Trans-Pacific Partnership Deal

[KingBeasley08]

This is some big stuff that's going under the radar and no one knows what it's even about due to all the secrecy around it.

Also, Obama and the Republicans are trying to pass it while the House and Senate Democrats like Elizabeth Warren oppose it. Can any economists or wannabe-economists break this ish down? I know that the details aren't known but what are the effects this could have?

[kNIOKAS]

What do you mean it is secret?
https://www.readthetpp.com/


Ok it's secret. Well, the concerns are that it would allow for companies to sue countries in a private arbitrage court, thefore rulings would be carried out not by international or local law, but by some private entity that would cater to the interests of companies.

Another concern would be that since the security standards for goods would become equal, they would go down to the lowest denominator, therefore standards would become lowera across the countries. For example, there has been a report EU has not passed a anti-pesticide law, which was aimed to prohibit the use of cancerogenic chemicals due to the pressure from US - US does not have such regulations.

Also, it is possible that the agreement would result in a job loss for local workers, since the import of cheaper goods would increase. The deal could undermine the protectionist aspects of certain goods. The effect could (and most likely will) be similar to the effect of NAFTA agreement some time ago, where mexican farmers lost their jobs, as well as the regular people of US suffered.

There are more concerns that should be mentioned. I suggest signing the petition and read more about it.

This is petition for TTIP (US-EU):
https://stop-ttip.org/

There are different petitions against TTP (Americas):
http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/stop-the-trans-pacific
http://stopthetrap.net/

[knickballer]

You should check out Dan Carlin's recent podcast episode where he talks about secrecy in politics and specifically talked about this deal. He pretty much reiterated what you guys mentioned. That the deal has no transparancey, sets dangerous precedent, countries will lose their soveirgnty, similar to NAFTA, etc.

But it's disgusting how they don't tell anyone whats in the bill. Then they say it's a national security concern or some BS to bypass telling the public what the deal really is...

[KingBeasley08]

Looks like the Senate passed the fast track bill. The thing that really bugs me about this is that no one knows about it. The media barely covers it and for such a big deal, there is no attention focused on it

[UK2K]

Looks like the Senate passed the fast track bill. The thing that really bugs me about this is that no one knows about it. The media barely covers it and for such a big deal, there is no attention focused on it

The mob is easily distracted.

[knickballer]

Looks like the Senate passed the fast track bill. The thing that really bugs me about this is that no one knows about it. The media barely covers it and for such a big deal, there is no attention focused on it

Media intentionally focuses on trivial issues like a ****ing flag debate or race baiting topics to draw the attention of the average american. These guys will dig up incidents from the depths of America if it fits a juicy story and go on a campaign to make sure everyone is focused on it. This bill will give greater powers to multinational corporations which probably isn't the reason stations like CNN or Fox aren't focusing on the issue.

Most of the politicians are in favor of passing the bill because that's what they are being told to do and obviously when corporations and large business make up your top donors you're going to repay them..

As for the secrecy the only thing they are telling us is there's going to be increased trade, more jobs, give the "average joe" an equal chance, blah blah. The same shit they've been telling us on every bill/treaty they pass and then people wonder what happened.

PS, props to Elizabeth Warren for fighting against this or fighting for transparency. Too bad America seems content with Hilary as their choice as she's the popular pick. Always have to have the celebrity pick eh america?

[KingBeasley08]

Media intentionally focuses on trivial issues like a ****ing flag debate or race baiting topics to draw the attention of the average american. These guys will dig up incidents from the depths of America if it fits a juicy story and go on a campaign to make sure everyone is focused on it. This bill will give greater powers to multinational corporations which probably isn't the reason stations like CNN or Fox aren't focusing on the issue.

Most of the politicians are in favor of passing the bill because that's what they are being told to do and obviously when corporations and large business make up your top donors you're going to repay them..

As for the secrecy the only thing they are telling us is there's going to be increased trade, more jobs, give the "average joe" an equal chance, blah blah. The same shit they've been telling us on every bill/treaty they pass and then people wonder what happened.

PS, props to Elizabeth Warren for fighting against this or fighting for transparency. Too bad America seems content with Hilary as their choice as she's the popular pick. Always have to have the celebrity pick eh america?
Exactly. I support free trade in general but this just seems a ploy to boost up American corporations and beat China to the punch. Especially when you consider terms of the deal are rumored to include intellectual property rights.

[kNIOKAS]

Obama ran with "Nafta took our 1 million jobs" but wants to fasttrack the TPP and TTIP. Oh well, I guess he got his now..

It's good that we see signs of informed public being opposed to it. Need to get more of them informed, however.

[Derka]

The mob is easily distracted.
"Yeah this is going on...BUT THE CONFEDERATE FLAG IS FLYING SOMEWHERE AND THIS IS A GREAT OUTRAGE SO QUICK PAY ATTENTION TO THIS AND DON'T LOOK OVER THERE!"

[knickballer]

Obama ran with "Nafta took our 1 million jobs" but wants to fasttrack the TPP and TTIP. Oh well, I guess he got his now..

It's good that we see signs of informed public being opposed to it. Need to get more of them informed, however.


You know what's more hysterical is how uneducated media are on the deal. I was reading one of the papers at work the other day and there was a brief article on the TPP in the middle of the paper. In the article they didn't even bother to state what the deal was about they just reiterated: Bipartisan agreement, economic growth, Obama, creating jobs, increased trade, job creations, more jobs, JOBS!, did I mention jobs?.

No mention that the deal is secret. No mention that this deal gives special rights to already powerful corporations. No mention of how this is another NAFTA and will steal jobs away from Americans. No mention on the copyright policies. No mention of why maybe it's a good idea to see whats in the bill before they pass it?

But it's gonna create more jobs though, right?

[DCL]

But it's gonna create more jobs though, right?




yup, it will create tons of new jobs...

in vietnam, malaysia, philippines, etc

[ItsMillerTime]

So did this pass already?

[KyrieTheFuture]

Not the deal, but now they can't change provisions only ratify or reject because why would debate and compromise have a place in politics?

[DCL]

like it or not, you have no say in this.

even if you do, nobody cares.

and we dare to call this democracy. :lol

[IcanzIIravor]

Not the deal, but now they can't change provisions only ratify or reject because why would debate and compromise have a place in politics?

There are a number of politicians on both sides who are wary of the deal, so the debate over it when it comes to a vote should shed better light on what is exactly in the agreement.

[kNIOKAS]

There are a number of politicians on both sides who are wary of the deal, so the debate over it when it comes to a vote should shed better light on what is exactly in the agreement.
Well, that is a secret.

EU has made their TTIP mandate public, that means they declared what they are negotiating for, but since in the negotiations there is always the other side, the mandate has to be compromised by the definition.

So far they went as far as "debunk" "the myths" about the possible dangers of TTIP by saying "no, this is a myth, the fact is it won't happen". See for yourself, page 17:

http://trade.ec.europa.eu/doclib/docs/2015/march/tradoc_153266.pdf