So... LBJ leaves Miami = lottery team. MJ leaves the Bulls = 2nd round team.

[Ariza4three]

And the only reason Chicago lost in the 2nd was because of bad calls. So really they were an ECF team. MJ stans, hold this L.

[kamil]

2/5
8 points
LeFlop
LeIntegrity
LeCollusion

Bran stans are fvcking try hard losers.

[JT123]

OP speaking the truth. :applause:
In b4 MJ stans with their predictable 2/5 response, cause they can't make an intelligent argument.

[You Cant Ban Me]

LeBron lives rent free in Op's noggin and his neighbor is Michael Jeffrey Jordan...kobe lives down the street every other house in his head is filled with 10 year old girls

[OldSchoolBBall]

The only reason they even got past the first round was because Daugherty, Larry Nance, and Hot Rod Williams were out for the Cavs and Price was injured (ORtg of 97 for that series vs. 118 for the regular season). The Cavs won the season series 4-1 that year.

[talkingconch]

I cant believe its possible to be this stupid like OP

[Smoke117]

Wade isn't going into his prime with Lebron leaving like Pippen was when Jordan did. If this was 2009 the Heat would be a pretty damn good team.

[qrich]

I cant believe its possible to be this stupid like OP

You haven't seen many OP posts.

[Ariza4three]

OP speaking the truth. :applause:
In b4 MJ stans with their predictable 2/5 response, cause they can't make an intelligent argument.
The Lebron Family is full of geniuses. Others just don't stack up.

[Demon Lizard]

So the OP is saying it is more important what a team does without a player than what they accomplish with the player? :biggums:

[sportjames23]

And the only reason Chicago lost in the 2nd was because of bad calls. So really they were an ECF team. MJ stans, hold this L.


Miami = aging, injured Wade, Bosh and scrubs

Chicago = prime Pippen, Grant, Kukoc and Armstrong (with Pip, Grant and Armstrong being All-Stars that year)


Yeah, eat shit, OP.

[3ball]

OP speaking the truth. :applause:
In b4 MJ stans with their predictable 2/5 response, cause they can't make an intelligent argument.
Jordan had built the Bulls into 3-peat, defending champions.

Lebron wasted the prime of his supporting talent by only going 2/4 instead of 4/4, and left the team in shambles, having just experiencing the worst loss in NBA history.

[Ariza4three]

Miami = aging, injured Wade, Bosh and scrubs

Chicago = prime Pippen, Grant, Kukoc and Armstrong (with Pip, Grant and Armstrong being All-Stars that year)


Yeah, eat shit, OP.
Wait wait wait...
now they suck? I thought LBJ had a bunch of allstars and a stacked team? Then even w/o LBJ you add some great roleplayers like Deng and the emergence of Whiteside...
not to mention TWO current allstars in D-Wade and Bosh. That team is stacked to the deck right? Even without Lebron they have all that!

[sportjames23]

OP speaking the truth. :applause:
In b4 MJ stans with their predictable 2/5 response, cause they can't make an intelligent argument.


6-0, bitch.

I don't even need to bring up 2/5.

[kamil]

Jordan had built the Bulls into 3-peat, defending champions.

Lebron wasted the prime of his supporting talent by only going 2/4 instead of 4/4, and left the team in shambles, having just experiencing the worst loss in NBA history.

Worst lost in history against an 'old ass spurs team'.

1/3 against Duncan.

[sportjames23]

Wait wait wait...
now they suck? I thought LBJ had a bunch of allstars and a stacked team? Then you add some great roleplayers like Deng and the emergence of Whiteside...
not to mention TWO current allstars in D-Wade and Bosh. That team is stacked to the deck right? Even without Lebron they have all that!


Relatively healthy Wade and Bosh + prime Lebron = stacked team, phaggit.

They got two rings with that combo (coulda had 3 if Lebron didn't shit the bed in 2011).

[Papaya Petee]

Bulls were fully healthy that year...Except that the Heat haven't been close to fully healthy all year and a fully healthy Heat team with Wade Bosh Whiteside and Deng is a 2nd round team at worst...

[JebronLames]

Miami = aging, injured Wade, Bosh and scrubs

Chicago = prime Pippen, Grant, Kukoc and Armstrong (with Pip, Grant and Armstrong being All-Stars that year)


Yeah, eat shit, OP.
LOL no one mentions the above about miami when talking about them winning in 2012 and 2013. They always talk like lebron won with prime wade, like bosh was playing PF and wasnt hurt in 2012, and that they didn't have a major problem inside. Lebron won despite all that. No other player in history wins back to back championships with those teams. How miami is doing now shows how underrated Lebron is.

[mehyaM24]

not that crazy.. lebron is arguably the highest net impact player of all time.

jordan is up there too.. its just that his volume scoring and depleted versatility (compared to lebron) are easier to replace.

[Hey Yo]

The title should read "Jordan quits Bulls while under contract with a chance to 4peat" = 2 round

[Mr Exlax]

I like how everybody is attacking the OP, but nobody has really said anything to disprove what he's saying lol.

[Lebronxrings]

ether

[Ariza4three]

I like how everybody is attacking the OP, but nobody has really said anything to disprove what he's saying lol.
Because there is no disproving it. And that's why MJ stans are holding an L here. These are straight up facts: Lebron leaves CLE = one of the worst teams ever. Lebron leaves MIA = a lottery team. Yet Jordan's team was arguably still a contender without him. These are straight up facts.

[mehyaM24]

I like how everybody is attacking the OP, but nobody has really said anything to disprove what he's saying lol.
get used to it.

there's been maybe one.. two at best... jordan fans that can actually come up with decent counter-arguments for the OP, and other topics they see as a hindrance to jordan. they're legit masters of ad hominem attacks. :oldlol:

credit to 3ball though.. he is wrong 99% of the time, but at least he tries to debate.

[TheMan]

Jordan had built the Bulls into 3-peat, defending champions.

Lebron wasted the prime of his supporting talent by only going 2/4 instead of 4/4, and left the team in shambles, having just experiencing the worst loss in NBA history.
:applause:

But LeStat's Finals FG% doe :oldlol:

and he had his defensive cover (a role player BTW) win Finals MVP, that's like MJ giving up Shandon Anderson FMVP :roll:

[AirFederer]

ISH :facepalm

[Demon Lizard]

Wait wait wait...
now they suck? I thought LBJ had a bunch of allstars and a stacked team? Then even w/o LBJ you add some great roleplayers like Deng and the emergence of Whiteside...
not to mention TWO current allstars in D-Wade and Bosh. That team is stacked to the deck right? Even without Lebron they have all that!

He was there for 4 years, and a lot changes in that time. Bosh and Wade were still pretty damn elite the first 2 years. Not as much the last 2 with Wade in particular rapidly declining. Wade was a superstar when LeBron first joined. Wade would not make the West all-star team any more.

[Hey Yo]

Because there is no disproving it. And that's why MJ stans are holding an L here. These are straight up facts: Lebron leaves CLE = one of the worst teams ever. Lebron leaves MIA = a lottery team. Yet Jordan's team was arguably still a contender without him. These are straight up facts.
No team lost more games than the Cavs did over that 4 season span when James was in Miami.

[Sarcastic]

Isn't Miami the 7 seed right now? How is that lottery? :confusedshrug:

[Collie]

Because Lebron makes his teammates worse PERMANENTLY, and they never really recover their game after he leaves. Whereas Jordan left his mark on guys like Pippen and Horace to step up even after he left. Pippen, Grant, BJ Armstrong and others had career years after MJ left. Can you name 2 players who became better after LBJ left?

[TheMan]

Isn't Miami the 7 seed right now? How is that lottery? :confusedshrug:
Yeah, even with all the injuries, they aren't a lottery team...Epic fail OP :lol

[Ariza4three]

Isn't Miami the 7 seed right now? How is that lottery? :confusedshrug:
They'll likely lose tonight. They were in the lottery like yesterday or so lol.

[Ariza4three]

Because Lebron makes his teammates worse PERMANENTLY, and they never really recover their game after he leaves. Whereas Jordan left his mark on guys like Pippen and Horace to step up even after he left. Pippen, Grant, BJ Armstrong and others had career years after MJ left. Can you name 2 players who became better after LBJ left?
This is legitimately the dumbest thing I've ever heard :oldlol:

[TheMan]

Because Lebron makes his teammates worse PERMANENTLY, and they never really recover their game after he leaves. Whereas Jordan left his mark on guys like Pippen and Horace to step up even after he left. Pippen, Grant, BJ Armstrong and others had career years after MJ left. Can you name 2 players who became better after LBJ left?
He makes opposing players richer doe, Hibbert, Tyson Chandler, Terry, Barrea all got big checks because of LeShareTheWealthAround. KLeonard next :oldlol:

[Mr Exlax]

Why can't anybody just say that MJ had a better supporting cast? That doesn't make him any less of a player. I would think you people would like that your favorite player had a great team smh.

[Hey Yo]

Because Lebron makes his teammates worse PERMANENTLY, and they never really recover their game after he leaves. Whereas Jordan left his mark on guys like Pippen and Horace to step up even after he left. Pippen, Grant, BJ Armstrong and others had career years after MJ left. Can you name 2 players who became better after LBJ left?
Like who?

Depends on your definition of better. What merits you using?

[FLDFSU]

Isn't Miami the 7 seed right now? How is that lottery? :confusedshrug:


We did go from the "most stacked team of all time" to just a 7th seed in the "weak" Eastern Conference though by losing James and replacing him with a capable starter in Deng.

[FLDFSU]

Because Lebron makes his teammates worse PERMANENTLY, and they never really recover their game after he leaves. Whereas Jordan left his mark on guys like Pippen and Horace to step up even after he left. Pippen, Grant, BJ Armstrong and others had career years after MJ left. Can you name 2 players who became better after LBJ left?

That's not what ISH was saying at the beginning of the season.

Bosh was not going to win MVP now that the ball hog and stat whore was not limiting his touches and stealing his rebounds...

[JT123]

Worst lost in history against an 'old ass spurs team'.

1/3 against Duncan.
The Heat were the older team, idiot.

[Prometheus]

Because Lebron makes his teammates worse PERMANENTLY, and they never really recover their game after he leaves. Whereas Jordan left his mark on guys like Pippen and Horace to step up even after he left. Pippen, Grant, BJ Armstrong and others had career years after MJ left. Can you name 2 players who became better after LBJ left?

:facepalm

Don't ever say something like this again.


Why can't anybody just say that MJ had a better supporting cast? That doesn't make him any less of a player. I would think you people would like that your favorite player had a great team smh.

As a matter of fact, that's what I came here to say. Jordan's Bulls were clearly a better team than LeBron's Heat. Jordan is still better than LeBron.

Jordan > LeBron
Phil > Erik
Jordan's supporting cast > LeBron's supporting cast
6/6 > 2/4

Seems pretty straightforward to me.

[Tainted Sword]

This is actually an argument for MJ being superior to LeBron.

LeBron only thrives when on teams that are built around his "LeBron ball" style of play and that makes his teams more vulnerable when he leaves.

Jordan could be successful on any team regardless of the system which makes him more versatile. It also bodes well for the teams he plays on as they don't completely collapse when he isn't playing.

Jordan teams have far more potential and have better lasting power because they're not limited to only playing one style of basketball.

[livinglegend]

This is actually an argument for MJ being superior to LeBron.

LeBron only thrives when on teams that are built around his "LeBron ball" style of play and that makes his teams more vulnerable when he leaves.

Jordan could be successful on any team regardless of the system which makes him more versatile. It also bodes well for the teams he plays on as they don't completely collapse when he isn't playing.

Jordan teams have far more potential and have better lasting power because they're not limited to only playing one style of basketball.

Prove it. The only system where he won was the triangle system.

And how was Miami Lebron ball? You dumb or what?

[livinglegend]

Bulls were fully healthy that year...Except that the Heat haven't been close to fully healthy all year and a fully healthy Heat team with Wade Bosh Whiteside and Deng is a 2nd round team at worst...

Liar. Bulls were not fully healthy. Some of their key players missed games and they still won 55 games. They would have won more than 60 games if they were fully healthy and probably the championship if the refs didnt cheat.

And when was the last time Wade was fully healthy. Stop acting like Lebron played with a fully healthy Wade for 4 years.

[Spurs m8]

And the only reason Chicago lost in the 2nd was because of bad calls. So really they were an ECF team. MJ stans, hold this L.

Grow up and get a clue, champ

[JT123]

Liar. Bulls were not fully healthy. Some of their key players missed games and they still won 55 games. They would have won more than 60 games if they were fully healthy and probably the championship if the refs didnt cheat.

And when was the last time Wade was fully healthy. Stop acting like Lebron played with a fully healthy Wade for 4 years.
I do find it funny that people are acting like Wade missing a ton of games is something that is out of the ordinary. :oldlol:
Even when Wade and Bosh have played together the Heat have been far from impressive, posting a record of 13-15. Considering the conference they play in that is honestly pathetic.

[305Baller]

Bulls won a championship, Heat did not.

[livinglegend]

Bulls won a championship, Heat did not.
That's the point. Heat did not win because the rest of the team sucked bad. If they were as good as the Bulls rest of team, they would have won.

[sportjames23]

Bulls won a championship, Heat did not.


Huh? When MJ left, the Bulls most certainly did not win a championship.

[305Baller]

Huh? When MJ left, the Bulls most certainly did not win a championship.

The year before. It was a championship squad that was primed for a 4th..

[Prime_Shaq]

Lakers were a lottery team when Shaq left too. With another all time top 10 player entering his prime. Prime Shaq > LeBron

[305Baller]

That's the point. Heat did not win because the rest of the team sucked bad. If they were as good as the Bulls rest of team, they would have won.

Yeah, exactly. LeBron did more with less but it was still not a title team. If he would have won the title and then the team was revealed to be bad then LeBron would get more props. As it is it was an Iverson-esque performance.

[Mr Exlax]

Lakers were a lottery team when Shaq left too. With another all time top 10 player entering his prime. Prime Shaq > LeBron

Prime Shaq > everybody

[Prime_Shaq]

Prime Shaq > everybody
:applause:

[97 bulls]

Lakers were a lottery team when Shaq left too. With another all time top 10 player entering his prime. Prime Shaq > LeBron
Why do people keep missing this concept? In every other situation, when a team loses their best pkayer, the team ends up sucking. Bigtime. This seems to be the rule. Except when it comes to the Bulls.

[Prime_Shaq]

Why do people keep missing this concept? In every other situation, when a team loses their best pkayer, the team ends up sucking. Bigtime. This seems to be the rule. Except when it comes to the Bulls.
Went from a 3 peat to not winning the title and another 3 peat when MJ returns. I'm sure it wasn't because of Jordan though.

[knicksman]

what will be remembered is 2/5 and 6/6

[sportjames23]

The year before. It was a championship squad that was primed for a 4th..

Ah, gotcha.

[G-train]

Miami isn't a lottery team.

[knicksman]

Yeah, exactly. LeBron did more with less but it was still not a title team. If he would have won the title and then the team was revealed to be bad then LeBron would get more props. As it is it was an Iverson-esque performance.

this.. a 54 win team in the east is not a playoff team in the west. And the way they got destroyed by the spurs shows they dont belong in the playoffs. So miami really were a lottery team even with lebron

[RoundMoundOfReb]

And remember LBJ was replaced by Deng, McRoberts, and another top 15 all time player in Wilt Chamberlain where as Jordan was replaced by no one of note. Dat GOAT level impact.

[305Baller]

Miami isn't a lottery team.

We sure look like one.

[funnystuff]

Miami = aging, injured Wade, Bosh and scrubs

Chicago = prime Pippen, Grant, Kukoc and Armstrong (with Pip, Grant and Armstrong being All-Stars that year)


Yeah, eat shit, OP.
Hahaha coming from one of the simpletons claiming Lebrons team was stacked during that 4 year Heat run.


:roll: :roll: :roll:

[funnystuff]

this.. a 54 win team in the east is not a playoff team in the west. And the way they got destroyed by the spurs shows they dont belong in the playoffs. So miami really were a lottery team even with lebron
Lol my god

[Mr Exlax]

Soooooo nobody got nothing? Gotta give this one to you Jam. You shut these idiots up for once. Good shit.

[Euroleague]

And the only reason Chicago lost in the 2nd was because of bad calls. So really they were an ECF team. MJ stans, hold this L.

Were you under the false impression that those Bulls teams were a one man team? That they were not absolutely freaking stacked?

What the hell does Jordan leaving have to do with anything? Of course they should have still been a good team, because they still had a lot of good players and a good coach.

WTF is your damn point? How the hell does that have anything to do with LeBron?

STOP WATCHING ESPN FIRST TAKE TO GAIN YOUR SPORTS "KNOWLEDGE"

[Ariza4three]

Were you under the false impression that those Bulls teams were a one man team? That they were not absolutely freaking stacked?

What the hell does Jordan leaving have to do with anything? Of course they should have still been a good team, because they still had a lot of good players and a good coach.

WTF is your damn point? How the hell does that have anything to do with LeBron?

STOP WATCHING ESPN FIRST TAKE TO GAIN YOUR SPORTS "KNOWLEDGE"
First of all the point I'm trying to make is that Lebron never had stacked teams compared to Jordan, and LBJ is the best at making a team better.
And second of all, let me warn your ****ing ass one time. You flap your gums like that again to me and I will knock you the **** out. No questions asked.

[DonDadda59]

Bruh...

http://s3.amazonaws.com/rapgenius/filepicker%2F9jx3HfPRbCrB4XEIR3lg_wade_champion.jp g

3 rings > 2 rings

:confusedshrug:

[Euroleague]

Because there is no disproving it. And that's why MJ stans are holding an L here. These are straight up facts: Lebron leaves CLE = one of the worst teams ever. Lebron leaves MIA = a lottery team. Yet Jordan's team was arguably still a contender without him. These are straight up facts.

"MJ stans"........I'm no "MJ stan" and I'm no LeBron hater.. I'm not "attacking" you. It's a stupid thread topic. Those Bulls teams were freaking stacked and had Jackson as the coach. What the hell did you expect a team like that to just roll over and die and turn into some kind of scrub team because Jordan left?

You are trolling.

You are trolling at the same level as people that say this, "Brady sucks and is a system QB because the year he was injured, Matt Cassel went 11-5."

You are trolling.

[Euroleague]

what will be remembered is 2/5 and 6/6

Which is retarded. Sorry, but that's imbecile land. So Magic is worse than Kobe because he was 5/9 and Kobe was 5/7?

Or somehow Kareem didn't win the same as Jordan did even though they both won 6, but Kareem got to more finals..........which actually means Kareem won MORE THAN JORDAN DID to anyone with more than 2 functioning brain cells.

6 > 2

But stop with all this nonsense about 2/5 and 6/6 because it's freaking irrelevant. Don't pretend that Jordan didn't lose a whole bunch of freaking times in the playoffs because he DID. And don't pretend that getting to the Finals isn't hard and is totally meaningless because it isn't.

Stop being a mindless clown.

Some of these posts sound like 3 second sound bytes from ESPN First Take, they are so retarded.

[nba_55]

Which is retarded. Sorry, but that's imbecile land. So Magic is worse than Kobe because he was 5/9 and Kobe was 5/7?

Or somehow Kareem didn't win the same as Jordan did even though they both won 6, but Kareem got to more finals..........which actually means Kareem won MORE THAN JORDAN DID to anyone with more than 2 functioning brain cells.

6 > 2

But stop with all this nonsense about 2/5 and 6/6 because it's freaking irrelevant. Don't pretend that Jordan didn't lose a whole bunch of freaking times in the playoffs because he DID. And don't pretend that getting to the Finals isn't hard and is totally meaningless because it isn't.

Stop being a mindless clown.

Some of these posts sound like 3 second sound bytes from ESPN First Take, they are so retarded.
:applause: :applause: :applause:

[RoundMoundOfReb]

MJ stans in this thread:

http://content.presentermedia.com/files/clipart/00007000/7708/stick_figure_holding_letter_l_md_wm.jpg

[red1]

lbj is the new mj. goat and 2nd goat

[Prime_Shaq]

Which is retarded. Sorry, but that's imbecile land. So Magic is worse than Kobe because he was 5/9 and Kobe was 5/7?

Or somehow Kareem didn't win the same as Jordan did even though they both won 6, but Kareem got to more finals..........which actually means Kareem won MORE THAN JORDAN DID to anyone with more than 2 functioning brain cells.

6 > 2

But stop with all this nonsense about 2/5 and 6/6 because it's freaking irrelevant. Don't pretend that Jordan didn't lose a whole bunch of freaking times in the playoffs because he DID. And don't pretend that getting to the Finals isn't hard and is totally meaningless because it isn't.

Stop being a mindless clown.

Some of these posts sound like 3 second sound bytes from ESPN First Take, they are so retarded.
Wow you're actually a pretty good poster when you don't talk about anything euro

[Ariza4three]

MJ stans in this thread:

http://content.presentermedia.com/files/clipart/00007000/7708/stick_figure_holding_letter_l_md_wm.jpg
http://media.tumblr.com/e16dd16f4de841b391f118f72714a54e/tumblr_inline_nbat9kBEXc1satqni.gif

[knicksman]

Which is retarded. Sorry, but that's imbecile land. So Magic is worse than Kobe because he was 5/9 and Kobe was 5/7?

Or somehow Kareem didn't win the same as Jordan did even though they both won 6, but Kareem got to more finals..........which actually means Kareem won MORE THAN JORDAN DID to anyone with more than 2 functioning brain cells.

6 > 2

But stop with all this nonsense about 2/5 and 6/6 because it's freaking irrelevant. Don't pretend that Jordan didn't lose a whole bunch of freaking times in the playoffs because he DID. And don't pretend that getting to the Finals isn't hard and is totally meaningless because it isn't.

Stop being a mindless clown.

Some of these posts sound like 3 second sound bytes from ESPN First Take, they are so retarded.

So you want to include regular season? so 6/13 vs 2/11 Which will just make brans record worse. Just be happy that im giving a less embarrassing stat bro.

[SouBeachTalents]

So you want to include regular season? so 6/13 vs 2/11 Which will just make brans record worse. Just be happy that im giving a less embarrassing stat bro.

Knicks are on a 0/42 run

[poido123]

MJ stans taking a loss?? :biggums:


Soooo...6 from 6 >>>> 2 from 5. Did I do it right?


The logic and context is astounding in this one. :oldlol:

[iamgine]

90s Chicago Bulls was a very very good team with or without MJ. That much is true.

[sportjames23]

90s Chicago Bulls was a very very good team with or without MJ. That much is true.


Without MJ, they're very good. With him, they're great.

[sportjames23]

Hahaha coming from one of the simpletons claiming Lebrons team was stacked during that 4 year Heat run.


:roll: :roll: :roll:


Compared to the rest of the East? With a still very good Wade and Bosh?

Um, yeah, dumbass.

[sportjames23]

MJ stans in this thread:

http://content.presentermedia.com/files/clipart/00007000/7708/stick_figure_holding_letter_l_md_wm.jpg


Look at this ship-jumping fool here. Now all of a sudden reppin the Hawks. :facepalm