Hypothetical: Duncan wins FMVP

[Joyner82reload]

That would give him 6 titles, 4 FMVP, and 2 MVP's. Shouldn't that make him #3 all time behind Kareem & Jordan?

[Akrazotile]

That would give him 6 titles, 4 FMVP, and 2 MVP's. Shouldn't that make him #3 all time behind Kareem & Jordan?



Eye test > accolades


Wherever you have Duncan, whether it's top 5 or top 20, shouldnt change based on a handful of games and an award the lazy media votes on at the end of his career. We already know who he is as a player.

If you cant compare that to other guys and make your own decision, you shoukd watch closer.

[Spurs5Rings2014]

Yep. Said it a while back, but there would be no argument for anyone else being ahead of him other than Jordan and Kareem. Top 3 all time, dead or alive. More FMVP's than anyone not the GOAT.

:cry:

[Joyner82reload]

Eye test > accolades


Wherever you have Duncan, whether it's top 5 or top 20, shouldnt change based on a handful of games at the end of his career. We already know who he is as a player.

If you cant compare that to other guys and make your own decision, you shoukd watch closer.

Ok, then nothing LeBron does from this point forward will enhance his all time ranking. He already peaked and is clearly on the decline, near the end of his prime. He is what he was.

[Akrazotile]

Ok, then nothing LeBron does from this point forward will enhance his all time ranking. He already peaked and is clearly on the decline, near the end of his prime. He is what he was.


Lebron still has half a career to go left. If he falls off a cliff next season and never recovers, his lack of longevity will hurt his merit against other players of similar caliber.

Duncan is like 39. Hes already proven to be a great player with great longevity. Whether the Spurs make it back and the media votes him as FMVP this year or not doesnt change who he is as a player.

[SouBeachTalents]

Yep. Said it a while back, but there would be no argument for anyone else being ahead of him other than Jordan and Kareem. Top 3 all time, dead or alive. More FMVP's than anyone not the GOAT.

:cry:

Still would have been far behind Russell had the award been given out then

[J Shuttlesworth]

Rings can be overblown when it comes to all-time rankings. Accolade wise, he has a pretty clear case over someone like Larry Bird, or Wilt Chamberlain, but he doesn't have a case over Bill Russell.

That said, I would rather have prime Duncan on my team than prime Bill Russell. And even though Duncan is ranked higher than Shaq because he has one more ring, I'd rather have prime Shaq over Duncan.

[iamgine]

That would give him 6 titles, 4 FMVP, and 2 MVP's. Shouldn't that make him #3 all time behind Kareem & Jordan?
I don't think anything Duncan does now will affect anything.

He could stunk it up going 1/100 FG and miss 50 free throws and it won't change anything. And it goes both ways except if he performed above his prime/peak self.

[Akrazotile]

Rings can be overblown when it comes to all-time rankings. Accolade wise, he has a pretty clear case over someone like Larry Bird, or Wilt Chamberlain, but he doesn't have a case over Bill Russell.

That said, I would rather have prime Duncan on my team than prime Bill Russell. And even though Duncan is ranked higher than Shaq because he has one more ring, I'd rather have prime Shaq over Duncan.


This

[Joyner82reload]

Lebron still has half a career to go left. If he falls off a cliff next season and never recovers, his lack of longevity will hurt his merit against other players of similar caliber.

Duncan is like 39. Hes already proven to be a great player with great longevity. Whether the Spurs make it back and the media votes him as FMVP this year or not doesnt change who he is as a player.

Half of his career? He'll be at 43,000 career minutes(Playoffs+Regular season) at the end of the year. The NBA record for minutes played is 65,000 and that's by Kareem who was 7'3 and was a shadow of himself for his final 3 seasons(which totaled 8,000 minutes). Around 55,000 minutes is the absolute maximum a players body can take. LeBron has 2-3 good years left, period. Kobe & KG just hit that magic 55,000 minute mark for reference

[kennethgriffin]

only way i see it happening is if there 5-6 guys all averaging 13-14ppg and duncan leads the way with 15ppg


and even then itel be a useless finals mvp

he might move up to 4th or 5th all time but hes still just coasting off of his teams depth and popovich

put horry on this current spurs team and he could steal finals mvp somehow


sh*t danny green was his teams leading scorer through 6 games in 2013

[BlakFrankWhite]

I'll have him at #3

[BlakFrankWhite]

only way i see it happening is if there 5-6 guys all averaging 13-14ppg and duncan leads the way with 15ppg


and even then itel be a useless finals mvp

he might move up to 4th or 5th all time but hes still just coasting off of his teams depth and popovich

put horry on this current spurs team and he could steal finals mvp somehow


sh*t danny green was his teams leading scorer through 6 games in 2013

:facepalm

The only "useless finals mvp" is that off 2010 Kobe

Seriously though, 6/24 in the most important game of his career...he's lucky Gasol bailed him out or else he'd been crucified if Lakers lost game 7 on their own court

[kennethgriffin]

rings and finals mvps arent as clear cut and equal as some believe

is chauncy billups ring/finals mvp worth the same as dirk nowitzki's ?



duncan already has an asterisk 1999 lockout title

shouldnt have won finals mvp over ginobili in 2005

parker won finals mvp rightfully in 2007

basically a rookie won finals mvp over duncan in 2014 with parker as the 2nd man


and winning a title in 2015 would probably be even less impressive




i'd give duncan

0.5 for 1999
1.0 for 2003
0.5 for 2005
0.5 for 2007
0.2 for 2014

so in reality duncan has like 2.7 titles... and another crap title would be 0.3 at best as 3rd, 4th option

[kennethgriffin]

:facepalm

The only "useless finals mvp" is that off 2010 Kobe

Seriously though, 6/24 in the most important game of his career...he's lucky Gasol bailed him out or else he'd been crucified if Lakers lost game 7 on their own court

yeah averaging nearly 30/10/5 for the finals is useless

[JebronLames]

GOAT since he plays in a tougher era than jordan.

6>6#

#= weak era

[Smoke117]

I dunno why you are so shook Kenneth? Duncan is already > Kobe. This just builds onto it.

[kennethgriffin]

GOAT since he plays in a tougher era than jordan.

6>6#

#= weak era


as much as the 90s era sucked...

duncan could be replaced by josh mcroberts and the spurs still win in 2014

[kennethgriffin]

I dunno why you are so shook Kenneth? Duncan is already > Kobe. This just builds onto it.


all i'm gonna say is


people hate on kobe when he averages 32/8/5 for a finals series as finals mvp

people praise duncan when he averages 15/10/2 for a finals series as the 3rd most important player



theres a consistent double standard.

its as if tim duncan had a v*gina or something..


its like this is a female vs male dunk contest and the judges give the woman a 10 out of 10 for just being able to do a steve nash type dunk while the guys are doing windmill 360's and getting 7's or 8's


know what i mean?

[rmt]

only way i see it happening is if there 5-6 guys all averaging 13-14ppg and duncan leads the way with 15ppg


and even then itel be a useless finals mvp

he might move up to 4th or 5th all time but hes still just coasting off of his teams depth and popovich

put horry on this current spurs team and he could steal finals mvp somehow


sh*t danny green was his teams leading scorer through 6 games in 2013

Why don't you check before posting rubbish?

Through 6 games - 2013 Finals
Duncan 108 pts
Parker 100
Leonard 83
Green 93

[kennethgriffin]

Why don't you check before posting rubbish?

Through 6 games - 2013 Finals
Duncan 108 pts
Parker 100
Leonard 83
Green 93

my bad. through 5 games... i think it was both green and duncan at 18ppg

i forgot it was game 6 green had only 2 points

[Smoke117]

all i'm gonna say is


people hate on kobe when he averages 30/8/5 for a finals series as finals mvp

people praise duncan when he averages 15/10/2 for a finals series as the 3rd most important player



theres a consistent double standard.

its as if tim duncan had a v*gina or something..


its like this is a female vs male dunk contest and the judges give the woman a 10 out of 10 for just being able to do a steve nash type dunk while the guys are doing windmill 360's and getting 7's or 8's


know what i mean?

No, I absolutely don't know what you mean. I didn't read your post besides a glance and this ending "know what I mean". I don't know what you mean ever, so why would this change anything? I don't need to read it because I already know it led to...delusion. Being an alcoholic I know a lot about being full of shit...and home boy, you fit the bill.

