Has any player ever averaged 40 PPG in a playoff series?

[3ball]

.
MJ did it 6 times (the pace in each series shown in red):


1988 1st Round, Cavs 5th ranked defense: 45.2 PPG... (92.8 Pace)
1992 1st Round, Miami 25th ranked defense 45.0 PPG... (92.6)
1986 1st Round, Celtics 1st ranked defense: 43.7 PPG... (97.5)
1990 2nd Round, Sixers 16th ranked defense: 43.0 PPG... (92.1)
1993 NBA Finals, Phoenix 7th ranked defense: 41.0 PPG... (89.7)
1989 1st Round, Cavs 2nd ranked defense: 39.8 PPG... (89.9)


Today's pace: 93.9


Has anyone else ever averagd 40+ PPG in any playoff series ever?.. Or is it only MJ again?
.

[SouBeachTalents]

West, Baylor, Barry, and King did it as well

[3ball]

West, Baylor, Barry, and King did it as well


Cool thanks.. How many times did they do it, and are those the only guys?

[SouBeachTalents]

Cool thanks.. How many times, and is that it?

I believe so, and one time for each

[imdaman99]

If OKC had made the playoffs, Westbrook would have averaged 40 against the Warriors.

[3ball]

West, Baylor, Barry, and King did it as well


Looks like they only did it once each, to MJ's 6 times.. and MJ was the last guy to do it in 1993 Finals.

MJ did get 37.3 PPG in 1997 1st round vs. Bullets 13th ranked defense... 36.0 PPG in 1996 ECF vs. the Knicks' 4th ranked defense... and 35.8 PPG in 1992 Finals vs. Portland's 3rd ranked defense.

[theaussieguy]

Looks like they only did it once each, to MJ's 6 times.. and MJ was the last guy to do it in 1993 Finals.

MJ did get 37.3 PPG in 1997 1st round vs. Bullets 13th ranked defense... 36.0 PPG in 1996 ECF vs. the Knicks' 4th ranked defense... and 35.8 PPG in 1992 Finals vs. Portland's 3rd ranked defense.

MJ is the undisputed GOAT phorreal

[Rose'sACL]

durant would have done it if he played in the 80s or early 90s. He would have certainly did it in finals against western conference teams.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Lebron vs Hawks

[3ball]

.
PACE in each series that MJ got his 40+ PPG:


1988 1st Round, Cavs 5th ranked defense: 45.2 PPG (92.8 Pace)
1992 1st Round, Miami 25th ranked defense 45.0 PPG (92.6)
1986 1st Round, Celtics 1st ranked defense: 43.7 PPG (97.5)
1990 2nd Round, Sixers 16th ranked defense: 43.0 PPG (92.1)
1993 NBA Finals, Phoenix 7th ranked defense: 41.0 PPG (89.7)
1989 1st Round, Cavs 2nd ranked defense: 39.8 PPG (89.9)


Today's pace: 93.9

[Eric Cartman]

Ridiculous how much better Jordan is than any other player of all time :bowdown:

[pauk]

Meh, all scorers today would also have done that if they played with no real team defense, no zone / illegal defense... and they chucked 30-40 FGA like Jordan did...




lemme troll him damnit :P

[buddha]

MJ is the undisputed GOAT phorreal

his stans would be unbearable in the social media age, the thing is though we'd all be his stans.

[Paul George 24]

Meh, all scorers today would also have done that if they played with no real team defense, no zone / illegal defense... and they chucked 30-40 FGA like Jordan did...




lemme troll him damnit :P
DEFENCE 3 SECONDS ALLOW LEFLOP SCORES MUCH EASIER THAN BACK THEN

[3ball]

Meh, all scorers today would also have done that if they played with no real team defense, no zone / illegal defense... and they chucked 30-40 FGA like Jordan did...




lemme troll him damnit :P
:biggums:

[3ball]

no real team defense, no zone / illegal defense... and they chucked 30-40 FGA like Jordan did...

lemme troll him damnit :P


In the picture below, weakside floor-spreaders have drawn defenders away from the strongside.. If Noah doesn't leave #20 Mosgov and flood to the strongside, the strongside will only have 2 defenders on it.. This demonstrates how spacing necessitates flooding - defenders must flood BACK to the strongside (Noah), only because they were originally drawn away by floor-spreaders on the weakside (Mosgov)


http://i61.tinypic.com/2z7mnvm.png



Otoh, previous eras didn't have weakside floor-spreaders drawing defenders away from the strongside, so the strongside was usually ALREADY FLOODED with all 5 defenders, as seen below:


http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/54cd4db17a9330ca58b8e33a0b6f9b2f.gif


Without 3-point shooting, previous eras didn't have spacing or weakside floor-spreaders to draw defenders away from the strongside, so players faced more defenders on the strongside than today's game.. In today's game, weakside spacing ensures a more porous distribution of strongside defenders that prevents today's players from ever having to face a strongside with all 5 defenders on it (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11128077&postcount=21).

Accordingly, the stats of today's players should be downgraded appropriately, particularly the paint and at-rim efficiencies that benefited from the porous strongside defense.. It should also be noted that the porous spacing also allows today's players to take longer with decisions, while getting away with a weaker, less sophisticated repertoire and isolation ability (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=375397).
.

[oarabbus]

West, Baylor, Barry, and King did it as well


lmao at Wilt Chokerlain missing the list

[Eric Cartman]

lmao at Wilt Chokerlain missing the list

Only one of the Lakers big 3 not on it :(

[Mr Feeny]

.
MJ did it 6 times (the pace in each series shown in red):


1988 1st Round, Cavs 5th ranked defense: 45.2 PPG... (92.8 Pace)
1992 1st Round, Miami 25th ranked defense 45.0 PPG... (92.6)
1986 1st Round, Celtics 1st ranked defense: 43.7 PPG... (97.5)
1990 2nd Round, Sixers 16th ranked defense: 43.0 PPG... (92.1)
1993 NBA Finals, Phoenix 7th ranked defense: 41.0 PPG... (89.7)
1989 1st Round, Cavs 2nd ranked defense: 39.8 PPG... (89.9)


Today's pace: 93.9


Has anyone else ever averagd 40+ PPG in any playoff series ever?.. Or is it only MJ again?
.

Jerry West did it in the finals as well. Both he and MJ did that. It's just insane.

[Quickening]

What was league pace.... I don't care about the whole Bulls offence catering to MJ therefore lowering their pace.

[3ball]

What was league pace.... I don't care about the whole Bulls offence catering to MJ therefore lowering their pace.
when you're evaluating a specific player's PPG, the pace his team played is what's important - THAT'S the pace his PPG was achieved at.

[Prometheus]

3ball is the most dominant ISH poster I've ever seen. You can't even troll him - you think you're trolling him, but you're just setting him up to do what he came here to do. gg pauk, nice try, but you LOSE.

[SpanishACB]

3ball is the most dominant ISH poster I've ever seen. You can't even troll him - you think you're trolling him, but you're just setting him up to do what he came here to do. gg pauk, nice try, but you LOSE.

yeah but think about it, 3ball's agenda is proving the obvious

it's the most useless kind of determination

[Random_Guy]

and your point is 3ball? that mj is the best scorer ever? i dont see many people arguing that lol what are you trying to convince us of?

[DMV2]

I knew MJ did it but........GODDAMN! Six times?????

:bowdown:

[Prometheus]

and your point is 3ball? that mj is the best scorer ever? i dont see many people arguing that lol what are you trying to convince us of?

In today's game, weakside floor-spreaders draw defenders away from the strongside - this is a staple of any spacing strategy today.. The only reason Joakim Noah must strongside flood in the picture below is because floor-spreaders on the weakside (including #20 Mosgov) have drawn defenders to that side and left only 2 defenders on the strongside - if Joakim doesn't flood, the strongside will be left with only 2 defenders on it:


http://i61.tinypic.com/2z7mnvm.png



But in previous eras, all 5 defenders typically stayed on the strongside because there were no weakside floor-spreaders to draw them away.. With everyone already on the strongside, there was no need to flood anyone to that side - everyone was already there.. But in today's game, the spacing (particularly weakside floor-spreaders) necessitates flooding and shading to the strongside.


http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/54cd4db17a9330ca58b8e33a0b6f9b2f.gif


Today's player simply faces less defenders on the strongside than previous eras due to spacing and weakside floor-spreaders that draw defenders away from the strongside.. Today's player never faces a strongside with all 5 defenders on it (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11128077&postcount=21) because weakside spacing ensures a more porous distribution of strongside defenders..

Accordingly, the stats of today's players should be downgraded appropriately, particularly the paint and at-rim efficiencies that benefited from the porous strongside defense.. It should also be noted that the porous spacing also allows today's players to take longer with decisions, while getting away with a weaker, less sophisticated repertoire and isolation ability (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=375397).

[jzek]

Does anyone still need proof why Jordan is the GOAT?

How can anyone say LeBron or Kobe or anyone else over Jordan? :facepalm

[Marchesk]

3ball is the most dominant ISH poster I've ever seen. You can't even troll him - you think you're trolling him, but you're just setting him up to do what he came here to do. gg pauk, nice try, but you LOSE.

His navigational efficiency is off the charts. Dominant and efficient. Lebron can only be one at a time, but 3Ball, like his idol, is both at once.

[ILLsmak]

his stans would be unbearable in the social media age, the thing is though we'd all be his stans.

maybe, I think he would still have tons of haters. He had his bad moments, too. I think he would have a bunch of fans when he was just getting 40ppg and losing, but once he started being a dynasty player, they'd be like ehhh...

I think today's fan is much more full of hate than a fan in the 80s early 90s. Dudes were like... yeah I ****ing hate that dude cuz he kills my team, but I don't think they were like LOL MJ SUX on message boards. or like 1-9 LOL.

-Smak

[Kblaze8855]

If there are playoff game logs of Baylors early career I never see them. I know he put up like 38-39ppg in two playoff runs to the finals and West did 41 or 42 a game in the playoffs one season he ws out.. I dont think West did 40 in each series though.

Not 40ppg....but this is Kareem in the 1977 playoffs vs the Warriors:


WCSF vs Warriors
Game 1- 27 points, 16 rebounds, 7 assists, 3 blocks, 7/12 FT
Game 2- 40 points, 19 rebounds, 3 assists, 9 blocks, 4/6 FT
Game 3- 28 points, 14 rebounds, 7 assists, 4 blocks, 12/20 FG, 4/7 FT
Game 4- 41 points, 18 rebounds, 3 assists, 0 blocks, 11/16 FT
Game 5- 45 points, 18 rebounds, 3 assists, 3 blocks, 16/28 FG, 13/18 FT
Game 6- 43 points, 20 rebounds, 3 assists, 4 blocks, 17/25 FG, 9/11 FT
Game 7- 36 points, 26 rebounds, 0 blocks, 14/26 FG, 8/10 FT



He never really pushed his scoring the way he could have. I think he only had one 50 point game in his career but he would coast to 38-40 all the time. When he got old and some of the young stars thought they could handle him he embarrassed these dudes:



Having looked into it...he scored 40 on Hakeem in man to man coverage when he was 37 about to turn 38.

He scored 36 on 17-26 shooting when he was 38.

Next time they played he gave him 46/11 on 70% then then 43 on 68% shooting a couple weeks later. 14 days later he turned 39.

This is the LA times recap of the 46 point game:


Los Angeles Times:

While Akeem Olajuwon spent the whole game trying to steal the ball from Abdul-Jabbar, the Laker center spent the whole game throwing down a breathtaking series of hook shots on his way to a 46-point explosion.

For some reason, Rocket Coach Bill Fitch thinks it is a good idea to let Olajuwon go one-on-one with Abdul-Jabbar. It proved to be the biggest coaching blunder in any Laker game this season.

Abdul-Jabbar made 21 of 30 shots in 37 minutes to reach his high this season. He probably could have scored 50 points (his career high is 55) had he played any longer.



It was a 22 point blowout.


I feel like Ewing kinda got at him once and then Kareem gave him 44 or 46 the next time.

Kinda wish he were less laid back. Kareem could have done eye popping numbers most of his career(not that he didnt...but you know what I mean).

[3ball]

http://gifsforum.com/images_new/gif/other/grand/e026bdb37635f1d39f79bf0ad068f961.gif


It's interesting, because the lack of spacing and legal paint camping shown above often forced MJ to shoot repeated jumpshots, which he did at a truly elite level.. Even the great Jerry West thought MJ was the best jumpshooter in the game (2nd paragraph):

http://articles.latimes.com/1996-05-12/magazine/tm-3107_1_michael-jordan/4


Indeed, the best athlete in the game was also the best jumpshooter.. MJ routinely got 40, 50, 60 points on all jumpshots.

[Dro]

Ridiculous how much better Jordan is than any other player of all time :bowdown:
Goat gonna Goat and folks can't stand it..No point in fighting it any longer. Just embrace it..:bowdown:

Also, apparently people missed the white text in Pauk's post. Unless he edited it in later......

[Dro]

maybe, I think he would still have tons of haters. He had his bad moments, too. I think he would have a bunch of fans when he was just getting 40ppg and losing, but once he started being a dynasty player, they'd be like ehhh...

I think today's fan is much more full of hate than a fan in the 80s early 90s. Dudes were like... yeah I ****ing hate that dude cuz he kills my team, but I don't think they were like LOL MJ SUX on message boards. or like 1-9 LOL.

-Smak
I think this is true. This hater stuff is way worse now. I hated MJ too, figuratively speaking, because you could never stop him. It was more frustration than anything. Nowadays, kids act like they can't like Kobe AND Lebron AND Durant AND Westbrook. Its like they feel like they HAVE to pick sides...Why can't you just like them all?

[Dro]

If there are playoff game logs of Baylors early career I never see them. I know he put up like 38-39ppg in two playoff runs to the finals and West did 41 or 42 a game in the playoffs one season he ws out.. I dont think West did 40 in each series though.

Not 40ppg....but this is Kareem in the 1977 playoffs vs the Warriors:


WCSF vs Warriors
Game 1- 27 points, 16 rebounds, 7 assists, 3 blocks, 7/12 FT
Game 2- 40 points, 19 rebounds, 3 assists, 9 blocks, 4/6 FT
Game 3- 28 points, 14 rebounds, 7 assists, 4 blocks, 12/20 FG, 4/7 FT
Game 4- 41 points, 18 rebounds, 3 assists, 0 blocks, 11/16 FT
Game 5- 45 points, 18 rebounds, 3 assists, 3 blocks, 16/28 FG, 13/18 FT
Game 6- 43 points, 20 rebounds, 3 assists, 4 blocks, 17/25 FG, 9/11 FT
Game 7- 36 points, 26 rebounds, 0 blocks, 14/26 FG, 8/10 FT



He never really pushed his scoring the way he could have. I think he only had one 50 point game in his career but he would coast to 38-40 all the time. When he got old and some of the young stars thought they could handle him he embarrassed these dudes:





I feel like Ewing kinda got at him once and then Kareem gave him 44 or 46 the next time.

Kinda wish he were less laid back. Kareem could have done eye popping numbers most of his career(not that he didnt...but you know what I mean).
Yup, and this is why Kareem is 2nd goat of all time. I feel like everyone else in the top 10, pretty much achieved all they could. Kareem is the one I feel like always good have done more, but just didn't have that will I guess.....But he was still dominant...

[PsychoBe]

myplayer did on 2k.

[Kblaze8855]

Forums were full of idiots even back then...and this is from 1996...


Michael Jordan is not the best player to play game. In fact he was always
an overatted player. The only reason his PPG was so high was he is such
a BALLHOG. He is always taking contested double team shots insted of
passing to open teammates. Sure he hit a couple of great shots to win
series(Cleavland), but if he wasn't such a BALLHOG he wouldn't had to
take the game winning shots. This year just proves my point, his first
game back he takes 30 SHOTS???? Come on, he isn't that good, if anyone
should have been taking 30 shots that game, it should have been Reggie
Miller. He may have won three championships, but the 3 teams the Bulls
beat weren't that great. The Lakers were at the end of their Showtime
era and without Kareem and with Vlade when they were beet by the bulls.
The Portland Trail Blazers were show-stoppers either, the best team they
may have beaten was Phoenix. I would have liked to seen them beat some of
the Celtic, Laker, and Piston teams of the 1980's in finals.

[Dro]

Forums were full of idiots even back then...and this is from 1996...
Yeah, dude seems like a pure hater. Lol @ Reggie should have taken 30 shots. And Jordan being a ballhog especially during his title runs is one the biggest myths in NBA history probably. Jordan played within the team concept of the triangle and got his points generally in the flow. Those Bulls teams had great offensive continuity which you DON'T have if you have a ballhog on the team.....

[ClipperRevival]

His 41 ppg against Phx in the finals is impressive. To be that dominant at the biggest stage.

[Dro]

His 41 ppg against Phx in the finals is impressive. To be that dominant at the biggest stage.
And Phoenix was a great team. They beat anybody not named Chicago that year, I'd bet on it.

[livinglegend]

How many players ever averaged 20 RPG in a playoffs series?
Has Jordan ever done it?

[Dro]

How many players ever averaged 20 RPG in a playoffs series?
Has Jordan ever done it?
Bad analogy......

[Elosha]

It's seeing stats like this that make me wish Jordan hadn't retired in 94-95. I know why he did it after his father's death, but as a selfish fan, I regret missing two years of the GOAT's playoff performances.

[livinglegend]

Bad analogy......

How?
The greatest ever Russell was a great leader, rebounder, defender. Why should he be evaluated by the number of series with 40 ppg instead of 20 rpg?

[ClipperRevival]

And Phoenix was a great team. They beat anybody not named Chicago that year, I'd bet on it.

MJ prevented a lot of great teams and players from winning rings. The 90's Blazers team is one of the best teams ever not to win a ring. They made the finals in 1990 and 1992 and lost to a Laker team they should've beaten.

The Jazz of that era were the Spurs of this era. Always playing the right way and making few mistakes. They never beat themselves. The Sonics team were also stacked. And as you mentioned, the Suns teams.

[livinglegend]

MJ prevented a lot of great teams and players from winning rings. The 90's Blazers team is one of the best teams ever not to win a ring. They made the finals in 1990 and 1992 and lost to a Laker team they should've beaten.

The Jazz of that era were the Spurs of this era. Always playing the right way and making few mistakes. They never beat themselves. The Sonics team were also stacked. And as you mentioned, the Suns teams.

It's a team sport.
Bulls prevented a lot of great teams from winning rings.
Put MJ in a mediocre 90's team, he doesn't win anything.

[Dro]

How?
The greatest ever Russell was a great leader, rebounder, defender. Why should he be evaluated by the number of series with 40 ppg instead of 20 rpg?
Would Jordan ever have a fair change to grab 20rpg? No, he's a SG, he doesn't play right in front of the basket.

Now scoring? Everyone has equal opportunities to score if thats what you're best at. Whether its Wilt or Iverson, goat scorers are goat scorers period. And the most important thing in basketball, is putting the ball in the basket. A guy grabbing 20 rpg will never be as important to me as a guy shooting 50% and averaging 30-35 ppg. Yes, Russell grabbing 20 rpg is impressive but if weren't on the court, then those 20 rpg would probably be split up among 2-3 other players on the team with maybe a few missed rebounds going to the other team since Russell's not there.

Now tell me who's replacing Jordan's offensive output with that efficiency? And tell me who's putting more pressure on the other team, the guy you can't stop, or the guy grabbing rebounds?

[SamuraiSWISH]

If OKC had made the playoffs, Westbrook would have averaged 40 against the Warriors.
:rolleyes:

[Elosha]

It's a team sport.
Bulls prevented a lot of great teams from winning rings.
Put MJ in a mediocre 90's team, he doesn't win anything.

Sure Jordan was just a role player, a cog in the Bulls wheel. :rolleyes:

[livinglegend]

Would Jordan ever have a fair change to grab 20rpg? No, he's a SG, he doesn't play right in front of the basket.

Now scoring? Everyone has equal opportunities to score if thats what you're best at. Whether its Wilt or Iverson, goat scorers are goat scorers period. And the most important thing in basketball, is putting the ball in the basket. A guy grabbing 20 rpg will never be as important to me as a guy shooting 50% and averaging 30-35 ppg. Yes, Russell grabbing 20 rpg is impressive but if weren't on the court, then those 20 rpg would probably be split up among 2-3 other players on the team with maybe a few missed rebounds going to the other team since Russell's not there.

Now tell me who's replacing Jordan's offensive output with that efficiency? And tell me who's putting more pressure on the other team, the guy you can't stop, or the guy grabbing rebounds?

You could say the same for Jordan missing the court. His points will be split up among 2-3 other players on the team and maybe a few missed points.

[livinglegend]

Sure Jordan was just a role player, a cog in the Bulls wheel. :rolleyes:

Quote the line where I said that.

[livinglegend]

Would Jordan ever have a fair change to grab 20rpg? No, he's a SG, he doesn't play right in front of the basket.

Now scoring? Everyone has equal opportunities to score if thats what you're best at. Whether its Wilt or Iverson, goat scorers are goat scorers period. And the most important thing in basketball, is putting the ball in the basket. A guy grabbing 20 rpg will never be as important to me as a guy shooting 50% and averaging 30-35 ppg. Yes, Russell grabbing 20 rpg is impressive but if weren't on the court, then those 20 rpg would probably be split up among 2-3 other players on the team with maybe a few missed rebounds going to the other team since Russell's not there.

Now tell me who's replacing Jordan's offensive output with that efficiency? And tell me who's putting more pressure on the other team, the guy you can't stop, or the guy grabbing rebounds?

Are you telling me that if Jordan played center he would average 20 rpg? :biggums:
He would protect the rim like Russell did?

[Elosha]

Quote the line where I said that.

Perhaps you don't understand sarcasm. Go re-read your post and think about what you said.

[livinglegend]

Perhaps you don't understand sarcasm. Go re-read your post and think about what you said.

My post was well thought and I stand by it.
MJ without his teammates wouldn't win anything.
He had a great team around him. He was great, and his teammates and his GOAT coach were also great.
It's disrespecting his teammates and his coach when people say MJ prevented teams from winning championship.

[3ball]

Put MJ in a mediocre 90's team, he doesn't win anything.


That's exactly what the Bulls were - even the team that won the 55 games:

Take away the swagger of being defending 3-time champions and the chip on their shoulder to prove they could make it in the wild on their own and what do you have left??.. You have an ordinary 2nd round exit team that was a Toni Kukoc, walk-off prayer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NSpgbPcxoU), Ray Allen-style, from being down 3-0 and certainly swept..

Which is exactly like THIS year's Bulls' team when Rose hit that fool's gold of a lucky 3-pointer.. Both Bulls teams were just mediocre, 2nd round exit teams.. Plain and simple.