This "Weight-lifting" fad and its effects(negative) on the modern league.

[TonyMontana]

The weight lifting fad isn't just taking college campuses by storm, but also basketball training and is one of the reasons for an inferior product.

All you have to do is look at players from the past 10-15 years compared to pre 00s and it's obvious they are "buffer".

However this isn't always a good thing.

I sit here with good reason in saying that the weight lifting fad is the number one reason for why injuries are so common in todays league compared to the past.

The most guilty are the 7 footers. Haing a 7 foot frame alone puts tremendous stress on ones joints. But then to top it all off have pounds and pounds of uneeded muscle?
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/sports/2006-12/25/xin_40120325085406343785.jpg

We will use Yao Ming as an example. However he is just one of the many recent bigmen whose larger than necessary frames have resulted in a career ending. (Oden, Bynum to name another few). These guys have legit 7+ foot frames and were heavy as shit. Its not a matter of when the sports injury will occur, but when.

Yao Ming came into the league pretty damn skinny and weak. Conveniently enough he also played every single game. Soon he became one of the strongest guys in the league. His legs were massive, and he was just a beast.....The problem is as soon as he did he couldn't stay on the court.

Even Shaq became injury prone as shit. I see it as pure luck that he was able to have 3 years in a row that were relatively injury free(00-02) however that didn't last long.

http://kellylowenstein.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/kareem-abduljabbar-and-bruce-lee11.jpg

Now we look here at a guy like Kareem Abdul Jabbar. He was an absolute stick for nearly his entire career. But he had LONGEVITY. And he won because of that. Before the 90s or so this was the typical physique for an NBA player....and despite sports science not being "as advanced" as now, the injuries were FAR fewer. "Having big muscle" as a necessity is one of the biggest crocks of shit to ever come out. This isn't bodybuilding. Whenever you see a prospect in the draft you will see unathletic message board posters write "he is too skinny, he needs to bulk up" where as that is one of the least important qualities there is.

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/PJ-BO973_SP_COU_DV_20130619174222.jpg
http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2011/0518/nba_g_kddirk_576.jpg
http://cdn-jpg.si.com/sites/default/files/si/2011/writers/michael_rosenberg/05/11/garnett.trash.talking/kg///kg-heat.jpg

Now here are 3 bigmen who have had incredible longevity. Tim Duncan in particular is someone to note. Tim Duncan when losing a bunch of weight and looking really skinny pretty much revolutionied his career a few years ago. He was on a steady downhill in the late 00s, but when he lost the weight he actually improved as a player. Practically unheard of for a guy in his 30s.

I hope you all learned something. "Muscles" is incredibly overrated.

[LAZERUSS]

The weight lifting fad isn't just taking college campuses by storm, but also basketball training and is one of the reasons for an inferior product.

All you have to do is look at players from the past 10-15 years compared to pre 00s and it's obvious they are "buffer".

However this isn't always a good thing.

I sit here with good reason in saying that the weight lifting fad is the number one reason for why injuries are so common in todays league compared to the past.

The most guilty are the 7 footers. Haing a 7 foot frame alone puts tremendous stress on ones joints. But then to top it all off have pounds and pounds of uneeded muscle?
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/sports/2006-12/25/xin_40120325085406343785.jpg

We will use Yao Ming as an example. However he is just one of the many recent bigmen whose larger than necessary frames have resulted in a career ending. (Oden, Bynum to name another few). These guys have legit 7+ foot frames and were heavy as shit. Its not a matter of when the sports injury will occur, but when.

Yao Ming came into the league pretty damn skinny and weak. Conveniently enough he also played every single game. Soon he became one of the strongest guys in the league. His legs were massive, and he was just a beast.....The problem is as soon as he did he couldn't stay on the court.

Even Shaq became injury prone as shit. I see it as pure luck that he was able to have 3 years in a row that were relatively injury free(00-02) however that didn't last long.

http://kellylowenstein.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/kareem-abduljabbar-and-bruce-lee11.jpg

Now we look here at a guy like Kareem Abdul Jabbar. He was an absolute stick for nearly his entire career. But he had LONGEVITY. And he won because of that. Before the 90s or so this was the typical physique for an NBA player....and despite sports science not being "as advanced" as now, the injuries were FAR fewer. "Having big muscle" as a necessity is one of the biggest crocks of shit to ever come out. This isn't bodybuilding. Whenever you see a prospect in the draft you will see unathletic message board posters write "he is too skinny, he needs to bulk up" where as that is one of the least important qualities there is.

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/PJ-BO973_SP_COU_DV_20130619174222.jpg
http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2011/0518/nba_g_kddirk_576.jpg
http://cdn-jpg.si.com/sites/default/files/si/2011/writers/michael_rosenberg/05/11/garnett.trash.talking/kg///kg-heat.jpg

Now here are 3 bigmen who have had incredible longevity. Tim Duncan in particular is someone to note. Tim Duncan when losing a bunch of weight and looking really skinny pretty much revolutionied his career a few years ago. He was on a steady downhill in the late 00s, but when he lost the weight he actually improved as a player. Practically unheard of for a guy in his 30s.

I hope you all learned something. "Muscles" is incredibly overrated.

http://i377.photobucket.com/albums/oo219/mlalli01/mk9pts.jpg

[buddha]

so this is why LeBron is always injured.

