How many people here dont have Jordan as the GOAT ?

[navy]

Ive always maintained that Jordan is considered the Goat by most, outside of a few stans and a plethora of trolls who probably don't actually believe what they say....So the question here who does not have Jordan as the GOAT ? And obviously say who you have at the top.

[Smoke117]

I have Kareem as the GOAT and I've never been shy about saying that.

[Im Still Ballin]

He's my GOAT

[k0kakw0rld]

KAJ all day

[Mass Debator]

21,493.5

#1 MJ
#2 Russell

[dubeta]

1) Kareem

2) Magic

3) Shaq

4) LeBron

5) Jordan

[Budadiiii]

KAJ is the GOAT because he played with another top 5 all-time player for the bulk of his rings.

Somehow that doesn't affect his legacy like it does with Jordan, who played with a fringe top 50er.

[nba_55]

i don't have him as goat after analysing his career.

[Paul George 24]

1) Kareem

2) Magic

3) Shaq

4) LeBron

5) Jordan


LEFLOP :roll:

[Paul George 24]

i don't have him as goat after analysing his career.
CAUSE U RE THE PERSON OF dubeta:oldlol:

[nba_55]

KAJ is the GOAT because he played with another top 5 all-time player for the bulk of his rings.

Somehow that doesn't affect his legacy like it does with Jordan, who played with a fringe top 50er.

Doesn't matter, Jordan probably had the most stacked cast ever. Which other all-time great had teammates who could win 55 games without him?

[jlip]

I rank players according to tiers, and MJ is only one of 3-5 players in tier #1.

[nba_55]

CAUSE U RE THE PERSON OF dubeta:oldlol:

are you theo?

[T_L_P]

Doesn't matter, Jordan probably had the most stacked cast ever. Which other all-time great had teammates who could win 55 games without him?

Kareem.

1989 Lakers: 57 wins

1990 Lakers: 63 games

[ralph_i_el]

https://www.extension.org/sites/default/files/Youth.png

[SouBeachTalents]

KAJ is the GOAT because he played with another top 5 all-time player for the bulk of his rings.

Somehow that doesn't affect his legacy like it does with Jordan, who played with a fringe top 50er.

For whatever reason, Kareem/Magic are held to a completely different standard than other all time greats. Kobe's first 3 titles are deemed a footnote for playing with Shaq, and LeBron's Finals runs are dismissed because of the conference he's played in, yet these two top 5 GOAT's played together, in an extremely weak conference, and none of their titles/accomplishments are ever criticized the way they are for LeBron & Kobe

[Psileas]

Ι find Wilt's, Russell's and Kareem's GOAT cases comparably serious, so I hesitate to call anyone the definite GOAT.

My own question is: Among the people who have Jordan at #1 "without thinking twice" and they have nothing to gain out of this choice (=it's their honest choice, not something that the media or someone else persuaded them to claim), how many have lived/studied extensively the games of the other players I mentioned.

[Patrick Chewing]

1. Jordan
2. Chamberlain

[Budadiiii]

Kareem.

1989 Lakers: 57 wins

1990 Lakers: 63 games
:roll:

Beat me to it. Made the NBA finals both years after Kareem retired and won more games both years.

[G0ATbe]

Great player. Was my favorite player growing up(before Kobe), but absolutely not GOAT material.

1. Kobe Bryant
2. Kareem
3. Magic
4. O'neal
5. Bird
6. Wilt
7. Duncan
8. Russell
9. Hakeem Olajuwon
10. Moses Malone
11. Oscar Robinson
12. Kevin Garnett
13. Scottie Pippen
14. Julius Erving
15. Dwyane Wade
16. Michael Jordan

[SouBeachTalents]

Great player. Was my favorite player growing up(before Kobe), but absolutely not GOAT material.

1. Kobe Bryant
2. Kareem
3. Magic
4. O'neal
5. Bird
6. Wilt
7. Duncan
8. Russell
9. Hakeem Olajuwon
10. Moses Malone
11. Oscar Robinson
12. Kevin Garnett
13. Scottie Pippen
14. Julius Erving
15. Dwyane Wade
16. Michael Jordan

Most accurate list of all time?

[Akrazotile]

I rank players according to tiers, and MJ is only one of 3-5 players in tier #1.


This.

People are too quick to assume there is a definitive chronological pecking order.

The fact is, there are a handful of players at each level that are basically interchangeable.

[DonDadda59]

Doesn't matter, Jordan probably had the most stacked cast ever. Which other all-time great had teammates who could win 55 games without him?

A ton. Better question is how many all time greats had a teammate who led a team to a championship before said supposed great fled their team to join up with them? :lol

[nba_55]

Kareem.

1989 Lakers: 57 wins

1990 Lakers: 63 games

Kareem didn't add anything to his legacy with that team, he was at the end of his career. Jordan gets credited for 3 championships for playing with the team that won 55 games without him.

[Hey Yo]

Kareem.

1989 Lakers: 57 wins

1990 Lakers: 63 games
:oldlol: :oldlol:

Kareem was 41yrs old when he walked away.

MJ was 30 and in his prime.

[nba_55]

A ton. Better question is how many all time greats had a teammate who led a team to a championship before said supposed great fled their team to join up with them? :lol

Why are you getting insecure? Lebron is not my father, you insulting him doesn't make me mad. Controle your insecurities and stay on topic.

And you got all those green bars :biggums: Flawed system

[SouBeachTalents]

A ton. Better question is how many all time greats had a teammate who led a team to a championship before said supposed great fled their team to join up with them? :lol

:oldlol: LeBron's the only one in the top 10 isn't he?

[nba_55]

:oldlol: :oldlol:

Kareem was 41yrs old when he walked away.

MJ was 30 and in his prime.

This.:applause: :applause:

[zizozain]

Kareem is the greatest player in NBA history

Kareem is the greatest basketball player in history

and if he wasn't a Muslim, ESPN and the rest of zionist media w made him GOD

MJ was juast a brand

[Hey Yo]

Why are you getting insecure? Lebron is not my father, you insulting him doesn't make me mad. Controle your insecurities and stay on topic.

And you got all those green bars :biggums: Flawed system
His uses his alt "beastmode" to give himself rep.

[Im Still Ballin]

If you want to take a garbage team as far as possible Lebron is your guy

If you have a talented team already that is not quite championship material you take Jordan

[24-Inch_Chrome]

If I had to guess I'd say the majority of real ISH posters (discounting all trolls, usually LeBron/Kobe stans) have Jordan as the GOAT. A smaller contingent would have Kareem, and a much smaller group would have Wilt.

I flip-flop between rankings and tiers but Jordan is #1 on my personal rankings and top tier in my tier list.

[T_L_P]

Kareem didn't add anything to his legacy with that team, he was at the end of his career. Jordan gets credited for 3 championships for playing with the team that won 55 games without him.

Kareem gets credit for 2 rings on teams that were able to win 63 games without him (not to mention, he wasn't even all that effective on the second title team).

[ArbitraryWater]

Kareem gets credit for 2 rings on teams that were able to win 63 games without him (not to mention, he wasn't even all that effective on the second title team).

Nahh not really.. I think most know he was a non-factor on the last 2 title Teams.

[Euroleague]

Abdul-Jabbar is the NBA GOAT for me.

[Smoke117]

Abdul-Jabbar is the NBA GOAT for me.

The NBA GOAT and the GOAT basketball player in general are not one in the same?...this should be good.

[Hey Yo]

Nahh not really.. I think most know he was a non-factor on the last 2 title Teams.
87 Finals he avg. 22-7- 2.5blks

I'd say he was a 39yr old factor at 34mpg

[24-Inch_Chrome]

The NBA GOAT and the GOAT basketball player in general are not one in the same?...this should be good.

Inb4 Spanoulis.

[jongib369]

My list changes, but I usually have Jordan at 3rd, sometimes higher at 4, but it's hard for me to rank someone so damn good....So I prefer tiers...But if it's a top 10 list?

1.Wilt
2.Kareem
3.Jordan

[Hey Yo]

The NBA GOAT and the GOAT basketball player in general are not one in the same?...this should be good.
If someone wanted to get picky, they could use a players NCAA days which obviously isn't NBA.

If NCAA rules (at the time) allowed Freshman to play, Kareem more than likely would have been part of 4 straight NCAA championships at UCLA.

So if you use both, you could say basketball career / player

[sdot_thadon]

He's my goat, used to be by far when I was a kid. Now I can see other cases a bit more objectively than when I was running around with my 23 jersey on all the time....
1.Mj (obvious reasons)
2.Jabbar (dominated every level of the game over 3 decades?)
3.Russell ( very underrated due to lack of info)

And I struggle like hell now with Wilt. I can't place him anymore. He can be anywhere from 3-8 on any given day lol.

[Fudge]

Jordan is the GOAT because I said so.

It's really not close either.

[Kblaze8855]

There is a reasonable argument to be made for Jordan, Kareem, Russell, and wilt to me. Long as you dont have anyone outside that 4...im not gonna argue with you.

[Euroleague]

The NBA GOAT and the GOAT basketball player in general are not one in the same?...this should be good.

That's not what I said. Two different discussions and issues. And I am not getting into that in this thread, because of trolling assholes.

What I am saying though that is relevant is that you can't claim someone that never played in FIBA is "greatest basketball player ever".

Kareem never played in FIBA.

So I am simply saying Kareem is the best NBA player ever for me. But he never played in any FIBA game ever. So that claim about "greatest basketball player ever" is over the top. Without him ever playing in FIBA.

I think it would be more fair to separate him out from that.

It is like Belov, the greatest FIBA player ever. he never played in NBA.

So you can say Belov is the best FIBA player ever. Kareem is the best NBA player ever. Leave it at that. No need to exaggerate one way or the other when neither played in both and say "greatest basketball player ever".

If you are going to do that, then you have to actually look at guys that played both.

I think it's fair to say Kareem is best NCAA player ever also though, but FIBA and NBA are much more important than NCAA.

Keep in mind here...........we are talking GOAT, as in GREATEST of all time. That has the meaning of the guy with the greatest career, not necessarily the best player.

And they are saying, "Kareem is the greatest basketball player of all time". It's not the same as saying "best basketball player of all time". Two different standards.

[ClipperRevival]

Good to see KAJ getting some love. I thought I would be the only one saying he's the only guy along with MJ who can make a legit claim to GOAT. No one else is in that class. Russell? Not much of an offensive game and questionable era. Wilt? Came up short in the playoffs time and time again. When you look at the total body of work, there is MJ and KAJ and then everyone else a notch below.

[SouBeachTalents]

There is a reasonable argument to be made for Jordan, Kareem, Russell, and wilt to me. Long as you dont have anyone outside that 4...im not gonna argue with you.

:applause: Agreed, those 4 all have legit arguments.

[Euroleague]

Inb4 Spanoulis.

Spanoulis is the Euroleague GOAT. That's a different discussion though. So stop trolling.

[swagga]

magic/kareem/jordan = goat tier for me. gun to the head i'd take kareem. DPOY defense at important position in the game and the best offensive move in the history of the L.





Spanoulis is the Euroleague GOAT. That's a different discussion though. So stop trolling.
ish GOAT doing work :lol

[Milbuck]

Spanoulis is the Euroleague GOAT. That's a different discussion though. So stop trolling.
Giannis >>>>>>>>> Spanoulis.

[r0drig0lac]

21,493.5

#1 MJ
#2 Russell
this

[Smoke117]

That's not what I said. Two different discussions and issues. And I am not getting into that in this thread, because of trolling assholes.

What I am saying though that is relevant is that you can't claim someone that never played in FIBA is "greatest basketball player ever".

Kareem never played in FIBA.

So I am simply saying Kareem is the best NBA player ever for me. But he never played in any FIBA game ever. So that claim about "greatest basketball player ever" is over the top. Without him ever playing in FIBA.

I think it would be more fair to separate him out from that.

It is like Belov, the greatest FIBA player ever. he never played in NBA.

So you can say Belov is the best FIBA player ever. Kareem is the best NBA player ever. Leave it at that. No need to exaggerate one way or the other when neither played in both and say "greatest basketball player ever".

If you are going to do that, then you have to actually look at guys that played both.

I think it's fair to say Kareem is best NCAA player ever also though, but FIBA and NBA are much more important than NCAA.

Keep in mind here...........we are talking GOAT, as in GREATEST of all time. That has the meaning of the guy with the greatest career, not necessarily the best player.

And they are saying, "Kareem is the greatest basketball player of all time". It's not the same as saying "best basketball player of all time". Two different standards.

:rolleyes: Why would he need to have played in the minor leagues?

[Euroleague]

Giannis >>>>>>>>> Spanoulis.

Giannis never played in Euroleague idiot, as has been explained to you in this forum about 1,000 times.

This guy Milbuck, is an example of one of those trolling ASSHOLES right there.

Also, try to derail the thread again, and I am reporting you directly to Jeff's twitter. That you once again, are trying to ruin a good basketball discussion with your sick trolling.

[nba_55]

Good to see KAJ getting some love. I thought I would be the only one saying he's the only guy along with MJ who can make a legit claim to GOAT. No one else is in that class. Russell? Not much of an offensive game and questionable era. Wilt? Came up short in the playoffs time and time again. When you look at the total body of work, there is MJ and KAJ and then everyone else a notch below.

Really? How many games of him have you watched? Can you go in details about his offensive game please? I would really like to know.

[Euroleague]

:rolleyes: Why would he need to have played in the minor leagues?

So, I am supposed to discuss who the GOAT basketball player is, with someone that does not even know what FIBA is?

IGNORE LIST.

You don't even have basic basketball knowledge and you are in a thread about the GOAT basketball player?

:biggums: :biggums: :biggums:

[Smoke117]

So, I am supposed to discuss who the GOAT basketball player is, with someone that does not even know what FIBA is?

IGNORE LIST.

You don't even have basic basketball knowledge and you are in a thread about the GOAT basketball player?

:biggums: :biggums: :biggums:

You realize that you supposedly added me to your ignore list about 2 years ago...right? :lol You're a joke.

[ClipperRevival]

Really? How many games of him have you watched? Can you go in details about his offensive game please? I would really like to know.

I have watched none. But I am going by accepted knowledge and stats. Let me flip it around. If you thought he was so good offensively, please describe his strengths as an offensive player.

[3ball]

:applause: Agreed, those 4 all have legit arguments (MJ, Russell, Wilt, Kareem).


The other guys all have weaknesses in some aspect of their ability or career.

Only MJ's ability and career had no weaknesses in any area..

[Milbuck]

Giannis never played in Euroleague idiot, as has been explained to you in this forum about 1,000 times.

This guy Milbuck, is an example of one of those trolling ASSHOLES right there.
Dude was a Greek League all star by 16. Not even a legal adult and he was tearing Euroleague apart. So ****ing dominant he left to go pro in the NBA at just 18.

[nba_55]

The other guys all have weaknesses in some aspect of their ability or career.

Only MJ's ability and career had no weaknesses in any area.

He is 1-9 without Pippen. He can't protect the pain like Wilt and Russell. He can't shoot 3's and more.

[SouBeachTalents]

The other guys all have weaknesses in some aspect of their ability or career.

Only MJ's ability and career had no weaknesses in any area.

I've got Jordan as GOAT, but Kareem (longevity), Russell (championships), and Wilt (stats) all have an argument

[Euroleague]

You realize that you supposedly added me to your ignore list about 2 years ago...right? :lol You're a joke.

Jordan played "in the minor leagues" according to your post.

STFU and GTFO.

People with actual basketball knowledge are trying to have a real basketball talk here.

[nba_55]

I have watched none. But I am going by accepted knowledge and stats. Let me flip it around. If you thought he was so good offensively, please describe his strengths as an offensive player.

I don't judge players I have never watched and this is why I never said he was good offensively or bad. GOAT is subjective, one shouldn't let other people's eyes decide their list for him.
You say he had no offensive game and yet have never watched him. LOL

[Euroleague]

Dude was a Greek League all star by 16. Not even a legal adult and he was tearing Euroleague apart. So ****ing dominant he left to go pro in the NBA at just 18.

kblaze claims to be a serious and good mod, yet he constantly lets ludicrous trolling like this go on in threads he posts in.

It is 100% proof that he is a worthless POS mod.

[ClipperRevival]

I don't judge players I have never watched and this is why I never said he was good offensively or bad. GOAT is subjective, one shouldn't let other people's eyes decide their list for him.
You say he had no offensive game and yet have never watched him. LOL

I didn't say he had no offensive game, just not much. And yeah, looking at stats is somewhat realiable to judge his merits as an offensive player just as I can to judge Wilt's dominance as an offensive player. Like I said, if some old timer who saw Russell play wants break down his offensive game, I would like to read it out of curiousity.

[3ball]

I've got Jordan as GOAT, but Kareem (longevity), Russell (championships), and Wilt (stats) all have an argument


but for all those guys, you can say "well, XXX is a drawback to their ability and/or career."

i.e. kareem was 2nd fiddle for most of his rings and has a FMVP deficit... wilt only won 2 rings and underachieved (ala Shaq)... russell's offense was far from elite.

but what's MJ's drawback?... he doesn't have one... that's why he has the best all-round case for GOAT - no weaknessees... it's not close actually - deep down everyone knows this but it's fun to sing "kumbaya" instead

[nba_55]

I didn't say he had no offensive game, just not much. And yeah, looking at stats is somewhat realiable to judge his merits as an offensive player just as I can to judge Wilt's dominance as an offensive player. Like I said, if some old timer who saw Russell play wants break down his offensive game, I would like to read it out of curiousity.

No, stats are not reliable, basketball is much more than stats. Last playoffs, Lewis dominated a game against Pacers and his stats were 0 point, 0 rbs, and 0 assists. His defensive, passing and spacing impacts didn't show up in the stats.

[Euroleague]

but for all those guys, you can say "well, XXX is a drawback to their ability and/or career."

i.e. kareem was 2nd fiddle for most of his rings and has a FMVP deficit... wilt only won 2 rings and underachieved (ala Shaq)... russell's offense was far from elite.

but what's MJ's drawback?... he doesn't have one... that's why he has the best all-round case for GOAT - no weaknessees... it's not close actually - deep down everyone knows this but it's fun to sing "kumbaya" instead

Jordan had the refs in his pocket during the entire 90s. Don't try to rewrite history. I'm not saying Jordan was not amazing and incredible, because he absolutely was. But he also ABSOLUTELY won some of those championships because the refs without any doubt at all favored the Bulls and gifted them calls.

They got just as much ref help, or more, as the Shaq and Kobe Lakers of 2000s.

So don't pretend that Jordan was some kind of god and won and did everything all on merit. Because he did not. He was certainly the best player of his time, but the refs exaggerated it a lot with how much they helped him and the Bulls.

[SouBeachTalents]

but for all those guys, you can say "well, XXX is a drawback to their ability and/or career."

i.e. kareem was 2nd fiddle for most of his rings and has a FMVP deficit... wilt only won 2 rings and underachieved (ala Shaq)... russell's offense was far from elite.

but what's MJ's drawback?... he doesn't have one... that's why he has the best all-round case for GOAT - no weaknessees... it's not close actually - deep down everyone knows this but it's fun to sing "kumbaya" instead

But it's not as open and shut a case as Gretzky for GOAT in his sport. Gretzky obliterates his historical competition by MVP count and especially statistically, something that can't be said for Jordan

[dubeta]

Jordan had the refs in his pocket during the entire 90s. Don't try to rewrite history. I'm not saying Jordan was not amazing and incredible, because he absolutely was. But he also ABSOLUTELY won some of those championships because the refs without any doubt at all favored the Bulls and gifted them calls.

And so it begins, the beginning of the 3ball - Euroleague essay feud :applause:

[nba_55]

Jordan had the refs in his pocket during the entire 90s. Don't try to rewrite history. I'm not saying Jordan was not amazing and incredible, because he absolutely was. But he also ABSOLUTELY won some of those championships because the refs without any doubt at all favored the Bulls and gifted them calls.

They got just as much ref help, or more, as the Shaq and Kobe Lakers of 2000s.

So don't pretend that Jordan was some kind of God and won and did everything all on merit. because he did not.
:applause: :applause: :applause:

[ClipperRevival]

No, stats are not reliable, basketball is much more than stats. Last playoffs, Lewis dominated a game against Pacers and his stats were 0 point, 0 rbs, and 0 assists. His defensive, passing and spacing impacts didn't show up in the stats.

I agree, stats can be misleading. But this topic is specifically about Russell's offensive game.His numbers say he wasn't much of a scorer. If you want to go beyond the stats to show that he was great offensively, the burden is on you to prove it. I know Wilt was great offensively. Why? His career scoring avg is 2nd best ever and his peak offensive numbers stil stand. This is the GOAT discussion. If I can't get two buckets from my big down low, he isn't on my GOAT team. I'm sorry. Kaj > Bill all days.

[nba_55]

I agree, stats can be misleading. But this topic is specifically about Russell's offensive game.His numbers say he wasn't much of a scorer. If you want to go beyond the stats to show that he was great offensively, the burden is on you to prove it. I know Wilt was great offensively. Why? His career scoring avg is 2nd best ever and his peak offensive numbers stil stand. This is the GOAT discussion. If I can't get two buckets from my big down low, he isn't on my GOAT team. I'm sorry. Kaj > Bill all days.

Offense is much more than scoring. You can say Russell was an average scorer just looking at the stats, but you can't conclude much more than that.

[Euroleague]

And so it begins, the beginning of the 3ball - Euroleague essay feud :applause:

3ball is one of the most knowledgeable guys in this site about basketball. I have no reason to "feud" with him here. He actually knows what he is talking about.

People just troll him because they are trolls.

[nba_55]

3ball is one of the most knowledgeable guys in this site about basketball. I have no reason to "feud" with him here. He actually knows what he is talking about.

People just troll him because they are trolls.
:facepalm
I take back my applauses

[ClipperRevival]

Offense is much more than scoring. You can say Russell was an average scorer just looking at the stats, but you can't conclude much more than that.

For consideration of being the GOAT as a big, you have to have a dominant offensive game. Russell didn't. And that is a huge minus on his resume. At least that's my take. How can you be the GOAT if you don't even know if your big can dominate offensively down low and carry a team and handle the doubles and find the open man?

[nba_55]

For consideration of being the GOAT as a big, you have to have a dominant offensive game. Russell didn't. And that is a huge minus on his resume. At least that's my take. How can you be the GOAT if you don't even know if your big can dominate offensively down low and carry a team and handle the doubles and find the open man?

As I said, you can't judge a player's offensive game only looking at stats. Offensive is more complicated, it's not just PPG.

[97 bulls]

As I said, you can't judge a player's offensive game only looking at stats. Offensive is more complicated, it's not just PPG.
Even more, you cant judge a players impact by stats only

[ClipperRevival]

As I said, you can't judge a player's offensive game only looking at stats. Offensive is more complicated, it's not just PPG.
Umm, in judging the GOAT big it is. Show me another all time great big with Russell's pedestrian offensive numbers. Kaj, Wilt, Hakeem, Shaq. All dominant offensively.

[nba_55]

Even more, you cant judge a players impact by stats only
Exactly! That guy is talking like he grew up watching Russell play live. Don't talk about shits you don't know.

[nba_55]

Umm, in judging the GOAT big it is. Show me another all time great big with Russell's pedestrian offensive numbers. Kaj, Wilt, Hakeem, Shaq. All dominant offensively.
Show we another all time great big with 11 rings.

We can make arbitrary criterias like these all day long.

[ClipperRevival]

Show we another all time great big with 11 rings.

And that's why when judging the GOAT, you have to look at the entire picture. Kaj won enough and was much more dominant offensively and played closer to the modern era when he talent pool was much greater. For me, Kaj clearly over Russell. If you disagree, fine.

[nba_55]

And that's why when judging the GOAT, you have to look at the entire picture. Kaj won enough and was much more dominant offensively and played closer to the modern era when he talent pool was much greater. For me, Kaj clearly over Russell. If you disagree, fine.

Yeah, it's fine.

Before this discussion, I didn't know if you were a knowledgeable poster, I didn't know if your GOAT list should be taken seriously. And I didn't make premature conclusions on you. I asked you questions, I informed myself and now, after discussing with you, I can safely conclude that you don't know much. Your GOAT list don't mean anything and shouldn't be taken seriously.

It was nice discussing with you. Have a good time.

[gts]

I've got Kareem...

[Uncle Drew]

To me, Kareem is the best to ever play. Or Lew Alincdor rather.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Giannis >>>>>>>>> Spanoulis.

Giannis:

http://i.giphy.com/1oum3cfEk9GUg.gif

Spanoulis:

http://i.minus.com/i7qcpmixMflsd.gif

Looks pretty clear to me. :confusedshrug:

[MJistheGOAT]

It

[WallIn]

He's a GOAT in my eyes. Very few arguments could be used against him.

[3ball]

He's a GOAT in my eyes. Very few arguments could be used against him.
what are the arguments against jordan?

it can't be longevity - he won 6 rings in 15 seasons - that's long enough... and his 6/15 winning percentage (40%) is the greatest of all time (besides russell ofc).

it can't be stats or accolades.

so what is it?

is it that he turned an ordinary 2nd round exit team into the greatest team of all time?

so when you say "very few"... i can't think of any.

[G0ATbe]

what are the arguments against jordan?


is it that he turned an ordinary 2nd round exit team into the greatest team of all time?

:yaohappy:? Pippen did that, not Jordan.


And it was actually 1st round exit:cheers: .