This Season, Westbrook > LeBron James [Archive] - Message Board Basketball Forum

Black and White

03-05-2015, 04:31 PM

There's been like 3-4 guys with a case over LeBron this year, and that's not even including Durant who would likely have a strong case if not injured most of it....

Whats your point OP?

I honestly didn't think that we would be talking about better players than LeBron this early, I thought it would come a bit later in his career.

RedBlackAttack

03-05-2015, 05:00 PM

Not even close.

JerrySeinfeld

03-05-2015, 05:04 PM

I honestly didn't think that we would be talking about better players than LeBron this early, I thought it would come a bit later in his career.

People focus too much on age and not enough on mileage. That's why I was :facepalm before the year when everyone had LeBron as an Mvp lock

Alamо

03-05-2015, 05:08 PM

Not even close.

This. Making this thread is like making a thread saying the earth is round. We didn't always know it, but we know it for sure now.

Goatbrook

greatest-ever

03-05-2015, 05:13 PM

Probably but it's close. The only thing Lbj has on him is efficiency.

kuniva_dAMiGhTy

03-05-2015, 05:16 PM

I wouldn't say that at all. Since LeBron has come back from his ailment or whatever, dude has clearly been the best player in the L ...

Black and White

03-05-2015, 05:17 PM

People focus too much on age and not enough on mileage. That's why I was :facepalm before the year when everyone had LeBron as an Mvp lock

Yea, I think LeBron has been good however, this is more just Westbrook becoming better.

24-Inch_Chrome

03-05-2015, 05:18 PM

I'm a huge Westbrook fan but LeBron is still the best player in the league. That said, there are other players who have been more valuable to their teams this season and have entered the MVP conversation as a result.

Quickening

03-05-2015, 05:19 PM

Lebron is coasting, Westbrook is playing desperate every night... when he wins a championship with OKC "most stacked team in league" then we can start comparing him to the King

greatest-ever

03-05-2015, 05:20 PM

I wouldn't say that at all. Since LeBron has come back from his ailment or whatever, dude has clearly been the best player in the L ...
Has he though? I don't think its a stretch to say Westbrook has been the best the past 5 weeks or so. By the way when evaluating whos better on the season you must consider the whole season not just what has happened recently.

zizozain

03-05-2015, 05:20 PM

wtf OP

This Season, Westbrook, Curry, Haredn, Davis, and more > LeBron James

RedBlackAttack

03-05-2015, 05:21 PM

LeBron is still the best player in the league by a fair margin.

greatest-ever

03-05-2015, 05:23 PM

Lebron is coasting, Westbrook is playing desperate every night... when he wins a championship with OKC "most stacked team in league" then we can start comparing him to the King
Lebron's rings have nothing to do with who is better currently. Westbrook does not need a ring to say he's had a better season than Lebron, unless Lbj goes on some mad playoff run then you may have a point.

JerrySeinfeld

03-05-2015, 05:23 PM

LeBron is still the best player in the league by a fair margin.

You don't actually believe this, do you?

Dude got clearly surpassed last year and has no case as the best this year.

ShawkFactory

03-05-2015, 05:23 PM

wtf OP

This Season, Westbrook, Curry, Haredn, Davis, and more > LeBron James
Queer.

kuniva_dAMiGhTy

03-05-2015, 05:24 PM

Has he though? I don't think its a stretch to say Westbrook has been the best the past 5 weeks or so. By the way when evaluating whos better on the season you must consider the whole season not just what has happened recently.

Don't think he's MVP over either Curry/Harden, but he's still better than those TWO and also Westbrook (more efficient and better defensively).

I agree that you need a certain number of games played to have an equal comparison, but that also should include postseason play. Without the playoffs, we're just playing hopscotch with the MVP. :oldlol:

zizozain

03-05-2015, 05:25 PM

LeBron is still the best player in the league by a fair margin.
wow

IncarceratedBob

03-05-2015, 05:26 PM

LeBron is the best player on the planet

Rose'sACL

03-05-2015, 05:27 PM

LeBron is still the best player in the league by a fair margin.
lebron isn't even top 7 in the league. it is OKC's time to win as they have this year's MVP frontrunner as well as last year's MVP. You should bet all you money on thunder winning it all.

BlackandWhite has already bet all his parents' savings on OKC winning it all this season.

24-Inch_Chrome

03-05-2015, 05:28 PM

You don't actually believe this, do you?

Dude got clearly surpassed last year and has no case as the best this year.

Because you have no bias. :rolleyes:

How is he not the best player, especially after returning from injury? His numbers have been top-notch and Cleveland has been winning, I don't know what else he should be doing.

beastee

03-05-2015, 05:32 PM

If Goatbrook was playing like this with Durant...Yes. Currently he is in SUPER-hero mode and putting up insane numbers because he can. Lebron lets Irving do a fair share of the work on the Cavs because KI has that clutch gene. So If Durant comes back and he keeps it up...YES.

JerrySeinfeld

03-05-2015, 05:40 PM

Because you have no bias. :rolleyes:

How is he not the best player, especially after returning from injury? His numbers have been top-notch and Cleveland has been winning, I don't know what else he should be doing.

He's not the only player that can make that claim.... at all.

And not to mention some of the other players who can make that claim, didn't need a 2 week break mid-season in order to do so.

upside24

03-05-2015, 05:43 PM

aj1987

03-05-2015, 05:50 PM

I don't think this is really a secret anymore. Do you agree?
You're basing this off of a month?

Nope. LeBron is still the best player in the world.

RedBlackAttack

03-05-2015, 06:03 PM

Westbrook has been having so many monster games with video game statlines with such frequency it's like it finally clicked inside his head how good he really is.

LeBron is playing well but isn't laying waste to other teams. Westbrook is like the Terminator. He doesn't stop attacking the entire game. I still think LeBron is the best but Westbrook isn't far behind.
The Cavs are 20-4 since Jan. 15 and have been absolutely annihilating teams much of that time. :oldlol:

I guess it depends what you mean by "laying waste to other teams."

We'll see in the playoffs. I can't believe people are even making this argument. Short memories, I guess.

Dave3

03-05-2015, 06:08 PM

I honestly didn't think that we would be talking about better players than LeBron this early, I thought it would come a bit later in his career.
You thought that LeBron would stay the best player in the league for longer than 6 years in a row? Those are ridiculously high expectations bud...

aj1987

03-05-2015, 06:08 PM

The Cavs are 20-4 since Jan. 15 and have been absolutely annihilating teams much of that time. :oldlol:

I guess it depends what you mean by "laying waste to other teams."

We'll see in the playoffs. I can't believe people are even making this argument. Short memories, I guess.
Exactly. WB was averaging 21 PPG on 20 shots a game in Jan. 46% TS. People seem to forget about that.

RedBlackAttack

03-05-2015, 06:13 PM

Exactly. WB was averaging 21 PPG on 20 shots a game in Jan. 46% TS. People seem to forget about that.
He's an extremely talented athlete, but what the hell are people thinking? Westbrook is having statistically his most inefficient season of his career, and he was never all that efficient to begin with. He's shooting 43% from the field and 28% from three. His eFG% and TS% are both down.

He also has an absurd usage rate of 38.1-percent. To put that in perspective, 33.6-percent is the highest James has ever registered for a season in his career.

Frankly, for the amount of possessions he uses, Westbrook's numbers better be pretty eye-popping.

Black and White

03-05-2015, 06:16 PM

You thought that LeBron would stay the best player in the league for longer than 6 years in a row? Those are ridiculously high expectations bud...

Hes a once in a generation kind of talent, so yea, I don't think he's dropped off as much as people think he has.

aj1987

03-05-2015, 06:17 PM

He's an extremely talented athlete, but what the hell are people thinking? Westbrook is having statistically his most inefficient season of his career, and he was never all that efficient to begin with. He's shooting 43% from the field and 28% from three.

He also has an absurd usage rate of 38.1-percent. To put that in perspective, 33.6-percent is the highest James has ever registered for a season in his career.

Frankly, for the amount of possessions he uses, his numbers better be pretty eye-popping.
The same overreaction which led people to make threads saying that KD had the GOAT season, and that he was equal to peak MJ or better than peak LeBron. Prisoners of the moment.

Black and White

03-05-2015, 06:23 PM

The same overreaction which led people to make threads saying that KD had the GOAT season, and that he was equal to peak MJ or better than peak LeBron. Prisoners of the moment.

People said he had the GOAT season??? Thats crazy, no, he had a better season than LeBron, but it wasn't the GOAT season

aj1987

03-05-2015, 06:25 PM

People said he had the GOAT season??? Thats crazy, no, he had a better season than LeBron, but it wasn't the GOAT season
You should've been here when he averaged 36/8/6 over a month. Shit was just idiotic.

