Has there ever been a more overhyped athlete than Andrew Wiggins?

[PleezeBelieve]

I mean really, we are talking about someone who has been hyped as being one of THE BEST EVER who has actually NEVER played ANYTHING CLOSE to that level.... PERIOD.

Think about that.

Fresh off his mediocre showing for Team Canada, is ISH ready to come to a consensus that this guy is nothing close to what he was hyped as?

[kennethgriffin]

lebron

/thread


we're still waiting for that 8th ring btw

[ClipperRevival]

Hey, I remember you. You made several other threads bashing the guy. But no one pegged him as a generational talent. His floor is an 18 ppg guy with very good D. His ceiling is a poor man's McGrady with all-nba type D. You can't teach what he has. 6'8", long, quick/light feet and elite athleticism. He's going to average 20 ppg this year and I see him making all-nba defensive teams for the next decade. He definitely has all the traits to be a shut down defender if he wants to be. He has extremely quick feet and can slide laterally with ease. The question of how great he will be will depend on how much offense can be bring to the table. Will he be able to create his own shot like a true great or will he be more of a 2nd fiddle guy who needs another scorer to work off of?

[PleezeBelieve]

Hey, I remember you. You made several other threads bashing the guy. But no one pegged him as a generational talent. His floor is an 18 ppg guy with very good D. His ceiling is a poor man's McGrady with all-nba type D. You can't teach what he has. 6'8", long, quick/light feet and elite athleticism. He's going to average 20 ppg this year and I see him making all-nba defensive teams for the next decade. He definitely has all the traits to be a shut down defender if he wants to be. He has extremely quick feet and can slide laterally with ease. The question of how great he will be will depend on how much offense can be bring to the table. Will he be able to create his own shot like a true great or will he be more of a 2nd fiddle guy who needs another scorer to work off of?
:no:

[Kobe_6/8]

Anthony Bennett
Ricky Rubio
Darko Milicic

[Brook(lyn)Lopez]

Anthony 'Magic' Randolph

[bdreason]

I think he's gonna be good. He plays explosive, but under control. He has a solid jumper, and has shown some nice moves/footwork around the mid-post. Perennial All-Star + All-Defense probably.



Durant Rookie Year

20/4/2/1/1 on 43/29/87%


Wiggins Rookie Year

17/5/2/1/1 on 44/31/76%

[Uncle Drew]

Dion Waiters

[kennethgriffin]

I think he's gonna be good. He plays explosive, but under control. He has a solid jumper, and has shown some nice moves/footwork around the mid-post. Perennial All-Star + All-Defense probably.



Durant Rookie Year

20/4/2/1/1 on 43/29/87%


Wiggins Rookie Year

17/5/2/1/1 on 44/31/76%


and wiggins didnt get the green light till mid way through

[Bless Mathews]

I think he's gonna be good. He plays explosive, but under control. He has a solid jumper, and has shown some nice moves/footwork around the mid-post. Perennial All-Star + All-Defense probably.



Durant Rookie Year

20/4/2/1/1 on 43/29/87%


Wiggins Rookie Year

17/5/2/1/1 on 44/31/76%

And WAY better defense


Damn.

You just shut down the whole thread.


:applause:

[Sportal]

I think he's gonna be good. He plays explosive, but under control. He has a solid jumper, and has shown some nice moves/footwork around the mid-post. Perennial All-Star + All-Defense probably.



Durant Rookie Year

20/4/2/1/1 on 43/29/87%


Wiggins Rookie Year

17/5/2/1/1 on 44/31/76%

This guy always disappears when people present some decent line to back Wiggins up... That's not a bad one. Also, as someone said, he didn't have the green light till what part of the season? Kevin Martin shot more in less minutes. Come on..

[MP.Trey]

http://40.media.tumblr.com/95b222c305aabbbfb0291398671a0e4f/tumblr_mxb7od6sw21qznj8ho1_1280.png

[DCL]

greg oden was hyped more than anybody

[FKAri]

Anthony Bennett
Ricky Rubio
Darko Milicic

OJ Mayo
Michael Beasley
literally a thousand other guys OP

[West-Side]

I mean really, we are talking about someone who has been hyped as being one of THE BEST EVER who has actually NEVER played ANYTHING CLOSE to that level.... PERIOD.

Think about that.

Fresh off his mediocre showing for Team Canada, is ISH ready to come to a consensus that this guy is nothing close to what he was hyped as?

LeBron looked pretty similar in his rookie year; he just had the green light to chuck all game long.

16.9 PPG, 4.6 RPG, 2.1 APG, 1.0 SPG, 0.6 BPG, 2.2 TO, 36.2 MPG (44 FG%)
20.9 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 5.9 APG, 1.6 SPG, 0.7 BPG, 3.5 TO, 39.5 MPG (42 FG%)

Not really that much off LeBron's rookie season.
Both are only 19 and we all know how great LeBron became.

How is he overhyped?
Kid has a ton of talent and athleticism and had a great rookie season for a 19 year old kid. Give him some time, I'll be shocked if he doesn't end up being one of the superstars in this league.

[West-Side]

Someone beat me to the punch; but yeah, Wiggins had a better rookie year than Durant.

It takes time to adjust to the speed of the NBA game.
If you guys knew more than the scouts do, than you would be getting 6 figures a year to scout talent and not sitting on the basketball forum questioning their assessments.

[Derka]

I think he's gonna be good. He plays explosive, but under control. He has a solid jumper, and has shown some nice moves/footwork around the mid-post. Perennial All-Star + All-Defense probably.

Durant Rookie Year

20/4/2/1/1 on 43/29/87%

Wiggins Rookie Year

17/5/2/1/1 on 44/31/76%

Winner by way of first-round knockout.

[West-Side]

Winner by way of first-round knockout.

Projecting isn't necessarily reality though.
Just because Durant too struggled his rookie season and now has become arguably the best player in the world, doesn't mean Wiggins will have similar success.

Odds are against him.
Durant scores almost 4 points more per game on 2 less minutes a game his rookie year.

The main point, however, is that I have no clue how anyone can bash Wiggins based on what he did his rookie season as a 19 year old.

To me, he impressed me; I actually didn't expect him to do that good his first year. Having little college experience and being 19 years of age, I thought the speed and talent of the NBA will humble him a lot.

He did just fine, in fact, he did great and showed signs of brilliance.
He can be a 25/7 type SF on 48% while being a candidate for DPOTY and 1st Team All D for a decade to come.

That my friends could easily make him the best player on the planet one day.

Other notable 19 year olds:

McGrady (his 2nd season): 9.3 PPG, 5.7 RPG, 2.3 APG, 1.1 SPG, 1.3 BPG on 44%
Garnett: 10.4 PPG, 6.3 RPG, 1.8 APG, 1.1 SPG, 1.6 BPG on 49%
A.Davis: 13.5 PPG, 8.2 RPG, 1.0 APG, 1.2 SPG, 1.8 BPG on 52%
Bryant: 15.4 PPG, 3.1 RPG, 2.5 APG, 0.9 SPG, 0.5 BPG on 43%


The kid stacks up pretty good with any of them.
He's already scoring more than both Kobe & McGrady did (but he plays more minutes) on a similar (or better) efficiency.

And the thing is; he didn't really get the green light until mid-season.
He's going to be just fine homies.

[Hey Yo]

I think he's gonna be good. He plays explosive, but under control. He has a solid jumper, and has shown some nice moves/footwork around the mid-post. Perennial All-Star + All-Defense probably.



Durant Rookie Year

20/4/2/1/1 on 43/29/87%


Wiggins Rookie Year

17/5/2/1/1 on 44/31/76%
Durant and the Sonics won 31 games his rookie year, compared to Wiggins and Minny's 16 wins.

Without looking it up, there's a good chance that Seattle's opponents had to keep the gas on the pedal longer than Minny's did. T-Wolves probably got blown out more often which gave Wiggin's more ample opportunities to add to the box score.

Just speculating.

[20Four]

leBRONZE james....for someone going 2/6 and not knowing how to post up and dribble....over hyped mutha fvcka

[FreezingTsmoove]

I think he's gonna be good. He plays explosive, but under control. He has a solid jumper, and has shown some nice moves/footwork around the mid-post. Perennial All-Star + All-Defense probably.



Durant Rookie Year

20/4/2/1/1 on 43/29/87%


Wiggins Rookie Year

17/5/2/1/1 on 44/31/76%


Tyreke Evans?

Wiggins is going to be goat though in my opinion. A taller Vince Carter who wins

[kennethgriffin]

darius miles was hyped as shit back in the day


anyone remember his expectations to become the next kevin garnett?

[kennethgriffin]

Someone beat me to the punch; but yeah, Wiggins had a better rookie year than Durant.

It takes time to adjust to the speed of the NBA game.
If you guys knew more than the scouts do, than you would be getting 6 figures a year to scout talent and not sitting on the basketball forum questioning their assessments.

you gotta write "KANG james" somewhere in your avatar

:roll:

[Legends66NBA7]

Tyreke Evans?

Wiggins is going to be goat though in my opinion. A taller Vince Carter who wins

Good luck to Wiggins winning in Minnesota.

[plowking]

Wiggins by all accounts is exceeding expectations.

As an athlete he hasn't really completely figured out how to assert his dominance. He has actually been doing it with skills and moves he has developed throughout last season.

Last season he was the most used wing player in post up possessions, and was extremely effective from there. Not to mention he surprised people with his midrange game. Once he figures out how to use his athleticism, it is going to open up his game completely.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Good luck to Wiggins winning in Minnesota.

They are building very nicely. Signed KG to mentor Towns (both are similar in size)

And signed andre miller to mentor tyus jones (similar in size)

They are making the right moves imo

[gyu]

How has he been playing for Team Canada in the FIBA americas games?

[CTbasketball92]

Wiggins is a good player, but he was definitely overhyped. I remember looking on this board and seeing people say his FLOOR was a prime Tmac. :facepalm

I don't think any player in history has ever had that floor, not even LeBron.

Wiggins numbers this year were solid, but compared to the initial hype circa 2012-2013, he was really, really overhyped. The adjusted ceiling became Paul George, which is something i can see him getting too, though he doesn't look as smooth and coordinated. He is quicker and bouncier though, in my opinion.

Based on the "eye test," Wiggins is nowhere close to LeBron, Durant or Kobe at the same stage. All of them just looked like they had transcendent skills from an early age. It would have been interesting to see what an 18 year old kobe would've done on a team as bad as the wolves were this year.

[Naero]

Wiggins has definitely been overhyped, but I would have to opine that LeBron was the most hyped-up athlete ever since the media coverage became exponentially scrutinous.

"Overhyped" is not to be tossed around pejoratively, of course; similar to "overrated," it doesn't insist that they aren't great but more so that the arbitrary level of hype simply hasn't been lived up to. LeBron has managed to fulfill most of the hype in his career, despite its astronomicality, and Wiggins has already had a comparable rookie season and has accelerated through his learning curve down the stretch of his rookie season.

Once-in-a-generation athletes such as them tend to be the most overhyped bevy of players. Everyone knows that there will be a steep learning curve in the college-to-NBA transition when it pertains to skills, especially as it pertains to adjusting to the game-speed continuum of the league; but when when one has the athleticism and physique of LeBron and Wiggins, they know it will carry over in the immediacy of their NBA stint and that it will remain as a strong accompaniment for a while to their eventually developed skills.

Nevertheless, regardless of how much we may hate the hype, if we have any appreciativity for the infusion of fresh talent in this league, we must appreciate Wiggins. Most drafts within the past-several years have been underwhelming, and Wiggins has so far been among a handful of players that have shown potential to be engraved as an all-time great down the road—and the only draftee from the reputedly stacked '14 draft class so far that has provenly lived up to his hype in an injury-plagued one so far.

[plowking]

Wiggins numbers this year were solid, but compared to the initial hype circa 2012-2013, he was really, really overhyped. The adjusted ceiling became Paul George, which is something i can see him getting too, though he doesn't look as smooth and coordinated. He is quicker and bouncier though, in my opinion.

LOL. Wiggins is far more talented than Paul George, and far more coordinated.


Based on the "eye test," Wiggins is nowhere close to LeBron, Durant or Kobe at the same stage. All of them just looked like they had transcendent skills from an early age. It would have been interesting to see what an 18 year old kobe would've done on a team as bad as the wolves were this year.

Eye test tells me he has a more advanced post game than both Durant and Bron at that age. A better midrange game than Bron. He is a better athlete than Kobe. Eye test reveals that he is every bit as talented as those 3. Stats suggest it too.

[midatlantic09]

Wiggins by all accounts is exceeding expectations.

As an athlete he hasn't really completely figured out how to assert his dominance. He has actually been doing it with skills and moves he has developed throughout last season.

Last season he was the most used wing player in post up possessions, and was extremely effective from there. Not to mention he surprised people with his midrange game. Once he figures out how to use his athleticism, it is going to open up his game completely.

13.9 PER is exceeding expectations?? :lol

[plowking]

13.9 PER is exceeding expectations?? :lol

So a made up statistic with arbitrary values given to statistics is what I should define a player by? It can be a useful tool at times, but I bet you couldn't even begin with explain the stat to me, or why values are what they are.

[midatlantic09]

So a made up statistic with arbitrary values given to statistics is what I should define a player by? It can be a useful tool at times, but I bet you couldn't even begin with explain the stat to me, or why values are what they are.

While PER doesn't carry much value for guys like Bruce Bowen, Ben Wallace, or Tony Allen, it definitely has merit when it comes to guys who are primarily known for their offensive talents. There's a reason why guys like Lebron, Durant, Anthony Davis, Westbrook, Harden, etc. all have over a 25 PER while guys who are considered terrible NBA players often have a PER below 10.

[plowking]

While PER doesn't carry much value for guys like Bruce Bowen, Ben Wallace, or Tony Allen, it definitely has merit when it comes to guys who are primarily known for their offensive talents. There's a reason why guys like Lebron, Durant, Anthony Davis, Westbrook, Harden, etc. all have over a 25 PER while guys who are considered terrible NBA players often have a PER below 10.

Absolutely, but at the same time you're using it on a rookie who was changing roles throughout the year a lot and never really got settled like Bron, KD, Kobe, etc.

KD had a pretty bad PER in his rookie year from what I remember and now he is the most or in the top players for PER.

[CTbasketball92]

LOL. Wiggins is far more talented than Paul George, and far more coordinated.



Eye test tells me he has a more advanced post game than both Durant and Bron at that age. A better midrange game than Bron. He is a better athlete than Kobe. Eye test reveals that he is every bit as talented as those 3. Stats suggest it too.



Wiggins is more talented than george, but i think that is a solid mid-ceiling for him. Maybe more fluid is more of the word i was looking for. George can slither past defenders sometimes, meanwhile wiggins just runs in a completely straight line and never changes speeds. PG probably couldn't do that too well coming into the league, but he even looked more fluid to me in college.


I think Wiggins' post game, while really impressive, comes a bit out of necessity. LeBron was a MUCH better ballhandler than wiggins and he seemingly got into the lane or wherever else he wanted at will. He was a primary ballhandler and was making no-look passes seem easy at 18-19 years old. Wiggins is a better shooter, but their overall jumpshot percentage from their rookie years are around 32%, so who cares.
Stats don't suggest it? Isn't lebron like one of 5 players to average 20 5 and 5 as a rookie?
And NO. Wiggins has never, in any setting, shown anything as eyeopening as this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LE7iCJHscu4

Or this: https://youtu.be/1Kl0Z-6HLlw


I won't even get into KD. He was 6'10" and from what i remember, already a good bit better as a ballhander and still looked better as a shooter, hitting 87% of his freethrows.


Wiggins is never, ever, going to be as good as LeBron KB or KD. He's not going to be a player that guarantees a decent team 50 wins. I see a Vince Carter sort of ceiling (for different reasons), which would still make him a top 3 wing (better than paul george).

[JtotheIzzo]

I mean really, we are talking about someone who has been hyped as being one of THE BEST EVER who has actually NEVER played ANYTHING CLOSE to that level.... PERIOD.

Think about that.

Fresh off his mediocre showing for Team Canada, is ISH ready to come to a consensus that this guy is nothing close to what he was hyped as?

Canada is 6-1 with him in the line up. Best they have played since 2000.

Stats mean NOTHING in FIBA.

Check LeBron:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/olympics/athletes/lebron-james-1

Wiggins in Tuto Marchand Cup:

14.5 - 3.5 - 1.2

so in a nutshull, suck my nutshell

[West-Side]

While PER doesn't carry much value for guys like Bruce Bowen, Ben Wallace, or Tony Allen, it definitely has merit when it comes to guys who are primarily known for their offensive talents. There's a reason why guys like Lebron, Durant, Anthony Davis, Westbrook, Harden, etc. all have over a 25 PER while guys who are considered terrible NBA players often have a PER below 10.

So Neil Johnston is better than Kareem & Magic, right?

[StephHamann]

Durant Rookie Year

20/4/2/1/1 on 43/29/87%


Wiggins Rookie Year

17/5/2/1/1 on 44/31/76%

https://media.giphy.com/media/eGc5POG8xKQta/giphy.gif

[ralph_i_el]

eye test homie. He's a guaranteed all-star.

-Great Length
-Great Agility
-Great explosiveness
-Good post game
-Good shot form (his shooting numbers will go up consistently)
.
.
.
Bad Handle

The dude was built to play basketball. He reminds me of young Durant, but obviously not the same quality of shooter. KD as a rookie had a 15.8 Per, and a -10 net rating. Wiggins had a 13.9 PER and a -11 net rating.

one thing that stood out to me was that wiggins finished 67% of his shots at the rim, even though he was taking 30% of his shots from that range.

[keep-itreal]

I think he's too ugly to become a superstar

[Kblaze8855]

he's fine. Worst case scenario he ends up doing around 20 a game with good defense. Not even in the discussion for most overhyped. Wiggins wasn't as hyped OJ Mayo and he's as good as Mayo ever was right now.

He could peak in his first couple of years like OJ and Evans did but I'd be surprised.

[LAZERUSS]

Greg Oden.

Way over-rated coming out of High School.

[Vaniiiia]

Dion Waiters
unoriginal

[ralph_i_el]

OP, who will be better this year? Wiggins or Waiters?

[ShawkFactory]

Were people expecting him to average 30 a game as a rookie?

[sundizz]

Greg Oden.

Way over-rated coming out of High School.

Is it your goal in life to hate on every other big man to try and prop up the Big Loser? You got Stockholm Syndrome or something...must of had you caged up and used back in the day.