[kennethgriffin]

and its duncans own fault for blowing that 2013 finals


sure it took a miracle three by ray allen

but it also took a missed point blank layup by tim duncan

[bobopenguin]

Rings can be overblown when it comes to all-time rankings. Accolade wise, he has a pretty clear case over someone like Larry Bird, or Wilt Chamberlain, but he doesn't have a case over Bill Russell.

That said, I would rather have prime Duncan on my team than prime Bill Russell. And even though Duncan is ranked higher than Shaq because he has one more ring, I'd rather have prime Shaq over Duncan.

was loyalty, body health, attitude in the consideration?
i take duncan if it's based from day 1 to last day in their career.

[kennethgriffin]

heres the video of duncan trying to make a layup in the 2013 finals

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLanJwKAJH8#t=0m24s

[kennethgriffin]

No, I absolutely don't know what you mean. I didn't read your post besides a glance and this ending "know what I mean". I don't know what you mean ever, so why would this change anything? I don't need to read it because I already know it led to...delusion. Being an alcoholic I know a lot about being full of shit...and home boy, you fit the bill.


well then why are you replying to me if you can't read

just log off lol

:roll:

f*cking helen keller wannabe

[Smoke117]

well then why are you replying to me if you can't read

just log off lol

:roll:

f*cking helen keller wannabe

http://www.niusnews.com/upload/imgs/default/15MarP/an/3.gif

[rmt]

all i'm gonna say is

people hate on kobe when he averages 32/8/5 for a finals series as finals mvp

people praise duncan when he averages 15/10/2 for a finals series as the 3rd most important player

theres a consistent double standard.

its as if tim duncan had a v*gina or something..

its like this is a female vs male dunk contest and the judges give the woman a 10 out of 10 for just being able to do a steve nash type dunk while the guys are doing windmill 360's and getting 7's or 8's

know what i mean?

The difference is that Kobe was 30 years old and in his prime while Duncan was 38 years old and by most standards shouldn't be putting up those numbers. Sounds like sour grapes.

[kennethgriffin]

http://www.niusnews.com/upload/imgs/default/15MarP/an/3.gif


yup.. thats what helen keller would do when she trys to read

look up and away to the sky while smiling

[kennethgriffin]

The difference is that Kobe was 30 years old and in his prime while Duncan was 38 years old and by most standards shouldn't be putting up those numbers. Sounds like sour grapes.

good for duncan. hes a great role player in his old age. but i fail to see how that title would boost his legacy

glen rice had a nice little 3rd man 15ppg ring back in the day with kobe and shaq...

do we even acknowledge it? not many people i know outside of the rice family

:confusedshrug:

[kennethgriffin]

if kobe won a title next year as the 3rd option on the spurs. how much higher would he move all time

would he leap frog into 2nd all time? maybe 1st as some are saying in this thread for duncan

[rmt]

and its duncans own fault for blowing that 2013 finals

sure it took a miracle three by ray allen

but it also took a missed point blank layup by tim duncan

You Kobe stans would fault a 38 year old Duncan for a 30 pt / 17 reb game. Maybe that 38 year old body was TIRED after playing 44:28.

[Smoke117]

if kobe won a title next year as the 3rd option on the spurs. how much higher would he move all time

would he leap frog into 2nd all time? maybe 1st as some are saying in this thread for duncan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3CxF6uztlI ;) Be you homeboy. I don't respect your opinion, but I always found it amusing and was upset when you got banned. Be you, bitch.

[Paul George 24]

GOAT since he plays in a tougher era than jordan.

6>6#

#= weak era
WEAK & SOFT ERA = LEBRON'S ERA

[Nowitness]

if kobe won a title next year as the 3rd option on the spurs. how much higher would he move all time

would he leap frog into 2nd all time? maybe 1st as some are saying in this thread for duncan

Kobe moving up 10 places because of one ring after taking 2 years off and contributing nothing more than 30 points on 30 shots? Nah.

Duncan moving up one spot because of a ring at 38, after going to three consecutive finals and still putting up elite defense and making the offence flow? Yes.

[DMAVS41]

Eye test > accolades


Wherever you have Duncan, whether it's top 5 or top 20, shouldnt change based on a handful of games and an award the lazy media votes on at the end of his career. We already know who he is as a player.

If you cant compare that to other guys and make your own decision, you shoukd watch closer.

I kind of agree, but Duncan playing great this late in his career (especially on defense)...matters.

If he were to have a great playoff run and win finals MVP this year...that absolutely should matter for how we view him as a basketball player.

Every single thing a player does on the court matters...obviously some stuff matters more than others.

[ninephive]

That would give him 6 titles, 4 FMVP, and 2 MVP's. Shouldn't that make him #3 all time behind Kareem & Jordan?
Yes, I think that would cement it for him no doubt. Honestly I think he has the case for #3 even without it, but with another FMVP for sure, and with just another title as a primary contributer (top 3 player on the team), he should have it.

[Alamо]

Manu Ginobili made a quote some years back saying "I know I'm going to be playing for a championship every year until my retirement probably, as long as I'm playing next to Tim Duncan."

That quote just says so much about Tim Duncan's all around impact on the game, and how much he still means to this team. The Spurs are Tim Duncan. His value to this team can't be denied. Damn right winning would boost his legacy even further.


Saying this, Top 3 all time is a bit of a stretch :oldlol:

[PejaTheSerbSnip]

good for duncan. hes a great role player in his old age. but i fail to see how that title would boost his legacy

glen rice had a nice little 3rd man 15ppg ring back in the day with kobe and shaq...

do we even acknowledge it? not many people i know outside of the rice family

:confusedshrug:

Role player?????

Duncan made 1st team all NBA that year, and was STILL the anchor of that defense. Many thought he was DPOY. Averaged 17/10/2.5/2 in the regular season, and 18/10 in the playoffs, putting up a 19/12 in the finals. He was 5 seconds away from being the run-away finals MVP (25 points in the first half of game 6). How the hell is that a role player?

Moreover....if hes a role player, who the hell on that Spurs team isn't, if you're crapping on the numbers he put up? Cripes, you dont think 17/10/3/2 blocks on 50% shooting is impressive yet you talk up his supporting cast ("legendary manu, top 50 parker") when they sure as sh!t were not posting better stats than that in their last 2-3 seasons, or from 1999-2007.


Stop talking crap, they're very close historically, Kobe is an ATG but isn't better than Duncan by some wide margin.

[BlakFrankWhite]

Role player?????

Duncan made 1st team all NBA that year, and was STILL the anchor of that defense. Many thought he was DPOY. Averaged 17/10/2.5/2 in the regular season, and 18/10 in the playoffs, putting up a 19/12 in the finals. He was 5 seconds away from being the run-away finals MVP (25 points in the first half of game 6). How the hell is that a role player?

Moreover....if hes a role player, who the hell on that Spurs team isn't, if you're crapping on the numbers he put up? Cripes, you dont think 17/10/3/2 blocks on 50% shooting is impressive yet you talk up his supporting cast ("legendary manu, top 50 parker") when they sure as sh!t were not posting better stats than that in their last 2-3 seasons, or from 1999-2007.


Stop talking crap, they're very close historically, Kobe is an ATG but isn't better than Duncan by some wide margin.

Why do you bother even arguing with this dude? The guy thinks Kobe > Jordan,Kareem,Wilt,Magic..

He's messed up in the head

[PejaTheSerbSnip]

You Kobe stans would fault a 38 year old Duncan for a 30 pt / 17 reb game. Maybe that 38 year old body was TIRED after playing 44:28.
And goddamn, Kobe is one of my favourite players of the 2000s but if duncan blew the 2013 finals by averaging 19/12 on 56 TS% and elite defense, then what did Kobe do in the 2004 and 2008 finals? He shot a combined 47.5 TS% in those two series. Barely had more points than shots.

[ShawkFactory]

If the Spurs won and he was awarded the MVP I'd probably move him up to 5. I have him at 7 now.

A guy this old anchoring a championship team is very impressive.

[PejaTheSerbSnip]

Why do you bother even arguing with this dude? The guy thinks Kobe > Jordan,Kareem,Wilt,Magic..
He's messed up in the head
Who knows.... At the very least he seems to BELIEVE what hes saying, as silly as it is.

[thefatmiral]

should have won it. ginobili meltdown took it away. top five atleast. kobe and shaq could be ranked higher. jordan kobe shaq duncan. didn't watch Russell or wilt. couldn't say.