Patrick Ewing pulls out his concealed pistol and shoots man attacking his sister

[HitandRun Reggie]

...and his 1 year old nephew. :eek:

http://m.fox19.com/fox19/db_347475/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=k5Gu1Z6q

oh sorry, you thought I was talking about THAT Patrick Ewing

[UK2K]

Only thing that can stop a bad guy with a gun, is a good guy with a gun.


That's when, police say, McCary pulled out a .38-caliber handgun and fired three shots at Ewing.

Ewing was not hit, but he had a gun on him and holds a permit to carry a concealed weapon. He drew his gun and fired three shots, striking McCary in the leg.

The amazing thing is that they can fire three shots a piece at each other, and only one hit the other.

Perhaps instead of holding the gun sideways...

[NumberSix]

:applause:

[GIF REACTION]

UK do you have an authority problem? Do you feel the need to dish out your own brand of law and justice?

[UK2K]

UK do you have an authority problem? Do you feel the need to dish out your own brand of law and justice?

I have zero tolerance for unnecessary violence and criminal behavior, if that is what you are asking.

I had an opportunity to dish our law, and turned it down. So, to your second question, no.

[GIF REACTION]

There's a fine line between upholding the law and being a vigilante.

Leave the gun at home.

[UK2K]

There's a fine line between upholding the law and being a vigilante.

Leave the gun at home.

Its better to have and not need, than to need and not have.

I have been carrying a gun for almost a decade now, and not once have I needed to pull it out. Knock on wood.

[Hawker]

There's a fine line between upholding the law and being a vigilante.

Leave the gun at home.
You don't even realize how much you're brainwashed to hate guns by the Australian governments. It's cute.

[GIF REACTION]

Gun related deaths/shootings/massacres have become pretty much minimal to non existent since John Howard passed the gun regulation law.

[GIF REACTION]

Guns are like Jenga blocks.

Sure, a high stack can be stable... But the foundation is weak and all it takes is one piece for the shit to come crashing down.

[UK2K]

Gun related deaths/shootings/massacres have become pretty much minimal to non existent since John Howard passed the gun regulation law.

They rounded up all 48 guns in the and destroyed them?

[GIF REACTION]

Not quite.


A nationwide gun buyback scheme also saw more than 640,000 weapons turned in to authorities.

And I'm sure there were MUCH more than that unaccounted for

[GIF REACTION]

Keep the guns at home Superman. Let the police to their jobs. Stand back. Make way. Submit to the higher power.

[UK2K]

Keep the guns at home Superman. Let the police to their jobs. Stand back. Make way. Submit to the higher power.

That's right.

When seconds count, the cops are only minutes away.

By the way, 640,000 is cool and all, but in the US we have about 270,000,000. So, 640,000 is drop in the bucket. May as well be 48.

http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s410/dguy3231/neighbor-sign.jpg

Thought this was funny. Would you be comfortable displaying your support for banning firearms? Get ya a sign.

[Lakers Legend#32]

The NRA just spooged.

[Styles p]

wish i could carry mine but nj laws suck dick.

[GIF REACTION]

Get that tough guy marine persona out of your head

This aint 1790 any more. The original purpose of the amendment that allowed the right to bare arms was fear of a tyrannical government. Is that REALLY a legitimate reason anymore? **** no.

[UK2K]

Get that tough guy marine persona out of your head

This aint 1790 any more. The original purpose of the amendment that allowed the right to bare arms was fear of a tyrannical government. Is that REALLY a legitimate reason anymore? **** no.

Again, when seconds count...

You can call me whatever you want. Doesn't change the fact that I can give you thousands of examples of guns saving lives, and thousands upon thousands more examples where a gun could have saved someones life.

This ain't Australia.

[GIF REACTION]

Guns were made to KILL

[UK2K]

Guns were made to KILL

Yes. And? In the event I ever need to use a gun, I don't intend to injure someone.

Don't try and twist that around to mean I want to kill someone either, because I know thats the next line in your argument.

[GIF REACTION]

Republican logic;

We'll be safer if EVERYONE has guns and they are easily accessible! Having more people with easier access to items that's MAIN purpose is to KILL. That's a sure fire piece of logic lads. The main reason why we are firmly against gun control is because some 18th century crack pipes wrote it on a piece of paper and declared it the Word of God.

[Styles p]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/veltape/unnamed_zps3121a7dd.jpg
shes purdy huh?

[4 Inches]

One time his shot didn't betray him in the clutch. :applause:

[Styles p]

Republican logic;

We'll be safer if EVERYONE has guns and they are easily accessible! Having more people with easier access to items that's MAIN purpose is to KILL. That's a sure fire piece of logic lads. The main reason why we are firmly against gun control is because some 18th century crack pipes wrote it on a piece of paper!

quick we better outlaw knives too.

[UK2K]

Republican logic;

We'll be safer if EVERYONE has guns and they are easily accessible! Having more people with easier access to items that's MAIN purpose is to KILL. That's a sure fire piece of logic lads. The main reason why we are firmly against gun control is because some 18th century crack pipes wrote it on a piece of paper!

Nope, never said everyone. I think that'd be an awful idea.

[UK2K]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/veltape/unnamed_zps3121a7dd.jpg
shes purdy huh?

Have the same one in Black.

Also have a Glock 22 and 27, the .40 versions.

[Styles p]

Have the same one in Black.

Also have a Glock 22 and 27, the .40 versions.
:cheers: if jersey laws allowed concealed carry i'd get a glock 26 or maybe the new single stack 43.

[ISHGoat]

is this the NBA patrick ewing or just some guy with the same name?

[UK2K]

is this the NBA patrick ewing or just some guy with the same name?

SGWTSN.

[Akrazotile]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/veltape/unnamed_zps3121a7dd.jpg
shes purdy huh?


Saw this posted on the real Styles P's insta just a couple days ago. Nice try.

[UK2K]

:cheers: if jersey laws allowed concealed carry i'd get a glock 26 or maybe the new single stack 43.
My brother tried to get his concealed carry in....... CHICAGO.

Said it was super expensive, several hundred dollars. I know NJ is strict, NYC too probably.

[ISHGoat]

SGWTSN.

uh what

oh I see

[Styles p]

My brother tried to get his concealed carry in....... CHICAGO.

Said it was super expensive, several hundred dollars. I know NJ is strict, NYC too probably.

only police officers and business owners who transport a lot of money can get it in nj.

[Styles p]

Saw this posted on the real Styles P's insta just a couple days ago. Nice try.
cool, would you like more pictures?

[GreggPopazit]

Oops

http://i.imgur.com/J2TCT3j.gif

[HitandRun Reggie]

Woman kills serial killer with her pistol on Saturday. I wonder if things would have worked out better if she had said, "Stop! I'm calling the police!"

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/woman-killed-alleged-serial-killer-neal-falls-recounts-final-fight/


Oops

http://i.imgur.com/J2TCT3j.gif

Naw the real PE doesn't need a gun, he can just inhale bad guys up his nostrils

[dunksby]

The US isn't a safe country, it seems reasonable to me to own a Glock, too many freaks and weirdos running wild.

[Akrazotile]

cool, would you like more pictures?



No silly, I was only being JK! :yaohappy:

[GIF REACTION]

The US isn't a safe country, it seems reasonable to me to own a Glock, too many freaks and weirdos running wild.
Then why not pass the simpliest of gun regulations to make it harder to obtain a gun? If it's that important for safety, it should be regulated to a degree.

[dunksby]

Then why not pass the simpliest of gun regulations to make it harder to obtain a gun? If it's that important for safety, it should be regulated to a degree.
At this point I don't see that ever becoming a reality or an option.

[HitandRun Reggie]

Then why not pass the simpliest of gun regulations to make it harder to obtain a gun? If it's that important for safety, it should be regulated to a degree.

There's always going to be a fight. Pro 2nd Amendment Americans are afraid even common sense things like thorough background checks, waiting periods, no over the counter sales at gun shows etc will be used a stepping stone to more strict regulations.

Best just to leave this issue to the states.

[GIF REACTION]

I do enjoy living in the best country on Earth

We have our problems though. They just don't involve guns. That's huge. I THOROUGHLY enjoy being able to live without feeling like I'm walking through a firing range knowing at any minute that I could possibly get my head blown off. It NOURISHES my soul.

[Styles p]

I do enjoy living in the best country on Earth

We have our problems though. They just don't involve guns. That's huge. I THOROUGHLY enjoy being able to live without feeling like I'm walking through a firing range knowing at any minute that I could possibly get my head blown off. It NOURISHES my soul.

don't know where you live but THERE ARE GUNS THERE criminals don't follow laws.
this video sums it up.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w80yc3bra6s

[GIF REACTION]

Using one event to try an prove a point?

Do you think these kids shooting up schools are buying these guns off the black market? I wouldn't think so. Why don't we just give every kid in the class room a gun then! LMAO. No matter how you slice it, easier access to guns is directly related to number of homicides and suicides involving a firearm. That's the clear truth. It's a logical truth. It's not about YOUR freedom. It's about the preservation of life. Nothing is more sacred than that.

You can't make knee jerk reactions based on singular events like that dude in the video was trying to make. No one said restricting guns would stop shootings forever. Human nature dictates outcome. It's been this way since the dawn of humanity. People will go to extremes to harm. You need to look at society as a whole. You can't fully stop crime. So we look at the statistics, and we restrict guns. Because someone is more likely to die when a firearm is involved. No way around that either. It's basic logic.

Basing an argument on fighting fire with fire ONLY leads to more fires. Doesn't take an idiot to understand this. This ain't a Clint Eastwood movie, pal. This ain't the wild wild west.

[UK2K]

Then why not pass the simpliest of gun regulations to make it harder to obtain a gun? If it's that important for safety, it should be regulated to a degree.
Because it's not licensed gun owners committing crimes.

You could have the strictest gun laws on the planet (like Mexico) and all that leads to is criminals owning guns.

The Randy Houser dude who shot up the theater in LA got denied a gun permit, so it clearly works. The problem is, you can obtain one illegally just as easy.

How many murders in Chicago (the 400 or so a year) are committed with legally purchased guns? Very few.

As I said, there's 270,000,000 guns here in America. Being the one person changing the world by not owning one simply makes you a target.

By the way you still haven't told me... If your neighbors put up that sign:

http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg635/mrtoolfool/my-neighbor-is-unarmed-39219775365_zps9610c800.jpg

Would you be upset?

[UK2K]

Using one event to try an prove a point?

Do you think these kids shooting up schools are buying these guns off the black market? I wouldn't think so. Why don't we just give every kid in the class room a gun then! LMAO. No matter how you slice it, easier access to guns is directly related to number of homicides and suicides involving a firearm. That's the clear truth. It's a logical truth. It's not about YOUR freedom. It's about the preservation of life. Nothing is more sacred than that.

You can't make knee jerk reactions based on singular events like that dude in the video was trying to make. No one said restricting guns would stop shootings forever. Human nature dictates outcome. It's been this way since the dawn of humanity. People will go to extremes to harm. You need to look at society as a whole. You can't fully stop crime. So we look at the statistics, and we restrict guns. Because someone is more likely to die when a firearm is involved. No way around that either. It's basic logic.

Basing an argument on fighting fire with fire ONLY leads to more fires. Doesn't take an idiot to understand this. This ain't a Clint Eastwood movie, pal. This ain't the wild wild west.
Then you're more dumb than I thought.

[dunksby]

Then you're more dumb than I thought.
*dumber.

[GIF REACTION]

Mexico is hardly a good example

It's pretty much a 3rd world country really

Developing if you want to put it that way

[UK2K]

*dumber.
I'm a traditionalist.

[GIF REACTION]

It really makes sense why a lot of American cops are excessive and brutal. I would be too if every jackass was packing heat and think they can take the law into their own hands. Fragile egos if you ask me. I've always thought guns were cowardly anyways.

[GIF REACTION]

I'm a traditionalist.
Translation: I'm stuck in the 18th century because some dude told me how to live on a piece of paper

[dunksby]

I'm a traditionalist.
Don't despair because they don't let you carry a gun even in freaking Afghanistan :lol And don't get mad, I served for two years so from one army guy to another :cheers:

[UK2K]

Don't despair because they don't let you carry a gun even in freaking Afghanistan :lol And don't get mad, I served for two years so from one army guy to another :cheers:
I was part of a security company escorting convoys. If I didn't carry a gun they would charge us.

[dunksby]

I was part of a security company escorting convoys. If I didn't carry a gun they would charge us.
You are a ****ing Merc? :facepalm

[UK2K]

Translation: I'm stuck in the 18th century because some dude told me how to live on a piece of paper
I was actually speaking to his correction of 'more dumb' to dumber.

More dumb was correct until the early 2000's.

http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg635/mrtoolfool/my-neighbor-is-unarmed-39219775365_zps9610c800.jpg

Serious question you refuse to answer... Would you be upset if your neighbors put this in their yard?

It's not a trick, I'd just like to see how anti-gun you really are, and whether you want it broadcast to the world.

[UK2K]

You are a ****ing Merc? :facepalm
No I was a marine.

We were just in really shitty areas (Sangin, Now Zad, all over Helmand).

[dunksby]

No I was a marine.

We were just in really shitty areas (Sangin, Now Zad, all over Helmand).
I can't stand those rejects, not withstanding their nationality. :mad:

[UK2K]

I can't stand those rejects, not withstanding their nationality. :mad:
I know you're talking about the Afghans. :lol

[GIF REACTION]

Well they can do what they want but that is clearly trying to instigate conflict.

I would not be upset that they wouldn't in that scenario protect another human because they can do what they want

But I find it embarrassing that someone would not protect another human purely because of difference in opinion on a topic. That to me says fragile ego. If someone would go that far to defend a belief then i SERIOUSLY question whether that person should be in possession of a firearm, and that they CLEARLY have more important problems to take care of.

The instigation of conflict would make me upset a little. It is encouraging, and potentially putting danger on me. Not because a neighbor is trying to make a point about guns and he wouldn't save me. Rather that because he is publicly sharing this, it could potentially attract the wrong crowd. That is not an issue of guns, that is an issue of ego fragility.

[dunksby]

I know you're talking about the Afghans. :lol
That goes without saying.

[Bandito]

@Gif: You actually think kids buy their guns at a gun shop?

[GIF REACTION]

No but I don't think they buy it from gangs or any other Black market type shit

With how easy it is to buy a gun, it's not that hard to get one. They are floating around everywhere. Make it harder for them to get one. Get these guns off the streets. The black market will always be there.

[dunksby]

@Gif: You actually think kids buy their guns at a gun shop?
Nah, they will just get it from their mom's collection.

[GIF REACTION]

Imagine if they introduced gun laws

The black market prices would sky rocket

Now if lil Timmy wants to shoot up the science department he'll have to use mommie's credit card with the gangsters!

[Bandito]

No but I don't think they buy it from gangs or any other Black market type shit

With how easy it is to buy a gun, it's not that hard to get one. They are floating around everywhere. Make it harder for them to get one. Get these guns off the streets. The black market will always be there.
If they dont buy it from the black market where do they buy it from. When I was a kid I could get a gun a drugs easy. I can imagine it, it hasnt change much and it has gotten very easy. Heck there was this website that got put down by the federals that use to sell a lot of things like guns, drugs and some other stuff and it works just as ebay.

Fact of the matter is I dont believe making it harder to get guns for regular law abiding citizens is going to make any difference in thugs breaking the laws and killing people.

[UK2K]

Well they can do what they want but that is clearly trying to instigate conflict.

I would not be upset that they wouldn't in that scenario protect another human because they can do what they want

But I find it embarrassing that someone would not protect another human purely because of difference in opinion on a topic. That to me says fragile ego. If someone would go that far to defend a belief then i SERIOUSLY question whether that person should be in possession of a firearm, and that they CLEARLY have more important problems to take care of.

The instigation of conflict would make me upset a little. It is encouraging, and potentially putting danger on me. Not because a neighbor is trying to make a point about guns and he wouldn't save me. Rather that because he is publicly sharing this, it could potentially attract the wrong crowd. That is not an issue of guns, that is an issue of ego fragility.

So you'll talk the anti gun game on ISH but not in public? Anyone can ask me in person if own guns, and I'll tell them absolutely. I'm not trying to hide it.

Believe me, I get your argument. At the same time, tougher gun restrictions only lead to less guns for the population who could legally carry. Criminals don't care about laws, obviously, so what does enacting stricter gun laws do?

The laws restrict just about anybody who has committed a crime, so criminals aren't supposed to have guns in the first place. They can get charged with that, sure, but so what? Chances are they're being charged with something else anyway.

I'd even like to see the renewal period set to every year, for everyone. You get retrained, requalfied, retested. A two hour (the renewal process) window once a year isn't that much to ask for.

It's not like the movies where you think a CCL holder is just going to stand up and start blasting. You've got to understand though, that the people that live in Australia are not the same people that live here. We have thousands of gangs, and millions more who are just street trash. Cartels control the southern border.

In my hometown, a mob rolled through the park and destroyed a gas station, beat up an old man, and pulled a woman from her car and destroyed it. Out of nowhere. A place I frequent fairly often.

Not only do my guns protect me, they protect my family, they protect innocent people. Hell, I'd even protect you if you needed it. That's what it's for.

Like I said, I can give you thousands of examples of guns saving lives, and thousands upon thousands more examples where guns could have prevented a crime. An assault, a rape, a murder? Happens every day.

It's just part of the world we live in.

[GIF REACTION]

If you restrict supply, you increase demand

Timmy wants to shoot up the Cafeteria but he has to wait until he makes all that extra cash in the summer working double shifts at the hotdog stand!

Saving lives.

[Bandito]

If you restrict supply, you increase demand

Timmy wants to shoot up the Cafeteria but he has to wait until he makes all that extra cash in the summer working double shifts at the hotdog stand!

Saving lives.
Timmy can't buy a gun in a gun shop so your argument is invalid.

[GIF REACTION]

Timmy can't buy a gun in a gun shop so your argument is invalid.
But he can with the Mexicans or the Bikers or the Blacks or the Russians or the Aryans.

Right?

[UK2K]

If you restrict supply, you increase demand

Timmy wants to shoot up the Cafeteria but he has to wait until he makes all that extra cash in the summer working double shifts at the hotdog stand!

Saving lives.
Like when they made drugs illegal, the country suddenly ran out of drugs.

[DonDadda59]

Get that tough guy marine persona out of your head

This aint 1790 any more. The original purpose of the amendment that allowed the right to bare arms was fear of a tyrannical government. Is that REALLY a legitimate reason anymore? **** no.

Been working on my aim. Pretty sure I can take out an F-22 or a remote-controlled drone with my glock. My militia is armed and ready if Obama gets any crazy ideas. :crazysam:

[Bandito]

But he can with the Mexicans or the Bikers or the Blacks or the Russians or the Aryans.

Right?
Yes he can. As long as he has money.

[HitandRun Reggie]

Been working on my aim. Pretty sure I can take out an F-22 or a remote-controlled drone with my glock. My militia is armed and ready if Obama gets any crazy ideas. :crazysam:

Why aim when spray and pray is so much more fun?

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view7/2857590/glock-17-o.gif

[GIF REACTION]

Yes he can. As long as he has money.
And if there are gun restrictions the black market prices will increase making it harder for Timmy to buy these automatic weapons

[GIF REACTION]

You want evidence that gun-control works? How about this. Let's look at the Homicide rates per year and the strictness of their gun laws.

Intentional Homicide Rates (Murders per 100,000 people) -
Japan - 0.3 as of 2011 (4th lowest) - Very strict anti-weapon laws from the 1600s
UK - 1.0 as of 2011 (27th lowest) - Fairly strict anti-gun laws
Australia - 1.1 as of 2012 (34th lowest) - Fairly strict anti-gun laws
USA - 4.7 as of 2012 (107th lowest/112th highest) - Minimal gun regulation
South Africa - 31.0 as of 2012 (11th highest) - Minimal gun regulation passed in 2000
Honduras - 90.6 as of 2012 (1st highest) - Literally no gun control.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate (based on UNODC murder rates)

Noticing a pattern here? More gun control means a lot less homicide. If you think the right to be able to grab an assault rifle from a gun store is gonna protect you from the government, I got news for you; it won't. Between drones, tanks, and other advanced military hardware, guns are nothing. The 2nd amendment was written in a time when the gun was the most powerful weapon and when we didn't have a proper military. Nowadays? Guns are hardly the deadliest thing out there.

If you REALLY are worried about a Tyranny, America, perhaps you should reduce the USA's military budget so they don't have the capacity to use 100s of million-dollar smart-missiles capable of individually killing more people then all USA terrorist deaths since the turn of the 21st century combined.

[Bandito]

And if there are gun restrictions the black market prices will increase making it harder for Timmy to buy these automatic weapons
But he will if he wants too. Is not like a piece is going to be thousands worth. Heck when alcohol was prohibited was when people use to buy a lot more.

[UK2K]

And if there are gun restrictions the black market prices will increase making it harder for Timmy to buy these automatic weapons
Like drugs, right?

Drugs are so hard to get and so expensive.

[Bandito]

What about Chicago?

[DonDadda59]

Why aim when spray and pray is so much more fun?

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view7/2857590/glock-17-o.gif

18th century tyranny ain't got shit on that :applause:

[GIF REACTION]

Guns and drugs are incomparable.

[UK2K]

You want evidence that gun-control works? How about this. Let's look at the Homicide rates per year and the strictness of their gun laws.

Intentional Homicide Rates (Murders per 100,000 people) -
Japan - 0.3 as of 2011 (4th lowest) - Very strict anti-weapon laws from the 1600s
UK - 1.0 as of 2011 (27th lowest) - Fairly strict anti-gun laws
Australia - 1.1 as of 2012 (34th lowest) - Fairly strict anti-gun laws
USA - 4.7 as of 2012 (107th lowest/112th highest) - Minimal gun regulation
South Africa - 31.0 as of 2012 (11th highest) - Minimal gun regulation passed in 2000
Honduras - 90.6 as of 2012 (1st highest) - Literally no gun control.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate (based on UNODC murder rates)

Noticing a pattern here? More gun control means a lot less homicide. If you think the right to be able to grab an assault rifle from a gun store is gonna protect you from the government, I got news for you; it won't. Between drones, tanks, and other advanced military hardware, guns are nothing. The 2nd amendment was written in a time when the gun was the most powerful weapon and when we didn't have a proper military. Nowadays? Guns are hardly the deadliest thing out there.

If you REALLY are worried about a Tyranny, America, perhaps you should reduce the USA's military budget so they don't have the capacity to use 100s of million-dollar smart-missiles capable of individually killing more people then all USA terrorist deaths since the turn of the 21st century combined.

Does Japan the type of crime we do? We have 66 times more rape in this country than Japan. What good does comparing crime statistics when you're comparing the melting pot of the world with 300,000,000 people to a tiny island nation with traditionalist values?

You want to know something cool about the gun homicide rate in the States? If you take out Chicago, LA, DC, Detroit, and NYC, the gun homicide rate drops to one of the lowest on earth (I want to say #180 something but don't quote me).

That's not a gun problem, that's a culture problem. Guns aren't the problem, the culture 100% is.

[Akrazotile]

I love how the debate is always about ordinary citizens legally obtaining guns rather than dealing with the repeat-offender vioent criminals who use them with or without legal obtainment.

When are we gonna talk about kicking out or putting down these people?

I guess going after criminals doesnt jive with the left wing class warfare agenda :facepalm

[UK2K]

Guns and drugs are incomparable.
What???

Whaaat???

Incomparable? How do you figure? You think if they made guns illegal here that local gangs and, even more than now, Cartels wouldn't flood this country with more?

You think they'd just be like 'nah we don't want to make profit off that'.

Get real. They'd be as easy to get as ever. The screening process catches most everyone with a criminal history, as I said. Even small crimes can bar you from owning a firearm. The system works, its the culture.

[Bandito]

I love how the debate is always about ordinary citizens legally obtaining guns rather than dealing with the repeat-offender vioent criminals who use them with or without legal obtainment.

When are we gonna talk about kicking out or putting down these people?

I guess going after criminals doesnt jive with the left wing class warfare agenda :facepalm
Cant believe I agree with him.

[DonDadda59]

What about Chicago?

Chicago has the same problem Mexico does in terms of gun control. People buy guns from states that have lax gun laws- in shops, shows, wal-mart, etc and then they sell them on the street for a profit.

Countries like Japan and the UK have the benefit of being Islands.

[GIF REACTION]

Just another flaw of the state jurisdictional style of America.

[Bandito]

Chicago has the same problem Mexico does in terms of gun control. People buy guns from states that have lax gun laws- in shops, shows, wal-mart, etc and then they sell them on the street for a profit.

Countries like Japan and the UK have the benefit of being Islands.
Well Puerto Rico is an island with strict gun laws. (trust me, cant get a gun here easily if I do it legally)

Why is gun related crime high? Getting a gun in the black market is simple though.

[DonDadda59]

Just another flaw of the state jurisdictional style of America.

Pretty much. Americans' appetite for cocaine, weed, heroin, etc is the reason why the cartels and guys like Chapo Guzman exist. Our second amendment is the biggest contributor to their gun violence issues (as it is on our side of the border in places like Chicago). As many as 3/4 guns in Mexico were purchased here.

Our legally bought guns become 'Black Market' guns.



Well Puerto Rico is an island with strict gun laws. (trust me, cant get a gun here easily if I do it legally)

Why is gun related crime high? Getting a gun in the black market is simple though.

I don't know anything about PR's gun statistics but I can imagine that commonwealth status and proximity contribute to it.

[GIF REACTION]

Tell that to little Timmy who just wants to lay some rounds into the teachers.

How on earth is a kid going to get a gun through the black market

It's highly unlikely compared to how many guns are floating around today, and so accessibly

[UK2K]

[QUOTE]They seized 7,400 guns here in crimes or unpermitted uses last year (compared with 3,285 in New York City), and have confiscated 574 guns just since Jan. 1

[Bandito]

Pretty much. Americans' appetite for cocaine, weed, heroin, etc is the reason why the cartels and guys like Chapo Guzman exist. Our second amendment is the biggest contributor to their gun violence issues (as it is on our side of the border in places like Chicago). As many as 3/4 guns in Mexico were purchased here.

Our legally bought guns become 'Black Market' guns.



I don't know anything about PR's gun statistics but I can imagine that commonwealth status and proximity contribute to it.
Do you know how far we are from the states or Colombia for that matter? Black market will always find a way.

[DonDadda59]

Check the $tats:

[INDENT]Mexican Crime, American Guns

A shocking new report obtained by ABC News says that as many as three out of four guns used in crimes in Mexico and recovered and capable of being traced can be traced to gun stores just across the border in the U.S. The numbers bolster complaints by Mexican officials that the country's unprecedented bloodshed

[HitandRun Reggie]

Do you know how far we are from the states or Colombia for that matter? Black market will always find a way.

We already have high profile American politicians flooding our streets with rocket launchers and grenades from Southeast Asia.

[DonDadda59]

Do you know how far we are from the states or Colombia for that matter? Black market will always find a way.

People keep using that term.

What is the Black Market exactly? Are you saying that guns used in murders were made in someone's basement? How does one make a bootleg assault rifle? :confusedshrug:

The 'Black Market' is made up of guns that were made in a factory, sold legally over the counter like a cheeseburger, and someone took them to other places with stricter laws and sold them illegally.

But if they don't have access to factory made weapons... how do black market profiteers make/get guns in bulk?

[GIF REACTION]

Imagine how much the black market fire arms would increase in cost if gun restrictions were put in place.

[NumberSix]

Chicago has the same problem Mexico does in terms of gun control. People buy guns from states that have lax gun laws- in shops, shows, wal-mart, etc and then they sell them on the street for a profit.
Hence, the only people in Chicago that have guns are the people who are willing to break the law to get them... while law abiding citizens are left defenseless.


Pretty much. Americans' appetite for cocaine, weed, heroin, etc is the reason why the cartels and guys like Chapo Guzman exist. Our second amendment is the biggest contributor to their gun violence issues (as it is on our side of the border in places like Chicago). As many as 3/4 guns in Mexico were purchased here.
No, their lack of a second amendment is the biggest contributor of gun violence.

The criminals in Mexico has a special super power that all other Mexican citizens don't have. It's easy to terrorize and bully a population of unarmed people when you're the only ones that have guns. If normal citizens could have guns, the criminals wouldn't have such lopsided power.

[Bandito]

People keep using that term.

What is the Black Market exactly? Are you saying that guns used in murders were made in someone's basement? How does one make a bootleg assault rifle? :confusedshrug:

The 'Black Market' is made up of guns that were made in a factory, sold legally over the counter like a cheeseburger, and someone took them to other places with stricter laws and sold them illegally.

But if they don't have access to factory made weapons... how do black market profiteers make/get guns in bulk?
Good question cause I dont know. Maybe is as you said. Mom and Pops gun shops are the reason why kids are killing people.

[NumberSix]

People keep using that term.

What is the Black Market exactly? Are you saying that guns used in murders were made in someone's basement? How does one make a bootleg assault rifle? :confusedshrug:

The 'Black Market' is made up of guns that were made in a factory, sold legally over the counter like a cheeseburger, and someone took them to other places with stricter laws and sold them illegally.

But if they don't have access to factory made weapons... how do black market profiteers make/get guns in bulk?
Largely old war stock piles.

To this day, there are still millions of soviet era AK-47s that have never fired a round. Russian mobsters sell these illegally all over the world by the truck load.

[GIF REACTION]

So your answer is to give people more guns?

Jesus ****ing christ

[NumberSix]

So your answer is to give people more guns?

Jesus ****ing christ
Yes. :hammerhead:

[RidonKs]

oh goodness not ewing ****ing goddamn :facepalm

maybe there's middle ground to be had here between the 2nd amendment and the safety concerns by giving all the guns to karl malone and letting him run a federal police force with patrick ewing as his deputy.

[Angel Face]

Only thing that can stop a bad guy with a gun, is a good guy with a gun.



The amazing thing is that they can fire three shots a piece at each other, and only one hit the other.

Perhaps instead of holding the gun sideways...

It's much harder than you think. Trigger finger, length of the barrel, target moving / not moving, target distance, can affect the accuracy of your shot. 1 small tiny flick when pressing the trigger can also determine the flight angle of your bullet.

[DonDadda59]

Hence, the only people in Chicago that have guns are the people who are willing to break the law to get them... while law abiding citizens are left defenseless.

So instead of dealing with the root cause- the easy availability of firearms to anyone willing to show up to a gun show or a Wal-Mart... your answer is to introduce more guns to what for all intent and purpose is a war zone?

OK.


No, their lack of a second amendment is the biggest contributor of gun violence.

:oldlol:

It's not. That is ridiculous. The biggest contributor to their gun violence is the American fueled drug market... which is enforced with American made/purchased guns.


The criminals in Mexico has a special super power that all other Mexican citizens don't have. It's easy to terrorize and bully a population of unarmed people when you're the only ones that have guns. If normal citizens could have guns, the criminals wouldn't have such lopsided power.

The police and army in Mexico have guns and have been engaging in open gun battles with the cartels for decades now and the problem is only getting worse as more and more American guns are flooding the streets.

But introducing even more guns will make the problem go away.

Story checks out.

[DeuceWallaces]

Gun advocates are stuck in the 70's; 1770's that is.

[longtime lurker]

Gun advocates are stuck in the 70's; 1770's that is.

Let's not mince words. The gun advocates are a bunch of low IQ small ***** dipshits. If you got rid of the entire right wing America would make a lot of progress over night.

[Akrazotile]

Let's not mince words. The gun advocates are a bunch of low IQ small ***** dipshits. If you got rid of the entire right wing America would make a lot of progress over night.



A country full of only soft white pansy liberals?? :roll:

u doormat ******* would be tied up to telephone polls so fast by gangs, cartels and muslims whom youd be too PC to resist since it might make you racist. And they'd all be running through the streets laughing and rioting while you sat tied up in your capri pants crying your eyes out worrying that one of the remarks you made before your mouth was duct taped was insensitive and might have hurt the guy with the machete's feeling :facepalm

[DonDadda59]

A country full of only soft white pansy liberals?? :roll:

u doormat ******* would be tied up to telephone polls so fast by gangs, cartels and muslims whom youd be too PC to resist since it might make you racist. And they'd all be running through the streets laughing and rioting while you sat tied up in your capri pants crying your eyes out worrying that one of the remarks you made before your mouth was duct taped was insensitive and might have hurt the guy with the machete's feeling :facepalm

http://png-2.findicons.com/files/icons/974/glyphish/16/music_note.png And then a hero comes along, with the strength to carry on... http://png-2.findicons.com/files/icons/974/glyphish/16/music_note.png

http://www.addictinginfo.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/donald-trump1.jpg

[JEFFERSON MONEY]

And you caassttt your fearss assiddee and you knoww you can surviveeeee

http://tekoagospelmusicnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Gloria-Gaynor-We-Will-Survive-CD-cover.jpg

[Akrazotile]

And you finally see the truuuuuuth....
That a hero lies in......








http://ambernagle.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/AmericanIdol_william_hung.jpg
YOUUUUUUUUU-UUUUUUUUU

[longtime lurker]

A country full of only soft white pansy liberals?? :roll:

u doormat ******* would be tied up to telephone polls so fast by gangs, cartels and muslims whom youd be too PC to resist since it might make you racist. And they'd all be running through the streets laughing and rioting while you sat tied up in your capri pants crying your eyes out worrying that one of the remarks you made before your mouth was duct taped was insensitive and might have hurt the guy with the machete's feeling :facepalm

How come this is always the right wing response to everything. Could you dip shits be any more transparent that you're actually insecure weak small dicked imbeciles? Without the right wing the US would actually make progress on education, healthcare, civil rights, you know the basic stuff that most 1st world countries are miles ahead of America on. The US wants to pat their backs on gay marriage while gay marriage in Canada has been legal for a decade. The US wants to make a big deal out of a woman president while PAKISTAN has had a female president years ago. The right wing and conservatives have always been on the wrong side of history for America and they're a net negative when you evaluate them in totality. If the right was was in control the US would be a mixture be ISIS and Saudi Arabia. And I'm dead serious when I say that.

[Akrazotile]

How come this is always the right wing response to everything. Could you dip shits be any more transparent that you're actually insecure weak small dicked imbeciles? Without the right wing the US would actually make progress on education, healthcare, civil rights, you know the basic stuff that most 1st world countries are miles ahead of America on. The US wants to pat their backs on gay marriage while gay marriage in Canada has been legal for a decade. The US wants to make a big deal out of a woman president while PAKISTAN has had a female president years ago. The right wing and conservatives have always been on the wrong side of history for America and they're a net negative when you evaluate them in totality. If the right was was in control the US would be a mixture be ISIS and Saudi Arabia. And I'm dead serious when I say that.


Who cares what gender the president is? Who cares about gay marriage in comparison to things like abused children and sky high homicide rates?


You're a beta, you arent good at anything in life, and youre like an empty nester mother begging to look after the neighbors kids. You need minorities to need you so you have some kind of meaning in life. Otherwise youre just an average, plain, scrawny, insecure cuck. Liberalism is your shield from realizing how unimportant and weak you are. As long as you can oppose conservatives, you have something to cling to.

Im tellin ya man. Take up some hobbies. Crying like a bitch doesnt count.

[Droid101]

A country full of only soft white pansy liberals?? :roll:

Says the lilly white boy literally living off mom's dime? :roll:

Yeah, tell us more bro. You've got all the answers.

[Akrazotile]

Says the lilly white boy literally living off mom's dime? :roll:

Yeah, tell us more bro. You've got all the answers.


Soon, my good man :cheers:

[longtime lurker]

Who cares what gender the president is? Who cares about gay marriage in comparison to things like abused children and sky high homicide rates?


You're a beta, you arent good at anything in life, and youre like an empty nester mother begging to look after the neighbors kids. You need minorities to need you so you have some kind of meaning in life. Otherwise youre just an average, plain, scrawny, insecure cuck. Liberalism is your shield from realizing how unimportant and weak you are. As long as you can oppose conservatives, you have something to cling to.

Im tellin ya man. Take up some hobbies. Crying like a bitch doesnt count.

:roll: :roll: :roll:

this coming from the college dropout that's failed in everything in life. You'd be dead or homeless on the street if it wasn't for your parents supporting you. You talk about handouts but you're literally sucking on the teat of the bank of Dad. You're the typical representation of the right wing. Poorly educated, low intelligence, but possess a superiority complex that blames liberals, feminists, blacks, jews, gays and poor people for the fact that you're an abject failure in life.

[HitandRun Reggie]

Let's not mince words. The gun advocates are a bunch of low IQ small ***** dipshits. If you got rid of the entire right wing America would make a lot of progress over night.

That's why exit polls of high school dropouts after the last election have 70% voting for Obama. :lol He also won the criminal vote(yes felons can vote in some states) by even more than that.

[TheMan]

That's right.

When seconds count, the cops are only minutes away.

By the way, 640,000 is cool and all, but in the US we have about 270,000,000. So, 640,000 is drop in the bucket. May as well be 48.

http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s410/dguy3231/neighbor-sign.jpg

Thought this was funny. Would you be comfortable displaying your support for banning firearms? Get ya a sign.
The insecurity is strong with this one...lol at people who needs guns to feel safe

[NumberSix]

The insecurity is strong with this one...lol at people who needs guns to feel safe
Why do you care?

[UK2K]

It's much harder than you think. Trigger finger, length of the barrel, target moving / not moving, target distance, can affect the accuracy of your shot. 1 small tiny flick when pressing the trigger can also determine the flight angle of your bullet.

You don't say.

[UK2K]

The insecurity is strong with this one...lol at people who needs guns to feel safe

So you wouldn't be upset if your neighbor put that in their lawn?

You don't need a gun to feel safe, cause you're so badass. Would you feel safe if the fact you don't need a gun is broadcast?


MISSOURI CITY, Texas -
Missouri City Police are investigating if a home invasion in the 4500 block of Parkview Court is connected to another home invasion from 10 days earlier in Fort Bend County.

According to police, four masked gunmen broke into the home around 2 a.m. Monday. Police say the gunmen tied up five people and ransacked the house, leaving with an undisclosed amount of cash and jewelry.

Their family didn't need a gun to feel safe either.

[TheMan]

So you wouldn't be upset if your neighbor put that in their lawn?

You don't need a gun to feel safe, cause you're so badass. Would you feel safe if the fact you don't need a gun is broadcast?



Their family didn't need a gun to feel safe either.

I would counter that sign with one saying the neighbor has a gun but he's a terrible shot...plus he has a ton of cash and jewelry in his home so go in at least four or five deep and take him out :lol

[warriorfan]

A country full of only soft white pansy liberals?? :roll:

u doormat ******* would be tied up to telephone polls so fast by gangs, cartels and muslims whom youd be too PC to resist since it might make you racist. And they'd all be running through the streets laughing and rioting while you sat tied up in your capri pants crying your eyes out worrying that one of the remarks you made before your mouth was duct taped was insensitive and might have hurt the guy with the machete's feeling :facepalm

Didn't you literally run for your life after getting one hit quit by a random mexican dude? :confusedshrug:

[UK2K]

http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/szhaman/7191632/411588/411588_original.jpg

[Patrick Chewing]

I'm disappointed this wasn't my childhood hero who played Center on the Knicks.

[TheMan]

http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/szhaman/7191632/411588/411588_original.jpg
Stupid chart...arming everyone in Chicago wouldn't stop the gun violence, in fact I bet it would make it worse.

Chicago's high murder rate is mostly a result of gang violence and mostly confined to ghettos and projects. It's basically thugs killing other thugs. If you're a law abiding citizen not living in a gang infested neighborhood, you're chances of being involved in gun violence would be pretty much the same in as any other part of the US.

[UK2K]

Stupid chart...arming everyone in Chicago wouldn't stop the gun violence, in fact I bet it would make it worse.

Chicago's high murder rate is mostly a result of gang violence and mostly confined to ghettos and projects. It's basically thugs killing other thugs. If you're a law abiding citizen not living in a gang infested neighborhood, you're chances of being involved in gun violence would be pretty much the same in any other part of the US.
Nobody has ever called for arming everyone. Nice personal twist on the gun debate though. You start your post off with a subtle lie, and then write out a rational response in the hopes that people will skim over your first little bit.

Lots of news sources do the same thing.

[GIF REACTION]

Keep the guns at home guys.

[TheMan]

Nobody has ever called for arming everyone. Nice personal twist on the gun debate though. You start your post off with a subtle lie, and then write out a rational response in the hopes that people will skim over your first little bit.

Lots of news sources do the same thing.
So what is the the point of comparing Chicago's anti concealed carry gun law to Houston's pro conceal carry gun law? :confusedshrug:

The way that flawed chart is designed is to give the impression that Houston is safer because you can carry guns and Chicago is more violent because you can't carry guns. To pretend you can't see that is just being intellectually dishonest. I'm not anti gun per se, I've owned guns but since the birth of my children, I've gotten rid of them because I'm aware of the stats that show kids are more likely to die by accidental gun violence than me stopping armed thugs in their tracks.

[DonDadda59]

http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/szhaman/7191632/411588/411588_original.jpg

And like I pointed out earlier in this thread, all the illegal guns on Chicago's streets come from states like Texas that have lax gun laws. Same exact thing that has led to Mexico's gun violence problem (3 out of every 4 guns in Mexico were bought legally in the U.S., then resold illegally to the cartels).

Gun bans don't work if you can just buy assault rifles at any Wal-Mart in a nearby State with little to no gun control.

[UK2K]

So what is the the point of comparing Chicago's anti concealed carry gun law to Houston's pro conceal carry gun law? :confusedshrug:

The way that flawed chart is designed is to give the impression that Houston is safer because you can carry guns and Chicago is more violent because you can't carry guns. To pretend you can't see that is just being intellectually dishonest. I'm not anti gun per se, I've owned guns but since the birth of my children, I've gotten rid of them because I'm aware of the stats that show kids are more likely to die by accidental gun violence than me stopping armed thugs in their tracks.
Nothing, it's just a fun little graphic. It's old anyway. The numbers are far worse now.

[UK2K]

And like I pointed out earlier in this thread, all the illegal guns on Chicago's streets come from states like Texas that have lax gun laws. Same exact thing that has led to Mexico's gun violence problem (3 out of every 4 guns in Mexico were bought legally in the U.S., then resold illegally to the cartels).

Gun bans don't work if you can just buy assault rifles at any Wal-Mart in a nearby State with little to no gun control.

Yet, only in Chicago is the gun violence so high. Amazingly, other places can have legal guns and not blow each other away at such amazing rates.

Maybe only illegal guns shoot people?

[DonDadda59]

Yet, only in Chicago is the gun violence so high. Amazingly, other places can have legal guns and not blow each other away at such amazing rates.

Maybe only illegal guns shoot people?

:facepalm

Chicago, like Mexico has a serious problem with drug gangs/cartels. Bringing more guns into the situation will only make matters much worse. Think about it- if the U.S. stopped making the purchase of guns so easy and the weapons pipeline from the border states to Mexico was shut down... the cartels would lose 75% of their arms/ammunition.

You don't think that would be an easier, more sensible way of reducing their destructive capabilities then just throwing even more guns at the problem? As it stands, the army and police of Mexico are powerless to stop the cartels despite having guns, tanks, etc of their own.

But for some reason giving the average citizen AR-15s will somehow make the problem go away? Is that what you seriously think? :biggums:

[UK2K]

:facepalm

Chicago, like Mexico has a serious problem with drug gangs/cartels. Bringing more guns into the situation will only make matters much worse. Think about it- if the U.S. stopped making the purchase of guns so easy and the weapons pipeline from the border states to Mexico was shut down... the cartels would lose 75% of their arms/ammunition.

You don't think that would be an easier, more sensible way of reducing their destructive capabilities then just throwing even more guns at the problem? As it stands, the army and police of Mexico are powerless to stop the cartels despite having guns, tanks, etc of their own.

But for some reason giving the average citizen AR-15s will somehow make the problem go away? Is that what you seriously think? :biggums:

And Houston doesn't? :coleman:

You are totally missing the point, and continuing on that same stupid argument the guy up ^^there^^ had. Nobody said give everyone guns. Nobody. No matter how many times you repeat the lie, it won't make it true.

[DonDadda59]

And Houston doesn't? :coleman:

Obviously nowhere near as serious as Chicago or in the same realm as Mexico.

The vast majority of killings in Chicago are drug/gang related. There are plenty of guns on the street there.


You are totally missing the point, and continuing on that same stupid argument the guy up ^^there^^ had. Nobody said give everyone guns. Nobody. No matter how many times you repeat the lie, it won't make it true.

Because you don't have one.

What exactly were you hoping to prove with that graphic?

[UK2K]

Obviously nowhere near as serious as Chicago or in the same realm as Mexico.
Somehow Houston sits between both, where guns are legal, and yet the two shit holes to the north and south are slaughtering each other (where guns are not legal).


The vast majority of killings in Chicago are drug/gang related. There are plenty of guns on the street there.
the vast majority of killings everywhere in this country are drug/gang related.


Because you don't have one.

The people with those guns aren't supposed to have them anyway. Tougher gun laws won't stop it. What will stop it, is tougher sentencing for gun related crimes. Assault with a firearm is six months to a year in county jail, out in 2 months with good behavior. Oooohhhh scarrryyyy. Why not give them 20 for it? Clean up the trash off our streets while we're at it. Nobody willing to use a gun in a crime should be free anyway. That would put an end to it. But then, you would claim that is racist, so it'd never fly.


What exactly were you hoping to prove with that graphic?
Nothing really. Just, amazing at the stark contrast from one city to the next.

But seriously though, the straw man argument of pro-gun supporters wanting to arm everyone on the planet is old, and played out, and ignorant. I know you aren't that dumb. Maybe I don't.

[TheMan]

Obviously nowhere near as serious as Chicago or in the same realm as Mexico.

The vast majority of killings in Chicago are drug/gang related. There are plenty of guns on the street there.



Because you don't have one.

What exactly were you hoping to prove with that graphic?

He was trying to link having concealed carry gun laws to safer cities but we called BS on him so he's now backtracking, lol

[TheMan]

If drugs were made legal, drug/gang violence would drop off a cliff in Chicago and Mexico. But the US is too stupid to be that foward thinking.

[UK2K]

He was trying to link having concealed carry gun laws to safer cities but we called BS on him so he's now backtracking, lol

Its years old :lol

Concealed carry wont help Tyrone in the hood. He wouldn't legally be allowed to own a gun.

[UK2K]

If drugs were made legal, drug/gang violence would drop off a cliff in Chicago and Mexico. But the US is too stupid to be that foward thinking.

Finally! Something we can agree on.

It won't be legal until they figure out a way to tax it. Uncle Sam is gonna take his cut even though he's had no hand in making it.

[DonDadda59]

Somehow Houston sits between both, where guns are legal, and yet the two shit holes to the north and south are slaughtering each other (where guns are not legal).

And 40% of the illegal guns in Mexico were bought legally in Texas. This is a proven fact.


the vast majority of killings everywhere in this country are drug/gang related.

And your point is...


The people with those guns aren't supposed to have them anyway. Tougher gun laws won't stop it. What will stop it, is tougher sentencing for gun related crimes. Assault with a firearm is six months to a year in county jail, out in 2 months with good behavior. Oooohhhh scarrryyyy. Why not give them 20 for it? Clean up the trash off our streets while we're at it. Nobody willing to use a gun in a crime should be free anyway. That would put an end to it. But then, you would claim that is racist, so it'd never fly.

Just like drug use/sales was curtailed after the Rockefeller laws and others were introduced. :rolleyes:

Anyone who is willing to risk life behind bars or a death sentence to settle a drug gang dispute isn't going to be dissuaded from owning a 'black market' gun because of potentially spending a few extra months in jail.

The Gun show/over-the-counter ease of purchasing guns is the root cause.


Nothing really.

You don't say.


But seriously though, the straw man argument of pro-gun supporters wanting to arm everyone on the planet is old, and played out, and ignorant. I know you aren't that dumb. Maybe I don't.

Wow, accuses others of 'straw man arguments' after posting graphics that literally have no point whatsoever, by his own admission. Take a bow. :applause:

[UK2K]

Anyone who is willing to risk life behind bars or a death sentence to settle a drug gang dispute isn't going to be dissuaded from owning a 'black market' gun because of potentially spending a few extra months in jail.


Months? Im not talking months. Im talking years.

Anyone willing to rob someone or assault someone with a gun doesn't deserve to be on the streets.

And anyone willing to risk life behind bars to settle a drug/gang dispute doesn't deserve to be on the streets either.

I'm more strict on illegal possession of a firearm than I am on most other offenses.

[TheMan]

Finally! Something we can agree on.

It won't be legal until they figure out a way to tax it. Uncle Sam is gonna take his cut even though he's had no hand in making it.
:cheers:

A few years ago, former Mexican presidents Ernesto Zedillo and Vicente Fox were part of a group of former Latin American leaders and scholars that were trying to push that idea to their US counterparts but the US Govt quickly shot that down:banghead:

[UK2K]

:cheers:

A few years ago, former Mexican presidents Ernesto Zedillo and Vicente Fox were part of a group of former Latin American leaders and scholars that were trying to push that idea to the US counterparts but the US Govt quickly shot that down

Legalize the drugs, stop criminalizing drug users, instead of prison send them to mandatory rehab.

[QUOTE]But the amount of one drug

[TheMan]

Legalize the drugs, stop criminalizing drug users, instead of prison send them to mandatory rehab.



If they can't make a profit off of it, they will move on to something else.
I'm not even sure it should be mandatory. If someone loves beong all doped up and isn't hurting anyone, why make him go clean? As far as I know, you can't force aomeone to not be an alcoholic, right?

[DonDadda59]

Months? Im not talking months. Im talking years.

Wouldn't make a lick of difference. Anyone who is willing to risk spending the rest of their lives behind bars or face the death penalty over trivial disputes isn't going to be dissuaded by the prospect of jail time.

Easy access to guns is the problem. Houston's gang violence issue may not be anywhere as serious as Mexico's cartel problem... but Mexican cartels are keeping the army and police at bay with guns bought in Houston gun shops.

I can't stress this enough- it has been proven that 75% of Mexico's illegal guns were bought legally in the United States, mainly from the border states with Texas making up 40% of the purchases alone.

No amount of pointless graphics or ineffectual hypothetical jail sentences will change those facts.

[TheMan]

I can't recall who said it but some Republcan douche said a while back that the way Mexico floods the US with drugs could be seen as an act of war. A reporter then asked if flooding a country with weapons like the US does to Mexico could also be seen as an act of war :oldlol:

[UK2K]

I can't recall who said it but some Republcan douche said a while back that the way Mexico floods the US with drugs could be seen as an act of war. A reporter then asked if flooding a country with weapons like the US does to Mexico could also be seen as an act of war :oldlol:
If I was the Mexican government, after the Fast and Furious embarrassment, I'd have been mad as hell.

[UK2K]

Wouldn't make a lick of difference. Anyone who is willing to risk spending the rest of their lives behind bars or face the death penalty over trivial disputes isn't going to be dissuaded by the prospect of jail time.

Easy access to guns is the problem. Houston's gang violence issue may not be anywhere as serious as Mexico's cartel problem... but Mexican cartels are keeping the army and police at bay with guns bought in Houston gun shops.

I can't stress this enough- it has been proven that 75% of Mexico's illegal guns were bought legally in the United States, mainly from the border states with Texas making up 40% of the purchases alone.

No amount of pointless graphics or ineffectual hypothetical jail sentences will change those facts.

It's 60%. Which I agree is still a high percentage.



In 2009, Mexico reported that they held 305,424 confiscated firearms,[30] but submitted data of only 69,808 recovered firearms to the ATF for tracing between 2007 and 2009.[8] This is a 23% sample of total gun population. To be statistically accurate, the property in the sample should reflect the population as a whole. Some analysts claim the sample submitted for tracing is preselected to represent the guns that Mexican authorities suspect are US origin.[31] The US Congress has been informed that ATF agents working in Mexico routinely instruct Mexican authorities "to only submit weapons for tracing that have a likelihood of tracing back to the U.S .... instead of simply wasting resources on tracing firearms that will not trigger a U.S. source." This policy skews the pool of weapons submitted for tracing to weapons already suspected of being US origin.

Just so you're aware. It's 60% of the guns they actually trace. Which, as the blurb points out, is pointless to trace a gun that was made in Russia cause we aren't going to chase someone over there, which is why they mainly trace weapons that would be made in the US.


In 2011 CBS News reported "The Mexican military recently reported nearly 9,000 police weapons "missing."" A 2009 U.S. State Department audit showed 26 percent of guns sold legally to governments in Mexico and Central America were diverted to the wrong hands.

And you can blame random guys at gun shows all you want, but let's not pretend the Mexican government isn't handing them over either accidentally or intentionally.

You're right though.

Tell me something.

You are a cartel leader. You have 20 men. Town A is on your left, with 2000 people and zero guns. Town B is on your right, with 2000 people and some guns (you don't know how many).

Which are you going for?

Gun advocates only want innocents to be able to defend themselves. You keep spouting off how we want everyone armed. We don't. I don't at least. I only want people to be able to at least fight back when someone sticks a gun in their face. If someone walked into a restaurant with a gun, and you're eating dinner, what are you going to do? Sit under the table and do nothing. And hope he doesn't see you. And wait for the cops 15 minutes away.

No thanks.

[KNOW1EDGE]

What does Obama have to say about this?

[DonDadda59]

It's 60%. Which I agree is still a high percentage.



Just so you're aware. It's 60% of the guns they actually trace.

Maybe in 2009 with just the fast and furious case. The ATF put the number as high as 90%. The Justice department is on the record that from '06-'11 the number was 70%, CBS News in 2010 reported it as being 3 out of every 4.

Even if it's just 60% (it's not), that's a ridiculously high number.




And you can blame random guys at gun shows all you want, but let's not pretend the Mexican government isn't handing them over either accidentally or intentionally.

The Mexican government gets a lot of its weaponry from the U.S.

You are correct that the cartels steal weapons from the military or defectors (1/8th of the army desserts every year and take their guns with them).


You're right though.

Tell me something.

You are a cartel leader. You have 20 men. Town A is on your left, with 2000 people and zero guns. Town B is on your right, with 2000 people and some guns (you don't know how many).

Which are you going for?

I go to whatever towns presents me the most strategic advantage for my operations. Like I give a f*ck if some random people have guns. Earlier this year one of the newer cartels shot down a military helicopter and they engage in open battles with the military and police routinely. But some farmer with a shotgun is going to scare us? :lol


Gun advocates only want innocents to be able to defend themselves. You keep spouting off how we want everyone armed. We don't. I don't at least. I only want people to be able to at least fight back when someone sticks a gun in their face. If someone walked into a restaurant with a gun, and you're eating dinner, what are you going to do? Sit under the table and do nothing. And hope he doesn't see you. And wait for the cops 15 minutes away.

No thanks.

I think instead of focusing on old west shootouts in crowded places like restaurants and movie theaters as the only solution... we should make sure we do everything humanly and legally possible to make sure that guy can't get a gun in the first place.

[NumberSix]

Stupid chart...arming everyone in Chicago wouldn't stop the gun violence, in fact I bet it would make it worse.

Chicago's high murder rate is mostly a result of gang violence and mostly confined to ghettos and projects. It's basically thugs killing other thugs. If you're a law abiding citizen not living in a gang infested neighborhood, you're chances of being involved in gun violence would be pretty much the same in as any other part of the US.
Chicago's problem isn't with guns or lack of guns. Chicago has a gang problem.

[NumberSix]

And like I pointed out earlier in this thread, all the illegal guns on Chicago's streets come from states like Texas that have lax gun laws. Same exact thing that has led to Mexico's gun violence problem (3 out of every 4 guns in Mexico were bought legally in the U.S., then resold illegally to the cartels).

Gun bans don't work if you can just buy assault rifles at any Wal-Mart in a nearby State with little to no gun control.
What's an assault rifle? :confusedshrug:

[warriorfan]

What's an assault rifle? :confusedshrug:

Usually defined as a semi automatic or automatic rifle that fires high velocity rounds and can hold large clips of ammunition

[DonDadda59]

What's an assault rifle? :confusedshrug:

This a trick question? :confusedshrug:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-76lwmNn_3ZE/UNLXVFysTlI/AAAAAAAABGs/aTv7ptTj1MM/s1600/bushmaster.jpg

Something like that ^

[NumberSix]

This a trick question? :confusedshrug:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-76lwmNn_3ZE/UNLXVFysTlI/AAAAAAAABGs/aTv7ptTj1MM/s1600/bushmaster.jpg

Something like that ^
Weird. It only says "rifle".

[Droid101]

Weird. It only says "rifle".
:rolleyes:

[Dresta]

DonDadda showing off his terribly literal, one track mind as usual :rolleyes:

People like him who think over 300,000,000 guns can suddenly be rounded up and made unavailable, are, quite frankly, out of their damn minds. His type are almost always liberal and middle class people, living in safe suburban areas, and thinking no-one else has to fear things like home invasion, because he doesn't. Self-righteous twats, basically. The UK has very strict gun laws, and obtaining a gun is not difficult, particularly if you have a few friends with criminal connections; i knew people who had them, and have been threatened with one - this is on an island, the place where if gun-control could work, it would. America, with its vastness and widespread criminality, would be an absolute nightmare to live in as a law-abiding citizen were people given the same right of self-defense as in England.

http://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2007/02/gun_law_and_com.html

Some highlights:



Like most 'liberal' solutions, they don't work against their intended target, and they attack freedom. It helps a great deal to be liberal about this if you a) don't think about it and b) know no history at all. Until 1920, Britain's gun laws made Texas look effeminate. There was no effective restriction at all on owning a firearm. Yet there was virtually no gun crime. Now we have some of the most restrictive anti-gun laws in the world, and gun crime is a serious and growing problem. Interestingly, the laws came first, the problem afterwards, and the recent ban on handguns was a completely logic-free response to the Dunblane mass-murder which preceded it.

Here's a strange fact. If you read the Sherlock Holmes stories, you will notice just how frequently Holmes and Watson take guns out on various missions (Watson’s is usually his trusty old service revolver, retained from his brush with war in Afghanistan). On one occasion, Holmes amuses himself by picking out the Royal monogram 'VR' in bullet-pocks above the fireplace, a remarkable tribute to his shooting ability with a handgun. His skills may have been exceptional, but gun ownership was, at the time the stories were written, entirely legal and normal, and nobody thought it odd.

Our small, easily-policed and largely urban society is deeply unlike the USA, where many people live hours from the nearest police station and can expect no immediate help if they are in dire trouble. But I do think that the continued existence of a legal right for law-abiding subjects to own and use weapons (actually set out in the 1689 Bill of Rights) is important. I'll explain why in a moment.

And I also think that strict gun laws are wholly ineffective against their targets. The guns used in crime are hardly ever legally obtained. The people who use them almost invariably have criminal convictions, which would disqualify them from legal gun ownership anyway. So you can pass as many laws against gun ownership as you like. It will have precisely no effect on the level of gun crime. In which case, why do it?

Well, partly to keep the dim liberals happy, of course, which is important these days. But could there be another reason? If the state and the people broadly agree, about most matters, then the state can license the people to do such things as defend themselves, make citizen's arrests, thump burglars, even keep weapons. (Every Swiss home contains arms and ammunition, and the Swiss crime problem is minor, to put it mildly).

Actually, I don't want us to become a gun-carrying, gun-owning society at all. I have absolutely no desire to own a gun or have one in my house. They are even more dangerous (which is saying something) than motor cars, which I - likewise - don’t much like using because of the heavy responsibility of being in control of such powerfully lethal machinery. And any burglar who arrives at my house will be given a cup of tea (choice of Indian, China or herbal) and a biscuit, and asked to sign a release form stating that he has not been harmed, intimidated or upset in any way. I understand the liberal criminal law well enough to know that this is the only sensible approach for a British burglary victim, who doesn't want to be handcuffed and put in the cells.

I don't want my neighbours to own guns, either. It shouldn't be necessary in a properly law-governed country.

But if the state believes that criminals are to be pitied and treated, while the people believe that criminals need to be punished, then the state cannot trust the people any longer.

And the people, likewise, cannot trust the state, which is becoming - increasingly - a tyranny which watches, dockets, snoops and generally pries into our lives, and grants us smaller and smaller limits within which we may live if we wish to avoid being interfered with by its agencies.

The same 'experts' who have banned guns and knives (with no noticeable effect on their use by criminals, though the harassment of innocents for carrying pen-knives grows year by year) pursue individuals for hitting burglars too hard or, in a notable incident last week, a pensioner who had clouted one of a gang of youths who had pelted his home with snowballs for hours on end.

Actually, I object strongly to the expression 'taking the law into your own hands'. The law is ours and we made it for ourselves, to protect us and govern us, as a free people. Our freedom to defend ourselves against criminal violence is part of our general freedom to live our lives lawfully. We hire the police to help us enforce the law, not to tell us that we cannot do so. Sadly, the modern British law is not our law, but an elite law, based on ideas which most of us do not share. And the modern police are the elite's police, not ours, which is one of the reasons why they have vanished from the streets, where we want them to be. The disarming of the people, and the cancellation of all their rights to defend themselves, are bad signs.



Amen to that.

As for all that stuff about guns being purchased legally in Texas and then moved and sold in different states or in Mexico, well, that is because it is the cheapest and most easily accessible market - getting rid of it would simply mean its shifting to a different means of acquisition, not the elimination of illegally obtained weaponry (honestly, what an idiotic thing to suggest). If Texas didn't sell guns there'd be 40% less weapons in Mexico, hurp-a-durp...

God damn, just think about what you're arguing for a second.

edit: an lol, these fools don't even know what an assault rifle is :facepalm

Better to just call it a machine gun and save you all the confusion.

[DonDadda59]

DonDadda showing off his terribly literal, one track mind as usual :rolleyes:

Have we met before? :confusedshrug:


People like him who think over 300,000,000 guns can suddenly be rounded up and made unavailable, are, quite frankly, out of their damn minds. His type are almost always liberal and middle class people, living in safe suburban areas, and thinking no-one else has to fear things like home invasion, because he doesn't.

:lol

I grew up in a township in South Africa during apartheid. Trust me, whatever neighborhood you think you've seen or heard of that's bad is Disneyland compared to where I'm from.

Everyone in Soweto had guns. Yet surprisingly, SA had the highest murder rate in the World for a while. Shocking.


Self-righteous twats, basically. The UK has very strict gun laws, and obtaining a gun is not difficult, particularly if you have a few friends with criminal connections; i knew people who had them, and have been threatened with one - this is on an island, the place where if gun-control could work, it would.

Wow, so you know somebody that knows somebody that knows something about it. That really changes England's gun murder rate though. :applause:


America, with its vastness and widespread criminality, would be an absolute nightmare to live in as a law-abiding citizen were people given the same right of self-defense as in England.

China has over 4 times the population of the U.S. and they have heavily regulated gun laws that bar citizens from owning firearms.


As for all that stuff about guns being purchased legally in Texas and then moved and sold in different states or in Mexico, well, that is because it is the cheapest and most easily accessible market - getting rid of it would simply mean its shifting to a different means of acquisition, not the elimination of illegally obtained weaponry (honestly, what an idiotic thing to suggest). If Texas didn't sell guns there'd be 40% less weapons in Mexico, hurp-a-durp..

So say you're the member of the Zetas in charge of keeping the troops well armed. Hypothetically speaking let's say the American pipeline of weapons was shut down completely and 70-90% of your source of weapons is gone. How and from where do you obtain the heavy weaponry you need to enforce your cartel's business interests?

Be specific.

[Droid101]

DonDadda showing off his terribly literal, one track mind as usual :rolleyes:

People like him who think over 300,000,000 guns can suddenly be rounded up and made unavailable, are, quite frankly, out of their damn minds. His type are almost always liberal and middle class people, living in safe suburban areas, and thinking no-one else has to fear things like home invasion, because he doesn't. Self-righteous twats, basically. The UK has very strict gun laws, and obtaining a gun is not difficult, particularly if you have a few friends with criminal connections; i knew people who had them, and have been threatened with one - this is on an island, the place where if gun-control could work, it would. America, with its vastness and widespread criminality, would be an absolute nightmare to live in as a law-abiding citizen were people given the same right of self-defense as in England.

http://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/2007/02/gun_law_and_com.html

Some highlights:



Amen to that.

As for all that stuff about guns being purchased legally in Texas and then moved and sold in different states or in Mexico, well, that is because it is the cheapest and most easily accessible market - getting rid of it would simply mean its shifting to a different means of acquisition, not the elimination of illegally obtained weaponry (honestly, what an idiotic thing to suggest). If Texas didn't sell guns there'd be 40% less weapons in Mexico, hurp-a-durp...

God damn, just think about what you're arguing for a second.

edit: an lol, these fools don't even know what an assault rifle is :facepalm

Better to just call it a machine gun and save you all the confusion.
Dresta literally dumb as hell.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11281344&postcount=6


Its amazing people pay exorbitant costs (plus interest) to get the approval of a bunch of smug, phony, pretentious hacks with completely arbitrary qualifications for teaching others.


Yeah, we could get the same thing for free from Dresta.

[TheMan]

Dresta literally dumb as hell.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11281344&postcount=6
That was one of the GOAT slays in ISH history, lmao

and yea, Dresta is a blowhard...always with his wall of text of crap

[Dresta]

Have we met before? :confusedshrug:



:lol

I grew up in a township in South Africa during apartheid. Trust me, whatever neighborhood you think you've seen or heard of that's bad is Disneyland compared to where I'm from.

Everyone in Soweto had guns. Yet surprisingly, SA had the highest murder rate in the World for a while. Shocking.



Wow, so you know somebody that knows somebody that knows something about it. That really changes England's gun murder rate though. :applause:



China has over 4 times the population of the U.S. and they have heavily regulated gun laws that bar citizens from owning firearms.



So say you're the member of the Zetas in charge of keeping the troops well armed. Hypothetically speaking let's say the American pipeline of weapons was shut down completely and 70-90% of your source of weapons is gone. How and from where do you obtain the heavy weaponry you need to enforce your cartel's business interests?

Be specific.
1. England's gun murder rate went up after the banning of handguns in 1997 - its homicide rate shot up by 50%. Not only that, but huge increases in the numbers of police (as if the US needs more police problems), and ubiquitous CCTV were the result:

http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/2013/12/murder-and-homicide-rates-before-and-after-gun-bans/

2. China is an autocratic police state devoid of political liberty; thanks, but no thanks. I suppose that is what you want America to be like? A giant beehive? I wouldn't be surprised. China also didn't have over 300,000,000 weapons already circulating.

3. There is no data regarding the majority of weapons in Mexico, and your 70-90% estimate is specious nonsense. Heavy weaponry coming from America? Give me a break: these guys have grenades, machine guns, and grenade launchers, none of which are available to buy legally in the US - where are they getting them from? Santa Claus? If you don't think people with as much money as these criminal gangs can't get hold of weapons without the aid of US gun shows, then your reason is utterly lost.

[DonDadda59]

1. England's gun murder rate went up after the banning of handguns in 1997 - its homicide rate shot up by 50%. Not only that, but huge increases in the numbers of police (as if the US needs more police problems), and ubiquitous CCTV were the result:

http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/2013/12/murder-and-homicide-rates-before-and-after-gun-bans/

You've got some bad information, son.

England and Wales Crime Rate Falls to Lowest Levels in 33 years (2014) (http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/apr/24/crime-rate-england-wales-falls-lowest-level-33-years)

:confusedshrug:


2. China is an autocratic police state devoid of political liberty; thanks, but no thanks. I suppose that is what you want America to be like? A giant beehive? I wouldn't be surprised. China also didn't have over 300,000,000 weapons already circulating.

So now your argument changes from the 'vastness' of the U.S. which has a population 1/4th the size of China... to politics? Bottom line is China does not allow its citizens to purchase/own guns outside of a few exceptions like hunting.

Check out their gun death rate or murder rate in general. The population debate holds no merit whatsoever.


3. There is no data regarding the majority of weapons in Mexico, and your 70-90% estimate is specious nonsense. Heavy weaponry coming from America? Give me a break: these guys have grenades, machine guns, and grenade launchers, none of which are available to buy legally in the US - where are they getting them from? Santa Claus? If you don't think people with as much money as these criminal gangs can't get hold of weapons without the aid of US gun shows, then your reason is utterly lost.

The ATF (http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-03-18-cartelguns_N.htm) is on record that 90% of the guns used in crimes in Mexico comes from American dealerships.

The Justice Department (http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/06/14/mexico.guns/index.html) released figures from 2006-2011 of weapons used in crimes and showed data pointing to 70% of the guns used being traced back to the U.S.

You never answered my question- if you're in charge of arming a cartel and the main supply line for your weapons, your next door neighbor, is cut off... how and from where specifically are you getting arms? Again, be as specific as possible. Thanks.

And the grenades and grenade launchers you mention (one of which was used to shoot down a Mexican military helicopter earlier this year in Jalisco) were most likely stolen from the Mexican army which is supplied heavily by the U.S.

[Hawker]

Just curious but how do you expect to remove guns from those that already have them?

In my opinion it is a culture issue, in Australia it's more evident than it's ever been to me. These people grow up with anti-gun propaganda and are raised to be scared of them. They follow the laws and are quite obedient to the government and all wear the same clothes throughout school. This creates a bit more of a community attitude where in America it's way more individualistic. Americans don't care as much about doing something for the good of humanity.

They also don't have the same history or demographics like America does. Like most countries in the world.

I'm not sure what the answer is to guns in America but taking guns out of law abiding citizens isn't one of them. You can't guarantee that everyone will give up their guns so you're putting law abiding citizens at risk by leaving them defenseless.

[NumberSix]

It wasnt always like this. The Port Arthur Day Massacre was the trigger that made everyone change their minds about gun-control. Australia also has a very macho conservative society as well ; bushrangers, Ned Kelly, Gold Rushes, Immigrants etc.

The only issue with America is the sheer size of the country. With so many guns around already, its impossible to try and stop.
It's not a matter of "macho". It's a matter of respecting people's rights as human beings. You have no right remove someone's ability to protect themselves. It's an utterly immoral idea.

I'm not interested in this "you're not allowed to protect yourself, but don't worry about that. We (the government) will protect you". You people can't even run a damn website. And half the people you hire to "protect and serve" are borderline retards who you don't properly train and abuse their power at every turn. We're supposed rely on these people with our lives? :wtf:

[TheMan]

It's not a matter of "macho". It's a matter of respecting people's rights as human beings. You have no right remove someone's ability to protect themselves. It's an utterly immoral idea.

I'm not interested in this "you're not allowed to protect yourself, but don't worry about that. We (the government) will protect you". You people can't even run a damn website. And half the people you hire to "protect and serve" are borderline retards who you don't properly train and abuse their power at every turn. We're supposed rely on these people with our lives? :wtf:
Good to see a conservative dude like yourself not suck every cop's ass like most on the right:applause: