Big O, only player to record a Triple double season.(6 30/10 seasons) best guard ever

[k0kakw0rld]

No one will ever match what this guy done for the league. Averaging a triple double for a season is very difficult. Played also 80 games. 30.8 points, 12.5 rebounds, and 11.4 assists per game-an average of a triple-double for an entire season. Kidd came close but with 10+ppg. Oscar not only averaged a triple double but averaged 30+ ppg doing that. That only is enough for him to stay Top 10 forever. :pimp:

[juju151111]

Pace

[ImKobe]

weak era...

[Nuff Said]

Pace
You say pace as if this was a common thing back then when he was the only one to do it. Truly impressive.

[k0kakw0rld]

weak era...
You talking as if this era is so tough. :oldlol:

We live in an era where defense don't matter to be considered a great player (Harden, Love, Curry) still nigghaz ain't dominating like old days.

[riseagainst]

pace, weak era. Everyone's stats are inflated. If you transpose his numbers to today's game, his triple double seasons will be something like: 22-5-5.

[ralph_i_el]

Raise your hand if you watched him play live.

*nobody*

Otherwise stfu

[k0kakw0rld]

Raise your hand if you watched him play live.

*nobody*

Otherwise stfu
My grandpa did and I have videos to understand his greatness.

There is a lot of players in the top 10

[HOoopCityJones]

You mean against the non existent defensive schemes of the time? Truly impressive. Zone defense was illegal back then if I'm not mistaken, so for Oscar to average a Triple Double is truly beyond anything we've ever seen in the game today.

GOAT.

[Haymaker]

Shitty era.

[Practice?]

Russell probably did this multiple times but blocks weren't counted yet.

[Dresta]

Lots of players have been 'the only guy ever' to average a certain combination of stats. That fact of 3 of them being comprised of double digits really means **** all.

[CavaliersFTW]

Russell probably did this multiple times but blocks weren't counted yet.
I don't know if Russell or wilt ever blocked OVER 10 a game for the duration of a season, but Harvey P the infamous stat guy of the 60s claims wilt blocked more shots than Russell.

For reference Wilt blocked 6.7 shots a game as a sophomore in less than 40 minutes if NCAA play, and 5.7 a game his junior year or 6.3 a game total NCAA career.

In his final nba season age 36 with a 50+ game sample size he's still getting tallied at 5.4bpg. Maybe it's possible he got over 10 a game in his prime I don't know. If he did, then possibly Russell to I guess but as far as shot block volume goes wilt is at the top. That's not to say he's an all around better defender than Russell though, nor was he quite the contortionist. Russell could block shots behind him. Not convinced he got more than wilt though if Harvey P says he didn't.

[T_L_P]

The old timers (Wilt fans, Oscar fans) just love harping on about the Regular Season.

Not saying they were Playoff failures or anything, but my god.

When we talk about Jordan, Hakeem, Shaq, Duncan...it's always about what they did in the postseason.

tl;dr: Regular Season statpadding (ala Oscar and 49 MPG Wilt) means little to nothing.

[CavaliersFTW]

The old timers (Wilt fans, Oscar fans) just love harping on about the Regular Season.

Not saying they were Playoff failures or anything, but my god.

When we talk about Jordan, Hakeem, Shaq, Duncan...it's always about what they did in the postseason.

tl;dr: Regular Season statpadding (ala Oscar and 49 MPG Wilt) means little to nothing.
We appreciate greatness further back in time then you boo ****itty hoo

[ProfessorMurder]

tl;dr: Regular Season statpadding (ala Oscar and 49 MPG Wilt) means little to nothing.

How can that mean nothing?

Wilt played every game, never fouled out, dominated statistically, AND played more minutes per game than are actually in a game. That's f*cking amazing.

But give me Bran's 37 minute, two week vacation taking, colluding ass instead.

[AirFederer]

Lots of players have been 'the only guy ever' to average a certain combination of stats. That fact of 3 of them being comprised of double digits really means **** all.
:applause:

Team game.

[Dro]

How can that mean nothing?

Wilt played every game, never fouled out, dominated statistically, AND played more minutes per game than are actually in a game. That's f*cking amazing.

