People discredit the MVP award by bringing steve nash, what about FMVP...

[nba_55]

with a bench player like Igoudala winning it or a role player like Kawhl winning it?

[Heavincent]

Iguodala and Leonard aren't role players.

[iamgine]

What's there to discredit, they deserved it. :confusedshrug:

[nba_55]

Iguodala and Leonard aren't role players.
:facepalm
If they are not role players, then there's no such thing as a role player.

[Bernkastel]

People with agendas will discredit anything.

[warriorfan]

Curry is the only player to win the Finals as the team's PPG and assist leader while having zero HoF or future HoF teammates

One of the greatest seasons of all time

[nba_55]

What's there to discredit, they deserved it. :confusedshrug:

Yeah, but you have many members in here saying MVPs are nothing a good way of evaluating a player's greatness, and they bring Nash having more MVPs than Shaq to support their argument. This thread is dedicated to those people. The same type of argument could be used against FMVPs, Iggy has more than great players like Garnett or Charles Barkley...

[nba_55]

Curry is the only player to win the Finals as the team's PPG and assist leader while having zero HoF or future HoF teammates

One of the greatest seasons of all time

so?

[warriorfan]

so?

Curry winning a ring with 0 HoF or future HoF teammates is very impressive, so hard that it has never been done before!

[outbreak]

:facepalm
If they are not role players, then there's no such thing as a role player.
I don't think you understand what a role player is. A role player is a player who comes in to fill one specific role; Mike Miller is a role player as all he does is fill a shooting role. Iguodala and Kawhi are two of the most muti facted players in the league. They get you points, assists, rebounds, defence whatever you need they can do it to a serviceable level.

[BlakFrankWhite]

so?


Lol

[nba_55]

I don't think you understand what a role player is. A role player is a player who comes in to fill one specific role; Mike Miller is a role player as all he does is fill a shooting role. Iguodala and Kawhi are two of the most muti facted players in the league. They get you points, assists, rebounds, defence whatever you need they can do it to a serviceable level.

One specific role? Be more clear because Mike Miller also grab rebounds ,play defense, pass the ball just like Igoudala. He is not as good, but he does those things on the court.

[Wade's Rings]

Curry winning a ring with 0 HoF or future HoF teammates is very impressive, so hard that it has never been done before!

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.2260676.1434521358!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_635/477386510.jpg

[warriorfan]

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.2260676.1434521358!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_635/477386510.jpg

Exactly, Curry won a ring with Iguodala (non future HoF) as his second best player...Amazing performance. Curry lead the team in ppg and assists while being double teamed the entire series, with NOT ONE fellow future Hall of Famer. Record setting and historic performance by Curry. :applause:

[Ne 1]

Honestly, MVP of the Finals is a pretty useless award when you think about it. Plenty of non-elite players have won it (Cedric Maxwell, Joe Dumars, James Worthy, Chauncey Billups, Tony Parker, Paul Pierce, Kawhi Leonard and Andre Iguodala have all won Finals MVP. Even John Starks was literally 1 shot away from winning a Finals MVP. The NBA should make the award defunct and introduce a Playoffs MVP award like they have in the NHL. 16-28 game sample size > 4-7.

I've actually said for many years that Finals MVP needs to be discarded and replaced with Playoffs MVP and I've never heard a convincing argument otherwise that doesn't just rely on tradition.

[konex]

Kawhii wasn't a big name yet but he had the best stats and impact in that series. He clearly deserved it. Iguodola on the other hand...

[outbreak]

One specific role? Be more clear because Mike Miller also grab rebounds ,play defense, pass the ball just like Igoudala. He is not as good, but he does those things on the court.
Are you being obtuse or are you an idiot? Mike Miller makes his pay cheque through his jump shot. Iggy and Kawhi are all round players. He does those things on the court but it's not what he's on a roster to do.

[nba_55]

Are you being obtuse or are you an idiot? Mike Miller makes his pay cheque through his jump shot. Iggy and Kawhi are all round players. He does those things on the court but it's not what he's on a roster to do.

So is Fisher a role player? Chalmers is not a role player also?

[bballnoob1192]

Honestly, MVP of the Finals is a pretty useless award when you think about it. Plenty of non-elite players have won it (Cedric Maxwell, Joe Dumars, James Worthy, Chauncey Billups, Tony Parker, Paul Pierce, Kawhi Leonard and Andre Andre Iguodala have all won Finals MVP. Even John Starks was literally 1 shot away from winning a Finals MVP. The NBA should make the award defunct and introduce a Playoffs MVP award like they have in the NHL. 16-28 game sample size > 4-7.

