Clutch Stats: Kobe vs. Lebron (2006-2012)

[3ball]

.
(shots to tie or take lead in final minute of 4Q or OT)


......Name..........Made......Attempts... Percentage

1. Dirk Nowitzki..... 43.............94............. 45.7
2. Rudy Gay...........42.............97............. 43.3
3. LeBron James..... 61............143............ 42.7
4. Kobe Bryant........80............193............ 41.5

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1218071-lebron-james-ending-the-debate-on-lebrons-clutch-ability


Both players have elite clutch shooting percentages (top 5 itl) - so it's definitely better for them to take the shot than any teammate they could have..

But Kobe takes the shot far more often, while Lebron defers to teammates with lower clutch percentages.. Statistically, Kobe's higher volume approach more value to his team specifically IN THE CLUTCH.

In just the last minute of the 4th and the rare overtime, Kobe took a whopping 50 more clutch shots over a 6 year period from 2006-2012, at basically the same percentage as Lebron.

[ISHGoat]

Why only 2006-2012 mfer?

[Hit_Em]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSe80qSgXVA

13 years later...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5uP3bylWFs

[SugarHill]

"defers"

not "finding the open man"

[jlip]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2BlOTeoZVE

[Straight_Ballin]

I'll take the player that has proven he can shit on the other player more often than not based on their 1v1 matchups.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JABKg2azkp0

[lilteapot]

OP is OBSESSED with Lebron. I'm not just saying this to get under his skin, it is actually true. He will take any opportunity he sees, hell he will MAKE an opportunity to discredit Lebron at any time. It's really quite pathetic, just like his empty life.

[Lebron23]

I'll take the player that has proven he can shit on the other player more often than not based on their 1v1 matchups.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JABKg2azkp0


Same guy who dominated Kobe in their head to head match up.

[Straight_Ballin]

OP is OBSESSED with Lebron. I'm not just saying this to get under his skin, it is actually true. He will take any opportunity he sees, hell he will MAKE an opportunity to discredit Lebron at any time. It's really quite pathetic, just like his empty life.

If LeBron didn't have so many holes in his game and couldn't be so easily exposed, it wouldn't be so easy for people to exploit him.

When I watched the superstar of my childhood, Jordan, all I saw was a guy shitting on anyone and anything that tried to stop him. Anyone that tried to say anything about him just got made fun of, was told "ya, ya, ya.... 6/6 so please STFU", and the like.

If the media and fans would have just treated LeBron like a normal basketball player he would have been fine, but everyone has to try and blow him up like he's Jordan and therefore he got exposed for what he is. Dude is a 2/5'r but has done some pretty impressive things in his career but has also straight up failed in certain situations. It's his fans and media that just need to stop. Stop trying to prop the guy up like he's Duncan or someone.

[lilteapot]

If LeBron didn't have so many holes in his game and couldn't be so easily exposed, it wouldn't be so easy for people to exploit him.

When I watched the superstar of my childhood, Jordan, all I saw was a guy shitting on anyone and anything that tried to stop him. Anyone that tried to say anything about him just got made fun of, was told "ya, ya, ya.... 6/6 so please STFU", and the like.

If the media and fans would have just treated LeBron like a normal basketball player he would have been fine, but everyone has to try and blow him up like he's Jordan and therefore he got exposed for what he is. Dude is a 2/5'r but has done some pretty impressive things in his career but has also straight up failed in certain situations. It's his fans and media that just need to stop. Stop trying to prop the guy up like he's Duncan or someone.

Name the holes in his game for me please.

He's an all time great player, and easily top 10, at worst top 15. All great players fail at some situations. If you're going to compare anyone's career to Michael Jordan's career, then you 1. Can never enjoy that basketball player because they will always fail and 2. You are watching basketball the wrong way.

Lebron has missed game winners, so what? Basketball is a game of makes and misses. Kobe doesn't make every clutch shot, neither did Michael, neither did Lebron. You just choose to shine light on Lebron's misses more than anyone elses because you refuse to enjoy a great basketball player.

[lilteapot]

If LeBron didn't have so many holes in his game and couldn't be so easily exposed, it wouldn't be so easy for people to exploit him.

When I watched the superstar of my childhood, Jordan, all I saw was a guy shitting on anyone and anything that tried to stop him. Anyone that tried to say anything about him just got made fun of, was told "ya, ya, ya.... 6/6 so please STFU", and the like.

If the media and fans would have just treated LeBron like a normal basketball player he would have been fine, but everyone has to try and blow him up like he's Jordan and therefore he got exposed for what he is. Dude is a 2/5'r but has done some pretty impressive things in his career but has also straight up failed in certain situations. It's his fans and media that just need to stop. Stop trying to prop the guy up like he's Duncan or someone.

Fact is, you immature basketball "fans" always try to bring down anyone who experiences success.

Lebron proves himself time and time again, and you try to bring him down.

Curry wins MVP and right away people say he doesn't deserve it and he's soft, he's a "bad 1v1 player", any chance to try and discredit him because you people have a hive mind and you want to try and fit in by trying to discredit anyone who is successful.

Grow up.

[sportjames23]

If LeBron didn't have so many holes in his game and couldn't be so easily exposed, it wouldn't be so easy for people to exploit him.

When I watched the superstar of my childhood, Jordan, all I saw was a guy shitting on anyone and anything that tried to stop him. Anyone that tried to say anything about him just got made fun of, was told "ya, ya, ya.... 6/6 so please STFU", and the like.

If the media and fans would have just treated LeBron like a normal basketball player he would have been fine, but everyone has to try and blow him up like he's Jordan and therefore he got exposed for what he is. Dude is a 2/5'r but has done some pretty impressive things in his career but has also straight up failed in certain situations. It's his fans and media that just need to stop. Stop trying to prop the guy up like he's Duncan or someone.


This. All this. :cheers:

[sportjames23]

Name the holes in his game for me please.

He's an all time great player, and easily top 10, at worst top 15. All great players fail at some situations. If you're going to compare anyone's career to Michael Jordan's career, then you 1. Can never enjoy that basketball player because they will always fail and 2. You are watching basketball the wrong way.

Lebron has missed game winners, so what? Basketball is a game of makes and misses. Kobe doesn't make every clutch shot, neither did Michael, neither did Lebron. You just choose to shine light on Lebron's misses more than anyone elses because you refuse to enjoy a great basketball player.


1. No post game
2. Suspect midrange jumper
3. Turnover prone
4. No go to move
5. Relies too much on physical skill, which will bite him in the ass when it's gone
6. No leadership
7. Beta mentality


Good enough for you, champ?

[lilteapot]

1. No post game
2. Suspect midrange jumper
3. Turnover prone
4. No go to move
5. Relies too much on physical skill, which will bite him in the ass when it's gone
6. No leadership
7. Beta mentality


Good enough for you, champ?

1. Lebron lead the league in scoring percentage on post ups. If you watch basketball Lebron actually doesn't go to the post enough considering how effective he is down there.
2. Lebron's midrange field goal percentage is higher than Kobe's
3. This is true, but so is every great point guard not named Chris Paul. Magic Johnson, anyone?
4. Why do you think this is a "hole" in his game? Lebron can score in a myriad of ways.
5. Every basketball player relies on "physical skill". Kobe and Michael were great post players, and you need physical skill to be one. They still had quickness and speed, they still had their same defensive instincts at the tail end of their careers. And Lebron isn't going to get significantly weaker, Karl Malone was still just as strong when he retired.
6. Lol at this. He lead his team to 5 finals appearances, he's lead his team deep into the playoffs ever since 2007, he's lead a team full of playoff inexperienced stars to the playoffs. Of course since some little kid on insidehoops thinks he doesn't have any leadership, I guess he doesn't?
7. He just hit a game winner and has hit more buzzer beating playoff game winners than anyone in the past 15 years. I guess that's a beta mentality. I even hate using that term since you 12 year old kids love using it.


Again, grow up. I just dismantled all of your points about his supposed "holes".

[tmacattack33]

.
(shots to tie or take lead in final minute of 4Q or OT)


......Name..........Made......Attempts... Percentage

1. Dirk Nowitzki..... 43.............94............. 45.7
2. Rudy Gay...........42.............97............. 43.3
3. LeBron James..... 61............143............ 42.7
4. Kobe Bryant........80............193............ 41.5

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1218071-lebron-james-ending-the-debate-on-lebrons-clutch-ability


Both players have elite clutch shooting percentages (top 5 itl) - so it's definitely better for them to take the shot than any teammate they could have..

But Kobe takes the shot far more often, while Lebron defers to teammates with lower clutch percentages.. Statistically, Kobe's higher volume approach more value to his team specifically IN THE CLUTCH.

In just the last minute of the 4th and the rare overtime, Kobe took a whopping 50 more clutch shots over a 6 year period from 2006-2012, at basically the same percentage as Lebron.

A) No, it's not definitely better for one of them to shoot at 40% if Zydranus Illguaskas or Lamar Odom was open under the hoop for an easy lay-up with a 90% chance of going in.

Look at the assist numbers for the same situation (less than 1 minute, possessions to tie or take the lead) and I guarantee Lebron shits on Kobe.

[tmacattack33]

And the fact that you did not even consider the above shows how your logic skills are pretty low.

You might want to stop posting nonsense and find something you don't suck at.

[Hey Yo]

If LeBron didn't have so many holes in his game and couldn't be so easily exposed, it wouldn't be so easy for people to exploit him.

When I watched the superstar of my childhood, Jordan, all I saw was a guy shitting on anyone and anything that tried to stop him. Anyone that tried to say anything about him just got made fun of, was told "ya, ya, ya.... 6/6 so please STFU", and the like.

If the media and fans would have just treated LeBron like a normal basketball player he would have been fine, but everyone has to try and blow him up like he's Jordan and therefore he got exposed for what he is. Dude is a 2/5'rbut has done some pretty impressive things in his career but has also straight up failed in certain situations. It's his fans and media that just need to stop. Stop trying to prop the guy up like he's Duncan or someone.
The same can be said about Jordan.

[ShawkFactory]

I'll take the player that has proven he can shit on the other player more often than not based on their 1v1 matchups.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JABKg2azkp0
You realize there's a 15 minute video of Lebron scoring on Kobe too, right?

Anyone can make a YouTube video to fit what they want.

[gts]

Why 2006? why lop off ten years of Kobe's career?

[TheMarkMadsen]

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e246/J_K/KobeoverLebrongamewinner_zpsd97ee867.gif (http://s40.photobucket.com/user/J_K/media/KobeoverLebrongamewinner_zpsd97ee867.gif.html)


game winner over bran

[Rose'sACL]

Why 2006? why lop off ten years of Kobe's career?
same for lebron. why remove 2012-15?

[choppermagic]

Oh god, not this shit again.

FG% is not a true indicator of "clutchness".

Clutch players can create a shot (even a lower percentage one) when others would not even be able to get one off.

Clutch players have less chances of dribbling the ball around and bouncing it off their foot, or running out of time on the clock, etc.

Clutch players can also find the open man, after drawing defenders who think that player is going to shoot for sure

Clutch players wont make bad passes at the last second, making turnovers, or giving the ball to another player in a bad spot with no time to do anything.

FG% is an inaccurate measure of clutchness.

[Magic 32]

If the media and fans would have just treated LeBron like a normal basketball player he would have been fine, but everyone has to try and blow him up like he's Jordan and therefore he got exposed for what he is. Dude is a 2/5'r but has done some pretty impressive things in his career but has also straight up failed in certain situations. It's his fans and media that just need to stop. Stop trying to prop the guy up like he's Duncan or someone.


http://espn.go.com/photo/2006/1013/nba_g_james2b_395.jpg

[Wade's Rings]

2. Lebron's midrange field goal percentage is higher than Kobe's

Kobe shoots 44% from Midrange for his Career.

Bron shoots 36% from Midrange for his Career.

[the_troof]

Last 5 seconds is a stupid measure because a lot of shots come down to luck. Stephanie's shot against the Pelicans is a perfect example of that. He is the anticlutch... a clutch guy is someone who takes control when his team needs him the most, like Kemba Walker or Kobe or post 2011 Lebron. Judging guys based off of buzzer beater situations alone is pretty stupid, especially when you consider the context and difficulty of those shots

[LBJ 23]

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e246/J_K/KobeoverLebrongamewinner_zpsd97ee867.gif (http://s40.photobucket.com/user/J_K/media/KobeoverLebrongamewinner_zpsd97ee867.gif.html)


game winner over bran


Reaching 3ball/kenneth dubeta level with your trolling I see, posting that gif in multiple threads like you proved something new to us with that gif.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFfrFmBRgCw

too easy....



And I know it hurts that this ''beta bron'' who was supposed to be such a choker is dominatting Kobe in every clutch category and especially in the playoffs. That's all you Kobe stans had, I remember years ago how Kobe's clutchness was always your main argument to put Kobe above Lebron even though it was always just a myth.

[TheMarkMadsen]

Reaching 3ball/kenneth dubeta level with your trolling I see, posting that gif in multiple threads like you proved something new to us with that gif.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QFfrFmBRgCw

too easy....



And I know it hurts that this ''beta bron'' who was supposed to be such a choker is dominatting Kobe in every clutch category and especially in the playoffs. That's all you Kobe stans had, I remember years ago how Kobe's clutchness was always your main argument to put Kobe above Lebron even though it was always just a myth.

you do realize that clutch isn't just determined in the last 24 seconds of the game..

clutch is also playing well enough through the first 3 quarters so that your team isn't receiving the worst beat down in finals history like the lebron led miami heat did last year..

yeah that guy who is supposed to have some GOAT impact according to his stans, led his team into the biggest massacre in nba finals history.. while collected majority of his points during garbage time

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y02r-Dz5cMw

CLUTCH!!

