I'm not entirely sure that people fully grasp the psychological impact..

[Orlando Magic]

that great players can have on their teammates if they're the type of great player that gets people involved.

The best recent example I have of this is Cleveland with LeBron. Clearly to anyone watching, LeBron, while still amazing, is not quite 100 percent of what he used to be... nevertheless the Cavs continue to perform and have a legit title shot despite a roster full of players that never won a damn thing in their lives and were considered in some cases as being cancerous players and or garbage throwaways.

See JR Smith on the Knicks.

I see people on this site calling the Cavs the deepest team in the league with a loaded roster even with love hurt... Meanwhile these are all the same guys that just a year ago were all losing like crazy, doing nothing to truly help their teams win in any significant way, and now they're probably going to the finals... what changed?

It is my humble belief that LeBron, in this case, has given these guys an identity, purpose... and most importantly... the power of BELIEF... thus the aforementioned psychological impact. He doesn't even have to necessarily perform on the level that he once did in order for them to win it all because of this one simple yet unbelievably complex fact.

[Prometheus]

that great players can have on their teammates I'd there the type of great player that gets people involved.

The best recent example I have of this is Cleveland with LeBron. Clearly to anyone watching, LeBron, while still amazing, is not quite 100 percent of what he used to be... nevertheless the Cavs continue to perform and have a legit title shot despite a roster full of players that never won a damn thing in their lives and were considered in some cases as being cancerous players and or garbage throwaways.

See JR Smith on the Knicks.

I see people on this site calling the Cavs the deepest team in the league with a loaded roster even with love hurt... Meanwhile these are all the same guys that just a year ago were all losing like crazy, doing nothing to truly help their teams win in any significant way, and now they're probably going to the finals... what changed?

It is my humble belief that LeBron, in this case, has given these guys an identity, purpose... and most importantly... the power of BELIEF... thus the aforementioned psychological impact. He doesn't even have to necessarily perform on the level that he once did in order for them to win it all because of this one simple yet unbelievably complex fact.

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view3/20140312/4998581/howie-scared-of-the-sun-o.gif

[SpaceJammeR]

well obviously lebron helps a lot. only the haters are saying they are stacked to fit their agenda. i mean houston, spurs, gsw, clippers are more stacked.

[305Baller]

Could LeBron win a title if you replaced Harden with him on the Rockets?
That's what Im wondering...

[Genaro]

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Hikawoydt9k/UfubHrfpGnI/AAAAAAAABFQ/hDU6x_1t9Yw/w360-h348-no/bocejo.gif

[chazzy]

JR Smith was the 2nd option on the 3rd best offense in the league just two years ago

[BigBoss]

Op thinks hes Tony Robbins

[sd3035]

OP is onto something, Lebron brings ref security, a big psychological boost

[DCL]

matthew dellavedova ain't dropping 19 in a close-out playoff game if he's playing with kobe

[Cocaine80s]

matthew dellavedova ain't dropping 19 in a close-out playoff game if he's playing with kobe
This. Lebron is turning his teammates into all stars

[Dave3]

matthew dellavedova ain't dropping 19 in a close-out playoff game if he's playing with kobe
But Kareem Rush will drop 18 in the exact same scenario with Shaq/Kobe. Look, I do think LeBron has a huge impact on the floor even if he's struggling shooting (even more so than other stars) , just from his ball movement, defensive attention etc., but attributing a fluke hot game from a 10th man to LeBron is complete delusion. Dellavedova had a hot game, that's all. The same way any scrub can have a good game once in a while.

[DCL]

But Kareem Rush will drop 18 in the exact same scenario with Shaq/Kobe. Look, I do think LeBron has a huge impact on the floor even if he's struggling shooting (even more so than other stars) , just from his ball movement, defensive attention etc., but attributing a fluke hot game from a 10th man to LeBron is complete delusion. Dellavedova had a hot game, that's all. The same way any scrub can have a good game once in a while.

you still need a leader who gives you some confidence to keep rolling and have a hot game.

if dellavedova missed two shots, he'd almost immediately get this guy to look like this:

http://www.themarsreel.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/kobe.jpg
"F--king A, Matt. do you really have to shoot everytime you get wide open??? DAFUQ, man"

:lol

[toneloc103]

Man... LBJ cant win with most of you guys. If they would have lost he is beta af. If they win the bbulls were hurt/disorganized. If a role player has a good game, he had nothing to do with it. Damn Give dude some credit... LBJ is a special player. i am not a stan. I hated him when he left. I am a Cavs fan. Can yall let us enjoy the series win for at least a day?

[ClipperRevival]

that great players can have on their teammates if they're the type of great player that gets people involved.

The best recent example I have of this is Cleveland with LeBron. Clearly to anyone watching, LeBron, while still amazing, is not quite 100 percent of what he used to be... nevertheless the Cavs continue to perform and have a legit title shot despite a roster full of players that never won a damn thing in their lives and were considered in some cases as being cancerous players and or garbage throwaways.

See JR Smith on the Knicks.

I see people on this site calling the Cavs the deepest team in the league with a loaded roster even with love hurt... Meanwhile these are all the same guys that just a year ago were all losing like crazy, doing nothing to truly help their teams win in any significant way, and now they're probably going to the finals... what changed?

It is my humble belief that LeBron, in this case, has given these guys an identity, purpose... and most importantly... the power of BELIEF... thus the aforementioned psychological impact. He doesn't even have to necessarily perform on the level that he once did in order for them to win it all because of this one simple yet unbelievably complex fact.

I agree. That's also something a guy like Magic brought to the table. It motivates guys to play harder, to move around more, to cut to the basket harder, to run the floor harder, etc because they know their superstar will find them if they are open. When your superstar player is completely into playing the game the right way, yes, it can definitely impact the rest of the team in a hugely, positive way.

[ClipperRevival]

Man... LBJ cant win with most of you guys. If they would have lost he is beta af. If they win the bbulls were hurt/disorganized. If a role player has a good game, he had nothing to do with it. Damn Give dude some credit... LBJ is a special player. i am not a stan. I hated him when he left. I am a Cavs fan. Can yall let us enjoy the series win for at least a day?

I don't like LeBron too much either but I do recognize he is special. He plays the game the right way and impacts the game in so many ways.

[KevinNYC]

I agree. That's also something a guy like Magic brought to the table. It motivates guys to play harder, to move around more, to cut to the basket harder, to run the floor harder, etc because they know their superstar will find them if they are open. When your superstar player is completely into playing the game the right way, yes, it can definitely impact the rest of the team in a hugely, positive way.

Apparently those 60's Celtics teams felt that no matter what happened they wind up with the win because they had Russell. It would free them up to play their best.

M. L. Carr said as long as they had Bird, they felt every time they walked on the court they could win.

[jzek]

Agree. Look at Rodman when he joined Jordan.

[ArbitraryWater]

It is amazing, and shouldn't go unnoticed... its like any team LeBron joins, has the ability to play at a league high level offensively... everyone can hit their shots, 3's, clinical... LeBron's impact is so much higher than someone like Kobe, comparing them isn't fair for Kobe.

[ClipperRevival]

Apparently those 60's Celtics teams felt that no matter what happened they wind up with the win because they had Russell. It would free them up to play their best.

M. L. Carr said as long as they had Bird, they felt every time they walked on the court they could win.

And on the flip side, take Kobe, who is on the opposite end of the spectrum. Now let me clarify, Kobe played the game in different ways depending on his supporting cast. When he had scrub teammates, he played "F everyone else, I'm getting mines" ball but when he knew he had enough talent to contend, he did play the game the right way. But when Kobe had a crappy team, you could see guys just standing around. And his fans always complain, "Well, if Kobe had decent teammates, he would pass to them." Well, when your star isn't even looking to get others involved, even when you are open, you start to lose the motivation to move around and get open as much. And the more you see your star chucking away and forget the team, the easier it is to just stand and watch.

Players are not robots. They are human beings. They have things that motivate or de-motivate them. How your superstar player plays the game hugely impacts the morale of your team. Team ball is contagious just as ball hogging is contagious. One positively impacts the team while the other negatively impacts the team.

And in that aspect, I like LeBron because he always played the game the right way. And that is why guys all love to play with him because he will make them look good by setting them up with easy looks time and time again. And on the flipside, no one wants to play with Kobe because Kobe is always trying to impose his will on the team and that wears guys out. Howard left, Gasol left. And no stars wanted to come to LA.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

LeBron's impact is so much higher than someone like Kobe, comparing them isn't fair for Kobe.
No it's not.

[SpecialQue]

Sitting on OP's bookshelf right now:

https://bellasfashionistasblog.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/secret.gif

[Dro]

I agree with OP. Some people are just haters. I'm not a hater. Last year you guys were calling Kevin Love "empty stats" this, overrated that. Now folks were saying the Cavs couldn't win without him. Did Love get that much better this year? Of course not, in fact he didn't get better at all. Lebron plays team ball. People can say he's stat padding or whatever. Well guess what, can a scrub stat pad? Nope. Can a role player statpad? Sometimes. A great player can statpad every game because he's good enough to do it. Period.

He's good enough to grab rebounds, lead the offense, run the break, guard multiple positions, and get his shots in the flow of the offense while at the same time keeping everyone happy. I remember Stockton saying he always keeps a timer in his head to know that ok, Karl hasn't had a shot in 3 possessions, lets get him the ball this time. Hornacek hasn't had a good look at a 3, lets get him one.

Thats why Lebron's so great and I have a lot of respect for him. He gets JR Smith shots, he gets Love shots, he gets Irving shots, he drives and drops off dimes to Mozgof and Thompson. He's not just out there trying to shoot and score every time. He's trying to win and keep his teammates happy at the same time which is pretty admirable actually. A guy like MJ or Kobe don't give a damn you guys may call that Alpha. Sure maybe to an anti-social d!ck. But to a regular dude like me, I'd prefer to get along with teammates and see everyone happy, not just myself. And if you're good enough to do that, why not?

[Dro]

No it's not.
Yes it is. I don't even think its arguable...

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Yes it is. I don't even think its arguable...
Again, it's not. LeBron's impact is not "so much greater" than Kobe that its "not fair to discuss". That is a full retard statement.

People are underestimating LeBron's teammates yet again.

[Dro]

And on the flip side, take Kobe, who is on the opposite end of the spectrum. Now let me clarify, Kobe played the game in different ways depending on his supporting cast. When he had scrub teammates, he played "F everyone else, I'm getting mines" ball but when he knew he had enough talent to contend, he did play the game the right way. But when Kobe had a crappy team, you could see guys just standing around. And his fans always complain, "Well, if Kobe had decent teammates, he would pass to them." Well, when your star isn't even looking to get others involved, even when you are open, you start to lose the motivation to move around and get open as much. And the more you see your star chucking away and forget the team, the easier it is to just stand and watch.

Players are not robots. They are human beings. They have things that motivate or de-motivate them. How your superstar player plays the game hugely impacts the morale of your team. Team ball is contagious just as ball hogging is contagious. One positively impacts the team while the other negatively impacts the team.

And in that aspect, I like LeBron because he always played the game the right way. And that is why guys all love to play with him because he will make them look good by setting them up with easy looks time and time again. And on the flipside, no one wants to play with Kobe because Kobe is always trying to impose his will on the team and that wears guys out. Howard left, Gasol left. And no stars wanted to come to LA.
This is a great post. I didn't even read it before I posted.

Lebron makes sometimes basic passes to a guy standing on the perimeter next to him but he zips it so quick it gives JR. Smith or whoever the chance to get a good look at 3, even though there was zero ball movement or offensive movement at the time. Its just Lebron can see the game in advance and realize that if he gets it over fast enough, the guy gets a good look. You don't see any other player in recent memory do this. Its a very unselfish thing and you have to be able get the pass over there quick enough and know the guy will have enough to space to get off a good shot.

[CavaliersFTW]

that great players can have on their teammates if they're the type of great player that gets people involved.

The best recent example I have of this is Cleveland with LeBron. Clearly to anyone watching, LeBron, while still amazing, is not quite 100 percent of what he used to be... nevertheless the Cavs continue to perform and have a legit title shot despite a roster full of players that never won a damn thing in their lives and were considered in some cases as being cancerous players and or garbage throwaways.

See JR Smith on the Knicks.

I see people on this site calling the Cavs the deepest team in the league with a loaded roster even with love hurt... Meanwhile these are all the same guys that just a year ago were all losing like crazy, doing nothing to truly help their teams win in any significant way, and now they're probably going to the finals... what changed?

It is my humble belief that LeBron, in this case, has given these guys an identity, purpose... and most importantly... the power of BELIEF... thus the aforementioned psychological impact. He doesn't even have to necessarily perform on the level that he once did in order for them to win it all because of this one simple yet unbelievably complex fact.
That's the coaches job dingus, coaches inspire the players and gives them an identity and purpose on the floor :hammerhead:

Jesus the media really brainwashes fans these days. Coaches get all of the blame for losses and are the first to get fired, and get none of the credit for crafting the identity of teams and inspiring players to win games. Meanwhile superstars get all the credit for everything and none of the blame. Can't have it both ways. Like I said, your description is the coaches job. Not Lebrons. His job is to play basketball.

[ClipperRevival]

Again, it's not. LeBron's impact is not "so much greater" than Kobe that its "not fair to discuss". That is a full retard statement.

People are underestimating LeBron's teammates yet again.

If you give both of them crappy teams, LeBron would have the greater impact given his more well rounded game and the fact that he would play team ball and set his teammates up with easy looks. Kobe, on the other hand, would try to do it himself.

Now, give both of them teams that have enough talent to compete and I think their impact can be very similar because that is when Kobe decides to play within the team concept and his superior offensive iso skills can play a big factor.

[Dro]

Again, it's not. LeBron's impact is not "so much greater" than Kobe that its "not fair to discuss". That is a full retard statement.

People are underestimating LeBron's teammates yet again.
Put Kobe on those Cavs teams with Mo Williams as his 2nd best player and tell me how good the Cavs are.

Lebron goes to any team at damn near any age so far and makes them title favorites. When was the last time you could say that about Kobe? Could you ever say that about Kobe?

I like Kobe also by the way. Probably the same amount I like Lebron.

[bobeticus]

I agree with OP. Some people are just haters. I'm not a hater. Last year you guys were calling Kevin Love "empty stats" this, overrated that. Now folks were saying the Cavs couldn't win without him. Did Love get that much better this year? Of course not, in fact he didn't get better at all. Lebron plays team ball. People can say he's stat padding or whatever. Well guess what, can a scrub stat pad? Nope. Can a role player statpad? Sometimes. A great player can statpad every game because he's good enough to do it. Period.

He's good enough to grab rebounds, lead the offense, run the break, guard multiple positions, and get his shots in the flow of the offense while at the same time keeping everyone happy. I remember Stockton saying he always keeps a timer in his head to know that ok, Karl hasn't had a shot in 3 possessions, lets get him the ball this time. Hornacek hasn't had a good look at a 3, lets get him one.

Thats why Lebron's so great and I have a lot of respect for him. He gets JR Smith shots, he gets Love shots, he gets Irving shots, he drives and drops off dimes to Mozgof and Thompson. He's not just out there trying to shoot and score every time. He's trying to win and keep his teammates happy at the same time which is pretty admirable actually. A guy like MJ or Kobe don't give a damn you guys may call that Alpha. Sure maybe to an anti-social d!ck. But to a regular dude like me, I'd prefer to get along with teammates and see everyone happy, not just myself. And if you're good enough to do that, why not?

agreed. thats why Spurs are successful have some finals run and titles run.. its not about Duncan nor Parker or Gino... its about team impact how you impact your co-player to play better and have confidence in his self.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

If you give both of them crappy teams, LeBron would have the greater impact given his more well rounded game and the fact that he would play team ball and set his teammates up with easy looks. Kobe, on the other hand, would try to do it himself.

Now, give both of them teams that have enough talent to compete and I think their impact can be very similar because that is when Kobe decides to play within the team concept and his superior offensive iso skills can play a big factor.
It's all situational I agree. The former is likely to have less success in the playoffs as we seen with most of LeBron's Cav teams pre Heat.

On good teams, their impact is much closer and arguably on the same tier.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Put Kobe on those Cavs teams with Mo Williams as his 2nd best player and tell me how good the Cavs are.

Lebron goes to any team at damn near any age so far and makes them title favorites. When was the last time you could say that about Kobe? Could you ever say that about Kobe?

I like Kobe also by the way. Probably the same amount I like Lebron.
Who cares? The furthest LeBron got with Mo Williams was his ass handed to him by the Magic; they never won anything.

Put Kobe on the 2011 Heat. Does he wet the bed like LeBron? As I said, its all situational.

[ClipperRevival]

It's all situational I agree. The former is likely to have less success in the playoffs as we seen with most of LeBron's Cav teams pre Heat.

On good teams, their impact is much closer and arguably on the same tier.

Yeah, Kobe was funny because when he knew he didn't have the talent to win, he just decided to get his. And that never sat well with me because I think the game should be played a certain way (team basketball). But give the guy enough talent to win, and he blends into the team concept (for the most part) and he can have a LeBron type impact as he will also attract the double and find open teammates and you add in his legendary ability to score, and you have a dangerous alpha dog leading a talented team.

[ISHGoat]

This is a great post. I didn't even read it before I posted.

Lebron makes sometimes basic passes to a guy standing on the perimeter next to him but he zips it so quick it gives JR. Smith or whoever the chance to get a good look at 3, even though there was zero ball movement or offensive movement at the time. Its just Lebron can see the game in advance and realize that if he gets it over fast enough, the guy gets a good look. You don't see any other player in recent memory do this. Its a very unselfish thing and you have to be able get the pass over there quick enough and know the guy will have enough to space to get off a good shot.

And most of the times lebron zips a pass to an open 3pt shooter, its dam accurate too. Lebron may not have the flashiest passing but his court vision is amazing and his passing is extremely efficient just like the rest of his game. He plays the right way.

[ApexPredator]

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Hikawoydt9k/UfubHrfpGnI/AAAAAAAABFQ/hDU6x_1t9Yw/w360-h348-no/bocejo.gif
This.

[Dro]

Who cares? The furthest LeBron got with Mo Williams was his ass handed to him by the Magic; they never won anything.

Put Kobe on the 2011 Heat. Does he wet the bed like LeBron? As I said, its all situational.
Eh, that Cavs team with Kobe on doesn't make it past 1st or 2nd round in my opinion.

And for 2011? If you're going to say well yeah if you give Kobe 2 other stars, he could win also. Well of course he could. So could maybe Carmelo, or Cousins, or name any other great player, Durant, Westbrook. Thats a given. But we're talking about impact.

If those guys can't take a scrub team deep into the playoffs, then they don't have as much impact as the guy who can. The only guy on that last that has proven that he can, is Lebron.

[tpols]

last night was nothing more than the Ewing effect... when a star goes down and all of a sudden there's opportunity freed up, role players can go off short term.

Nobody scouts delly.. when a player isn't taken into consideration and gets a big opportunity, they can do a lot more than usual.

Lebron has always been good at getting shooters looks though.. that's what he does drive and kick. And he's always been good at being the one man army style of ball where he's the main cog and there's 4 indiscriminate pieces around him that don't need the ball or have egos..

But when you pair bron with another big star his ability to enhance those stars like he did the role players doesn't exist. Because stars like to create themselves.. not just be bird fed spot up shots.

so he enhances average teammates but detracts from star teammates. if you want rings? You'd rather it be the other way around.... hence 2/5.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Eh, that Cavs team with Kobe on doesn't make it past 1st or 2nd round in my opinion.

And for 2011? If you're going to say well yeah if you give Kobe 2 other stars, he could win also. Well of course he could. So could maybe Carmelo, or Cousins, or name any other great player, Durant, Westbrook. Thats a given. But we're talking about impact.

If those guys can't take a scrub team deep into the playoffs, then they don't have as much impact as the guy who can. The only guy on that last that has proven that he can, is Lebron.
That's nice. LeBron can take a team a round or two further with scrubs. But if they're not winning anything in a joke conference, is it even worth discussing?

Impact is also how much you can win w/ applicable talent.

[FLDFSU]

that great players can have on their teammates if they're the type of great player that gets people involved.

The best recent example I have of this is Cleveland with LeBron. Clearly to anyone watching, LeBron, while still amazing, is not quite 100 percent of what he used to be... nevertheless the Cavs continue to perform and have a legit title shot despite a roster full of players that never won a damn thing in their lives and were considered in some cases as being cancerous players and or garbage throwaways.

See JR Smith on the Knicks.

I see people on this site calling the Cavs the deepest team in the league with a loaded roster even with love hurt... Meanwhile these are all the same guys that just a year ago were all losing like crazy, doing nothing to truly help their teams win in any significant way, and now they're probably going to the finals... what changed?

It is my humble belief that LeBron, in this case, has given these guys an identity, purpose... and most importantly... the power of BELIEF... thus the aforementioned psychological impact. He doesn't even have to necessarily perform on the level that he once did in order for them to win it all because of this one simple yet unbelievably complex fact.

Forget a year ago...most of these guys were losers THIS year.

JR Smith, Shump, and Mozgov have a .200 winning percentage THIS season without Lebron on the court.

[ArbitraryWater]

Who cares? The furthest LeBron got with Mo Williams was his ass handed to him by the Magic; they never won anything.

Put Kobe on the 2011 Heat. Does he wet the bed like LeBron? As I said, its all situational.

Kobe doesn't make it past the Bulls.


That's nice. LeBron can take a team a round or two further with scrubs. But if they're not winning anything in a joke conference, is it even worth discussing?

Impact is also how much you can win w/ applicable talent.

going full eyes closed hater mode :oldlol:

[ImKobe]

That's why Kobe's teams went to 7 NBA Finals. Even Jordan couldn't accomplish this feat, and he was arguably the best teammate of all-time.

No one gets their teammates involved and focused as much as Kobe does.

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

Kobe doesn't make it past the Bulls.



going full eyes closed hater mode :oldlol:
Maybe. Maybe not. The way Chicago has played in this series, though, I could see Kobe in his prime taking a dump on them.

But yeah, I don't hate LeBron. If I had to pick between him and Kobe, I'd probably go with LeBron. That being said, people are really underrating Kobe if they think LeBron's impact engulfs Kobe's; on equal teams against quality competition they are pretty close.

[Rake2204]

And on the flip side, take Kobe, who is on the opposite end of the spectrum. Now let me clarify, Kobe played the game in different ways depending on his supporting cast. When he had scrub teammates, he played "F everyone else, I'm getting mines" ball but when he knew he had enough talent to contend, he did play the game the right way. But when Kobe had a crappy team, you could see guys just standing around. And his fans always complain, "Well, if Kobe had decent teammates, he would pass to them." Well, when your star isn't even looking to get others involved, even when you are open, you start to lose the motivation to move around and get open as much. And the more you see your star chucking away and forget the team, the easier it is to just stand and watch.

Players are not robots. They are human beings. They have things that motivate or de-motivate them. How your superstar player plays the game hugely impacts the morale of your team. Team ball is contagious just as ball hogging is contagious. One positively impacts the team while the other negatively impacts the team.

And in that aspect, I like LeBron because he always played the game the right way. And that is why guys all love to play with him because he will make them look good by setting them up with easy looks time and time again. And on the flipside, no one wants to play with Kobe because Kobe is always trying to impose his will on the team and that wears guys out. Howard left, Gasol left. And no stars wanted to come to LA.I agree with this post so much that I feel I could have written it myself. The manner with which LeBron James plays the game has been a breath of fresh air to me since his preseason debut against the Pistons in 2003.

In a post-Jordan era I struggled to understand, one that put a premium stars willing to be "The Man" by taking contested mid-range fallaways over triple teams all night, James' approach was stark and welcomed. Surely, he's not without fault, but someone who seemed to fully understand that his team's best chance to win came from him influencing the game through his own scoring and making the right play, even if it meant making a pass that leads to a pass that leads to a score... he just played right.

On a far lower level, I've had a teammate in my life who played like an amateur Kobe Bryant and I've honestly had one that played like a LeBron James/Jason Kidd hybrid.

The amateur Bryant was a killer. He was the best option every time down the floor, so it was tough to fault him for pursuing his own business on each trip. I recall him dropping a cool 48 points in one of our rec games and apparently he registered higher than that on numerous other occasions. But his approach drained every one of his teammates. He could hit a contested fallaway over two people, but after standing around - often open on the arc (conserving energy really, as moving without the ball provided no benefits) - and for a significant portion of the game, it's very difficult to not check out or lose one's flow, no matter how hard I tried. So the rare times he did kick to me, it was almost startling and usually just reaffirmed his self-fulfilling prophecy that he needed to shoulder everything himself.

In contrast, the Kidd/James teammate (probably more Kidd-like, as was not as scoring-dominant) made every team he played on seemingly 100% better. He was the best player, but also a super willing and fundamental passer. He went hard, led by example, and just played right. Teammates didn't stand around because they knew if they were in the right spot, he'd deliver. As a result, we were an extremely dangerous squad.

Both players were talented, but playing with someone with an approach like James and Kidd was one of the best basketball experiences of my life. It's the essence of making one's teammates better. Everyone ran lanes, cut hard, moved, because they knew there was a reason. And five always beats one.

[ClipperRevival]

I agree with this post so much that I feel I could have written it myself. The manner with which LeBron James plays the game has been a breath of fresh air to me since his preseason debut against the Pistons in 2003.

In a post-Jordan era I struggled to understand, one that put a premium stars willing to be "The Man" by taking contested mid-range fallaways over triple teams all night, James' approach was stark and welcomed. Surely, he's not without fault, but someone who seemed to fully understand that his team's best chance to win came from him influencing the game through his own scoring and making the right play, even if it meant making a pass that leads to a pass that leads to a score... he just played right.

On a far lower level, I've had a teammate in my life who played like an amateur Kobe Bryant and I've honestly had one that played like a LeBron James/Jason Kidd hybrid.

The amateur Bryant was a killer. He was the best option every time down the floor, so it was tough to fault him for pursuing his own business on each trip. I recall him dropping a cool 48 points in one of our rec games and apparently he registered higher than that on numerous other occasions. But his approach drained every one of his teammates. He could hit a contested fallaway over two people, but after standing around - often open on the arc - for a significant portion of the game, it's very difficult to not check out or lose one's flow, no matter how hard I tried. So the rare times he did kick to me, it was almost startling.

In contrast, the Kidd/James teammate (probably more Kidd-like, as was not as scoring-dominant) made every team he played on seemingly 100% better. He was the best player, but also a super willing and fundamental passer. He went hard, led by example, and just played right. Teammates didn't stand around because they knew if they were in the right spot, he'd deliver. As a result, we were an extremely dangerous squad.

Both players were talented, but playing with someone with an approach like James and Kidd was one of the best basketball experiences of my life. It's the essence of making one's teammates better.

Well said. No one wants to play with a guy who hogs the ball and doesn't look to pass. No one. And that's why guys love to play with LeBron. I don't even like the guy but I can appreciate the fact that he plays the game the right way. He's just looking to make the correct basketball play. In theory, it's so simple yet when done correctly time and time again, it can make a team dangerous, like the 2014 Spurs and almost unstoppable.

There's nothing worse than playing with a guy who thinks he's the shit and isn't even looking to pass. In situations like that, why even bother slashing or cutting or setting screens or trying to get open because chances are, even if you are open, you won't get the ball. On the flip side, play with a superstar who is completely willing to find the open man, and you watch the level of intensity and motivation go up from his teammates. It's just human nature

[ISHGoat]

"Grateness is inspirition"

- Theoo

[chazzy]

LeBron's impact is so much higher than someone like Kobe, comparing them isn't fair for Kobe.
Never go full pauk. What's up with these european lebron stans being so hyperbolic about dude?

[Hey Yo]

JR Smith was the 2nd option on the 3rd best offense in the league just two years ago
2nd options don't come off the bench. JR started zero games that year.

[buddha]

see Chris Paul..

it's more about teaming up with great players instead of being great and getting others involved.

[chazzy]

2nd options don't come off the bench. JR started zero games that year.
That's irrelevant because he played the most minutes on that team and had the 2nd most pts and FGA

[Hey Yo]

That's irrelevant because he played the most minutes on that team and had the 2nd most pts and FGA
Maybe because he was available for more games than any other teammate besides Novak.

Still doesn't change the fact he wasn't a starter that year, viewed as a team cancer around the league and the NYK were dying to get rid of him this season.

[chazzy]

Maybe because he was available for more games than any other teammate besides Novak.

Still doesn't change the fact he wasn't a starter that year, viewed as a team cancer around the league and the NYK were dying to get rid of him this season.
Stop arguing about semantics and being a dork, you get my point and you're just upset that it goes against your Lebron=Jesus narrative

[oarabbus]

I agree with this post so much that I feel I could have written it myself. The manner with which LeBron James plays the game has been a breath of fresh air to me since his preseason debut against the Pistons in 2003.

In a post-Jordan era I struggled to understand, one that put a premium stars willing to be "The Man" by taking contested mid-range fallaways over triple teams all night, James' approach was stark and welcomed. Surely, he's not without fault, but someone who seemed to fully understand that his team's best chance to win came from him influencing the game through his own scoring and making the right play, even if it meant making a pass that leads to a pass that leads to a score... he just played right.

On a far lower level, I've had a teammate in my life who played like an amateur Kobe Bryant and I've honestly had one that played like a LeBron James/Jason Kidd hybrid.

The amateur Bryant was a killer. He was the best option every time down the floor, so it was tough to fault him for pursuing his own business on each trip. I recall him dropping a cool 48 points in one of our rec games and apparently he registered higher than that on numerous other occasions. But his approach drained every one of his teammates. He could hit a contested fallaway over two people, but after standing around - often open on the arc (conserving energy really, as moving without the ball provided no benefits) - and for a significant portion of the game, it's very difficult to not check out or lose one's flow, no matter how hard I tried. So the rare times he did kick to me, it was almost startling and usually just reaffirmed his self-fulfilling prophecy that he needed to shoulder everything himself.

In contrast, the Kidd/James teammate (probably more Kidd-like, as was not as scoring-dominant) made every team he played on seemingly 100% better. He was the best player, but also a super willing and fundamental passer. He went hard, led by example, and just played right. Teammates didn't stand around because they knew if they were in the right spot, he'd deliver. As a result, we were an extremely dangerous squad.

Both players were talented, but playing with someone with an approach like James and Kidd was one of the best basketball experiences of my life. It's the essence of making one's teammates better. Everyone ran lanes, cut hard, moved, because they knew there was a reason. And five always beats one.



THIS x10000.


It's ALWAYS more fun to play with a talented PG than a talented SG... and offensively, Bron is a PG, while Kobe is an SG. The SG's tend to be black holes and "body language retarded" in that they can't tell the teammates are getting frustrated, irritated, losing flow. The brillliant PGs "know your game better than you know it yourself" (not really, but it's an analogy). When they see a guy start to stiffen up since he's been frozen out on the last 5 possessions, they'll find the guy. As a result that guy probably works harder on defense too.

[chips93]

JR Smith was the 2nd option on the 3rd best offense in the league just two years ago

thats two years ago

the knicks were trying to shed his contract because he wasnt worth it. any team in the league could have had him.

he would have had far more trade value, if people really thought he was capable of playing as well as he is right now.