Is MVPs + FMVPs the best way to rank players all time?

[dubeta]

Is a combination of MVPs and FMVPs the best way to grade players all time, with a requirement of at least 1 of each?

[Eric Cartman]

Kobe + Lebron wouldn't tie Michael Jordan.

11>9

[Cold soul]

Kobe + Lebron wouldn't tie Michael Jordan.

11>9

I'm not sure both players combined equal MJ.

[Eric Cartman]

I'm not sure both players combined equal MJ.

According to OP, Lebron is twice as good as Kobe, 6>3.

He'll sing a different tune when/if Lebron wins sidekick rings with Kyrie

[KNOW1EDGE]

No.

Watching them play is the best way to rank players.

[knicksman]

Youre on a meltdown bro. Just take this 2/5 and move on

[miles berg]

Can't believe there are actually idiots out there that argue LeBron or Kobe us even on the same planet as Air Jordan.

Crazy.

[Akrazotile]

I'd say it's pretty reasonable.

The three best players of the post-jordan era, Shaq, Duncan, Lebron all have at least four. Nobody else is in that company. So the system seems to work.

[dubeta]

I'd say it's pretty reasonable.

The three best players of the post-jordan era, Shaq, Duncan, Lebron all have at least four. Nobody else is in that company. So the system seems to work.

Yup, Magic has 6 combined and Bird has 5 combined. All the greats have 4+, and the GOAT tier players all have 6+ (LeBron, Jordan, Kareem etc)

[TheMilkyBarKid]

I think this way takes into account the individual moreso than their circumstances which I like.

When ranking I like to judge whether or not a candidate has put a full dominant season together (mvp, ring and finals mvp).

Off the top of my head MJ, shaq, magic, bird, duncan, hakeem and lebron have all done this.

[greatest-ever]

No definitely not because that would make Tony Parker a top 15 player ever with 4 rings and a FMVP.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

No definitely not because that would make Tony Parker a top 15 player ever with 4 rings and a FMVP.

Read the title again. "MVPs+FMVPs." Where do rings come into it?

[Akrazotile]

No definitely not because that would make Tony Parker a top 15 player ever with 4 rings and a FMVP.


When was Parker the MVP?

Maybe had a case in 08 but a lot of deserving players got shafted bigtime by the media's agenda that year.

[Marchesk]

Is a combination of MVPs and FMVPs the best way to grade players all time, with a requirement of at least 1 of each?

You'd have to estimate how many FMVPs Russell would have had, and then put him at #1, right above MJ.

[navy]

You'd have to estimate how many FMVPs Russell would have had.
No you dont. He has all of them ever created.

[dubeta]

I think we are all in agreement with this new measurement. There's really no counterargument to this, makes sense to judge winning, as well as dominance.


Only issue is that we need to discount weak era rings, as in my other thread (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=370813) it was proven it was the equivalent of winning in the second round.

However, the metric seems strong enough, should it be an official ISH metric for ranking players all time now?

[Marchesk]

FMVPs is dumb, because you have to rely on teams making the finals. Wilt against the Lakers in the 60s would have racked up much better finals stats, which would go in as estimated FMVPs.

Hakeem with a better team for half his career would probably have a couple more FMVPs as well. Wasn't his fault Sampson got hurt and other guys were drug addicts.

[Fudge]

Biggest meltdown in ISH history. :oldlol: :oldlol:

Kobe stans in your head BAD.

Damn.

[Akrazotile]

Moses Malone has 4. Very impressive. :applause:

It looks like four really is the cut-off where you start to go from noteworthy player to all-time great territory.

[SouBeachTalents]

Ok, so if we're counting players who would have won Finals MVP had the award been given out, here's the top 10

1. Russell- 12
2. Jordan- 11
3. Mikan- 9
4. Kareem- 8
5. Wilt- 6
5. Magic- 6
5. LeBron- 6
8. Bird- 5
8. Duncan- 5
10. Shaq- 4
10. Moses- 4

[Marchesk]

However, the metric seems strong enough, should it be an official ISH metric for ranking players all time now?

No, it's not fair. Give Oscar Kareem in the 60s and we can talk. Magic was great, but he was extremely fortunate to have that Laker team to start out his career with.

[dubeta]

Ok, so if we're counting players who would have won Finals MVP had the award been given out, here's the top 10

1. Russell- 12
2. Jordan- 11
3. Mikan- 9
4. Kareem- 8
5. Wilt- 6
5. Magic- 6
5. LeBron- 6
8. Bird- 5
8. Duncan- 5
10. Shaq- 4
10. Moses- 4

:applause:

Now just remove all the weak era rings, as I proved 100% in this thread (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=370813) why they aren't valid. There were 4 teams and the best won the ring, it was easier than even making the playoffs in today's era.

So No Russell, Wilt, Mikan

1. Jordan

2. Kareem

3. LeBron

3. Magic

5. Bird

Top 5 All time, whats the problem?

[knicksman]

OP trying too hard..But end up as 2/5..:yaohappy: ..

[stalkerforlife]

Best way to measure greatness is if a player sticks with one team to win lots of titles and refuses to leave his own team...twice...to form super teams.

[Spurs5Rings2014]

Best way to measure greatness is if a player sticks with one team to win lots of titles and refuses to leave his own team...twice...to form super teams.

That's my GOAT.

:applause: