Iran's second in charge wants war with Israel

[BigNBAfan]

http://www.levitt.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/pic-Ayatollah-Ali-Khamenei.jpg



In a 416-page manifesto called Palestine, Iran's Ayatollah Ali Khamenei details his view on the destruction of Israel and the deception of the US. The book, which credits Khamenei as "The flag bearer of Jihad to liberate Jerusalem," is only available in Iran, the NY Post revealed.

According to the Post, Khamenei quickly asserts his belief that Israel does not have a right to exist as a state. He does this by using three words: nabudi meaning annihilation, imha meaning fading out and zaval meaning effacement. The book allegedly states Khamenei's strategy for the destruction of Israel is through "well-established Islamic principles".

One of those principles is that a land under Muslim rule, no matter how brief, can never be returned to non-Muslim rulers. The Post reported that Khamenei lists Israel as a special case because it is an "ally of the American Great Satan," it has waged war against Muslims and because it occupies Jerusalem, which he calls "Islam's third Holy City."

In his new book, the Iranian religious leader calls for long periods of low-intensity warfare that makes like unpleasant or impossible for a majority of Israeli Jews so they leave Israel. He does not, however, call for the complete destruction of the country or the massacre of Jewish people.

Despite this, Khamenei's plan includes a group of "fighters" in the West Bank that would develop Hezbollah-style units.

"We have intervened in anti-Israel matters, and it brought up victory in the 33-day war by Hezbollah against Israel in 2006 and in the 22-day war between Hamas and Israel in the Gaza Strip," he allegedly wrote.

The Post reported that Khamenei then believes that as the cost of staying in Israel rises, the cost of supporting the Jewish state, particularly for the US, will also rise. Khamenei believes there should be a one-state formula that would be called Palestine under Muslim rule. However, non-Muslims would be allowed to stay if they prove "genuine roots" in the region, thus becoming "protected minorities."

His plan would put Israel, the West Bank and Gaza under a United Nations mandate before creating the new state of Palestine.

Source: http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/irans-ayatollah-ali-khamenei-publishes-book-to-destroy-israel-and-deceive-us/ar-BBlllUD?ocid=spartandhp#image=1


Religion of peace

[Nick Young]

"We have intervened in anti-Israel matters, and it brought up victory in the 33-day war by Hezbollah against Israel in 2006 and in the 22-day war between Hamas and Israel in the Gaza Strip," he allegedly wrote.

Oh Iran. A land where victories are defeats and defeats are victories.

these people :facepalm

[fiddy]

Hes right though, Israel shouldnt exist

[sweggeh]

Oh Iran. A land where victories are defeats and defeats are victories.

these people :facepalm

He sounds like a Liverpool fan.

[poido123]

Progression in beliefs and culture takes time.

There are still fundamentalist figureheads(like this guy) who refuse to conform to a more progressive Iran. Still stuck in old, outdated ruthless thinking.

You have the young, up and coming future people of Iran who are pushing for a more free thinking society and are clearly divided from leaders who are stuck in their fundamentalistic ways (I have two friends who left Iran for these reasons). No different to Christians who take the bible word for word literally and form the basis of extremism.

What my point here is, we do more by encouraging and embracing the progressive and peace loving people of religion than unfairly grouping people together and labelling them terrorists under name religion. This leader clearly holds onto deep seeded religious fundamentalism and will not open his mind to compromise and understanding.


Israel and Iran have a responsibility to understand one another. If people cannot let go of the past, they are doomed for the future. Where there is hate, there is misunderstanding.

[Nick Young]

Hes right though, Israel shouldnt exist
In my country, Europe, we believe that all countries have the right to exist, especially countries with oppressed minorities. Why do you believe that Israel shouldn't exist, mon ami?

[fiddy]

In my country, Europe, we believe that all countries have the right to exist, especially countries with oppressed minorities. Why do you believe that Israel shouldn't exist, mon ami?
You lost your troll game homie, try again

[rufuspaul]

This leader clearly holds onto deep seeded religious fundamentalism and will not open his mind to compromise and understanding.



Isn't it great that we're lifting economic sanctions that will further entrench his leadership position and provide additional funding to the military and terrorist organizations that Iran supports?

[poido123]

Isn't it great that we're lifting economic sanctions that will further entrench his leadership position and provide additional funding to the military and terrorist organizations that Iran supports?


The world is a scary place right now. That I do know.


I fear there is no coming back from a number of complex issues throughout the world where people won't let go of the "they did this to me" mentality.


There is too much at stake for the world for countries to squabble over land conquest, religious intolerance and greed.


If the world doesn't learn to get along, we are all fcked.

[RidonKs]

an msn.com article referring to a new york post feature... on iran?


"We have intervened in anti-Israel matters, and it brought up victory in the 33-day war by Hezbollah against Israel in 2006 and in the 22-day war between Hamas and Israel in the Gaza Strip," he allegedly wrote.

a manifesto is worth discussing but not this way, that shit has no credibility

[poido123]

an msn.com article referring to a new york post feature... on iran?



a manifesto is worth discussing but not this way, that shit has no credibility



lol

[KevinNYC]

The original story on this is a NY Post article by Amir Taheri.

Taheri has been accused of making of quotes and stories before particularly about Iran.

Here's his report that Bin Laden died in 2002. (http://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/11/opinion/the-death-of-bin-ladenism.html)

The Canadian Post had to retract his story claiming that Iran was going to make Jews and Christians wear special clothing (https://web.archive.org/web/20060603144931/http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/717935.html).
For a few hours on Friday, many around the world were ready to believe a report in the media that Iran had decided that Jews living there would be forced to wear a yellow strip of material on their clothing to denote their religion.

Leaders of international Jewish organizations were quick to respond, and likened the decision to the Nuremberg Laws of Nazi Germany.

Yesterday, after it emerged that the report had been false, the affair of "the yellow patch that wasn't" left us with one lesson: The world is ready to believe anything when it comes to a country ruled by Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.
.....

Several hours following its publication, the National Post retracted the article, and laid the blame for the story in the lap of veteran journalist and Iran analyst Amir Taheri.


So I'll wait for confirmation on this one.

[poido123]

And Jews claiming God himself granted Israel to the Jews is worse than what this religious nut job is claiming? One group is calling for genocide of a people (Iranian leaders) while the other is claiming their group are Gods chosen people (The Jews). Hitler would be proud of both groups today.


Why must people be so us against them all the time?


Can't we all just chill out and get along?

[RidonKs]

Why must people be so us against them all the time?


Can't we all just chill out and get along?
na bro there's shit in the ground we wanna dig up and we gotta get the ppl living there to dig er up! those are called non-negotiable contractual obligations, we're just doin up the contracts now

[fiddy]

Isn't it great that we're lifting economic sanctions that will further entrench his leadership position and provide additional funding to the military and terrorist organizations that Iran supports?
While the U.S. openly supports jihadists in Syria? :roll:

[poido123]

While the U.S. openly supports jihadists in Syria? :roll:


Which begs the question.


Who are the "good guys" in this world?


If you believe the media, they will tell you :oldlol:

[Godzuki]

only a moron thinks Iran is peaceful. they despise Israel. its obvious as fukk. they put their PR figurehead Rouhini in place to look moderate when dude has no power and their supreme religious leader calls all of the shots.

ISH has so many dumb fukk Iran sympathizers who keep trying to preach how the US, Israel, etc. are so bad and how we're the problem, meanwhile, you got Iranian marchers shouting death to America, death to Israel, their leader calling us the enemy, and supporting our enemies at every turn.

blah blah blah we did this and that 50~ years ago, lets live in the present reality stupid fgts, where these fanatically muslim governed powers are the real bad guys :rolleyes:

[Godzuki]

funny thing is whenever i read about how all of these weak minded bitches are flocking to ISIS around the world i'm always like who the fukkk would be that stupid? :biggums:

then i read ISH and realize apparently there are a lot of mf'ers that dumb :facepalm

[poido123]

only a moron thinks Iran is peaceful. they despise Israel. its obvious as fukk. they put their PR figurehead Rouhini in place to look moderate when dude has no power and their supreme religious leader calls all of the shots.

ISH has so many dumb fukk Iran sympathizers who keep trying to preach how the US, Israel, etc. are so bad and how we're the problem, meanwhile, you got Iranian marchers shouting death to America, death to Israel, their leader calling us the enemy, and supporting our enemies at every turn.

blah blah blah we did this and that 50~ years ago, lets live in the present reality stupid fgts, where these fanatically muslim governed powers are the real bad guys :rolleyes:


Iranian marchers? What "group" are you clutching for here? :oldlol:

Crazy nutjobs who so happen to be Muslim? That makes sense. But not the way you're swiping the whole brush over ALL muslims and ONLY muslim run Countries.

:rolleyes:

[sweggeh]

funny thing is whenever i read about how all of these weak minded bitches are flocking to ISIS around the world i'm always like who the fukkk would be that stupid? :biggums:

then i read ISH and realize apparently there are a lot of mf'ers that dumb :facepalm

Not necessary just stupidity, but they are weak minded and prone to peer pressure and brainwashing. All it takes is for one already recruited guy to tell all his friends how great it is there, how much the media is lying, the great stuff they will get there, etc. And just by the law of averages he will be able to recruit some people. And the cycle just goes from there.

Thats the theory anyway. Still doesn't make sense to me why anyone of these people would go there, but when you see transgenders, transracials, people becoming animals, people tattooing their eyeballs, etc., you realise that there are some things in this world you will just never understand why people would want to do it. But they just do.

[UK2K]

The world is a scary place right now. That I do know.


I fear there is no coming back from a number of complex issues throughout the world where people won't let go of the "they did this to me" mentality.


There is too much at stake for the world for countries to squabble over land conquest, religious intolerance and greed.


If the world doesn't learn to get along, we are all fcked.
Look at our country now.

Nothing is ever anybody's fault, and everyone wants to blame their circumstances on everyone else but themselves.

Sad.

[UK2K]

Iranian marchers? What "group" are you clutching for here? :oldlol:

Crazy nutjobs who so happen to be Muslim? That makes sense. But not the way you're swiping the whole brush over ALL muslims and ONLY muslim run Countries.

:rolleyes:

Iran has openly stated they want to destroy Israel.

[Godzuki]

Iranian marchers? What "group" are you clutching for here? :oldlol:

Crazy nutjobs who so happen to be Muslim? That makes sense. But not the way you're swiping the whole brush over ALL muslims and ONLY muslim run Countries.

:rolleyes:


ummm the ones in power? u know the ones who actually matter? the thousands you see marching and praying with the Ayatollah in clips i've posted here?

NOT the few hundred throwing rocks and getting life in jail after one protest against their current regime who we're fed lies about how they're ready to take over. take over my ass. they'd be lucky to take over a elementary school, let alone Iran :oldlol:

that shit ain't changing for a long time with all those muslim hardliners and US/Israel ingrained hate.

[RidonKs]

only a moron thinks Iran is peaceful. they despise Israel.
who is more peaceful, iran or israel? if you look over the last 50 years of history, dated 1965 - present, there is only one possible answer. iran hasn't attacked anybody in a first strike. israel has attacked it's neighbours repeatedly. i know you aren't the right person to say this to and in fact i now regret it, so please allow me to save you the trouble of responding by rescinding everything so far written in this post.

[Godzuki]

Irony :oldlol: :oldlol:


yeah lol the irony :oldlol: you're exactly one of those who could easily join ISIS from ISH i'm talking about.

its real funny to me how you're so excited to come to America too :facepalm

[poido123]

Not necessary just stupidity, but they are weak minded and prone to peer pressure and brainwashing. All it takes is for one already recruited guy to tell all his friends how great it is there, how much the media is lying, the great stuff they will get there, etc. And just by the law of averages he will be able to recruit some people. And the cycle just goes from there.

Thats the theory anyway. Still doesn't make sense to me why anyone of these people would go there, but when you see transgenders, transracials, people becoming animals, people tattooing their eyeballs, etc., you realise that there are some things in this world you will just never understand why people would want to do it. But they just do.


This is true.


Only way to curb these extremists is by promoting inclusion and acceptance. Acts of kindness goes a long way to changing people's perception of one another. I think the government in Western societies need to be more educated on extremist tendancies and why people choose to go this way.


Right now, western society are only helping the problem get worse.


Solution.


Get out of the middle East. Stop meddling in their affairs and leave them completely alone. Stop giving the children and the future generations a reason to hate westerners.

This will end what's driving ISIS.

[RidonKs]

yeah lol the irony :oldlol: you're exactly one of those who could easily join ISIS from ISH i'm talking about.

its real funny to me how you're so excited to come to America too :facepalm
sheeeeeeeeet is J$ an isis recruiting agent? like that show about russian spies the americans, except zanier???

[Godzuki]

who is more peaceful, iran or israel? if you look over the last 50 years of history, dated 1965 - present, there is only one possible answer. iran hasn't attacked anybody in a first strike. israel has attacked it's neighbours repeatedly. i know you aren't the right person to say this to and in fact i now regret it, so please allow me to save you the trouble of responding by rescinding everything so far written in this post.


god you're so dumb and so are all of the stupid mf'ers that always try to make this same 'play dumb' argument. why is it so hard to keep shit real with a lot of u mf'ers here? i know u know Israel doesn't just mindlessly shoot rockets into Palestine :facepalm

EVERYONE who follows Palestine vs Israel knows Israel more or less does things in retaliation to terrorist groups like Hamas firing rockets into their territory. stop playing it like everyone is stupid since we've all been thru this a million times and its funny how some of you keep playing this Israel aggression BS. you might get dumbass's like Rihanna and Dwight Howard to buy that stupidity but not anyone who half follows current events.

its funny how quick that whole sympathy for Palestine movement died after we saw the Hamas rocket tents being set up next to schools and shelters :lol

sooo many of u terrorist sympathizing mf'ers here make these disingenuous arguments constantly its just dumb we hear it over and over.

[poido123]

ummm the ones in power? u know the ones who actually matter? the thousands you see marching and praying with the Ayatollah in clips i've posted here?

NOT the few hundred throwing rocks and getting life in jail after one protest against their current regime who we're fed lies about how they're ready to take over. take over my ass. they'd be lucky to take over a elementary school, let alone Iran :oldlol:

that shit ain't changing for a long time with all those muslim hardliners and US/Israel ingrained hate.



Well do your part and help this systemic, ingrained hate and bridge the gap?


The way your thinking is exactly what fuels ISIS to keep doing what its doing and is no different to the hardliners mentality that you speak of.

I have Muslim friends from Iran who are extremely peaceful and very progressive. The issue is to undo the fundamentalism from Islam and those who follow the old ways of Sharia law etc. No different to the bible/Christians who have extremely violent and perverse teachings in their culture/book too, but it's up to the individual whether they take upon a free thinking, worldy approach to religion or the hardline, dark age interpretation.

[fiddy]

god you're so dumb and so are all of the stupid mf'ers that always try to make this same 'play dumb' argument. why is it so hard to keep shit real with a lot of u mf'ers here? i know u know Israel doesn't just mindlessly shoot rockets into Palestine :facepalm

EVERYONE who follows Palestine vs Israel knows Israel more or less does things in retaliation to terrorist groups like Hamas firing rockets into their territory. stop playing it like everyone is stupid since we've all been thru this a million times and its funny how some of you keep playing this Israel aggression BS. you might get dumbass's like Rihanna and Dwight Howard to buy that stupidity but not anyone who half follows current events.

its funny how quick that whole sympathy for Palestine movement died after we saw the Hamas rocket tents being set up next to schools and shelters :lol

sooo many of u terrorist sympathizing mf'ers here make these disingenuous arguments constantly its just dumb we hear it over and over.



hahahahahhaahhahahahahahhahahahqhahahahhahahahhaha hhahh Godzuki-embarrassment for mankind

[LJJ]

I don't know how anyone can doubt the validity if this. Iran is very open about their position on Israel, there is nothing new here.

[RidonKs]

you're talking about a media narrative. it explicitly frames each new incident as a palestinian attack with an israeli response. that framing typically has nothing to do with the reality on the ground. by the time we hear it on the news, they're usually a few days into an escalation involving heated disputes, rock throwing, interrogations, kidnapping, theft on both sides, things getting more serious, etc etc etc

now regardless of what ACTUALLY HAPPENED in june of 2006 or may of 2014 or whenever you like (these dates don't matter)... the us media talks about every single flare up between israelis and palestines in the exact same way i described above. it's consistent and it's why you're so fcking brainwashed.

but the israeli aggression i was referring to in my last post was not about its conflict with palestinians who live inside its territory. i was talking about attacks on its neighbours and other enemies it has in the region. in terms of unprovoked attacks, it is the most hostile country in the region. simultaneously it is the most developed and most democratic and probably one of the happiest. that isn't a contradiction, those are just basic facts.

the israeli state, due to its birth in a climate of fear but with a bevy of power on its side, has grown into a nationalist power with aspirations for expansion. it is despised by the people who live around it, and not strictly or even mostly on the basis of antisemitism.

[Godzuki]

Well do your part and help this systemic, ingrained hate and bridge the gap?


The way your thinking is exactly what fuels ISIS to keep doing what its doing and is no different to the hardliners mentality that you speak of.

I have Muslim friends from Iran who are extremely peaceful and very progressive. The issue is to undo the fundamentalism from Islam and those who follow the old ways of Sharia law etc. No different to the bible/Christians who have extremely violent and perverse teachings in their culture/book too, but it's up to the individual whether they take upon a free thinking, worldy approach to religion or the hardline, dark age interpretation.


its nobody's fault but muslim communities and families who emphasis it so much to their children, who are then enveloped to different degree's into the religion, and then easily impressioned by hardliners.

its nobody elses fault or ability to change that but muslims. they need to adapt a less religiously focused culture which obviously won't happen anytime soon.

maybe more western influence over time might but it might take a century before that happens.

[fiddy]

you're talking about a media narrative. it explicitly frames each new incident as a palestinian attack with an israeli response. that framing typically has nothing to do with the reality on the ground. by the time we hear it on the news, they're usually a few days into an escalation involving heated disputes, rock throwing, interrogations, kidnapping, theft on both sides, things getting more serious, etc etc etc

now regardless of what ACTUALLY HAPPENED in june of 2006 or may of 2014 or whenever you like (these dates don't matter)... the us media talks about every single flare up between israelis and palestines in the exact same way i described above. it's consistent and it's why you're so fcking brainwashed.

but the israeli aggression i was referring to in my last post was not about its conflict with palestinians who live inside its territory. i was talking about attacks on its neighbours and other enemies it has in the region. in terms of unprovoked attacks, it is the most hostile country in the region. simultaneously it is the most developed and most democratic and probably one of the happiest. that isn't a contradiction, those are just basic facts.

the israeli state, due to its birth in a climate of fear but with a bevy of power on its side, has grown into a nationalist power with aspirations for expansion. it is despised by the people who live around it, and not strictly or even mostly on the basis of antisemitism.

Not only that, Zionist have been stealing palestian land for decades unpunished
Such as
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/07/israel-accused-advancing-settlement-plans-150723125557567.html
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/04/israel-invites-tenders-settlement-buildings-150427094646714.html
http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/7/29/israel-approves-settlement-expansion-plans.html
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2014/11/us-calls-israel-settlement-plans-unfortunate-2014113193732621259.html The U.S. calls them "unfortunate", how cute :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Godzuki]

you're talking about a media narrative. it explicitly frames each new incident as a palestinian attack with an israeli response. that framing typically has nothing to do with the reality on the ground. by the time we hear it on the news, they're usually a few days into an escalation involving heated disputes, rock throwing, interrogations, kidnapping, theft on both sides, things getting more serious, etc etc etc

now regardless of what ACTUALLY HAPPENED in june of 2006 or may of 2014 or whenever you like (these dates don't matter)... the us media talks about every single flare up between israelis and palestines in the exact same way i described above. it's consistent and it's why you're so fcking brainwashed.

but the israeli aggression i was referring to in my last post was not about its conflict with palestinians who live inside its territory. i was talking about attacks on its neighbours and other enemies it has in the region. in terms of unprovoked attacks, it is the most hostile country in the region. simultaneously it is the most developed and most democratic and probably one of the happiest. that isn't a contradiction, those are just basic facts.

the israeli state, due to its birth in a climate of fear but with a bevy of power on its side, has grown into a nationalist power with aspirations for expansion. it is despised by the people who live around it, and not strictly or even mostly on the basis of antisemitism.


it makes me laff when foreign people or youtube watchers pretend to clown US media. we have media thats all over the fukkin place. CNN and every liberal source was actually very pro Palestine and anti Israel not too long ago, and even Obama was takiing Palestine's side until the footage of Hamas tents being set up next to schools and shelters.

Fox is probably the only source that is pro US agenda to a fault and most don't even take them seriously.

Youtube University conspiracy watchers, let alone the Russian propaganda readers, or the Al Jazheria or Arab publication readers are EASILY much more slanted and full of brainwash than anything we read in the US, short of Fox news.

[Nick Young]

the israeli state, due to its birth in a climate of fear but with a bevy of power on its side, has grown into a nationalist power with aspirations for expansion. it is despised by the people who live around it, and not strictly or even mostly on the basis of antisemitism.

You don't know jack shit about this situation. You regularly regurgitate Western university BDS (aka Hamas and ISIS) propaganda nearly word for word. You don't know jack shit what it's like over there.

As someone who believes yourself to be intelligent and informed about the world, you would do well to read about the history of the region from the 1800s onwards. You are very ignorant in regards to Israel and the Middle East in general, as well as the motivations and general beliefs of the common people who live in the region. Spewing lies and BDS (aka Hamas and ISIS) propaganda does not help anyone, and only serves to make you look like a moronic puppet.

[poido123]

its nobody's fault but muslim communities and families who emphasis it so much to their children, who are then enveloped to different degree's into the religion, and then easily impressioned by hardliners.

its nobody elses fault or ability to change that but muslims. they need to adapt a less religiously focused culture which obviously won't happen anytime soon.

maybe more western influence over time might but it might take a century before that happens.



Still the same point.

People choose how they practice their religion. You deal with the people's interpretation and cultural tendancies and you fix the religious stereotyping/stigma.


What makes you so sure that you aren't an extremist? You might not be cutting people's heads off, but your attitude and what you say to/about Muslims is damaging and has far wider ramifications of systemic cultural ingrained hate than any knife will do to some westerner's head.


Stop the finger pointing and start understanding, open your mind.

[Godzuki]

Not only that, Zionist have been stealing palestian land for decades unpunished
Such as
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/07/israel-accused-advancing-settlement-plans-150723125557567.html
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/04/israel-invites-tenders-settlement-buildings-150427094646714.html
http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/7/29/israel-approves-settlement-expansion-plans.html
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/middleeast/2014/11/us-calls-israel-settlement-plans-unfortunate-2014113193732621259.html The U.S. calls them "unfortunate", how cute :roll: :roll: :roll:


Palestinians are basicallly a conquered people. we all know and have accepted this.

only reason half the muslim countries are involved is they hate Israel due to religious fundamentalism.

[fiddy]

Palestinians are basicallly a conquered people. we all know and have accepted this.

only reason half the muslim countries are involved is they hate Israel due to religious fundamentalism.
We? Who the fuсk are you?

[RidonKs]

i mean the territories really are an entirely different matter. negotiations at camp david in 1979, oslo in the 90s, the taba and geneva accords... none of these were undertaken in good faith by israeli governments. claim what you want about shady palestinian authority diversions, i'm no fan of arafat. but his side was negotiating out of desperation, whereas israel and the united states (every negotiation has been trilateral since 1967) are operating from positions of incredible power. the do not have to accept palestinian concessions because they ARE the dominant militarized state in the region and they control the national resources. rocket attacks might kill a few people each year tops; compare that to the impact of dozens of palestinians dying every month. who is more desperate to come to the table? thus who has leverage?

the oslo accords were an incredible sham. the final deal that arafat agreed just legitimized the status quo. all resources and borders controlled by israel. no moratorium on settlement expansion. designated zones impossible to travel between due to 'check points'. and a continuation of raids, interrogations, assassinations, thuggery and theft, the rest of it.

it's shameful that in spite of a global consensus, we continue down this road.

[Godzuki]

Still the same point.

People choose how they practice their religion. You deal with the people's interpretation and cultural tendancies and you fix the religious stereotyping/stigma.


What makes you so sure that you aren't an extremist? You might not be cutting people's heads off, but your attitude and what you say to/about Muslims is damaging and has far wider ramifications of systemic cultural ingrained hate than any knife will do to some westerner's head.


Stop the finger pointing and start understanding, open your mind.

lol don't play that dumbass boomerang BS with me. lol i'm the extremist :oldlol:

and i don't take that retarded politically correct unrealistic argument you're throwing at me seriously either :oldlol:

generalizing and stereotyping are things that become earned not thru anyone elses fault but those that earned it. its not on everyone elses shouldeers to change someones perceptions by the masses, its on those that earned those judgemental observations by 3rd parties to change how people see them.

i swear i wish people could keep shit real and not so politically correct unrealistic to things :rolleyes:

[RidonKs]

You don't know jack shit about this situation. You regularly regurgitate Western university BDS (aka Hamas and ISIS) propaganda nearly word for word. You don't know jack shit what it's like over there.

As someone who believes yourself to be intelligent and informed about the world, you would do well to read about the history of the region from the 1800s onwards. You are very ignorant in regards to Israel and the Middle East in general, as well as the motivations and general beliefs of the common people who live in the region. Spewing lies and BDS (aka Hamas and ISIS) propaganda does not help anyone, and only serves to make you look like a moronic puppet.
yes, i need lessons on the world, because i don't know that the tactic of boycott/divestment/sanctions IS THE SAME THING as fcking hamas and isis (two organizations that are COMPLETELY DIFFERENT)

good god man i could inhabit your mom's ass for 50 years and still come out knowing more about world affairs than you do

[Godzuki]

We? Who the fuсk are you?


the non extremists :pimp:

[Nick Young]

yes, i need lessons on the world, because i don't know that the tactic of boycott/divestment/sanctions IS THE SAME THING as fcking hamas and isis (two organizations that are COMPLETELY DIFFERENT)

good god man i could inhabit your mom's ass for 50 years and still come out knowing more about world affairs than you do
Who do you think funds and sponsors the Western BDS movement, breh? It is not a secret. Do some due diligence before regurgitating other peoples ideas that you have no true understanding of. You are directly parroting the Hamas party line and don't even realize it.

[RidonKs]

Palestinians are basicallly a conquered people. we all know and have accepted this.

only reason half the muslim countries are involved is they hate Israel due to religious fundamentalism.
yeah, the non extremists. maybe if the political center were occupied by pinochet.

[RidonKs]

Who do you think funds and sponsors BDS, breh? It is not a secret. Due some due diligence before regurgitating other peoples ideas that you have no true understanding of. You are parroting the Hamas party line.
haha you're full of shit, i liked your pussified act more but you're starting to sound like a cvnt again

[Godzuki]

yeah, the non extremists. maybe if the political center were occupied by pinochet.


we're not judging based on religious causes or territory. lets be honest most muslim countries don't really give a fukk about the Palestinians, more the religious aspects and rights.

[BlakFrankWhite]

Have to say, I agree with Ridonks opinion

[Charlie Sheen]

haha you're full of shit, i liked your pussified act more but you're starting to sound like a cvnt again
:lol I noticed that too...you hit a nerve and rocked him straight outta talking about what goes on in his country of Europe

[Nick Young]

haha you're full of shit, i liked your pussified act more but you're starting to sound like a cvnt again
Educate yourself, parrot. You are literally word for word spewing out the official party message of Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood

Many accept BDS as grass-roots pressure on Israel to complete the peace process and accede to a Palestinian state along the June 4, 1967 lines, with its capital in east Jerusalem. This is a fundamental misrepresentation. Much BDS and pro-Palestinian NGO activity in Europe and the United States is connected to radical Islamic groups and Palestinian terror organizations such as Hamas.

Hamas and its parent Muslim Brotherhood organization fuel and direct international BDS and anti-Israel political activities on hundreds of university campuses across the United States via the Muslim Students Association.

Many of the MSA’s 600 chapters in North America have been branded “extensions of the Muslim Brotherhood,” as the MB itself stated in its operational plan, captured in the FBI’s raid on the Holy Land foundation – a Hamas charity, in 2001.

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/Columnists/The-world-from-here-Hamas-and-BDS-344303



In Western circles, BDS is commonly misunderstood. It is generally viewed as a progressive, nonviolent campaign led by Palestinian grassroots organizations and propelled by Western human rights groups, who call for boycotting Israeli goods produced in the “occupied” or “disputed” Golan Heights and West Bank territories captured from Syria and Jordan respectively in the 1967 war.

It is also widely assumed that the global BDS movement is further limited to boycott and divestment aimed at Israel’s presence over the 1967 Green Line, resulting in international actions led frequently by the Palestinian Authority at the United Nations, at the UN-affiliated International Court of Justice, as well as petitions made to the International Criminal Court.

However, a closer investigation of the BDS movement reveals a starkly different picture. BDS is more accurately described as a political-warfare campaign conducted by rejectionist Palestinian groups in cooperation with radical left-wing groups in the West. BDS leaders and organizations are also linked to the Palestinian Authority leadership, the radical Muslim Brotherhood, other radical groups, terror-supporting organizations, and in some cases even terror groups themselves such as Hamas.

http://jcpa.org/unmasking-bds/


http://egyptianstreets.com/2015/05/11/what-keeps-isis-running-the-funding-and-support-of-a-terror-organization/

[RidonKs]

we're not judging based on religious causes or territory. lets be honest most muslim countries don't really give a fukk about the Palestinians, more the religious aspects and rights.
according to many polls, the palestinian issue has been on the muslim agenda for decades now. part of it is propaganda certainly. large factions only support the palestinian cause as a fk you to america the devil and israel the demon.

but plenty of people see israel's domination of the palestinian people, they're conquering of the palestinian people to use your words, as symbolic of western colonialism in the region dating back hundreds of years to the brits and even the ottoman's, now wholly subservient to the western hegemony.

it is religious in that muslims identify their freedom with finally ridding themselves of the shackles that have hamstrung their governance for so long. unfortunately it does not appear they will achieve it any time soon, especially given the sorts of groups which typically fill a power void after a major conflict... fundamentalists and other violent groups.

[RidonKs]

:lol I noticed that too...you hit a nerve and rocked him straight outta talking about what goes on in his country of Europe
he's just starved for attention, i don't expect much to deter him from his trolling... he needs a new name though, which i have no doubt he could pull off. nick young has too much happy nostalgia though back when he thought his life was full of incredible opportunity instead of the dull slumber it's turned into.

[poido123]

lol don't play that dumbass boomerang BS with me. lol i'm the extremist :oldlol:

and i don't take that retarded politically correct unrealistic argument you're throwing at me seriously either :oldlol:

generalizing and stereotyping are things that become earned not thru anyone elses fault but those that earned it. its not on everyone elses shouldeers to change someones perceptions by the masses, its on those that earned those judgemental observations by 3rd parties to change how people see them.

i swear i wish people could keep shit real and not so politically correct unrealistic to things :rolleyes:



So when your mother dropped you on your head as a baby, did she decide that you can deal with that and it's not her fault, it was an accident?

Have a long hard think about the connections I made in this question...

[imdaman99]

:lol I noticed that too...you hit a nerve and rocked him straight outta talking about what goes on in his country of Europe
:roll: Ridonks gets him goin...love it :rockon:

I have no doubt that some people in Iran want war with Israel, it doesn't mean it will happen even if they somehow end up in charge.

[Nick Young]

Jew haters runnin' wild up in heeya, no doubt

[NumberSix]

Second in charge?

[LJJ]

The one thing I can never get behind when it comes to Israel are the settlements in the West-Bank.

The state Israel? Justified.
Taking Jerusalem? Justified.
Maintaining a big military presence capable of aggression? Justified.
Building walls and maintaining check points? Justified.
Blockading Gaza? Justified.
Building up big defences? Justified.
Controlling flow of goods into Palestine? Justified.

I get why many people don't like these things, but you should be able to see obvious justifications for them even if you disagree on a personal level.

But then supporting further annexation of Palestinian territory in a very insidious way, which obviously makes any real peace process impossible, throws a massive brick through the fa

[NumberSix]

I don't why why non-Jews and non Palestinians give a fcuk about this one tiny strip of land, but I guess only those of us who are neutral on the subject can see some obvious realities.

One side is strong, the other side is weak. The strong side doesn't actually have to negotiate at all. People say dumb things like "they don't negotiate in good faith because their plan is to take the entire thing". Ok. So what's stopping them? If what they really want is to just take the entire piece of land, what are they waiting for?

One side HAS to negotiate to get what they want. The other side is strong enough to just take it all if they want to..... but they don't.

We know that the strong side is at least somewhat interested in a deal. Perhaps a deal that is skewed in their favor, but they hold all the cards and want to at least offer something. If it was reversed and the other side had all the power, would there be any negotiations? Would there be any offers at all? I don't know.

[Nick Young]

One side HAS to negotiate to get what they want. The other side is strong enough to just take it all if they want to..... but they don't.

We know that the strong side is at least somewhat interested in a deal. Perhaps a deal that is skewed in their favor, but they hold all the cards and want to at least offer something. If it was reversed and the other side had all the power, would there be any negotiations? Would there be any offers at all? I don't know.
Ding ding ding! No one of these pro-PLO, Hezbollah and Hamas parrots has ever given a semi decent answer to this. Usually they resort to usage of logical fallacy, personal attacks or simply disappear and stop responding when confronted with this basic truth.

[LJJ]

What's the argument, that Israel doesn't have to negotiate or give in to anything if they don't want peace? Yeah, that's pretty evident...

Israel is in the position they want to be right now. They don't want a peaceful legitimate Palestinian state. No one is arguing something else than that.

[RidonKs]

its like u have an amazing knack for asking just the most perfect stupid questions to delve in further and elucidate the issue...


I don't why why non-Jews and non Palestinians give a fcuk about this one tiny strip of land, but I guess only those of us who are neutral on the subject can see some obvious realities.
it matters because western support, primarily american but from pups like canada and australia too), is a crucial reason that israel is able to scorn its neighbours and continue to develop without coming to the negotiating table on substantive issues; its nuclear weapons program, its occupied territories, its aggression abroad, its strange immigration status as some sort of nation state bastion for a large disparate religious community... etc

this issue matters to people who don't live there or never been because in lots of cases, their own governments are responsible for failing to hedge at the negotiating table. with a democratic vote a person could have influence over that policy, thus they bear responsibility for its failure.

People say dumb things like "they don't negotiate in good faith because their plan is to take the entire thing". Ok. So what's stopping them? If what they really want is to just take the entire piece of land, what are they waiting for?
because to actually forcibly annex the land for explicitly israeli citizens would likely turn into an ethnic cleansing campaign and the world wouldn't stand for it. not even big brother murrica could protect against that international backlash. this is why they take to "mowing the lawn" every few years "in proportional retaliation" in order to "maintain stability". not too far, just far enough, to maintain the status quo.


We know that the strong side is at least somewhat interested in a deal. Perhaps a deal that is skewed in their favor, but they hold all the cards and want to at least offer something.
we don't know that at all sir, this is an insubstantial assumption until its argued further. the least you might be able to say is "the strong side is at least as interested in a deal as the weak side". even that i would disagree with but at least it's honest.


If it was reversed and the other side had all the power, would there be any negotiations? Would there be any offers at all? I don't know.
this is like "if the indians came to europe and killed all my people, you think they would be signing my hundred year old land claims into law? fk no, fk them, they would just be assholes like everybody else". that is a terrible argument because i could ask it about anything and never receive an answer. smarten up.

[Nick Young]

What's the argument, that Israel doesn't have to negotiate if they don't want peace? Yeah, that's pretty evident...
If Israel has an insidious plan to exterminate and wipe out the Palestinians and steal their land, why aren't they doing it? What is stopping them from going in their tomorrow and taking all of Ghaza and the West bank for themselves?




because to actually forcibly annex the land for explicitly israeli citizens would likely turn into an ethnic cleansing campaign and the world wouldn't stand for it. not even big brother murrica could protect against that international backlash. this is why they take to "mowing the lawn" every few years "in proportional retaliation" in order to "maintain stability". not too far, just far enough, to maintain the status quo.
Ah yes. The good ol Jew World Order Jewluminati conspiracy theory. Of course.

[LJJ]

If Israel has an insidious plan to exterminate and wipe out the Palestinians and steal their land, why aren't they doing it? What is stopping them from going in their tomorrow and taking all of Ghaza and the West bank for themselves?

They are doing it. They have absolutely no intention to exterminating the Palestinians, that's ridiculous. But they do have the intention to take most of the West Bank and prolong the establishment of a legitimate Palestinian state as long as possible.

[RidonKs]

They are doing it.
are u down with the cry that the 2 state solution is dead? and is a single state even possible / desirable at this point?

edit: i take it from your edit that u disagree with the first question, would still like to hear your thoughts tho

what needs to happen first and foremost to get everybody back to the table? the hamas/fatah divide is probably the biggest barrier to continued negotiations. both parties are despicable for different reasons. they got this unity thing going but somehow i doubt that lasts. there could be a swing in gaza the next few years, back over to another 'center' compromising party which might help long term, but that sort of overhaul

especially with bibi sticking it out for another god knows how many more years...

[LJJ]

are u down with the cry that the 2 state solution is dead? and is a single state even possible / desirable at this point?

edit: i take it from your edit that u disagree with the first question, would still like to hear your thoughts tho

what needs to happen first and foremost to get everybody back to the table? the hamas/fatah divide is probably the biggest barrier to continued negotiations. both parties are despicable for different reasons. they got this unity thing going but somehow i doubt that lasts. there could be a swing in gaza the next few years, back over to another 'center' compromising party which might help long term, but that sort of overhaul

especially with bibi sticking it out for another god knows how many more years...

The 2 state solution is the only solution, but it's not close.

Logistically it's fine. Even though they are making settlements, so far the bigger populations are near the Israeli border so it could easily be consolidated. The others? Just kick them out, it's Israel's problem.

the problem is that the stars need to align and both sides need that charismatic figure at the same time willing to make it happen. I could see that happening in Israel at some point, but the Palestinians will never do it. The people with the power in Palestine get way too much money from the Arab world to be bad, their system is fuelled with hate money to the core.

Powerful foreign intervention could force the job, but when has that worked out lately. They are stuck with their status quo.

[KevinNYC]

Second in charge?
yeah, I noticed that too.

[KevinNYC]

I don't why why non-Jews and non Palestinians give a fcuk about this one tiny strip of land

Seriously?

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Qp1_Y_MeLZE/UlwNCzw6KvI/AAAAAAAAAhY/IOC1UTIgk6I/s1600/circle_of_life_01.png


Jerusalem has been the holiest city in Judaism and the ancestral and spiritual homeland of the Jewish people since the 10th century BCE. During classical antiquity, Jerusalem was considered the center of the world, where God resided.


In Christian tradition, Jerusalem's place in the life of Jesus gives it great importance,.......At the end of each of the Gospels, there are accounts of Jesus' Last Supper in an "upper room" in Jerusalem, his arrest in Gethsemane, his trial, his crucifixion at Golgotha, his burial nearby and his resurrection and ascension........ Jerusalem is mostly important to Christianity because that is where Jesus Christ was brought to occasionally as a child, preached to the poor in his adult life, crucified in the end of his life, and resurrected by God. The Church of the Holy Sepulchre is said to have been built over the location where Jesus was crucified and where the tomb was buried.



Jerusalem is considered a sacred site in Sunni Islamic tradition, along with Mecca and Medina. .... The Dome of the Rock is an Islamic sacred shrine in Jerusalem, built on the Temple Mount. This is where Muhammad ascended into heaven and was given the 5 pillars of Islam from Allah, which is still used today.[14]

[fiddy]

Religions in the 21st century :facepalm