How do White Americans go to bed at night knowing the U.S. was built on slave labor

[PleezeBelieve]

.... and yet y'all care about 9/11, The Holocaust, dogs, rioting, Taliban, etc more than Black Americans.

Explain...

[L.Kizzle]

#neverforget
#PearlHarbor
#VietnamWar
#Titanic
#Reaganomics
#Watergate
#Elvis

[CavaliersFTW]

I lay down, I close my eyes, I fall asleep.

Slavery is pretty much never on my mind seeing as how it doesn't exist anymore. Remind me why I should think about a problem that was solved 200 years ago again?

[knickballer]

Arabs had a thriving slave trade in Africa for over 10 centuries and eventually killed them off but yet no one mentions that fact. :confusedshrug:

[PleezeBelieve]

#neverforget
#PearlHarbor
#VietnamWar
#Titanic
#Reaganomics
#Watergate
#Elvis
:applause:

You can add about 1000 more hashtags descriptions before slavery

[NumberSix]

i dont want their sympathy i just want them to be scared of us...They are so im happy :lol.I really get off on intimidating white people :lol.Nothing better than picking on the weak
Lol. There's only about a 100% chance that you're either white or Asian. :roll:

[PleezeBelieve]

I lay down, I close my eyes, I fall asleep.

Slavery is pretty much never on my mind seeing as how it doesn't exist anymore. Remind me why I should think about a problem that was solved 200 years ago again?
Pure white arrogance right here.

So pure. So carefree. So ..... typical

[CavaliersFTW]

Pure white arrogance right here.

So pure. So carefree. So ..... typical
Yep.

[Hit_Em]

Lol. There's only about a 100% chance that you're either white or Asian. :roll:
:djparty

[PleezeBelieve]

True Americans were hung from trees and permanently separated from loved ones based on religious, racial, economic principles.

Where's the damn holiday at least?

[DonDadda59]

I lay down, I close my eyes, I fall asleep.

Slavery is pretty much never on my mind seeing as how it doesn't exist anymore. Remind me why I should think about a problem that was solved 200 years ago again?

Not in the U.S. but slavery still exists in parts of the World.


Arabs had a thriving slave trade in Africa for over 10 centuries and eventually killed them off but yet no one mentions that fact.

Pretty much every 'race' and 'nationality' was at one point or another subjected to slavery throughout History. Rome conquered most of Western Europe and had a thriving slave trade/culture built on the backs of people they defeated in wars. It's not a strictly American thing.

[TheMarkMadsen]

True Americans were hung from trees and permanently separated from loved ones based on religious, racial, economic principles.

Where's the damn holiday at least?


did you celebrate holocaust day this year or something?

[outbreak]

Not in the U.S. but slavery still exists in parts of the World.



Pretty much every 'race' and 'nationality' was at one point or another subjected to slavery throughout History. Rome conquered most of Western Europe and had a thriving slave trade/culture built on the backs of people they defeated in wars. It's not a strictly American thing.

Africa had a larger slave trade than the U.S while the U.S had slavery.

There's more slaves in the world right now then there was at any other point in history.

[DonDadda59]

Africa had a larger slave trade than the U.S while the U.S had slavery.

It's possible. I don't have any figures off hand that would support or dispute this claim. Do you? :confusedshrug:


There's more slaves in the world right now then there was at any other point in history.

See the above.

[NumberSix]

Only other thing I can think of being forgettable is the genocide of Native Americans.

Yeah, slavery and Native Americans are the top 2 subjects America doesn't want to talk about.
Genocide? Committed by who? Germs? :confusedshrug:

[GimmeThat]

Similar to how addidas made shoes that hurts players knees
While Nike doesnt.

This. Is a basketball forum after all, right?

[MavsSuperFan]

Biologically humans, including white people need to sleep to be able to survive.

Non-PC answer: Although slavery is hugely immoral, african americans probably live a higher standard of living than african people do on average. I cant think of a single nation in africa with a per capita GDP that is even close to america. Further America is very politically stable in comparison to most african nations. Eg. not ruled by dictators, no genocide (eg. Tutsi vs Hutu), much less islamic extremist violence, much less civil wars.

There are millions of middle class and rich african americans in america.
Many people from africa give up their lives in africa to choose to come to america, because they see more opportunity here.

Also Obama is president... so we even.

[Akrazotile]

Slaves built Philadelphia and New York and DC?

Pittsburgh, Buffalo, Chicago, Los Angeles, San Fransisco???


https://rumorsontheinternets.files.wordpress.com/2011/10/wee-bey-oh-shit.gif

[PleezeBelieve]

Africa had a larger slave trade than the U.S while the U.S had slavery.

There's more slaves in the world right now then there was at any other point in history.
Typical go to response by White.America. What does Africa have to do with this country? :roll:

Only time whites care about blacks in this country is when they're trying to excuse white-on-black atrocities.

Its as hilarious as it is pathetic.

[NumberSix]

Typical go to response by White.America. What does Africa have to do with this country? :roll:

Only time whites care about blacks in this country is when they're trying to excuse white-on-black atrocities.

Its as hilarious as it is pathetic.
In the entire history of America, what would you guess has a bigger number?


A) Blacks killed by whites
B) Whites killed by black

:confusedshrug:

[Akrazotile]

In the entire history of America, what would you guess has a bigger number?


A) Blacks killed by whites
B) Whites killed by black

:confusedshrug:


It has to be A.

Not in the last 30 years of course, but overall?

I dont think theres any question it's A.

[outbreak]

Typical go to response by White.America. What does Africa have to do with this country? :roll:

Only time whites care about blacks in this country is when they're trying to excuse white-on-black atrocities.

Its as hilarious as it is pathetic.

It's not excusing it, it's just clearing the facts when someone else posted slavery barely exists now and puts it in to context when you talk about the time period. I just think it's ignorant when people kick up a big fuss about african americans being kept as slave and then blatantly ignore and insult all the millions of people currently in slavery. Both are terrible and bother are inexcusable.

[MavsSuperFan]

I



See the above.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/10/17/this-map-shows-where-the-worlds-30-million-slaves-live-there-are-60000-in-the-u-s/

[QUOTE]We think of slavery as a practice of the past, an image from Roman colonies or 18th-century American plantations, but the practice of enslaving human beings as property still exists. There are 29.8 million people living as slaves right now, according to a comprehensive new report issued by the Australia-based Walk Free Foundation.

This is not some softened, by-modern-standards definition of slavery. These 30 million people are living as forced laborers, forced prostitutes, child soldiers, child brides in forced marriages and, in all ways that matter, as pieces of property, chattel in the servitude of absolute ownership. Walk Free investigated 162 countries and found slaves in every single one. But the practice is far worse in some countries than others.

The country where you are most likely to be enslaved is Mauritania. Although this vast West African nation has tried three times to outlaw slavery within its borders, it remains so common that it is nearly normal. The report estimates that four percent of Mauritania is enslaved

[MavsSuperFan]

In the entire history of America, what would you guess has a bigger number?


A) Blacks killed by whites
B) Whites killed by black

:confusedshrug:
1000% sure white people have killed more black people than the reverse.

During Jim Crow, white people lynched black people at community picnics.

[HitandRun Reggie]

The majority of white Americans aren't of British descent yet the average African American has 23% European DNA. Those mostly British-descent slave owners did a lot of fvckin' and rapin', but they only consisted of 2-4% of the total population. Chances are that if you're African American, you more likely have a great great grandaddy who was a white slave owner than your average "white" American.

It's like Mexicans blaming all whites for the atrocities of the Aztec natives, when they are the ones with all the Conquistador blood

[NumberSix]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/10/17/this-map-shows-where-the-worlds-30-million-slaves-live-there-are-60000-in-the-u-s/



To be fair though the human population has exploded in recent decades, so though in aggregate there are more slaves than ever, per capita there are less.
People have a warped view of slavery. I've literally heard people who think numbers as ridiculous as 100 million African slaves were shipped from Africa to America.

The actual number. 400,000. Still a lot, but not the crazy numbers that people imagine.

[MavsSuperFan]

The majority of white Americans aren't of British descent yet the average African American has 23% European DNA, those slave owners did a lot of fvckin, but they only consisted of 2-4% of the total population. Chances are that if you're African American, you more likely have a great great grandaddy who was a white slave owner than your average "white" American.
This is somewhat irrelevant as White people have benefited from the residual impact of slavery while black people have certainly suffered.

a second non-PC point: Slavery hindered american progress.

Slavery always hinders technological progress and in the long term hurts nations.

The arab world is a back water
South america and the Caribbean are relatively unadvanced
the Southern slave states of the US are the least advanced areas of the US.
The higher levels of industrialization in the north are why the South had no chance in the civil war.

Cheap labor removes the incentive for technological progress.
Eg. slaves used to harvest corps.
later when labor costs increased effort was expended to invent the combine tractor, and other farm equipment to counter the higher labor costs
Later treads of farm equipment inspired the development of the tank.
Also industry promotes further industrialization, which further promotes GDP growth/productive potential.

[DonDadda59]

In the entire history of America, what would you guess has a bigger number?


A) Blacks killed by whites
B) Whites killed by black

:confusedshrug:

I assume it would be A by a large margin :confusedshrug:


To be fair though the human population has exploded in recent decades, so though in aggregate there are more slaves than ever, per capita there are less.

Thanks for the link :cheers:

And I figured population density would be a factor. Either way, slavery is still very much an ongoing practice all over the World.

[MavsSuperFan]

People have a warped view of slavery. I've literally heard people who think numbers as ridiculous as 100 million African slaves were shipped from Africa to America.

The actual number. 400,000. Still a lot, but not the crazy numbers that people imagine.
I know that. What did i post that lead you to believe i didnt know that?
http://www.theroot.com/articles/history/2012/10/how_many_slaves_came_to_america_fact_vs_fiction.ht ml

The most comprehensive analysis of shipping records over the course of the slave trade is the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade Database, edited by professors David Eltis and David Richardson. (While the editors are careful to say that all of their figures are estimates, I believe that they are the best estimates that we have, the proverbial "gold standard" in the field of the study of the slave trade.) Between 1525 and 1866, in the entire history of the slave trade to the New World, according to the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade Database, 12.5 million Africans were shipped to the New World. 10.7 million survived the dreaded Middle Passage, disembarking in North America, the Caribbean and South America.

And how many of these 10.7 million Africans were shipped directly to North America? Only about 388,000. That's right: a tiny percentage.

In fact, the overwhelming percentage of the African slaves were shipped directly to the Caribbean and South America; Brazil received 4.86 million Africans alone! Some scholars estimate that another 60,000 to 70,000 Africans ended up in the United States after touching down in the Caribbean first, so that would bring the total to approximately 450,000 Africans who arrived in the United States over the course of the slave trade.


most slaves that were apart of Atlantic slave trade were sent to the Caribbean and south america. Because of the harsh conditions of sugar plantations the death rates were much higher and new slaves needed to replenish the slaves that died because of the brutal conditions.

IIRC sugar cane after its cut rots within 48 hours or something, so the pressure to convert it to sugar is much more intense.

[NumberSix]

Edit: uhhhhh.... This thread is such a downer. Too much race topics lately. I have a pretty high threshold for being able to discuss these heavy topics in an emotionless, intellectual way, but there's only such much talking about numbers of murdered people, slavery and violence until you can't help being affected by the immense horror of it all. I'm taking a break from these topics.

[Patrick Chewing]

How do Black Americans go to bed at night knowing that if they weren't brought to the U.S., they'd be doing this.....


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/08/24/article-1208479-06277461000005DC-34_634x286.jpg

[MavsSuperFan]

.... and yet y'all care about 9/11, The Holocaust, dogs, rioting, Taliban, etc more than Black Americans.

Explain...
TBH america doesn't address slavery enough.

To answer your question, its primarily because slavery ended after the civil war. And perhaps unfairly many people dont appreciate the lingering effects of slavery as well as the fact that slavery wasnt replaced with equality.


9/11, rioting, Taliban
these are happening to current day america and the fact they are currently occurring is what drives the attention


The Holocaust
Is the holocaust more taboo than slavery?


dogs,
I honestly dont think most white people care about unrelated dogs more than unrelated black people. I think most white people if they could (without risk to themselves) save a black child or a puppy, would chose to save a black child.

[MavsSuperFan]

Edit: uhhhhh.... This thread is such a downer. Too much race topics lately. I have a pretty high threshold for being able to discuss these heavy topics in an emotionless, intellectual way, but there's only such much talking about numbers of murdered people, slavery and violence until you can't help being affected by the immense horror of it all. I'm taking a break from these topics. I have some doubt about how accurately america used to tract the deaths of black people.

What about the deaths during slavery?

But i get your point today black people kill white people at a higher rate than the reverse. I am still 100% sure that over the course of american history white people have killed more black people than the reverse

edit: you edited your post, I respect your decision

[MavsSuperFan]

Genocide? Committed by who? Germs? :confusedshrug:
The american government took steps to purposefully subjugate the native population.

The Indian Wars (many individual massacres)
Forcing the natives onto reservations (very comparable to concentration camps)
Purposefully destroying orchids, purposefully trying to exterminate the american bison, basically to remove ability of native people to feed themselves.

It wasnt an accident that white people supplanted the native population. It was purposeful. Also white people spread disease among the natives purposefully. It is very fair to describe what the american government did to native american's as ethnic cleansing or genocide.

[Akrazotile]

The american government took steps to purposefully subjugate the native population.

The Indian Wars (many individual massacres)
Forcing the natives onto reservations (very comparable to concentration camps)
Purposefully destroying orchids, purposefully trying to exterminate the american bison, basically to remove ability of native people to feed themselves.

It wasnt an accident that white people supplanted the native population. It was purposeful. Also white people spread disease among the natives purposefully. It is very fair to describe what the american government did to native american's as ethnic cleansing or genocide.


Thats true but this is no different than what separate tribes were already doing to each other throughout the world, in america, africa, asia, australia.

The was no moral difference whatsoever between white imperialism and what was already going on in the places whites showed up . The ONLY difference was the technological superiority europeans brought with them, and thus their dominance AND efficiency in the conquest game.

[warriorfan]

remember when soulja boy gave slavemasters a shout out? :lol

[JohnnySic]

The vast majority of white Americans have no ancestors with a connection to slavery.

[The Iron Sheik]

It has to be A.

Not in the last 30 years of course, but overall?

I dont think theres any question it's A.

it should be "b" but it isn't. black people should be the ones flying planes into buildings but they don't. yet they still get treated like crap.

i'm just trying to figure out what black people did that warranted the way they've been treated in america. historically speaking.

[Godzuki]

every country in the world was built on slave labor. its been norm for most of humanity's existence.

most people these days are past it and realize those were much different times than today.

[magictricked]

I sleep on my side

[jimmybball]

Pretty easy to sleep on beds made by other minorities.

[Dresta]

Why do people like Mavs have massive guilt-complexes over things that have nothing to do with him, and which were normal, worldwide practices, for thousands of years? There is nothing special, nor particularly black about slavery - it affected many peoples in many places, and was only finally eradicated by European peoples and European ideas. Slavery would still persist if not for 'the West' - so people really need to quit whining about it like children, or feeling guilty about it like a masochist with zero self-respect.

[Jailblazers7]

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/fb/b7/59/fbb759afdea0210d33bce257872729b6.jpg

[imdaman99]

#NotAllWhiteAmericans

[Budadiiii]

I sleep like a ****ing baby.

[DonDadda59]

Thats true but this is no different than what separate tribes were already doing to each other throughout the world, in america, africa, asia, australia.

The was no moral difference whatsoever between white imperialism and what was already going on in the places whites showed up . The ONLY difference was the technological superiority europeans brought with them, and thus their dominance AND efficiency in the conquest game.

White man = conquest game LeBron James (outside the finals).

[KNOW1EDGE]

Step 1: Lay head on pillow.
Step 2: Pull blankets over ones self
Step 3: Close eyes
Step 4: (this is the tricky part) Fall asleep

[bluechox2]

those bitches who done the slave trade are sleeping in their graves

[Derka]

Without much difficulty, really.

[Hittin_Shots]

I sleep like a ****ing baby.

Waking up crying multiple times a night shitting yourself and begging for a titty?

[Nick Young]

Many countries have economies that are still reliant on slave labor.

I'm a white American and I sleep just fine. Am I supposed to feel guilt because of what white people I'm not related to did to black people I'm not related to a hundred years ago?:confusedshrug:

1,200,000 mostly white Americans died fighting in a war that ended up with slavery being made illegal. Surely that should count as some form of redemption for you, OP?

[Hittin_Shots]

Many countries have economies that are still reliant on slave labor.

I'm a white American and I sleep just fine. Am I supposed to feel guilt because of what white people I'm not related to did to black people I'm not related to a hundred years ago?:confusedshrug:

1,200,000 mostly white Americans died fighting in a war that ended up with slavery being made illegal. Surely that should count as some form of redemption for you, OP?

People like OP aren't after any redemption, redemption to them would take away their victim card.

[Nick Young]

I lay down, I close my eyes, I fall asleep.

Slavery is pretty much never on my mind seeing as how it doesn't exist anymore. Remind me why I should think about a problem that was solved 200 years ago again?
Arabs in UAE and Quatar and Kuwait and several other gulf countries are still enslaving millions of Asians and Africans and no one cares.

American slave trade that ended 160 years ago is worse than slavery that is still going on today on a more massive scale than ever before in the eyes of these lib-tards.

Do you know who first introduced the idea of slavery to white Europeans? Africans. Do you know who willingly traded their own slaves to Europeans and Americans? Africans.

Surely that means Africans are just as complicit in the European and American slave trade as Americans and Europeans are.

If Africans stopped trading their own people to the Europeans and Americans, none of this shit would have been able to happen.

Should all West Africans feel guilty because their ancestors started and perpetuated the American and European slave trade?


Should all arabs feel guilty because Arabs today are the biggest practitioners of slavery in the world?

OP is retarded.

[Eric Cartman]

OP might be unto something here:

Whites should be enslaved and treated like the Negro was treatred for an equal amount of time, then we call it even.

Quid pro quo.

[ace23]

Lol @ thinking white people give a shit about black struggle. Them crackas don't give a ****. :roll:

[Nick Young]

Lol @ thinking white people give a shit about black struggle. Them crackas don't give a ****. :roll:
Should all black people feel guilty because their ancestors began the European slave trade and perpetuated it by trading their own people in exchange for gold and guns?:confusedshrug:

Surely Africans are equally as responsible as Americans and Europeans for the slave trade. They could have stopped trading slaves at any time, but didn't. They also re-introduced the idea of slavery back to Europeans, after hundreds of years of slavery being outlawed on the continent due to the influence of Christianity.

Black people are just as responsible as white people for slavery, if not moreso. Deal with it.

Arabs, Asians and Africans today are the biggest practitioners of slavery. There are more slaves in the world right now than any point in history.

But white people are the most responsible? XD

[bluechox2]

arabs take your passport away and wont give it back untill they think you've done enough work or have died

[L.Kizzle]

Lol @ thinking white people give a shit about black struggle. Them crackas don't give a ****. :roll:
Right on nigha.

[LBJMVP]

Many countries have economies that are still reliant on slave labor.

I'm a white American and I sleep just fine. Am I supposed to feel guilt because of what white people I'm not related to did to black people I'm not related to a hundred years ago?:confusedshrug:

1,200,000 mostly white Americans died fighting in a war that ended up with slavery being made illegal. Surely that should count as some form of redemption for you, OP?

you know they don't care about that truth.....
if i was black i would be embarrassed how my culture acts everytime an officer kill one of them as well. thought it was funny that two of officers charged in baltimore were black :roll:

[gigantes]

How do White Americans go to bed at night knowing the U.S. was built on slave labor
it might be a lot harder for white americans to sleep if black americans weren't reminding white americans of it so often and in so many large and small ways.

it's certainly horrible what happened, and the price is still being paid on both sides, but maybe the worst part of it is that in this day and age the situation is sort of permanently toxic to black america.

while black europeans get after career, family and so forth pretty much at the same level as other euros, most black americans have to get through a lot of strife from their own peeps over achieving too much, blending in too easily and failing to hold a certain chip on their shoulders.

not to say that racism and misunderstandings will ever go away... not to say that white southerners shouldn't feel ashamed and embarrassed about the deeds of their peoples... but black american culture took some unfortunate turns and doesn't do itself a lot of favors IMO.

[Dbrog]

True Americans were hung from trees and permanently separated from loved ones based on religious, racial, economic principles.

Where's the damn holiday at least?

Is MLK day and black history month not enough for you? What about all the government help programs that are specifically set up for blacks? Or the scholarships that only blacks can apply for? GTFO man...way more marginalized groups than blacks these days.

Edit: on topic, all nations were built on slavery/indentured servitude/etc

[Nick Young]

it might be a lot harder for white americans to sleep if black americans weren't reminding white americans of it so often and in so many large and small ways.

it's certainly horrible what happened, and the price is still being paid on both sides, but maybe the worst part of it is that in this day and age the situation is sort of permanently toxic to black america.

while black europeans get after career, family and so forth pretty much at the same level as other euros, most black americans have to get through a lot of strife from their own peeps over achieving too much, blending in too easily and failing to hold a certain chip on their shoulders.

not to say that racism and misunderstandings will ever go away... not to say that white southerners shouldn't feel ashamed and embarrassed about the deeds of their peoples... but black american culture took some unfortunate turns and doesn't do itself a lot of favors IMO.
If this is the case, then black americans should also feel ashamed for the deeds of their peoples back in Africa-aka trading slaves to Americans and Europeans in exchange for goods.

[Graviton]

I assume the same way everyone else does. Slavery wasn't anything new, black people weren't special. Throughout history, in most wars the losing nation had its people enslaved. That's how empires were built. Italians should probably be ashamed too considering how much Rome benefited from slavery. :lol

[gigantes]

If this is the case, then black americans should also feel ashamed for the deeds of their peoples back in Africa-aka trading slaves to Americans and Europeans in exchange for goods.
i'm sure there are bigger f-cking idiots on ISH, but i'm challenged to think who they may be at this time.

[Nick Young]

i'm sure there are bigger f-cking idiots on ISH, but i'm challenged to think who they may be at this time.
Funny you resort to character assassination and petty attacks because you can't argue what I said.

Did Africans not re-introduce the idea of human slavery back to Europeans?

Did Africans trade their own slaves to white Europeans and Americans in exchange for money and goods?

The answer to both questions is yes. Slavery was outlawed in Europe for a long time due to the influence of Christianity.

The slave trade would not have gotten as big as it did without Africans trading THEIR OWN PEOPLE to Europeans and Americans in exchange for money and goods.

Africans who traded slaves to Europeans are equally complicit in the slave trade as the Europeans are.


Or in your mind, are Africans just idiots with no agency of their own who don't have to take any responsibility for their actions?


If you truly believe all white southerners should feel guilt due to the slave trade, why shouldn't black Americans? Their own ancestors STARTED the atlantic slave trade and perpetuated it by shipping out their own people by the ship load in exchange for gold and guns. Surely both groups of people should feel equally guilty here, as both groups are equally responsible-going by your logic.

[9erempiree]

Interesting take on it and a fact that is ignored by so many.

If I was black I would be more ashamed of my own people contributing to slavery than slavery itself. Before people jump on me, I am against slavery.

Can't blame the crackhead, got to lay some blame on the crack dealer.:biggums:

[Nick Young]

Yep. Europeans would not have thought up the slave trade on their own. They were very religious at the time and slavery was banned in Europe for hundreds of years at that point.

It was Africans who offered human laborers in exchange for the Europeans goods and Africans who continued to trade their own people across the ocean with no second thoughts to what might happen to them, in exchange for money and trade goods.

Africans are just as responsible for the Atlantic slave trade as Europeans and Americans are.

Africans were the suppliers and wholesalers, white Europeans and Americans were the dealers.

Dealers can't sell shit without a supplier supplying them with product.

In this case, the product was humans. Disgusting.

Who is more responsible? That is a chicken or the egg question IMO. I personally see both groups of people as equally responsible.

People like gigantes who can't think outside the box don't like hearing the truth. They can't handle any ideas that go against their group-think narrative. So they do the only thing they can do-lash out in anger so they can attack the messenger without having to think about the message.

[NumberSix]

Why do we always forget that free blacks also owned slaves? The first slave owner in American history was black. Until then, blacks, whites and whoever were used as indentured servants. The man that argued in court for owning blacks as permanent slaves...... was black.


https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ncsNT57R9cc/VPzVJJvT_dI/AAAAAAAAjLQ/v5ReAotpVzk/w640-h641/2014%2B-%2B1

[Nick Young]

The Atlantic slave trade with Europeans was started by black Africans.

The first slave owner in America was a black man.

Black people are just as responsible as white people for the European and American slave trade. It would not have been able to happen without Africans providing a constant supply of their own people as slaves in exchange for European and American goods.



Black people played an equal role, by creating the idea of a slave trade in the first place, fighting to sustain it, and acting as wholesalers by shipping large amounts of slaves to Europe and America for low prices.

Do you think all black people should still feel guilty, gigantes and OP, because of the actions of black people hundreds of years ago?

No one alive today should feel guilty for slavery, except for assholes who are still practicing slavery.

[gigantes]

Funny you resort to character assassination and petty attacks because you can't argue what I said...
give me a f-cking break. your entire approach is to completely ignore what another person says, insert a strawman in their place, defeat said strawman slowly and noisily, and then reach around and pat yourself on the back.

there are plenty of people i like on ISH, and they tend to be average folks expressing honest emotion and thoughts like the OP, and people who are way more educated than me across a variety of subjects.

people like you who've pieced together a couple facts here and there and then use that wealth of information to blow opinions out your ass are pretty much the bottom of the barrel, even on a place like ISH.

don't wait up, btw.

[Dresta]

i'm sure there are bigger f-cking idiots on ISH, but i'm challenged to think who they may be at this time.
Except he's right and your assertion that American southerners be singled out for being 'ashamed' is absurd. It doesn't take a genius to understand why southerners didn't want to get rid of slavery (their economy dependant on it, fearful of a large and free former slaves - i.e. fearing another Haiti), and why northerners would have acted in pretty much the exact same way had the two switched places. In order to found the United States, a compromise was needed over the issue of slavery, and all the founders signed off on it; abolitionism was detested in the North as in the South, as it was perceived to be a threat to the Union, a single idea far more important than moral scruples over the matter of slavery. Nor was it all peaches and cream for blacks in the North, who may have been free, but in many ways, had tougher lives than many of their slave counterparts in the South.

Not to mention that West Africa was highly muslim, and that many of those taken into slavery would have had slaves themselves - so, fair game in the eyes of the liberal-left even. There is nothing for anyone to feel guilty about, guilt being a negative and self-destructive emotion, and a rather Christian one too.

You either take the good with the bad and get over the past, or you incessantly dwell on the past, fuming over guilt and past injustices, and end up staying there, never moving forwards. I look at American race relations and that's what i see: a bunch of people who are never going to get anywhere because they can't get over these petty issues of guilt and reparations, a new 'White Man's Burden' has been born - one that is about guilt and 'helping' the black man, but which is no less racist and patronising than the burden favoured by Kipling and Woodrow Wilson (see the poem).

[Nick Young]

give me a f-cking break. your entire approach is to completely ignore what another person says, insert a strawman in their place, defeat said strawman slowly and noisily, and then reach around and pat yourself on the back.

there are plenty of people i like on ISH, and they tend to be average folks expressing honest emotion and thoughts like the OP, and people who are way more educated than me across a variety of subjects.

people like you who've pieced together a couple facts here and there and then use that wealth of information to blow opinions out your ass are pretty much the bottom of the barrel, even on a place like ISH.

don't wait up, btw.
Why are you unable to answer my points, and instead resorting to petty insults and attempts at character assassination?:confusedshrug:

Can you attempt to argue the point I made that Africans were the ones who introduced the idea of slavery to European explorers and merchants, and offered human slaves in exchange for goods?

Can you attempt to argue the point that black people were trading other black people to Europeans and Americans over the course of the entire slave trade?

Please stop patronizing black Africans and removing all responsibility from their shoulders. I find that idea of yours incredibly racist.
Your argument is basically "Black people were ignorant and don't know any better, so they should be excused for all participation and responsibility in the slave trade, and for starting it up in the first place."

BONUS QUESTION: How long does the guilt extend for?

Should all Italians feel guilt, for what their ancestors the Romans did to various ethnic groups all over the world? Should all Mongolians feel guilt because of what their ancestors did to Asia, China and Eastern Europe? Should all Iranians feel guilt for what their Persian ancestors did to the Jews and several other ethnicities and religious groups? Should all Greeks and Macedonians grow up feeling guilt for what Alexander the great did to various cities and ethnic groups? Should all Muslims feel guilt because of what their prophet Mohammad did at the Siege of Medina? Should all Germans feel guilt from what their ancestors did to the Jews? Should all polynesians feel guilt because their ancestors practiced cannibalism? Should all Japanese people feel guilt for what their ancestors and relatives did to the Chinese and Koreans? Should all Chinese feel guilt for what their ancestors and relatives did to the Tibetans? Should all Spanish people feel guilt for what their ancestors did to the native south Americans? Should all Mexicans feel guilt for what their ancestors the Aztecs did to all of those human sacrifices?

What is the time frame for feeling guilt? Are any lines drawn? Who draws the lines?