If Lebron wins a ring, where does he rank all time?

[VengefulAngel]

and wins FMVP.

4x MVP
3x NBA champion
3x FMVP


5 finals in a row.


???

That's a pretty impressive resume.

[ISHGoat]

Top 5 undisputable

[VengefulAngel]

Top 5 undisputable

It just hit me how impressive those accolades are.

[SOD 21]

Top 5-7 alltime if that happens.

[VengefulAngel]

Top 5-7 alltime if that happens.

I can't think of 7 players who have had a 5 year span as good as that.

[LEFT4DEAD]

Top 5-7 alltime if that happens.
Agree. One more FMVP and ring after that and he is top 3.
But still its a dissapointment, since he had talent to be the GOAT.

[Trollsmasher]

2nd GOAT

[Im so nba'd out]

top 10

[Bernkastel]

Top 6 at least. Will have to reflect a few years after his retirement to get an accurate assessment tbh

[Megabox!]

Top 6 at least. Will have to reflect a few years after his retirement to get an accurate assessment tbh
Nailed it

[Kobe_6/8]

Is LeBron already the GOAT small forward?

[kennethgriffin]

how the hell is 3 for 6 finals

better than any of

11 for 12 finals
6 for 6 finals
6 for 10 finals
5 for 9 finals
5 for 7 finals
5 for 6 finals


all these guys had just as good a career as hypothetical best case scenario lebron.

its about #of rings by mvp winners

not #of mvps by ring winners


otherwise moses malone would be top 10 all time.



1 more ring and lebrons in the conversation with bird/wilt/shaq. thats about it

top 7-10

[kennethgriffin]

yall listing #of mvps are kidding yourself



stephen curry = kobe bryant
allen iverson = hakeem olajuwon
derrick rose = oscar robertson
steve nash > shaquille oneal

?

[Spaulding]

Top 10 no question.

[plowking]

yall listing #of mvps are kidding yourself



stephen curry = kobe bryant
allen iverson = hakeem olajuwon
derrick rose = oscar robertson
steve nash > shaquille oneal

?

Why are you so upset that not everyone has the same way of ranking players as you?

Some people prefer sustained excellence and winning rings as the best player. Others prefer championship totals like yourself.

In what way is it not debatable that Lebron winning 3 as the FMVP not better than a guy winning 5 or 6 championships but only 1 or 2 as the main guy?


1 more ring and lebrons in the conversation with bird/wilt/shaq. thats about it

Then you say something like this which doesn't even back up your argument seeing as Wilt had two championships and Bird had 3, but in the scenario Bron would have more as the FMVP winner... Yet he is only in the conversation with them... You don't even stay consistent with your own set of rules.

[3peated]

rings and fmvp are the most important awards, the regular season doesn't mean anything.

[Akrazotile]

Top 1 by a country mile

[Lebron23]

Top- 3-5 player of all time.

[Magic 32]

Top- 3-5 player of all time.

Less and less each time..

[BlakFrankWhite]

if he wins 2 more rings....he's top 3 all time

[AirFederer]

Top 7-8

[ImKobe]

I'd say he'd have a definite case over Hakeem, so around 9-10 all-time.

[Keno]

2nd GOAT

this. if he wins one more mvp or ring/finals mvp combined with his career stats next season + playoffs. he's the official goat.

[Real14]

number 21.

[IncarceratedBob]

I can't think of 7 players who have had a 5 year span as good as that.
Well that's because your basketball knowledge is limited

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Top 7-8

This.

[dubeta]

Ironically he'll be around 3-6 all time

[the mesiah]

No doubt top 10, would be in that 7-9 range for me but would need to have a pillar to post dominant Finals or a definate Finals clutch time moment against Spurs no less.Don't want to see any deferment to Kyrie or Love in any of the games ,still don't see him having that in him tho.

[VengefulAngel]

Well that's because your basketball knowledge is limited

Name them.