Dave3

03-05-2015, 06:29 PM

Hes a once in a generation kind of talent, so yea, I don't think he's dropped off as much as people think he has.
There's been like 4 players in league history who have been the best player in the league for as long as LeBron. Consdiering that this year still remains to be seen, he might have 7 years consecutively. Saying Westrbook is a better player right now is definitely premature. Saying Westbrook is playing better right now though, is very different.

JerrySeinfeld

03-05-2015, 06:30 PM

nba_55

03-05-2015, 06:32 PM

Durant was better than LeBron last year.
:roll: :roll: :roll:

Black and White

03-05-2015, 06:32 PM

There's been like 4 players in league history who have been the best player in the league for as long as LeBron. Consdiering that this year still remains to be seen, he might have 7 years consecutively. Saying Westrbook is a better player right now is definitely premature. Saying Westbrook is playing better right now though, is very different.

As he said ^ I think Durant was the better player last year, and what I meant was, up until now this season, Westbrook has been better imo, still remains to be seen if he carries it through, but I have no doubt that he can

ArbitraryWater

03-05-2015, 06:35 PM

You guys are just desperately searching for guy to trump 'Bron.. look, no credible source, coach, player (even KD) will say Westbrook is better than LeBron :oldlol:

Look, once it will happen, it will happen... too bad you'll just have to wait a bit longer. LeBron's the best, and by a comfortable margin.

The most pathetic thing is you saying this like its some consensus opinion :oldlol: cute

SugarHill

03-05-2015, 06:35 PM

wtf OP

This Season, Westbrook, Curry, Haredn, Davis, and more > LeBron James
please do go on with the "more"

Orlando Magic

03-05-2015, 06:37 PM

Westbrook has been playing out of his mind but James is still superior.

The Cavs are a damn borderline lottery team without LeBron and with him they are looking like title favorites as I originally thought they would be, despite the fact that I massively gave up on them and admittedly thought they would continue to suck about halfway through the season.

Replace RW with LBJ on OKC and they're a hell of a lot better than 8th seed.

Replace LBJ with RW on CLE and they're not winning 18 of 20 games or whatever such nonsense they just did.

On a side note... the MVP should only really change once every 5 to 10 years. All of this nonsense about choosing a new MVP every year or two really needs to stop. Sure, there are years that are exceptions but generally speaking when a guy becomes the actual best and thus most valuable player in the league he stays that way for most of his career. Jordan should have gotten close to 10 MVPs, LeBron should have 7 or 8, Shaq should have gotten 6 or 7, etc, etc... but that's not a fun story now is it? ******s.

The thing about LeBron is this... no matter what team he's on, they're going to the playoffs and there's a good chance they're contending. No matter what team. 76ers? Knicks? No problem. The same can not be said of any other player in the league and can't be said of any player in the league since prime Duncan and Shaq. Those guys are/were so ****ing good that everyone around them believed that their team was going to win.

Black and White

03-05-2015, 06:39 PM

please do go on with the "more"

See I like Curry, and hes been really good, but his team helps him ALOT.

24-Inch_Chrome

03-05-2015, 06:39 PM

He's not the only player that can make that claim.... at all.

And not to mention some of the other players who can make that claim, didn't need a 2 week break mid-season in order to do so.

You're out of your mind if you're trying to argue that Curry/Harden are better than LeBron. They've been more valuable to their team through the season but neither is better, at least not yet.

Hey Yo

03-05-2015, 06:41 PM

He's not the only player that can make that claim.... at all.

And not to mention some of the other players who can make that claim, didn't need a 2 week break mid-season in order to do so.
LeBron didn't need a month long break at the beginning of the season like Westbrook.

JerrySeinfeld

03-05-2015, 06:41 PM

You're out of your mind if you're trying to argue that Curry/Harden are better than LeBron. They've been more valuable to their team through the season but neither is better, at least not yet.

So Durant wasn't better last year, and none of Curry/Harden/Davis/Westbrook are better this year?

Next year will the same thing happen again? How long is LeBron going to carry the "best player" title while being undeserving?

RedBlackAttack

03-05-2015, 06:45 PM

So Durant wasn't better last year, and none of Curry/Harden/Davis/Westbrook are better this year?

Next year will the same thing happen again? How long is LeBron going to carry the "best player" title while being undeserving?
http://reactiongif.org/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/10/Confused-Confusing-Confusion-GIF.gif

StrongLurk

03-05-2015, 06:45 PM

I'll take Lebron over all of them in the playoffs this year.

inclinerator

03-05-2015, 06:46 PM

lebron james is clearly the best player in the league, just look @ his matchups against other mvp calibur players

Dave3

03-05-2015, 06:49 PM

As he said ^ I think Durant was the better player last year, and what I meant was, up until now this season, Westbrook has been better imo, still remains to be seen if he carries it through, but I have no doubt that he can
And it you want to argue that, that's fine. I can understand both sides of that coin. But for Westbrook being better this season? Dude, he's been amazing for one month and playing like the best in the league, but best for the entire season? Others have already made a much better argument as to why he hasn't been.

24-Inch_Chrome

03-05-2015, 07:01 PM

So Durant wasn't better last year, and none of Curry/Harden/Davis/Westbrook are better this year?

Next year will the same thing happen again? How long is LeBron going to carry the "best player" title while being undeserving?

Durant is injured, until he's playing consistently he doesn't really count as anything in terms of best player in the league. MVP =/= best player, it's not like he was universally acknowledged as the best player last season, there was debate on the subject (though he did deserve the MVP). Curry and Harden have been more valuable to their teams this season but neither is an immediate threat as far as best player.

LeBron will carry that title until someone can take it from him. Durant seems to be the next big thing, with Davis also looking to have monster potential, but until Durant is healthy/Davis' potential is realized and translates into wins they haven't earned the title. Any argument about Durant being better is based on one contentious season and any argument about Davis being better includes less than 50 games as a sample. There has to be consistency from both of them, in the regular season and the playoffs, to strip LeBron of his crown.

How exactly is he "undeserving?" 4 straight finals appearances (streak going to 5 seems likely), 2 rings, fantastic stats, Cleveland playing winning basketball...what else does he have to do?

Your anti-LeBron agenda is obvious, it's time to accept reality.

Black and White

03-05-2015, 07:01 PM

And it you want to argue that, that's fine. I can understand both sides of that coin. But for Westbrook being better this season? Dude, he's been amazing for one month and playing like the best in the league, but best for the entire season? Others have already made a much better argument as to why he hasn't been.

Well I think he's been better so far, playoffs will be the deciding factor, WB has to go through a dogfest out west, but he has a knack of destroying West point guards.

upside24

03-05-2015, 07:06 PM

The Cavs are 20-4 since Jan. 15 and have been absolutely annihilating teams much of that time. :oldlol:

I guess it depends what you mean by "laying waste to other teams."

We'll see in the playoffs. I can't believe people are even making this argument. Short memories, I guess.
He is putting up insane numbers. No team has an answer for him and no individual defender can stop him you just have to hope he has an off night.

I agree LeBron is the better player but Westbrook is playing better.

RedBlackAttack

03-05-2015, 07:11 PM

He is putting up insane numbers. No team has an answer for him and no individual defender can stop him you just have to hope he has an off night.

I agree LeBron is the better player but Westbrook is playing better.
I can't imagine what LeBron's numbers would look like if he EVER had a usage rate of 38.1 and almost 50 over a month-long period. Keep in mind that, even in his most statistically dominant seasons, he never used close to that many possessions to do it.

I'm sorry if I'm not doing cartwheels for a guy who uses that many of his teams possessions and he is putting up big numbers. What would you expect?

upside24

03-05-2015, 07:17 PM

I can't imagine what LeBron's numbers would look like if he EVER had a usage rate of 38.1 and almost 50 over a month-long period. Keep in mind that, even in his most statistically dominant seasons, he never used close to that many possessions to do it.

I'm sorry if I'm not doing cartwheels for a guy who uses that many of his teams possessions and he is putting up big numbers. What would you expect?
Westbrook is having to do more without Durant. He is the best scoring and playmaking option on his team so if he is involved with a high percent of his teams posessions then good.

As long as he is scoring and assisting fairly effectively and is not a detriment to the team I don't see the problem. Same with Harden.

LeBron can coast whenever he needs. Kyrie might **** around and drop 55 again.

JT123

03-05-2015, 07:18 PM

I'll take Lebron over all of them in the playoffs this year.
This is what it all comes down to. Not a single person who has posted in this thread would take Westbrook on their playoff roster over Lebron. Until that changes Lebron will always be better than Westbrook.

pauk

03-05-2015, 07:23 PM

http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/f-p.gif

RedBlackAttack

03-05-2015, 07:25 PM

Westbrook is having to do more without Durant. He is the best scoring and playmaking option on his team so if he is involved with a high percent of his teams posessions then good.

As long as he is scoring and assisting fairly effectively and is not a detriment to the team I don't see the problem. Same with Harden.

LeBron can coast whenever he needs. Kyrie might **** around and drop 55 again.
Westbrook is obviously doing what he needs to do to keep the team afloat in KD's absence. If that means using half of his team's possessions against the 76ers, have at it. But, that really should produce insane numbers (it has, for the most part) and it should be noted when discussing said numbers. Let's not pretend that he is doing all this with standard usage, even for a PG. He's dominating the ball in a historic fashion.

Allen Iverson NEVER put up a usage rate over 38, even when he was basically the only real scoring threat on those 76ers teams. That should help put this into context. AI was maligned much of the time for his domination of the basketball.

I also have to think that being THAT active for too big a stretch will be detrimental, longterm, especially for a guy with an injury history. I understand OKC is still in a fight to secure a playoff spot, but my goodness. He's averaging over 34 shots a game (shooting 40% from the field, 13% from three and averaging five turnovers) over the last three games.

The rebounds are probably the most impressive thing to me, for a guard. That's something that Westbrook really excels at given his size and position. But the rest of it? A little context please.

Also, FYI... LeBron didn't play in the game wherein Kyrie scored 55. Personally, I'd much rather have a whole team contributing. It's more sustainable, imo.

upside24

03-05-2015, 07:32 PM

Westbrook is obviously doing what he needs to do to keep the team afloat in KD's absence. If that means using half of his team's possessions against the 76ers, have at it. But, that really should produce insane numbers (it has, for the most part) and it should be noted when discussing said numbers. Let's not pretend that he is doing all this with standard usage, even for a PG. He's dominating the ball in a historic fashion.

Allen Iverson NEVER put up a usage rate over 38, even when he was basically the only real scoring threat on those 76ers teams. That should help put this into context.

I also have to think that being THAT active for too long will be detrimental, longterm. I understand OKC is still in a fight to secure a playoff spot, but my goodness. He's averaging over 34 shots a game (and shooting 40% from the field, 13% from three and averaging five turnovers) over the last three games.

The rebounds are probably the most impressive thing to me, for a guard. That's something that Westbrook really excels at given his size and position.

Also, FYI... LeBron didn't play in the game wherein Kyrie scored 55. Personally, I'd much rather have a whole team contributing. It's more sustainable, imo.
I know. I was just pointing out that his team has an incredible 2nd option that can carry the load if needed.

Westbrook has Durant obvously but he is more often DNP than not.

RedBlackAttack

03-05-2015, 07:41 PM

I know. I was just pointing out that his team has an incredible 2nd option that can carry the load if needed.

Westbrook has Durant obvously but he is more often DNP than not.
Oh I agree with that. And, the Cavs are winning at a rate and by large point spreads that mirrors the talent on their roster.

But, even when LeBron was virtually by himself with the Cavs... prior to the Larry Hughes trade, even. He never dominated the ball the way Westbrook has recently and for a season.

Look, I'm not saying Westbrook isn't a great talent (he is) and that he's not having a fine season (he is), but the context is necessary and when people start saying that he's the best player in the league... ?

I think that's a little over-the-top and hyperbolic. I'd be willing to say he is currently a top five player in the league and he's putting up huge numbers right now because he has to in order for his team to stay in playoff position. But, that has brought with it almost unprecedented ball domination and it also happens to coincide with a soft spot in the schedule for OKC.

J Shuttlesworth

03-05-2015, 08:05 PM

Are the people saying Westbrook > LeBron based on this season also ready to say that LeBron has been > Kobe since 05?

Papaya Petee

03-05-2015, 08:29 PM

At 27\8\7 43% FG and 28% 3PT, the only version of LeBron this is better than was Rookie LeBron, and maybe this years LeBron.

:roll:

tmacattack33

03-05-2015, 08:35 PM

Nah...Lebron's been better since coming back from his injury.

Westbrook's been good, but it still not efficient and is not getting the W's. His 40 point triple doubles look good and grab the headlines, but look closer and his efficiency in them hasn't been so good, with weak shooting percentages and around 5 turnovers in each... and very importantly OKC lost 2 of these 3 games...and they came close to losing the other against a team that is tanking.