..

it goes to show how insecure you bran stans really are, literally the most relevant player on ish since game 4 has been Kobe, all in some pathetic attempt to draw attention away from the FACT that lebron does not have to "play like superman" for his team to win this series, and in FACT can shoot 32% over the course of the past 2 games and still have the very real possibility of winning.

yall shook because this is exposing how pathetic the eastern conference is and how much help bran has..

love out, kyrie hurt, shump hurt, smith out 2 games, lebron playing like ass and they still will easily make the finals...

free pass to the finals theory confirmed

[TheMarkMadsen]

2 minutes or less 4th quarter game within 5 points PLAYOFFS


2008:

http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/clutch/?sort=PTS&dir=1&Season=2007-08&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&ClutchTime=Last%202%20Minutes

2009: http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/clutch/?sort=PTS&dir=1&Season=2008-09&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&ClutchTime=Last%202%20Minutes

2010: http://stats.nba.com/league/player/#!/clutch/?sort=PTS&dir=1&Season=2009-10&SeasonType=Playoffs&Period=4&ClutchTime=Last%202%20Minutes

:lol :lol


Kobe also led the entire playoffs in 4th quarter scoring on incredible efficiency for b2b championship runs in 01 & 02

[LBJ 23]

lol nobody gives a shit about Kobe anymore but of course people will talk negatively about him if a million of you Kobetards is on here 24/7 hating on every little thing Lebron does. You are like parazites eating a dead body with no meat left and should be long gone. And then you're are surprised that people throw Kobe back at your faces and create threads about him :lol

Try doing something else other than hating on Lebron all the time and maybe there will be less Kobe comparisons don't you think?

[TheMarkMadsen]

lol nobody gives a shit about Kobe anymore but of course people will talk negatively about him if a million of you Kobetards is on here 24/7 hating on every little thing Lebron does. You are like parazites eating a dead body with no meat left and should be long gone. And then you're are surprised that people throw Kobe back at your faces and create threads about him :lol

Try doing something else other than hating on Lebron all the time and maybe there will be less Kobe comparisons don't you think?

riiiiight

thats why when bran hit that shot it was bran stans making Kobe threads (for some weird reason).. "bran haters" weren't even on ISH yet there was like 10 Kobe threads on the first page :lol


and nice, just ignore aeveryhing else in my post, things were about to get tough for you, best you just wait for help to arrive from other bran stans

i see you've learned a lot from your idol :bowdown:

[LBJ 23]

lol don't have the time to get in that shit.....done that in the past learned a lesson just no point arguing. Better for me to study right now :oldlol: . And like I said, you Kobe stans were using clutchness as you main argument in years 09', 10', 11', 12 and then that picture showing Lebron's, Kobe's and Jordans gamewinners came out and you suddenly became so quiet about it.

I've been here long enough so I know a thing or two about the past. And what a shocker years we've been hearing from you and your friends how Kobe is more clutch than Bron etc etc... and then you're surprised that when Bron hits a gamewinner there are comparison threads. Having said that, Kobe fans are still by far the biggest group of people on here hating on Lebron nonstop so of course you will get that reverse effect. Also, a lot of threads were made by third world posters like 3ball and others who are not Lebron fans at all...

[Nash]

lol at anybody nitpicking Lebrons game vs Kobe. Kobe is filled with embarrassing stats and numbers.

[Heavincent]

lol at anybody nitpicking Lebrons game vs Kobe. Kobe is filled with embarrassing stats and numbers.

Yeah like being the only member of the 30,000/5,000/5,000 club. And having 5 rings. So embarrassing!

[riseagainst]

Yeah like being the only member of the 30,000/5,000/5,000 club. And having 5 rings. So embarrassing!

30k/5k/5k/5rings club.

:bowdown:

[TheMarkMadsen]

30k/5k/5k/5rings club.

:bowdown:

it's actually the 30/6k/6k club

[ShawkFactory]

Lebron will be in the 30k/7k/7k club in a couple years.

[Roundball_Rock]

.
But Kobe takes the shot far more often, while Lebron defers to teammates with lower clutch percentages.. Statistically, Kobe's higher volume approach more value to his team specifically IN THE CLUTCH.

In just the last minute of the 4th and the rare overtime, Kobe took a whopping 50 more clutch shots over a 6 year period from 2006-2012, at basically the same percentage as Lebron.

Yeah, and LeBron took far more than Dirk. Attempts are meaningless without data on both number of opportunities (the idea is to avoid needing a game winner at the end...) and other outcomes, i.e. assists.