View Full Version : Turns out McHale is actually a good coach?
oarabbus
03-02-2015, 03:39 PM
General consensus has been that the guy is shit. But look at the Rockets now, 3rd seed, no Dwight for a long ass time, and they're still running like a well-oiled machine. Good production from guys like Motiejunas, Smoove, Ariza, and Jones, who I don't think would necessarily be producing this well without good coaching.
Harden is a beast no doubt but this team wouldn't be shit if "mcFail" was really as bad as people say he is. 3rd seed in one of the the toughest Western Conferences of all time is no joke. Don't bet me wrong, I'm glad we have Kerr and not McHale but... is this guy the most underappreciated coach out there right now?
Or in other words Harden is a beast.
Heavincent
03-02-2015, 03:41 PM
Never really understood why he got so much hate. I mean, he's not Pop but Rockets fans act like he's the biggest shithead ever. Scott Brooks is far worse imo.
Wally450
03-02-2015, 03:41 PM
Never really understood why he got so much hate. I mean, he's not Pop but Rockets fans act like he's the biggest shithead ever. Scott Brooks is far worse imo.
This. Don't see why people hate him. :confusedshrug:
IncarceratedBob
03-02-2015, 03:44 PM
He's just not a good coach at this moment. But he is such a good dude, Morey probably doesn't have the heart to fire him. Plus he had some difficulties in his personal life with his young daughter passing away, that was freaking terrible. Can't fire a guy after that. Sad story but I'm rooting for Coach McHale to prove me and the rest of the Houston faithful wrong. He can improve but he's gotta put in the time and effort
He gets hate because he doesnt really do anything special coaching wise. Isolate, chuck threes, post up, chuck some threes.
What makes him a good coach?
Harden makes him look way better than he really is.
Harden makes him look way better than he really is.
5 game winning streak, Harden is shooting 39% from the floor, 33% from deep.
Harden has been playing excellent, but the Rockets owe their season to the second unit that has gelled masterfully when nobody said they would.
oarabbus
03-02-2015, 03:50 PM
He gets hate because he doesnt really do anything special coaching wise. Isolate, chuck threes, post up, chuck some threes.
What makes him a good coach?
They're 3rd seed in the West you can't be serious. You don't get there unless your team AND your coach is good. Coaching is a thankless job unless you're Pop... If you have a superstar they're going to get all the credit. But a bad coach will ruin a team. Coaching is one of those "if you're doing it right no one will know you're doing it at all" deals.
At the end of the day Anthony Davis is more of a beast than Harden but the Pelicans don't have good coaching. And people called the Rockets done when Dwight went out... the fact they are this good with their best defensive player and best/second best overall player is COACHING.
Foster5k
03-02-2015, 03:52 PM
LeBron just choked.
They're 3rd seed in the West you can't be serious. Coaching is a thankless job unless you're Pop... If you have a superstar they're going to get all the credit. But a bad coach will ruin a team. Coaching is one of those "if you're doing it right no one will know you're doing it at all" deals.
Not really, I look at the small things you do on the floor as a coach.
What exactly does Kevin Mchale do that any coach playing for morey wouldnt? Great defensive schemes? Great offense?
I mean yeah, if you count things like motivational speaking. You cant replace that all the time.
LONGTIME
03-02-2015, 03:54 PM
Never really understood why he got so much hate. I mean, he's not Pop but Rockets fans act like he's the biggest shithead ever. Scott Brooks is far worse imo.
No he isn't. When the Thunder win, it's only because of Durant and Westbrook! and whenever they lose it's all Brooks fault! Stupid ass fans. :oldlol:
Scott Brooks is better than Mchale. Except, the one problem with Brooks is that he is far too stubborn with player rotations. Also, he also seems to take Durant and Westbrooks click into opinion on who he chooses to play. Although that may just be OKC beat writers making up stories.
Xsatyr
03-02-2015, 03:59 PM
Harden, defense thanks to T.R. Dunn and Ariza, and the second unit are the reason for their success. McHale does not do much which is why Morey and Les like him. Morey controls the style of play and McHale follows orders.
doesn't he have a winning coaching record in Minny of all places
GreggPopazit
03-02-2015, 04:16 PM
Harden is really good and the rest of the team borders on the stacked label as well. The Playoffs will be when we can tell if McHale has become a good coach or not. My gut tells me not.
Not really, I look at the small things you do on the floor as a coach.
What exactly does Kevin Mchale do that any coach playing for morey wouldnt? Great defensive schemes? Great offense?
I mean yeah, if you count things like motivational speaking. You cant replace that all the time.
They're third in OffEff and third in DefEff so he's doing something right, because the personnel the rockets have is nothing to indicate they are even close to those numbers.
Harden is really good and the rest of the team borders on the stacked label as well. The Playoffs will be when we can tell if McHale has become a good coach or not. My gut tells me not.
Stacked label?
Wtf are you talking about?
Smith got waived by his team and nobody wanted him. ISH laughed when Houston picked him up. 'He's a cancer'. 'Grasping for straws'. Here he is, beasting and doing what made him a known commodity.
Or Ariza? How many people laughed when Houston replaced Parsons with Ariza? Everyone but Houston fans.
Or Beverley? Scooped up from the Ukraine not long ago.
Stacked my ass. That roster is horrible. They have all of about 4 or 5 first round picks on their roster now. Their second best player over the last month has been DMo. And you think they're stacked? McHale has coached them up and got them to play together.
StephHamann
03-02-2015, 04:33 PM
TL DR
#noexcuses
Dresta
03-02-2015, 04:48 PM
I've always thought he was a decent coach. Houston fans on here though, in general, are dumbasses who had zero appreciation for their coach mingled with a desperation to prop up their pseudo-superstar Mr. James Harden. i.e. they blame McHale for everything.
They're third in OffEff and third in DefEff so he's doing something right, because the personnel the rockets have is nothing to indicate they are even close to those numbers.
Fair enough. I better not see a first round exit.
Fair enough. I better not see a first round exit.
Because their coach isn't as bad as people think he is?
That makes you a title contender these days? Cool.
Their roster is still horrid.
chocolatethunder
03-02-2015, 05:15 PM
Stacked label?
Wtf are you talking about?
Smith got waived by his team and nobody wanted him. ISH laughed when Houston picked him up. 'He's a cancer'. 'Grasping for straws'. Here he is, beasting and doing what made him a known commodity.
Or Ariza? How many people laughed when Houston replaced Parsons with Ariza? Everyone but Houston fans.
Or Beverley? Scooped up from the Ukraine not long ago.
Stacked my ass. That roster is horrible. They have all of about 4 or 5 first round picks on their roster now. Their second best player over the last month has been DMo. And you think they're stacked? McHale has coached them up and got them to play together.
This is correct. The problem is that it doesn't fit the narrative that's thrown around here that he can't coach and any problems they've ever had are all on him and any success that they've ever had is on Harden. I agree, he has an average roster playing great and has Harden playing about as well as anyone in the league. While I don't really think that they'll do well in the playoffs, I think that McHale has done a great gob coaching this team. There's no drop off with Dwight being down at all.
On a personal note, I am also happy that KJ McDaniels can't even get on the floor. When he was in Philly his mom was a loudmouthed jerk on twitter saying he deserved to be playing more and that the team was "****ing him over". KJ is very solid for a second round pick for sure but he can neither dribble nor shoot and although he gets lots of blocks, he gambles for them and steals way too often. He and MCW are literally the only two players who have been on the Sixers this year who bitched and moaned and had bad body language when they were subbed in games. McDaniels played on the Sixers whose pace is 6th in the league and whose roster is so bad that he can get 20 minutes a night. In his prime he will be a guy who's going to get 20 minutes. He cannot dribble or shoot a lick although he does hustle.
KungFuJoe
03-02-2015, 05:31 PM
Rockets are stacked. McHale still sucks. He's a figurehead...Harden runs the show. Dude is a serious MVP candidate and as much as I used to hate on the guy, you can't deny that he's balling his ass off.
Honestly, a lot of the blame needs to go to Morey. Harden is getting run into the ground because McHale doesn't have another playmaker (and Morey doesn't give a shit about that kinda stuff).
If McHale was a good coach, he'd have found a way to integrate DH into the offense. He has no clue what to do with him. He also has no clue how to spread playmaking duties around and relies way too much on Harden. They need to put Beverley on the bench (or trade him) and get someone like a Barrea who can hit the open jumper and run the offense for stretches to give Harden a breather.
Rockets are stacked. McHale still sucks. He's a figurehead...Harden runs the show. Dude is a serious MVP candidate and as much as I used to hate on the guy, you can't deny that he's balling his ass off.
Honestly, a lot of the blame needs to go to Morey. Harden is getting run into the ground because McHale doesn't have another playmaker (and Morey doesn't give a shit about that kinda stuff).
If McHale was a good coach, he'd have found a way to integrate DH into the offense. He has no clue what to do with him. He also has no clue how to spread playmaking duties around and relies way too much on Harden. They need to put Beverley on the bench (or trade him) and get someone like a Barrea who can hit the open jumper and run the offense for stretches to give Harden a breather.
Bench Beverely and start... Who exactly? Terry is 37. Prigiini is 37. So you bench Bev and start Harden and Brewer and now Harden is the only point guard on the floor, so he will be doing all of the ball handling and guarding the opposing teams point guard.
Solid game plan.
Houston has had a mediocre roster for years. The addition of a broken down Howard didn't change that. Terry is old. Pablo is old. Smith was hated so much the Pistons were willing to pay him 7 figures to go away.
You say he hes clueless, but again, the Rockets are #3 in Off and Def efficiency, and it sure isnt because of the roster, so what could it be?
Personally, I see great movement on offense. Lots of double screens, drive and kicks, the offense has been fluid all season. Yeah Harden averages a ton, but McHale has used that to his advantage, spacing the floor and giving guys all sorts of room to shoot.
But wait, you want Howard to become more of a focal point on offense? You're kidding me right? Dwight is a poor mans Deandre Jordan now. In fact, I'd trade one for the other in a heart beat.
You can say what you want about how they have 'underperformed', but to be honest, which year were they supposed to make a title run? Last year? This year? With three starters missing almost 100 games already, did you expect them to be sitting with the fourth best record in the league?
That's not because of Harden, who has been mediocre in their five game winning streak. Its because the team is playing like a team. No more Dwight sucking up space. No more pounding it down low for 22 seconds at a time. The offensive and defensive schemes are perfectly suited for this roster, and that is 100% McHale.
aj1987
03-02-2015, 05:44 PM
Or in other words Harden is a beast.
LOL! Nope, he's not. Dude has been great (literally hurt me, typing that out), but he's not a "beast"
KungFuJoe
03-02-2015, 06:13 PM
Bench Beverely and start... Who exactly? Terry is 37. Prigiini is 37. So you bench Bev and start Harden and Brewer and now Harden is the only point guard on the floor, so he will be doing all of the ball handling and guarding the opposing teams point guard.
Solid game plan.
Houston has had a mediocre roster for years. The addition of a broken down Howard didn't change that. Terry is old. Pablo is old. Smith was hated so much the Pistons were willing to pay him 7 figures to go away.
You say he hes clueless, but again, the Rockets are #3 in Off and Def efficiency, and it sure isnt because of the roster, so what could it be?
Personally, I see great movement on offense. Lots of double screens, drive and kicks, the offense has been fluid all season. Yeah Harden averages a ton, but McHale has used that to his advantage, spacing the floor and giving guys all sorts of room to shoot.
But wait, you want Howard to become more of a focal point on offense? You're kidding me right? Dwight is a poor mans Deandre Jordan now. In fact, I'd trade one for the other in a heart beat.
You can say what you want about how they have 'underperformed', but to be honest, which year were they supposed to make a title run? Last year? This year? With three starters missing almost 100 games already, did you expect them to be sitting with the fourth best record in the league?
That's not because of Harden, who has been mediocre in their five game winning streak. Its because the team is playing like a team. No more Dwight sucking up space. No more pounding it down low for 22 seconds at a time. The offensive and defensive schemes are perfectly suited for this roster, and that is 100% McHale.
You're reaching too much...trying to make it seem like the Rockets AREN'T stacked so when they get booted from the playoffs, you can go around saying, "See...I told you so".
To address your points...no...there's nothing to do about Beverley now. It's too late as there isn't anyone around who can share the playmaking duties with Harden. That's on Morey as he should have been looking for that instead of picking up guys solely on stats. KPop could have been a poor man's Parsons for you guys but he got stuck on the bench and he's gone anyways.
As for DH, a good coach would have worked out a system where he gets his touches in the offense...just enough to make him happy, so he plays with energy on D. Everyone knows that an unhappy DH doesn't like to play D. He's 10x the defender DJ is, especially man on man. You live with the couple of TOs because he can score at times and he'll hustle on the other end.
As for how smoothly the offense runs...it only runs smoothly when Harden is in. I've seen plenty of instances where all they do is jack up three after three after three and have no clue on offense. Then they just give the ball to Harden and let him work. But, other than that, there isn't much else that's run.
Honestly, you gotta give Ariza a TON of credit..he might be your second most important player. His defense is amazing this year...he's always been a good defender, but if he doesn't get some All NBA defense consideration, I will consider it a robbery. That defense he played against James was some of the best I've ever seen against a DETERMINED Lebron. Especially that play where Lebron got the ball off a missed shot above the three point line and Ariza was all up on him and almost forced him to a backcourt violation and he had to throw the ball away. Man, I was impressed.
You're reaching too much...trying to make it seem like the Rockets AREN'T stacked so when they get booted from the playoffs, you can go around saying, "See...I told you so".
To address your points...no...there's nothing to do about Beverley now. It's too late as there isn't anyone around who can share the playmaking duties with Harden. That's on Morey as he should have been looking for that instead of picking up guys solely on stats. KPop could have been a poor man's Parsons for you guys but he got stuck on the bench and he's gone anyways.
As for DH, a good coach would have worked out a system where he gets his touches in the offense...just enough to make him happy, so he plays with energy on D. Everyone knows that an unhappy DH doesn't like to play D. He's 10x the defender DJ is, especially man on man. You live with the couple of TOs because he can score at times and he'll hustle on the other end.
As for how smoothly the offense runs...it only runs smoothly when Harden is in. I've seen plenty of instances where all they do is jack up three after three after three and have no clue on offense. Then they just give the ball to Harden and let him work. But, other than that, there isn't much else that's run.
Honestly, you gotta give Ariza a TON of credit..he might be your second most important player. His defense is amazing this year...he's always been a good defender, but if he doesn't get some All NBA defense consideration, I will consider it a robbery. That defense he played against James was some of the best I've ever seen against a DETERMINED Lebron. Especially that play where Lebron got the ball off a missed shot above the three point line and Ariza was all up on him and almost forced him to a backcourt violation and he had to throw the ball away. Man, I was impressed.
Again, I point to the fact that Harden is shooting 39% from the field over the 5 game winning streak. Its not all him.
I'm simply stating the facts. The ariza acquisition was laughed at. Beverley was playing in the Ukraine two years ago. Smith was paid however many million to go away, but they continue to win, even with three starters missing 100 games.
That's the coach. You can pretend the bench is stacked, but none of those guys were wanted by any one else, and yet, here they are, thriving under a system tailored to their abilities.
As individuals, none of them are that special. As a team, they are outstanding.
Milbuck
03-02-2015, 06:26 PM
Wait...I thought Harden had zero help though. I thought his team was filled with scrubs and McHale was worse than a retarded version of Scott Brooks?
chocolatethunder
03-02-2015, 06:31 PM
Howard doesn't deserve to get more touches. He's never been particularly effective offensively but since his back problem he's even less effective. He's a guy who's always complained about getting touches but can't do anything once he gets them. He played his best under Van gundy and now he's not capable of being anything more than an 18ppg scorer but was only a 22ppg scorer at his best.
To try and say that McHale hasn't done a good job coaching this team is just bullshit. They've been decimated by injuries and are clearly one of the best teams in the league. Coaching is a huge part of that.
1987_Lakers
03-02-2015, 06:43 PM
I thought McHale did a great job with Houston in his rookie year, he got Houston whose leading scorer was Kevin Martin to a 34-32 record.
1987_Lakers
03-02-2015, 06:49 PM
Rockets are stacked.
In what world are the Rockets stacked?:oldlol:
- Beverly is an average starting point guard in this league at best
- Ariza is just solid, very good defensively and below average on offense
- Dwight Howard has missed pretty much half the season
- Terrence Jones has played in a total of 16 games this year
The Rockets are so stacked that they have ancient Jason Terry playing 21 mpg.:oldlol:
Wait...I thought Harden had zero help though. I thought his team was filled with scrubs and McHale was worse than a retarded version of Scott Brooks?
Don't let the randos fool you...
They watched one game where the bench played well and assume Houston is stacked. They forget all about how old and unwanted all of those same guys were just 4 months ago.
Harden is the MVP, that much is true. But, the roster is, and has been all season, full of below average individuals who have morphed into a top 4 team in the league record wise. Harden didn't do that. It was McHale.
Smook A.
03-02-2015, 06:57 PM
Don't let the randos fool you...
They watched one game where the bench played well and assume Houston is stacked. They forget all about how old and unwanted all of those same guys were just 4 months ago.
Harden is the MVP, that much is true. But, the roster is, and has been all season, full of below average individuals who have morphed into a top 4 team in the league record wise. Harden didn't do that. It was McHale.
He was one of them last year :oldlol:
I remember the offseason like it was yesterday.
"Rockets will be lucky to make the playoffs"
"Rockets are ****ed for the next 5 years"
"Morey is the worst GM in the league for letting Parsons go"
"The loss of Asik, Lin, and Parsons will tremendously hurt the Rockets"
"Rockets will be lucky to win 50"
"Harden will get eliminated before the playoffs even start"
Crazy stuff.
Milbuck
03-02-2015, 07:03 PM
Don't let the randos fool you...
They watched one game where the bench played well and assume Houston is stacked. They forget all about how old and unwanted all of those same guys were just 4 months ago.
Harden is the MVP, that much is true. But, the roster is, and has been all season, full of below average individuals who have morphed into a top 4 team in the league record wise. Harden didn't do that. It was McHale.
Ariza, Bev, D-Mo, Brewer, TJones, etc are not below average. That's a solid group of role players, centered around a ball-dominant guard that puts it all together. They defend, they shoot, they play hard, they play together. Just because they're not star offensive players doesn't mean they're scrubs. They fit the identity of the team.
He was one of them last year :oldlol:
I remember the offseason like it was yesterday.
"Rockets will be lucky to make the playoffs"
"Rockets are ****ed for the next 5 years"
"Morey is the worst GM in the league for letting Parsons go"
"The loss of Asik, Lin, and Parsons will tremendously hurt the Rockets"
"Rockets will be lucky to win 50"
"Harden will get eliminated before the playoffs even start"
Crazy stuff.
Don't put words in my mouths. The Rockets are championship contenders and anything less than the chip is a complete failure.
Smook A.
03-02-2015, 07:25 PM
Don't put words in my mouths. The Rockets are championship contenders and anything less than the chip is a complete failure.
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10947146&postcount=213
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11004920&postcount=62
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10998620&postcount=62
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10755339&postcount=5
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10256815&postcount=10
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11032826&postcount=18http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11032826&postcount=18
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10303223&postcount=6
Let's not sit here and act like you don't change your mind every once in a while.
I<3NBA
03-02-2015, 10:52 PM
bad coaches are exposed in the playoffs.
so we'll see...
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10947146&postcount=213
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11004920&postcount=62
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10998620&postcount=62
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10755339&postcount=5
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10256815&postcount=10
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11032826&postcount=18http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11032826&postcount=18
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10303223&postcount=6
Let's not sit here and act like you don't change your mind every once in a while.
:applause:
RoseCity07
03-02-2015, 11:26 PM
Not even as good as Nate McMillan was as Blazer's head coach. All he knew was ISO Brandon Roy to end every game. Same thing going on in Houston. It's Harden every time and everyone knows it. He's too predictable.
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