report: Knicks looking to trade the #4 pick and move down

[Knicksfever2010]

I guess Phil didnt get enough of ****ing up the Knicks during his time as head coach of the Bulls, now he wants to **** us up from the inside.

http://www.nj.com/knicks/index.ssf/2015/06/nba_draft_rumors_knicks_will_likely_trade_4th_pick .html

[Foster5k]

The ZenMaster is turning into the WTFYouDoingMaster.

[VengefulAngel]

:roll: :roll: :roll:

[navy]

Not crazy. Everything I hear about the Knicks is that they dont want to rebuild slowly through picks.

[Knicksfever2010]

Not crazy. Everything I hear about the Knicks is that they dont want to rebuild slowly through picks.

So they will get retread players with big contracts? Knicks could get those without giving up a talent like either Winslow/Okafor/Russell

[alanLA92]

42 years and counting.

[navy]

So they will get retread players with big contracts? Knicks could get those without giving up a talent like either Winslow/Okafor/Russell
They obviously dont feel like after Towns/Okafor there is a surefire thing.

Anyways, who knows what they trade. They might like a lower projected top pick and still get him while getting something for the 4th spot in return. Double win.

[snipes12]

Trade for bargani and pick 4 + shane larkin , tim hard away for keneth faried and ty lawson sign marc gasol.

Gasol
Faried
Melo
Lawson

[UK2K]

Going for gold

[Rocketswin2013]

#4 pick will be a superstar confirmed. It would just be so Knicks if it happened.

[FreezingTsmoove]

If this is true than maybe the Knicks know something that we dont about the players in the draft. But how can Mudiay Russell WCS Porzingis all be busts? Very interesting

[SwishSquared]

Wouldn't shock me at all if Phil wants something like 4/Calderon for Hibbert/Miles/Hill/11.

Hill-Miles-Melo-Lyles-Hibbert

Your 2015-2016 NYK everybody

[RRR3]

http://nbafunnymeme.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/b5cf7bdcuaa2df0.jpg

[NugzFan]

Trade for bargani and pick 4 + shane larkin , tim hard away for keneth faried and ty lawson sign marc gasol.

Gasol
Faried
Melo
Lawson

Id probably do that.

[Rocketswin2013]

Trade for bargani and pick 4 + shane larkin , tim hard away for keneth faried and ty lawson sign marc gasol.

Gasol
Faried
Melo
Lawson
Defense.

[SwishSquared]

Id probably do that.If you trade for Lawson + Faried, you don't have max space to sign Gasol.

[MellowYellow]

jose + 4 for bledsoe + 13
get it done philly

[imdaman99]

Id probably do that.
I wouldn't. I'll take Lawson but want nothing to do with Faried.

Caldy + Knicks pick for Lawson + Nuggets pick.

This assures you get Winslow. Honestly I'd rather have Winslow but seems like this fcking ZenBastard doesn't wanna draft him because he plays the same position as Melo :facepalm

[MellowYellow]

I wouldn't. I'll take Lawson but want nothing to do with Faried.

Caldy + Knicks pick for Lawson + Nuggets pick.

This assures you get Winslow. Honestly I'd rather have Winslow but seems like this fcking ZenBastard doesn't wanna draft him because he plays the same position as Melo :facepalm

Ty Lawson is just a younger Raymond Felton, why would you want that?

[NugzFan]

I wouldn't. I'll take Lawson but want nothing to do with Faried.

Caldy + Knicks pick for Lawson + Nuggets pick.

This assures you get Winslow. Honestly I'd rather have Winslow but seems like this fcking ZenBastard doesn't wanna draft him because he plays the same position as Melo :facepalm

That deal I wouldn't do.

[NugzFan]

Ty Lawson is just a younger Raymond Felton, why would you want that?


:oldlol: uh, no.

[Patrick Chewing]

The most sensible trade scenario I've seen thus far is trading with Phoenix for Eric Bledsoe.

Phx gets: 4th pick

NYK gets: Bledsoe, 13th pick

[MellowYellow]

:oldlol: uh, no.

2010 Raymond Felton 15 4 8 2 on 42/35/80
Last year Ty Lawson 15 3 9 1 on 44/34/73

plus they look alike and are kinda doughy

[NugzFan]

The most sensible trade scenario I've seen thus far is trading with Phoenix for Eric Bledsoe.

Phx gets: 4th pick

NYK gets: Bledsoe, 13th pick

Awful for New York. Amazing for Phoenix.

[NugzFan]

2010 Raymond Felton 15 4 8 2 on 42/35/80
Last year Ty Lawson 15 3 9 1 on 44/34/73

Ask 30 GMs who they'd rather have.

You should really pick your battles better. This one just makes you look like a stupid homer.

And lol@your edit. As if that helped your cause. :lol

[MellowYellow]

Ask 30 GMs who they'd rather have.

You should really pick your battles better. This one just makes you look like a stupid homer.

Obviously recency bias would come into play.... but it doesn't matter. They ain't much different.

[imdaman99]

2010 Raymond Felton 15 4 8 2 on 42/35/80
Last year Ty Lawson 15 3 9 1 on 44/34/73

plus they look alike and are kinda doughy
Lawson fell off last year because he was unhappy. I have criticized his defense, but his offense is really good. He's fast and he can shoot. He might not be the typical pass first PG, but playing with Melo that would be useless. Felton couldn't shoot for shit. Although I have to admit, I liked Felton in his first go-around with the Knicks, but that's because he had great chemistry with Amare. Once Melo came, he killed all chemistry possible between them 2. Lawson with Melo would be better than Felton with Melo.

[MellowYellow]

Lawson fell off last year because he was unhappy. I have criticized his defense, but his offense is really good. He's fast and he can shoot. He might not be the typical pass first PG, but playing with Melo that would be useless. Felton couldn't shoot for shit. Although I have to admit, I liked Felton in his first go-around with the Knicks, but that's because he had great chemistry with Amare. Once Melo came, he killed all chemistry possible between them 2. Lawson with Melo would be better than Felton with Melo.
slightly maybe, but give me bledsoe over ty all day. Also Melo was traded for Felton so what chemistry did he kill?

[Patrick Chewing]

Awful for New York. Amazing for Phoenix.


Bledsoe's about to blow up though. And Phoenix seems to be more enamored with Knight.

[navy]

Lawson fell off last year because he was unhappy. I have criticized his defense, but his offense is really good. He's fast and he can shoot. He might not be the typical pass first PG, but playing with Melo that would be useless. Felton couldn't shoot for shit. Although I have to admit, I liked Felton in his first go-around with the Knicks, but that's because he had great chemistry with Amare. Once Melo came, he killed all chemistry possible between them 2. Lawson with Melo would be better than Felton with Melo.
Except Melo is exactly why you need a pass first point guard. Melo can score but you need someone to facilitate for the team and to feed Melo easy shots.

Lawson is a decent player, but he's a player you get in free agency. Trading for him would be silly.

[GimmeThat]

At the #4 pick, I think you are really looking at derrick favors or paul millsap in a deal as to whether or not you can get jeff teague in return as well.

As for using the pick to move down. Recent trends means that teams are going to stock pile bigs. And getting an athletic 2 guard could prove to be quite useful, given that the zen philosophy might be that even if you don't shoot the ball well now, you work on that on your own, because team practice is for something else.

You might as well even look into the possibility of.Dwayne Wade if you want to roll the dice.

Typing all this on a phone

[NugzFan]

Obviously recency bias would come into play.... but it doesn't matter. They ain't much different.

Lol. Yeah....recency bias. That's it.

[NugzFan]

Bledsoe's about to blow up though. And Phoenix seems to be more enamored with Knight.

If New York wants to do that deal, fine with me. Can only help our chances at a good pick next year.

[Springsteen]

Phil Jackson is going to go down as another big name brought in through panic by this organization only to end in failure. This dude may be a GOAT coach, but he has had no in-depth front office experience, at least to my knowledge.

go ny go ny go

[SwishSquared]

Chris Sheridan reported that if Okafor isn't on the board, Phil's gonna try to move #4, looking for cap relief and future picks. He even suggested 5 second rounders + next year's Lakers' pick as basis for #4. I'm pretty flipping sure any GM takes that deal. I will LOL so hard if something like that happens.

[NugzFan]

Chris Sheridan reported that if Okafor isn't on the board, Phil's gonna try to move #4, looking for cap relief and future picks. He even suggested 5 second rounders + next year's Lakers' pick as basis for #4. I'm pretty flipping sure any GM takes that deal. I will LOL so hard if something like that happens.

Link?

[SwishSquared]

Link?http://www.sheridanhoops.com/2015/06/19/podcast-knicks-likely-to-trade-no-4-pick/

Listened to it a couple hours ago, maybe about 2/3 of way in he specifically mentions that proposal. Sounds like pure speculation on his part b/c he says Phil would try to pry more out of Danny Ainge to get Hinkie to bid up.

[QuebecBaller]

Chris Sheridan reported that if Okafor isn't on the board, Phil's gonna try to move #4, looking for cap relief and future picks. He even suggested 5 second rounders + next year's Lakers' pick as basis for #4. I'm pretty flipping sure any GM takes that deal. I will LOL so hard if something like that happens.

Is it the Celtics or the 76ers who owns a huge load of second rounders?

[SwishSquared]

Is it the Celtics or the 76ers who owns a huge load of second rounders?The 76ers have 5 this year and 9 total from 2016-2020 or something like that, so that's what that my previous post referenced. Boston has a lot too (maybe 2nd most in the NBA), but they only have 2 this year. Between 2015-2017 drafts, they likely get 4 total seconds from 76ers and T-Wolves alone, so they should be pretty decent 2nds.

[Mr. I'm So Rad]

Phil's never been keen on young guys. He's always preferred veteran talent. And he's never been a direct position to draft before. For him this is pretty new.

[DMAVS41]

Not crazy. Everything I hear about the Knicks is that they dont want to rebuild slowly through picks.

Yea...I mean...unless you move Melo...kind of no point in taking a player here.

They don't have their draft pick in 2016 either.

They are stuck trying to figure out a way to put a team around Calderon/Melo/Tim Hardaway/Larkin (assuming he's back...can't remember if he's a free agent or not)

Now, that isn't actually terrible.

Calderon/Hardaway/Larkin are all players capable of playing in the rotation on a good team.

I wouldn't call Melo a superstar, but he's in that next class of player.

You fill out that roster with a trade on Thursday and then in free agency and you could get to 50 wins really fast in the East.

I think they could get really creative if they trade that number 4 pick and waive some guys.

I mean...it's the dream scenario for them, but what if they signed both Butler and Monroe in free agency? And had previously picked up something quality for that number 4 pick?

Calderon/Butler/Melo/Something/Monroe

You have something serious there. Likely? No, but something like that is possible I think depending on what the actual cap is and what kind of trade they make.

[kurple]

2010 Raymond Felton 15 4 8 2 on 42/35/80
Last year Ty Lawson 15 3 9 1 on 44/34/73

plus they look alike and are kinda doughy
i like how you say 9 ast for lawson when it should be 10.. just to make it seem more legit

[DMAVS41]

If they can pull off something on Thursday....it could really help their ability to get a couple max guys in free agency....or near max guys.

I don't see how a team that has to win now...and doesn't have their draft pick next year...is going to draft a rookie with number 4 pick and hope he develops. Just the "completely miss" factor that is there will all draft picks kind of makes this a no brainer for a trade.

Pick up a proven asset from a team looking for a pick and hope you can get the players you need in free agency.

You can't do this half in/half out approach that some teams seem to do. They are stuck all in with Melo through 2019 likely. Might as well make the most of your chances each year....

Only way you take the pick is if you think you have a superstar at the number 4 slot.

[NugzFan]

i like how you say 9 ast for lawson when it should be 10.. just to make it seem more legit

Do you have any idea how hard it is to make Felton comparable to Lawson?

[Duderonomy]

I heard the Pistons are interested in moving up, they currently have the 8th pick. Celtics could make a decent offer with all their picks.

[GimmeThat]

If they can pull off something on Thursday....it could really help their ability to get a couple max guys in free agency....or near max guys.

I don't see how a team that has to win now...and doesn't have their draft pick next year...is going to draft a rookie with number 4 pick and hope he develops. Just the "completely miss" factor that is there will all draft picks kind of makes this a no brainer for a trade.

Pick up a proven asset from a team looking for a pick and hope you can get the players you need in free agency.

You can't do this half in/half out approach that some teams seem to do. They are stuck all in with Melo through 2019 likely. Might as well make the most of your chances each year....

Only way you take the pick is if you think you have a superstar at the number 4 slot.

I feel certain I have offered this idea in other trade possibilities. If you can trade for another pick, ranges in the teens. Signing a few more veterans to contend isn't out of the question.

In fact, that's how the Rockets and the Bulls had been able to place themselves in playoff/contending positions recently. Have they won? No. But you have this 4th and high teen pick, and it comes down to who is willing to fill up your bench at what price.

[kshutts1]

DMavs saying my exact thoughts.

IMO, based upon Melo's age, the Knicks have two choices...
1) Keep Melo, trade the pick
2) Trade Melo, keep the pick

There really is no other sound option, IMO. The pick is not likely to be an impact piece for another 2-3 years, at which point Melo will be well past his prime.

Anyway, some trades I cooked up... #4 pick to....

Charlotte for #9 and Kemba (Knicks may have to throw in a second rounder, or heavily protected future first)

Denver for #7 and Lawson (Knicks may have to throw in a second rounder, or heavily protected future first). This is my favorite deal.

Detroit for #8 and Jackson

Those are all deals that, I think, would be accepted by the other team. The Knicks still maintain a solid pick placement in the draft.
With their cap, they likely have enough space to sign Millsap and Robin Lopez.

Lawson/Calderon/Larkin
Hardaway/Galloway/Shved
Melo/Early
Millsap/Kaminsky (fills a need, and I like him)
Robin/Kofous

If Melo can play like the top 10 player I still think he is, then that team has a shot to make the finals.

[Knicksfever2010]

why on earth would the Knicks trade the #4 pick for a lot of 2nd rounders? Its EXTREMELY RARE that you will find REAL TALENT in the 2nd round. SMH

[DMAVS41]

DMavs saying my exact thoughts.

IMO, based upon Melo's age, the Knicks have two choices...
1) Keep Melo, trade the pick
2) Trade Melo, keep the pick

There really is no other sound option, IMO. The pick is not likely to be an impact piece for another 2-3 years, at which point Melo will be well past his prime.

Anyway, some trades I cooked up... #4 pick to....

Charlotte for #9 and Kemba (Knicks may have to throw in a second rounder, or heavily protected future first)

Denver for #7 and Lawson (Knicks may have to throw in a second rounder, or heavily protected future first). This is my favorite deal.

Detroit for #8 and Jackson

Those are all deals that, I think, would be accepted by the other team. The Knicks still maintain a solid pick placement in the draft.
With their cap, they likely have enough space to sign Millsap and Robin Lopez.

Lawson/Calderon/Larkin
Hardaway/Galloway/Shved
Melo/Early
Millsap/Kaminsky (fills a need, and I like him)
Robin/Kofous

If Melo can play like the top 10 player I still think he is, then that team has a shot to make the finals.

I like these ideas.

I'd actually do it a little differently though.

Just for fun, lets say one of those deals above happened and the Knicks had the 9th pick after a trade that landed them a quality player.

I'd then flip that pick again to a team for another rotation player.

Again, I just don't see the upside here of drafting a player. There is bust potential, like always, and even under good circumstances said player is likely not going to be ready for at least 2 years.

So if the Knicks played their cards right....they could potentially turn the number 4 pick into two quality rotation players....either in the same trade or two separate trades.

If they could get players the caliber of what you list above....and then make another move after that to get another rotation guy?

You are looking at a team....after free agency...that could be legit.

[DMAVS41]

DMavs saying my exact thoughts.

IMO, based upon Melo's age, the Knicks have two choices...
1) Keep Melo, trade the pick
2) Trade Melo, keep the pick

There really is no other sound option, IMO. The pick is not likely to be an impact piece for another 2-3 years, at which point Melo will be well past his prime.

Anyway, some trades I cooked up... #4 pick to....

Charlotte for #9 and Kemba (Knicks may have to throw in a second rounder, or heavily protected future first)

Denver for #7 and Lawson (Knicks may have to throw in a second rounder, or heavily protected future first). This is my favorite deal.

Detroit for #8 and Jackson

Those are all deals that, I think, would be accepted by the other team. The Knicks still maintain a solid pick placement in the draft.
With their cap, they likely have enough space to sign Millsap and Robin Lopez.

Lawson/Calderon/Larkin
Hardaway/Galloway/Shved
Melo/Early
Millsap/Kaminsky (fills a need, and I like him)
Robin/Kofous

If Melo can play like the top 10 player I still think he is, then that team has a shot to make the finals.


I don't hate the bold, but I also don't think it's good enough to make the finals. You'd have to hope that the Knicks land better players than that.

I also don't love Millsap on this team. Melo is best when he's playing the 4 and I don't think that combo works that well because they are going to need to play smaller to play at an optimal level. Melo/Millsap/Lopez is a combo I'd like to stay away from playing....especially in the playoffs against teams like the Cavs. The Cavs would just blow that team away going small.

It might be a pipe dream, but Jimmy Butler should be the guy they want most. He would be the perfect fit on this team.

With Calderon and Melo...you have to get defense. Butler fills in that gap very well.