If the East is so weak why did prime Wade and Melo do nothing without HOFers

[Akrazotile]

At various points in the last half dozen plus years Wade and Carmelo were heralded as top 5 players, sometimes as high as top 3.

But aside from Wade's years with either Shaq still playing at a high level or Lebron, and for Carmelo its been the whole time, neither of these dudes can even come CLOSE to replicating Lebron's success in the conference, dragging mediocre (at best) rosters through the playoffs.

Melo and Wade are HOFers right. They were both considered top 3 at one point. If the conference is SO weak, how come they cant achieve anything on their own out there?

Same for HOFers like Bosh and Pierce before joining big threes.

HOFers in a "historically bad" conference and nobody can win in it except Lebron?

How friggin good does that make The King???

[PJR]

LeBron has won a championship without a Hall of Famer? When did this occur?

[kennethgriffin]

over a span of 12 years kobe beat

24 teams with 50+ wins to make 7 nba finals

over a span of 12 years lebron will have beatin

7 teams with 50+ wins to make 6 nba finals



the east sucks




NEXT

[Poetry]

how come they cant achieve anything on their own out there?

Wade won a ring without LeBron. LeBron hasn't won a ring without Wade.

[kennethgriffin]

Wade won a ring without LeBron. LeBron hasn't won a ring without Wade.


and both guys had shaq


a year before shaq got to cleveland wasnt he averaging like 18/10 on phoenix

thats about what he averaged in the 2006 finals

[Jameerthefear]

Why is OP such a moron

[Smoke117]

Because Wade played with a bunch of nobodies...players that barely had any business being in the NBA. Carmelo? He just wasn't that good. Naming him with Wade like they are on the same tier is just an insult. Marshmelo was never close to as good as Wade in his prime.

[Akrazotile]

LeBron has won a championship without a Hall of Famer? When did this occur?


I didnt say he won a chip without one. I said hes gotten to the finals without one, and is about to do it again, and has also gotten to a conference finals without one when he was like 23 years old and carrying a team on his back.

The East is supposed to be a cakewalk but guys like Wade, Pierce, and Melo never got to a conference finals without HOFers on their team. Lets not act like Alonzo Mourning playing backup on the Heat wasnt better than any starting center Bran has ever played with.

LOL @ "Well Wade got a ring doe." He won a chip woth a center who was second in the MVP voting the year before :biggums:

Wade's prime years were before Lebron got there, but as soon as Shaq was gone? He couldnt do squat in the playoffs. Was losing to teams like the Josh Smith Hawks.

[SouBeachTalents]

and both guys had shaq


a year before shaq got to cleveland wasnt he averaging like 18/10 on phoenix

thats about what he averaged in the 2006 finals

False, he averaged 14/10, a slight drop off from his 35/15 he was putting up in the '00-'02 Finals

[tpols]

Melo obviously isn't on wade or brons level..

And wade had shit teams late 2000s.. brons were at least slightly above average.. they took 2008 celtics to 7 games despite lebron having atrocious series.. and we're generally one of the best defense and rebounding teams. Nobody ever wants to acknowledge that doe.

[kennethgriffin]

False, he averaged 14/10, a slight drop off from his 35/15 he was putting up in the '00-'02 Finals

well if this was a debate with anyone other than lebron i'd bring up the "wade 20 fta's per game" thing that puts a big asterisk on the 2006 title


but this is a wade vs lebron discussion... and both get unfair treatment from the refs like no other in nba history

so its the only time i'l say "wades 2006 fmvp >>>>>>> either of lebrons"

[PJR]

LOL @ "Well Wade got a ring doe." He won a chip woth a center who was second in the MVP voting the year before :biggums:

Wade's prime years were before Lebron got there, but as soon as Shaq was gone? He couldnt do squat in the playoffs. Was losing to teams like the Josh Smith Hawks.

Wade's teams were awful and makeshift in 2009 and 10. The Heat were purposely sitting on contracts in preparation for the 2010 free agency.

You also conveniently left out that before Shaq's trade to Miami, Wade led the Heat to the playoffs as rookie(when he played with actual good players like Lamar Odom and Eddie Jones), and advanced past the first round. :confusedshrug:

Stop being stupid.

[Akrazotile]

Melo obviously isn't on wade or brons level..

And wade had shit teams late 2000s.. brons were at least slightly above average.. they took 2008 celtics to 7 games despite lebron having atrocious series.. and we're generally one of the best defense and rebounding teams. Nobody ever wants to acknowledge that doe.


Yeah, it's funny how guys suddenly become a lot better playing with Lebron, isnt it? Just ask Shump, JR and Mozgov. Or Delonte West, Boobie Gibson, and Donyell Marshall :oldlol:

[edrick]

and both guys had shaq


a year before shaq got to cleveland wasnt he averaging like 18/10 on phoenix

thats about what he averaged in the 2006 finals

lol Shaq was ****ing done, don't even compare Shaq in 2006 to the Shaq that Lebron played with. :roll:

[TheBigVeto]

At various points in the last half dozen plus years Wade and Carmelo were heralded as top 5 players, sometimes as high as top 3.

But aside from Wade's years with either Shaq still playing at a high level or Lebron, and for Carmelo its been the whole time, neither of these dudes can even come CLOSE to replicating Lebron's success in the conference, dragging mediocre (at best) rosters through the playoffs.

Melo and Wade are HOFers right. They were both considered top 3 at one point. If the conference is SO weak, how come they cant achieve anything on their own out there?

Same for HOFers like Bosh and Pierce before joining big threes.

HOFers in a "historically bad" conference and nobody can win in it except Lebron?

How friggin good does that make The King???

Wade and Melo aren't that good. And they are not future HoFers. The HoF should just be closed if they admit DWhistle in.

[Smoke117]

LOL @ "Well Wade got a ring doe." He won a chip woth a center who was second in the MVP voting the year before :biggums:



You are such a dumb bastard. What the hell does the MVP voting in 2005 have to do with the 2006 season? In the 2006 season Wade was 6th in MVP voting and Shaq wasn't even in contention. How can the MVP voting of the year before possibly matter more than the MVP voting of the actual season? You lebron dick sucking f*ggot.

[PJR]

Wade and Melo aren't that good. And they are not future HoFers. The HoF should just be closed if they admit DWhistle in.

Why do you post nothing but stupid shit? Every time I peep your post it's just nonsensical, off the wall shit.

Shut up, b.

[3ball]

over a span of 12 years kobe beat

24 teams with 50+ wins to make 7 nba finals

over a span of 12 years lebron will have beatin

7 teams with 50+ wins to make 6 nba finals



the east sucks


THIS

It's amazing that Lebron has only beaten 7 teams with 50+ wins in his entire playoff career, compared to 24 for Kobe... THAT'S how much worse the East is.

here's a detailed, informative thread showing all the 50+ win teams beaten by both players:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=336347

[PJR]

You are such a dumb bastard. What the hell does the MVP voting in 2005 have to do with the 2006 season? In the 2006 season Wade was 6th in MVP voting and Shaq wasn't even in contention. How can the MVP voting of the year before possibly matter more than the MVP voting of the actual season? You lebron dick sucking f*ggot.

LOL. Rekt.

[Wade's Rings]

and both guys had shaq


a year before shaq got to cleveland wasnt he averaging like 18/10 on phoenix

thats about what he averaged in the 2006 finals

Shaq averaged 13/10 in the NBA Finals. He was a net negative and missed crucial minutes in the 4th sitting on the bench.

Stop it!!!

[Wade's Rings]

well if this was a debate with anyone other than lebron i'd bring up the "wade 20 fta's per game" thing that puts a big asterisk on the 2006 title


but this is a wade vs lebron discussion... and both get unfair treatment from the refs like no other in nba history

so its the only time i'l say "wades 2006 fmvp >>>>>>> either of lebrons"

Kobe had a series averaging 16 FTA per Game= Wade's 2006 Finals FTA
He also had another averaging 15 FTA in 2001.

So Wade's had 1 Series averaging 15+ FTA while Kobe has had 2.

Kobe= Asterik Title & Asterik Finals Appearance.

[tpols]

Yeah, it's funny how guys suddenly become a lot better playing with Lebron, isnt it? Just ask Shump, JR and Mozgov. Or Delonte West, Boobie Gibson, and Donyell Marshall :oldlol:

Dude jr was going off with bron out the game.. he was just hitting everything, hand in face and all. Lebron literally wasn't even in the game or setting him up lol


and yea bran makes role playing shooters better than just about anybody ever.. problem is he limits fellow stars.. so it balances out.

[Poetry]

Yeah, it's funny how guys suddenly become a lot better playing with Lebron, isnt it? Just ask Shump, JR and Mozgov. Or Delonte West, Boobie Gibson, and Donyell Marshall :oldlol:

With LeBron it can go either way. Some play better and some play worse.

JR was already part of several 50+ win seasons. Former sixth man of the year. Has averaged near 15 points per the last 7 season coming off the bench.

Donyell was much better pre-LeBron.

Shump and Mozgov are about the same, except now they're on a better team with better teammates.

[bobeticus]

over a span of 12 years kobe beat

24 teams with 50+ wins to make 7 nba finals

over a span of 12 years lebron will have beatin

7 teams with 50+ wins to make 6 nba finals



the east sucks




NEXT


first 3peat as Sidekick with Shaq

second 2peat as Sidekick with Pau

Greatest Sidekick of All Time (GSOAT) :rockon: :rockon: :rockon:

[Dresta]

I didnt say he won a chip without one. I said hes gotten to the finals without one, and is about to do it again, and has also gotten to a conference finals without one when he was like 23 years old and carrying a team on his back.

The East is supposed to be a cakewalk but guys like Wade, Pierce, and Melo never got to a conference finals without HOFers on their team. Lets not act like Alonzo Mourning playing backup on the Heat wasnt better than any starting center Bran has ever played with.

LOL @ "Well Wade got a ring doe." He won a chip woth a center who was second in the MVP voting the year before :biggums:

Wade's prime years were before Lebron got there, but as soon as Shaq was gone? He couldnt do squat in the playoffs. Was losing to teams like the Josh Smith Hawks.
This is such a redundant argument. 05 Shaq was a lot, lot better than 06 Shaq, and 06 finals Shaq (and 07 Shaq) was a downright defensive liability, who made 30% of his fts in the finals (and who sat as Miami closed out with him on the bench in game 6). See, not MVP candidate material:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/200606200DAL.html

Arguing otherwise is pure frivolity and foolishness. Oh, and Wade didn't get out of the first round in 09-10 because Miami were effectively tanking those seasons for 2010 free agency (and how did that work out? It's amazing how Bron worshippers will bring up these years when they were deliberately sacrificed to build a championship team 11-14, which were the only years in Bron's career when he's ever looked like winning a ring). How hard is that to understand, seriously?

No one played better than Wade against the 10 Celtics (11 Celtics too actually), and yet Miami still lost in 5 (because his team was god-awful), but that was for a reason very obvious to anyone that didn't first start paying attention to the Miami Heat once Lebron James was there.

[sd3035]

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Op_452d34_5378697.jpg

[greatest-ever]

Ok first of all Melo was never a top 3 player and probably never top 5. And second, Wade was playing with scrubs from 08-10 his teams weren't good at all.

[Leroy Jetson]

THIS

It's amazing that Lebron has only beaten 7 teams with 50+ wins in his entire playoff career, compared to 24 for Kobe... THAT'S how much worse the East is.

here's a detailed, informative thread showing all the 50+ win teams beaten by both players:

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=336347
How many has Duncan beaten? Gotta be close to Kobe.

[Akrazotile]

Ok first of all Melo was never a top 3 player and probably never top 5. And second, Wade was playing with scrubs from 08-10 his teams weren't good at all.


Certainly I never thought so, but we really gonna act like MOST average fans here didnt argue he was top 5, even top 3 at one point? Cmon man. A lot of people were saying that a couple years ago when Anthony was a supposed "MVP candidate."

[greatest-ever]

Certainly I never thought so, but we really gonna act like MOST average fans here didnt argue he was top 5, even top 3 at one point? Cmon man. A lot of people were saying that a couple years ago when Anthony was a supposed "MVP candidate."
Ive never heard Melo argued as a top 3 player. And even if some ppl did who cares? No knowledgeable fan would argue Melo was ever a top 3 player. I think in 2013 he was in the 5-7 range at best. He wasn't close to top 5 in 2011, 12, or 14. Prime Wade when healthy was consistently a top 2-5 player. Melo was never close to having prime Wade's impact.

[dh144498]

what has lebron won without another HOF?

:coleman:

[ISHGoat]

what has lebron won without another HOF?

:coleman:

how did his HOF teammate play in their championship runs? I bet he averaged like 20/5/5 over those 4 years. Pretty pedestrian for a HOFer. Certainly nothing like peak shaq or gasol putting up 20/10/4/2blk every game with amazing defense.

[Tking714]

Their teams were the reason the East was so weak. Think

[iamgine]

After winning the championship in 05-06, suddenly the next season Wade's best teammates declined hard. In particular Shaq, Walker and Mourning. Hardly a surprise though since they were old and had accomplished their goal. Wade himself was still spectacular.

[Wade's Rings]

how did his HOF teammate play in their championship runs? I bet he averaged like 20/5/5 over those 4 years. Pretty pedestrian for a HOFer. Certainly nothing like peak shaq or gasol putting up 20/10/4/2blk every game with amazing defense.

LeBron Stans underrating Wade's Impact. It goes deeper than his numbers.

[PJR]

how did his HOF teammate play in their championship runs? I bet he averaged like 20/5/5 over those 4 years. Pretty pedestrian for a HOFer. Certainly nothing like peak shaq or gasol putting up 20/10/4/2blk every game with amazing defense.

You mean the same Hall of Fame teammate that put up 26-7-5 on 55% shooting in the 2011 Finals while LBJ was outscored by a 6th man, and scored 8 points in game 4?

Let's not go there.

[Droid101]

False, he averaged 14/10, a slight drop off from his 35/15 he was putting up in the '00-'02 Finals
No, he was averaging 18/8 on Phoenix just before he went to the Cavs.