WOJ: OKC and Brooklyn progressing on trade talks

[russwest0]

https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/status/556127365193953280

Looks like the three team deal is nixed, but OKC and Brooklyn are progressing without Charlotte in on the deal.

[fpliii]

Isn't this highway robbery? Is Brooklyn just trying to clear salaries before the team is sold, or is Brook ****ed injury-wise for the long-term?

Why wouldn't they try moving DWill or JJ first? Or even KG if he has any value?

[nba_55]

Good trade for OKC. Most stacked team in the league by far if it happens.

[russwest0]

Isn't this highway robbery? Is Brooklyn just trying to clear salaries before the team is sold, or is Brook ****ed injury-wise for the long-term?

Why wouldn't they try moving DWill or JJ first? Or even KG if he has any value?

My guess is that Brooklyn is trying to get out of the luxury tax for next season so that their owner can potentially try and sell the team?

[tpols]

Why is there no Reggie Jackson in this deal smh.. Perkins and lamb wtf? They are more useless than Lopez.. What the hell is the point.

[fpliii]

If Lopez is healthy for them, this makes up for the Harden fiasco IMO. Harden is a legit MVP candidate, but nobody could have projected this level of play from him. They also had Westbrook anyway.

Lopez would allow them to do more things offensively (no disrespect to Adams, but a healthy Lopez has a great post scoring skillset).

[russwest0]

If Lopez is healthy for them, this makes up for the Harden fiasco IMO. Harden is a legit MVP candidate, but nobody could have projected this level of play from him. They also had Westbrook anyway.

Lopez would allow them to do more things offensively (no disrespect to Adams, but a healthy Lopez has a great post scoring skillset).

The thing about Harden is that there is no way he was going to get the looks in OKC that he is getting in Houston.

The problems OKC has really have nothing to do with Harden but more to do with their coach and the stupid decisions he makes that consistently hold the team back.

[Spurs5Rings2014]

If Lopez is healthy for them, this makes up for the Harden fiasco

Nothing will make up for the Harden fiasco.

:no:

[fpliii]

The thing about Harden is that there is no way he was going to get the looks in OKC that he is getting in Houston.

The problems OKC has really have nothing to do with Harden but more to do with their coach and the stupid decisions he makes that consistently hold the team back.
I agree that Brooks is incompetent in terms of offensive schemes. Isos and screens without purpose will **** you in the playoffs.

Really, I'm not sure how I feel about WB+KD vs Harden+KD if that's where the conversation is going. So I won't comment on that.

If it did come down to Ibaka vs Harden, it's tough. Ibaka has evolved into a better all-around defender (a few years ago he was just a lower impact guy getting weakside blocks), but I think he's been exposed as a jumpshooter offensively. He has some range which is useful, but he can't create his own shot. Maybe you don't need that with the roster (KD/WB, plus Waiters, assuming Reggie is on his way out).

[russwest0]

I agree that Brooks is incompetent in terms of offensive schemes. Isos and screens without purpose will **** you in the playoffs.

Really, I'm not sure how I feel about WB+KD vs Harden+KD if that's where the conversation is going. So I won't comment on that.

If it did come down to Ibaka vs Harden, it's tough. Ibaka has evolved into a better all-around defender (a few years ago he was just a lower impact guy getting weakside blocks), but I think he's been exposed as a jumpshooter offensively. He has some range which is useful, but he can't create his own shot. Maybe you don't need that with the roster (KD/WB, plus Waiters, assuming Reggie is on his way out).

I'm definitely taking Ibaka on 10M a year over Harden on the max if thats what you're talking about.

Harden has yet to prove himself at all as the guy in the playoffs but everyone still buys the hype... It's hilarious.

Harden didn't have half the impact of Westbrook in OKC's lone Finals series, and hasn't had the half the impact of Westbrook in the playoffs since, and OKC as a team looked at their best the year following Harden's departure, until Westbrook got hurt by Beverley...

Yet everyone still tries to focus on that trade when the teams primary problem has long since been their head coach, the guy who openly played Kendrick Perkins vs Chris Bosh in the Finals while Perkins got consistently dominated...

It honestly seems to me like the front office is limited on what they can do financially and that includes firing Brooks... But they are still able to make moves to try and force Brooks to not play the guys who are holding the team back... This would replace Perkins with Lopez which I'm all for...

Now if we can just find a way to get him to start Morrow over Roberson, we'll be good.

[El Kabong]

My guess is that Brooklyn is trying to get out of the luxury tax for next season so that their owner can potentially try and sell the team?
I would say so. With the repeater tax as well I doubt there's people who'd want to pay hundreds of millions of dollars for a team knowing you've got a huge tax bill coming your way. Aren't they now to pay $1.75 for every dollar above the line and then up to $2.50 the year after? The team is going to suck either way, so if you've got the choice of buying a team that can't make the playoffs and buying a team that can't make the playoffs that has an added pricetag worth tens of millions you've got to pay straight up, which would you spend your $ on?

[russwest0]

I can also say about Jeremy Lamb that he isn't a bad player, he just appears to have waning confidence and has, since his time in OKC here, been given the shortest leash of all time. I've seen the guy pulled just for missing a shot or turning the ball over once, all while guys like Sefolosha, Fisher, Butler, and Perkins were allowed to do far worse and stay in the game.

[fpliii]

I'm definitely taking Ibaka on 10M a year over Harden on the max if thats what you're talking about.

Harden has yet to prove himself at all as the guy in the playoffs but everyone still buys the hype... It's hilarious.

Harden didn't have half the impact of Westbrook in OKC's lone Finals series, and hasn't had the half the impact of Westbrook in the playoffs since, and OKC as a team looked at their best the year following Harden's departure, until Westbrook got hurt by Beverley...

Yet everyone still tries to focus on that trade when the teams primary problem has long since been their head coach, the guy who openly played Kendrick Perkins vs Chris Bosh in the Finals while Perkins got consistently dominated...

It honestly seems to me like the front office is limited on what they can do financially and that includes firing Brooks... But they are still able to make moves to try and force Brooks to not play the guys who are holding the team back... This would replace Perkins with Lopez which I'm all for...

Now if we can just find a way to get him to start Morrow over Roberson, we'll be good.
I do think Harden this year is the real deal, but I agree we need to see him continue in the playoffs. Anyhow, even though Dwight looked great in the playoffs with his new moves, I think playing alongside KD would make a huge deal to him.

Westbrook has a higher ceiling because he's an awesome defender when he wants to be (which is much more often than most perimeter players in the league today). I'm not buying Harden as a plus defender, but he's not a negative anymore. If this isn't fools gold, and he can exploit the drive and corner three (both as the scorer and the passer for both) as much as he has, I think we have to respect that. But he might not.

Perkins is and always has been useless. Only value is in setting illegal screens, boxing out, and playing some tough man to man defense against traditional low post centers (which don't exist anymore). What's the issue with Roberson though? I thought he was pretty good defensively?

[russwest0]

I do think Harden this year is the real deal, but I agree we need to see him continue in the playoffs. Anyhow, even though Dwight looked great in the playoffs with his new moves, I think playing alongside KD would make a huge deal to him.

Westbrook has a higher ceiling because he's an awesome defender when he wants to be (which is much more often than most perimeter players in the league today). I'm not buying Harden as a plus defender, but he's not a negative anymore. If this isn't fools gold, and he can exploit the drive and corner three (both as the scorer and the passer for both) as much as he has, I think we have to respect that. But he might not.

Perkins is and always has been useless. Only value is in setting illegal screens, boxing out, and playing some tough man to man defense against traditional low post centers (which don't exist anymore). What's the issue with Roberson though? I thought he was pretty good defensively?

Roberson is good defensively, and is a good rebounder but is absolutely useless with what they are asking him to do on offense (space the floor), and in my mind you shouldn't be starting one way players, especially when you have a guy like Morrow who is a much better fit with the starters than with the backups that he currently plays more with.

The main problem with this OKC team is the fact that they have like six guys shooting a combined 24% from deep on a combined 14 three point attempts per game....

That includes Roberson, Collison, Westbrook, Jackson, PJ3, and now potentially Waiters all shooting way more 3's than they should be, with the last 4 all getting their shots mostly off of iso's, and with Collison and Roberson being so bad at shooting that they shouldn't even be allowed to shoot 3's but Scott Brooks still encourages them to do so anyway...

[3peated]

Isn't this highway robbery? Is Brooklyn just trying to clear salaries before the team is sold, or is Brook ****ed injury-wise for the long-term?

Why wouldn't they try moving DWill or JJ first? Or even KG if he has any value?

they have plumlee playing well, they dont have a backup pg/sg playing well.

[dazzer87]

No more Excuses for FT35................

[fpliii]

Roberson is good defensively, and is a good rebounder but is absolutely useless with what they are asking him to do on offense (space the floor), and in my mind you shouldn't be starting one way players, especially when you have a guy like Morrow who is a much better fit with the starters than with the backups that he currently plays more with.

The main problem with this OKC team is the fact that they have like six guys shooting a combined 24% from deep on a combined 14 three point attempts per game....

That includes Roberson, Collison, Westbrook, Jackson, PJ3, and now potentially Waiters all shooting way more 3's than they should be, with the last 4 all getting their shots mostly off of iso's, and with Collison and Roberson being so bad at shooting that they shouldn't even be allowed to shoot 3's but Scott Brooks still encourages them to do so anyway...
What's his value offensively then? Can he handle the ball or pass?

I agree about one-way players. Tony Allen is a monster defensively, but if they had a Korver, or even a Korver-lite in Memphis, they'd be a clear contender.

What was the issue with Sefolosha anyway? Inconsistency with his shot? Can Morrow play decent enough defense for you?

[russwest0]

What's his value offensively then? Can he handle the ball or pass?

I agree about one-way players. Tony Allen is a monster defensively, but if they had a Korver, or even a Korver-lite in Memphis, they'd be a clear contender.

What was the issue with Sefolosha anyway? Inconsistency with his shot? Can Morrow play decent enough defense for you?

His only value offensively is slashing but he doesn't get to do much of that at all, and mostly just stands pat on the corner of the 3pt line, taking 1-2 threes a game on 9% shooting from deep or whatever it is now.

You can ask any OKC fan if they had the option of trading Reggie, Waiters, Roberson, or Morrow, who would be the last they'd trade and I bet most of them would say Morrow because his playstyle is a perfect fit with this team (and particularly the starters), yet Brooks still prefers his iso chucking players in Jackson and Waiters and his new Sefolosha in Roberson over Morrow... It's pathetic.

And Morrow's defense has looked good so far this season. I wouldn't call him a great defender or anything, but compare it to what say, Harden played for us, or what Reggie is playing for us now and it's good.

And Sefolosha's problem was a bunch of things in OKC. For one, on fast breaks the guy would constantly keep the ball when the best play was clearly to pass it up. Among OKC fans this action basically became known as "the Sefolosha." Another thing that got really annoying last year was him pump faking way too much on open looks because his shooting confidence had dropped a ton. Doing that was just awkward for the offense, because passing the ball to Sefolosha in the halfcourt almost never led to something productive, particularly in the second half of the season... He just became too turnover prone and his great defense that he's known for had fell off hard in some games.

Though you look at the stats and Sefolosha is doing nothing statistically worth noting in Atlanta... Shooting the ball poorly, turning it over a bit too much for his role, etc... He just fits in better with that team as a defensive leader which OKC doesn't need anymore, especially at 4M a year for 3 years... And especially if Brooks' stubborn self was going to keep starting him.

[T_L_P]

Not a fan of this trade at all (for OKC).

Perk is the leader and I still think he brings good value to the team.

Lopez is just a loser. Can't defend, rebound or pass. He can draw double teams but what good is that if he can't even find the open man? He's ultimately a high usage scorer, which won't blend well with Durant and Westbrook (two high usage scorers who are a lot more effective).

Not to mention Lopez is rarely healthy. :confusedshrug:

Maybe they'll just ask Brook to decoy and improve on defense. Can't see it though.

[Rose'sACL]

brooklyn is priming themselves for a sale of the team by dumping salary. Why have all these big contract for new owners to pay?

As a basketball move this is dumb as fck. Business wise this makes more sense

[StephHamann]

OKC trying to rebuild the Cavs.


Waiters = Waiters

Lopez = Varejao

[bdreason]

Lopez won't do anything for the Thunder unless they completely change their offense. I dare to say they may be better just sticking with Perkins... at least he'll give you a few hard fouls. :oldlol:

[bagelred]

brooklyn is priming themselves for a sale of the team by dumping salary. Why have all these big contract for new owners to pay?


This always happens when a team is being prepared for sale...dumping of contracts. And it's unbelievably illogical.

Either way, whether it's Lopez, Williams or Johnson.....or...other players. There's a minimum salary teams have to pay. So what's the difference if you have their future contracts or not? You have to pay team salary no matter what. KG is off books next season so they'll be under luxury tax anyway...

Wouldn't an incoming owner want a good young player in Lopez instead of accepting shit assets for him?

The logic of getting rid of contracts for sale's prep makes no sense. None.

[tpols]

Lopez is a great first half scorer.. Mostly off long or mid jumpers, good at catching and floating in paint shots with touch.. Horribly uncluth(same jumper that's wet to start will brick in any close game) , and cannot rebound, but pretty good at blocking shots. You don't ever want him to have to take more than one dribble.

Overall he doesn't even help OKC as his softness and fragile mentality will be heavily exposed against tough playoff opponents. His impact outside ppg is low and you already have Westbrook and Durant and waiters and Jackson.. Too much diminishing returns.

[Cocaine80s]

Lol Lopez is trash. OKC should be looking for someone else than this scrub



Also, No Excuses.

[MJistheGOAT]

The only trade that OKC needs to get a ring is WAIVE BROOKS.

What a joke of coach.

[BlazerRed]

This is all well and good, but Lopez's health is about as good as Bogut's health. I hope Lopez could stay healthy for the playoffs.

[hawkfan]

Brooklyn will get better with Perkins there because they get improved inside defense.

[bluechox2]

any future owner who would want to buy the nets should know that they cant escape that luxury tax , so why trade a good asset when you have like 4 years of no draft picks coming your way

[hawkfan]

any future owner who would want to buy the nets should know that they cant escape that luxury tax , so why trade a good asset when you have like 4 years of no draft picks coming your way

Yes they can.
Next year Joe Johnson becomes an expired, so he can be traded out.
Also next year, Deron Williams will have two years left on his deal, so he will be easier to deal.
And they can use the stretch provision on someone.

[The JKidd Kid]

any future owner who would want to buy the nets should know that they cant escape that luxury tax , so why trade a good asset when you have like 4 years of no draft picks coming your way

Actually no. Depending on how the trade works out, the Nets could end up well below the luxury tax line when you take into account KGs and Mirzas expiring contracts.

[niko]

I don't get why Nets fans are so concerned with the team saving money, or the luxury tax, If it gives you cap money, etc. then yes but otherwise it's only P&L savings. Who cares. They don't give you the money back.