So is Lebrons dominance in this era = Russell in the 60s?

[ISHGoat]

I mean, we all see the haters discrediting his conference, etc.

Back when Russell played, there were even less teams than in the EC, so when Russell wins a chip, it's basically like winning 2/3 rounds (first round bye lol), which lebron has just done for the 5th consecutive time, in pretty convincing fashion.

Does this mean that lebron, relative to his conference and peers, Is as dominant and impactful as Russell was in the 60s?

[sportjames23]

Um, nope. Because, even though there were less teams back then, at least Russell DID dominate.

I mean, 11/13 vs 2/5. Really?

C'mon, son.

[keep-itreal]

Um, nope. Because, even though there were less teams back then, at least Russell DID dominate.

I mean, 11/13 vs 2/5. Really?

C'mon, son.

/thread

[Dresta]

:lol

The man has won 2 titles.

[dynasty1978]

11 seasons, 2 championships.

So no, not even close to the dominance of Russell.

Or Jordan.
Or Magic.
Or Duncan......and so on

[ISHGoat]

Um, nope. Because, even though there were less teams back then, at least Russell DID dominate.

I mean, 11/13 vs 2/5. Really?

C'mon, son.
The point is that winning the finals back then is equivalent to winning your conference today, due to the amount of teams and rounds of playoffs you had to go through. Lebron is like 6/7 in the conference finals, which is pretty dominant

[Dresta]

The point is that winning the finals back then is equivalent to winning your conference today, due to the amount of teams and rounds of playoffs you had to go through. Lebron is like 6/7 in the conference finals, which is pretty dominant
No it isn't. Has nothing to do with the overall number of teams, and everything to do with the respective talent pools (and most of the league's talent right now is in the opposite conference to Bron). Russell massacred his competition, Bron has had very little of that in the East, and he's only 2 for 5 in the finals (with two god-awful performances to boot).

[ISHGoat]

No it isn't. Has nothing to do with the overall number of teams, and everything to do with the respective talent pools (and most of the league's talent right now is in the opposite conference to Bron). Russell massacred his competition, Bron has had very little of that in the East, and he's only 2 for 5 in the finals (with two god-awful performances to boot).

sounds like what would happen to russell if he had to play a fourth round, which he never had to do

[Magic 32]

I mean, we all see the haters discrediting his conference, etc.

Back when Russell played, there were even less teams than in the EC, so when Russell wins a chip, it's basically like winning 2/3 rounds (first round bye lol), which lebron has just done for the 5th consecutive time, in pretty convincing fashion.

Does this mean that lebron, relative to his conference and peers, Is as dominant and impactful as Russell was in the 60s?

I think Russell also won the finals.

[Dresta]

sounds like what would happen to russell if he had to play a fourth round, which he never had to do
No, it sounds like you've got some kind of brain damage (seriously).

[Marchesk]

Russell's team was busy keeping Wilt's team out of the finals. That would be like Lebron's team keeping Jordan's team out. Russell had to contend with the most dominant player of his era, and maybe all-time. Who has Lebron had to contend with on that kind of level? Duncan is the only one that comes to mind, and that's in the finals.

[SexSymbol]

When there's less teams the talent is not spred thin like today. Imagine if there were 8-12 teams today, you'd have some teams with rosters like
PG - Westbrook
SG - Kobe
SF - Durant
PF - Love
C - Gasol
And it would be very normal.
It was harder to get to the finals back them, then it is now, especially in the joke of a conference that is the east

[ISHGoat]

When there's less teams the talent is not spred thin like today. Imagine if there were 8-12 teams today, you'd have some teams with rosters like
PG - Westbrook
SG - Kobe
SF - Durant
PF - Love
C - Gasol
And it would be very normal.
It was harder to get to the finals back them, then it is now, especially in the joke of a conference that is the east

More like
PG - 5'10 australian guy (real job: accountant)
SG - 6'0 thug (real job: drug dealer)
SF - 6'3 black guy with flat top hair (2 felonies)
PF - 6'6 canadian guy (sucked so bad he switched shooting hands)
C - top 5 goat

sound familiar?

[BigTicket]

Russell had an incredible run obviously, but he also played on the most stacked teams of all time.

If you look at Russell as an individual, does anyone believe he was better than Duncan or Hakeem ?

[Marchesk]

More like
PG - 5'10 australian guy (real job: accountant)
SG - 6'0 thug (real job: drug dealer)
SF - 6'2 black guy (2 felonies)
PF - 6'6 canadian guy
C - Russell

1961/62 Roster:

PG - 6'1 Bob Cousy
SG - 6'4 Sam Jones
SF - 6'6 Tom Sanders
PF - 6'7 Tom Heinson
C - 6'10 Bill Russell
6th Man - 6'5 Havliceck

[kshutts1]

I mean, we all see the haters discrediting his conference, etc.

Back when Russell played, there were even less teams than in the EC, so when Russell wins a chip, it's basically like winning 2/3 rounds (first round bye lol), which lebron has just done for the 5th consecutive time, in pretty convincing fashion.

Does this mean that lebron, relative to his conference and peers, Is as dominant and impactful as Russell was in the 60s?
Getting sick and tired of this "less teams" argument.

Less teams means the talent is LESS dispersed, LESS diluted. So Russell, while having multiple HOF players on his roster, was constantly facing teams that also fielded multiple HOF players, or multiple AS-quality players.

Lebron has faced zero HOF quality opponents in the playoffs this year. Not to detract from what Lebron has done, because it's remarkable, but let's at least put it in context.

[Duncan21formvp]

Lebron isn't even as dominant as I was. I beat him twice in the finals. Lebron also lost with HCA in the finals as well to a German.

[Psileas]

Back when Russell played, there were even less teams than in the EC, so when Russell wins a chip, it's basically like winning 2/3 rounds (first round bye lol), which lebron has just done for the 5th consecutive time, in pretty convincing fashion.

So, if LeBron was given a first round bye and had to play 1 or even, at times, 2 rounds less every year, would this somehow make him more capable of beating the Spurs in 2007, '14 or the Mavs in 2011? :rolleyes:
Not to mention that having to play so many less games would butcher his "totals"/"longevity" records, upon which he bases so much of his legacy. Heck, it would also butcher his averages. LeBron can only be thankful that he has more rounds to play, especially in the East.

[Pointguard]

The point is that winning the finals back then is equivalent to winning your conference today, due to the amount of teams and rounds of playoffs you had to go through. Lebron is like 6/7 in the conference finals, which is pretty dominant
So what do that make Duncan??? Magic in the most competitive era??? He was no where near as dominant as Shaq. Jordan was unbeatable once he got going. Lebron has a finals where he didn't play to win, and got dominated three times at the championship level. And nobody would be surprised if it was four. He's not on these guys level at all. He's great no doubt, but not dominant in winning like guys even in his era.

[kennethgriffin]

2004 - misses playoffs
2005 - misses playoffs
2006 - spanked
2007 - swept in finals
2008 - spanked
2009 - spanked by orlando
2010 - spanked by boston
2011 - shit the bed in the finals
2012 - lockout title colluding/ring chasing
2013 - lost the finals (ray allen saves the day)
2014 - quit the finals due to cramped ovaries
2015 - spanked in the finals by the warriors



Russell-esq

[ISHGoat]

2004 - misses playoffs
2005 - misses playoffs
2006 - spanked
2007 - swept in finals
2008 - spanked
2009 - spanked by orlando
2010 - spanked by boston
2011 - shit the bed in the finals
2012 - lockout title colluding/ring chasing
2013 - lost the finals (ray allen saves the day)
2014 - quit the finals due to cramped ovaries
2015 - spanked in the finals by the warriors



Russell-esq


mods please ban this scum

[CavaliersFTW]

As far as 60's players impact is concerned Lebrons pace right now in this era is closest to Jerry-West-like though slightly better success rate at actually winning once the Finals has been made (currently has 2 titles, to West's 1).

He's making a few finals but he's not winning all of them. He's nowhere close to Bill Russell in terms of winning - literally not even close.

He's also not comparable to Wilt who similarly to West, was making Finals/ECF but not winning all of them but the reason Lebron isn't comparable to him because he isn't shattering records and carving his name into the record books.

So winning/Finals appearances+impact on the floor/stats combo I'd say he's pretty much closest to Jerry West was in the 1960's though even then one needs to acknowledge Jerry West's playoff career statistically was superior even relatively speaking despite not winning the extra title Lebron has over him.

[Ne 1]

mods please ban this scum
Pot says to kettle.

[dubeta]

As far as 60's players impact is concerned Lebron right now in this era is closest to Jerry-West-like though slightly better success rate at actually winning once the Finals has been made (currently has 2 titles, to West's 1).

He's making a few finals but he's not winning all of them. He's nowhere close to Bill Russell in terms of winning - literally not even close.

He's also not comparable to Wilt who similarly to West, was making Finals/ECF but not winning all of them but the reason Lebron isn't comparable to him because he isn't shattering records and carving his name into the record books.

So winning/Finals appearances+impact on the floor/stats combo I'd say he's pretty much closest to Jerry West was in the 1960's though even then one needs to acknowledge Jerry West's playoff career statistically was superior even relatively speaking despite not winning the extra title Lebron has over him.


Lol so 2/5 lebron is comparable to 1/9 West, yet somehow 2/6 Wilt is GOAT?? :oldlol:


These 60's era stans are something else


Yet keep telling us how Wilts 18 ppg finals average 'broke records'

[CavaliersFTW]

Lol so 2/5 lebron is comparable to 1/9 West, yet somehow 2/6 Wilt is GOAT?? :oldlol:


These 60's era stans are something else


Yet keep telling us how Wilts 18 ppg finals average 'broke records'
Titles is a fun angle to play if only the record books and physical basketball abilities didn't exist.

[dubeta]

Titles is a fun angle to play if only the record books and physical basketball abilities didn't exist.


60's basketball is an even better angle to play

Competition = car salesmen

[CavaliersFTW]

60's basketball is an even better angle to play

Competition = car salesmen
A car salesmen:

http://vlsportysexycool.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/blake-griffin-kia.jpg

Not a car salesmen:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IlubSSwQ0yY/UPzbjLxgbzI/AAAAAAAAFUU/vJgiArJZlLU/s800/Nate%252520Thurmond1.jpg

[ISHGoat]

A car salesmen:

http://vlsportysexycool.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/blake-griffin-kia.jpg

Not a car salesmen:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IlubSSwQ0yY/UPzbjLxgbzI/AAAAAAAAFUU/vJgiArJZlLU/s800/Nate%252520Thurmond1.jpg

thats lebrons dad

[ImKobe]

lol

Duncan won 3 rings since Bran entered the league, Kobe 2

Bran doesn't even have the most titles in his own ****ing era, at least Kobe and Duncan won 5, Shaq won 4...Wade even took a team to a title before him....

Overrated.

[i<3basketball]

2004 - misses playoffs
2005 - misses playoffs
2006 - spanked
2007 - swept in finals
2008 - spanked
2009 - spanked by orlando
2010 - spanked by boston
2011 - shit the bed in the finals
2012 - lockout title colluding/ring chasing
2013 - lost the finals (ray allen saves the day)
2014 - quit the finals due to cramped ovaries
2015 - spanked in the finals by the warriors



Russell-esq
2004 - destroyed lakers
2005 - misses playoffs
2006 - epic comeback by suns
2007 - spank by suns again
2008 - spanked by boston
2009 - carried by gasol
2010 - carried by gasol, artest , and fisher
2011 - shit the bed against dallas
2012 - spanked again
2013 - irrelevant
2014 - irrelevant
2015 - irrelevant

[kennethgriffin]

2004 - destroyed lakers
2005 - misses playoffs
2006 - epic comeback by suns
2007 - spank by suns again
2008 - spanked by boston
2009 - carried by gasol
2010 - carried by gasol, artest , and fisher
2011 - shit the bed against dallas
2012 - spanked again
2013 - irrelevant
2014 - irrelevant
2015 - irrelevant


I didnt lie. You did


Lebron really did win in a lockout.
Lebron really did ring chase
Lebron really did get saved by ray allen


I never made things up like "lebron was carried"
Na lebron won the finals mvps. How was he carried

Kobe was too both times.

And whyd you skip half of kobes career lmao

You forgot

2000 nba champs - wcf game 7 mvp ( real nba finals )
2001nba champs - 29/7/6 playoffs
2002 nba champs - 27/6/5 playoffs

No lockouts
No ring chasing



So 5 big time titles without cheating

Lebron = 1.5 titles with cheating

[ImKobe]

2004 - lost to a better team in the Finals
2005 - injured, no system, scrub teammates
2006 - takes the best offense of his era to 7 games
2007 - lost to a much superior opponent
2008 - lost to a better team in the Finals
2009 - dominant championship run, FMVP
2010 - dominant championship run, FMVP
2011 - injured, Pau disappeared, Pjax got cancer
2012 - lost to a much superior opponent
2013 - carried an injured roster to the Playoffs
2014 - season-ending injury
2015 - season-ending injury

PS: I'm a fakkit

Agreed.

[inclinerator]

didnt they only play like 3 games back then

[i<3basketball]

I didnt lie. You did


Lebron really did win in a lockout.
Lebron really did ring chase
Lebron really did get saved by ray allen


I never made things up like "lebron was carried"
Na lebron won the finals mvps. How was he carried

Kobe was too both times.

And whyd you skip half of kobes career lmao

You forgot

2000 nba champs - wcf game 7 mvp ( real nba finals )
2001nba champs - 29/7/6 playoffs
2002 nba champs - 27/6/5 playoffs

No lockouts
No ring chasing



So 5 big time titles without cheating

Lebron = 1.5 titles with cheating

you're out of your mind man. Even if Lebron did ring chase or ray allen saved his career, he was still the best player on his team and they needed every single bit of lebron. If lebron wasn't on the heat, they would go nowhere. So all i'm saying is regardless of lockout or ring chasing he still won. So give credit to where credit is due and appreciate a once in a lifetime player who took his team to the finals 5 straight years and you have to admit it is impressive.

[G0ATbe]

I'll admit they're similar. Russell played in a weak ass era on the most stacked team. Bald plays in a weak ass conference on the most stacked. Difference is Russell doesn't have a losing record in the finals and isn't remembered as a choke artist like lebald will be.

2/6

[TheMan]

mods please ban this scum
:coleman: If mods are gonna ban KennethGriffin, they might as well ban you to for even trying to compare LeBron's "dominance" to Russell's :facepalm