[greatest-ever]

I'd put him 5th all time behind Mj Kareem Wilt and Tim Duncan. He'd just barely edge out Shaq and Magic.

Fwiw i think its a joke that some people don't consider Lebron as top 10 ever, with another title it won't even be a debate anymore.

[kennethgriffin]

Is lebron a female or something... why is 3 better than guys with 4,5,6 rings


Please explain this obvious double standard

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Is lebron a female or something... why is 3 better than guys with 4,5,6 rings


Please explain this obvious double standard

Robert Horry > Kobe.

[greatest-ever]

I can't think of 7 players who have had a 5 year span as good as that.
Thank you. There isn't 7 players that have, i'd say the only ones that have would be Mj, Kareem and Shaq that is probably it. Btw, if you throw in 09 & 2010 that's a 7 year span as a top 3 player basically.

[kennethgriffin]

2 less rings and lost 1 more finals...

Yeah dats betta dan kobe yo... lebron = special olympian

:lol

[JebronLames]

I already got him as GOAT

[kennethgriffin]

Robert Horry > Kobe.


Youre a moron


This thread is about how lebron would improve all time with another ring. And then when logic is thrown into the equation you discount all rings by saying superstar rings are on the same level as horrys?

Make up your f*cking mind

:lol

[greatest-ever]

Is lebron a female or something... why is 3 better than guys with 4,5,6 rings


Please explain this obvious double standard
What double standard? You can't rank players simply by ring count and there isn't a huge difference between 3, 4 & 5 especially when you aren't the best player on all of the rings. It isn't like people are putting Lebron top 5 with only 1 ring. THen you would have a point.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

2 less rings and lost 1 more finals...

Yeah dats betta dan kobe yo... lebron = special olympian

:lol

Same number of rings as a first option. :confusedshrug:

[kennethgriffin]

Modern day titles by superstars = how players are ranked


Been that way for 30 years

Ever since the merger and how the league has progressed

[kennethgriffin]

Same number of rings as a first option. :confusedshrug:


Kobe averaged 30ppg as a 2nd option in a playoffs

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Kobe averaged 30ppg as a 2nd option in a playoffs

But Shaq was the deciding factor and FMVP winner for three rings. That leaves two rings as a first option, same as LeBron.

Kobe also didn't average 30PPG through any of those playoff years. 21.1, 29.4, 26.6.

2008-2009 and 2009-2010 were impressive runs but so were LeBron's in 2011-2012 and 2012-2013.

[kennethgriffin]

But Shaq was the deciding factor and FMVP winner for three rings. That leaves two rings as a first option, same as LeBron.

Kobe also didn't average 30PPG through any of those playoff years. 21.1, 29.4, 26.6.

2008-2009 and 2009-2010 were impressive runs but so were LeBron's in 2011-2012 and 2012-2013.


Ray allen was the deciding factor in 2013

The lockout was the deciding factor in 2012


kobes 30ppg championship run as his teams #1 assist play maker/ball handler and top defensive achieved player has more prestige than a fake season or bail out ring

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Ray allen was the deciding factor in 2013

The lockout was the deciding factor in 2012


kobes 30ppg championship run as his teams #1 assist play maker/ball handler and top defensive achieved player has more prestige than a fake season or bail out ring

Not true. Ray kept them in it, LeBron took over and delivered from that point on.

Not true.

No.

I don't know why I expected a good post out of you.

[RepMe]

10th

[RepMe]

Not true. Ray kept them in it, LeBron took over and delivered from that point on.

Not true.

No.

I don't know why I expected a good post out of you.

I was just wondering why you were in a back and forth with him.

[kennethgriffin]

If we were to rank them

#1 - 2009 kobe 30/6/5
#2 - 2010 kobe 30/6/5
#3 - 2001 kobe 30/7/6
#4 - 2002 kobe 27/6/5
#5 - 2013 ray allen bail out
#6 - 2000 kobe 21/5/5
#7 - 2012 fake season

[24-Inch_Chrome]

I was just wondering why you were in a back and forth with him.

I had hoped that he was making progress. Unfortunately the delusions are still strong. :oldlol:

[AintNoSunshine]

yall listing #of mvps are kidding yourself



stephen curry = kobe bryant
allen iverson = hakeem olajuwon
derrick rose = oscar robertson
steve nash > shaquille oneal

?
And according to your system Horry >>> Kobe

[kells333]

I dont see how lebron isnt top 5 already even without this hypothetical scenerio. Hes been the best player in the league for about 7 years now. Cleveland was a contender with him he left they became worst team in league while he brought a non playoff miami team to the finals 3 years in a row. Then he left miami and they added an allstar sf and all nba pg and didnt make the playoffs withot him. Then goes back to cleveland and makes a non playoff team a contender again. All while winning mvps and fmvps in between. Thats pretty damn impressive. 100% best player any of us under 28 have ever seen.

[RepMe]

I had hoped that he was making progress. Unfortunately the delusions are still strong. :oldlol:

I doubt they are delusions. Just trolling.

[24-Inch_Chrome]

I doubt they are delusions. Just trolling.

I don't know if kenneth is smart enough to troll, even at a low level. :confusedshrug:

Either way he's a worthless poster.

[kennethgriffin]

And according to your system Horry >>> Kobe


Except rings are actually under a superstars control. While mvps are under the medias control


And again. Is horry a superstar?




I ask again.. why are letards asking "where does lebron rank with another ring" if they place rings on the level of robet horry


Any human with a brain knows its about production when winning


If a guy averages 25 or 30ppg then he obviously deserves major credit for the title.. if a guy averages 1 more point and claims a mvp trophy then good for him... but unless a guy has an absolute major advantage to his 2nd option. Then its a 2 man team...


For instance


The irony of it all is gasol will average 12 less ppg in a playoff title.. then people say he deserves more credit than kobe.. then kobe will win a title as 2nd option with 1 less point and people say it doesnt count lol


Yall shook

[ShawkFactory]

If we were to rank them

#1 - 2009 kobe 30/6/5
#2 - 2010 kobe 30/6/5
#3 - 2001 kobe 30/7/6
#4 - 2002 kobe 27/6/5
#5 - 2013 ray allen bail out
#6 - 2000 kobe 21/5/5
#7 - 2012 fake seasonWe? :lol

[VengefulAngel]

I don't know if kenneth is smart enough to troll, even at a low level. :confusedshrug:

Either way he's a worthless poster.

He completely hijacked this thread with his illogical arguments.

[kennethgriffin]

He completely hijacked this thread with his illogical arguments.


Being able to count is illogical?

[raprap]

Winning a chip in Cleveland would be huge for his legacy. Top 5 all time no doubt.

[ShawkFactory]

Being able to count is illogical?
A 4 year old can count. Doesn't make them logical :lol

[kennethgriffin]

A 4 year old can count. Doesn't make them logical :lol


Yes it does... atleast in terms of counting

[ShawkFactory]

Yes it does... atleast in terms of counting
There's no logic in counting. Ranking basketball players requires it. 4 year old "analytics" (counting) don't apply here. Sorry charlie.

[Hey Yo]

Being able to count is illogical?
Kobe has 3 second banana rings and that's being generous considering he missed practically 2 games of the 2000 Finals.

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe has 3 second banana rings and that's being generous considering he missed practically 2 games of the 2000 Finals.


30ppg is not 2nd banana

[Hey Yo]

30ppg is not 2nd banana
Which Finals did he avg 30ppg?

[kennethgriffin]

Which Finals did he avg 30ppg?


Since when is the playoffs 1 series?

And the real finals was the wcf


Kobe averaged over 30ppg vs teams like sanantonio


Who cares if the lakers coasted in the finals vs philly and jersey


And besides.. kobes 2001 and 2002 finals ppg were around the same as lebrons 2012 and 2013

[VengefulAngel]

30ppg is not 2nd banana

29.4 doesn't equal 30, I thought you could count...

[kennethgriffin]

29.4 doesn't equal 30, I thought you could count...


Still better than either of lebrons titles


29.4ppg 7rpg 6apg in a real season with no bail outs by team mates during a 15-1 run to the goat all time playoff record?


No chance :lol

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Back on topic. With another ring LeBron will cement himself in the top-10, probably at Bryant's expense on lists where they're both vying for the 10 spot. I currently have him ranked 10th but tier him with Hakeem and Bird. A 3rd ring would bring him above those two for me and leave him 7-8 range.

[ShawkFactory]

Back on topic. With another ring LeBron will cement himself in the top-10, probably at Bryant's expense on lists where they're both vying for the 10 spot. I currently have him ranked 10th but tier him with Hakeem and Bird. A 3rd ring would bring him above those two for me and leave him 7-8 range.
Agreed. With another great postseason performance and a title I think he moves firmly above Hakeem and is cemented in the top 10. Then you could make arguments with him against Kobe, Shaq, and Bird.

[Hey Yo]

Since when is the playoffs 1 series?

And the real finals was the wcf


Kobe averaged over 30ppg vs teams like sanantonio


Who cares if the lakers coasted in the finals vs philly and jersey


And besides.. kobes 2001 and 2002 finals ppg were around the same as lebrons 2012 and 2013
Except for the fact that LeBron was the clear cut best player and difference maker on his team. Just like Shaq was in the Finals which got him 3 straight FMVP's.

You can try to rewrite the rules all you want but what Kobe did in the playoffs with Shaq doesn't matter when it comes to what he did in the Finals with him. There are no playoff MVP's or rings awarded.

[Beastmode88]

Back on topic. With another ring LeBron will cement himself in the top-10, probably at Bryant's expense on lists where they're both vying for the 10 spot. I currently have him ranked 10th but tier him with Hakeem and Bird. A 3rd ring would bring him above those two for me and leave him 7-8 range.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

Bird had to win rings against magic and the lakers. Lebron got his rings against a 22 year old kevin durant and a 37 y/o tim duncan. He will still not be ahead of kobe until he wins 5 rings.

[imdaman99]

Dude will play on nothing but stacked teams from now on, and everyone wants to put him into top 5s?? :roll:

[kennethgriffin]

Except for the fact that LeBron was the clear cut best player and difference maker on his team. Just like Shaq was in the Finals which got him 3 straight FMVP's.

You can try to rewrite the rules all you want but what Kobe did in the playoffs with Shaq doesn't matter when it comes to what he did in the Finals with him. There are no playoff MVP's or rings awarded.


It is acceptable that one guy can be the better player. But shaq only outperformed kobe by a fraction



Throughout history there are teams with 2 major contributors

Magic and kareem come to mind as the main one

Magics 5 titles all count. Even if he didnt win mvp twice.


Now il admit that in 2000 kobe didnt produce enough to get an equal ring. But he did in 2001 and 2002

So i'd say kobe has 4 leader rings and 1 2nd banana

[stanlove1111]

rings and fmvp are the most important awards, the regular season doesn't mean anything.

Everytime I see someone obsesses with the FMVP award I just see a moron and simpleton.


But can explain the obsession with the FMVP award.

[Real14]

Dude will play on nothing but stacked teams from now on, and everyone wants to put him into top 5s?? :roll:
Exactly. What a phucked up era:oldlol:

[24-Inch_Chrome]

Agreed. With another great postseason performance and a title I think he moves firmly above Hakeem and is cemented in the top 10. Then you could make arguments with him against Kobe, Shaq, and Bird.

If I had to make a top-10 list it would probably look something like this:

1. Jordan
2. Kareem
3. Russell
4. Wilt
5. Duncan
6. Magic
7. Shaq
8. Bird
9. Olajuwon
10. LeBron

If LeBron won another ring I think I could move him into the 7-8 spot, probably 8th, and bump Olajuwon and Bird down one spot each. After that it gets much more difficult for me.

[Hey Yo]

Dude will play on nothing but stacked teams from now on, and everyone wants to put him into top 5s?? :roll:
This is a stacked team?

Cavs opening day starting 5 and bench

Kevin Love, PF
LeBron James,SF
Anderson Varejao, C
Kyrie Irving, PG
Dion Waiters, SG


Tristan Thompson, C
Matthew Dellavedova, SG
Shawn Marion, SG
Mike Miller, SG
James Jones, SF
Alex Kirk, C
Brendan Haywood, C
Joe Harris, SG

[J Shuttlesworth]

I'd have LeBron just ahead of Bird if he gets another ring this year

[greymatter]

I'd have LeBron just ahead of Bird if he gets another ring this year

So that would be what? 5th or 6th?

[J Shuttlesworth]

So that would be what? 5th or 6th?
For my list, that would be 7th

[kennethgriffin]

Lebrons 2.5 rings in 5.5 finals are not top 5 material

Especially since he ring chased/colluded when getting the asterisk title and ray allen fluke


As it stands.. 1.5 out of 4.5

[Meticode]

Hard to say, definetely top 10. I'm thinking by the time he ends his career he could be around a 5-ish. He has to win at least 1 more ring to even get that far, otherwise he'll never crack the top 5 if he doesn't.

[Meticode]

Lot's of all-time greats played with stack teams.

[kennethgriffin]

Lot's of all-time greats played with stack teams.



Nobodies saying you cant win with talent

But cheating to get that talent discounts the ring


Colluding / tampering


Lebron wade bosh all colluded and tampered with regulations


Then lebron did it again with wiggins/love negotiations before the 30 day window was up

[poido123]

Weak conference and stacked teams in the time he's been winning.

However, the eye test shows he's a great player who deserves a top 10 all time ranking.



I have him in front of Olajuwon and Kobe at around 8 if he wins his third title.

The guys in front of him I find it hard for him to pass, simply because they are legends who had a different set of circumstances to what Lebron has with these super teams...

[dubeta]

Kenneth already in full meltdown/damage control mode and the playoffs haven't even started :lol


Damn if lebron wins this summers going to be tough for Kobe stans










But then again LeBron is already ahead of Kobe all time so don't know why they are concerned.

[J Shuttlesworth]

Weak conference and stacked teams in the time he's been winning.

However, the eye test shows he's a great player who deserves a top 10 all time ranking.



I have him in front of Olajuwon and Kobe at around 8 if he wins his third title.

The guys in front of him I find it hard for him to pass, simply because they are legends who had a different set of circumstances to what Lebron has with these super teams...
Where do you rank Magic Johnson who had Kareem/Worthy in a weak conference?

[poido123]

Where do you rank Magic Johnson who had Kareem/Worthy in a weak conference?



Magic is at 7 for mine. Both Lebron and Magic are interchangeable, but Magic gets the edge on rings.

[Cocaine80s]

7th or 8th all time

[TheMarkMadsen]

Lebron only outscored Kyrie by 3 points per game, his 3rd option gives you 16/10 while stretching the floor and their in a historically weak conference,

no excuse not to make the finals with that amount of help

if the lakers were stacked when they had Kobe outscoring Pau by 9 points per game and the lakers 3rd option putting up 11/9 then how stacked are the Cavs?

[Showtime2001]

Only on ISH where "sidekick rings" count for everyone except Kobe.

:lebronamazed:

[ShawkFactory]

Only on ISH where "sidekick rings" count for everyone except Kobe.

:lebronamazed:
Well the situations are slightly different. Lebron is clearly the best player on the team. Kyrie having a great series wouldn't all of a sudden make Lebron a sidekick. Shaq was the best player in the game for those 3 titles.

Either way, I still don't consider Kobe a sidekick. But yea.

[greatest-ever]

And besides.. kobes 2001 and 2002 finals ppg were around the same as lebrons 2012 and 2013
I didn't know that ppg is all there is to evaluating a player. Lebron averaged 10+ boards per game in those series and had a big impact defensively.

And it's quite disingenuous to ignore that he had Shaq who got more of the defensive detention, Lebron had a banged up Wade and a Bosh who was basically a glorified role guy in those title runs.

[kennethgriffin]

I didn't know that ppg is all there is to evaluating a player. Lebron averaged 10+ boards per game in those series and had a big impact defensively.

And it's quite disingenuous to ignore that he had Shaq who got more of the defensive detention, Lebron had a banged up Wade and a Bosh who was basically a glorified role guy in those title runs.

kobe was 1st team all defense and averaged 7 rebounds

as a 6-5 shooting guard weighing 205 pounds soaking wet


and was also his teams assist leader


dont act like all kobe did was score

[kennethgriffin]

this would be my new ranking if lebron won



#1 jordan 6 for 6
#2 kareem 5.5 for 9.5 ( half prestige for 1 due to era .. )
#3 russell 5.5 for 6 ( half prestige due to era.. )
#4 magic 5 for 9
#5 kobe 5 for 7
#6 duncan 4.5 for 5.5 ( half prestige for 1 due to lockout )
#7 shaq 4 for 6
#8 bird 3 for 5
#9 lebron 2.5 for 5.5 ( half prestige for 1 due to lockout )
#10 hakeem 2 for 3
#11 wilt 1 for 2.5 ( half prestige due to era .. )

tie breaker = wcf title or ecf title

[KirbyPls]

Dude will play on nothing but stacked teams from now on, and everyone wants to put him into top 5s?? :roll:

Like the current top-5 won rings on anything besides stacked teams. Kobetards gonna tard.

[greatest-ever]

this would be my new ranking if lebron won



#1 jordan 6 for 6
#2 kareem 5.5 for 9.5 ( half prestige for 1 due to era .. )
#3 russell 5.5 for 6 ( half prestige due to era.. )
#4 magic 5 for 9
#5 kobe 5 for 7
#6 duncan 4.5 for 5.5 ( half prestige for 1 due to lockout )
#7 shaq 4 for 6
#8 bird 3 for 5
#9 lebron 2.5 for 5.5 ( half prestige for 1 due to lockout )
#10 hakeem 2 for 3
#11 wilt 1 for 2.5 ( half prestige due to era .. )

tie breaker = wcf title or ecf title
There's no such thing as a half title or half of a finals series. How can you expect anyone to take you serious when you say things like this? It makes me think you're about 12 years old.

Even if it's a lockout year the playoffs are exactly the same and you have to beat them all the same. And since when is 66/82 games 1/2 if that's the logic you wanna use? lol

[ShawkFactory]

There's no such thing as a half title or half of a finals series. How can you expect anyone to take you serious when you say things like this? It makes me think you're about 12 years old.

Even if it's a lockout year the playoffs are exactly the same and you have to beat them all the same. And since when is 66/82 games 1/2 if that's the logic you wanna use? lol
The lockout nonsense makes a little bit of sense in theory but it doesn't check out when the results finalize.

For example, maybe Kenneth thinks that the lockout is what caused the Spurs to not be in the finals in 2012. But they were easily the 1 seed and swept through the first 2 rounds of the amazing west. They lost because KD and Harden went apeshit, not because there wasn't a preseason or training camp or whatever.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

How are you imbeciles so easily baited by Kenneth? Nobody that isn't seriously retarded would "rank" players the way he does.

Let him post all the bullshit he wants; just stop feeding the clown. :oldlol:

[ralph_i_el]

Kenny g:facepalm

[TylerOO]

He'd be on everyone's Mount Rushmore....of life.

[Real14]

He'd be on everyone's Mount Rushmore....of life.
:roll:

[JohnFreeman]

5-7

[RoundMoundOfReb]

top 5