[Rocketswin2013]

Shaq was the most impressive. The Guy was at 380 in the '02 playoffs. Unreal that he was relatively healthy throughout his career.

[Nuff Said]

I agree somewhat. Having big muscular arms does nothing for basketball. I do think it's good to do core exercises tho and build up the legs as well. But you really don't need upper body strength as a ball player. I think the lighter you are the better. Bicep curls and sit-ups do nothing for basketball.

[TonyMontana]

http://i377.photobucket.com/albums/oo219/mlalli01/mk9pts.jpg

Here is what Wilt looked like in the prime of his career.

http://www.lagranepoca.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/nodo_fotos/wilt_chamberlain.jpg

He got bigger muscles later, but he was clearly at his best when he had that twig track star body.... when he got bigger, coincidentally enough he got injured.

[LAZERUSS]

[QUOTE=TonyMontana]Here is what Wilt looked like in the prime of his career.



So a pre-NBA Wilt was in the prime of his career?

[TonyMontana]

I agree somewhat. Having big muscular arms does nothing for basketball. I do think it's good to do core exercises tho and build up the legs as well. But you really don't need upper body strength as a ball player. I think the lighter you are the better. Bicep curls and sit-ups do nothing for basketball.

Weight lifting has become a fad. It's not hard to see why though.

1. it is easy as **** to do. You only do the movement for a few reps, and then you stand around waiting for a couple of minutes dicking around.

2. people like the look it gives them. even though the muscles are better for show than for performance.

[TonyMontana]

So a pre-NBA Wilt was in the prime of his career?

Can you edit your post and remove the image? I edited it for reason. It ****s the page up.

http://media.tumblr.com/e5b8990f17d46f920d6279da2b9eeb10/tumblr_inline_mjyy7mshLc1qz4rgp.jpg

[Jameerthefear]

i think skinny but muscular track star build is the best for basketball which is a cardio sport, so i agree with OP for the most part.

[eriX]

Weightlifting can build muscle or strength, you don't have to be looking like Mr. Olympus to be weight lifting, every single one you mentioned would've lift weights for strength building purposes :facepalm

[plowking]

Weightlifting has one of the lowest injury rates, if not the lowest out of all pro sports.

You only become better with weight training. They have the best strength coaches in the world. They aren't doing stupid, pointless exercises. They're having them do functional strength exercises, not bodybuilding shit.

[LAZERUSS]

Can you edit your post and remove the image? I edited it for reason. It ****s the page up.

http://media.tumblr.com/e5b8990f17d46f920d6279da2b9eeb10/tumblr_inline_mjyy7mshLc1qz4rgp.jpg

That was an early Sixers Wilt...

how about a 315 lb. Chamberlain in 1964...

http://www.si.com/vault/1964/03/02/608684/meet-the-new-wilt-chamberlain


With Chamberlain now doing what everyone expected of him all along, San Francisco fans are coming back. They like him and his perpetual-motion supporting cast, and they like winning. About the only people not happy are the Warriors' opponents. The St. Louis Hawks' 6-foot-9, 240-pound Zelmo Beaty, for example, found out recently that he can no longer take Chamberlain's great strength for granted. Unable to slow Wilt down with conventional maltreatment, Beaty tried to yank his shorts off. Chamberlain, who can press 400 pounds without breathing hard, makes it a point to control his temper, primarily because he is genuinely afraid he might kill somebody. Beaty's unethical yank, however, was too much. Wilt flicked an arm, and Beaty flew across the floor like a man shot out of a cannon. Referee Mendy Rudolph rushed over to him and said: "For God's sake, stay down, man. Don't even twitch a muscle." Beaty didn't twitch, and he is still active in the NBA.

[Fowl]

Ummmm..... THis guy played in the 90s.

http://www.sikids.com/sites/default/files/multimedia/photo_gallery/1008/karl.malone.rare.photos/images/malone-bicep.jpg

http://www.muscleandfitness.com/sites/muscleandfitness.com/files/karl_malone_rotator.jpg

[Fowl]

And this guy...
http://www.basketball-reference.com/images/players/robinda01.jpg

[Fowl]

And one of the most jacked dudes in the NBA (Top 5 most muscles) is also the most durable.

http://i534.photobucket.com/albums/ee350/Jarg007/lebron_james_2.jpg

[TonyMontana]

Weightlifting has one of the lowest injury rates, if not the lowest out of all pro sports.

You only become better with weight training. They have the best strength coaches in the world. They aren't doing stupid, pointless exercises. They're having them do functional strength exercises, not bodybuilding shit.

These guys arn't getting injured during the weight lifting activity.

They are getting injured because weight lifting/mass building puts unnecessary mass on their frames which is a liability in basketball, particularly towards the risk of getting injured.

There is literally nothing the extra mass helps for except maybe your ego when fighting for post position for a few seconds.


And this guy...
http://www.basketball-reference.com/images/players/robinda01.jpg

To be fair David Robinson actually had a pretty slight frame. Yes he was ripped to shit, but thats mostly because of his mucle insertions and extremely low body fat. He was much lighter than a lot of other centers who had injury history.

as for Karl Malone you have me there. He basically counteracts everything I am saying. For now I put him as an outlier.


That was an early Sixers Wilt...

how about a 315 lb. Chamberlain in 1964...

http://www.si.com/vault/1964/03/02/608684/meet-the-new-wilt-chamberlain

Are you implying Wilt wasn't at his best right at the beginning of his career? He pretty much was. His 50 PPG year was his third season. Wilts game wasn't about skill, so its not like he learned things later in his career(aside from the mental side of the game). He dominated because of his height,length and athletisicm.

Even if he benched 400 pounds at the time(I dont believe that he did) I highly doubt that he worked with weights on a consistent basis. He was just a genetic freak if anything.

[Spurs5Rings2014]

It's genetics. Weight lifting has nothing to do with it. Also, as already pointed out, not all weight lifting is purely to build mass.

[BlakFrankWhite]

Ummmm..... THis guy played in the 90s.

http://www.sikids.com/sites/default/files/multimedia/photo_gallery/1008/karl.malone.rare.photos/images/malone-bicep.jpg

http://www.muscleandfitness.com/sites/muscleandfitness.com/files/karl_malone_rotator.jpg


Malone was a freak of nature...damn

[plowking]

These guys arn't getting injured during the weight lifting activity.

They are getting injured because weight lifting/mass building puts unnecessary mass on their frames which is a liability in basketball, particularly towards the risk of getting injured.

There is literally nothing the extra mass helps for except maybe your ego when fighting for post position for a few seconds.



A lot of these guys aren't putting on a lot of size. It is simply repeated actions creating more efficient muscles. No one is telling these dudes to add an insane amount of size unless absolutely necessary. Corey Brewer would undoubtably benefit from it, as far as one example I can think of.

I just don't see how you don't think doing squats and developing a better core won't help you with your vertical, or first step. It will. Undoubtably. They've done studies on it. I remember reading one recently saying after 3 months of squatting, the average vertical jump increase was around 2-3 inches.

[bdreason]

These guys are doing full body workouts for the most part. They aren't isolating muscles and training for bulk.

[ProfessorMurder]

Flexibility > strength
cardio > strength

OP is partially right.

I wouldn't blame it for injuries but it certainly doesn't help things some of the time. There are points of diminishing returns.

[outbreak]

I agree and disagree. Some frames are built for muscle others aren't. It's the players with frames that aren't built to be body builders who cause themselves injury working out to much. Cricket has had the same problem with players being injury prone due to working out and building up unneeded muscle. Big men in the nba need strength to get a good position in the paint but they don't need to be ripped for that they mainly need a good core and leg strength

[SHAQisGOAT]

:rolleyes:

19 seasons
http://l1.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/YQTDYiDZsDxrxgE7AJVRrA--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTYwMA--/http://l.yimg.com/os/publish-images/sports/2013-07-27/1942ddc9-ca35-47cc-8a4b-e24a3dcb045b_Karl-Malone-greatest.jpg

19 seasons
http://lakersblog.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c506253ef0154354aa4d4970c-pi

17 seasons
http://media.oregonlive.com/behindblazersbeat/photo/buck-williamsjpg-aeb7e1bc8a37657e_large.jpg

14 seasons
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_nmHlqBtuOwk/TCozcC7wbnI/AAAAAAAACb4/s5Y9XAn5V5I/s1600/thurmond.jpg

13 seasons
http://www.ballerstatus.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/2012-06-01-woo.jpg

14 seasons
http://www.legendsofbasketball.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/robinda01-e1328893067274.jpg

15 seasons
http://www.mainlineautographs.com/images/product_pics/dantley0001_20100627248.gif

14 seasons
http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/teamsites/images/legacy/pistons/rodman_300_110211.jpg

15 seasons
http://www.kingzkrib.com/uploads/2/9/5/7/2957210/1482576_orig.jpg

..........

Not even going into medicine advancements, and all the other "luxuries" you can think of...


-> Agree with the OP's premise though.

[SHAQisGOAT]

A lot of these guys aren't putting on a lot of size. It is simply repeated actions creating more efficient muscles. No one is telling these dudes to add an insane amount of size unless absolutely necessary. Corey Brewer would undoubtably benefit from it, as far as one example I can think of.

I just don't see how you don't think doing squats and developing a better core won't help you with your vertical, or first step. It will. Undoubtably. They've done studies on it. I remember reading one recently saying after 3 months of squatting, the average vertical jump increase was around 2-3 inches.

Think Brewer's game would take a negative hit if he did that, tbh.

Some players are just better like that and would be overdoing it otherwise...
Michael Cooper is one of the best examples I can think of, for the start of the season he'd always get down to his playing weight of 175/180 lbs, and I'd say rightfully so because if he'd put on more weight, he wouldn't be as good at doing what he did, his style/game would suffer.

[Maga_1]

This is probably the worst thread i've ever read in ISH and that is saying a lot.
And basketball is not a cardio sport, just saying.

[CavaliersFTW]

Kareem lifted weights OP...

Thus destroying your entire argument.

[CavaliersFTW]

Here is what Wilt looked like in the prime of his career.

http://www.lagranepoca.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/nodo_fotos/wilt_chamberlain.jpg

He got bigger muscles later, but he was clearly at his best when he had that twig track star body.... when he got bigger, coincidentally enough he got injured.
He played some of his absolute heaviest seasons between 1963-65, peaking at 320lbs. Was putting up 45ppg playing 47mpg for 80 game seasons without missing a beat.

He was fine during his heavier seasons. And as a 310lb 36 year old man he played every minute of the playoffs, and averaged 47mpg for the season while finishing 4th in MVP votes, leading league in rebounds and blocked shots, and breaking/shattering the field goal percent record.

Either you're injury prone, or your not. Weight lifting as far as I know is not proven to increase risk of injury, in fact I'm pretty sure strengthening your body would serve to decrease risk of injury if anything.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Kareem lifted weights OP...

Thus destroying your entire argument.

Also practiced martial-arts, did yoga... One of the best conditioned athletes, that's why he had tremendous longevity even as a 7'2 player (having the best offensive weapon in your arsenal helps a lot with that also though).

[GIF REACTION]

A lot of uneducated, never lifted in their life idiots here. Plowking is right.

These players have the best strength and conditioning coaches in the world, access to the best treatment/massage/etc in the world.

You may have a slight point OP but it is a stupid and misinformed one. Players are better athletes today, and the weight to power output is incredibly higher across the board when compared to 50 years ago. It is not extra bulk but the fact that these players are moving with alot more explosion and ferocity. The more explosive you move, the higher chance muscles, ligaments, have of getting injured theoretically... But thinking that way doesn't account for the movement capacity that quality strength training offers... the neurological muscular adaptions, using your muscles more efficiently... Then you have other adaptions over time like increased bone density and stronger ligaments and connective tissues...

Basically, you have more injuries on the court because the game and talent pool is infinitely larger, you have more elite level athleticism across the board... And any time you kick it to max gear, you are putting yourself in a more compromising position if you lose balance or mistep when compared to a 60's athlete who wasn't nearly as explosive. That said, it is not as if players are getting injured every day... The game is transitioning to a faster pace, and favors the most athletic... but they still need to be able to shoot, pass....

Curry is a perfect example of the power to weight ratio done right. He deadlifted 405 and he weighs 180... Even if you just watch him pre game... He does a very smart warm up with a trainer that targets and pre exhausts his hip/trunk stabilizers... And when he plays he does so in a very controlled manner, no unnatural, forced movements. Lebron is like this too... Makes him come off as very stiff in movement, but he rarely gets injured (combination of quality strength training, genetics, HGH usage + anabolics, knowing how to move properly and efficiently)

[GIF REACTION]

Any time you turn up the volume, you're going to risk waking up the neighbors. Doesn't mean you shouldn't, because a louder party is usually a better party.

Better athletes better players...

[HALLandOATES]

Any1 else notice how much bigger iggys,arms/neck/shoulders were then lebrons during the finals?? I mean lebron might weigh more but iggy has to be close because he looks like the biggest mofo in the nba pound 4 pound,Westbrook is a close 2nd...

lebron muscles just don't pop this season like they used to,he looks 275ish 2 years ago and now like 250ish,Iggy looks 250 as well but he's almost 2-3 inches shorter.

[SyRyanYang]

Weightlifting doesn't equal bodybuilding. Being strong and explosive doesn't equal being jacked.

[PsychoBe]

A lot of uneducated, never lifted in their life idiots here. Plowking is right.

These players have the best strength and conditioning coaches in the world, access to the best treatment/massage/etc in the world.

You may have a slight point OP but it is a stupid and misinformed one. Players are better athletes today, and the weight to power output is incredibly higher across the board when compared to 50 years ago. It is not extra bulk but the fact that these players are moving with alot more explosion and ferocity. The more explosive you move, the higher chance muscles, ligaments, have of getting injured theoretically... But thinking that way doesn't account for the movement capacity that quality strength training offers... the neurological muscular adaptions, using your muscles more efficiently... Then you have other adaptions over time like increased bone density and stronger ligaments and connective tissues...

Basically, you have more injuries on the court because the game and talent pool is infinitely larger, you have more elite level athleticism across the board... And any time you kick it to max gear, you are putting yourself in a more compromising position if you lose balance or mistep when compared to a 60's athlete who wasn't nearly as explosive. That said, it is not as if players are getting injured every day... The game is transitioning to a faster pace, and favors the most athletic... but they still need to be able to shoot, pass....

Curry is a perfect example of the power to weight ratio done right. He deadlifted 405 and he weighs 180... Even if you just watch him pre game... He does a very smart warm up with a trainer that targets and pre exhausts his hip/trunk stabilizers... And when he plays he does so in a very controlled manner, no unnatural, forced movements. Lebron is like this too... Makes him come off as very stiff in movement, but he rarely gets injured (combination of quality strength training, genetics, HGH usage + anabolics, knowing how to move properly and efficiently)

you're missing the point.

a basketball player's strength relies in the strength of their core, legs, and their physical conditioning (how long their body can move at maximum effort before it needs to rest).

but if you bulk-up unnecessarily (biceps/triceps/pecs etc) and stress your joints then your body will break down faster, it's just a fact, especially due to all the movement you have to do on the basketball court.

if you see bruce lee for example, he was extremely powerful, but you wouldn't know it by looking at him. why is that? because he practiced cardio intensely. he knew that too much mass would slow him down so that's why he would always place an emphasis on his cardio so that his body would stay slim and toned because too much bulk would slow him down.

people use karl malone as an example but he put in an immense amount of work on his cardio (someone said that he worked out 6-8 hours a day) so that his body was well conditioned for the stress of the basketball court (running and stopping, twisting, turning, etc).

it's like players nowadays have turned ussj instead of ssj2, thinking that they have found the secret when in reality they have only stifled themselves.

here's a good informational video that describes what has happened to the league.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1iF9OSYHlY

[AboutBuckets]

Lebron is like this too... Makes him come off as very stiff in movement, but he rarely gets injured (combination of quality strength training, genetics, HGH usage + anabolics, knowing how to move properly and efficiently)

lmao that whole post just to throw the jab at Lebron, well done :applause:

[LBJ 23]

Weightlifting has one of the lowest injury rates, if not the lowest out of all pro sports.

You only become better with weight training. They have the best strength coaches in the world. They aren't doing stupid, pointless exercises. They're having them do functional strength exercises, not bodybuilding shit.


I agree with you with everything. But I will never forget once watching a youtube vid of Hibbert doing trap deadlifts with basketball shoes....I mean when I train I make sure to deadlift barefooted or with flat shoes, not with some basketball squishy shoes, let alone if you're a 7 footer who is probably even more prone to the slightest mistakes when weightlifting.

[I<3NBA]

steroids cause bones to be brittle. i suspect that PG injury is because of steroid overuse. that guy in NCAA that had his leg just break has his legs broken definitely because of steroid overuse.

[LAZERUSS]

Injuries have been part of most all major sports, and for years.

[warriorfan]

WOAT thread

[sd3035]

This guy was trying to flex but had no muscles :lol

http://thedailyworld.com/sites/thedailyworld.com/files/article/55196_web_Jocks-wilt-3-col-BW.jpg

[sportjames23]

This is probably the worst thread i've ever read in ISH and that is saying a lot.
And basketball is not a cardio sport, just saying.


Dude, really? This is no where near some of the worst threads ever at ISH. Matter fact, it's a pretty good thread with interesting debate.

[Chadwin]

Remember when Chris Bosh got up to 250 and then subsequently had knee issues?

[jongib369]

This guy was trying to flex but had no muscles :lol

http://thedailyworld.com/sites/thedailyworld.com/files/article/55196_web_Jocks-wilt-3-col-BW.jpg

http://cache1.asset-cache.net/gc/515102761-wilt-chamberlain-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=X7WJLa88Cweo9HktRLaNXmt8aqiXk1zF%2bmYm11YoPvo3F8 g8Y9zh9Rr1Ytr4i9ANRdKJbXnTMmtTlOclnJrV7A%3d%3d

http://cache3.asset-cache.net/gc/515102767-wilt-chamberlain-gettyimages.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=X7WJLa88Cweo9HktRLaNXq8wC96%2fYXMvZWYxgbj%2bc0xW E4Yio2IoJMekP1K4iKQnSSo2o%2fhr2BuNdRoY%2bR3%2f7A%3 d%3d

He obviously had some weight training in his playing days...Imagine if he played today with the new focus on it

:eek:

Though I'll admit, it looks like he skipped leg day

[Maga_1]

Dude, really? This is no where near some of the worst threads ever at ISH. Matter fact, it's a pretty good thread with interesting debate.

I'm talking about the content, 90% of the inputs have been wrong.
I'm saying this not because i know everything about the subject but because i'm building a high level trainning progrm specific for basketball players in off season.

[eliteballer]

The problem is when guys add too much upper body mass and not enough in the legs to support it(ie McGrady).

[GIF REACTION]

you're missing the point.

a basketball player's strength relies in the strength of their core, legs, and their physical conditioning (how long their body can move at maximum effort before it needs to rest).

but if you bulk-up unnecessarily (biceps/triceps/pecs etc) and stress your joints then your body will break down faster, it's just a fact, especially due to all the movement you have to do on the basketball court.

if you see bruce lee for example, he was extremely powerful, but you wouldn't know it by looking at him. why is that? because he practiced cardio intensely. he knew that too much mass would slow him down so that's why he would always place an emphasis on his cardio so that his body would stay slim and toned because too much bulk would slow him down.

people use karl malone as an example but he put in an immense amount of work on his cardio (someone said that he worked out 6-8 hours a day) so that his body was well conditioned for the stress of the basketball court (running and stopping, twisting, turning, etc).

it's like players nowadays have turned ussj instead of ssj2, thinking that they have found the secret when in reality they have only stifled themselves.

here's a good informational video that describes what has happened to the league.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1iF9OSYHlY
I can just tell from this post you've never been a real athlete before

You missed my point entirely. But that's okay, i wouldn't expect someone like you to understand much.

I'll give you some basic hints.

1. Movement
2. Power/stremgth to weight ratio

[Maga_1]

A lot of uneducated, never lifted in their life idiots here. Plowking is right.

These players have the best strength and conditioning coaches in the world, access to the best treatment/massage/etc in the world.

You may have a slight point OP but it is a stupid and misinformed one. Players are better athletes today, and the weight to power output is incredibly higher across the board when compared to 50 years ago. It is not extra bulk but the fact that these players are moving with alot more explosion and ferocity. The more explosive you move, the higher chance muscles, ligaments, have of getting injured theoretically... But thinking that way doesn't account for the movement capacity that quality strength training offers... the neurological muscular adaptions, using your muscles more efficiently... Then you have other adaptions over time like increased bone density and stronger ligaments and connective tissues...

Basically, you have more injuries on the court because the game and talent pool is infinitely larger, you have more elite level athleticism across the board... And any time you kick it to max gear, you are putting yourself in a more compromising position if you lose balance or mistep when compared to a 60's athlete who wasn't nearly as explosive. That said, it is not as if players are getting injured every day... The game is transitioning to a faster pace, and favors the most athletic... but they still need to be able to shoot, pass....

Curry is a perfect example of the power to weight ratio done right. He deadlifted 405 and he weighs 180... Even if you just watch him pre game... He does a very smart warm up with a trainer that targets and pre exhausts his hip/trunk stabilizers... And when he plays he does so in a very controlled manner, no unnatural, forced movements. Lebron is like this too... Makes him come off as very stiff in movement, but he rarely gets injured (combination of quality strength training, genetics, HGH usage + anabolics, knowing how to move properly and efficiently)

This is actually very accurate :applause:

[jongib369]

Trap bar deadlift? Higher starting point? Why not just do normal deadlifts :lol

Its done him well, I just don't get it. Are his trainers to lazy too make sure he does proper form?

[GIF REACTION]

Trap bar deadlift? Higher starting point? Why not just do normal deadlifts :lol
Yeah I'd personally opt for a conventional for more posterior chain focus because most basketball players are extremely quad dominant from the nature of playing ball.... Trap seems like it would have more carry over for basketball but most ball players need a lot more posterior chain work to counteract and balance all that jumping knee dominant stuff they do...

Then again maybe they use the trap bar for safety because not many would know proper conventional form... Probs balance it out with other posterior chain work

[Maga_1]

Trap bar deadlift? Higher starting point? Why not just do normal deadlifts :lol

Its done him well, I just don't get it. Are his trainers to lazy too make sure he does proper form?

It's to prevent the bad angles in his knees because of how tall he is, it's actually smart for a tall person to do in a trap bar.
Higher starting point will make him do the deadlift without hurting is back or creating a bad angle of his body.

[Maga_1]

You guys need to definitelly check the workouts done on P3, most of them are still unconventional or just not known but they do an awesome work in Santa Barbara... that's why more and more well known sports players go there now.

[jongib369]

It's to prevent the bad angles in his knees because of how tall he is, it's actually smart for a tall person to do in a trap bar.
Higher starting point will make him do the deadlift without hurting is back or creating a bad angle of his body.
I've seen Roy Hibbert do them, which is understandable...But Steph is 6'2 w/o shoes, with a 6'3 Wingspan. He should be able to do them just fine.

Guess it doesn't matter considering his results

[Maga_1]

I've seen Roy Hibbert do them, which is understandable...But Steph is 6'2 w/o shoes, with a 6'3 Wingspan. He should be able to do them just fine.

Guess it doesn't matter considering his results

I still think it's about the corporal stance.
I've seen plenty of basketball specific workouts and they mostly use that.

[iznogood]

Basketball players don't deadlift from the floor because the risk of injury the first couple of inches bring is not proportionate to the benefits it brings.

[gilalizard]

...why injuries are so common in todays league compared to the past.

Is this true? Are injuries happening at a significantly higher rate than in decades past?

[PsychoBe]

I can just tell from this post you've never been a real athlete before

You missed my point entirely. But that's okay, i wouldn't expect someone like you to understand much.

I'll give you some basic hints.

1. Movement
2. Power/stremgth to weight ratio

you say i missed your point, then you turned around and agreed with what i said :facepalm

let me simplify this for you since you sound really confused right now

if your upper body is heavier than your lower body, your lower body will buckle under the weight of your upper body. if you want to prevent that from happening, then focus more on core/leg/back strength to help stabilize your other muscle groups so that your body and joints can better handle the stress of the basketball court.

was that simple enough for you?

[jstern]

I think the best way to prevent injuries for an NBA player is absolute proper preparation, without shortcuts, and proper and efficient footwork in the way you run, and do your moves. The latter one is harder to explain.

[PsychoBe]

I think the best way to prevent injuries for an NBA player is absolute proper preparation, without shortcuts, and proper and efficient footwork in the way you run, and do your moves. The latter one is harder to explain.

this too derrick rose for instance used to always skip his warm-up drills which was retarded

[Kobe_6/8]

Is this true? Are injuries happening at a significantly higher rate than in decades past?

I doubt it.

With the medical advances of today, there's more injuries possible than there were in decades past.

Also with the internet, today we hear injuries the second they happen. Back in the day, a team could keep injuries under wraps and come up with a good cover story.

[Kobe_6/8]

I doubt it.

With the medical advances of today, there's more injuries possible than there were in decades past.

Also with the internet, today we hear injuries the second they happen. Back in the day, a team could keep injuries under wraps and come up with a good cover story.


this too derrick rose for instance used to always skip his warm-up drills which was retarded

The GOAT basketball player in my gym class always skipped warm-ups. Never got injured tho.

[funnystuff]

Any1 else notice how much bigger iggys,arms/neck/shoulders were then lebrons during the finals?? I mean lebron might weigh more but iggy has to be close because he looks like the biggest mofo in the nba pound 4 pound,Westbrook is a close 2nd...

lebron muscles just don't pop this season like they used to,he looks 275ish 2 years ago and now like 250ish,Iggy looks 250 as well but he's almost 2-3 inches shorter.
Iggy is ripped but Lebron is 10x stronger than the guy.


Muscle size doesn't equal strength. God some people :lol :facepalm

[funnystuff]

you're missing the point.

a basketball player's strength relies in the strength of their core, legs, and their physical conditioning (how long their body can move at maximum effort before it needs to rest).

but if you bulk-up unnecessarily (biceps/triceps/pecs etc) and stress your joints then your body will break down faster, it's just a fact, especially due to all the movement you have to do on the basketball court.

if you see bruce lee for example, he was extremely powerful, but you wouldn't know it by looking at him. why is that? because he practiced cardio intensely. he knew that too much mass would slow him down so that's why he would always place an emphasis on his cardio so that his body would stay slim and toned because too much bulk would slow him down.

people use karl malone as an example but he put in an immense amount of work on his cardio (someone said that he worked out 6-8 hours a day) so that his body was well conditioned for the stress of the basketball court (running and stopping, twisting, turning, etc).

it's like players nowadays have turned ussj instead of ssj2, thinking that they have found the secret when in reality they have only stifled themselves.

here's a good informational video that describes what has happened to the league.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1iF9OSYHlY
I don't agree with you on some points but gah damn, this is on point. :applause:


Iggy would benefit a lot more, in the game of BASKETBALL, if he stopped trying to get bigger. Bulk is not for sports. All it does is slow you down.

[tmacattack33]

Many of the currently injured players are not super buff or anything:

Derrick Rose
Durant
Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love
Joel Embiid
Anthony Parker



And here are the recent super-stars who had injuries kill their careers...none of these guys were super-buff either:

Penny
Grant Hill
T-mac
Brandon Roy

[plowking]

Trap bar deadlift? Higher starting point? Why not just do normal deadlifts :lol

Its done him well, I just don't get it. Are his trainers to lazy too make sure he does proper form?

Why do people keep shitting on the trap bar deadlift? I've done it like twice myself just to try it out and it is an exercise like any other. You use it to focus on particular things.

Don't want to get an extremely thick trunk, and focus more on glutes? Trap bar deadlift seems fine.

[funnystuff]

Why do people keep shitting on the trap bar deadlift? I've done it like twice myself just to try it out and it is an exercise like any other. You use it to focus on particular things.

Don't want to get an extremely thick trunk, and focus more on glutes? Trap bar deadlift seems fine.
Deadlifts are more a dick measuring contest than an actual lift.


Not to mention, why **** your back up?

[hawke812]

Weight lifting has become a fad. It's not hard to see why though.

1. it is easy as **** to do. You only do the movement for a few reps, and then you stand around waiting for a couple of minutes dicking around.

2. people like the look it gives them. even though the muscles are better for show than for performance.

1. Bball players don't work out at Planet Fitness. And they have strength coaches. Pretty sure they would get fired for letting the players stand around:lol

2. :roll: :roll: :roll:

[hawke812]

Deadlifts are more a dick measuring contest than an actual lift.


Not to mention, why **** your back up?

Deadlifts are the best core exercise on the planet:lol

[plowking]

Deadlifts are more a dick measuring contest than an actual lift.


Not to mention, why **** your back up?

Deadlifts are awesome for building a strong core and to work on general explosiveness.

[sd3035]

Deadlifts are more a dick measuring contest than an actual lift.


Not to mention, why **** your back up?

Confirmed idiot who has never lifted :facepalm

[Beastmode88]

Deadlifts are more a dick measuring contest than an actual lift.


Not to mention, why **** your back up?

This confirmed you don't lift. Go outside to get some sunlight.

[iamgine]

It's less about weight lifting and more about using the right muscle.

When you jump/run, if you land using the wrong muscle, you will hurt your knee. It might not show in the short term but it will definitely show long term. Never let force travels up your knee, take it up the butt instead. No, seriously, the gluteous maximus or butt muscle are where you want the force to travel to since it's the strongest/largest muscle. A lot of people don't know how to do this consistently thus why they get hurt, especially considering the rigorous schedule of the NBA.

For example, in badminton, it's basic technique when you lunge you have to land on your heel even though most everything else you land on your forefoot. Why? Because lunging without landing on the heel is terrible for the knee. It's all about movement techniques and even a very fat, non muscular person won't get injured if he masters that.

[Soundwave]

Weight lifting in and of itself doesn't really harm basketball performance.

Being 10-20 pounds heavier as a result of having a lot more muscle mass does exert more stress on the knees and back when running and jumping though.

[funnystuff]

This confirmed you don't lift. Go outside to get some sunlight.
Sorry, but if you've ever been to the gym(doubt it), 99% of the people you see do not have the right form.(IE too much weight in most cases) If you aren't doing the proper weight, no matter what you can handle, you're hurting your back as much as you are "GETTING THAT CORE STRENGTH BRO". Its common sense. Then again, I see people doing deads without braces and i cringe.

http://stronglifts.com/deadlift/back-pain/


Sorry bout it, but a simple google search would suffice for the 3 of you derps. :lol

[Norcaliblunt]

Weight lifting in excess is just mental mastur bation.

[eriX]

Sorry, but if you've ever been to the gym(doubt it), 99% of the people you see do not have the right form.(IE too much weight in most cases) If you aren't doing the proper weight, no matter what you can handle, you're hurting your back as much as you are "GETTING THAT CORE STRENGTH BRO". Its common sense. Then again, I see people doing deads without braces and i cringe.

http://stronglifts.com/deadlift/back-pain/


Sorry bout it, but a simple google search would suffice for the 3 of you derps. :lol

so because apparently "99%" of people don't have the right form people shouldn't do deadlift? Logic 10/10.

[PsychoBe]

It's less about weight lifting and more about using the right muscle.

When you jump/run, if you land using the wrong muscle, you will hurt your knee. It might not show in the short term but it will definitely show long term. Never let force travels up your knee, take it up the butt instead. No, seriously, the gluteous maximus or butt muscle are where you want the force to travel to since it's the strongest/largest muscle. A lot of people don't know how to do this consistently thus why they get hurt, especially considering the rigorous schedule of the NBA.

For example, in badminton, it's basic technique when you lunge you have to land on your heel even though most everything else you land on your forefoot. Why? Because lunging without landing on the heel is terrible for the knee. It's all about movement techniques and even a very fat, non muscular person won't get injured if he masters that.

this is correct. derrick rose (i hate to pick on him) used to jump and stomp on a dime on his heels as hard as he could and it would completely shred his knees

[LONGTIME]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UZHHdU_tRk At the end of the day.... YOU CAN DO WHATEVER THE F#CK YOU WANNA DO!!! :lol

[GIF REACTION]

you say i missed your point, then you turned around and agreed with what i said :facepalm

let me simplify this for you since you sound really confused right now

if your upper body is heavier than your lower body, your lower body will buckle under the weight of your upper body. if you want to prevent that from happening, then focus more on core/leg/back strength to help stabilize your other muscle groups so that your body and joints can better handle the stress of the basketball court.

was that simple enough for you?
This post was some cringe ass shit LMAO

Is this you? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABZTEkPu6s8

Stop thinking like a ****ing idiot and realize that basketball players don't lift like bodybuilders... Jesus christ we have some ****ing broscientists in here completely missing the point...

[plowking]

Agreed... way too much broscience in here.

People acting like players are doing bodybuilding rather than trying to increase functional strength. The major sign of a great athlete is power output, and repeated ability of that power.

A lot of these basketballers probably aren't great at moving great weights, but I can bet any money in the world that they'd be great at moving light to moderate weights at a great pace.

So in that sense, the OP's point is way off to begin with. Bodybuilding/powerlifting fad is bad for basketballers. None of them do that though. At least not the ones that are closely monitored by their strength coaches.

Weightlifting is one of the greatest things a basketballer can do for himself. It is all about being able to move weights as quickly as possible. It actually increases flexibility unlike bodybuilding and powerlifting since it focuses on drawing power from a great range of motion. Ask any Olympic weight lifter if they can bench more, or throw more above their head, and the answer will be the amount they can throw above their head. Never the case for bodybuilders or powerlifters since they don't have anywhere near the shoulder flexibility for it.

Eh, that's enough for now...

[KelticForce1349]

That was an early Sixers Wilt...

how about a 315 lb. Chamberlain in 1964...

http://www.si.com/vault/1964/03/02/608684/meet-the-new-wilt-chamberlain



HA HA HA LMAO! :roll:

These legendary tales about Wilt have me pissing laughter! I have heard and read so many ricockulous Wilt stories that I don't anything seriously about him anymore. As a matter of a fact, I don't know if I believe he actually played Basketball at all.

IF Wilt played....I bet he was a towel-waving scrub.

[PsychoBe]

This post was some cringe ass shit LMAO

Is this you? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABZTEkPu6s8

Stop thinking like a ****ing idiot and realize that basketball players don't lift like bodybuilders... Jesus christ we have some ****ing broscientists in here completely missing the point...

:facepalm

not all basketball players are well educated on the adverse effects of putting on weight could do to their bodies.

that's the entire point of the thread.

[Velocirap31]

:facepalm

not all basketball players are well educated on the adverse effects of putting on weight could do to their bodies.

that's the entire point of the thread.

They don't need to be. The professional players have professional trainers telling them what to do.

[hawke812]

Sorry, but if you've ever been to the gym(doubt it), 99% of the people you see do not have the right form.(IE too much weight in most cases) If you aren't doing the proper weight, no matter what you can handle, you're hurting your back as much as you are "GETTING THAT CORE STRENGTH BRO". Its common sense. Then again, I see people doing deads without braces and i cringe.

http://stronglifts.com/deadlift/back-pain/


Sorry bout it, but a simple google search would suffice for the 3 of you derps. :lol

They don't have coaches with them in the gym like these NBA players:hammerhead: :hammerhead: :hammerhead:

[hawke812]

They don't need to be. The professional players have professional trainers telling them what to do.

That is what these fools don't understand. The players have professional help for exercise and nutrition:lol

[GIF REACTION]

:facepalm

not all basketball players are well educated on the adverse effects of putting on weight could do to their bodies.

that's the entire point of the thread.
Please just stop posting

[Kobe_6/8]

That is what these fools don't understand. The players have professional help for exercise and nutrition:lol

Yeah the players have trainers, but they can eat whatever they want at home or workout as much/little as they want.

[funnystuff]

so because apparently "99%" of people don't have the right form people shouldn't do deadlift? Logic 10/10.
Find where I say that ha, thanks.


You're hurting your back if your form isn't spot on. And more often than not, the forms you witness are laughable.

[hawke812]

Yeah the players have trainers, but they can eat whatever they want at home or workout as much/little as they want.

Are we talking about the ones eating whatever they want and working out a little bit:hammerhead: