

funny thing is they crack on aau but all we ever see
is the finished product . . . . we didn't see the long
gangly uncoordinated kid that came into the gym
couldn't walk and chew gum at the same time

hours days months and years of training and traveling
with kids - no charge in most cases cause it's mostly
low income families - the kid turns up and becomes
a player . . . everybody and they momma gets
praise - youth coaches n trainers catch shit

idiots can bite

[gts]

Kobe is completely wrong here.

EVERY team in Europe, Asia, South America import a black American to be their main post player.

Why would they take guys from an inferior talent pool to patrol the paint and score inside for them?

Failbe
Dumbbe
Bitterbe
Notarealbrothabe:oldlol:

[3ball]

LeBron (his court vision, passing alone makes him uniquely elite skilled)


court vision... lol... anyone can have court vision if they dribble the ball 12 times first and survey the floor for half the shot clock.

truthfully, now that lebron isn't the super-quick player he once was, it is suboptimal for a forward to impinge on the duties of the guards by dominating the ball as much as he does - his level of overall domination no longer justifies him creating a suboptimal environment where guards must be relegated to lesser roles... he's better off on the block at this point in his career, especially with love floor-spreading.

and since lebron dominates the ball more than a lot of point guards and more than any other wing, his assist numbers aren't impressive... they are barely above average for such a massive ball-dominator... guys like chris paul, steve nash, magic johnson and others are GREAT passing ball-dominators... lebron is not.





how is LeBron not every bit as talented if not more than Kobe


well, he can't slide between defenders like kobe and his drives are much more predictable because he needs a larger, more straight-away lane to drive... he can't just drive at any moment he chooses and he can't change direction an unlimited number of times like kobe... he has to wait for an opening more and use more screens to get in the lane than kobe - these things make him more exploitable than kobe and his game less adjustable than kobe.

also, there is the issue of scoring versatility and elite skill in various offensive categories - when it comes to scoring, lebron is good at a lot of things, but great at nothing... otoh, kobe was great at a lot of aspects of scoring... for example, lebron can't get 40 playing strictly off-ball like kobe.. lebron can't get 40 shooting all mid-range jumpshots like kobe.

[3ball]

talent kicks skills ass


is that why the pistons beat the lakers in the 80's?

is that why the bulls beat the blazers, suns, and sonics?

is that why detroit beat LA in 2004?

is that why the spurs beat the heat?

is that why dallas beat the heat?




9 times out of 10 . . .


except when the talent is close (which is most of the time in championship games), then the superior skills win 10 out of 10 times... :confusedshrug:

talent really only kicks skills ass when you are talking about one level versus a lower level, like a college team vs a high school team... or maybe the best teams in the nba vs the worst...

[Milbuck]

I think the "lack of skill" argument about today's NBA players is blown completely out of proportion. The skills haven't diminished, they've changed..and they're not unskilled compared to international players, they're just less reliant on skills..doesn't mean it's not there. There are less traditional bigs with complete back to the basket games..and that has something to do with teaching, and some to do with the league's style of play evolving and changing..but it's not like today's NBA era is filled with a bunch of unskilled scrubs that are just athletic freaks or something.. This whole argument to me is the era discussion equivalent of saying Wade isn't skilled because he doesn't have great range on his jumper. It's just way too narrow a view.

Physical/natural talent can only get you so far in this league. No matter how physically gifted you are, you need to have discernible skill at what you do. Even the freaks like Lebron, Westbrook, Davis, Blake, healthy Rose, etc have clear skill and finesse to their game, whether they apply it regularly or not...be it Lebron's passing ability, Davis and Blake's jumpshot and handles for their size/position, Rose's touch and variety of moves around the rim, Westbrook's ability to stop on a dime and knock down FT line jumpers..and those are the freak athletes who can get by purely on talent if they wanted to..you look at the other stars of the league not gifted with the same physical tools, and the skill level is insane. Curry, KD, CP3, Aldridge, Love, Irving, Harden (as much as I hate him), Cousins, Lillard, Melo, healthy PG, Bosh, etc..these guys are as skilled as they come, whether they perform or not, whether you like them or not.

[T_L_P]

Did Kobe really fall into the trap?

We have three Europeans.

Our smartest two players are American and South American.

Our two best players are both American.

[3ball]

I think the "lack of skill" argument about today's NBA players is blown completely out of proportion. The skills haven't diminished, they've changed..and they're not unskilled compared to international players, they're just less reliant on skills..doesn't mean it's not there.


3-and-D basketball not only sounds like a joke, but it is a joke compared to what kobe is talking about.

i'll never understand the fascination with open shots and one 3-pointer after another - it's just play-finishing, but somehow people like it more than players having to TAKE each other and score ON each other.

btw, i assume that when you say "they are just less reliant on skills", i assume you mean because the spacing generates open shots, so they don't have to use their skills... this is not a good thing.





Lebron's passing ability, Davis and Blake's jumpshot and handles for their size/position, Rose's touch and variety of moves around the rim, Westbrook's ability to stop on a dime and knock down FT line jumpers..

Curry, KD, CP3, Aldridge, Love, Irving, Harden (as much as I hate him), Cousins, Lillard, Melo, healthy PG, Bosh, etc..these guys are as skilled as they come, whether they perform or not, whether you like them or not.


the skills you mention here that some of today's star players possess, were STANDARD in previous eras for even middling players - i.e. you cite westbrook's pull-up, mid-range jumpshot... seriously, that is impressive to you?... do you know how standard that was back when they ONLY shot two's?... why do you think the pace was so fast back then?... no need to set up spacing, just do a russell westbrook pull-up every time.

also, other than the very unique KD, every player you mentioned has SEVERAL guys from the 90's that were better:... davis < robinson, hakeem.... blake < malone, barkely ... aldridge < kemp, webber.... cousins < shaq, ewing, alonzo, most good C's or PF's in previous eras.... melo < scottie... lebron < Jordan... bosh < derrick coleman... harden < drexler... westbrook < Payton and Penny... PG < grant hill... got any more for the 90's to crush?

[aau]

is that why the pistons beat the lakers in the 80's?

is that why the bulls beat the blazers, suns, and sonics?

is that why detroit beat LA in 2004?

is that why the spurs beat the heat?

is that why dallas beat the heat?


except when the talent is close (which is most of the time in championship games), then the superior skills win 10 out of 10 times... :confusedshrug:

talent really only kicks skills ass when you are talking about one level versus a lower level, like a college team vs a high school team... or maybe the best teams in the nba vs the worst...



hahaha

we talking individual talent and skills as a youth
you bring up professional team competition

miss me dude

[3ball]

also, other than the very unique KD, every player you mentioned has SEVERAL guys from the 90's that were similar player types and better:... davis < robinson, hakeem.... blake < malone, barkely ... aldridge < kemp, webber.... cousins < shaq, ewing, alonzo, most good C's or PF's in previous eras.... melo < scottie... lebron < jordan... bosh < derrick coleman... harden < drexler... westbrook < Payton and Penny... PG < grant hill... got any more for the 90's to crush?


I should mention that all these players are from one season, 1996.

[SpanishACB]

Somebody tell Kobe that Manu is from Argentina. :oldlol:


are you trolling or just stupid?

[Budadiiii]

LeBron is the perfect example of aau ball.. The biggest best kid that got to handle it all game and doesn't know how to play a lick off ball and has poor footwork/inconsistent post skills.
This.

LeBron has the same "skills" he's had since he was 8. Plays the same damn way.

[Budadiiii]

are you trolling or just stupid?
Am I missing something?

[SpanishACB]

Am I missing something?

Manu played from 21 to 26 in Europe. The influences to his game should be obvious; that's clearly what Kobe is talking about, since they were in the same league at the same time... somehow the guy I quote thought Kobe was a geographical retard when in reality he just missed the point himself.

[Budadiiii]

Manu played from 21 to 26 in Europe. The influences to his game should be obvious; that's clearly what Kobe is talking about, since they were in the same league at the same time... somehow the guy I quote thought Kobe was a geographical retard when in reality he just missed the point himself.
:cheers:

[aau]

i'm callin bullshit on aau damaging young ballplayers

you've just been given the opportunity of hosting a
prestigious middle school youth camp that starts
on friday and ends on sunday . . . . in terms
of player development what does your
first and final hour look like

you'll have a dunk contest or 3pt shootout along the way
but for the most part it's all about skill development
you'll have 8-10 stations and every kid no matter
how big or small , , skilled or unskilled will do
the same things that everyone else does

from this camp you grab a few kids and form a team
develop them for 4 years to the point you think
they're pretty good . . . . it's the college
viewing period and vegas is offering
bigfoot - the adidas 64 and fab 48

you also get an invite to the salt lake city nationals

hahaha , , , where you goin . . . . . myself
i'm hittin up vegas . . why? cause that's
where the scouts will be . . . . . why?

cause that's where the top talent will be

normally young talent is immature so if they're
looking for kids with good skills to play
a cerebral game and graduate

if that's what you got

go to salt lake

[aau]

Seriously I'm having a hard time comprehending what you're writing. Why do you type like that?


that's ok , , shouldn't be that difficult

never liked book writings . . . too many words and i'm
already long-winded . . . besides ,, grew up reading
newspaper columns and prefer that format better

[aau]

Also, strong username to topic and post ratio..


could talk about this all day

got 3 kids in the league and that's just the first batch

of them
one we had to literally kick in the ass just to shoot the ball

hopefully you'll be seeing his lil cousins in a few - the oldest is
playing college ball now (not to put too much on it but the
closest thing to the doctor I've seen) and the youngest
is 15 years old 6'9 240 just started the 9th grade

parents phone hasn't stopped ringing

could post youtubes for days

but i'll wait

[aau]

didn't mean to turn spiritual and should have said we
instead of I because it's totally a huge team effort

it just grinds me to see the coaches get the shaft when
a lot of times these kids have to live with these guys
oftentimes for a pretty large part of their lives

you guys think it's about getting paid when for the
most part it's all out-of-pocket for the coaches
only a few get the nike or adidas deals

i'ma hop off this soapbox saying the most difficult thing
is keeping them eligible and in school with the hope
they can even get into college because most
can't afford it


that's the main goal for most

[Rooster]

I agree with Kobe for the most part except we developed guards here better than anywhere. Generally, Euros are much better skilled but they are very unathletic and soft.

[BigMacAttack]

that's ok , , shouldn't be that difficult

never liked book writings . . . too many words and i'm
already long-winded . . . besides ,, grew up reading
newspaper columns and prefer that format better

You write like an AAU produced ball player. You can spell and do flashy things like hyphenate words but you have no idea about the basics such as full stops and capital letters.

[fandarko]

Somebody tell Kobe that Manu is from Argentina. :oldlol:
He did play in Italy for four years before joining the NBA.

[plowking]

Kobe is full of shit for the most part when he speaks about ball today and prior, just like most players.

[Yao Ming's Foot]

You write like an AAU produced ball player. You can spell and do flashy things like hyphenate words but you have no idea about the basics such as full stops and capital letters.

:oldlol:

[dreamwarrior]

Blame it on the culture. Back in the 90's every kid either posted up like a big man or drove to the basket like Jordan. Nowadays when I go to the park I see kids dribbling like God Shammgod and then shoot the ball like Lisa Leslie. WTF

[JtotheIzzo]

America still produces the most players and American imports dot the international landscape so they must be doing something right.

AAU is a real threat to school based teams and that makes people uncomfortable, but I think it is a good thing as the school season isn't long enough and AAU gets the kids more reps.

In Canada the best hockey players don't play for their high school they play midget AAA (an age group, below it is bantam, above it is junior) from there they either go the US college route, or the major junior route. Major junior produces the bulk of NHL players.

AAU is more similar to that, but is needs regulation to keep the sketchy guys away from kids, but to be fair, these incidents are few and far between.

People are averse to change, and AAU is a threat to NCAA and high school leagues.

[Sharmer]

This is common knowledge. That Euros are more skilled.

[JtotheIzzo]

This is common knowledge. That Euros are more skilled.


It is a fallacy. Most people only see the top percentile of European players.

If you look at all the NBA rejects who go on to star for teams all over the globe you'd realize that Americans are superiorly skilled.

If Euroleague used only the top 40 US players and that was the global perception of American basketball, it would be a whitewash.

Look at what the US did in the WC with their Gamma squad. Faried ran wild, Curry and Thompson couldn't miss, they were never even pushed.

To say another part of the world is more talented is nonsense.

[Sharmer]

It is a fallacy. Most people only see the top percentile of European players.

If you look at all the NBA rejects who go on to star for teams all over the globe you'd realize that Americans are superiorly skilled.

If Euroleague used only the top 40 US players and that was the global perception of American basketball, it would be a whitewash.

Look at what the US did in the WC with their Gamma squad. Faried ran wild, Curry and Thompson couldn't miss, they were never even pushed.

To say another part of the world is more talented is nonsense.

I've played pick up games in Serbia. Firstly everyone's at least 6'5 and these are just amateurs in the park. They can dribble both hands and they can all shoot from long range.

In contrast a lot of these Americans are short and lack skills. I've played against a lot of college players and I was surprised how many short point guards are in the American system. Point conceded they are more athletic. But still lacking in the skill department.

Just my experience around the world.

[JtotheIzzo]

I've played pick up games in Serbia. Firstly everyone's at least 6'5 and these are just amateurs in the park. They can dribble both hands and they can all shoot from long range.

In contrast a lot of these Americans are short and lack skills. I've played against a lot of college players and I was surprised how many short point guards are in the American system. Point conceded they are more athletic. But still lacking in the skill department.

Just my experience around the world.

Why do most European teams start a black American who was cut from the NBA at center then?

[SpanishACB]

Why do most European teams start a black American who was cut from the NBA at center then?

what the hell are you talking about? literally..

do you even realize how many leagues are in Europe?

where did you read these claims?

[Rooster]

what the hell are you talking about? literally..

do you even realize how many leagues are in Europe?

where did you read these claims?

Yes most of them have American rejects as their key player :rolleyes:

[Rooster]

It is a fallacy. Most people only see the top percentile of European players.

If you look at all the NBA rejects who go on to star for teams all over the globe you'd realize that Americans are superiorly skilled.

If Euroleague used only the top 40 US players and that was the global perception of American basketball, it would be a whitewash.

Look at what the US did in the WC with their Gamma squad. Faried ran wild, Curry and Thompson couldn't miss, they were never even pushed.

To say another part of the world is more talented is nonsense.

I think he said skilled not talented. One thing we have an advantage though is supreme athleticism. Plus Euros are soft.

[The_Yearning]

More skilled, more intelligent, and cleaner as well.

[Nash]

He did play in Italy for four years before joining the NBA.
who cares, at that point he was already a pro. Kobe talking about the AAU years and at that time Manu was back in South America.

[magic chiongson]

You write like an AAU produced ball player. You can spell and do flashy things like hyphenate words but you have no idea about the basics such as full stops and capital letters.

oowwww

[julizaver]

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/12114523/kobe-bryant-says-european-players-more-skilled-americans-blames-aau


Kobe Bryant believes European basketball players are more skillful than American basketball players, and says it's a growing trend that can be blamed on the greed and coaching at the AAU level.

"I just think European players are just way more skillful," Bryant said Friday night after the Los Angeles Lakers' 109-106 loss to the Memphis Grizzlies. "They are just taught the game the right way at an early age. ... They're more skillful. It's something we really have to fix. We really have to address that. We have to teach our kids to play the right way."

Bryant was quick to point the finger for the decline of skilled players in the United States.

"AAU basketball," Bryant said. "Horrible, terrible AAU basketball. It's stupid. It doesn't teach our kids how to play the game at all so you wind up having players that are big and they bring it up and they do all this fancy crap and they don't know how to post. They don't know the fundamentals of the game. It's stupid."

Bryant was born in Philadelphia, but when he was 6, his father, former NBA player Joe Bryant, moved the family to Italy to continue his playing career. Kobe spent his childhood in Europe until Joe retired in 1991 and moved the family back to the United States.

"When you have limitations and you understand your limitations and you stay within yourself, you can be great," Kobe Bryant said. "You know what you can do and what you can't do. In America, it's a big problem for us because we're not teaching players how to play all-around basketball. That's why you have Pau and Marc [Gasol], and that's the reason why 90 percent of the Spurs' roster is European players, because they have more skill."

Bryant smiled when asked what type of player he would have become if his family had never moved to Italy and he hadn't learned how to play the game in Europe.

"I probably wouldn't be able to dribble with my left and shoot with my left and have good footwork," Bryant said. "I was kind of fortunate because when I was growing up in Italy, the Red Auerbachs and the Tex Winters and all those great coaches were doing clinics and camps in Europe. They were teaching all the club coaches, and the club coaches were following their advice and their fundamentals like the bible, and they were teaching all of us kids that type of stuff. Me, Manu [Ginobili] and all these guys that grew up around that same time, we're a product of that. It's a big difference."

Bryant had a simple solution to the problem.

"Teach players the game at an early age and stop treating them like cash cows for everyone to profit off of," he said. "That's how you do that. You have to teach them the game. Give them instruction."

But Bryant, who holds an annual summer basketball camp, also was quick to point out that any solution involving changing the current culture of AAU basketball won't happen overnight.

"That's a deep well because then you start cutting into people's pockets," Bryant said. "People get really upset when you start cutting into their pockets because all they do is try to profit off these poor kids. There's no quick answer."

http://i.imgur.com/79c7dOg.png

The European players are no better in general than the US born players. What they have (and what Kobe said) is that they learn the fundamentals of the game.

There is no college leagues like NCAA in Europe (I am not saying that students in Europe doesn't play team basketball). I mean that in Europe you start training with a team as a child, go trough the junior teams and when became 18 you sign your first processional contract with that team. So at 18 you are already professional and start earn some money. In US you go to college but you are young talent and you are not paid for it (I am not talking about payments from "agents and sponsors") and instead of polish your skills in college (footwork, shooting and where the system in general is similar to Europe/FIBA) and where there are coaches who are very good tacticians and game is more team orientated you jump straight to the pros where you showcase your talent, but you missed the fundamentals. And NBA is a lot more about the individual talent, big stars, multimillion contracts, marketing, one to one match ups and so on. You are the franchise player and you can clash with your coach or ... even fired him.

It is no secret that the Afro-american players (the majority of NBA players) are superior to the white guys (most European players are white) in terms of athleticism, their bodies are better suited for that sport - the same as Brazilians are better suited for football (soccer). They had basketball instilled in their DNA. The lack of fundamentals they compensate in every other aspect of the game, individual skills, one to one plays, individual defense intensity level, higher hoops and so on. The level of competition is the highest as there are thousands of gifted players in US. The pool of talent is still the biggest in the world and by far.

- what US basketball suffers a lot is the lack of quality dominating big men.
And just looked at the 2012 Olympics final and Spain with Gasols brothers badly exposed their front line. Good for US team that Marc Gasol played only 17 minutes as he was in foul trouble for most of the game, because the US team was basically perimeter team. Now there is a new generation of big men who could score and rebounds and dominate the paint. Not to extent of his predecessors - but just look how comfortably they won the 2014 FIBA WC with 2 true centers (and Davis) although they lacked the star power of 2008 and 2012 Olympic teams.

An electrifying players like Eving, Jordan, Nique brought a lot of popularity to the game - they become idols for milions, future generation copied their moves on the playground. But their highlights had also detrimental influence in some way as young players copy their fancy moves, they go straight to the basket dunking over people, they forgot to pass, forgot to defense, forgot the team play, forgot the footwork - they played for the highlights. And that's why players now are less and less versatile players, we have shot blocking experts, rebounders who could not shoot, PG who could pass but could not shoot, SG who could shoot but could not pass.

Believe or not (young fans) when Shaq enters the league in 1992 I've heard people saying that only thing he could do is dunking, he is some fat big guy who could not move his ass from the paint, that he lacked skills, that he can't shoot. Although in my opinion he was sufficiently skilled for a seven footer (and is more skilled than DW for example). In reality he do what a person with his physique shall do - he had the power game, low post domination and he exploit all of his abilities. And he excelled at it. What he needed to do was to be a little more professional. He should took more care of his body - this is where he underachieved to some extent. He really came to preseasons overweight and missed a lot of games even in his prime years.

[kNIOKAS]

The European players are no better in general than the US born players. What they have (and what Kobe said) is that they learn the fundamentals of the game.

There is no college leagues like NCAA in Europe (I am not saying that students in Europe doesn't play team basketball). I mean that in Europe you start training with a team as a child, go trough the junior teams and when became 18 you sign your first processional contract with that team. So at 18 you are already professional and start earn some money. In US you go to college but you are young talent and you are not paid for it (I am not talking about payments from "agents and sponsors") and instead of polish your skills in college (footwork, shooting and where the system in general is similar to Europe/FIBA) and where there are coaches who are very good tacticians and game is more team orientated you jump straight to the pros where you showcase your talent, but you missed the fundamentals. And NBA is a lot more about the individual talent, big stars, multimillion contracts, marketing, one to one match ups and so on. You are the franchise player and you can clash with your coach or ... even fired him.

It is no secret that the Afro-american players (the majority of NBA players) are superior to the white guys (most European players are white) in terms of athleticism, their bodies are better suited for that sport - the same as Brazilians are better suited for football (soccer). They had basketball instilled in their DNA. The lack of fundamentals they compensate in every other aspect of the game, individual skills, one to one plays, individual defense intensity level, higher hoops and so on. The level of competition is the highest as there are thousands of gifted players in US. The pool of talent is still the biggest in the world and by far.

- what US basketball suffers a lot is the lack of quality dominating big men.
And just looked at the 2012 Olympics final and Spain with Gasols brothers badly exposed their front line. Good for US team that Marc Gasol played only 17 minutes as he was in foul trouble for most of the game, because the US team was basically perimeter team. Now there is a new generation of big men who could score and rebounds and dominate the paint. Not to extent of his predecessors - but just look how comfortably they won the 2014 FIBA WC with 2 true centers (and Davis) although they lacked the star power of 2008 and 2012 Olympic teams.

An electrifying players like Eving, Jordan, Nique brought a lot of popularity to the game - they become idols for milions, future generation copied their moves on the playground. But their highlights had also detrimental influence in some way as young players copy their fancy moves, they go straight to the basket dunking over people, they forgot to pass, forgot to defense, forgot the team play, forgot the footwork - they played for the highlights. And that's why players now are less and less versatile players, we have shot blocking experts, rebounders who could not shoot, PG who could pass but could not shoot, SG who could shoot but could not pass.

Believe or not (young fans) when Shaq enters the league in 1992 I've heard people saying that only thing he could do is dunking, he is some fat big guy who could not move his ass from the paint, that he lacked skills, that he can't shoot. Although in my opinion he was sufficiently skilled for a seven footer (and is more skilled than DW for example). In reality he do what a person with his physique shall do - he had the power game, low post domination and he exploit all of his abilities. And he excelled at it. What he needed to do was to be a little more professional. He should took more care of his body - this is where he underachieved to some extent. He really came to preseasons overweight and missed a lot of games even in his prime years.
Man stop increasing the general IQ level of this board... We only need something alpha beta lebronytes stuff... That's what hot here.

[LAZERUSS]

The European players are no better in general than the US born players. What they have (and what Kobe said) is that they learn the fundamentals of the game.

There is no college leagues like NCAA in Europe (I am not saying that students in Europe doesn't play team basketball). I mean that in Europe you start training with a team as a child, go trough the junior teams and when became 18 you sign your first processional contract with that team. So at 18 you are already professional and start earn some money. In US you go to college but you are young talent and you are not paid for it (I am not talking about payments from "agents and sponsors") and instead of polish your skills in college (footwork, shooting and where the system in general is similar to Europe/FIBA) and where there are coaches who are very good tacticians and game is more team orientated you jump straight to the pros where you showcase your talent, but you missed the fundamentals. And NBA is a lot more about the individual talent, big stars, multimillion contracts, marketing, one to one match ups and so on. You are the franchise player and you can clash with your coach or ... even fired him.

It is no secret that the Afro-american players (the majority of NBA players) are superior to the white guys (most European players are white) in terms of athleticism, their bodies are better suited for that sport - the same as Brazilians are better suited for football (soccer). They had basketball instilled in their DNA. The lack of fundamentals they compensate in every other aspect of the game, individual skills, one to one plays, individual defense intensity level, higher hoops and so on. The level of competition is the highest as there are thousands of gifted players in US. The pool of talent is still the biggest in the world and by far.

- what US basketball suffers a lot is the lack of quality dominating big men.
And just looked at the 2012 Olympics final and Spain with Gasols brothers badly exposed their front line. Good for US team that Marc Gasol played only 17 minutes as he was in foul trouble for most of the game, because the US team was basically perimeter team. Now there is a new generation of big men who could score and rebounds and dominate the paint. Not to extent of his predecessors - but just look how comfortably they won the 2014 FIBA WC with 2 true centers (and Davis) although they lacked the star power of 2008 and 2012 Olympic teams.

An electrifying players like Eving, Jordan, Nique brought a lot of popularity to the game - they become idols for milions, future generation copied their moves on the playground. But their highlights had also detrimental influence in some way as young players copy their fancy moves, they go straight to the basket dunking over people, they forgot to pass, forgot to defense, forgot the team play, forgot the footwork - they played for the highlights. And that's why players now are less and less versatile players, we have shot blocking experts, rebounders who could not shoot, PG who could pass but could not shoot, SG who could shoot but could not pass.

Believe or not (young fans) when Shaq enters the league in 1992 I've heard people saying that only thing he could do is dunking, he is some fat big guy who could not move his ass from the paint, that he lacked skills, that he can't shoot. Although in my opinion he was sufficiently skilled for a seven footer (and is more skilled than DW for example). In reality he do what a person with his physique shall do - he had the power game, low post domination and he exploit all of his abilities. And he excelled at it. What he needed to do was to be a little more professional. He should took more care of his body - this is where he underachieved to some extent. He really came to preseasons overweight and missed a lot of games even in his prime years.

I'll comment on this later on when I have more time, but I just had to...

:applause: :applause: :applause:

[kunk75]

a lot of aau is shit but my son's coach stresses fundamentals and they are expected to be students of the game and its a top notch aau team

[Height Freak]

Spot on Kobe. Can't speak for himself but spot on, Europeans are also taller players on average.

[SpanishACB]

the same as Brazilians are better suited for football (soccer).

stopped reading there.

Brazil's success in soccer is cultural, not metabolical.

[julizaver]

stopped reading there.

Brazil's success in soccer is cultural, not metabolical.

It is cultural - of course.

[Sharmer]

Why do most European teams start a black American who was cut from the NBA at center then?


More about publicity and marketing. Very little to do with performance.

[JtotheIzzo]

More about publicity and marketing. Very little to do with performance.

Yeah, because they would rather lose and overpay than win with local talent.:rolleyes:

[masonanddixon]

The issue with AAU is its all about marketing young black players with minimal skills and forcing every negative stereotypes on young white players and not providing them with similar exposure. White Europeans don't have to deal with the reverse racism and thats why they are more successful in the NBA than white Americans.

[SpanishACB]

Why do most European teams start a black American who was cut from the NBA at center then?


More about publicity and marketing. Very little to do with performance.

What?

you quote someone talking out of his ass to reply to him from your own ass.

Where are you guys getting this information from? I'm legitemely concerned...

First of all, European teams employing American centers is a myth that guy made up and I'm clueless were he got it from.

There's 32 teams in the Euroleague and only 3 or 4 so teams have USA Centers and not all of those start them. Pana, Berlin, Kazan (has a bunch of americans) and probably someone else...

They do have American guards though and some forwards. Good defenders, good shooters. Just like almost all relevant NBA teams have key foreign players...

Were you talking about national leagues? Please englighten me

[sportjames23]

The issue with AAU is its all about marketing young black players with minimal skills and forcing every negative stereotypes on young white players and not providing them with similar exposure. White Europeans don't have to deal with the reverse racism and thats why they are more successful in the NBA than white Americans.


Interesting username to go along with this post.

[masonanddixon]

Interesting username to go along with this post.

How so?

[Euroleague]

I agree with Kobe for the most part except we developed guards here better than anywhere. Generally, Euros are much better skilled but they are very unathletic and soft.

You are Australian.

[Euroleague]

who cares, at that point he was already a pro. Kobe talking about the AAU years and at that time Manu was back in South America.

Almost every single player and coach in the history of Argentina's national team is Italian. And they took their entire basketball knowledge from Italy's basketball program.

Stop being such a freaking moron.

[Euroleague]

What?

you quote someone talking out of his ass to reply to him from your own ass.

Where are you guys getting this information from? I'm legitemely concerned...

First of all, European teams employing American centers is a myth that guy made up and I'm clueless were he got it from.

There's 32 teams in the Euroleague and only 3 or 4 so teams have USA Centers and not all of those start them. Pana, Berlin, Kazan (has a bunch of americans) and probably someone else...

They do have American guards though and some forwards. Good defenders, good shooters. Just like almost all relevant NBA teams have key foreign players...

Were you talking about national leagues? Please englighten me

24

Also, as has been said about 1,000 times here in this forum, there is no such thing as "starters" concept in Euroleague. Anyone that mentions that is an automatic TROLL.

[Rooster]

What?

you quote someone talking out of his ass to reply to him from your own ass.

Where are you guys getting this information from? I'm legitemely concerned...

First of all, European teams employing American centers is a myth that guy made up and I'm clueless were he got it from.

There's 32 teams in the Euroleague and only 3 or 4 so teams have USA Centers and not all of those start them. Pana, Berlin, Kazan (has a bunch of americans) and probably someone else...

They do have American guards though and some forwards. Good defenders, good shooters. Just like almost all relevant NBA teams have key foreign players...

Were you talking about national leagues? Please englighten me

Maybe not Center but there are more American named Euroleague MVP, Final Four MVP, All Euroleague First and 2nd Team than any nation in Europe. Some of them are corpses and obscure players. McAdoo, Galis, Clifford Luyk
Wayne Brabender etc.:roll: :roll:

[TheBigVeto]

http://i.imgur.com/rBcEXie.png

http://i.imgur.com/gzkPLmw.png

https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429058014494721
https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/551429447736635395

Pretty much this.

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:

[Euroleague]

Pretty much this.

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:

That's out of context. When Kobe was a kid in Italy learning the game there, that was EXACTLY how they played the game.

The way Kobe plays, is EXACTLY 100% how they played in Italy.

So, Givony is taking that out of context.

[SexSymbol]

Yeah, because they would rather lose and overpay than win with local talent.:rolleyes:
That is actually true.

Most Euroleague teams look for talent in d-league or they try to buy small time nba players, because they're cheaper than local talent who can produce at the same level, much cheaper

[SexSymbol]

24

Also, as has been said about 1,000 times here in this forum, there is no such thing as "starters" concept in Euroleague. Anyone that mentions that is an automatic TROLL.
There obviously is, are you crazy?
Have you even watched euroleague? At least once?
You constantly make these stupid statements about european basketball, and looks like it's intentionally to make it look bad.
Stop being an idiot for Euroleague's sake, many people on this forum would take the league much more seriously, maybe even follow it, if not for how shitty you present it. You're an idiot, who's either intentionally ruining one thing you hate or and idiot who's unintentionally ruining one thing you love