shaq coulda won 3 straight if you replaced kobe with any other quality 2nd option

[kennethgriffin]

1993 - nick anderson 20ppg
1993 - dennis scott 16ppg
1993 - scott skiles 15ppg

result = missed playoffs

1994 - penny hardaway 16ppg
1994 - nick anderson 16ppg
1994 - dennis scott 13ppg
1994 - scott skiles 10ppg

result = swept first round

1995 - penny hardaway 21ppg
1995 - nick anderson 16ppg
1995 - dennis scott 13ppg
1995 - horace grant 13ppg

result = swept nba finals

1996 - penny hardaway 22ppg
1996 - dennis scott 18ppg
1996 - nick anderson 15ppg
1996 - horace grant 13ppg

result = swept third round

1997 - eddie jones 17ppg
1997 - nick van exel 15ppg
1997 - elden campbell 15ppg
1997 - cedric ceballos 11ppg

result = lost 1-4 first round

1998 - eddie jones 17ppg
1998 - kobe bryant 15ppg
1998 - nick van exel 14ppg
1998 - rick fox 12ppg
1998 - elden campbell 10ppg

result = swept first round

1999 - kobe bryant 20ppg
1999 - glen rice 18ppg
1999 - rick fox 10ppg

result = swept 2nd round

2003 - kobe bryant 30ppg ( injured in playoffs )
2003 - derek fisher 10ppg

result = lost 2-4 in 2nd round

2004 - kobe bryant 24ppg ( bad shoulder all year
2004 - payton 15ppg
2004 - malone 12ppg ( injured in finals )

result = lost 1-4 in nba finals

2005 - dwyane wade 24ppg
2005 - eddie jones 13ppg
2005 - damon jones 12ppg
2005 - udonas haslem 11ppg

result = lost 3-4 in third round


2007 - dwyane wade 27ppg
2007 - jason williams 11ppg
2007 - jason kapono 11ppg
2007 - udonas haslem 11ppg

result = swept first round

2008 - amare stoudemire 25ppg
2008 - steve nash 16ppg
2008 - shawn marion 16ppg
2008 - leandro barbosa 16ppg
2008 - grant hill 13ppg
2008 - raja bell 12ppg

result = lost 1-4 first round

2009 - amare stoudemire 21ppg
2009 - jason richardson 16ppg
2009 - steve nash 16ppg
2009 - leandro barbosa 14ppg
2009 - grant hill 12ppg
2009 - matt barnes 10ppg

result = missed playoffs

2010 - lebron james 30ppg
2010 - mo williams 16ppg
2010 - antawn jamison 16ppg

result = lost 2-4 in 2nd round

2011 - paul pierce 19ppg
2011 - ray allen 17ppg
2011 - kevin garnett 15ppg
2011 - glen davis 12ppg
2011 - rajon rondo 11ppg
2011 - jeff green 10ppg

result = lost 1-4 in 2nd round











http://missxpose.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/Shaq22_t670_zps00efb4c9.jpg




only wins


2000 - kobe bryant 23ppg ( becomes elite, 1st team defense, assist leader, steals leader )
2000 - glen rice 16ppg

result = NBA CHAMPIONS ( no finals without kobe game 7 wcf )

2001 - kobe bryant 29ppg ( legendary mode )
2001 - derek fisher 12ppg

result = NBA CHAMPIONS

2002 - kobe bryant 25ppg ( legendary mode )
2002 - derek fisher 11ppg

result = NBA CHAMPIONS

2006 - dwyane wade 27ppg ( became elite, legendary mode )
2006 - jason williams 12ppg
2006 - antoine walker 12ppg

result = NBA CHAMPIONS ( shaq only 13ppg in the finals though )

[ralph_i_el]

lol PPG

because that's the only thing that makes Kobe look good.

[Bankaii]

Shit thread. But I did notice something.
Kobe 2000 Finals: 16/5/4 on 37%. 20% 3p.
Fisher 2002 Finals: 13/4/4 on 52%. 67% 3p.:bowdown:
Fisher > Kobe. Thanks Kenneth.

[kennethgriffin]

lol PPG

because that's the only thing that makes Kobe look good.



1998-99 NBA All-NBA (3rd)
1999-00 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
1999-00 NBA All-NBA (2nd)
2000-01 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2000-01 NBA All-NBA (2nd)
2001-02 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2001-02 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2002-03 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2002-03 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2003-04 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2003-04 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2004-05 NBA All-NBA (3rd)
2005-06 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2005-06 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2006-07 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2006-07 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2007-08 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2007-08 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2008-09 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2008-09 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2009-10 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2009-10 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2010-11 NBA All-Defensive (1st)
2010-11 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2011-12 NBA All-Defensive (2nd)
2011-12 NBA All-NBA (1st)
2012-13 NBA All-NBA (1st)

2001-02 NBA All-Star Game MVP
2006-07 NBA All-Star Game MVP
2007-08 NBA MVP
2008-09 NBA All-Star Game MVP
2008-09 NBA Finals MVP
2009-10 NBA Finals MVP
2010-11 NBA All-Star Game MVP

All-Star Games
1998 NBA
2000 NBA
2001 NBA
2002 NBA
2003 NBA
2004 NBA
2005 NBA
2006 NBA
2007 NBA
2008 NBA
2009 NBA
2010 NBA
2011 NBA
2012 NBA
2013 NBA
2014 NBA
2015 NBA

Championships
2000 Los Angeles Lakers (NBA) *assist leader, *steals leader
2001 Los Angeles Lakers (NBA) *assist leader, *steals leader
2002 Los Angeles Lakers (NBA) *assist leader, *steals leader
2009 Los Angeles Lakers (NBA) *assist leader
2010 Los Angeles Lakers (NBA) *assist leader, *steals leader



- only player to win multiple titles without a legendary sidekick (Pau Gasol 85th all time HOF rating)

- only player to start or make 17 consecutive all-star games

- all time record for all NBA 1st teams (11)

- all time record for all defensive 1st teams (9)

- all time record for all star game mvps (4)

- all time best International win% (100%)

- all time most 50+ win playoff teams beatin (24)

- youngest NBA allstar (19 years)

- youngest 1st team all defense (21 years)

- youngest dunk contest champion (18 years)

- youngest nba starter (17 years)

- Sporting News Player of the decade ( 2000's )

- Dime Magazine Player of the decade ( 2000's )

- TNT Player of the decade ( 2000's )

- 2 olympic gold medals

[kennethgriffin]

Shit thread. But I did notice something.
Kobe 2000 Finals: 16/5/4 on 37%. 20% 3p.
Fisher 2002 Finals: 13/4/4 on 52%. 67% 3p.:bowdown:
Fisher > Kobe. Thanks Kenneth.

19ppg in the games kobe actually played more than 2 minutes

:lol

and kobe held reggie to 1 for 16 in game 1

saved game 4

and had a double double in game 6

not to mention saving the season in game 7 wcf

[kennethgriffin]

hypocrisy at its finest



"shaq can win with any kobe replacement"


"all kobe does is score"


"how can you mention only ppg"


https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/577183466783158273/37BIgZO0.jpeg

[GIF REACTION]

Fun fact: Kobe has NEVER led the playoffs in Box Plus Minus

[GIF REACTION]

Lebron has led it 8 times and MJ has led it 6

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

To be fair, Shaq won his first title while his second option got outscored by a role player, Austin Croshere.

http://s4.postimg.org/9bvf558ul/BTg_Oby_JCQAA_Cdz.jpg



http://home.comcast.net/~magic_rat/croshere9.jpg

[kennethgriffin]

Fun fact: Kobe has NEVER led the playoffs in Box Plus Minus


1 more reason for me not to give a f*ck about advanced stats/ analytics


didnt kobe lead the lakers in win shares during the 2001 playoffs

:lol

[kennethgriffin]

To be fair, Shaq won his first title while his second option got outscored by a role player, Austin Croshere.

http://s4.postimg.org/9bvf558ul/BTg_Oby_JCQAA_Cdz.jpg



http://home.comcast.net/~magic_rat/croshere9.jpg


if michael jordan missed 2 full games during a finals he might get outscored in total points by scottie pippen. who knows

what does that prove?

:lol


fact is without kobes heroics VS the REAL finals ( best team ) portland.... shaq wouldnt have made it to the finals to beat up on the pissers lol

[GIF REACTION]

Only because he played more minutes than Shaq

Shaqs per48 win shares was slightly better

Then you factor in Shaq was the brunt of the defensive attention

It's the closest Kobe ever came to dethroning Shaq

[GIF REACTION]

Fun Fact: Pau Gasol has a higher career playoffs Box Plus Minus and Win shares per 48 minutes than Kobe

[kennethgriffin]

people seem to forget that the east has sucked forever. and the real nba finals is in the western conference


they all say ... "well shaq and any 20ppg guy can beat the pissers, philly and jersey"


except shaq with any other guy doesnt make it past portland, sanantonio or sacramento to play those weak finals matchups


sh*t.. kobe and any adequate big woulda shat all over indy, philly and jersey too


this isnt saying allot.. the east sucked


:roll:

[GIF REACTION]

Fun additional Fact: Pau had a superior Win shares per 48, Box Plus Minus, and Win shares in the 2010 playoffs compared to Kobe

[kennethgriffin]

Fun Fact: Pau Gasol has a higher career playoffs Box Plus Minus and Win shares per 48 minutes than Kobe


youre only proving your analytics favor efficient 7 footers






does that anaylics stuff factor in that gasol is 0-16 as leader without kobe?



:oldlol:

[GIF REACTION]

And there it is

Kenneth gon' Kenneth

His absolute rebuttal for everything is always a team feat, whether it be 2/6 or 5 rings!!! It's the absolute cop out, like calling someone a racist. Effectively dropping out of an argument

[kennethgriffin]

Fun additional Fact: Pau had a superior Win shares per 48, Box Plus Minus, and Win shares in the 2010 playoffs compared to Kobe


and yet kobe won finals mvp

:lol

[kennethgriffin]

And there it is

Kenneth gon' Kenneth

His absolute rebuttal for everything is always a team feat, whether it be 2/6 or 5 rings!!! It's the absolute cop out, like calling someone a racist. Effectively dropping out of an argument



you can wipe team accomplishments away and i'm pretty sure kobe comes out with 100 times the career pau gasol had


and thus... proving youre analytics are worthless


:roll:

[kennethgriffin]

And there it is

Kenneth gon' Kenneth

His absolute rebuttal for everything is always a team feat, whether it be 2/6 or 5 rings!!! It's the absolute cop out, like calling someone a racist. Effectively dropping out of an argument


its actually 1.5 for 6


lockouts arent subjective

[GIF REACTION]

Why would a lockout ring be worth less than a standard 82 gamer ring

Explain your reasoning kenneth

[dubeta]

Agreed, remember we're talking about a peak Shaq here not a young 20 year old Orlando shaq or a 35 year old Miami Shaq


Peak Shaq + a decent 2nd option = 3-4 rings


Prime Gasol + decent role players = 2 rings

[kennethgriffin]

Agreed, remember we're talking about a peak Shaq here not a young 20 year old Orlando shaq or a 35 year old Miami Shaq


Peak Shaq + a decent 2nd option = 3-4 rings


Prime Gasol + decent role players = 2 rings


shaq was just a body and an athlete

he barely even evolved as a player asside from adding a post hook in his 2nd or 3rd year


prime shaq is basically 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005



and he was all nba level in 2006, 2007, 2008




if anyone tries telling me 29ppg 2nd year shaq wasnt good enough to accept blame for defeat. then youre a god damn f*ggot

he had a bunch of help EVERY YEAR HE PLAYED

[kennethgriffin]

people seem to only judge shaq for the years he won

"the poor guy wasnt good enough before 2000!"

"the big fella was washed up by 2003!"


lol hogwash

[dubeta]

Shaq was in his prime in 2005? :lol :roll:



I guess Kobe's in his prime right now, since he apparently doesn't rely on athleticism and is all skill based. Shouldn't he average 30 this season? :lol

[kennethgriffin]

Shaq was in his prime in 2005? :lol :roll:



I guess Kobe's in his prime right now, since he apparently doesn't rely on athleticism and is all skill based. Shouldn't he average 30 this season? :lol




shaq 1994 - 29.3ppg, 13.2rpg, 2.4apg, 3.0bpg, .599% fg's ( NOT prime )
shaq 1995 - 29.3ppg, 11.4rpg, 2.7apg, 2.4bpg, .583% fg's ( NOT prime )
shaq 2000 - 29.7ppg, 13.6rpg, 3.8apg, 3.0bpg, .574% fg's ( PRIME!!!!!! )

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:



dude... shaq was just a body. he had a body from his early days... all that changed was he got kobe bryant


:lol

[GIF REACTION]

lmao kenneth straight ducking my lockout question

duckin mofo

[dubeta]

So tell me, how important was Kobe's 22 points on 40% during the 3 peat ? :lol :roll:


Kobe was a role-player, what's so hard in accepting it? There's no shame in that, just admit your favorite player is easily replaceable

[kennethgriffin]

lmao kenneth straight ducking my lockout question

duckin mofo


why not just flip a coin to see who wins during lockout years. save the season that way



why is that any different than 82 games. 50 games? 66 games? 0 games? same difference right?

[GIF REACTION]

Roll player gon roll player.

[GIF REACTION]

why not just flip a coin to see who wins during lockout years. save the season that way



why is that any different than 82 games. 50 games? 66 games? 0 games? same difference right?
Everyone still has to play the same amount of games though bro

It's still fair

[kennethgriffin]

So tell me, how important was Kobe's 22 points on 40% during the 3 peat ? :lol :roll:


Kobe was a role-player, what's so hard in accepting it? There's no shame in that, just admit your favorite player is easily replaceable


nobodies questioning the lakers finals matchups

shaq needed elite kobe for the western battles

look up those numbers/matchups





kobe and a broom stick woulda beat the pissers, philly and jersy

[kennethgriffin]

Everyone still has to play the same amount of games though bro

It's still fair


so a 0 game title coin flip is the same as an 82 game season title due to the 0 game season being played on an even scale... all 30 teams played 0 games. so it counts

this is your argument?

[dubeta]

so a 0 game title coin flip is the same as an 82 game season title due to the 0 game season being played on an even scale... all 30 teams played 0 games. so it counts

this is your argument?


16 playoff wins is 16 wins

[kennethgriffin]

Roll player gon roll player.



kobe has the 2 highest 2nd leading scorer averages in playoff/finals history

[GIF REACTION]

Yes, every team played the same amount of games

Stupid argument using 0 games

The lockout was 66 games bro

[kennethgriffin]

16 playoff wins is 16 wins


ok so 0 game season/ 16 playoff wins is the same as 82 game/16 win playoffs?

[GIF REACTION]

kobe has the 2 highest 2nd leading scorer averages in playoff/finals history
:roll:

Kobe has to use '2nd leading scorer' tag

Pretty much sums it up guys

[kennethgriffin]

Yes, every team played the same amount of games

Stupid argument using 0 games

The lockout was 66 games bro


why is 0 games a stupid argument

what makes 66 games the magic number?


does that mean duncans 1999 title is voided?

or is 50 games the new measuring stick


can 40 games be the bar?


then if its 40 and actually half a year. is that officially 0.5?

then if thats officially 0.5 cause its half a year. then can we atleast agree that 50 games is 0.6 of a title

and 66 games is 0.8 of a title


if not and it doesnt matter... then 0 games is just as legitimate







you know whats easier than all of this. accepting it for what it is. a lockout title and only comparable to other lockout titles. its not a real title

[Dbrog]

Hey Kenneth, the "legendary kobe" that you have on your dick all the time (01') played 68 games during the season. Guess that means his season has an asterisk and doesn't count :oldlol:

[kennethgriffin]

:roll:

Kobe has to use '2nd leading scorer' tag

Pretty much sums it up guys




so 29ppg isnt legit if its a 2nd leading scorer






even though the #1 guy is averaging 0.1 more ppg for the playoffs

and that 2nd leading scorer averages more ppg during the first 3 rounds against better teams ?


lol


seriously. at some point you kobe haters are gonna all die off. and all that will live on are people who appreciate kobe



hate is spite... nobody will have spite for kobe in the future



deal with it.


:lol

[kennethgriffin]

Hey Kenneth, the "legendary kobe" that you have on your dick all the time (01') played 68 games during the season. Guess that means his season has an asterisk and doesn't count :oldlol:


wrong

because kobe not playing all 82 games didnt effect the other teams throughout the league in terms of practice time, pre season, training camp, back to back to backs, 4 games in 5 nights, injuries to dozens of stars throughout the league. most notably the reigning league mvp

[dubeta]

Kobe was a Role Player


Accept it and move on

[dubeta]

Should the lockout count as 2 rings?


Miami was a old team with a 30 year old injured Wade, Bosh who was injured half the playoffs, and old vets in Battier, Miller, Haslem etc



They suffered the most with the condensed schedule, back-to-backs, less prep time



So should it count as 2 rings?? :wtf:

[GIF REACTION]

Roll players gon' Roll players.

[Bosnian Sajo]

Jordan would of still won 6 if you replace Pippen with any other quality 2nd option.

Same with Magic, take Jabbar out and put in any quality 2nd option.

Same with Celtics, take out McHale who cares, Bird still getting titles.

Curry could of easily done it without finals mvp Iggy.....are you starting to understand how dumb these statements sound?

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe was a Role Player


Accept it and move on

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Btu00qoIAAEQz9r.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bu0WfSGIMAA1M9N.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Lc9ZYfv.png


:lol

[DMV2]

To be fair, Shaq won his first title while his second option got outscored by a role player, Austin Croshere.

http://s4.postimg.org/9bvf558ul/BTg_Oby_JCQAA_Cdz.jpg



http://home.comcast.net/~magic_rat/croshere9.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/3ulcawP.gif

[GIF REACTION]

LMAO Kobetards needa use tv graphics during the playoffs because we all know how they look at the end of the playoffs

LMAO

[kennethgriffin]

http://i.imgur.com/3ulcawP.gif


the finals wasnt even the finals

:oldlol:


a healthy kobe with a trash bag coulda beat the pissers





give shaq austin croshere and see if he makes it past portland

[dubeta]

Shaq: 36 and 15 on 56 %


Kobe : 22 and 5 on 40%



:roll: :roll:

[DMV2]

if michael jordan missed 2 full games during a finals he might get outscored in total points by scottie pippen. who knows

what does that prove?

:lol


fact is without kobes heroics VS the REAL finals ( best team ) portland.... shaq wouldnt have made it to the finals to beat up on the pissers lol
So you admit that Kobe missed 2 full games(one playing only 8 mins) in the 2000 Finals?

That means Shaq carried that entire team with an injured Kobe, a washed up Glen Rice and a bunch of nobodies

That also means Kobe gets an asterisk on his 2000 Finals since he only played 4 full games out of 6.

4 rings, 2 FMVP, 1 MVP, one asterisk ring...actually 2 asterisk rings if you remember 2002.

[GIF REACTION]

Holy shit

This is like the equivalent of three dudes taking turns beating the shit out of a down syndrome kid

It's brutal

[Dbrog]

This thread is a MURDER!

RIP Kenny

[kennethgriffin]

LMAO Kobetards needa use tv graphics during the playoffs because we all know how they look at the end of the playoffs

LMAO


at the end of the playoffs it looked like this


kobe = 471 points, 29.4ppg + assists leader + steals leader
shaq = 487 points, 30.4ppg




http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view/46055/razor-o.gif

[dubeta]

So even after all your stat manipulation and cherry picking, Shaq STILL ends up with more points, rebounds, and fg% ??:oldlol: :lol



Sidekick gon sidekick

[kennethgriffin]

So you admit that Kobe missed 2 full games(one playing only 8 mins) in the 2000 Finals?

That means Shaq carried that entire team with an injured Kobe, a washed up Glen Rice and a bunch of nobodies

That also means Kobe gets an asterisk on his 2000 Finals since he only played 4 full games out of 6.

4 rings, 2 FMVP, 1 MVP, one asterisk ring...actually 2 asterisk rings if you remember 2002.


the real finals isnt vs the east


:lol

[GIF REACTION]

Don't even mention the blocks LMAO

[kennethgriffin]

So even after all your stat manipulation and cherry picking, Shaq STILL ends up with more points, rebounds, and fg% ??:oldlol: :lol



Sidekick gon sidekick


co lead

1 guy has to be named fmvp on a 2 man team


it was shaq


good for him


fact remains kobe did more for his 2001 and 2002 titles than most finals mvps ever did for theirs


and kobe saved shaqs career in the 2000 wcf

[dubeta]

co lead

1 guy has to be named fmvp on a 2 man team


it was shaq


good for him


fact remains kobe did more for his 2001 and 2002 titles than most finals mvps ever did for theirs


and kobe saved shaqs career in the 2000 wcf



So then why wasn't Gasol a co-lead with his 21/11/3 with 2 blocks on 52% Fg??? :lol :lol

He also posted higher Win Shares and PER than Kobe, and saved Kobe's career in that horrible Game 7


Can't have it both ways :lol



Why isn't Gasol a co-lead??



Try and dodge this one

[kennethgriffin]

and yall wonder why mods let me be who i am


because they see me being attacked by trolls and thus legitimizing my POV


the mods see me providing a solid case


the mods see that every turd on ISH is on my n*ts hanging off my every word

the mods see that the only useful thing you r*tards bring to ISH is more traffic and thus more money for jeff

the mods know i continuously have to state these facts on a routine basis due to people forgetting everything a day later



this is why i exist. because you allow me to. you make this possible


:oldlol:

[dubeta]

So then why wasn't Gasol a co-lead with his 21/11/3 with 2 blocks on 52% Fg??? :lol :lol

He also posted higher Win Shares and PER than Kobe, and saved Kobe's career in that horrible Game 7


Can't have it both ways :lol



Why isn't Gasol a co-lead??



Try and dodge this one


Damn, Troll Thread officially Destroyed :lol

[kennethgriffin]

So then why wasn't Gasol a co-lead with his 21/11/3 with 2 blocks on 52% Fg??? :lol :lol

He also posted higher Win Shares and PER than Kobe, and saved Kobe's career in that horrible Game 7


Can't have it both ways :lol



Why isn't Gasol a co-lead??



Try and dodge this one


because being outscored by nearly 10ppg is not a co-lead

i readily admit kobe was a 2nd option on the 2000 title team

2001 and 2002 however ... being 1 point behind in playoff scoring is as close as it gets


if gasol averaged 29ppg to kobes 30ppg... then maybe...

[GIF REACTION]

Fun fact: Gasol had a better Box Plus Minus and Win shares compared to Kobe in the 2010 playoffs

[kennethgriffin]

Fun fact: Gasol had a better Box Plus Minus and Win shares compared to Kobe in the 2010 playoffs


and yet he was outscored by 10 ppg from a guy who also lead the team in assists and steals. drawing double teams to make up for half of gasols points


analytics take a back seat to facts

[dubeta]

No consideration to rebounds and fg%? :lol


Gasol was better than Kobe


Shaq had 3 times Kobe's rebounds


Gasol had twice Kobe's rebounds



Both were more efficient









Both were better than Kobe

[kennethgriffin]

No consideration to rebounds and fg%? :lol


Gasol was better than Kobe


Shaq had 3 times Kobe's rebounds


Gasol had twice Kobe's rebounds



Both were more efficient









Both were better than Kobe


kobe had more points, assists, steals, threes, free throws, ft%, 3pt%, minutes, fg's

pau had more rebounds, blocks, fg%





kobe outscored pau 695 points to 420 points in 2009

kobe outscored pau 671 points to 450 points in 2010



sorry... its not quite the same as a kobe/shaq co-lead ring

[dubeta]

So.... Can we conclude that:





Kobe was never the best player on a championship team

[kennethgriffin]

So.... Can we conclude that:





Kobe was never the best player on a championship team




na

[dubeta]

na


Shaq clearly was 100% better than Kobe in the 1st 3, and Gasol was more productive in the other 2. Overall Kobe was never the best player in a championship team

[GIF REACTION]

So to conclude

kobe has smaller stats
smaller achievements
smaller frame
smaller hands
smaller impact

Lebron wins

[kuniva_dAMiGhTy]

http://i.imgur.com/3ulcawP.gif

And that's with Kobe playing 30 more minutes than Big Crosh. :eek:

So, not only could one argue Kobe's 2000 championship has an asterisk next to it, but NOW it has been established that Shaq indeed won with a bunch of role players that year.

MDE

http://exnba.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/shaq-lakers-dunk.gif

[Paul George 24]

hypocrisy at its finest



"shaq can win with any kobe replacement"


"all kobe does is score"


"how can you mention only ppg"


https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/577183466783158273/37BIgZO0.jpeg
ALL KOBE CAN DO IS STAY BEHIND SHAQ

[feyki]

Total career championship ratios from by win shares(oliver n kubatko) ;

1- Bill Russell - 2.83

2- Michael Jordan - 1.75

3- George Mikan - 1.72

4- Sam Jones - 1.48

5 - Earvin "Magic" Johnson - 1.27

6 - Tim Duncan - 1.27

7 - John "Hondo" Havlicek - 1.16

8 - Kobe Bryant - 1.12

9 - Kareem Abdul Jabbar - 1.07

10 - Scottie Pippen - 1.00

11 - Shaquille O'Neal - 1.00

12 - Tommy Heinsohn - 0.99

13 - Robert Horry - 0.95

14 - Larry Bird - 0.89

15 - Frank Ramsey - 0.80

16 - Wilt Chamberlain - 0.66

17 - Lebron "King" James - 0.62

18 - Dwyane Wade - 0.59

19 - Manu Ginobili - 0.57

20 - Bob Cousy - 0.56

[kennethgriffin]

ALL KOBE CAN DO IS STAY BEHIND SHAQ


and then..... 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015

happened

[dubeta]

and then..... 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015

happened


He was shit for half those years, and irrelevant for the other half

[kennethgriffin]

1993 - nick anderson 20ppg
1993 - dennis scott 16ppg
1993 - scott skiles 15ppg

result = missed playoffs

1994 - penny hardaway 16ppg
1994 - nick anderson 16ppg
1994 - dennis scott 13ppg
1994 - scott skiles 10ppg

result = swept first round

1995 - penny hardaway 21ppg
1995 - nick anderson 16ppg
1995 - dennis scott 13ppg
1995 - horace grant 13ppg

result = swept nba finals

1996 - penny hardaway 22ppg
1996 - dennis scott 18ppg
1996 - nick anderson 15ppg
1996 - horace grant 13ppg

result = swept third round

1997 - eddie jones 17ppg
1997 - nick van exel 15ppg
1997 - elden campbell 15ppg
1997 - cedric ceballos 11ppg

result = lost 1-4 first round

1998 - eddie jones 17ppg
1998 - kobe bryant 15ppg
1998 - nick van exel 14ppg
1998 - rick fox 12ppg
1998 - elden campbell 10ppg

result = swept first round

1999 - kobe bryant 20ppg
1999 - glen rice 18ppg
1999 - rick fox 10ppg

result = swept 2nd round

2003 - kobe bryant 30ppg ( injured in playoffs )
2003 - derek fisher 10ppg

result = lost 2-4 in 2nd round

2004 - kobe bryant 24ppg ( bad shoulder all year
2004 - payton 15ppg
2004 - malone 12ppg ( injured in finals )

result = lost 1-4 in nba finals

2005 - dwyane wade 24ppg
2005 - eddie jones 13ppg
2005 - damon jones 12ppg
2005 - udonas haslem 11ppg

result = lost 3-4 in third round


2007 - dwyane wade 27ppg
2007 - jason williams 11ppg
2007 - jason kapono 11ppg
2007 - udonas haslem 11ppg

result = swept first round

2008 - amare stoudemire 25ppg
2008 - steve nash 16ppg
2008 - shawn marion 16ppg
2008 - leandro barbosa 16ppg
2008 - grant hill 13ppg
2008 - raja bell 12ppg

result = lost 1-4 first round

2009 - amare stoudemire 21ppg
2009 - jason richardson 16ppg
2009 - steve nash 16ppg
2009 - leandro barbosa 14ppg
2009 - grant hill 12ppg
2009 - matt barnes 10ppg

result = missed playoffs

2010 - lebron james 30ppg
2010 - mo williams 16ppg
2010 - antawn jamison 16ppg

result = lost 2-4 in 2nd round

2011 - paul pierce 19ppg
2011 - ray allen 17ppg
2011 - kevin garnett 15ppg
2011 - glen davis 12ppg
2011 - rajon rondo 11ppg
2011 - jeff green 10ppg

result = lost 1-4 in 2nd round






















MDE


:lol

[kennethgriffin]

He was shit for half those years, and irrelevant for the other half


2003 - 1st team all nba, 1st team all defense
2004 - 1st team all nba, 1st team all defense
2005 - 3rd team all nba
2006 - 1st team all nba, 1st team all defense
2007 - 1st team all nba, 1st team all defense
2008 - 1st team all nba, 1st team all defense
2009 - 1st team all nba, 1st team all defense
2010 - 1st team all nba, 1st team all defense
2011 - 1st team all nba, 1st team all defense
2012 - 1st team all nba, 2nd team all defense
2013 - 1st team all nba


:lol

[dubeta]

Lol why are you using his 2003-2004 years with Kobe?

Doesn't that go against your point?

[kennethgriffin]

Lol why are you using his 2003-2004 years with Kobe?

Doesn't that go against your point?


no it helps due to kobe not being 100% vs their best competition in the playoffs either year


i said shaq needed an elite/healthy kobe to beat his best competition


i.e.

- Portland 2000
- San Antonio 2001
- Sacramento 2002
- San Antonio 2003
- Detroit 2004




had kobe been 100% for 2003, 2004 playoffs the lakers probly win both years and 5-peat

[Paul George 24]

and then..... 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015

happened

no kobe shaq win again with wade
and kobe need fisher & gasol to the last 2 rings :roll:

[Paul George 24]

and kobe is done and about retire :lol

[dubeta]

Kobe wasn't elite in 2000



Lol

Rekt


:lol

[kennethgriffin]

no kobe shaq win again with wade
and kobe need fisher & gasol to the last 2 rings :roll:


shaq was the 3rd leading scorer in the 2006 finals

kobe was the leading scorer and finals mvp in 2009 and 2010


:lol

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe wasn't elite in 2000



Lol

Rekt


:lol


youre a lazy troll

Rekt



ISH used to have way better competition for me

[Paul George 24]

shaq was the 3rd leading scorer in the 2006 finals

kobe was the leading scorer and finals mvp in 2009 and 2010


:lol
gasol carried kobe

[Dbrog]

If Kobe was so injured in 04', why did he insist on playing KoME ball and shot jacking for days while ignoring Shaq in the paint? Everything looked fine to me except the mansion Kobe was building with all those bricks! He also played 45 minutes or more each of those games...because that's what injured players do :D

[dubeta]

If Kobe was so injured in 04', why did he insist on playing KoME ball and shot jacking for days while ignoring Shaq in the paint? Everything looked fine to me except the mansion Kobe was building with all those bricks! He also played 45 minutes or more each of those games...because that's what injured players do :D


Damn



Rekt





:lol

[ShaqTwizzle]

Why is Mr. Griffin listing shitty choke artist roleplayers like Anderson & Scott as if they matter?

02 Kobe : 26 / 4.4-apg on 49%TS (vs West)

12 Wade : 23 / 4.3-apg on 53%TS
95 Drexler : 21 / 5-apg on 59%TS

Ray Allen in the 01 playoffs : 25 / 6-apg on 61%TS

Kobe was a solid All-Star in 00 & 02 but his performance level honestly wasn't all that special.
Plenty of sidekick #2's have put up comparable or better numbers over the years.

So yes many, many guys could have potentially replaced him those two years (Penny included).
>inb4 oh Shaq already lost with Penny

Competition matters.
00 Lakers especially after their injury (loss of Kobe) wouldn't have beaten the 95 Rockets.
02 Lakers wouldn't have beaten the 96 Bulls (I don't think).
So yeah... Penny and Shaq could have won in 00 & 02.

For Kenneth.
All the years when Shaq had a "legit All-Star" at his side he did very well.

93 = No All-Stars
94 = No All-Stars
95 = Made Finals
96 = Made CFinals lost to 96 Bulls (no shame in that) (PF was injured)
97 = No All-Stars
98 = No All-Stars
99 = No All-Stars
00 = Ring
01 = Ring
02 = Ring
03 = Lost to Champs (Kobe was injured + other issues)
04 = Made Finals
05 = Made CFinals (would have made Finals if Wade not injured)
06 = Champ

07+ = Shaq was washed up after this so why even list these years unless you're a troll?

Also please don't spout nonsense like Van Exel was a legit All-Star or a guy you could win a title with as your #2.

He was a flashy chucker and a playoff choker.
In the 97/98 playoffs combined he averaged : 12 / 5-apg on 46%TS.
Yeah that is not an All-Star buddy.
He also averaged 9ppg / 4-apg on 36%TS against Utah in the 98 WCF.

Jones was a 3 & D roleplayer who was good on the break.
An elite roleplayer but not a guy who could create a high amount of offense for himself in the playoffs because he didn't have the skillset for it.

In the 97 & 98 playoffs he averaged : 14.6 / 2.6-apg on 60%TS
(his numbers were much worse VS Utah)

Kobe was a scrub until 99 and wasn't a legit All-Star until 00.

Even 2000 Kobe failed to perform at an All-Star level in 6/11 games LAL won prior to the Finals.

[sportjames23]

Anyone else get a kick outta dubeta and kenniff going at it? :oldlol:

[ArbitraryWater]

And that's with Kobe playing 30 more minutes than Big Crosh. :eek:

So, not only could one argue Kobe's 2000 championship has an asterisk next to it, but NOW it has been established that Shaq indeed won with a bunch of role players that year.

MDE

http://exnba.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/shaq-lakers-dunk.gif

:roll: :roll:

lovely ISH styled thread.. beautiful.

Stupidity and everyone ganging up on Kenny and a few funny gems

[kennethgriffin]

:roll: :roll:

lovely ISH styled thread.. beautiful.

Stupidity and everyone ganging up on Kenny and a few funny gems


am i the only one who values the WCF portland series above the indiana series


either one of shaq or kobe coulda slayed indiana without the other guy



there is no finals without game 7 wcf when kobe saved shaqs legacy

[ShaqTwizzle]

the fact that you said shaq had NO allstars in 1998

when infact the lakers sent an all time record 4 players to the 1998 allstar game


pretty much makes you and everything you stand for .....


All-Star Game is a popularity contest.
The 98 Lakers were a popular team.

Doesn't change the fact that 6th man Kobe, roleplayer Jones and Exel were not legit All-Star caliber players.

Once again....

Kobe 98 playoffs : 8.7-ppg / 1.5-apg on 50%TS
Exel 98 playoffs : 11.6-ppg / 4.6-apg on 45%TS

But muh, muh 4 All-Stars!
:kobe:

[kennethgriffin]

All-Star Game is a popularity contest.
The 98 Lakers were a popular team.

Doesn't change the fact that 6th man Kobe, roleplayer Jones and Exel were not legit All-Star caliber players.

Once again....

Kobe 98 playoffs : 8.7-ppg / 1.5-apg on 50%TS
Exel 98 playoffs : 11.6-ppg / 4.6-apg on 45%TS

But muh, muh 4 All-Stars!
:kobe:



http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/61/61b768b60c39d47171c26bb8cb6293f51cfbc8017addb7194d 9368f083ed5f3f.jpg



when you have a team with 4 allstars and one of them taking up a bulk of the shots... the other 3 guys will have trouble dropping historic numbers due to having to share the ball


:facepalm

[ShaqTwizzle]

there is no finals without game 7 wcf when kobe saved shaqs legacy

Kobe didn't save shit.

Shaq carried the Lakers to a 3-1 lead over the first 4 games of that series despite Kobe shitting it up.

Over those games Shaq averaged : 29 / 12 / 4.3-apg / 3-bpg on 56%TS
Over those games Kobe averaged : 17 / 5-apg and was shit in 3/4 games + 2/3 wins.

Then in G5 with a chance to end the series.
----
Shaq : 31 / 21 / 3-ast / 2-BLK on 61%TS
Kobe : 17 / 5 / 4-ast / 6-TOV / 6-PF on 50%TS

Kobe playing well in G7 was just making up for his shitty play in 2 of their first 3 wins and in G5 where they should have ended the series.

[Dbrog]

when you have a team with 4 allstars and one of them taking up a bulk of the shots... the other 3 guys will have trouble dropping historic numbers due to having to share the ball


:facepalm

Go back and look at the numbers that YOU POSTED when comparing Shaq and Kobe's ppg when one was taking up a bulk of the shots and apply your above statement. You are now disproving your own posts in the thread with your new posts :lol

[ShaqTwizzle]

when you have a team with 4 allstars and one of them taking up a bulk of the shots... the other 3 guys will have trouble dropping historic numbers due to having to share the ball


Yet they had no problem doing it for 60+ games in the reg-season and in certain playoff rounds.

What a silly excuse.

Shaq was insanely efficient in the playoffs that year, passed very well and was not very ball dominant for a leading scorer.
He made life much easier on his guys not visa-versa.

The truth is Van Exel usually sucked in the playoffs.
The year before Shaq joined the team he put up 11.8 / 6.8-apg on 39%TS.

Eddie Jone's playoff PER in 98 was the highest of his career and he never put up better numbers in any other year.

Kobe was just not "there yet" in 98 and his ineptitude in the playoffs was proof of that. He wasn't ready.

Just face it.
That team didn't have a single legit All-Star outside of Shaq.
Van Exel is not even close and he is not gonna be the #2 on a legit contender.
Jones (who I liked) was still just an elite roleplayer.
Kobe was still too young and not close to being a legit A-Star yet.

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe didn't save shit.

Shaq carried the Lakers to a 3-1 lead over the first 4 games of that series despite Kobe shitting it up.

Over those games Shaq averaged : 29 / 12 / 4.3-apg / 3-bpg on 56%TS
Over those games Kobe averaged : 17 / 5-apg and was shit in 3/4 games + 2/3 wins.

Then in G5 with a chance to end the series.
----
Shaq : 31 / 21 / 3-ast / 2-BLK on 61%TS
Kobe : 17 / 5 / 4-ast / 6-TOV / 6-PF on 50%TS

Kobe playing well in G7 was just making up for his shitty play in 2 of their first 3 wins and in G5 where they should have ended the series.



https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Btu00qoIAAEQz9r.jpg:large


there is no finals without kobe saving shaqs legacy


period

if kobe doesnt lead the lakers in every single category in the most important game of shaqs life... then shaq goes down as a choking little B*TCH


that woulda been the 7th straight year shaq flopped in the playoffs

[kennethgriffin]

Yet they had no problem doing it for 60+ games in the reg-season and in certain playoff rounds.

What a silly excuse.

Shaq was insanely efficient in the playoffs that year, passed very well and was not very ball dominant for a leading scorer.
He made life much easier on his guys not visa-versa.

The truth is Van Exel usually sucked in the playoffs.
The year before Shaq joined the team he put up 11.8 / 6.8-apg on 39%TS.

Eddie Jone's playoff PER in 98 was the highest of his career and he never put up better numbers in any other year.

Kobe was just not "there yet" in 98 and his ineptitude in the playoffs was proof of that. He wasn't ready.

Just face it.
That team didn't have a single legit All-Star outside of Shaq.
Van Exel is not even close and he is not gonna be the #2 on a legit contender.
Jones (who I liked) was still just an elite roleplayer.
Kobe was still too young and not close to being a legit A-Star yet.



face it


lakers had 4 allstars .... because they HAD 4 allstars


you f*cking idiot

the shaqtwizzle criteria for allstars doesnt trump that of actually being named an allstar

[dubeta]

face it


lakers had 4 allstars .... because they HAD 4 allstars


you f*cking idiot

the shaqtwizzle criteria for allstars doesnt trump that of actually being named an allstar

So you admit the Lakers were stacked?



And they couldnt even get past the 2nd round? :biggums:


Kobe :facepalm

[ShaqTwizzle]

face it


lakers had 4 allstars .... because they HAD 4 allstars


you f*cking idiot

the shaqtwizzle criteria for allstars doesnt trump that of actually being named an allstar

Being an "All-Star" for me has nothing to do with making the actual All-Star game.

Plenty of All-Star caliber players have missed the game and plenty of guys who weren't All-Star caliber players have made the game because of popularity or other factors.

Dale Davis was an All-Star in 2000 averaging 10 / 9.9-rpg on 53%TS
By your rule book he was also an All-Star player and if Prime Kobe played with him they should win a title right?
I mean how can Prime Kobe not win with an All-Star bigman???

This fukkin guy...
:whatever: :coleman:

[kennethgriffin]

So you admit the Lakers were stacked?



And they couldnt even get past the 2nd round? :biggums:


Kobe :facepalm


agreed


shaq needs an elite kobe


kobe wasnt alpha or in the top 10 yet

[kennethgriffin]

Being an "All-Star" for me has nothing to do with making the actual All-Star game.

Plenty of All-Star caliber players have missed the game and plenty of guys who weren't All-Star caliber players have made the game because of popularity or other factors.

Dale Davis was an All-Star in 2000 averaging 10 / 9.9-rpg on 53%TS
By your rule book he was also an All-Star player and if Prime Kobe played with him they should win a title right?
I mean how can Prime Kobe not win with an All-Star bigman???

This fukkin guy...
:whatever: :coleman:




1998 allstar - eddie jones
1998 allstar - nick van exel
1998 allstar - kobe bryant


:lol

youre mad as F*ck eh?

[dubeta]

agreed


shaq needs an elite kobe


kobe wasnt alpha or in the top 10 yet


Kobe's 3 peat average of 22 points on 40% was elite? :biggums:

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe's 3 peat average of 22 points on 40% was elite? :biggums:


didnt tim duncan win a finals mvp averaging 20ppg on 40% before


:lol


duncans defense though!

kobe = 1st team all defense





and again... i never said shaq needed kobe in the finals. i said shaq needed kobe for their toughest opponents

portland
sacramento
san antonio


kobes averages vs those teams during those 3 years are quite a bit better than 22 on 40% ( duncans fmvp stats from 2005... lulz )



:roll: :roll: :roll:



kobes overall playoff average was 25/5/5 and even better during the WC rounds

[dubeta]

didnt tim duncan win a finals mvp averaging 20ppg on 40% before


:lol


duncans defense though!




This isnt about Duncan, duncan was carried as well



Stop dodging the facts

22 points 40% FG


and then Gasol outplays him for the last 2 rings :lol


So Kobe:


-Was never the best player in a championship team

-shoots 40% career in the finals




-oh and only 1 MVP in 20 years

:lol

[ShaqTwizzle]

kobes overall playoff average was 25/5/5 and even better during the WC rounds

Kobe 2000 playoff averages over the games they won (15 games).
20.3 / 4.5-apg on 52%TS

Kobe against the West in 2002 : 26 / 4.4-apg on 49%TS

:kobe:

[kennethgriffin]

This isnt about Duncan, duncan was carried as well



Stop dodging the facts

22 points 40% FG


and then Gasol outplays him for the last 2 rings :lol


So Kobe:


-Was never the best player in a championship team

-shoots 40% career in the finals




-oh and only 1 MVP in 20 years

:lol


but youre wrong

thats whats so funny

:lol


i can just as easly say


"no jews were killed during world war 2"

or

"santa is real"



i can say it all day every day on a message board for years

so much so that even i myself start to believe it


but it doesnt make it relevant to anyone else i preach it to


so continue your ranting day in day out you tired piece of sh*t


:roll:

[kennethgriffin]

Kobe 2000 playoff averages over the games they won (15 games).
20.3 / 4.5-apg on 52%TS

Kobe against the West in 2002 : 26 / 4.4-apg on 49%TS

:kobe:


and shaq still doesnt have a ring without kobes game 7 wcf heroics


:lol

[GIF REACTION]

meltdown

[kennethgriffin]

meltdown


i can't imagine what it must have felt like...


witnessing kobe win those 2 titles after dumping shaq at the side of the curb like yesterdays garbage


i can tell it still stings even to this very day


http://40.media.tumblr.com/eaed7f36c8de4dbdafb80d2f2bc0f11d/tumblr_n2sobfHtAt1ruj0bpo1_1280.jpg

[ShaqTwizzle]

http://i58.tinypic.com/s2gso4.png

:oldlol:

[kennethgriffin]

:oldlol:


yup. that pic pretty much sums up shaq fans reactions


even shaq himself admitted on his podcast that he was "pissed" when kobe got 1 more ring than him


so if shaq himself is mad as F*ck


then i'd imagine his fans share his feelings



:lol

[Dbrog]

but youre wrong

thats whats so funny

:lol


i can just as easly say


"no jews were killed during world war 2"

or

"santa is real"



i can say it all day every day on a message board for years

so much so that even i myself start to believe it


but it doesnt make it relevant to anyone else i preach it to


so continue your ranting day in day out you tired piece of sh*t


:roll:

Most ironic post award? Anyone? :banana:

[dubeta]

yup. that pic pretty much sums up shaq fans reactions


even shaq himself admitted on his podcast that he was "pissed" when kobe got 1 more ring than him


so if shaq himself is mad as F*ck


then i'd imagine his fans share his feelings



:lol


Whats there to get pissed about?

Didnt Horry end up with more rings than Duncan?


Doesnt Wade have more than LeBron?


If a role player gets more rings, it doesnt matter, especially when they still have less FMVP's







FMVPs + MVPs + PER is all that matters

[kennethgriffin]

Whats there to get pissed about?

Didnt Horry end up with more rings than Duncan?


Doesnt Wade have more than LeBron?


If a role player gets more rings, it doesnt matter, especially when they still have less FMVP's







FMVPs + MVPs + PER is all that matters



LOL this guy pulling the horry 7ppg ring count excuse


thats when you know he just shat his pants

[ShaqTwizzle]

then i'd imagine his fans share his feelings

:lol

Meh.
Shaq was never in competition with Kobe.

I mean 00-04 Shaq >>> 06-10 Kobe
And 94-99 Shaq >>>>> 00-05 Kobe

Longevity
----
Shaq elite from : 93-06 (14 years) + maybe 09 (15)
Kobe elite from : 00-12 (13 years)
Shaq wins again

No matter how you slice it Shaq had a vastly superior prime, peak & career.
Just being real now.
:pimp:

[dubeta]

Meh.
Shaq was never in competition with Kobe.

I mean 00-04 Shaq >>> 06-10 Kobe
And 94-99 Shaq >>>>> 00-05 Kobe

Longevity
----
Shaq elite from : 93-06 (14 years) + maybe 09 (15)
Kobe elite from : 00-12 (13 years)
Shaq wins again

No matter how you slice it Shaq had a vastly superior prime, peak & career.
Just being real now.
:pimp:

Solid points

And Kobe wasnt elite in 2000 and 2005

Furthermore Kobe struggled in 2012, but was good in 2013, so they both cancel each other out

Overall Kobe only had 11 elite seasons

[kennethgriffin]

Meh.
Shaq was never in competition with Kobe.

I mean 00-04 Shaq >>> 06-10 Kobe
And 94-99 Shaq >>>>> 00-05 Kobe

Longevity
----
Shaq elite from : 93-06 (14 years) + maybe 09 (15)
Kobe elite from : 00-12 (13 years)
Shaq wins again

No matter how you slice it Shaq had a vastly superior prime, peak & career.
Just being real now.
:pimp:


shaq after 2004 - " you cant win without me"

kobe after 2004 - "pack your bags fat *ss"

shaq after 2008 - "he couldnt do without me!!!!!!! taste my ass!!!!! **** you kobe!"

kobe after 2010 - "i got one more than shaq"

shaq this month on his podcast - "i was pissed when you got 1 more than me. then you said it on tv and i was like... aww man he got me."















http://espn.go.com/i/page2/ksi/boxing.jpg

[ShaqTwizzle]

Yeah Kobe won more Rings.
He also had far better circumstances and weaker competition.
You think the 09 Lakers would beat the 95 Rockets?
You think the 10 Lakers would beat the 96 Bulls?
:yaohappy:

Imagine if Prime Shaq got to play with what Kobe got to play with.

00-02 Kobe played with 00-02 Shaq
So
94-96 Shaq gets to play with 91-93 Jordan

03-04 Kobe played with 03-04 Shaq
So
97-99 Shaq gets to play with 97-98 Jordan

08-10 Kobe played with Peak Gasol and Odom
So
00-02 Shaq gets to play with 2002 Kobe, Prime Odom and of course Phil.

Shaq would have 8+ Rings with Kobe's amazing casts.
Nuff said.

http://i59.tinypic.com/352orjm.jpg

[stalkerforlife]

I admit it, reluctantly...kenneth slayed all haters with this thread.