Is this legit the greatest run of all time?

[ISHGoat]

3rd option out since first round
2nd option hobbled since first round and out for half of ECF and basically all of finals

Averaging 30/11/8/2/1 for the entire playoffs and stepping it up BIG TIME to basically a 40 point triple double in the finals.

Beating a 67 win team with the reigning MVP that posted the best defense in the RS and PO.

Is this ring worth double?

[BlakFrankWhite]

Yes ofcourse


Inb4 some retard says....but but jordan

[imdaman99]

It's a nice run but relax. Don't bust your load before it's even ended, fool. All I see is thread after thread from you meanwhile you were MIA after game 1. Why is that? Is frontrunning a fun thing? Should I join in?

[Rocketswin2013]

It's as impressive as it gets.

[ISHGoat]

It's a nice run but relax. Don't bust your load before it's even ended, fool. All I see is thread after thread from you meanwhile you were MIA after game 1. Why is that? Is frontrunning a fun thing? Should I join in?

I guess frontronning and being a lebron fan are synonymous cos we always in front my niggah

[Doranku]

It might be the most impressive FINALS win ever.

But overall playoff run? Nah, the East was too bad. Nothing will ever compare to Hakeem's run in '95 imo.

[riseagainst]

just by the finals alone, it's worth 5 rings.

[LAZERUSS]

Just curious...

if the Warriors rout the Cavs in the next three games, will this still be considered a great accomplishment?

[Fudge]

IF he gets it done this year and beats a considerably much more talented team, with one of the weakest supporting casts ever, it probably surpasses Hakeem's run in '95 for me. They're almost neck and neck in terms of pure production.

[Magic 32]

The new trend for Lebron stans.

Never mention fg%...ever.

40% playoff run.

36 shots per game in the finals.

Obscene.

[Doranku]

IF he gets it done this year and beats a considerably much more talented team, with one of the weakest supporting casts ever, it probably surpasses Hakeem's run in '95 for me. They're almost neck and neck in terms of pure production.

Hakeem's '95 first round opponent was the Malone/Stockton Jazz who won 60 games. Better than any team LeBron has faced in these playoffs including the Warriors.

And that was just his first round opponent...

[ISHGoat]

Just curious...

if the Warriors rout the Cavs in the next three games, will this still be considered a great accomplishment?

absolutely not.

although the manner in which you win and lose is important, his legacy hinges on securing the championship and not just posting insane stats.

even if he goes 20/5/5 for the remainder of the series and cavs still win, he will become a legend and they will build statues for him

[ISHGoat]

Hakeem's '95 first round opponent was the Malone/Stockton Jazz who won 60 games. Better than any team LeBron has faced in these playoffs including the Warriors.

And that was just his first round opponent...

youre right, so lebron should tank the regular season so he can face the #1 seed every time so people won't say his opposition was weak in the first round

how is it any different facing the jazz in the first round or in the ECF? would lebron's run be more impressive if he faced the hawks in the first round and the bulls in the ECF instead?

[Doranku]

youre right, so lebron should tank the regular season so he can face the #1 seed every time so people won't say his opposition was weak in the first round

how is it any different facing the jazz in the first round or in the ECF? would lebron's run be more impressive if he faced the hawks in the first round and the bulls in the ECF instead?

It doesn't matter what seed the Cavs get in the East. ALL the other teams are trash, it doesn't matter what order he faces them in. WTF are you talking about?

You act like it's exclusively the Jazz who are better than what LeBron has faced. No... Barkley's Suns, Robinson's Spurs, and Shaq's Magic are all EASILY better than anything LeBron played in the East and arguably better than the Warriors.

The competition simply doesn't compare. No amount of mental gymnastics is going to change that, sorry bud. Like I said, it might be the most impressive finals victory tho.

[tpols]

Not even close.. 2011 mavs faced a way tougher road and won in dramatic fashion.

[ImKobe]

only having to play one contender all run is what it is.

dude's getting away with taking 36 shots a game and making barely 40% of them

Warriors have been ice cold from deep for most of the series, which is what's keeping Cleveland alive so far.

Warriors in 7.

[dazzer87]

lol people forget that team in Dallas that went on that amazing run in 2011... :roll:

[riseagainst]

this run is far better than any run kobe has ever had.

[Ne 1]

The new trend for Lebron stans.

Never mention fg%...ever.

40% playoff run.

36 shots per game in the finals.

Obscene.

This. We will never hear the Player takes X shots for Y points argument again by these efficiency elitists. This is actually team perfectly suited for a high-usage ball dominant/high volume shooting star player.

Also, you can't neglect the fact that basketball is played on both ends of the floor or at like the Cavs have some below average, run of the mill role players when Tristan Thompson is playing like Dennis Rodman and Delly is playing like Sidney Moncrief. Mozgov is playing like an elite rim protector right now, looking like Dwight in the post and Tristan Thompson might be the best offensive rebounder in the NBA, which is a huge key giving the Cavs so many second chance points. Shumpert is a good defender on the perimeter. You can't neglect that the Cavs defense have held the Warriors to 39 and 40% shooting in the games they won after 48% in regular season and have made the league MVP look so mediocre. Smith, Shumpert, James Jones, and Delladova are all very good 3P shooters also.

[Ne 1]

Hakeem's '95 first round opponent was the Malone/Stockton Jazz who won 60 games. Better than any team LeBron has faced in these playoffs including the Warriors.

And that was just his first round opponent...

Yeah, Hakeem's 1995 run in route to a championship is more impressive to me than any other individual run in history to me actually. The '95 Rockets were actually weaker overalll than the '94 team and at the same time, they faced stiffer competition (60 win teams starting in the first round), even though he had a better "#2 option", the overall team was weaker. 33/10/5 averages throughout the playoffs.

35/9/4 vs Jazz, 30/9/4 vs Suns, 35/13/5 vs Spurs, 33/12/6 vs Magic.

He put up arguably the greatest series performance ever in the WCF where he tore 'MVP' David Robinson a new asshole. Robinson was completely dominated...Impressive Finals against Shaq too.

[DukeDelonte13]

Bulls were arguably as good or better than any of the hobbled teams GSW faced in the playoffs. Let's not act like they went through the healthy thunder or spurs.

[ZMonkey11]

Impressive? Yes.

But lets get this whole "Golden State is a much better team" part cleared up. Both their best players have had concussions RECENTLY. And Golden State never played out in my mind as a team that could win the championship this year. No experience and Curry is not ready to lead a team. If he wins this year, there is a huge asterisk because every team he went through was injured.

Curry has shrank when they needed him most. Were his 3s big last night? Yes. But that was to make up for his shotty play all game.

[FLDFSU]

Impressive? Yes.

But lets get this whole "Golden State is a much better team" part cleared up. Both their best players have had concussions RECENTLY. And Golden State never played out in my mind as a team that could win the championship this year. No experience and Curry is not ready to lead a team. If he wins this year, there is a huge asterisk because every team he went through was injured.

Curry has shrank when they needed him most. Were his 3s big last night? Yes. But that was to make up for his shotty play all game.

:roll: :roll: Here it comes...

"2012-2013 equals weak era" 2014 is a good era but "2015 equals weak era"

I wonder why that is...:roll: :roll:

[funnystuff]

Just curious...

if the Warriors rout the Cavs in the next three games, will this still be considered a great accomplishment?
No, the Warriors are still the favorites.

[ZMonkey11]

:roll: :roll: Here it comes...

"2012-2013 equals weak era" 2014 is a good era but "2015 equals weak era"

I wonder why that is...:roll: :roll:

Look man, just watching as a spectator. This is a pretty bad finals we are watching. If you don't agree, I don't know what to say.

Doesn't look like either team is running any plays or getting coached. Bron is doing EVERYTHING for a team that doesn't have another player that could sniff an All-Star team. Golden States MVP is shooting for shit and made up his FG% last night off 3s that didn't really matter. The Golden State defense, which was so highly vaunted, can't stop one man.

How is this NOT a weak Finals? I have nothing against 2012-2013. The Heat earned it. I have a thing against the 2013-2014 championship because the Spurs obviously deserved it.

Do I think this era is weaker than say the 80s? Yes. The 90s? Probably not. But we've pussified the league. Stern has went ahead and said that. But from mid 90s on, I would never say this age got weaker. The game changed. The floor is spread. We can't breathe on each other, literally, or it's a technical.

I have nothing against 2010 on. So here we go with nothing. Its a shitty finals man.

[Chadwin]

no, Hakeem or Dirk

[BlazerRed]

Beating GSW would be super impressive, but I don't count the first three rounds. The East blows.. like.. really bad.

[Tmuston Beltics]

I am amused. One of the best playoff runs I have ever seen. He is truly playing like the King right now!

[TrueBlue89]

Beating GSW would be super impressive, but I don't count the first three rounds. The East blows.. like.. really bad.
Except the Bulls were 2-1 up in the series & were a LeBron GW away from taking a 3-1 lead. Perhaps Warriors are fortunate enough not to be 3-0 down right now & facing elimination tomorrow.

Perhaps LeBron is just this great rather than the complete history revision whenever he wins.

[ZMonkey11]

And to clarify, I am an IsiahThomasstan and Detroitstan. Not Cleveland, not Miami, Not LeBeej, Not Kobrick.

The closest I'd get to stanning a player in this era was KD, but he's got this tough guy attitude I'm not really respecting.

I'd stan a Detroit player, but I can't really brag them up any. :confusedshrug:

[Magic 32]

Except the Bulls were 2-1 up in the series & were a LeBron GW away from taking a 3-1 lead.

How did the Bulls get back in that game by the way?

[DukeDelonte13]

ITT fans of western teams that blow living vicariously through their conference.

[Hey Yo]

This. We will never hear the Player takes X shots for Y points argument again by these efficiency elitists. This is actually team perfectly suited for a high-usage ball dominant/high volume shooting star player.

Also, you can't neglect the fact that basketball is played on both ends of the floor or at like the Cavs have some below average, run of the mill role players when Tristan Thompson is playing like Dennis Rodman and Delly is playing like Sidney Moncrief. Mozgov is playing like an elite rim protector right now, looking like Dwight in the post and Tristan Thompson might be the best offensive rebounder in the NBA, which is a huge key giving the Cavs so many second chance points. Shumpert is a good defender on the perimeter. You can't neglect that the Cavs defense have held the Warriors to 39 and 40% shooting in the games they won after 48% in regular season and have made the league MVP look so mediocre. Smith, Shumpert, James Jones, and Delladova are all very good 3P shooters also.
Yet, even after losing last night, Golden St. is still considered the favorites in the series.

[TrueBlue89]

This run is easily better than Dirk's. His supporting cast of Jason Terry, Kidd, Marion & Chandler would all be starters on this hobbled up Cavs team.

Hakeem in 94 was amazing but this Warriors team would destroy that 55 Knicks team who's second option was literally a bag boy.

[FLDFSU]

Look man, just watching as a spectator. This is a pretty bad finals we are watching. If you don't agree, I don't know what to say.

Doesn't look like either team is running any plays or getting coached. Bron is doing EVERYTHING for a team that doesn't have another player that could sniff an All-Star team. Golden States MVP is shooting for shit and made up his FG% last night off 3s that didn't really matter. The Golden State defense, which was so highly vaunted, can't stop one man.

How is this NOT a weak Finals? I have nothing against 2012-2013. The Heat earned it. I have a thing against the 2013-2014 championship because the Spurs obviously deserved it.

Do I think this era is weaker than say the 80s? Yes. The 90s? Probably not. But we've pussified the league. Stern has went ahead and said that. But from mid 90s on, I would never say this age got weaker. The game changed. The floor is spread. We can't breathe on each other, literally, or it's a technical.

I have nothing against 2010 on. So here we go with nothing. Its a shitty finals man.

What makes this Finals awful is that the Cavs have no business getting past Chicago much less winning 2 games against the best Western Conference team in the NBA Finals.

And the Heat last year could not stop a team that had an average age of 80 from scoring 80 points by halftime. Does that make last year's Finals awful?

You are getting an historic 67 win game team vs a out-manned, over matched "weak" Eastern conference team, and each game is being decided in the last 30 seconds of regulation or overtime...

That is not an awful Finals.

And I knew people, if the Cavs started to win, would start screaming about "weak era." For the last year I have not heard anything about a "weak era" only the "weak East." And something tells me if a certain player doesn't reach the Finals next year, ISH will drop the whole "weak conference/era" nonsense.

Just like ISH quickly dropped the whole "historically stacked Miami Heat" the second a certain player revealed that he was returning home.

[LockoutOver11]

I think its an amazing finals.... Fun shit

But something about the mavs championship year was far beyond crazy. Maybe because it meant more to.me for them to win, but i remember no one thinkings mavs would win from my circle.

Also the last celtics run people enjoyed alot... I didnt... But i heard them battling LA was dooe

And then off course Detriot winning one against that dream team was special...

[Goldrush25]

Look man, just watching as a spectator. This is a pretty bad finals we are watching. If you don't agree, I don't know what to say.
.

It's a bad finals if you wanted GS to blow these guys out. I think Cavs fans and non-partisan fans are enjoying the heck out of it.

[ISHGoat]

To all those claiming 2011 mavs, did you know that Jason terry averaged 17.5 ppg on .604 TS% with a 119 ORTG and 109 DRTG? Dirk only had an ORTG of 115 throughout the playoffs.

He was also surrounded by SOLID vets in jason kidd, shawn marion, and tyson chandler

Lets compare the supporting casts

Delly vs Kidd
JR vs Terry
Shumpert vs Marion
Mozgov vs Chandler
TT vs ???

You replace dirk with lebron on that 2011 mavs team and they probably sweep this warriors team

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

One of the greatest individual finals of all-time, no question.

Far as the playoffs in totality go? Nah. Some of Jordan, Bird and Magic's runs are right there.

[ShawkFactory]

To all those claiming 2011 mavs, did you know that Jason terry averaged 17.5 ppg on .604 TS% with a 119 ORTG and 109 DRTG? Dirk only had an ORTG of 115 throughout the playoffs.

He was also surrounded by SOLID vets in jason kidd, shawn marion, and tyson chandler

Lets compare the supporting casts

Delly vs Kidd
JR vs Terry
Shumpert vs Marion
Mozgov vs Chandler
TT vs ???

You replace dirk with lebron on that 2011 mavs team and they probably sweep this warriors team
Truth. Terry was cold-blooded in 2011.

He wasn't an allstar but he absolutely played like one

[Relinquish]

The new trend for Lebron stans.

Never mention fg%...ever.

40% playoff run.

36 shots per game in the finals.

Obscene.

He's shooting over 42% in the playoffs.

[Magic 32]

He's shooting over 42% in the playoffs.

Not against teams with more wins than losses.

I don't think of the first round in the east as playoff basketball.

[Relinquish]

Not against teams with more wins than losses.

I don't think of the first round in the east as playoff basketball.


Neither is the first round in the west then.

[Magic 32]

Neither is the first round in the west then.

Is that why CP3 was crying?

[Cone]

dirk 2011 = goat run

[Foster5k]

3rd option out since first round
2nd option hobbled since first round and out for half of ECF and basically all of finals

Averaging 30/11/8/2/1 for the entire playoffs and stepping it up BIG TIME to basically a 40 point triple double in the finals.

Beating a 67 win team with the reigning MVP that posted the best defense in the RS and PO.

Is this ring worth double?
I don't care what anyone says. This latest title run by LeBron is up there with the greatest of all time. If he wins it all, he starts having a legit case for G.O.A.T. However, he will still have to do more to gain that title, but damn he is currently at legendary status already.

[ZMonkey11]

It's a bad finals if you wanted GS to blow these guys out. I think Cavs fans and non-partisan fans are enjoying the heck out of it.

Besides watching LeBron dominate, what is there for nonpartisan fans to enjoy? We've gone several stretches in games where 2 points are scored over 4 minutes with teams throwing the ball around willy nilly. To the common fan, I guess watching 6 foot+ guys play dodgeball is fun, but real basketball fans should see this for what it is, purely coaches, unorganized basketball.

[Foster5k]

Besides watching LeBron dominate, what is there for nonpartisan fans to enjoy? We've gone several stretches in games where 2 points are scored over 4 minutes with teams throwing the ball around willy nilly. To the common fan, I guess watching 6 foot+ guys play dodgeball is fun, but real basketball fans should see this for what it is, purely coaches, unorganized basketball.
:oldlol:

Dude is salty as hell LeBron about to win another ring with scrubs and silence all the haters.

#HateHard

[Springsteen]

The series isn't over, this Warriors team has been here before. Calm down. :facepalm

[Duncan21formvp]

We were up 2-1 in 2013 as well and lost game 4 at home. Sure we won game 5 and then Manu choked game 6 away.

[Goldrush25]

The series isn't over, this Warriors team has been here before. Calm down. :facepalm

Didn't Tony Allen get hurt before GS could turn that series around?

Maybe Grizzlies win the series if Allen never gets hurt.

[Haymaker]

It might be the most impressive FINALS win ever.

But overall playoff run? Nah, the East was too bad. Nothing will ever compare to Hakeem's run in '95 imo.

This. Also, Dirk's 2011 playoffs/finals run is way ahead too.

[Haymaker]

Didn't Tony Allen get hurt before GS could turn that series around?

Maybe Grizzlies win the series if Allen never gets hurt.

Also, Conley wasn't close to 100%

[Springsteen]

Didn't Tony Allen get hurt before GS could turn that series around?

Maybe Grizzlies win the series if Allen never gets hurt.

That was a real shocker for me. Was it ever explained how he even got that hamstring injury? It f*cked them over big time.

[Goldrush25]

That was a real shocker for me. Was it ever explained how he even got that hamstring injury? It f*cked them over big time.

I don't know.

But that's why I wasn't completely convinced that GS was this invincible force. Memphis made them bleed but couldn't keep it up because they were injured, not because GS figured them out or anything.

[dreamwarrior]

If they win I would say yes.

[TheMarkMadsen]

This is more about the warriors choking than anything IMO.

There have been moments when the cavs should have been down by like 15+ but the warriors just have been missing everything

They have no inside presence and rely primarily on the jumpshot..

Literally no team in nba history has won the championship built like the warriors are built.. No inside go to player and just relying on jumpers..

I've been saying this all playoffs.. I'd be surprised as hell if GSW win the championship because that would mean Curry & Klay shot out of their mind for 4 series..

As predicted that is nearly impossible to do..

[coin24]

I'd say the most bizarre run..

Standard 1st round sweep fair enough, but shitcago and then the cawks just imploding like that? Unheard of..

And to top it off the warriors choking and shook as fu*k:lol dream run for bran, not sure you can place it as greatest ever as there is no opposition..

[HurricaneKid]

It might be the most impressive FINALS win ever.

But overall playoff run? Nah, the East was too bad. Nothing will ever compare to Hakeem's run in '95 imo.

Christ. Dream's HoFer and top 50 player Clyde led the team in postseason WS. Dream's best run was 94. Unless you call leading the defending Champion team who added a HoFer to a 6 seed as best run ever.

[HurricaneKid]

Standard 1st round sweep fair enough, but shitcago and then the cawks just imploding like that? Unheard of..


So the Bulls, ATL, and now GSW all just imploded? Cle defense had nothing to do with any of that??

[Bernkastel]

Only if they win. If the Cavs lose, who cares? It's not Hakeem-like if they lose.

[ArbitraryWater]

people now just glossing over the Bulls and Hawks :lol

Bulls gave the Cavs a better fight so far lol, with Kyrie..

[Magic 32]

If he was shooting better than AI and did it in a sophisticated and inspiring way.

But right now it's just volume and brute force.

[Roundball_Rock]

people now just glossing over the Bulls and Hawks :lol

Bulls gave the Cavs a better fight so far lol, with Kyrie..

Yup. The Bulls were one missed technical foul away from being up 3-1...

[coin24]

people now just glossing over the Bulls and Hawks :lol

Bulls gave the Cavs a better fight so far lol, with Kyrie..


What? The Bulls flat out quit. They gave game 4 away it was pathetic, had nothing to do with the refs..
And the Hawks, they were just garbage. The cavs D wasn't that great until the finals where it has been superb.

[ArbitraryWater]

What? The Bulls flat out quit. They gave game 4 away it was pathetic, had nothing to do with the refs..
And the Hawks, they were just garbage. The cavs D wasn't that great until the finals where it has been superb.

you mean game 6?

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM...... so basically what HOU did in game 3 vs GSW? Or MEM in game 4, 5, 6 vs GSW?

[coin24]

you mean game 6?

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM...... so basically what HOU did in game 3 vs GSW? Or MEM in game 4, 5, 6 vs GSW?


Yeah pissing away the lead and going on scoring droughts and flat out sucking.
Game 6 they didn't even show up.

But yeah it's all about brans greatest run ever right, slurp slurp..

[ArbitraryWater]

Yeah pissing away the lead and going on scoring droughts and flat out sucking.
Game 6 they didn't even show up.

But yeah it's all about brans greatest run ever right, slurp slurp..

they didn't piss away any leads in game 4....

I just offered you 4 instances of the same thing happening in the West, all AGAINST GSW :lol

But yeah it's all about bran hate right, whaaa whaaa.

[triangleoffense]

GTFO at no one on this forum mentioning Jordan's stats in the playoffs and finals.

Jordan finals stats: copy and pasted


YEAR G GS MPG FG% FT% OFF DEF TOT APG SPG BPG PPG
1991 5 5 44.0 .558 .848 1.6 5.0 6.6 11.4 2.80 1.40 31.2
1992 6 6 42.3 .526 .891 1.0 3.8 4.8 6.5 1.67 0.33 35.8
1993 6 6 45.7 .508 .694 2.5 6.0 8.5 6.3 1.67 0.67 41.0
1996 6 6 42.0 .415 .836 1.7 3.7 5.3 4.2 1.67 0.17 27.3
1997 6 6 42.7 .456 .764 1.5 5.5 7.0 6.0 1.17 0.83 32.3
1998 6 6 41.7 .427 .814 1.5 2.5 4.0 2.3 1.83 0.67 33.5

averaged 41 on over 50% for the three-peat with 41/8.5/6 stats overall.

gtfo op

[ShawkFactory]

If he was shooting better than AI and did it in a sophisticated and inspiring way.

But right now it's just volume and brute force.
Just give it up. He's playing amazing basketball.

[triangleoffense]

Just give it up. He's playing amazing basketball.
People love ranking stuff on this site so I have to say it's up there but not "top10".. Historically speaking Lebron is definitely unique in the trends he's set (players having more power, collaborating, etc).. which might be overall good for this league but it actually insults players like Bird, Jordan, Isiah, etc who actually did more with less.

[chazzy]

Lol you can't retroactively pretend the Bulls and Hawks are good because Curry is getting unexpectedly shut down by Dellavedova. I'll take 12 and 13 Lebron over this Lebron easily.

[Magic 32]

Just give it up. He's playing amazing basketball.

21 missed shots per game and 35 iso's is amazing basketball?

Please.

[jzek]

All his asterisks get removed if they win.

[jzek]

21 missed shots per game and 35 iso's is amazing basketball?

Please.

They're up 2-1, that's all that matters.

He can miss 100 more as long as th ey still win.

[Magic 32]

They're up 2-1, that's all that matters.

He can miss 100 more as long as th ey still win.

Not the subject of my comment or this thread.

[coin24]

They're up 2-1, that's all that matters.

He can miss 100 more as long as th ey still win.



The irony:lol :lol What happened to efficiency and fg%:roll: :roll: :roll:

[Ne 1]

The irony:lol :lol What happened to efficiency and fg%:roll: :roll: :roll:
The John Hollinger/Henery Abbot followers have been exposed as hypocrites. They were the same guys who kept screaming "6/24" and spouting all their rhetoric emphasizing FG% and advanced meteoric and formulas before, now they're no where to be found. R.I.P. Player X amount of shots for Y points argument. :oldlol:

[livinglegend]

Lol you can't retroactively pretend the Bulls and Hawks are good because Curry is getting unexpectedly shut down by Dellavedova. I'll take 12 and 13 Lebron over this Lebron easily.

Hawks and Bulls were good the whole year, but as soon as they lost to Cavs, people considered them bad.
Both teams had trouble scoring.
So are the 67 warriors.
What makes warriors better than Bulls as of right now (3 games in the finals)?

[livinglegend]

What? The Bulls flat out quit. They gave game 4 away it was pathetic, had nothing to do with the refs..
And the Hawks, they were just garbage. The cavs D wasn't that great until the finals where it has been superb.

Their defense has been great the whole playoffs.
All 3 teams : Hawks, Bulls and Gsw have struggled offensively against cavs.
But to fit your agenda, you choose to believe that Bulls and Hawks had hard time because they sucked. And gsw are struggling because Cavs suddently started to play better D.

EXPOSED

next

[dreamwarrior]

Besides watching LeBron dominate, what is there for nonpartisan fans to enjoy? We've gone several stretches in games where 2 points are scored over 4 minutes with teams throwing the ball around willy nilly. To the common fan, I guess watching 6 foot+ guys play dodgeball is fun, but real basketball fans should see this for what it is, purely coaches, unorganized basketball.
Or great defense? GSW was the best defensive team in the league. Cleveland with Kyrie and Love out are now the second best defensive team in the league.

[DMAVS41]

Lol you can't retroactively pretend the Bulls and Hawks are good because Curry is getting unexpectedly shut down by Dellavedova. I'll take 12 and 13 Lebron over this Lebron easily.

This.

People on here are losing their minds...trying to use this as evidence that efficiency doesn't matter when scoring.

Imagine if Curry and Barnes and Green weren't all crapping the bed. The reason it hasn't mattered is because the other guys on the other team are scoring horribly.

And yes. LeBron's shot is broke as **** and while he's still playing all time great basketball, two years ago he'd be doing this at a 58% TS clip with ease and the
cavs would be up 3-0 in this series.

Efficiency doesn't matter? Curry is at a poor 53% TS and that is inflated as shit after his meaningless late game shots last night, Barnes/Green are both at 40% TS....

Give the Cavs/Lebron all the credit for shutting them down, but don't pretend like efficiency doesn't matter...and certainly don't pretend like the Hawks/Bulls were better than they were because those 3 guys have played like ass so far. They aren't even guarding Barnes and Green. It's not the defense for them at least...they are just choking/playing scared.

[Aiolos]

Take away whoever Hakeem's, Jordan's, Kobe's, Duncan's, and whoever the **** else 2nd and 3rd options and lets see if they even get to the Finals in this "weak" East.

When somebody does that come talk to me:pimp:

[ShawkFactory]

It's just crazy to think what he could have done 4 years ago with this mentality.

Though most of the reason for it is because of his experiences and failures.

[TheBigVeto]

Not even close.. 2011 mavs faced a way tougher road and won in dramatic fashion.

The Mavs also had to overcome David Stern. No small task.
The Cavs don't have to deal with that evil clown anymore.

[tpols]

This.

People on here are losing their minds...trying to use this as evidence that efficiency doesn't matter when scoring.

Imagine if Curry and Barnes and Green weren't all crapping the bed. The reason it hasn't mattered is because the other guys on the other team are scoring horribly.

And yes. LeBron's shot is broke as **** and while he's still playing all time great basketball, two years ago he'd be doing this at a 58% TS clip with ease and the
cavs would be up 3-0 in this series.

Efficiency doesn't matter? Curry is at a poor 53% TS and that is inflated as shit after his meaningless late game shots last night, Barnes/Green are both at 40% TS....

Give the Cavs/Lebron all the credit for shutting them down, but don't pretend like efficiency doesn't matter...and certainly don't pretend like the Hawks/Bulls were better than they were because those 3 guys have played like ass so far. They aren't even guarding Barnes and Green. It's not the defense for them at least...they are just choking/playing scared.

I think you miss the point of Lebron's approach this series. In the past when he had very high efficiency he did it on 20 or less shots.. hes taking 35+ in this series. There's no way he's doing 58TS on that volume with his current teammates.. but the approach is for him to drive, collapse the defense and get a decent look at a floater or banker.. and if it misses his rebounders are on queue to crash the glass with the defense scrambled.

Heat relied on good defense and high efficiency to win while current cavs rely on good defense + atg rebounding and stalling offense to win. The efficiency in this series is secondary to the aggressiveness that leads to the increased offensive rebounding chances ( which demoralize the opponent and give energy to role players)

[Prime_Shaq]

Its up there but not the best

[joe]

Lebron is in complete control of the game right now. Stop focusing on his shooting percentage and watch him play. He is dictating everything that is happening on the floor, not just with his play but with his attitude and leadership. He has transformed into a higher level basketball player this year, understands the game at a level that very few have reached. He might not be shooting as well but that is not everything in the game of basketball. This is Jordan, Duncan, Kobe esque. The highest of high level legends. And he is doing it without his 2nd and 3rd options. To belittle him right now is absurd.

[brain drain]

This "efficiency doesn't matter" debate is rather ridiculous.

The Cavs are winning **IN SPITE OF** bad efficiency because they make up for it by defense and rebounding.

How anybody can get to the assumption that making a lower percentage of shots is somehow better is beyond me.

(Unless you can prove that worse shooting in itself leads to better defense and rebounding - which you can't.)

[LAZERUSS]

Lebron is in complete control of the game right now. Stop focusing on his shooting percentage and watch him play. He is dictating everything that is happening on the floor, not just with his play but with his attitude and leadership. He has transformed into a higher level basketball player this year, understands the game at a level that very few have reached. He might not be shooting as well but that is not everything in the game of basketball. This is Jordan, Duncan, Kobe esque. The highest of high level legends. And he is doing it without his 2nd and 3rd options. To belittle him right now is absurd.

:applause:

[plowking]

Lol you can't retroactively pretend the Bulls and Hawks are good because Curry is getting unexpectedly shut down by Dellavedova. I'll take 12 and 13 Lebron over this Lebron easily.

No one is pretending after the fact it happened.

A lot of the more intelligent, non agenda driven posters recognized both as good teams prior to the finals. A lot of Kobe stans like yourself simply refused to acknowledge them as decent teams and pretended as if the Cavs rolled through the Bulls, which is the furthest thing from the truth.

[plowking]

This "efficiency doesn't matter" debate is rather ridiculous.

The Cavs are winning **IN SPITE OF** bad efficiency because they make up for it by defense and rebounding.

How anybody can get to the assumption that making a lower percentage of shots is somehow better is beyond me.

(Unless you can prove that worse shooting in itself leads to better defense and rebounding - which you can't.)

Shooting a worse % is never better. Although it is the style of play that is dictating this and keeping them in it.
If they speed the game up and stop isoing Bron, they lose, since there are more possession and GSW are the better offensive team by far. They can live with the lower shooting percentage and treat it as a sacrifice in order to stop turnovers, long rebounds and transition opportunities.
With Bron taking up most of the shotclock and going to the post, the rest of the team is at the top of the key, ready to stop transition points, and they limit their turnover probabilities by not passing as much.

[DMAVS41]

I think you miss the point of Lebron's approach this series. In the past when he had very high efficiency he did it on 20 or less shots.. hes taking 35+ in this series. There's no way he's doing 58TS on that volume with his current teammates.. but the approach is for him to drive, collapse the defense and get a decent look at a floater or banker.. and if it misses his rebounders are on queue to crash the glass with the defense scrambled.

Heat relied on good defense and high efficiency to win while current cavs rely on good defense + atg rebounding and stalling offense to win. The efficiency in this series is secondary to the aggressiveness that leads to the increased offensive rebounding chances ( which demoralize the opponent and give energy to role players)

Except the Cavs offense isn't good.

It's only good for slowing the game down and muddying the tracks so to speak.

So you'd have a point if the Cavs offense was any good.

You guys just aren't understanding what is making this work... It's tempo control, good defense, and the Warriors gagging on open looks.

If Lebron was playing the exact same way and Curry, Barnes, and Green weren't playing like shit... You'd be on here saying that Lebron is being too selfish and not shooting well enough.

Give the Cavs all the credit, but don't pretend like the Cavs offense is dominating.

Lebron is playing an all time great series though... It just has more to do with the other aspects of his game. It's why he's on another level than a guy like Kobe... He can completely control a series with an off shot while dominating on the glass and defending well all while basically getting no rest.

[pastis]

Dirks, Ducans and Hakeems run are still ahead.

its not about the fact missing allstars (like Hakeem or Dirk also didnt had one)

its the road to the finals.
Dirk and the mavs eliminated Kobes Lakers with Gasol, Odom, Bynum, MWP, goat coach. Eliminating OKC with RWB, James harden, KD.

judging a "run", you always have to keep the road to the finals in your mind.

I really dont know how this cavs team would have played against memphis, spurs, clippers.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Playoff run? No. Others have done better, others have done more with less (considering teammates and competition).

Finals? Also no. I can name players who did better for a full-Finals, while winning. Shit, go watch peak's Shaqs Finals, just an example...

Not denying he's having a great run, especially tremendous Finals but people need to stop over-hyping everything and it's not even over yet...

[oh the horror]

Playoff run? No. Others have done better, others have done more with less (considering teammates and competition).

Finals? Also no. I can name players who did better for a full-Finals, while winning. Shit, go watch peak's Shaqs Finals, just an example...

Not denying he's having a great run, especially tremendous Finals but people need to stop over-hyping everything and it's not even over yet...




IMO part of this hype is the media. They're spewing their usual hyperbole and people are eating it up.

[Da_Realist]

There's nothing about this Finals that I'd want to re-watch. Stop it. The numbers look better than the games.

[Funktion]

Rick Barry's Warriors swept the 60+ win Bullets with scrubs and rookies in the 1975 Finals.

Boston and Washington were shitting on everybody that year.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdRAy7_g5Y0

[LeBird]

The John Hollinger/Henery Abbot followers have been exposed as hypocrites. They were the same guys who kept screaming "6/24" and spouting all their rhetoric emphasizing FG% and advanced meteoric and formulas before, now they're no where to be found. R.I.P. Player X amount of shots for Y points argument. :oldlol:


Stop talking nonsense. People pretend like Lebron being praised for his game, despite his low efficiency, is an out for the Kobe apologists so that they can pretend there is a double standard.

There is none. Lebron isn't being given props for the low-efficiency and unlike Kobe he isn't playing in a vacuum chucking up shot after shot. Lebron is dominating the game in all facets and has put this team on his back. His rebounding, passing, scoring volume and incredible defence sets him apart. The way the Cavs have set up is their only chance. Kobe, regardless of his teammates, has been a chucker with a Jordan complex, despite not being on his level.

Kobe was/is a career low-efficiency, high volume, scorer who was for a time great perimeter defender (but nothing comparable to the value of Lebron as a defender, particularly his versatility).

The Kobe stans have to give up; there is no rational argument for him over Lebron so stop trying to make yourselves feel better with petty asides as arguments.

[nzahir]

Dirks, Ducans and Hakeems run are still ahead.

its not about the fact missing allstars (like Hakeem or Dirk also didnt had one)

its the road to the finals.
Dirk and the mavs eliminated Kobes Lakers with Gasol, Odom, Bynum, MWP, goat coach. Eliminating OKC with RWB, James harden, KD.

judging a "run", you always have to keep the road to the finals in your mind.

I really dont know how this cavs team would have played against memphis, spurs, clippers.
Well you have dirk in your top 15....so uhm, ya.
Dirks run is arguably the greatest run, his finals series was overrated though, rest of playoffs was great. If lebron wins it though, this is the greatest run of all time imo, or at least finals run. Although dirk had no all star at the time, he had great role guys like terry, kidd, marion, chandler, jj, and deshawn. Hakeem's runs are overrated, had maxwell, thorpe, kenny, and ellie in 94 and in 95 they got clyde.
Duncan had tp, manu, robinson, and bruce(we are talking 03 right)?

[Deuce Bigalow]

.493 TS

http://img.pandawhale.com/post-41349-jonah-hill-oscars-cut-it-out-g-w5Tc.gif

[DMAVS41]

Stop talking nonsense. People pretend like Lebron being praised for his game, despite his low efficiency, is an out for the Kobe apologists so that they can pretend there is a double standard.

There is none. Lebron isn't being given props for the low-efficiency and unlike Kobe he isn't playing in a vacuum chucking up shot after shot. Lebron is dominating the game in all facets and has put this team on his back. His rebounding, passing, scoring volume and incredible defence sets him apart. The way the Cavs have set up is their only chance. Kobe, regardless of his teammates, has been a chucker with a Jordan complex, despite not being on his level.

Kobe was/is a career low-efficiency, high volume, scorer who was for a time great perimeter defender (but nothing comparable to the value of Lebron as a defender, particularly his versatility).

The Kobe stans have to give up; there is no rational argument for him over Lebron so stop trying to make yourselves feel better with petty asides as arguments.

This man gets it.

Also, Lebron's poor efficiency still matters. Everyone here would be singing a different tune if the Warriors weren't gagging on a ton of wide open shots.

[DMAVS41]

Well you have dirk in your top 15....so uhm, ya.
Dirks run is arguably the greatest run, his finals series was overrated though, rest of playoffs was great. If lebron wins it though, this is the greatest run of all time imo, or at least finals run. Although dirk had no all star at the time, he had great role guys like terry, kidd, marion, chandler, jj, and deshawn. Hakeem's runs are overrated, had maxwell, thorpe, kenny, and ellie in 94 and in 95 they got clyde.
Duncan had tp, manu, robinson, and bruce(we are talking 03 right)?

TP and Manu weren't that good yet in 03.

Also, Hakeem in 94 and Duncan in 03 were better players than Lebron is currently.