But give me Bran's 37 minute, two week vacation taking, colluding ass instead.
:applause:

[aj1987]

How can that mean nothing?

Wilt played every game, never fouled out, dominated statistically, AND played more minutes per game than are actually in a game. That's f*cking amazing.

But give me Bran's 37 minute, two week vacation taking, colluding ass instead.
Yeah, because going from statpadding 30 PPG in the RS to 17 PPG in the Finals is amazing. I've seen people harp about LeBron not fouling for 4-5 games straight, but when Mr. Chokerlain does it, it's amazing. GTFOH. Dude just cared about his stats. Nothing more.

Yeah, I'll take LeBron over Chokerlain in the Playoffs. Oh, and are we pretending that Wilt didn't play with West and Baylor?

@ OP, pace and a shitty era for guards.

[colts19]

Yeah, because going from statpadding 30 PPG in the RS to 17 PPG in the Finals is amazing. I've seen people harp about LeBron not fouling for 4-5 games straight, but when Mr. Chokerlain does it, it's amazing. GTFOH. Dude just cared about his stats. Nothing more.

Yeah, I'll take LeBron over Chokerlain in the Playoffs. Oh, and are we pretending that Wilt didn't play with West and Baylor?

@ OP, pace and a shitty era for guards.

Please give me the list of players who avg. 23 pts and 25 rbs per game in the playoffs. Wilt did.

Anyone who would take Lebron to start a team over Chamberlain, Jordan, Magic or Bird, just doesn't understand the game of basketball.

[Psileas]

Please give me the list of players who avg. 23 pts and 25 rbs per game in the playoffs. Wilt did.

Anyone who would take Lebron to start a team over Chamberlain, Jordan, Magic or Bird, just doesn't understand the game of basketball.

Plus, haters will never grasp (or, even worse, pretend to never grasp) that Wilt had not a single season when he slipped in the Finals as badly as the rough numbers indicate (30 vs 17 - and it's actually 19) and that you can't use stats in such an ignorant way (the way that produces the "3rd type of lies"). Which makes them either stupid or liars.

[ralph_i_el]

[QUOTE=k0kakw0rld]My grandpa did and I have videos to understand his greatness.

There is a lot of players in the top 10

[Marchesk]

If Lebron or Kobe averaged a tripple double for a season, it would go from a "meaningless arbitrary" stat to OMFG GOAT JUST PASSED MJ.

But they never have. Inflated pace and yet nobody else in the 60s did that? How come?

[colts19]

Raise your hand if you watched him play live.

*nobody*

Otherwise stfu
Hand raised. I saw him play in high school, my best friend was on my High school team and played against Big O. I have always thought Big O was the best non center I ever saw.

[SugarHill]

If Lebron or Kobe averaged a tripple double for a season, it would go from a "meaningless arbitrary" stat to OMFG GOAT JUST PASSED MJ.

But they never have. Inflated pace and yet nobody else in the 60s did that? How come?
people writing off a triple double average is fascinating :oldlol:

[oarabbus]

people writing off a triple double average is fascinating :oldlol:


This... what kind of mental gymnastics do you have to perform in order to convince yourself that isn't jaw-droppingly incredible.


And is this topic about Wilt or Oscar Robertson? Hard to tell from the replies...

[LAZERUSS]

pace, weak era. Everyone's stats are inflated. If you transpose his numbers to today's game, his triple double seasons will be something like: 22-5-5.


:roll: :roll: :roll:

EVERYONE's stats are inflated?

Oscar's numbers actually translate to about a 30-8-10 season in TODAY's NBA.

First of all, a prime Big-O averaged about 30 ppg on about 21 FGAs per game. Are you really suggesting that a more ball dominant Oscar couldn't get 21 FGAs in today's NBA? Hell, Durant averaged 21 FGAs just last year.

Secondly, he had seasons shooting as high as .518 from the field, in an NBA that shot an eFG% of .441. Put him in the current NBA, which is shooting an eFG% of .498, and his FG% translates to .585 in today's NBA. His 21 FGAs would be the equivalent of making 12.3 FGs per game, instead of the actual 10.9...or 2.8 more ppg on the same number of attempts.

His assists would certainly not suffer, either. The current NBA is averaging 22 apg per team. Using the example of the 62-63 season, the NBA averaged 22.7 apg per team.

Rebounding is the only area in which Oscar's numbers would decline. Today's NBA is rebounding at about 67% of a peak NBA in the 60's. Oscar's 12.5 would translate to around 8.3 rpg.

His 45-46 mpg would likely also decline, albeit, probably not by much. There have been players averaging 42-43 mpg just in the last few years. But even if his minutes declined somewhat, the assumption would also be then, that his efficiencies would increase somewhat.

As for "EVERYONE's" numbers...????

Aside from Wilt, who had two seasons of 24-24-8, no other player came close to a "triple double" season. BTW, had blocked shots ben officially recorded, and Wilt might very well have had at least a couple of "triple-double" seasons, and those 24-24-8 seasons might have actually been 24-24-8-10.

Furthermore, remove Wilt and his 14 seasons from the NBA, and the next highest full-time scoring season was Barry's 35.6 ppg in '67. And after that, KAJ's and Baylor's 34.8 ppg, then Baylor and Archibald's 34.0 ppg. Not one other player had a season higher than KAJ's 31.7 ppg in '71. None of those numbers are "inflated." My god, Kobe averaged 35.4 ppg in an NBA that averaged 97 ppg just a few years ago. And MJ's 37.1 ppg in '87 is still the highest "non-Wilt" season in NBA history.

For all of the so-called "inflated scoring" from the 60's...think about this: If you remove Chamberlain from the Wilt-era...there were a TOTAL of FIVE 60+ point games. There have been 25 since. So there was absolutly nothing out of the ordinary in Wilt's 14 seasons in the league....other than WILT, himself (who had 32 60+ point games.)

[ralph_i_el]

Hand raised. I saw him play in high school, my best friend was on my High school team and played against Big O. I have always thought Big O was the best non center I ever saw.

:applause: Cool.
My grandpa lived in San Francisco so he likes to tell Bill Russell stories.

He said that back then players we're taught not to jump around on D, but Russell was so quick as a big that he would bounce around everywhere and be able to recover.

He also said something about a riot over a basketball game between Russell's high school and a white high school and a girl got knifed and thrown in a fountain :eek:

[ralph_i_el]

:roll: :roll: :roll:

EVERYONE's stats are inflated?

Oscar's numbers actually translate to about a 30-8-10 season in TODAY's NBA.

First of all, a prime Big-O averaged about 30 ppg on about 21 FGAs per game. Are you really suggesting that a more ball dominant Oscar couldn't get 21 FGAs in today's NBA? Hell, Durant averaged 21 FGAs just last year.

Secondly, he had seasons shooting as high as .518 from the field, in an NBA that shot an eFG% of .441. Put him in the current NBA, which is shooting an eFG% of .498, and his FG% translates to .585 in today's NBA. His 21 FGAs would be the equivalent of making 12.3 FGs per game, instead of the actual 10.9...or 2.8 more ppg on the same number of attempts.

His assists would certainly not suffer, either. The current NBA is averaging 22 apg per team. Using the example of the 62-63 season, the NBA averaged 22.7 apg per team.

Rebounding is the only area in which Oscar's numbers would decline. Today's NBA is rebounding at about 67% of a peak NBA in the 60's. Oscar's 12.5 would translate to around 8.3 rpg.

His life got flipped-turned upside down
And I'd like to take a minute
Just sit right there
I'll tell you how I became the prince of a town called Bel Air

In west Philadelphia born and raised
On the playground was where I spent most of my days
Chillin' out maxin' relaxin' all cool
And all shootin some b-ball outside of the school
When a couple of guys who were up to no good
Started making trouble in my neighborhood
I got in one little fight and my mom got scared
She said 'You're movin' with your auntie and uncle in Bel Air'

I begged and pleaded with her day after day
But she packed my suit case and sent me on my way
She gave me a kiss and then she gave me my ticket.
I put my Walkman on and said, 'I might as well kick it'.

First class, yo this is bad
Drinking orange juice out of a champagne glass.
Is this what the people of Bel-Air living like?
Hmmmmm this might be alright.

But wait I hear they're prissy, bourgeois, all that
Is this the type of place that they just send this cool cat?
I don't think so
I'll see when I get there
I hope they're prepared for the prince of Bel-Air
Well, the plane landed and when I came out
There was a dude who looked like a cop standing there with my name out
I ain't trying to get arrested yet
I just got here
I sprang with the quickness like lightning, disappeared
I whistled for a cab and when it came near
The license plate said fresh and it had dice in the mirror
If anything I could say that this cab was rare
But I thought 'Nah, forget it' - 'Yo, homes to Bel Air'
I pulled up to the house about 7 or 8
And I yelled to the cabbie 'Yo homes smell ya later'
I looked at my kingdom
I was finally there
To sit on my throne as the Prince of Bel Air


hmmm.....interdasting

[Ariza4three]

*
You forgot this bud. Weak ass era.

[Collie]

I'm not sure how true this is, but I've seen it mentioned that Oscar's best years came during a time when the league was still majority white, and that he had a massive physical advantage over the guards of that era (think Lebron vs today's forwards). As the league got blacker, his physical advantages were minimized (guys like Sam Jones were starting to emerge), thus his lowered stats (specifically rebounding) during the years that should have been his prime.

[La Frescobaldi]

I'm not sure how true this is, but I've seen it mentioned that Oscar's best years came during a time when the league was still majority white, and that he had a massive physical advantage over the guards of that era (think Lebron vs today's forwards). As the league got blacker, his physical advantages were minimized (guys like Sam Jones were starting to emerge), thus his lowered stats (specifically rebounding) during the years that should have been his prime.
Sam Jones was in the league like 2 or 3 years before Oscar showed up. Not too many guards ever were stronger than the Big O was.

[oarabbus]

I'm not sure how true this is, but I've seen it mentioned that Oscar's best years came during a time when the league was still majority white, and that he had a massive physical advantage over the guards of that era (think Lebron vs today's forwards). As the league got blacker, his physical advantages were minimized (guys like Sam Jones were starting to emerge), thus his lowered stats (specifically rebounding) during the years that should have been his prime.

Hmm... maybe this guy may have a good point...


Sam Jones was in the league like 2 or 3 years before Oscar showed up. Not too many guards ever were stronger than the Big O was.


:roll: :roll: :roll:


People will really make up all kinds of bullshit to discredit these guys :roll:

[CavaliersFTW]

I'm not sure how true this is, but I've seen it mentioned that Oscar's best years came during a time when the league was still majority white, and that he had a massive physical advantage over the guards of that era (think Lebron vs today's forwards). As the league got blacker, his physical advantages were minimized (guys like Sam Jones were starting to emerge), thus his lowered stats (specifically rebounding) during the years that should have been his prime.
:facepalm


...just no.

http://youtu.be/h9QzIaXcfhg?t=33s

He played Oscar in the later half of Oscars career. Actually, most players (backcourt or otherwise) that only saw Oscars second half STILL call him the GOAT all around player/toughest player they faced (if they played backcourt) etc.

The blackness of the league had nothing to do with his effectiveness, who ever suggested it is being ridiculous.

[La Frescobaldi]

Hmm... maybe this guy may have a good point...




:roll: :roll: :roll:


People will really make up all kinds of bullshit to discredit these guys :roll:
? I didn't follow ya. Sam signed up in '58

[La Frescobaldi]

:facepalm


...just no.

http://youtu.be/h9QzIaXcfhg?t=33s

He played Oscar in the later half of Oscars career. Actually, most players (backcourt or otherwise) that only saw Oscars second half STILL call him the GOAT all around player/toughest player they faced (if they played backcourt) etc.

The blackness of the league had nothing to do with his effectiveness, who ever suggested it is being ridiculous.

Never saw that interview before.

Add Earl the Pearl to that enormous list that has Wilt Chamberlain as the G.O.A.T.

[Psileas]

I'm not sure how true this is, but I've seen it mentioned that Oscar's best years came during a time when the league was still majority white, and that he had a massive physical advantage over the guards of that era (think Lebron vs today's forwards). As the league got blacker, his physical advantages were minimized (guys like Sam Jones were starting to emerge), thus his lowered stats (specifically rebounding) during the years that should have been his prime.

When Oscar was averaging these numbers, he was getting them regardless of the color of the opponent. Much like Wilt, people love to attribute his dominance to the league having less blacks, yet, he was hugely dominant vs blacks, as well.
Oscar's physical advantages were never "minimized". He'd still be among the biggest PG's in the game.

[CavaliersFTW]

When Oscar was averaging these numbers, he was getting them regardless of the color of the opponent. Much like Wilt, people love to attribute his dominance to the league having less blacks, yet, he was hugely dominant vs blacks, as well.
Oscar's physical advantages were never "minimized". He'd still be among the biggest PG's in the game.
^exactly. 6-4 and 3/4 without shoes point guard (same height as Barkley, Bryant, and MJ) and and a wide 220lbs without lifting weights? He would be a "6-6" 235lb point guard today, that's a matchup nightmare for anyone anytime. His height/weight/strength combo at the 1-spot is probably only second to Magic. At least as far as impact making all star caliber players goes.

[LAZERUSS]

When Oscar was averaging these numbers, he was getting them regardless of the color of the opponent. Much like Wilt, people love to attribute his dominance to the league having less blacks, yet, he was hugely dominant vs blacks, as well.
Oscar's physical advantages were never "minimized". He'd still be among the biggest PG's in the game.

The "bashers" NEVER mention this...

SEASONS against Russell of 38, 40, and 40 ppg.

SEASONS against Bellamy of 43 and even 52 ppg.

A SEASON of 39 ppg against Reed.

A SEASON of 29 ppg against Thurmond.

Hell, a 35 and 36 year old Wilt averaged 24 ppg on a .750 FG% against Lanier.

The reality was, Chamberlain was just slaughtering the likes of Embry, Ellis, Dukes, Beatty, Reed, Bellamy, Thurmond, and Russell in the 60's. And he was still routinely outplaying guys like Lanier, Hayes, McAdoo, and Kareem in the 70's, and well past his prime.

[La Frescobaldi]

The "bashers" NEVER mention this...

SEASONS against Russell of 38, 40, and 40 ppg.

SEASONS against Bellamy of 43 and even 52 ppg.

A SEASON of 39 ppg against Reed.

A SEASON of 29 ppg against Thurmond.

Hell, a 35 and 36 year old Wilt averaged 24 ppg on a .750 FG% against Lanier.

The reality was, Chamberlain was just slaughtering the likes of Embry, Ellis, Dukes, Beatty, Reed, Bellamy, Thurmond, and Russell in the 60's. And he was still routinely outplaying guys like Lanier, Hayes, McAdoo, and Kareem in the 70's, and well past his prime.
did you see that little clip cavsftw has of Monroe talking about Chamberlain? Real cool.

Earl Monroe, they called him Black Jesus, and Earl the Pearl... and he was the Fire of the Fire & Ice Rivalry between him and Walt Frazier which is almost forgotten today... but when he was in Baltimore, Knicks - Bullets games were always a high point of every season and they were some of the first nationally televised regular season games. Later on he was 1/2 of the Rolls Royce Backcourt.

Pearl joined the Knicks midway through the '72 season but didn't play a lot in the Finals... seems like Holzman played Dean Meminger a lot maybe he wanted more defense or maybe he felt like Dean was a better matchup for Goodrich.... I've always thought that was a mistake

Monroe is a streetball legend, he was on a lot of playgrounds in the off-season and drew huge crowds. Every year at the beginning of the season the announcers would have a lot of fun talking about "there's another palming violation by Earl.... he's got to get back to the rules after a summer on the playgrounds."
He would be the talk of the town if he was playing today, just like he was back in those days, just an all time great.

[Jasper]

No one will ever match what this guy done for the league. Averaging a triple double for a season is very difficult. Played also 80 games. 30.8 points, 12.5 rebounds, and 11.4 assists per game-an average of a triple-double for an entire season. Kidd came close but with 10+ppg. Oscar not only averaged a triple double but averaged 30+ ppg doing that. That only is enough for him to stay Top 10 forever. :pimp:
Guy kinda likes bball , huh :basketball