I've actually said for many years that Finals MVP needs to be discarded and replaced with Playoffs MVP and I've never heard a convincing argument otherwise that doesn't just rely on tradition.
just make it so the mvp awards are not voted solely by the goddamn biased as **** media. idk why the nba does not make it a player/coach/gm/media voted award. that way of the different views on the sport and its players are actually represented. Actually im declaring it. from now on i don't give a shit who wins the mvp or fmvp anymore until they change the voting base

[nba_55]

Kawhii wasn't a big name yet but he had the best stats and impact in that series. He clearly deserved it. Iguodola on the other hand...

Lebron had the best stats and impact.

[HOoopCityJones]

http://media.giphy.com/media/uzS6trKIqo8mI/giphy.gif

[Bernkastel]

Yeah, but you have many members in here saying MVPs are nothing a good way of evaluating a player's greatness, and they bring Nash having more MVPs than Shaq to support their argument. This thread is dedicated to those people. The same type of argument could be used against FMVPs, Iggy has more than great players like Garnett or Charles Barkley...

I think that this is one of those times where you simply have to look at the context in which a player won it. Sure, Iggy isn't LeBron or Byrd or whomever, but that's why you actually won the game.

FMVP, just like MVP, should be looked at in the context in which the player won it. Iggy played great; he deserved it, though arguments can be made for LeBron and Steph. It doesn't mean that Iggy > Garnett; it just means that Iggy had the biggest impact in the series in which he won it, bigger than Garnett when he played.

[Wade's Rings]

Exactly, Curry won a ring with Iguodala (non future HoF) as his second best player...Amazing performance. Curry lead the team in ppg and assists while being double teamed the entire series, with NOT ONE fellow future Hall of Famer. Record setting and historic performance by Curry. :applause:

Iggy is First Ballot HOFer :confusedshrug:

[nba_55]

just make it so the mvp awards are not voted solely by the goddamn biased as **** media. idk why the nba does not make it a player/coach/gm/media voted award. that way of the different views on the sport and its players are actually represented. Actually im declaring it. from now on i don't give a shit who wins the mvp or fmvp anymore until they change the voting base

FMVP voting process in even worse than MVP because only 11 members of the media vote for the FMVP. Another reason to discredit that award.

[bballnoob1192]

Iggy is First Ballot HOFer :confusedshrug:
no chance first ballot. unless the warriors win some more titles with him contributing decently or is still on the team. he'll make the HoF down the road tho

[Lakers Fan]

Curry is the only player to win the Finals as the team's PPG and assist leader while having zero HoF or future HoF teammates

One of the greatest seasons of all time


At least since Kobe did it in the 2010 finals. :kobe:

[HOoopCityJones]

At least since Kobe did it in the 2010 finals. :kobe:

You don't think Pau and Fisher are HoF?

[warriorfan]

At least since Kobe did it in the 2010 finals. :kobe:

True, Pau has a better chance than Iguodala at making HoF but both of them are still very doubtful.

[bballnoob1192]

True, Pau has a better chance than Iguodala at making HoF but both of them are still very doubtful.
you are crazy pau will make the HoF 10000000% and he has a decent chance to be first ballot.

[bballnoob1192]

You don't think Pau and Fisher are HoF?
fisher is a weird case.he might get his number retired by the lakers, but not make the HoF. If horry makes the HoF then Fisher might have a chance. very small still.

[HOoopCityJones]

Both Pau and Iggy are sure fire HoF.

[DMV2]

Wasn't this Finals MVP based on just 11 writers' votes?
Kinda strange they voted for a guy who averaged only 16 PPG and had a 7 point game performance.

Previously it was 50% fans, 50% writers. Right?

[iamgine]

Yeah, but you have many members in here saying MVPs are nothing a good way of evaluating a player's greatness, and they bring Nash having more MVPs than Shaq to support their argument. This thread is dedicated to those people. The same type of argument could be used against FMVPs, Iggy has more than great players like Garnett or Charles Barkley...
Those are called using # of awards without context. Do that and it's turns stupid pretty quick.

[HOoopCityJones]

fisher is a weird case.he might get his number retired by the lakers, but not make the HoF. If horry makes the HoF then Fisher might have a chance. very small still.

Horry is too decorated not to make it imo. He's arguably the greatest role player of all time, where coming up huge in big games are concerned.

[Lakers Fan]

You don't think Pau and Fisher are HoF?

No. :oldlol: WTF? Fisher was a fantastic clutch player but he's not making it. Pau only makes it if they give him credit for being the most significant player to come out of Spain

[Ne 1]

just make it so the mvp awards are not voted solely by the goddamn biased as **** media. idk why the nba does not make it a player/coach/gm/media voted award. that way of the different views on the sport and its players are actually represented. Actually im declaring it. from now on i don't give a shit who wins the mvp or fmvp anymore until they change the voting base

I agree. For the regular season MVP, the media often pick the star whose team exceeds expectations the most and they also favor a good story over the guy who truly is the MVP of the league and deserves the award the most. They'll often choose a player who is most valuable to their respective team when it's supposed to be the "NBA's most valuable player." Somehow exceeding expectations one year makes a player more valuable than guys who regularly lead their teams to contending records by that logic. We've seen this with Iverson, Nash and Rose for example, though I do think that Nash actually wasn't a bad choice in '05 considering the candidates, and he had a case in '06 as well (although it should have gone to Kobe or Dirk IMO), but a lot of the emphasis was on the Suns turnaround and then the Suns winning without Ama're Stoudemire.

Look at Jason Kidd's 2002 season as another example, Kidd almost wins the award, though ultimately the correct choice was made (Duncan). But Kidd nearly edged Duncan and almost won due to the Nets turnaround.

However, the very next season, Duncan wins the award again with a similar season to his '02 regular season in both wins and individual performance. But Kidd plays better than he did in 2002, yet drops from 2nd to 9th in voting and goes from 45 first place votes in 2002 to 0 in 2003.

It just shows you that the media gets caught up in a good story.

[Bernkastel]

I don't see what good having coaches and the like vote on the award. They used to do that in college football for football rankings or something, and many coaches didn't even care to put in the effort to make a reasoned out decision.

I don't see why you'd saddle coaches with this burden.

[oarabbus]

No. :oldlol: WTF? Fisher was a fantastic clutch player but he's not making it. Pau only makes it if they give him credit for being the most significant player to come out of Spain


Lmao this idiot thinks pau is not a HoFer

[HOoopCityJones]

It should be the players like back in the day. Media is too biased.


Curry was deserving , but we gonna act like he deserved it any more than Harden who was playing without his second best player all year? It's the same type of shit they were gonna give Lebron the FMVP based solely on the precedent that he over performed while being undermanned.

[Lakers Fan]

Lmao this idiot thinks pau is not a HoFer

Sit down and shut up. It took Jo Jo White 35 years to make it, and he was a 7x All-Star, a FMVP, and has his number retired in the rafters by the Celtics. But no, Pau is a sure fire MVP. :oldlol:

[bballnoob1192]

I don't see what good having coaches and the like vote on the award. They used to do that in college football for football rankings or something, and many coaches didn't even care to put in the effort to make a reasoned out decision.

I don't see why you'd saddle coaches with this burden.
my point is to not put the burden/responsibility on any single group. if you have coaches/gms/players/ and media vote. the winner will surely have been judged from all aspect of the game? the media can have their story driven votes, the GMs and coaches can have their franchise player type of votes, and the players can have their on the court and in the locker room view of a player vote. all in all it's much better than just having the media.

[HOoopCityJones]

my point is to not put the burden/responsibility on any single group. if you have coaches/gms/players/ and media vote. the winner will surely have been judged from all aspect of the game? the media can have their story driven votes, the GMs and coaches can have their franchise player type of votes, and the players can have their on the court and in the locker room view of a player vote. all in all it's much better than just having the media.

This sounds amazing but you know the national media rather feel entitled than just included.

[Ne 1]

Sit down and shut up. It took Jo Jo White 35 years to make it, and he was a 7x All-Star, a FMVP, and has his number retired in the rafters by the Celtics. But no, Pau is a sure fire MVP. :oldlol:

It's the basketball hall of fame, not the NBA hall of fame. Pau's international career will come into account when he is eligible for the HOF.

[imnew09]

Iggy was a franchise player for the Sixers, gold medalist, Fiba world champion, All Star


Stop disrespecting this man. He accepted the role coming off the bench to better the team, and he showed his true professionalism

[funnystuff]

Iguodala and Leonard aren't role players.
Every player is role player, some just have more roles than others. :facepalm

[Ne 1]

Every player is role player, some just have more roles than others. :facepalm

Yes, but typically a role player refers to someone who plays mainly in specific situations, or a supporting cast member, someone who's fairly important, not a dispensable scrub, but not leading either.

Iggy and Kawhi definitely aren't just some below average or run of the mill role players, but they aren't exactly elite players either. They're borderline All-Star level players I'd say.

[TheBigVeto]

Iguodala and Leonard aren't role players.

Yup.

And Nash is a bad example if you want to discredit MVP award. He's GOAT PG.

At least pick Kobe or Rose as example if you want to discredit MVP.

[bballnoob1192]

Yup.

And Nash is a bad example if you want to discredit MVP award. He's GOAT PG.

At least pick Kobe or Rose as example if you want to discredit MVP.
kobe whooped Cp3's ass in the final game of the season to secure the MVP. you know something that Cp3 could've done to kobe, but guess what that's not what happened you inbred mongoloid. Also cpchoke lost to the spurs at home in game 7 that same year kobe whoop the spur's ass in 5 games in the conference finals (a place that cpchoke has yet to reach in his entire career). Come at me again how CPchoke deserve MVP over Kobe.

[catch24]

Already been repeated I'm sure, but FMVP needs to become playoff MVP. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense to award one guy for playing 82+ games, and the other for just coming through in one 7 game series.

MVP + Playoff MVP :rockon: